Proof that S.F.’s circumcision ban Is anti-Semitic
As you may have heard by now, San Francisco will be voting this November on whether or not to ban circumcision in the city.
Defenders of the measure say it’s all about “human rights” and “protecting babies” from unnecessary procedures.
But critics suspected there was something vaguely anti-Semitic about the whole proposal, since among Jews (and Muslims, as well) circumcising male babies is a religious duty, not just a mistaken medical procedure.
Ban proponents insisted their proposal had nothing to do with Jews — really, it’s all about the rights of children.
Well, any doubt that they were lying have now been dispelled, with the publication of new campaign literature for the upcoming circumcision ban. The campaign comic book, called “Foreskin Man,” after its baby-saving superhero, features a litany of evil Jews doing battle with blond Nordic saviors.
(Oh, and did I mention the artist’s last name is Hess? A relative of Rudolf, perhaps?)
Below you will find a selection of images taken from Foreskin Man, the campaign brochure for San Francisco’s anti-circumcision ballot measure. You tell me: anti-Semitic or not?
UPDATE:
For context, check out the original movie posters for the German and Dutch versions of the infamous 1940 Nazi film Der Ewige Jude, legendary as one of the most extreme examples of anti-Semitic propaganda ever made, and compare them to the “collector’s card” for Monster Mohel:
Notice a resemblance?
Bizarre…and most definitely anti-Jew. Seems to align well with other conspicuous and bold anti-Jew activity around the world.
That is an incredibly anti-Semitic comic, no doubt of that at all. It’s repugnant. But it shouldn’t be seen as representing all people who oppose circumcision.
I’m not against circumcision myself. If anything, I support the Jewish approach where a young adult takes the cut willingly as a sacrament.
But you should be aware that there is an anti-circumcision movement that has nothing to do with anti-Semitism. I’m not a part of it – in fact, I was willingly cut myself. Nevertheless, many people think that it’s wrong to cut young boys (or girls) without their willing consent.
Unfortunately, these neo-Nazis are clouding that issue by trying to make it about Jews. It isn’t.
Ideally, I’d like to see a ban on involuntary circumcision of newborns – but an allowance of voluntary circumcision for boys over 14. Hopefully this could satisfy both the honest groups of pro- and anti- lobbyists, and frustrate the Jew-haters.
The Law of Moses requires that the boy be circumcised on the eighth day. If you abolish infant circumcision, you criminalize Judaism.
Oh, I didn’t know that. For some reason I thought it was done at age 14.
I guess that rules out the idea of a blanket ban.
Mohammadans do it at 12 or so. This, and most anticirc lit I’ve seen (which I admit isn’t much) seems to have a strong antiSemitic undercurrent. However, it does raise some interesting questions. For example — why then >do< we get so upset about so-called "female circumcision"? If you're allowed to do it to a boy, how can forbid -or discourage- a similar practice with a girl? If circumcision is permitted, generally, do you have a problem with other minor procedures on an infant? Like ear piercings? I admit I was kinda startled the first time I saw a baby girl with ear studs. What about other kinds of piercings? If you're going to cut off a bit of skin off your baby boy, why not give him a Prince Albert while you're down there?
No, I have no problem with clip n flip, it was done to me as a babe, and I've never thought anything of it; my three sons as well. And I don't have answers or retorts for the questions I've asked, I don't know. Just think it's interesting what we think is OK and what we don't.
Thanks for the thoughtful comment, Psychodad. I think my initial mistake was due to getting circumcision mixed up with Bar Mitzvah.
I frequent men’s rights forums, where the subject of circumcision frequently comes up. It’s usually raised by men who were circumcised as babies. Their grievance is usually not religious in nature, but a feeling that they have had a sensitive part removed without consent. They can never know if they’re missing out on something or not.
To me, this comic was a shock. It was the first time I became aware that Jew-haters were jumping onto that issue as a way to spread their bile. I would liken the feeling to Tea Party members suddenly realising that real racists had joined their rally.
Circumcision itself is not a big issue for me, though it is for some of the activists I mentioned above. To find Nazis riding the bandwagon was a most unwelcome surprise.
Evil Pundit – Troll via subterfuge. Too obvious you’re lipsticking the pig of bigotry & racism coming from the left, made even more spectacularly obvious with the ridiculous nazi/tea party comment. Nice try weasel.
PsychoDad – Female circumcision involves the partial or complete removal of the clitoris, which contains the majority of the female nerves that are involved in pleasure and orgasm. It would be somthing like removing the entire head of the penis. You would probably never enjoy sex your entire life. There can be no comparison made between male an female circumcision. Male circumcision is hygienic and reduces the risk of HIV infection by approximatly 60%( which why these nutjobs want to outlaw it in SAN FRANCISCO!!! of all places is beyond me) and female circumcision is just evil and barbaric.
Yes, but when real racists showed up to Tea Party events, they got thrown out so hard they bounced.
If one believes that the ends justify the means, then one tends to embrace all means, no matter what ends they have produced in the past. If one rather, believes that the means create the ends, one does tend to be a bit more careful of the means one employees.
@PsychoDad & Anonymous, it’s not just that female circumcision removes nerve endings and reduces (or eliminates) the enjoyment of sex, it’s that this is the PURPOSE of female circumcision. The idea is that if women don’t enjoy sex, they won’t participate in premarital sex or adultery.
The purpose of male circumcision is to sacrifice a small part (an arguably unnecessary part) of oneself as a sign of obedience to God. Whether the foreskin is actually unnecessary, and whether it is right to make that choice on behalf of an infant is a point of contention, but at least you can’t argue that the parents’ intention is to harm or restrict their child’s future sexual enjoyment.
I understand, EP, that there is a legitimate anti-circ movement; it’s aligned with men’s and father’s rights advocates. This isn’t that. If they want a ban, they’re going to HAVE to allow the religious exemption, period. And frankly, there ARE cases where circumcision is medically warranted, and they better allow that too. With the Jewish exemption, it’s nice to note that Mohels tend to do a far better job than doctors, with far fewer complications and by all appearances with much less pain. It’s simply inexcusable to come along 5000 years later and demand we have the right to legislate the religious rites of Jews. It’s not called for in Christianity, so there’s no religious exemption called for.
Psycho Dad, female “circumcision” isn’t remotely the same thing, that’s why people get upset about it. Removing a few inches of foreskin (and yes, I am aware that it is important tissue and full of nerve endings, and protective of the glans, etc. – as I said I know the people in anti-circ who aren’t anti-Semitic) is NOT the same as removing an entire clitoris (which would be akin to cutting off the entire head of the penis, not the foreskin.) Not to mention they usually remove a LOT more than the clitoris – the labia, inner and outer, and then sew the whole thing up; it is extremely disfiguring and highly debilitating throughout the woman’s life. It is, in fact, mutilation. And, considering the WAY that it’s done, it’s also absolutely torture.
Yes, exactly… left/liberal types actually hate Jews for “having too much” (though getting them to be secular and supportive of leftist policies at the same time has been one of the Left’s big efforts).
Wow… I know a very large number of very left very liberal Jews, and many very left very liberal people who fight for rights of all people, including jews… so that is a blatantly uneducated comment.
What’s criminalized is not Judaism, in the sense of being Jewish, but performing an irreversible (and painful, and slightly dangerous) procedure on a child who does not have the capacity to consent.
The child is an independent human being who has NOT chosen Judaism, and it’s no more legitimate to circumcise that child than to forcibly circumcise a random person on the street.
You have a freedom to believe what you want, but you don’t have the freedom to impose that on another person… not even if that person is your child. You may try to teach and convince (so long as you don’t cut the child off from other sources of information, or engage in abusive brainwashing). You may not assume. Not when it comes to lopping off body parts.
Children are people too.
I was given the choice almost immediately from escaping the vile ‘womb without a view’ to suckle my captor or starve.
Obviously,I suckled,amd I resent it to this day.
Why couldn’t we just be friends?
LOL really? So, the consent of the child now outweighs any decision made by parents? Really? So, if any medical procedure poses a risk to the child’s health, the decision to undergo that procedure must be delayed until the child becomes a legal adult at age 18? LOL You liberals crack me up.
So, let’s get this straight. Liberals are in favor of a circumcision ban because “infant circumcision is a violation of a child’s right to make decisions about their own body”, but these same liberals insist that every mother have a right to kill her child with an abortion.
Yeah. Makes total sense.
In reality, the only reason liberals are anti-circumcision and pro-abortion is because they are anti-judeo-christian values. Liberalism is strictly about being contrary to everything that makes a strong individual-centric free nation possible: strong families, religious and moral citizens, and individual liberties.
Next they will be saying we have to delay vaccinations until the child is old enough to make their own choice. No. Parents have the right to make decisions for their minor children, including circumcision, and it’s none of the state’s business period.
Wow.
Permit me, both of you, to reply in your own style, viz:
“Obviously any interference with any boneheaded abusive choice parents may make is completely out of the question. If the parents decide to rape the kid to death, well, that’s OK. It’s their culture, after all. Probably the kid would have grown up and wished he’d been raped to death anyway.”
That is exactly as valid a characterization of your position as you’ve made of mine. Your argument most definitely allows FGM, prolonged beatings as discipline, completely refusing all medical care, whatever. Sexual abuse, too, for that matter. I’m betting that you think there ARE limits, and that those limits are based on real distinctions.
So, now that we’ve gotten the kindergarden approach out of the way, let’s get to the obvious, real distinctions between circumcision and taking care of your kid, eh?
I’ll ignore the fact that even the youngest infants obviously and essentially universally WANT to be fed and be with their parents, and react to the somewhat stronger medical example. What’s the difference between circumcision and a medical procedure? The difference is that if you’re not circumcised, you can easily correct it. On the other hand, if you don’t get that medical procedure, you may not live to correct it. Or at the very least you may suffer a bunch of misery that cannot be undone. Sort of like the non-undoable misery caused by circumcision.
You guys really don’t seem to get it. YOUR CHILDREN ARE NOT YOUR PROPERTY. You do not get an unlimited license to do anything you want with them. Not even if you think it’s for their own good. They are there for themselves, not as fodder to be fed to your ethnic group or value system.
You want my personal list of limits, if I were King?
I would let parents make some irrevocable choices, because sometimes you can’t avoid an irrevocable choice. Whatever you do has consequences. I would have a strong bias against irrevocable choices that could safely be deferred until later.
I would let parents make medical decisions when there was a legitimate question about relative risk. I would involve the child more and more in those decisions from at least about age 12 on. I would NOT let the parents make obviously stupid medical decisions, like say relying on prayer when death or permanent disability was a serious possibility. I also would NOT let parents authorize risky procedures clearly out of proportion to the problem at hand.
I would NOT let parents make irreversible body modifications for religious or cultural reasons. No circumcision. No FGM, tattoos, scarification, branding, foot binding, neck extension, none of that, until the kid was old enough and informed enough to make permanent life decisions. Even reversible things like ear piercing would forbidden until the kid was old enough to at least have an opinion that wouldn’t change every 5 minutes.
I’d let parents teach kids anything they wanted, even silly nonsense. I think “silly nonsense” includes all religions, but I’d let people teach them to their kids or to anybody else who’d listen. I’d also let them run on about how you should follow the ideas of your ancestors umpty-ump years ago. Or define yourself in terms of the tribe you happen to be born into. Whatever. Go wild.
I would not, however, let parents restrict kids’ access to competing ideas. No isolating your kid from the world completely. No having a cow if somebody tells the kid something that contradicts your values. And definitely no help from the state in keeping the kid’s mind “pure”. Quite the contrary.
I would force some provable effort to teach kids basic facts and critical thinking, whether in school or elsewhere. That would include teaching them about their right to seek alternative views, and it would include physically permitting them to do so. And “critical thinking” dpesn’t mean “just rejecting stuff”. It means hardheaded logic, even when it makes you believe something you’d rather not believe, and hardheaded statistics, even when the probabilities look tough for your preferred view.
The test of education would be whether the kid could cogently ATTACK OR DEFEND any assigned value system, any epistemology, and any system of factual beliefs, including yours, mine, that of the kid’s parents, or the kid’s own. I don’t expect the kid to WIN the argument if assigned a silly position, just to make the best possible try.
I’d allow you to push your ideas on your kids from a position of obviously overwhelming influence. Then I’d give the kid the tools to evaluate them. If your ideas can’t compete after that, that probably says something about your ideas.
And I would recognize that everybody, not just the parents, has an interest in how a kid grows up, because the kid is an independently valuable, individual member of humanity, NOT an extension of a family, tribe, or ethnic group.
The answer on abortion is pretty damned simple: a lump of cells is not a child. Get over it. You’ve picked a silly point at which to assign personhood. That’s based on facts about what people are and what makes them that way. The opinions of ignorant tribal shamans 2500 years ago are irrelevant. If there’s an abortion, NO PERSON EVER EXISTED AND NO PERSON EVER COMES INTO BEING.
On the other hand, you can reasonably assign personhood and certain rights to a baby, and the ADULT into whom that baby will grow is DEFINITELY going to be a person with rights. That adult has to deal with the consequences of the parents’ choices, and shouldn’t be stuck with too much unfixable baggage.
I don’t know what “liberals” think; I guess I’ll have to ask every single one. I’m not sure I qualify anyway. Most people who call themselves “liberals” don’t like my radical individualism.
Personally however, I am indeed hostile to your value system. Because you’re on crack if you think Judeo-Christian morals do anything for individual freedom. The whole western concept of individual freedom arose in the context of a REBELLION against Judeo-Christian morality, which was rarely and incidentally about protecting persons, mostly about protecting tribes, families, the state, and the System itself, and had a large measure of protecting people from having to defend their shaky belief systems against serious challenges.
Nor does the child consent to being a citizen of the state for that matter, regulated by its laws. Still, authority is assumed.
many jews dont circumcise. id post links to anti-circumcision jewish support groups online, but this website wont let me include links in my replies.
anyway. so, if criminalizing circumcision would criminalize jews, then those jews who dont circumcise are criminals??
interesting.
Jewish law also requires stoning adulterers and gays, shunning menstruating women, and burning animal sacrifices.
Circumcision orthodoxy once required that the foreskin be torn from the glans by a sharpened fingernail and that the mohel suck blood from the wounded penis with his mouth. Most Jews would say, “but we don’t do it that way any more” to which I say then why not just keep on letting your sense of compassion and human rights keep moving you forward, away from slavery and all the other immoral stuff in the Torah.
But direct oral suction of the circumcision wound IS still done by a tiny minority, and babies have died by catching herpes from that. It’s called metzizah b’peh, and THAT is what the cutter in the comic book is up to. If you are defending an adult sucking on a baby’s bloody penis then shame on you. If you don’t think a depiction of such a person should resemble a monster then shame on you.
But it’s unfortunate that the comic book focused on Jewish circumcision in issue #2 since that is a very small aspect of the controversy. Maybe in issue #99 or #100 after all the “so he’ll look like Daddy” circumcisers had their butts kicked. Foreskin Man should have started his foray into Jewish circumcision by attending a Brit Shalom, a bloodless naming ceremony for a baby boy that is becoming more popular.
“Jewish law also requires stoning adulterers and gays, shunning menstruating women, and burning animal sacrifices.” This is only true if you circumcise, er, mutilate, about 2000 years of Jewish history. By the end of the rabbinic period these literal Torah injunctions were altered to create civil replacements such as compensations etc. Only fundamentalist Chistians read the bible literally. Judaism is evolutionary and the literal forms have been altered to express principle intents in G!d’s laws.
I can’t believe you just compared a forced clitoridectomy to circumcision. One of these is NOT like the other. Your compass is askew to a great degree.
I didn’t say “clitoridectomy”, I said “cutting”. There are many different degrees of female genital mutilation, some of which are little different to circumcision.
There are many kinds of female genital mutilations but all of them – in larger or smaller measure – aim to prevent enjoyment of sex. Women’s enjoyment, that is. Majority of such mutilations are also dangerous for women’s health. That’s why they are called “mutilation”.
Male circumcision does not prevent enjoyment of sex nor it is dangerous for men’s health.
And it seems to me that you well know the difference.
Female genital mutilation can exist in any degree, including the infliction of small symbolic nicks that have no effect on pleasure. Medical effects are largely a function of hygiene and care, and not of sex differences. Some of the motives for male circumcision include attempts to lower the sex drive (which may not be the actual result, but was sometimes the intention, eg in the 19th century).
No one is claiming that male circumcision is the same as FGM, but they are not as different as you think.
i think you need to do a little research on fgm. this article from who is a good place to start http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs241/en/
Where are you getting your information about this minor, symbolic genital scarring, which is besides the point, anyway? I don’t think you know much about this subject.
Meanwhile, the best numbers (those that rely on lifelong medical data, thus counting those occurring later than birth and correcting routine omissions from birth records) indicates that at least 80% of American males are circumcised — the numbers were higher prior to the influx of men from Mexico. When you consider that, and look at the size of the anti-circumcision movement (tiny, but loud and connected), you really have to wonder about the politics driving them, because it’s not an issue for virtually any men.
I’ve seen both infants and adult, late-term pregnant women mutilated by genital cutting. And frankly, once you have seen that, I don’t think you can view the self-indulgent, delusional comparisons between mutilation of females and ordinary male circumcision as anything other than evil. Evil, politically motivated denial.
I recently attended a college reunion and was shocked to hear educated people equate male circumcision with female genital mutilation — and frankly they were more incensed about the former, because being negative about the latter is now perceived as being culturally insensitive, I suppose. Talk about projection. What was most chilling to me was that these were very non-political people, with one exception, so this sick conspiracy theory has spread to folks who aren’t activists.
Oh, and the one politically active person — who also righteously fumed that female genital mutilation has nothing to do with Islam because other people also practice it, somewhat along the lines with your argument here — he was high up in the Obama administration, in human rights.
So there’s the peer group for those who minimize FGM. Not a very nice cohort, and inflected with paranoid misogyny as much as anti-Semitism, which is something that should not be forgotten.
Male circumcision is the new fluoridation panic. And just like the old one, the real danger isn’t a loss of virility: it’s a loss of credibility.
Your problem, Tina Trent, is that you are a sexist who hates men. Therefore your misandry leads you to believe that removing parts of boys’ genitals is fundamentally different from removing parts of girls’ genitals.
The motives many vary, and the degree of removal may vary, but the basic physical principle is the same. Your hostile reaction is simply a function of your double standards.
Baloney, EP.
Female genital mutilation almost HAS to include clitoridectomy – it’s well nigh impossible to separate the female hood from the clitoris in any meaningful fashion without real damage to the organ itself. And considering it’s generally done with cut glass or other crude instruments in the most vile circumstances, it doesn’t compare remotely with circumcision. And face it, we all know full well that almost NONE of the FGM is relegated to minimalization, but tends far more to the removal of everything female and sewing everything pretty much shut. It’s mutilation, it’s debilitating for life, and it’s disgusting. Moreover, it’s NOT a valid religious procedure. I don’t really mind a circumcision ban TOO much, if it’s generally doctors agreeing not to perform them, but there absolutely must be a religious exemption as well as a medical one. Also, Mohels do it with far fewer risks, less pain, quicker, and much more adeptly than Western doctors do. They’re the experts; let them do it.
Sorry, I meant to say nearly impossible to separate in a child. Hard enough to separate it in an adult woman but a child? Good luck.
They are in fact exactly the same. Not in impact, but in the fact that in both cases a human body (a child’s body) is mutilated without the consent of the person it’s happening to.
We have laws preventing this mutilation from happening to girls, but when done to boys it’s perfectly ok.
For that reason alone I fully support this ban, and consider any group or religion that performs such acts (whether on girls or boys) to be barbaric (and yes, that includes Jews, an otherwise very likeable group of people).
What would you feel about a religion that demands a child’s ears be clipped at say 3 months old, removing the earlobes (or the entire ear) for whatever religious reason?
Should we allow that too because it’s “freedom of religion”? There’s no negative side effects after all, hearing isn’t affected and instead of glasses you can always go for contact lenses if you need them (or wraparound glasses I guess, if those are hip at the moment).
Or we should start binding the feet of young girls the way it happened in China up into the last century. We’d only be culturally sensitive to a minority group after all.
Again, what’s the different? Allow one form of child mutilation, you have to allow them all.
Thanks for your condescending comment about our being an “otherwise likeable people.” But consider this: has anyone actually asked the millions of Jewish men around today who were circumcised at 8 days old whether they think that they have suffered as a result of this? The whole anti-circumcision campaign seems to be based on theories and the so-called evidence of a minority of circumcised men.
Has there been any actual scientific research carried out on this subject. I have personally never heard any Jewish man complain the lack of a foreskin has damaged his life in anyway.
FWIW David, some of us have great love for the Jewish people and Israel. Jewish tradition is 5000 years and more old; no way should it be forbidden for them to practice it; the thought is insane.
As to circumcision itself; a lot is known. The foreskin is a protective organ, producing lubricant for the glans and containing millions of nerve endings. No, you aren’t suffering for want of sensation and your – er- glans is toughened up by exposure. An intact male feels things and experiences things differently. You don’t know the difference having not been on the other side; but if you talk to someone who has experienced both as an adult they can explain more thoroughly. As a Christian it isn’t required for Christian people, so they might want to reconsider, although there is evidence that it affects female cancers and the transmission of AIDS, so there’s that. It’s a decision best left to parents and, if they wish, to the boy himself once he becomes an adult. Nothing wrong with informing people of all the sides of the debate so they can decide for themselves.
By the same token, Mohels do it effectively, with much less pain, and with far fewer bad effects and results than doctors.
You know, JT I don’t like when people pierce newborn girls’ ears, either. I hate it. But it’s NOT MY DECISION.
AND I DON’T USE NAZI PROPAGANDA TO DISCOURAGE IT – do you even SEE what is up there? WHY DON’T YOU SEE IT?
Giving an infant immunizations is done without their consent. So should we also wait until children can give consent before those as well? As a matter of fact, giving BIRTH is done without the infant’s consent. How dare they force a child from its mother’s womb like that! What exactly makes you believe that a 14-year-old child is mentally capable of giving consent to anything anyway?
“Consent” is the most absurd argument I’ve heard so far on this issue.
Good point. Have you reviewed studies showing the vaccine preservative thimerosal (which is a little shot of mercury for your kid when is most vulnerable) is a suspect in the rise of autism among children?
They took out thimerosol in many vaccines over a decade ago. Autism rates are still increasing in some areas where they have done that.
I hate to break it to you, but the research that was used to promote that was proved to be fraudulent. It was in the news last year.
Sorry ATLmom and HSmith, wrong on both counts.
Recent testimony at WHO showed the levels of Thimerosol in vaccines have not changed. And the witch hunt of Dr. Wakefield in UK is well publicized. Inform yourselves please.
Sorry GaryDC, thimerosal has indeed been removed from every infant vaccine since around 2001 except the voluntary flu shot. And Wakefield has been proven wrong, along with having his license to practice medicine revoked.
HSmith, the study that was used to “prove” the link was fraud was just proven to be a fraud itself. “Poul Thorsen, the principal coordinator of multiple studies funded by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) used to deny a vaccine/autism link was indicted on April 13th, 2011 on 13 counts of fraud and 9 counts of money-laundering. The charges relate to funding for work he conducted for the CDC, which claimed to disprove associations between the mercury-based vaccine preservative, thimerosal, and increased rates of autism,” from CNBC. I originally saw the story in April on CNBC, discussing how numbers were changed in order to keep funding and that all of his studies were a complete farce. Look it up. The thimerosal link has not been proven false.
If thinerosal has been out of childhood vaccines for over a decade, and autism rates continue to rise (let alone decline quickly if thimerosal was to blame), that constitutes concrete proof it isn’t to blame for autism.
Old busted and was never more than tinfoil hat crazy talk anyway. Now get back to monitoring the HAARP weather channel.
The autism conection is most definitely wrong. Immunizations are safe and are meant to protect everyone in the community, not just the kid.
As to female genital mutilation practiced by the religion of peace, there is no correlation. Male circumscision is safe, and healthy. The fact that SF wants to ban the procedure shows what will happen under Obamacare.
Were you aware that the govt has been secretly giving compensation to families with autistic children?
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/99826.php
Vaccines and autism AGAIN? Don’t people read? that has been debunked again and again and again…. Meanwhile, children die because their tinfoil-hat parents can read or digest evidence.
Oh, and to the person who tried to equate circumcision and female genital mutilation: One involves snipping the foreskin. The other? removal of the clitoris (orgasms are now impossible!). And in “pharoahnic” FGM, which our Pals in Egypt, Sudan, and many other moslem countries practice, they slice off the baby girls’ labia as well, then sew up the raw edges to leave only one opening for both urine and menstrual blood (when it comes). They do this to cover the vaginal opening like an extra hymen.
They then marry the child off at age 12 or so to a middle aged pederast.
And on her “wedding night,” he goes in to the child, slits her open with a knife, and effs her.
Yeah, that’s EXACTLY THE SAME as circumcision. EXACTLY THE SAME. Filthy liars.
My son was circumcised as an infant due to problems with an infection, the foreskin area takes a special effort to keep clean and being circumcised actually greatly reduces the chances of getting and spreading venereal diseases, so my question is why exactly do San Franciscans want to abolish this hygienic practice? Are they complete idiots? [rhetorical question]
Circumcision definitely makes regular cleaning and maintenance easier, has been proven to reduce the incidence of certain cancers and STD’s, has no demonstrable effect on sexual pleasure (there aren’t many nerve endings right there anyways), and has a multiple-thousand year history of acceptance across many cultures (not just the Jews).
It is an interesting question though: where precisely do we draw the line between parental responsibility and abuse? Why precisely is circumcision ok and a clitorectomy not? (I’m not saying that the latter is ok, just that we need to be very careful about our defense of the former). Banning circumcision is not being done for health reasons, it’s being done as a general attack on religion. Several steps down this road will be the banning of a parent’s right to bring their child up in their own faith.
It’s definitely not true that a male doesn’t feel a difference in sensitivity. For a medical reason, I was circumcised at the age of 24, and let me tell you; there’s a huge difference in sensitivity. The procedure did not help with the medical issue and if I had it to do over again; I would definitely not get the circumcision again. Because of this I appealed to my sister to not let her baby boy be circumcised. Fortunately she listened and didn’t do it.
Having said all that; I’m completely against anyone telling us we must or must not do anything by diktat or vote. It’s also why the obamacare health plan must be repealed. SF is pretty much a lost city and will eventually drown in it own cesspool of elitism.
The decision to have the procedure should be one the parents make and no one else should be involved in that final decision IMHO.
Paul,
In answer to your question, and in hopes of answering the questions of others:
A Jewish female is considered circumcised in a spiritual sense from birth, possessing the holy covenant within herself from the moment she is born. In Judaism, women are regarded as spiritually more evolved, and on a higher spiritual plane than men.
Avram name was changed by G-D to Avraham after his circumcision. It was then that was he able to father the Jewish nation. When his son, Isaac (Yitzchak) was born, Abraham circumcised him on the 8th day, as he was commanded to do so by God.
In Judaism, the soul of a male child is not fully in the body before the 8th day, so unholy forces cannot receive anything from that child. On the eighth day, body and soul unite and total holiness arrives. Since it has the ability to produce life, and unholy energies attach themselves to these areas, the greatest concentration of impurity comes to rest upon the male sex organ at that time. These energies gather in the foreskin, which is why it is removed.
For over 4,000 years, circumcision of Jewish males has been the symbol of the Covenant because this is the source from which the perpetuation of the species emanates.
The Brit Milah bids us to control the animal desires and direct this energy into the spiritual. The greatest challenge to a human being throughout life, is that we must refine ourselves constantly. No man is immune to the challenges of sexual urges. This is why the Brit Milah is done on the male organ- an organ of the body that too often has been used in barbaric behaviors, such as rape.
Bring holiness into our life in this area, then holiness in other areas will develop.
Circumcision has historically been thought to combat homosexuality and masturbation. It is thought to be involved in the heterosexual transmission of AIDS in Africa. It is a practice deeply invested in Judaism. Any or all of these three would be enough to mobilize San Francisco gays against the practice of circumcision. They are deeply anti-semetic, defensive, promoting of homosexuality, antagonistic towards heterosexuals, and eager to broaden the AIDS problem to include heterosexuals. Homosexuals can be incredibly selfish and hateful.
I’m impressed that everyone wants to refer to statistical information, rather than their feelings about male circumcision. As a Childbirth Educator, Inservice Educator for health care providers and auxilliary personel, and Infection Control Nurse (at French Hospital – long gone) in San Francisco in the late ’60s to early ’70s, I know that few males went uncircumcised, and that it was done at 3 days of age in the hospital (except for a few orthodox Jewish families that wanted a ritual ceremony done with a moel, at home, which was frowned upon).
There were some crass physicians who kidded around and seemed to lack a sense of place, but for the most part the occasion was one of deep respect and loving care of the baby. No one watched except medical professionals (usually a nurse and a doctor).
I was initially educated in Montreal, at the Jewish General Hospital there, where there was a “briss” room next to the Emergency Room (males tended to faint who were watching through a glass window as the moel accompanied by a doctor, or only a doctor performed the surgery).
I lived in San Francisco when men and women felt they could finally “come out of the closet” if not safely, at least with support of many friends. A lot of myths were cleared up then, and a lot of those who needed attention happened. This article seems to have many objectives, the least of which I feel was to villify Jews.
After all, it’s Dr. Dean Edell, the northern CA wellness guru of radio and TV, who led the “crusade” recently to educate those of the circumcision persuasion, that it wasn’t necessarily important to have that, and could be dangerous (for possible rare post surgical infection).
I haven’t been impressed by the data so far collected for or against the procedure. However I have been very impressed when taking care of babies as a Registered Nurse, to see how much feces (yellow and toothpasty in a newborn) can get into that space between the foreskin and the penis of a baby boy. Doctors uniformly advise against caregivers handling the foreskin to remove accumulated discharge, feces, urine, lint, etc. there. As a Public Health Nurse visiting newborns at home, I have been impressed by the odor eminating from under the foreskin, which only occasionally means an infection is brewing.
So infections can theoretically occur whether you do or do not circumcise, infections are possible. Data exists regarding a lower cervical cancer rate among women who have only had relations with uncircumcised men. Many studies debunked that one, but no other research has taken place with “N” satisfactorily high and a “control” study that verifies one or the other finding, for me.
AIDS prevention recommendations certainly don’t entertain the idea that if one has relations only with circumcised men, they are protected from that disease. My personal belief is that “safer” sex is only partially effective, and better than no precaution; but to whom does celibacy appeal these days? Catholic clergy haven’t proven that their lust is sufficiently dampened for self control of urges….. Married folks haven’t carried out their vows to a great extent, so life is a whole lot more dangerous out there than it once was, especially with unvaccinated kids and adults running around in it. Believe me, the disease is more life threatening than the even remotest possibility of autism, which has become a catch basket for “I don’t know what it is” in the past few decades.
Regards to the 100s of parents and grandparents in San Francisco, who I taught to have babies with the needed information to make their decisions intelligently.
Then why are they not speaking out about the forceful clitorectomies of little Muslim girls? What hypocrites.
You have GOT to be sh*tting me. How about we ban homos in San Francisco? After all, every major religion considers the foo-foo crowd sinners. Will it happen? Doubtfully. Leave it to the pooter-pokers and their supporters to be religion haters. Buncha sickos, the whole bloody lot.
Ummm.. why do you say neo-nazis made this comic? Neo-nazis did not make it, the politicians who are trying to get the bill passed made it to promote their bill. They call themselves “MGMbill.org”.
I say neo-Nazis, because this looks like neo-Nazi propaganda to me. If you think this comic doesn’t look like neo-Nazi propaganda, feel free to explain why.
What upsets me is that not only is the comic anti-Semitic, but it also tars the whole “intact-penis” movement with the same brush. I’m not an anti-circumcision campaigner, but I am aware of many who are, and their motives have nothing to do with anti-Semitism. Most of them just wish they had had a choice in the matter.
You know, “Evil Pundit,” for something you claim to have little interest in, you sure seem to be fully-up on it.
Others have called it out as well. Just stop lying.
“Colorado has become the 18th State to acknowledge that infant circumcision is unethical and a wasteful allocation of resources by terminating Medicaid funding for infant circumcision.”
Circumcision of the foreskin has NO connection to the removal of the girl’s clitoris and labia, in female genital mutilation, as it’s more properly known. It has no deleterious effect on the man’s later ability to feel pleasure or fully function in every way.
I’m a Protestant. All the men in my family were “done” as babies, as in the South, the only males who were uncut were the blacks, foreigners, and white trash. (I don’t know about Roman Catholics; there were so few in the Southeast that I didn’t meet one until I was 16, and of course had no information on such an intimate subject.)
Our boys were circumcised for reasons of HYGIENE. And the ladies are grateful. It also, we now know, greatly cuts down on transmission of venereal diseases (not all men are good about keeping clean!), and the transmission of HPV, which causes cervical cancer.
But, hey! who cares if the ladies get sick or die of cancer? as long as the Leftist Nazis can crow about how bloody PC they are about that little scrap of foreskin!
More important, they want to dictate to everyone, right down to the most intimate detail, how we live and move and even freakin’ breathe. They’re power-mad.
The Jew-hating in this “comic” is really off the charts. Goebbels, anyone? Frightening. It can happen here, folks. It IS happening.
did you know?? “Colorado has become the 18th State to acknowledge that infant circumcision is unethical and a wasteful allocation of resources by terminating Medicaid funding for infant circumcision.” guess not. stay in your stupid box or come out into the light. your choice.
Evil Pundit ….. The Jewish Approach requires the circumcision to happen at 8 days of age….perhaps you mean the Muslim approach when they do it voluntarily at 13 years of age? ……. Personally, given the choice, I think that I would rather have it done at an age when I would not remember the great pain and when my capillaries are smaller so there is less risk of complication. In addition the MODERN MUSLIMS HAVE ADOPTED THE JEWISH APPROACH AS THEY SEE IT AS MORE HUMANE!!!!!! THEY CIRCUMCISE THEIR MALES AT THE AGE OF 10 DAYS!!!!!!! Put that in your pipe and smoke it!!!!
Yes, anonymous. I got the age of circumcision wrong – I think I had it confused with Bar Mitzvah for some reason.
As for circumcision later in life, I had mine done when I was over 30, and it wasn’t too bad after the first few days. . I’m glad they used a local though.
I’m not against circumcision, I just wish it could be a voluntary choice. But I guess that’s not achievable.
my understanding is that it is done as an infant because the change of complications and infections is less. i’m an atheist and my son was circumcised at 2 days old on the advice of my obgyn who volunteers at nursing homes and told me that it breaks his heart to see so many infections in the uncircumcised elderly men who are not able to clean themselves properly
http://www.circumstitions.com/AMA.html
AMERICAN MEDICAL ASSOCIATION
” … the procedure is not essential to the child’s current well-being, parents should determine what is in the best interest of the child. [No, in such circumstances, invasive surgery should not be performed.] To make an informed choice, parents of all male infants should be given accurate and unbiased information and be provided the opportunity to discuss this decision…”
===
parents of all male infants should be given accurate and unbiased information
===
accurate and unbiased information
===
unbiased information … To make an informed choice
=========================================================
Why is San Francisco acting against the parents right to make this decision?
Why is San Francisco acting against the American Medical Association’s recommendation?
Why is this biased propaganda allowed?
Who is paying for this **intentionally biased and inaccurate propaganda?
San Francisco is a nest for misfits, depravity, and home base for Satan and his slaves. Of course the circumcision effort is anti-Semitic….anything God-centered is a threat to them.
yes san francisco where muslims are given pray time in school (but not christians) and now where jews will not be allowed to circumcise their males. wonder how long it will be before there are no jews or christains left in sf. i know if i were either i would be quickly looking for some where else to live
The anti-semitic libel of this ‘comic’ book is beyond the pale, even in an anything goes discourse.
This is especially dastardly in light of the fact that NO one in the industry dares to publish pictures ! of Mohammed, they are terrified to do so.
HOWEVER, when it comes to defiling Jewish tradition nothing is off the table. I have to state this for the record-IF Jewish groups do not threaten the originators of this screed then they will be complicit in the blood libel.
Threatening them in whatever way they see fit to get this out of circulation should not be off the table-there is more than one way to skin an anti-semitic cat…..
Adina,
You are so right. Any Jew who does not do something to put a stop to this is simply walking quietly into the cattle cars again. This is how it started. Now it is time to put an end to it. What’s next Krystalnacht?
Do you know the meaning of the term “Blood Libel”???
Ferociously anti-Jew. It even offers up the blood libel of Jews liking the blood of children. This ban is directed specifically at Jews. It’s of a piece with what’s happening not just around the world, but also in America on university campuses because of Muslims passing around money everywhere.
Circumcision benefits not just men but also women. Uncircumcised men often transmit biological matter under their foreskins, and that can result in uterine cancer for women. The city of San Francisco is forsaking women’s health to strike at Jews.
I assume all here are adults that are reading this article. The subject matter chosen by the San Fan Nan’s to make into law is a bit bizarre.
To make their point of how important a law for anti-circumcision is they write a comic book. It is all a bit juvenile if you ask me. Who benefits from this law? Why spend revenue of a state going broke to pass
a stupid law. Instead of women running across state lines into back alleys for abortions, you will have mothers of newborns running across state lines into back alleys for illegal circumcisions. After awhile you will have federally funded circumcision clinics with the ACLU involved along with the supreme court. Hey, Trannies get it all cut off. Stupid, stupid. San Fran Nans are bored and have nothing to do. Is it Anti-Semitic? No they are just bored and want to sell some weirdo comic books and get some air time. If this is anti-semitic why don’t the San Fran Nans attack the Big Hollywood Kabella crowd. You know Jewish mysticisim buch.
Notice the nanny state, as represented by F/S/man confiscates/kidnaps the child as well, after preventing circumcision. I thought at first that this was a joke, parodying the sanctimoniousness of the state, but they are serious in their propagandic use of the super hero as the personification of state intrusion into anything previously understood as to be none of their business.
I am christian and I read the bible’s references to sanctification as either symbolic or in fact adherence to the sanctified procedure. Jewish law, as commenters have noted, must happen on the eighth day. I am circumcised, and I’m not sorry about that. Bible exhortations of “Sanctify Yourself” are recurring, and are with reference to times of a confessional moment when the believer admits to falling away from the faith, and recommits himself by means of sanctifying himself, or re-sanctifying himself, but that does not mean literally to be circumcised again and again, because before long you’ll run out of …, or if it does, you’d think the feminists would love that.
Anyway, it’s no business of the state, and a constitutionally protected religious decision to be made by individuals in families, particularly the parents.
In christianity, the symbol of the iron fisted will of the state is the cross, which the romans used to kill hundreds of thousands of jews in Israel in addition to the rabbi Jessua. Never trust the state to do anything but intrude on your land, your property, and in your life where it does not belong. Eternal vigilance is the only thing to keep the state in line, and stop it from imposing its myriad political fads.
Yes, it’s antisemitic. You can tell at a glans.
[Rimshot]
Take a slice — please!
Keep the tip.
There are synapses formed to remember this jest now. I must fry them…
The Chronicle article describes the hero as a “blonde”. Thought the hero would look like SuperGirl, but I see now from above that it is a guy. Chronicle typos are bad enough, but the proofreader should have known from the comic that “blond” is the correct spelling.
Maybe “Aryan” would a more apt description….just sayin’
Both spellings are correct.
Yes both spellings are correct, but the usages are not the same. Blond refers to males and sometimes females but “blonde” with an “e” is used exclusively to refer to females.
Excellent sleuthing continues from zombie – many thanks for your thankless work from a long time fan!
One of the ironies of life is that Hitler tried to get rid of the Jews only to be conquered by a massive army of circumcised men. Unlike the Europeans, Americans, majority Christian, routinely circumcised and still do. It’s not obligatory in CHristianity, but has demonstrable hygenie and personal health advantages. The whinging and whining from narcissist junk-obsessed males is ridiculous. Obviously life is too easy to have to be making up trials and tribulations.
THe Left sure is pushing hard ..e r pushing ah to convince people circumcision is a tragedy for their little metros. It wasn’t tricky to identify a male Jew in Europe, but with 90% circumcision rates in the USA, the blonde, blue-eyed Nordics are nearly as likely as Jews to be “in that way.” Right now in the USA, they can’t isolate out the Jews.
Just the fussy Liberals talk pompously about saving their kid … and then a few years down the road, a few urinary track infections later and ya don’t hear about why the kid had surgery for “something.” ahem.
Circumcision is especially important in Third World conditions where it’s harder to maintain cleanliness – lack of water, lack of clean water etc. Circumcised men have fewer health issues, uncircumcised men have higher HIV/AIDS rates – evidently the virus lives a bit longer harbored in the foreskin, increasing the odds for infection.
Ya’d think THAT would interest San Fran, but nooo. Proof that some OTHER reason is the driving motivator. The macho Nordic in the comic is a second joke. The blonde, blue-eyed European males have been attacked for years by the Left as racist bad boys, so whassup with retreating behind THAT stereotype now?
I am partial to the wait till 14 suggestion: the Kenyan tribal people I lived with, the Bukusu, are infamous in Kenya for their circumcision practices. I witnessed an all nighter, triple circumcision of a trio of 12 year olds. They had to STAND in front of the ENTIRE family and get cut, no painkillers, and NO BLINKING. The kids were offered a hospital procedure, but they refused because they wanted to do it the MANLY way.
Looks like the Bukusu are on to something – the manhood rite of passage. Downright refreshing to see manliness celebrated instead of WIMPINESS. AMericans actually have a subtle advantage over Europeans – most Africans approve of male circumcision, know it as manhood passage, so they are reassured with American guys, but those Europeans … hmmm.
The Bukusu are ALSO infamous for their sport of ambushing their tribal neighbors, the uncircumcised LUOs and “fixing” them. The Luos are Obama’s father’s tribal group. Small world!
Thanks, but I’m rather glad that my parents had it done at my birth. . Some things are just a little too macho.
Heh. Just pointing out that the whinging about “losing” something they hadn’t a clue they’d lost until decades after is pretty whiney pathetic. We COULD do it as the Bukusu do it, so they are VERY AWARE it occured. It’s just pathetic to have a bunch of 12 year olds out macho the typical San Franscisco adult male wuss. After the successful no blink circumcision, the boys are MEN, asociating henceforth with MEN, and given what they endured to get that title, who would quibble with them?
There are a lot worse things to endure out there than infant male circumcision. Like cutting out the four bottom teeth, which is common for both males and females in some tribes. Or worse, having to listen to the self-absorbed tyrant nanny bigots on the SF City Council.
Surely they didn’t think they were deceiving anyone, did they? Their intent is more painfully obvious than the procedure itself.
Have you considered that this might be over-the-top satire? I mean, lefties are generally indistinguishable from Italian fascists, but they generally avoid the Teutonic Master Race fillip.
From their “About” page:
http://www.foreskinman.com/about.htm
“Matthew Hess is president of MGM Billboards, a San Diego, California USA based group working to enact legislation that would protect boys from forced circumcision.”
What makes you think they honestly ever avoided the “Teutonic Master Race fillip”? Maybe underground it for a while. But looking at modern liberal politics, their goals align consistently with all the totalitarian control freaks throughout history, and chauvinism/jingoism is a major theme, along with disarmament and oppression of those they consider their inferiors.
“they generally avoid the Teutonic Master Race fillip”
Huh? When?
Listen to the left prattle long enough, and you’ll hear them say things that makes you realize the whole eugenics movement just went underground. The Nazi paganism? Still there. The Nazi environmental and dietary “purity”? Still there. Nazi economics? Still there.
Sure looks like the lefties are channeling their inner Nazi. Hard to believe this is not parody, but nowadays, maybe not. We seem to be losing our grip on civilization.
Great….maybe the publishers will do a pop-up Protocols of the Elders of Zion book next….about as subtle
Sorry, but, have you ever tasted a man with his foreskin…BLECHK!!!!…all that smegma and cheeze…EEEwwwww!it’s Gross….I don’t like a man that looks like a horse! or smells like one…
Have you ever tasted a womans vagina who has not washed? Much the same thing. It has nothing to do with foreskin. How about if we cut off your Clit as a baby?
Unless you had to have your foreskin removed as an adult, there is no way you could “miss” it. You might wish you had it, but you’ve been without it your entire conscious life.
By the way, if San Francisco is so misguided as to pass this proposed First Amendment violation, you won’t get your foreskin back. You are aware of that, aren’t you?
As a teen, and yes sensitivity is lost. It is my opinion that a child’s rights to not be physically mutilated outweighs the parents 1st amendment rights(I made my own choice but it was the wrong one). Does the first amendment allow parents to preform female genital mutilation because its their religion? It has been proven to be traumatic to babies, people also used to use the first amendment to “prove” that it was OK to beat their kids. Yes mine is gone forever, I tried to make a poor tattoo choice as a kid too, fortunately it was against the law for me to make that decision until older, I wish it had been the same for circumcision.
Choices have consequences. Grow up and learn to live with that reality.
Female genital mutilation has proven, visible, demonstrable deleterious health effects. Circumcision has not been “proven to be traumatic to babies” by any legitimate study—though it appears that a lot of grownup babies have managed to think themselves into something resembling a “trauma” by obsessing over it.
As far as “parental choice” is concerned, there is absolutely no evidence that Jews, the most common practitioners of circumcision in the West, have been damaged by circumcision in any way; it has not prevented Jewish achievement, nor Jewish reproduction, nor Jewish enjoyment of sex. So where is your “evidence”?
“It is my opinion that a child’s rights to not be physically mutilated outweighs the parents 1st amendment rights”
Do tell me how you reconciled in your leftism drenched mind how a male child has a right to his foreskin over his parents wishes, but a baby fetus has no right to it’s life over it’s mother’s wishes?
You guys are making some pretty strong assumptions based on my position on Circumcision. I want small government and do not want the government to have a say in what we do with our own bodies, I am opposed to them passing a law. That being said, I will speak out against the practice based on my personal experience and research. If you do some of your own research you will find plenty of data both for and against and even more that say it doesn’t matter. I have some personal experience with before and after that you will never have (assuming that you were cut as a kid, otherwise cut it of now and see the difference for yourself) I’m not crying about it, i’m detailing an experience of mine, just as I would not recommend that 14 year olds purchase tattoos I do not recommend that they get circumcisions and I am strongly against parents doing so to children especially for purely religious reasons. If your god said “Cut off the babies earlobes” which would neither harm nor mater in life, would we allow parents to continue to do this in this modern day and age? At one time in history this was a decent practice for health reasons, now we have soap, we don’t “bleed” people with leaches any more either, we don’t beat our kids, we shouldn’t cut off their body parts. As to the abortion issue the difference is simple, an aborted fetus does not have a life (nor did it ever have one) to be concerned with a missing body part. But again, if you want to abuse your kids out of religious and health ignorance go ahead. lets keep the government and my tax money out of it.
Sensitivity is lost? How do you know?
Beyond that it’s nigligible. It does not harm the function in any way, shape, or form.
It does not cause social issues due to its absence.
It does not concern anyone else nor does it impact anyone in its absence.
Thus I deem it fine to be circucised. Sure there might be a few oddballs who whimper over it but otherwise there is no issue.
“As to the abortion issue the difference is simple, an aborted fetus does not have a life (nor did it ever have one)”
Wrong.
Not sure where you get your definition of life-form from but it isn’t science.
I’ve got an even better idea: how about you just knit your short-arm some festive cozies, pop a few Midol, and consider that whatever malfunctions/shortcomings you’re experiencing with “Little I.M.M.F.” MIGHT NOT HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE CIRCUMCISION.
Or, if there’s really a market of circumcised men out there who think that their Clintons are somehow less sensitive now, make lemons out of lemonade: launch a line of mink-lined condoms or something, and get rich. With that kind of scratch, you can find a street bum (just go outside, it’s S.F.) and PAY him for his foreskin. They just did a FACE transplant somewhere in the Midwest, for God’s sake!
You’re welcome.
Well now it all makes sense. You made a choice you regret, so now you must “protect” everyone else from being allowed to make a choice.
Grow up.
I was circumcised as an adult — of my own volition, after discovering I was technically Jewish. Was s3xually active (with the same lady) before and after, so have a control experiment. Being with her, the pluses actually outweigh the minuses — especially in terms of “staying power”.
But boy, did I wish my parents had this done to me at birth or 8 days! Adult male circumcision, especially if the local anesthetic doesn’t “block”, is quite painful…
The Victorian claim that circumcision makes self-abuse [sic] more difficult does have a grain of truth. So of course, a bunch of compulsive (literal and intellectual) self-strokers would have a good incentive to try and impose a ban on circumcision
I had no idea what a foreskin was until fifth-grade “health” class (sex-segregated sex education, with the blinds pulled down for good measure–this was in the early seventies). Our instructor (who doubled as the assistant gym teacher) was so vague in his description of what a foreskin was and where it was to be found that I had no idea then and there whether I’d been circumcised or not. Didn’t know I ever had a foreskin, didn’t miss it when I finally figured out what it was and that it was gone. Never met a woman who expected to see one, or who was disappointed when she didn’t.
Why assume Booboo is a guy?
Um, you’re not very good with the female anatomy if you are comparing the clitoris with the foreskin, bub. Lopping off the clitoris would be like removing the entire head of the penis, not just the foreskin.
Midsa is awesome,right, and not retarded. Where did that guy learn basic human anatomy? I just cut my nails short so you should cut your fingers off so you know my pain?
The stance on abortion is stupid too, ever hear of partial birth abortion? The baby is alive and generally left to die from neglect…You know, like what would happen TO ANY CHILD UNDER THE AGE OF 3. Dude’s just not informed at all.
Now that was just nassy Boo-boo. I could’ve gone all DAY without reading that. Your proclivities are yours and between you and your husband. Howzabout we keep ‘em that way, eh? A little decorum in the forum goes a long way kiddies.
What stuns me is how so called liberals these days can be against Jews, but claim to be for civil rights. I thought Jews were people too.
“Smegma and Cheese”? I don’t know what kind of men you’re giving BJ’s to, but I for one shower every day, and part of my daily hygiene includes sliding back my foreskin to keep the area clean. It’s as easy as washing behind your ears.
(Personally I think it’s a myth they tell cut boys so they don’t feel so bad about it.)
For those who say it makes no functional difference, this isn’t true, since a on a circumsized penis, the outer skin is taut, while on an uncut penis the outer skin is free to slide up and down the shaft (Which, unfortunately makes condom use a real pain).
But I’d wager the REAL reason this is getting so much traction in S.F. is that Foreskins are a well-known fetish among the gay population.
Next, Mel Gibson and Lars von Trier will make this a major motion picture, with the soundtrack taken from the works of Richard Wagner.
There’s never a Rabbi with a machine gun around when you need him.
Or a Hobo with a Shotgun for that matter.
What’d I miss?
“What did I miss?”
Reference to the pic above with the Mohel and his molls with the machine guns…because no bris is complete without a shootout…
Excellent!You win the ‘Best Message’ prize!
When you compare the consequences of those plying the “for the children” gambit to their stated goals, there’s always a vas deferens. (Sorry Z, I know: I should control myself better.)
Andrew Sullivan just got a pup tent seeing that.
Pity these soi-disant “Nordics”
Who simply can’t ignore dicks
And find meaning in opposing circumcision
Because whatever’s done
To somebody’s infant son
Is—quite rightly—the parents’ own decision
Oh, they can scream “Coercion!”
But that argument’s perversion,
Substituting state coercion for the parents’—
And since thousands of years have shown
There is no damage to the “bone”
The reason for their opposition is apparent
Not that it’s any news
That these “activists” hate Jews
And that is really what drives their agenda
But this comic makes it plain—
It’s just Nazis, at it again,
Hiding behind concern for male pudenda
You just won 10 Internets.
I’m shocked, shocked I tell you!
Okay, I’m not. Having noticed all the anti-Zionist signage at leftie protests for a while now, the rampant anti-Semitism in this measure is quite apparent.
Why not simply say that circumcision won’t be mandatory or routine (as it has been performed on the majority of male babies for the past 100 years or so); that it would only be done for religious reasons. Nope… because that wouldn’t target Jews, now, would it?
Funny how they don’t portray any evil Muslims mutilating their boys, too… or for that matter, evil Muslims giving clitoridectomies to their females. I guess clitorises aren’t nearly as important in SF as foreskins…
Seriously? Are you sure this isn’t a hoax of some kind?
Is this really affiliated with the anti-circumcision loonies in SF?
If it is for real, how in the Hell did it get on an SF ballot?
Yes it is real. Follow the links in the story.
The comic is put out by the group that got the measure on the ballot in San Francisco and Santa Monica.
As a commenter cited above:
From their “About” page:
http://www.foreskinman.com/about.htm
“Matthew Hess is president of MGM Billboards, a San Diego, California USA based group working to enact legislation that would protect boys from forced circumcision.”
The question, I think, is, “Is this seriously the official campaign brochure for the anti-circumcision campaign?”
People – with normal, working consciences, anyway – are a little shocked by the idea that a campaign could be this openly anti-semitic in its official propaganda.
I don’t know if it is “official” anti-circ crap, but….haven’t heard a single one of the “intactivists” I know condemn this, and it’s been out over a year. I posted a link to this on my FB page and my anti-circ nutjob sister in law ignored it (and she usually doesn’t let an opportunity pass to spout some half-edumacated drivel whenever she can.)
Silence implies consent….just sayin’.
The question is more like, why did it take SF so long to put it on the ballot.
Don,
Having lived in SF for 2 years working at my first serious job after graduation at Bechtel (and merrily jumping onto the old streetcars to commute to work with my sleek black briefcase, coat and tie and the whole bit — “Joe business man”) — and before that having spent 3 years at UC Berkeley on the other side of the Bay where it can, in many respects get even crazier (hence “the People’s Republic of Bezerkeley”) I can concur with with “Walt C” either above or below me (not sure where my comment will turn up) — namely, the question is, what took San Francisco so long to address such a pressing national issue
I mean SF (sotto voice) “lead the nation” with enacting blatantly illegal Gay marriages (and I have no problem at ALL, BTW, with wills, and all the other legal documents and legal benefits that marital spouses currently enjoy being enjoyed also by “Gay Spouses” — NONE AT ALL.
But the word “marriage” is inherently a “religious conception.” For G-d’s sake even Barney Fife, I mean Frank was DEAD-SET against it when SF’s mayor started doing the Gay Marriage thing (seriously, he was — it takes some degree of being able to judge the political winds to stay in office as long as he has especially with some of his “other problems” (ahem).
Frank knew his fired-up cohorts in SF were pushing things just a bit too hard when what is affectionately (NOT) known as “Flyover country” got wind that the “Gay Marriage machine” had its switch flipped to the “ON” position in SF.
Frank’s many things, but he’s not a stupid politician, I’ll say that for him. Had his friend simple… SIMPLY called what they wanted a different noun OTHER THAN “marriage,” they would have gone much further. But the flaunting is what did them in.
But I go far astray.
My point is, look at that issue, how it played out, and consider this utterly despicable issues, which my CHRISTIAN friends are even mailing me about! This, I tell you has not happened to me in AGES. Considering this comes upon the heels of the flat out warmest reception the entire US Congress, “the people,” gave to the leader of “the Jewish Nation”… their timing (in SF) could not be worse.
And it’s my sincere hope that just as in the Gay Marriage fiasco, this will meet with an equal amount of blow-back. The only, and unfortunately critical difference here is that this piece of chara targets only Judaism, not “Christendom” as did the former.
I think I’ve made my point and more. Sorry for the extra verbiage.
– FF
Those cartoons were as open as it gets. The left has been heading this way for years now and no one should be surprised where they are now. I wonder how the hard left Jews are going to handle this. It can’t be disguised as “anti-Israel” anymore.
By the way, you have to guffaw at the laziness and stupidity of the artist, who tries to draw a striped tallis (prayer shawl) which ends up looking like the school scarf that is given to Spencer Tracy in Desk Set.
It’s also pretty funny that, despite the ease with which one can find images of Hasidim, he draws the hats as if he were doing the Dickfight at the Intact Corral, or something, in addition to getting the hair wrong.
the same people who are pro abortion are anti circumcision. go figure…..
The hypocrisy of the Left is never ending. They seek to ban circumcision based upon an infant’s right to avoid an “unnecessary procedure,” yet have no problem with late term abortions.
Yes, Mike2, it’s getting harder and harder for the anti-semetic left to hide behind the “I’m not anti-semetic, I’m anti-Zionist!” meme, anymore.
The truth will out, sometimes.
By the way—I love the one letter at the original website from a fan who wants Foreskin Man to shoot laser beams from his super-powered foreskin.
(Great poem, as always, buzz.)
Yep, they are having real trouble hiding their poison now. Sooner or later all this crud will really start pouring out of the far left. It’s like a pot boiling, after a while it has to boil over and the left wing pot has been boiling since Stalin decided that Israel was not going to be a Communist country.
Peacekeeper, I love the idea of “Rabbi with a Machine Gun!”
Someone should do a comic strip of the same! Seriously!
There are very few times I ever find myself agreeing with a Liberal but on this subject I am in complete agreement. A man has a right to keep his body intact. If a stupid woman has a right to kill her unborn child because she is too lazy to take precautions then a man has a right to keep his FORESKIN! I have mine and believe me if you are cut then my friend call the cops because YOU WAS ROBBED! Screw the whales, save our foreskins,
If an unborn baby doesn’t have the right to stay alive, why should a 8 day newborn have the right to keep his foreskin? Parental choice trumps one, it trumps the other, no?
A ban on circumcision is like the foreskin itself, just… a little…over the top…
The comic is anti-semitic, the ban is pro-semitic, since it protects young Jewish and Muslim boys from being genitally mutilated. (and other boys too).
There is no need to cripple a child’s genitals for the sake of religion, what if they grow up to resent it? Lots of people do not want religion when older in their lives, and some circumcised boys end up with a broken penis, many with discomfort when having sex, it’s just not a good idea in general, there are many good reasons as to why there is a foreskin attached.
A circumcision is no big deal for an adult, at which point our duty of care is discharged and they can do whatever, circumcision, tattoo, Prince Albert or whatever, by all means tie a knot into your wurst if you want to — we don’t care when it’s your informed choice and you had the opportunity to say no.
So much stupid in one paragraph.
Circumcision does not “break” anything. There are, of course, botched circumcisions, just as there are also foreskins which have to be removed because they are deformed or faulty. Life is not perfect.
You apparently have no concept of what “religion” means, or what commandments mean as part of a religion. And since you cannot understand that, there is probably no point in explaining to you why a law written and supported by bigots in clear contravention of the First Amendment is a bad idea.
Circumcision removes a huge part of the penis, botched circumcision removes the entire penis or part thereof to the point of non-functionality.
Understand I’m not against people wanting to mutilate themselves once they are old enough to decide to do it, but babies are another matter, leave them alone, they can decide for themselves when they are old enough. That’s all that’s being asked of you, no-one is banning circumcision, what is being banned is the child abuse itself.
And if you think that religiousness is defined by the foreskin and reduced to nothingness if it’s present on a baby, then this is your problem not mine. Besides that, the Jewish religion is mutable, customs and rites have been abandoned (for example, Polygamy) when they didn’t fit life anymore or didn’t makes sense in modern times.
—
(just kidding, you have a terrible argumentation pattern there, it’s a complete train crash, back to Logic 101 with you!)
Person with the vestigal tail: Don’t bother trying. And I think you should look to suing the surgeon, because you sound as if you still have a tail, but not all the brain has been retained, perhaps he had you upside down when he removed the extra growth from your body?
You know, I haven’t told many gals this in my lifetime, especially hippie gals, but perhaps this is one time to let the boys be boys, and girls go to the kitchen. Because your retort has to be either parody, or you flunked basic anatomy.
I can assure you my circumsized penis is the most “functional”, “dependable” part of me – some times, too functional. I can prove it too.
You do not judge the operation based on what happens when it fails unless the failure rate is excessive.
That “large” part is not that large or necessary (nephew was just born and his pipes do work).
Sorry Charlie but having been circumcised I lose nothing.
It’s a safe procedure that doesn’t harm anyone any more than pulling a tooth. Even less than pulling a tooth.
So as much madam feel free to butt out.
FYI the bill won’t save anyone because there is nothing to save them from.
Rightwinghippychick, you have absolutely no idea what you’re talking about.
It’s called foreSKIN, not forePENIS. It is SKIN. Granted, there are more nerve endings in there than, say, the back of your hand, a circumsised penis works just fine and is not disfigured or mutilated.
I’m Irish Cathoic and was circumsise. I don’t remember a thing about the procedure, nor do I ever miss my foreskin. In fact, when I have the occasion to see an uncircumsised penis, I quietly thank my parents having mine done. Those things are gross.
For the life of me I can’t understand why this is an issue for anybody at all.
Rightwinghippychick, if you think that circumcision removes a “huge part of the penis”…..you either don’t know male anatomy AT ALL, or….you’ve been with a bunch of guys whose parents used a chainsaw when a scalpel will do.
Thanks for the laugh, though. Sometimes stupid IS funny!
It does NOT remove a huge part. I have not seen the “health” issue mentioned here for circumcision. Everyone is hung up on the “religious” aspect. The foreskin harbors bacteria, giving it a nice warm, sheltered place to grow. It is much harder for males to keep continuously clean. Yeast infections are very difficult to get rid of, no matter how much the woman treats it, if her husband is uncircumcised. I discovered that after a long bout with one.
There were many things that did not make sense to us, such as the ritual with “molds” on items or in a home. Read about it in the Tanach. Boring! But now that we know about molds that kill, makes sense doesn’t it. Then we have the clean vs unclean food, I like to use the word “healthy” in place of clean. Many of those foods we would not eat. Our digestive system could not take them. Shell fish absorbs all the bad stuff & fish with scales do not.
There is a good reasons for circumcision and the infant heals quicker, and even nicer, he doesn’t remember the pain. Many other surgeries for infants are decided by the parent, many life saving ones. Maybe they should wait on those too…oh wait, the child would not have survived to the age to be able to decide if they wanted it done. Don’t even compare what they do to a girl, very different REASON and outcome.
“Circumcision removes a huge part of the penis”. Yes that’s my excuse. It used to be so much larger than it is now.
RightwinghippyChick, that has got to be one of the dumbest comments on here.
Circumcision is no big deal for adults?!? I’ve known several people who have had circumcisions as adults. It is a VERY big deal. It is VERY painful. It typically takes a month or two to recover from it.
One person said that after his medically necessary circumcision, he concluded that he would circumcise his sons as infants, because the risk of pain experienced as an adult wasn’t worth the “benefits” of being uncircumcised.
As for my son’s infant circumcision (and probably mine, for that matter, since I don’t remember my circumcision), he recovered after a week, and he is no more traumatized than he is when he’s vaccinated, or when he has severe diaper rash.
You are very correct on that. Adult male circumcision takes a month to heal. (the traditional cultures provide a special hut for recovery – and 30 days is the time span). In the Bible, adult circumcision is described as debilitating the males – to the point of being vulnerable to attack – and was used once expressly to disable the fighting men against attack).
In contrast, an infant grows incredibly fast, so with all the cell growth, complete healing takes only ten days, and during those ten days the infant is far less aware of discomfort than an adult would be. We witnessesd it: There was NO difference between eating, sleeping and awake patterns of our daughters versus our circumcised sons. NONE. Slept like… babes and ate very well and were quite civil when awake. No random crying that some more milk couldn’t fix or any distress at all. If an infant’s circumcised area was hurting, the parents would KNOW. Infants aren’t diplomatic. Ya KNOW they have a problem. They cry.
“Cripple”??????? Cripple????? are you KIDDING ME! There is almost NO FEELING, extremely little SENSATION on the top of MY penis (and this is true for either circumcised or uncircumcised males, look at a Physiology book for Christ sake! Flesh cut further away doesn’t affect the flesh closer TO the spine and brain).
On the other hand, a Clitoris has to have at least 2 factors of 10 MORE nerve endings… it’s by FAR the center of pleasure of a woman (not that there aren’t others). But so much FGM is done on dirt floors of huts in North Africa with elderly female family members having previously conspired to grab and then drag and then hold down the POST-PUBESCENT SCREAMING girl and then hack away with a crude knife, utterly not sanitized.
The two are completely incomparable. UTTERLY INCOMPARABLE. Only in the best of circumstances is the girl, in a more rich family, still under false pretenses brought to an actual clinic or hospital where there is sanitation.
It totally destroys ANY credentials you may have thought you had as a “feminist” to say what you said!
–FF
There’s a big difference between circumcision and polygamy in the Jewish religion. Circumcision is a command from God that you have to do it to be included in the covenant and a parent who doesn’t do it to his child is essentially sinning every moment he fails to do so. This is as opposed to Polygamy which the bible doesn’t exactly put in a positive light in the first place, not to mention there’s no commandment to have multiple wives (unlike in certain groups of hardcore Mormons).
Ok now I really gotta read that.
That was just to stupid, and hilarious.
I know I’m not supposed to laugh at it but dear lord I can’t stop.
Why not ban tattoo parlors? Piercings? Other body modifications?
Oh, that’s right. It’s not hostile to Judaism…
If male circumcision were medically deleterious in any way, I would be against it too. But it is not. We might as well rant at piercing the ears of little girls. In the scheme of things that a city has to concern itself with, why bother with this?
What else could this be but a veiled attempt at antisemitism? I anxiously await the outcome if the City should pass this legislation. Will Sex magically improve for someone? How would anyone know?
This is an utter waste of time, money, and resources to accomplish a goal that is unmeasurable. I would expect nothing less from this city.
Mine got chopped off as a baby, and guess what. . .never missed it, never gave it a second thought, and don’t care. Don’t hate my parents. . .don’t hate my life. That part works JUST FINE.
Meanwhile, I think you could search the world over, and not find another city so obsessed with male sexual organs as San Francisco.
Frankly, I’ve love to SF pass this bill, prove just how “progressive” they are, then have every Jew in the city pick up and leave never to return. That could be followed up by a permanent boycott of the city of SF by every Jew, Muslim, and person of faith on the globe.
I’m glad to see the Left finally releasing their inner-Nazi. San Francisco Socialist Workers Party: Sazi? SaFrazi?
Does it strike anybody else that this ban ” about “human rights” and “protecting babies” from unnecessary procedures” is coming from people who will stand and fight for a woman’s “right” to murder that same baby a couple weeks before they will ban her from this horrendous unnecessary procedure?
San Fran-anti-semetic-sicko!
Good point, Rob Crawford; also, I’m wondering when Mr. Hess (Gotta love that name!) is going to do a comic strip about eeeeeeevill Mad Mullahs, grabing boys and circumsing them for Allah?
I mean, he is gonna do that, right? Right? ‘Cuz it’s all about saving the foreskins, right, and Moslems practice circumcision too, so he’s gonna go after them, right?
Isn’t he? I mean, he’s so brave and outstoken and a champeen of foreskins, right? So he’ll after Islam too, right?
Right?
Yes, the same people who support abortion are against circumcision. It’s really not about “The Children.” It’s about anti-semetism, and about a strange, bath-house aesthetic that sees uncircumsized males as being more atractive than circumcized ones (for whatever reason.)
Human rights got nothing to do with it. These same people also go in for all sorts of bizzare tattoos, piercings, breast implants and the like, which are far more dangerous than circumcision.
“and about a strange, bath-house aesthetic that sees uncircumsized males as being more atractive than circumcized ones (for whatever reason.)”
I guess the SanFran gays need more uncirced guys for “docking”…
so, according to the comic, it is better for some random in a super hero getup to abduct a family’s infant than performing a very common medical procedure
would san francisco issue the amber alert?
Ya know, Rightwinghippiechick, I was born with a vestigial tail, which my doctor, according to the practice of the time, chopped off. I believe I shall now become bitter and resentful, BECAUSE SOMEONE CHOPPED OFF MY TAIL! I WANT MY TAIL BACK! I BLAME MY PARENTS!
WE SHOULD NEVER REMOVE VESTIGIAL TAILS, BECAUSE KIDS MIGHT RESENT IT, AND NOW THEY CAN USE THEIR TAILS TO SWING FROM TREE BRANCHES!
(By the way, if you think Jewish parents can just shine on being circumcized, you know very little about Jewish law, and religious practice; you should study up on it. Circumcision ain’t optional. It’s like banning holy communion for Catholics, or Bible study, or Protestants.)
Ja wohl, daxypoo! San Francisco would never issue an amber alert. The pure, Ayran superhero must take the youngster to a proper “Foreskin Youth” group, where he can be raised properly under the mentoring of uncircumcised, manly guys, who will take him to the YMCA, where his—ahem—natural, uncut state will please all the manly men of Baghdad by the Bay. . .
dang!!
my mom recently informed me that i had my first swimming lessons at the YMCA– the horror
If they’re really concerned with the human rights of the baby, maybe they should ban abortion instead.
Yes, that would be logical and compassionate, to ban abortion, an act of violence that kills a baby. A ban would be a genuine protection of life, which is exactly why they will not do so.
Ding-Ding-Ding! We Have A Winner!!!
Sure, they’d like to keep foreskins – and yet throw fetuses into bio-hazard bins. The total hypocrisy!
The Two Minutes Hate is the same as the last Two Minutes Hate.
Tolerant my @$$.
Pitiful.
Could’ve been a reprint from Der Sturmer, the Julius Streicher rag from the Hitlerzeit. And these people consider themselves enlightened and liberal? Bah.
Foreskin is the perfect example of a vistigual organ. It is a reminder of the time when in the throws of evolution our penises were only the length of the head and had a skin covering to protect them. As man evolved so did the penises. I think there is a dramatic inverse correlation with the size of a man’s penis and the size of his brain. But, that’s off track; however, I’m sure that there is many a woman who can probably testify to that.
In a practical sense, a circumcised penis is cleaner than one that’s not. Being that is the inarguable case, let’s list its benefits. There is a dramatic difference between the incidents of infection and cancer between the circumcised and the uncircumcised. The circumcised have fewer urinary problems that the uncircumcised. That’s just on the male side. On the female side, there was a study that linked uncircumcised penises with higher incidents of cervical cancer. STDs are not the only thing that can be passed along with sex. In the term infection, there is a simple message. It is catching. That means that if a man has a urinary infection, a fungal type of infection such as yeast, a clamidial infection, a viral infection, or a parasitic infestation, all these are transferable by sex. That little huddy that the guy is wearing is a perfect place to store such an infection.
Circumcision has always been a sore point with anti-Semites, pardon the pun. There seems to be a real fear that the women will like them better. Maybe they seem cuter. To those who are against it, don’t try to protect me from it. I still have plenty for the fun stuff in life. Anti-Semites are hard to figure, they want the heads of our penises covered but object to us wearing a covering on our heads. Do they really know which end really needs to be covered? Why didn’t the cartoon feature a Moslem Mullah as a circumcissionist? Where is the objection to female genital mutilation? Why do I even have to write this stupid thing? I think I’ll just go off to a quiet corner with my head in my hand. Bye, folks!
Have you tried ‘washing’?
You see, all the diseases you described occur from bad hygiene, and men who don’t wash, circumcised or not are simply gross.
I hope you don’t use the same logic applied to your teeth — because without teeth, you save a lot of money and agony(no root canals or fillings, yay!), plus, think of all the time you save not having to brush them.
Not to be a pain, but circumcision became a common practice in the United States (at least) after WWI.
During trench warfare, uncircumcised men suffered more urinary tract infections and other problems than did circumcised ones.
The observation carried over into civilian practice; I have not noticed that it kept men from sex, enjoying sex, and so on. I really do not believe there is any kind of functional deficit, or lack of pleasure, caused by circumcision.
Not to put too fine a point on it, but most guys (sorry, I really love men, but they have, without women, some sad habits) on their own live like bears in caves, and bathe less than they should. Having dated men who were uncircumcised, even with very clean habits, I would ask that guys get circumcised. For one thing, circumcision makes using a condom a lot easier.
This is embarressing — mutilating boys because ‘men don’t wash’ — got any more misandrist ideas? Putting the condom on as another reason is also rich… yeah, so men get cut so women can fool around safely because the condom fits better?
Why don’t we lobotimise the men at the same time, and then feminists can finally shut up about ‘all men being violent by definition too’ — in fact, feminists are probably already planning to have boys’ sex changed instead of messing around with a wimpy mutilation. And the feminists will probably claim that after the operation, the underpants will fit better too.
You know what’s really sick about people like you? You’re pushing the idea that males who have been circumcised are “disfigured” or “mutilated”. That is absolutely disgusting and you should be ashamed of yourself.
And beyond that you are about as ignorant as anyone I’ve ever seen pontificating on the practice, which just makes your bullying activism that much worse.
Sometimes men CAN’T wash for some days due to a little thing called “being in the military”. Probably not a big feature of hippie life, but in the field you might go days where the only things that get cleaned are teeth and toes.
Now ladies, I didn’t mean to get you fighting over my penis. That truly wasn’t my intention.
On the other hand I don’t mind pissing off RightwingHippyChick. Lady, you really have some balls. I would never comment on whether you had a Brazilian or a full bush. Nor would I legislate one or the other or try to impose my will on you. What you have in your pants is your business and what I have in mine is my business. Don’t pontificate, don’t lecture, and go back to your modern mass produced electronic penises. Leave us alone to practice our religion. Also leave alone those Americans who are wise enough to recognize the health benefits of circumcision. I do have one question. Is it hard to find an uncircumcised dildo?
But doesn’t it sting
When you soap that thing?
I’m not “misandrist”. I’m a misanthrope – I think badly of human beings in general!
Get a clue – this is an idiotic law, and the comic is anti-semitic. Further, this debate strikes me as a form of hysteria, where a tiny matter unworthy of discussion becomes a means by which people who have lost mental balance divide “good” from “bad.”
This nasty comic merely reveals how unbalanced certain segments of our population have become.
you know, I am always queasy about giving my opinion on women’s issues… not being one.Apparently the reverse is not true, women can tell men stuff they obviously don’t know about their unit.
I can however tell you that being uncircumsized is a bad deal. no matter how clean you stay, you aren’t really clean. Peeing in the middle of the night? an adventure. I wish my parents had not decided I didn’t need to be circumsized.
The city (no longer spell it with a capital “C”, as did Herb Caen) is a garbage dump, but those who run or seek to run it think this sort of ban is important. Paging Andy Sully…
Well, my son was circumised in the hospital at three days. It was for health and hygiene reasons. At that time ’69, it was thought that there was lower incidents of penile cancers and cervical cancers when the male was circumsied. Of course those were the days of monogomy not the sexual libertism of today. Personaly, I’d vote against the measure. I still believe Mommy and Daddy know best.
I can see the explanatory “logic” of the cartoonist and friends now:
We’re not antisemitic, we just criticize Israel…
We’re not against Jews, we just criticize the Orthodox crazies
The righteous left can’t be evil, by definition. We’re the progressives…!
But perhaps this is all inevitable; notwithstanding the genuine tolerance which many contemporary Jews and Israelis express towards homosexuality, parts of the homosexual left cannot leave off resenting the religion that evolved as a radical alternative to the classical world of polygamy, pederasty, and child sacrifice. Substituting for that triad, an emphasis on monogamous marriage, family life, and circumscision, Judaism in some sense invented a concept of (male) homosexuality as something bad. There is certainly a section of homosexual culture that continues to hold a deep grudge against Judaism for just this reason. Obviously this circumcision business is just a screen for the deeper issue, whether or not there really is a choice to be made between the pagan and the Judeo-Christian.
Where is there any link between this comic and San Francisco? The link provided only says that this group is (a) from San Diego; and (b) “working to enact legislation that would protect boys from forced circumcision.”
From those two facts, the author eagerly jumps to the conclusion that proponents of the SF ban are antisemitic. Obviously, the comic book folks are antisemitic. But there is no evidence that they are in any way connected to the SF ban. More importantly, there is no reason to think that every proponent of the SF ban is antisemtic just because one loony group from San Diego is antisemitic.
Dan, yes there is evidence they are linked. The campaign bought the comic books and are distributing them, for one thing. See http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/djsaunders/detail?entry_id=90153
“It has been proven to be traumatic to babies”
I’m not sure how you’d devise the methodology to establish such a fact, but surely tiny babies – and older ones even – must be traumatised by many, many things?
Babies get sick. They get all kinds of pain. They experience hunger, thirst, discomfort, distress, fear and shock – all these things occur on a pretty regular basis for most small babies. Because they cannot verbalise their distress it must be quite traumatic simply to be a baby.
Then there are some born with medical conditions that require varying degrees of intervention. Some immensely painful and traumatic, I’d imagine.
All in all, I’m not sure why these people in SF are singling out one experience out of so many potentials.
“It has been proven to be traumatic to babies”
How exactly? Babies memories are inchoate and don’t begin to have long-term memories until around age three. Do YOU remember anything from when you were less than a year old? Do you know what is far more traumatic for a baby? Leaving a warm floating womb and being forcibly shoved down a narrow vaginal passageway into a cold, dry, bright frightening world.
I think a little nip-o’-the-tip doesn’t quite compare.
Cheshire… you said that more beautifully… with more elegance and eloquence than I could ever hope to. Thus I redirect all people to Cheshire Cat’s adroit response.
Whew! That’s ugly; bigoted and ugly.! But nothing having to do with San Francisco is surprising anymore.
Do you think abortion is traumatic to a baby?
Or how about birth itself?
Anything that is related to the G-d of Noah, Abraham, and Moses is being attacked by the Left, and has been for about 50 years now. Abortion, Homosexuality, spoling the child, circumcision, sex outside of marriage, etc… is fair game for the world. Those of the world hate G-d the Father, and think themselves as gods.
Just like before Noah’s flood.
Yes, like the days of Noah and the days of Lot, just as the Master said it would be in the days leading up to His Return.
So, so, so true! It’s only gonna get worse, the lines will be clearer than ever as to who will stand with God and who will not.
You’re totally right
consenting adults shouldn’t have the right to do run their lives according their desires with other consenting adults
we should totally punish these people, along with those that eat shrimp and refuse to stone their daughters for adulter
Pretty clearly, that was made by someone working to defeat the ban, don’t you think? If you can follow that twisty logic.
Please don’t construe that as a comment in support of the ban. I’m simply saying this is so over the top no one, regardless of private beliefs, would do it in sincerity. Bad PR. Therefore, it strikes me as fake — as counterpropaganda.
You are very naive, Annie. There are lots of people that sick and bigoted.
If only, my dear…but this is San Francisco we are talking about…subtlety and being sublime is not their forte. Folsom Street Fair? The most recent Easter Day Celebrations? I can go on and on.
Annie — I was forced to take a complete waste of time “communications” course in undergrad at UCSD. Of course, since I’ll now be quoting from it, I cannot fully say it was a waste of time (but it was darn close!)
In any case all we studied – and this is no Bull — was TV shows. Yup. That’s it, “communications” serious study was TELEVISION SHOWS, “compare and contrast.” CHRIST ALMIGHTY! (Excuse me religious compatriot Christians, it’s just a NYC Burroughs phrase that I picked up from my Dad who was a Brooklyn Jew. I should get out of the habit of using it.)
In any case, one thing that did in fact stick with me from this course where all tests were multiple choice, and you’d have to be an utter moron not to get an ‘A’ (and this was BEFORE grade inflation, was that when “All in the Family” first came out (“Archie Bunker & Gang” — anyone older than 45 should remember it well) it was (rightly) a shock to the nation. But most interestingly was that something like (and yes, my memory is a hair fuzzy on the exact numbers, but they COULD EASILY be found out) – something like 50% of the mail that wasn’t sent in to the show (back then people mailed actual letters — I know it’s hard to imagine — but they did, and they’d express support or condemnation for the show, or comment on a character, etc) — the cost was of postage back then — something like 10 cents or less.
Anyway, 50 frickin’ % (percent) thought — and this is no bull — that Archie Bunker, and the show “All in the Family” was NOT, I repeat NOT a comedy (per se). That it was “finally telling the truth” of all those “non-whites” and the rest intelligently, they thought, through the ruse of comedy — I guess they missed that half of everyone on the show was Jewish, but whatever).
So these letter writers were not stupid(!), they heard the laughter and realized that jokes were being made, but they were SO EMOTIONALLY JAZZED at hearing words like “Wop” and “Hymie” and other stereotypical names of ethnic groups (I believe the show was fairly equal opportunity — although I do not believe it ever use the word N****r — that, it at least stayed away from, but it used synonyms that got the point across) — but their non-White buttons were being SO WELL PUSHED by the character “Archie Bunker, that they lost all sense of the wool being pulled over their eyes, and would have marched onto Washington DC had Archie Bunker said that is what he was going to do. So please do not belittle the gullibility of many people in a large continental country like this. I love this country. But many citizens, either through financial problems or other reasons, will grow up and die more or less in their hometown, be incredibly provincial and just not have the power of a college education somewhere else to teach them “critical thinking” on the most mundane level. Most of them are NOT anti-Semitic (I’ve lived all throughout the Midwest and only had respect given to me when I mentioned my Judaism) — further. the polls tell us this same thing. So I don’t mind that we cannot send half the country to other countries for a year, or to university. But a non-trivial amount *are* anti-Semitic, and the have very god access to the internet and know how to use it for their purposes. And this comic book is an example of that as it WILL appeal to the many “Timothy McVeigh’s we still have living in the norther parts of Michigan, Wisconsin, and I won’t mention others since those are the only two in which I have direct personal experience.
So the obvious point is that often, no, MANY MANY not-so-educated people OR people who perhaps ARE educated but have/had latent biases towards these various ethnic groups would think it was “their” special show finally (for once) spilling the truths of all the hippie freaks that had caused so much mayhem in the 1960′s. And one can see how they were lulled into this, even with the laughing.
Back to All in the Family:
So the obvious point is, nothing changes, and while you and I and everyone here (mostly) will “get” that the comic book is ridiculously over the top and hence anti-Semitic, many WILL NOT! And it’s those “unwashed masses” if you’ll allow me a somewhat snobbish and semi-racists term myself who will believe this comic book
H O O K L I N E & S I N K E R.
Trust me, or do your own research on “All in the family.”
I kept sniffing for Onion-flavoring, because this is well-nigh unbelievable.
How can free Western minds, with access to more knowledge than has been available for the entirety of previous human history, with the Holocaust within living memory and emblazoned upon square miles of paper and film, enslave itself to fanatical phallus-worship at the expense of a people who have suffered so very much? And do it with “comic” books that would have passed muster with the Hitler Youth?
Do they know nothing? Have they never read personal
reminiscences of the Jewish ghettos, of Auschwitz, of Bergen-Belsen, of the years of terror and hunger and hiding? Do they think it never happened?
Apparently not. Their god is the almighty tinky-winky, an organ that can’t even stand up to an icy sitz bath (pun intended), but is to be denied nothing – except a snip of surgical steel.
I think the only cure is bell, book, and candle, because I certainly don’t see any other way off that Möbius strip of utter evil and madness.
Wow. Just, wow.
Is no one left with a corpuscle of conscience? Have they no shame?
That is just naked Jew-hate, and thank you for calling it to my attention. I’ll make sure every San Francisco voter I know is aware of it.
it makes sense coming from San Diego. My own experience is that there are plenty of white power/nazi and antisemite types there.
Dan, there is indeed evidence that they are more than connected with the SF ban. See http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/djsaunders/detail?entry_id=90153
We didn’t circumcise our son, btw, and we do believe intact is better. But this? This is shocking and vile.
Presently, when one delivers in a hospital, the mother is asked if she wants a male baby circumcised.
I think that works just fine.
Propagandize women in labor classes, or whatever, but there is no need for a legal ban.
As to this comic – the crux of this article, let’s remember – it’s open Jew-hate. Let’s drop all euphemisms, and be as blunt and open as they are. This is the same vile stew that is spewed in the Middle East daily. Let’s send it packing, because it’s beyond disgusting.
Hmm, that sounds more like a hatred for boys really and women get the power to decide if the penis should be mutilated or not.
There are also safe ways of labia and clitoris removal, what if the father was asked routinely if those should be removed right after birth?
You obviously don’t have much experience with circumcised men. Circumcised penises are plenty sensitive, and are not only cleaner, but also much more attractive. I think you have an unhealthy fixation with the word “mutilated”. You sound like a very sad person.
@Hippychick,
Ok, let me just check if you know this or not. When a woman’s clitoris is removed, she cannot have an orgasm anymore, because that is her primary means of feeling sexual pleasure. That is the reason why muslim men, among others, prefer for it to be cut off. So they will not “stray”. Because they would have no reason to, because they cannot feel sexual pleasure anymore. A man feels sexual pleasure in a different way. The head of the penis, along with the length of the shaft have sensitive nerve, which give pleasure when the right lady is operating it. To make your “father should have the right to cut off daughter’s clit” vs “mom and dad decide to go without foreskin” comparison work, the decision would have to be “mom and dad decide to cut off son’s penis.” Because he would not be able to feel sexual pleasure anymore. Is referenced in your comparison of a father cutting off the daughter’s clitoris. I just wanted to clue you in on what we are talking about, because you seem a little lost on this issue, based on this post, and some previous ones I saw.
Xamn, you are exactly right. The clitoris is the female equivalent of the male penis. In order to duplicate what female circumcision (mutilation) does, a man’s penis would have to be chopped off at its base. Male circumcision is a minor procedure done in the safety of a hospital and removes only skin. Within days, the baby is healed. Female circumcision, on the other hand, is done by Muslim mothers, grandmothers, or aunts, usually on a table in unsanitary conditions, and actually removes body parts. Females who have had this done to them have problems for life because of this procedure. Infections often set in. Sexual pleasure is gone. Childbirth is difficult and more painful than is normal. There is a BIG difference between female genital mutilation and male circumcision. You can’t compare the two.
Read Genesis, chapter 17. Circumcision is part of God’s covenant with Abraham.
San Francisco has surpassed Berkeley on the nutty scale with this stupid idea. Is there something in the water in California that turns ordinary people into wack jobs?
I lived in Turkey for four years. Boys are circumcised there at the age of 10 or 11. It’s a big deal over there, usually occurring in the spring. The storefronts are loaded with little boy mannequins clothed in the circumsion costume: usually white satin pants, top, cape, and some kind of headdress. It’s a time of celebration of the boy moving into manhood.
Removal of the labia and clitoris subject a woman to pain and lack of sexual pleasure for the rest of her life.
Circumcision does no such thing.
Compare apples to apples.
I understand that it is presently the fashion for women to depilate (which I find odd, but to each her own), which is much closer a comparison. Shall we make it illegal for a woman under the age of 18 to depilate? I would call that a ridiculous interference in parental supervision.
To the oxymoronic RightWingHippyChick:
Hmm, that sounds more like a hatred for boys really and women get the power to decide if the penis should be mutilated or not.
1. As for “hatred for boys”…well, that’s the current feminist bent…they would rather remove the entire PENIS.
1. Please take some basic anatomy courses. There is quite a difference between foreskin (“skin” with few nerve endings) and a clitoris (which is a very nerve-filled organ)
There are also safe ways of labia and clitoris removal, what if the father was asked routinely if those should be removed right after birth?
2. Well, I would hightail my ass out of Saudi Arabia and head back here to the US where we aren’t that stupid.
3. There are safe ways of removing an arm or hand, but now you are just delving into the silly.
Mothers aren’t the only ones making this decision. When we had our first son, I hesitated when our dr. spoke to us about circumcising him. My husband was adamant that he (and all of our sons) be circumcised, just like him. He also said that he didn’t want his sons to have a penis that looked like a dog’s (he used much more colorful language). I am glad that I went along with it, and so are my sons (I asked them – 19, 16 and 10 years old) – it is easier to keep clean and they prefer the way it looks.
And if I had had a daughter, I would have pierced her ears as soon as possible – would you ban that as well?
As the jews will tell you, you normally can’t walk or talk for a year afterwards. Better not to get it done as an adult then.
Circumcision wouldn’t have anything to do with gays prefering things uncut would it?
I’m not jewish, been done, don’t remember it. Don’t regret it. Maybe I’m one of those people that grew up.
> you normally can’t walk or talk for a year afterwards…
Best comment. You win the thread! ;o)
“Circumcision wouldn’t have anything to do with gays prefering things uncut would it?”
That is probably the one and only reason it’s on the ballot in GayFrancisco. They like a little ‘head cheese’ on the side, especially if it’s flavored with fecal matter.
And you know all this… how? Experience, perhaps?
“I’m not jewish, been done, don’t remember it. Don’t regret it. Maybe I’m one of those people that grew up.”
This is San Francisco. Stop trying to confuse the issue by using common sense.
As the jews will tell you, you normally can’t walk or talk for a year afterwards. Better not to get it done as an adult then.
And you shit and piss your pants continuously as well, not to mention the unhealthy fascination with women’s breasts…
(I see what you did there.)
Circumcision wouldn’t have anything to do with gays prefering things uncut would it?
Gee, you think? One word for you: “docking”.
And when I posted a snarky but not obscene comment, to wit:
“C’mon Lefties, just say it, all together now;
Juden Raus
Juden Raus
You know you want to.”
The comment was deleted. Touchy touchy.
On the same ballot should be a push to legalize clitorectomies on infant girls.
Why is Jewish ritual mutilation of infant males legal?
Why is Islamic ritual mutilation of infant girls illegal?
Answer : Filthy Jewish pigs have too much power.
Death to World Jewry.
Late term abortions to all Timos of the Nazi/Skin head party.
Timo,
In order to do that, you’d have to kill the Scotch-Irish as well, since Baptists support Israel. And the Scotch-Irish, unlike the Jews, are not nice and civilized sorts. We get ticked off, and we burn cities to ash on Monday, and Tuesday, and Wednesday…Not even taking a day off for Sunday.
Jews are gentle, kindly folk. The Scotch-Irish believe the best solution for being an idiot is a pillar of smoke ten thousand feet high.
Indeed. I’ll bring the matches and gasoline.
Folks, when will we wake from our dream and realize the only solution is to pick up our Louisville sluggers and ball-bat every American leftist to death wherever we find them, and wherever they stand? That’s the only way this madness is going to end. That includes the pols, the union hacks, the hippy chicks, the teachers – every last one of our self-appointed, know-better, masters.
Let me know when you’re ready to start burning Tennwriter. It’s time torch this clown show.
So you’re linking Timo who seems like a real Nazi, that is, an extreme Rightist, with union leaders, liberal pols and other “leftists”? Sounds like someone already took a bat to your brain.
Better watch out for Scottish Jews like me, we’re really evil.
Leatherneck – make that reference to San Diego Nazis “retroactive to age 30.” My father had to take five years out of his life to deal with Nazis and a lot of guys like him never came back. He carried the emotional scars for the balance of his life. I thought the Bund was dead. Tennwriter is dead right re: the Scots-Irish (like me – and him). Lots of urban renewal in Germany by us – and they had it coming, see Buchenwald/Bergen-Belsen/Nordhausen/Auschwitz, and the 50 from Stalag-Luft III, murdered by the Nazis. Society CAN dictate what you do with your body – they’re called pandering laws.
My kind got kicked out of England for taking the Kings deer, hogs, chickens, etc…,and Ireland for being poor and hungry in the 1850′s.
Hmmm, interesting comment about teeth, rightwinghippiechick;
WHEN I WAS A TEENAGER, I HAD TO HAVE MY WISDOM TEETH PULLED! THE HORROR! I WANT MY WISDOM TEETH BACK! I AM BITTER AND RESENTFUL, BECAUSE I LOST MY WISDOM TEETH!
(Anyway, circumcision is just an evil plot, because all women, everywhere, hate men.)
/Sarc. off.
Okay, Lefties! On the count of three! “SAY IT OUT LOUD! I’M ANTI-SEMETIC AND PROUD!”
Actually, I’m kind’ve glad they’ve “come out”, so to speak, and aren’t hiding behind the We’re-just-anti-Israel mask, anymore.
Had a horrible, cold feeling come over me reading that… “something wicked this way comes…”
First “Saturday,” then “Sunday” as the saying goes.
Banning circumcisions will pave the way to BEHEADINGS. Be careful what you wish for, leftists!
Notice how this comes on the heels of Obama calling for the division of Jerusalem?
These liberals are just stealth Nazis!
Check out the characters. Amanda Pagan, reporter, has a “pro-circumcision editor”. So, once again we have the evil Jews running the media. I am still looking for the “pro-circumcision banker” character.
Amanda “Pagan”? Oh, it just gets better and better…
Yeah, I’m sure that’s the first “trading card” my idiot sister in law will collect.
‘Cause she’s a pagan and everyone knows they were just all peaceable and crap until them eeeevvillll Christianists came by and stole ALL their rituals (ok, almost all of them, except for things like human sacrifice, genocide on conquered tribes, infanticide ~ especially if the child in question was disabled or a girl, cannibalism, having royal brothers marry their sisters for generations, etc., etc. No, the Christianists only took the good stuff, like wreaths during the winter and bunnies and eggs in the spring. They left all the bad stuff behind to make the pagans look bad.)
Of course, it does bring up the question…..is there REALLY a “circumcision bureau” at the Frisco papers? Because that’s the only way I could see why it would matter if an editor is pro or con on the procedure…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmYIo7bcUw
Come on, Lefties, sing it! You know you want to!
We understand that parents do not have the right to mutilate their children–whatever religion, cult or tribe they belong to.
At 18 yrs the offspring can make their own decision– with informed consent.
Mutilating children is barbaric.
Circumcision and clitoral surgery are practiced by a small minority–it is un American and child abuse
It’s child abuse when people like you reproduce, but we can’t pass a law against it.
Btw, I know three different guys who chose to be circumcized as teens or young adults – they resented their parents for not getting it done the easy way. Meanwhile, I’ve never heard of any guys who were circumcized as infants wishing they still had their foreskins.
“Meanwhile, I’ve never heard of any guys who were circumcized as infants wishing they still had their foreskins.”
There’s a whole (small) industry devoted to helping circumcised guys who’d rather not be circumcised sort of “re-grow” a foreskin by stretching penile skin up and over the head over a long period of time, with special tools and lotions and manuals.
The grass is always greener on the other side of the fence, I guess.
Victor, circumcision is practiced not only by Jews but by Muslims, such as the Turks who are paying you to pollute PM, not to mention yourself no doubt since you are a compulsive liar.
This ignorance is legendary…
Victor, being my parents Christian, as were virtually my friends Christian with a smattering of Jews thrown into the mix, you do recognize most Christian male babies like Jewish males are circumsized? In fact, I read a stat the other day in a medical journal that about 80% of the males in America are circumsized.
And the procedure for us is not the “evil” mohel with knife in hand, but the clamp or disposable band. I’ll assure you, the experience is not traumatic. Thank God for smart parents – my mother and father included.
The “hero” looks homoerotic–wonder if the “lavender mafia” is playing some sordid part in all this?
Not a doubt in my mind this is the product of the boys with “sugar in their tank” who bow down at the phallic altar.
You got it. Brownshirt Butt Pirates. Ernst Rohm would be proud.
Hot chicks prefer circumcized members. If you disagree with that statement, you’re either an ugly chick or a dude who gets no play.
I say that because when the Priests and Pristesses of the Sacred Foreskin are presented with medical/health evidence confirming that circumcized penises are more hygenic, they respond, “have you tried washing?”
Hey geniuses, if we take random samples of 1,000 or more circumcized males and compared them to 1,000 or more uncircumcized males for incidences of cancer, etc., we’d expect hygenic habits to “come out in the wash.”
anti-semetism, and vicious caricatures of Jews sneaking into homes to forcibly circumcise chldren, on the other hand, is perfectly American, and A-OK!
/Sarc. off.
Abortion is fine too, but don’t you dare “mutilate” your kid (if you decide to let him be born) by circumcising him! That’s child abuse!
/Sarc. off. Again.
I keep on hoping this is some kind of Onion satire, and someone’s going to stand up and say, “Okay, joke’s over!”
Sadly, this doesn’t seem to be the case.
Yes, Sanity Inspector, I noticed that about the hero; I also think he looks rather eugenically, grad-A pure Aryan—and his neck is thicker than the Incredible Hulk’s!
The comic book Jews have a great resemblance to those in Medieval “blood libel” texts, and those put out by the anti-semites of the U.S. from the 1930′s thru the 60′s.
Also, the same design shows up in both Egyptian and Syrian anti-Jewish pamphlets and posters from the 1950′s onward.
There is also an attempt to make the Jewish characters look like those in some of the “Evil Ernie” style comic books of today. I don’t know all their names, but the evil minister looks like the Mohel (broad black hat, long finger nails, etc).
Definitely anti-semitic. Definitely 3rd class artistry. Definitely boring.
I much prefer the “Mohel Man” of Marvel Comics. Oh, wait. You say it’s actually “Mole Man.” Sorry.
Old joke: Ad in a local newspaper. Mohel needed to circumcise elephants. The pay isn’t much but the tips are huge! Bata-bing, bata-boom.
Calling Anthony Weiner. Your pictures are ready for pick-up.
To #62/Victor:
You said, “Circumcision and clitoral surgery are practiced by a small minority–it is un American and child abuse.”
Um, even after 30 years of leftist propaganda, 60% of males in the US are circumcised. In what world is that a “minority.”
And, yes, I am going to drag G-d into this. Many of the strictures n the old testament have actually proven to be healthy. If God mandated this procedure, then I am going to give Him the benefit of the doubt.
I don’t want to get all biblical about this, but it seems to me that San Francisco is the modern day city of Sodom, and by pure “coincidence” the city happens to be located geographically exactly on top of a recognized major earthquake fault line.
I don’t think anyone is going to turn into a pillar of salt, nor would I wish such a thing onto the city, but who is to say that a little divine retribution is impossible?
God told Abraham that He would spare Sodom if His angels could find find ten righteous men there. I suspect that, even today, there are still more than ten righteous men living in San Francisco.
But this ban will drive out a few more of them.
If this kind of thing continues, God is going to have to either destroy San Francisco, or apologize to Sodom and Gomorrah.
http://www.adherents.com/lit/comics/Mendy_and_the_Golem.html
When it comes to comics, I prefer this!
On the other hand, the “Evil Ernie” mohel guy does look intelligent, unlike Foreskin Man, who looks rather like a brain-dead surfer; “Duuuuude, le’s goah BEACH!”
Understanding the problems in the Middle East.
Always remember when reading about Arabs and Muslims that half the population, the women, are unable to experience sexual satisfaction due to having had their external genitalia removed: sometimes just the clitoris, more often also the external vaginal lips, sometimes more, depending on the level of orthodoxy of the Islamic branch the particular country or region is following.
This means there is no such thing as a happy Muslim marriage, and there are 300 plus million desperately unhappy people.
Hmmm? Very artistic… scary faces, subtle, but not to subtle, a new Goebbels hones his craft for the future.
Has it occurred to anyone that this cartoon is rather TOO obvious in its politics, and at the same time artistically TOO sophisticated in paying homage to various graphic traditions?
The weird mixture of 1890s Russian antisemitism and fascination with Jewish minutiae bespeaks either a pathologically self-hating Jew such as Rahm Emmanuel, or a goy whose advances Judaism were rebuffed.
My advice to Jews in America- get out while you still can and move to Israel. Things are about to get ugly, and you don’t want to stick around for it. Remaining in exile is neither wise nor safe. Your homeland is restored; flee to it now, lest you be destroyed when the Wickedness is fully released. As the Lord lives, who brought the children of Israel out of the North country, and all the nations to which they had been scattered, perilous times are coming upon us. The coming of the Messiah is close at hand, and the days are coming when America will cease to be a refuge. Now that time may yet be years off, but America is not immune to being controlled by the Evil One, so flee now, into the bosom of the Lord! Return to the Land of Israel and circumcise your hearts. Why should you perish, O Israelites?
My advise to Jews in America – stay. We will stand and fight with you.
There are all sorts of good reasons for Jews to return to Israel, but safety is not one of them. Jews are far safer in the USA than in Israel, both from their enemies and from their own government. Indeed, if the USA could be persuaded to admit Israel as a state, that would solve most of the Jews’ problems.
Oddly enough those very same people who oppose circumcision on an 8 day old child, just a few days before would allow a partial birth prior to ending the babies life by punching a hole in the head to suck out the brains. Funny the rights a child gains in a few days.
I’m sure it’s all purely coincidental that a City that is dominated by far Left politics which just so happens to be an ever expandng conduit of anti-semitic ideas just so happens to focus on an important and longstanding Jewish ritual as a supposed violation of “human rights” while just so happening to promote their position through clear anti-semitic images. Nothing to see here.
There should be a pivotal moment when you’re about to unveil your news scoop which is based on the content of a comic book, who’s hero features a massive penis on his chest, where you question your own worth as a political contributor and the outlet which publishes content like this. Alas, it was not to be.
Unreal. Just unreal.
PGlenn writes: “Meanwhile, I’ve never heard of any guys who were circumcized as infants wishing they still had their foreskins.”
From which I gather that PGlenn never hangs around with crazy-ass gay men, some of whom bitterly decry their own infant circumcisions and wish they still had their foreskins.
In some cases, they wish they had foreskins so that they could PIERCE the foreskins and have a decorative little chain connecting the pierced foreskin to the big chrome ring that goes right through the hole they paid someone to punch in their glans penis — but because their cruel parents mutilated their dingdongs when they were helpless babies, these poor dudes have to make do with just the Prince Albert, while the lucky “intact” men can have multiple foreskin piercings for all sorts of decorative effects.
Mind you, while I can attest that this precious foreskin-exaltation definitely exists in American gay male culture, I’m not at all sure that it’s necessarily rooted in anti-Semitism — I think a lot of it comes, rather, from a self-flagellating anti-Americanism mixed with an incredibly naive Europhilia and Euro-envy. I mean, gay American men will watch European pr0n videos in which the men are uncircumcised, and they start thinking, “Oh, those Europeans are so much more enlightened and civilized than us dumb Americans — why, they have nude beaches over there, and children are allowed to drink wine with dinner, and they decriminalized sodomy decades before the Frowny McPrudes of the Supreme Court finally did it with Lawrence v. Texas!”
And apart from envying the sophisticated and socially advanced Europeans, the angle that “circumcision was promoted by sex-phobic Victorians to discourage masturbation” is utterly irresistible to certain gay men, who will turn around and draw an equal sign between “infant circumcision” and quack “cures” that homosexuals were subject to in decades past, such as electroshock aversion therapy or “chemical castration.”
Also, while this anti-circumcision and pro-foreskin attitude is certainly widespread and is the “fashionable opinion” in gay male circles, it’s far from universal, so I’m not sure whether the influence of the “lavender mafia” was THE deciding factor, even in San Francisco. Still, I agree with those who suspect that it was at least a contributing factor.
I don’t see evidence this being used as campaign material. While I don’t doubt the bill’s sponsors subscribe to the sentiments, I doubt there’s a direct link with the campaign.
Yes, there is ‘evidence’ that this comic is linked to the campaign:
See http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/djsaunders/detail?entry_id=90153
The campaign website links to the comic book site.
Both seem to be Hess’s websites.
Hess is the actual author of the anti-circumcision referendum, according to the SF Gate:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/nov05election/detail?entry_id=90251#ixzz1OKBmY1zT
Echoes of Julius Streicher and “Der Sturmer”.
As a conservative and Jewish guy living in SF, I *can’t wait* to vote FOR this nonsense, and to vote FOR legalizing prostitution in SF, vote for legalizing drugs in SF, vote FOR throwing more money at homeless drug addicts in SF, vote FOR more anti-business legislation to get more businesses to leave SF, and vote for any other nonsense that the morons here come up with. Before I move out of this city of stupidity and return to America, I want to do everything I can to help SF destroy itself, as it seems so determined to do.
Forbidding circumcision to a Jew is a progressive mitzvah, But forbidding circumcision to a Muslim is a hate crime. See how fair we are?
may the Norse be with you
San Francisco is all up in arms about circumcision but loves their abortion.
His name is Hess?
If this had been in a book or a movie, people would have criticized the author for being heavy-handed, unrealistic, and too obvious.
Men who obsess over their lost foreskin really are angry because they THINK their penis would’ve, should’ve, could’ve been….bigger. But for getting it clipped. Damn you mom and dad – my average organ was to be a pornstar schlong – until you stunted its growth!!! Dudes, here is some life-advice, “Lift thine eyes..” from your own crotch.
Sob – you don’t understand, I coulda,… I coulda been a CONTENDER!
WOW, to add insult to injury the Jewish child is forcibly removed from his family (mother’s wishes notwithstanding) to be raised a good Gentile. Sounds like what happened to Jews under the Ottoman empire and in Europe to a lesser extent.
This comic is shocking – usually, the Left manages to conceal its Antisemitism and religious hatred just a little better than this.
Of course, this is a blatant attempt to reduce the already dwindling numbers of Jews in the US. It will just increase the pressure to proselytize to encourage Jewish youth to resist joining the tribe when they are teens. As Catholics know, the optimal time to teach a child about the unique facets of their religion is before 14, starting with a firm grounding in the pre-K years, and continuing through the early teen years.
More evidence that the old European demons are starting to make noise again. This is scary.
It’s no secret that Andrew Sullivan supports extermination of Jews as revenge for their invention of circumcision. To him it’s all about maximizing the pleasure when he rapes little boys.
Try to picture in your mind the very first guy who ever had a thought to do such a thing to himself or to someone else, and who then mentioned his new idea to a friend.
“You wanna do WHAT?! Cut off your . . . WHAT?! And you want ME to do it TOO?! Are you freakin’ CRAZY?! Oh, your GOD says we have to do it, huh?! Well, sure then, no problem, just hand me that really sharp knife . . . You freakin PSYCHO!! GIDOUDDAHERE! Find your own damn cave!!”
. . . .
“Forbidding circumcision to a Jew is a progressive mitzvah, But forbidding circumcision to a Muslim is a hate crime.”
No, forbidding circumcision to a Muslim is a crime of stupidity. Jews won’t track you down and behead you. Muslims will. Jews will likely quietly apologize for their behavior and then help to elect Foreskinman as president.
The movie “Year One” has a brilliant scene on precisely this idea. You can find it on Youtube if you search for “Year One” and “Abraham”.
That one scene makes the whole movie worth it.
From our poster “IMissMyForeskin”
“an aborted fetus does not have a life (nor did it ever have one) to be concerned with a missing body part.”
Rather than worrying about your “poor tattoo choice” maybe you should seek some serious counseling regarding your perceptions of right and wrong.
I am a lapsed Baptist and I was circumcised sixty years ago and have no regrets. I am a father of four who when i was your age supported abortion on demand, and later in life as I watched the four caesarian births of my children my ability to “believe” a “fetus” was not a baby came face to face (literally) with the reality that murder is pretty much murder, no matter what Roe vs Wade claims.
I have been trying to find a good television lawyer on one of those late night TV ads to take my case against my pediatric surgeon who performed an apparently unneeded tonselectomy on me when I was six.
While that was some fifty four years ago, I am sure it has contributed to my current economic malaise. While an unnecessary tonselectomy may not be as traumatic as “Mesotheleoma” or as cloyingly pronounced either, it should be worth something.
And I am also hopeful of having an equally justified case of circumsion without my permnission filed against my long dead parents. If I have to move to San Francisco to file the case so be it.
I always knew that if I looked long enough and hard enough I could be a “victim” of something to whine about.
Looking at http://www.foreskinman.com/no2panel02.htm, notice that the author’s name is Hess?
What next in ‘liberal’ ‘Frisco? Burn down the city’s synagogues in its very own version on Kristalnacht and label it ‘strategic redevelopment’? Or perhaps stormtroopers outside Jewish shops with ‘Achtung Juden’ painted on the windows and entitled ‘consumer advice’? There are patently much deeper and darker forces at work here than is immediately apparant.
The real reason this is so important to the gays in SF is because circumcised is prettier adn more desirable than uncircumcised and they want to level the field by eliminating the clean circumcised gays and have everyone be smelly and cheesy.
What cracks me up about SF (I’ve lived in the Bay Area – although never in the tiny, insignificant City itself – for most of my life) is that the “downtrodden” whom they worship are generally composed of people who would gleefully kill everyone in the city.
I await the great Ironic Justice when the first Islamic smuggled-in nuke detonates in… San Francisco.
And will giggle with schadenfreude when the survivors whimper, “Why? Why us? Weren’t we ‘tolerant’ enough?”
SF is stuffed chock-full of incredibly stupid people.
-MJ
The super-hero dude should be wearing a pointy sheet and be referred to as the Grand Cyclops Savior in honor of a senator, and the comic book should be called The Robert C. Byrd Memorial Comic Book.
Ah “progressives”; got to love them. Note the reference in the last sentence to Charlton Heston’s famous quote (holding a musket over his head) “from my cold dead hands”. Circumcision is obviously viewed with the same disdain as the right to bear arms. Definitely need more Jewish members of the NRA.
http://www.jpfo.org/
Note that on the cover the mother of the child seems to be restrained against her wishes. I’d a subtle note to the fact that circumcision is NOT a woman’s choice, but something forced on her by the religious community. Anti-semetic? Yep. But in San Fran, nothing is really shocking.
If circumcisions are made illegal, then Jews will be forced to go to back-alley moyles to get the procedures!!!!Elventy!!11
Win!
It’s not Antisemetic. Criticism if Israel can’t be antisemetic.
Oh wait, this isn’t criticism of Israel. It’s demonization of Jews. But I’m sure if Israel didn’t exist this comic (and the circumcision ban) wouldn’t exist. Darn Jews, uh.. Zionists…
Whoa! This is a government sponsored campaign?!
Anti-Jew for sure. People currnetly have a choice, this campaign is to REMOVE THE FREEDOM OF CHOICE and force one point of view on everyone.
Thats horrifying, this whole thing is horrifying, I’m going to go and shake uncontrollably in the corner. Why can’t we force California to succeed from the union?
did anyone read the first episode/issue of Foreskin Man? the villain is a medical doctor, named “Dr. Mutilator”.
where is the outrage against the Anti-Doctorism in that? i haven’t seen a word of Shock and Offense about the fact that a medical doctor turns into a hulking bloodthirsty monster, yet the vilification of the antagonists (in the two different episodes) seems pretty much the same to me.
i’m not getting this huge Anti-Semitism vibe that everyone else has locked on to.
who knows who the villain will be in the third comic? but to me it seems like he’s just firing his shots one at a time at classes of individuals he knows are highly correlated to performing circumcision.
the first episode had nothing to do with Jews, the third might not either.
Hey genius.
“Anti-doctorism” didn’t lead to the murder of six million doctors. I suggest you do a little internet search on ‘Blood Libel’ and the history of pogroms.
If the next villain is Muslim I’ll eat my hat.
Joseph Goebbels would recognize this kind of comic/propaganda and would approve whole heartedly and support it with all his assets.
Do you know what a mohel is, you pathetically ignorant douchebag?
One point needs to be made very clear….male and female “circumcisions” are NOT the same thing….unless you wait until a boy is between the ages of 9-11 and hold him down with nothing to stop the pain and actually cut off his penis…with a knife that still has dried blood on it from the last time it was used….if that is what you are talking about THEN we can talk apples to apples!
I guess hospitals in near by towns like San Rafael will get more business and hospitals in SF will have less..which is always the result of government bans on anything.
This is not anti-Semitism at work, it is anti “God” in full display. Certainly they have targeted the Jews, but it is God they are trying to suppress. They have already suppressed Him from their own lives and now they wish to suppress Him in ours…as though they could. Why? Because, like the rest of us, every time they are confronted with God they are confronted by their own sinfulness. Unfortunately, their dark, hardened hearts will not allow them to repent.
Anti-Semitism? Baloney. It is common for religions to celebrate primitive rites. That shouldn’t give them the right to mutilate infants. It should be illegal to perform unnecessary surgry on anyone without their permission. Let the child attain his majority and then let him decide if he wants some bearded creep to chop off the end of something he holds precious. It is illegal to circumsize women in this and many other countries. The same right should be extended to men.
” Bearded creep” You really give yourself away.
note to PJ commenters: not all people from Michigan are as ignorant and hate-filled as Hopeychange here.
Because gee, heckety, golly whackets whizz, what could possibly be anti-semetic about caricatured images of hooknosed Jews attacking children?
Jared, if you’re not getting the anti-semetism vibe in this comic, you’re either kidding yourself—or trying to kid us.
Either way, not good.
As Bill M points out, “Anti-doctorism” hasn’t led to millions of doctors being killed. (And, even though it hasn’t, the image of doctors turning into horrible, hulking monsters, attacking babies is a pretty disgusting one, too. From what I’ve seen, all these comics are pretty nausea-inducing.)
Whoever the villain is in the third one, betcha anything it’s not gonna be a Moslem!
So, Hope Deferred, I take it you’re against abortion? (Talk about your “primitive rights”!) because that’s certainly performing surgery on someone, without their permission, and before they’ve attained their majority.
(Again, if you think the anti-semetism in this is just “baloney”, you’re either trying to fool yourself, or fool us. Not good.)
anti-semitism
anti-semitism
anti-semitism
etc.
But wait, I’m pretty sure that San Francisco, Oakland and Berkeley have passed resolutions establishing official positions that their municipalities are pro-choice. So, it’s ok to kill a baby just before it is born, but you can’t perform a medical proceedure on one after it is born!
An odd fixation with the penis in San Francisco.
Aren’t these the same chuckleheads who work themselves into a lather about “Keeping laws off my body” and “Rosaries off their ovaries”?
These people are as hypocritical as they are disturbed. They are making a cause out of something that seems to stem from deep personal issues. Think I’m kidding? And just read the comments here. Their zeal seems to stem from personal trauma and hatred for religion/God.
The whole issue is retarded.
There are no traumatic or harmful consequences to circumcision. The foreskin is A FLAP OF SKIN. It makes very little difference wether or not a child is circumcised, so we should just let the Jews observe their religion in peace.
Comparing circumcision to cliterectomies is preposterous. When that part of a female is removed, it is multitudes more painful because there are so many nerve endings in the clitoris making it extremely sensitive to pain. Also, circumcision has no effect on sexual enjoyment while cliterectomies prevent a woman from enjoying sex at all. They are wildly different operations.
People who oppose circumcision are Jew hating bigots! No “and’s” no “if’s” & no “But’s”! After seeing this comic I will from now on regard all opponents of circumcision they way a Black Man should regard white people who burn Crosses & like to wear white sheets and hoods!
As bigots!
Is it a coincident the “hero” in this comic is a tall Blonde Ayran superman type?
I think not.
I was circumcised & I have no complaints.
Good lord…we have returned in toto to the depravity of Europe in the 1930s. Is this a reprint of a Nazi party comic??
Where will this madness end?
People are running several issues together. Let’s take them one by one:
1) Will this be effective? No – parents can go to any of a long list of suburbs.
2) Is it constitutional? No, and the SCOTUS will probably rule that.
3) Is the promotional cartoon antisemitic? Actually, it goes beyond simple antisemitism, and well into Aryan supremacism.
4) Is the cartoon from the official campaign? Apparently.
5) Is circumcision good, bad, or indifferent? Off topic.
The only remaining question is why San Fransisco? I think some commenters above answered that.
Even if it is anti-Semitic, so what? Maybe the Jews should quit their disgusting barbaric behavior and evolve into the 21st century already.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gi7QAtV21-M
Circumcision has been proven to cut the occurrence of AIDs in adult males by 50%. Pretty barbaric. Now go eat a grilled dick cheese sandwich with some sauerkraut you Neo-Nazi.
BS it has been proven to have no health benefits whatsoever. As a matter of fact it is harmful. And it’s just a typical practice of the Jews – they mutilate animals and pray over them as they bleed to death, so they mutilate children also. No surprise the founder of Satanism was Anton LaVey – a Jew.
Why is it that the Jewish god demands that children and animals be mutilated to ‘please’ him? Because the Jewish god is simply a reflection of the Jews who created him.
Thank you for outing yourself as a complete Jew-Hater and God-Hater.
For those of you thinking this comic is counter-propaganda, I give you this guy as Exhibit A. They actually feel this way, and they do not see anything wrong with it. It also does no good to give them the facts. They just deny them.
Well if the Jews and their “god” demand the mutilation and blood of children and animals then all the good people of the world have a duty to hate them and their barbaric behavior.
It has not been proven harmful. Talking points are not proof of anything. There is medical benefit to circumcision but no benefit to NOT circumcising. In fact, it can be detrimental not to circumcise. However, the harm can be mitigated by good hygiene. Not just good hygiene, but the best hygiene. Like very diligent hygiene.
In any case, you’re totally ill informed and have no business pontificating on the is subject.
So what if the founder of Satanism started out as a Jew? He became disillusioned of religion at a young age, and then went on to found Satanism. Now, if Jews had flocked to him, and declared his way as the True way, then you might have a case: but Jews have not.
We might as well say that men are evil, and prove it by declaring “The founder of Satanism was a man!”, which, while true, has no bearing whatsoever as to whether or not men are evil.
This whole issue sounds like a set-up.
It is a lose-lose situation.
If the ban passes that is antisemitism.
If the ban does not pass, that would be great. BUT, I am afraid that the door to female genital mutilation would be wide open.
It would be hard to argue against fgm as another “legitimate religious practice” that parents could make for their girl babies or young girls.
People MUST understand that fgm and circumcision are NOT the same thing.
I have only seen a few other posts that accurately describe that cutting off the clitoris is NOT the same kind of procedure as removing foreskin.
I am pretty sure that women want to enjoy sex and have orgasms! I think cutting off the clitoris would impede that function for women! Circumsized men still seem to have that function. NOT THE SAME!
No they are not the same thing because circumcision is done to males, but it is no different than the practices that take place in Africa and the middle east. If you want to mutilate genitalia in the name of a tribal god, then move to one of those places.
They are not the same, but the argument that allowing male circumcision allows the other ignores thousands of years of male only traditions. WHy should the burden of a ban fall disporportionally on the Jews when they’ve NEVER practiced FGM or the Christians who’ve never practiced FGM or most AFricans tribes which don’t do it either? That’s nonsensical if banning FMG is a stated reason for banning ALL cicumcision.
They are NOT the same and should CONTINUE be treated as independent issues. FMG is concentrated in a certain region, amongst a certain religion, with a couple outliers literally physically on the fringe of the very same region, so probably adopted it from the ususal suspects.
SF would do more to get rid of FMG by funding on-going U.N. efforts to educate people out of FMG IN THE FIELD, than passing bans in SF city limits. Indeed, their pompous ban will have ZERO effect as people go to the suburbs for the procedure.
They are making an anti-religious, anti-Jewish, anti-Israel STATEMENT to the WORLD.
This is what I’m saying:
As several posts say, circumcision is done for good medical reasons. I agree.
This is what I think will happen next. If the circumcision ban is legally squashed, then I bet it will be used as a legal precident for Muslims to practice fgm on girls. They will hide behind it and say–if circumcision is allowed for Jews then why can’t we have fgm? They will lump it all together (as several confused posters have here) as just different forms of “religious genital cutting.”
Wasn’t there an issue with some American Pediatrics group approving fgm not too long ago?
It may very well be an attempt to force the legalization of female genital mutilation. The two are not the same, though, and we should remember that!
FGM is more akin to amputating the penis; I would go so far as to point out that it’s just as horrific as castrating a young man before puberty hits, so that he could continue to sing soprano as an adult–which produces a clear harm to the person!
I’ve never really understood antisemitism. I had Jewish buddies in the Army, have counted several as friends, once dated a very nice Jewish girl when I was single, and have been mentored in color and composition by the great painter Ellie Siskind, who happens to be Jewish. Of all bigotry, the animus toward Jewish people seems to me to be the most irrational, more of a mental disease than a simple, mindless prejudice. Can’t say I am surprised it has shown itself in San Francisco. Fringe belief systems both left and right seem to be a breeding ground for this particular bacilli.
And speaking of ‘fringe’ and ‘antisemitism’, why is Patrick ‘Hitler was a great man’ Buchanan still treated with a modicum of respect by many in the conservative community? He still writes for Townhall, I gather, and is still introduced as a conservative on talking head shows and the like. That rabid, jew-hating rat needs ridden out of town on a rail, in my view.
Unfortunately, there is an old-school pigheaded isolationist streak in a good many people. This was dormant during the Soviet menace, but has returned. See also Ron Paul.
The scriptural explanation is not mental illness, but Satanic. Satan hates God, thus Satan hates everything God created. He hates man who came though Adam who was made in God’s image; he hates woman from whom the Savior would be born, he hates God’s Chosen People through whom the Savior would come, so the entire world could be guaranteed they had the real Messiah. This would explain why there is a persistant, and apparently irrational thread of anti-semitism that has run through history. There is a supernatural consistency to the phenomenom, a constant seduction of each generation to turn against the Jews. Without a background and familiarity with the scriptures it’s easy to be enouraged to turn against the Jews. They are fallible humans just like everyone else, so fault-finding is easy, and the seduction encourages sins of coveting what thye have, hate and jealousy of what they’ve achieved and lying to bring false witness against them.
Take it or leave it, it’s the scriptural basis for what reasonable people can find no rational explanation for. It IS strange, that one people should suffer so much, that’s a fact.
To blame antisemitism on the Devil is a cop-out. A Christian myself (albeit perhaps not a very good one), I happen to think blaming anyone but ourselves for the sorry state of things–bigotry, wars of aggression, oppression, exploitation and greed–is an attempt to absolve ourselves of responsibility. Do I believe the Adversary exists? Sure, but his is the whispering voice that offers up rationalizations and excuses for the evils we commit. Ultimately, human beings with free will make the moral choices and perform the actions resulting from those choices. To do nothing–to not speak out against bigotry or to refuse to take a stand against injustice, for example–is a moral choice, one for which we are held accountable.
Where did you get that Buchanan quote from? I’ve never seen it, and a quick web search doesn’t bring it up. I don’t believe he ever said it. While I agree Buchanan is probably an antisemite, he’s careful not to reveal proof; my impression comes not from any specific thing he’s said but from the whole picture, and I couldn’t prove it if challenged. For him to say something like that would be quite out of character.
If they were really worried about the rights of children they’d be banning abortions instead of circumcisions.
The main effect of this law if it passes will be to cause all the mohels in San Francisco to move outside city limits, and for Jewish parents unfortunate enough to live there to have to make a short trip out of town to get to said mohels. I suspect that San Francisco hospitals will be seeing a precipitous drop in male children born there as well.
ISNT IT INTERESTING that the same crowd that is worried about a little snip of a baby’s skin that might hurt for 2 minutes is the same crowd that wants to give a woman the right to cave in her unborn infants skull and vacuum it out in little pieces.
and a great big “Sieg Heil!” to you, Ares, ya lil’ ol’ anti-semite, you!
(maybe anti-semites should quit their disgusting, murderous behavior, and evolve to—maybe the 15th Century? They’re not ready for the 21st Century yet.)
What is wrong with anti-Semitism? If Semites are causing problems throughout the world, which they ARE, then reason and logic shows that we should be anti-Semitic. At the root of all the world’s problems, you will find the Jews.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__vvCKHcOC0
Jerusalem is a burdensome stone, and all who oppose her will be cut to pieces, in fulfillment of prophecy.
Well we’ve already been cut to pieces by the Jews even though we have been aiding and abetting Israel since its inception. So the “prophecy” is just a little backward and screwy, just like everything in Jewish bible.
Interesting. So you DO think that they should all be rounded up and put in camps to keep the contagion isolated. There is a very efffective template available. I am sure you can find it on the internet, just do a search for Bergan-Belsen, Treblinka or Auschwitz-Birkenau.
Don’t be shy, it is the logical conclusion of your beliefs.
I am really very impressed. We don’t see skin-heads here often Aries.
Given Name: Ares, Family Name: ForeSkinHead
Well there has to be a solution to the Jewish problem. I think Hitler was trying to solve it – not by ‘exterminating’ the Jews, that has been proven to be a tale (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyMVWVBmGVo) – but by removing the Jews from Western civilization and resettling them somewhere else, e.g. Palestine, Jewish Autonomous Oblast, Madagascar, Antarctica, or wherever. Ultimately the Jewish Question will have to result in their expulsion. Jews are an antagonistic minority who demand that their interests come before the majority and eventually the people just cannot tolerate that behavior any longer. This is coming for America too, I assure you.
And BTW I’m not a skinhead and calling me one isn’t going to shut me up.
This is the most ridiculous comment I have read in awhile. Well, I guess you can convince 1% of the world of anything – look at all the people going around believing in the Rapture. If anything, the world would be better off if all dumb people like Ares decided to “relocate to Antarctica”.
It’s not about children, for them,Troika; it’s about Jew-hate, and the bathouse culture’s admiration of uncircumcised male genetalia. Kids don’t really enter into it.
Nothing wrong with “Jew-hate.” It’s like saying “cancer-hate.” It’s perfectly normal to hate those who hated everyone else first and are trying to destroy the world.
It seems George Soros has some paid commentors here on this forum. It’s a complete joke to say that Jews are causing trouble all over the world. You would only think that if you are a Muslim – a religion that teaches in its Quoran and Hadiths that Jews are to be stolen from, tortured and killed (of course, all other non-Muslims will be next on the menu). And no, I’m not Jewish, but I sure prefer their world view to yours. Stand with the Commmunists, Socialists and Muslims if you like – the people of the bloody purge. They are linking together now to destroy any sense of purpose and reason the world has left. I guess some people will follow anyone over a cliff – but the rest of us won’t follow.
Soros is a Jew.
Get your facts straight. Soros’s father was a Christian convert. That’s what saved Soros’s life. He was allowed to confiscate Jewish property for the Germans after the Jews were sent to death camps. If you wonder why he is so filthy rich, it came from things he squirreled away after the Jews were sent to their death. Soros has in no way ever practiced Judaism. To call this hated man a Jew is akin to blood libel. I don’t care if you hate Jews, that’s your business. When you spread lies, that’s my business.
Soros is as Jewish as they come. Here is his bio (as if his take-over-the-world-and-install-a-one-world-government globalist ideology wasn’t proof enough):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Soros#Family
Jews are a race, not a religious group. A Jew who converts to another religion or quits religion altogether is still a Jew. Jewish behavior transcends religious convictions, as Soros proves.
You are really f**ked up. The real you really oozes out. I wonder how brave you would be with me face to face.
I’ll be succinct, you are scum.
Wow great comeback, not that I expected anything more than name-calling from one of “God’s chosen.”
“Nothing wrong with “Jew-hate”…
Sure.
Tell that to that Israeli family, including their three-month-old infant girl, murdered in cold blood by ‘yutes’ a few months ago inside their homes as they slept. (Those who supported the murderers had a great party afterwards and exchanged sweets.)
Tell that to the family of that Hasidic couple in Mumbai who were murdered by Muslim terrorists inside their Chabad House and left their two-year-old orphaned son to wail among the bloodied bodies, until his nanny took him out of that massacre.
Tell that to any descendant of Holocaust victims or survivors! I dare ya!
“Nothing wrong with “Jew-hate”", indeed…
Bigot.
The Jews in Israel have killed plenty of Palestinian children also – in fact they have killed a hell of a lot more than vice versa – so your argument is destroyed.
More than half of the “Holocaust survivors” have been proven to be liars:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyMVWVBmGVo
And the other half admit that there was no plan to ‘exterminate’ Jews and that the concentration camps had orchestras, theaters, libraries, and even a swimming pool for recreation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPR3_zOPRlw
@127 Ares
“…hate those who hated everyone else first…”???
Your words?? Justify.
Or quote your source.
Nothing wrong with “Ares-hate.” It’s like saying “cancer-hate.” It’s perfectly normal to hate those who hated everyone else first and are trying to destroy the world.
There are many Jews, who oppose circumcision.
ANd so what? It’s a free choice. They are free to go with their consciences right now. But whassup with DENYING the choice to Jews and CHristians and Africans, and Muslims for that matter who practice it as a religious obligation or a cultural tradition or as hygenic practice?
San Franscico has an intolerant mind-set that has created a hostile and hateful environment, now doubling-down on their brand of tyrannical and abusive governing.
Hi zombie,
Great piece, as usual.
Love the melding of the uzi (Israeli) and the Jews now echoing King Herod’s order to murder all the babies (“Where is the child?”). Yeah, those Jews are responsible for all the wrongful death of children in the world (Al Dura anyone?). This is some sick stuff.
*yawn* cold, dead hand, huh… oh.. charlton heston.. right, right.. *yawn*
“ISNT IT INTERESTING that the same crowd that is worried about a little snip of a baby’s skin that might hurt for 2 minutes is the same crowd that wants to give a woman the right to cave in her unborn infants skull and vacuum it out in little pieces.”
Not particularly interesting, but only because it’s so internally consistent in its evil logic and predictability. It boils down to one thing: SOMEBODY has to be God.
But if you reject the possibility of the one true God, then by default YOU “become” God whether or not you realize it.
It follows, then, that — as “God” — life is of value if and when YOU deem it to be so…a life in case A is disposable while an identical life in case B is to be cherished…it’s all your call because YOU are God.
Best of all, you cannot be accused of hypocrisy or inconsistency because, once again, you are “God.” To have thousands of like-minded madmen (who are also “God”) agreeing with you…well…none can say “no” to you.
Result: a dissipated, dying, sex-obsessed society where other humans exist to serve you in one way or the other, else they’re to be gotten rid of for the greater good, however it is that you (“God”) care to define “good.”
It’s cornball, I admit, but every time I read of an incident like this I am reminded of an old Dr. Who episode (Tom Baker, if anyone cares) where the Doctor confronts the evil Egyptian god/alien Sutekh imprisoned on Mars. The Doctor rails on Sutekh but he calmly replies, “Your evil is my good.” The Bible spoke to exactly this corruption first…those who call good ‘evil’ and evil ‘good.’ They cannot be rationalized with. No point trying. They’re “God,” you’re not.
Our Founders believed, as I do, that our rights come from God. They are unalienable. To reject this proposition, you must believe that rights come from men just like yourself who have rule over you. This is at the heart of socialism and communism. In these systems, mere mortals just like you set themselves up as gods with the power to dictate to you. This is not what our country is all about. These bans that San Francisco are trying to put into place are unconstitutional and communistic. These kinds of things are what they do in dictatorships. Are we really going to sit back and let tyranny rule?
I’m getting to the point that I wish there would be an earthquake of mammoth proportions and California would just sink into the sea. My apologies to the few good people who live there, but it seems that the majority of Californians are illegals, drug dealers, welfare recipients, Hollywood nuts, and a whole gaggle of goofy politicians whose main aim is to destroy the state. I’ve said it before: Give California to the Israelis. They would clean it up. They would get rid of all the misfits and illegals, would bring it back to economic prosperity, and the Middle East problem would be poof! Gone.
Excellent post, Gorgo!
Just remember that in San Francisco it is morally acceptable and even promoted to cut a penis off, but do not dare cut that foreskin.
http://www.bluecollarphilosophy.com/2011/05/san-francisco-liberals-cutting-foreskin-is-bad-cutting-off-penis-is-good.html
This is right out of Julius Streicher’s “Der Sturmer”. Why must people hate the Jews so much? I don’t get it.
Because Jews don’t declare jihads and blow themselves up with explosives in public places, I suppose.
133. Blue Collar Todd
“Just remember that in San Francisco it is morally acceptable and even promoted to cut a penis off, but do not dare cut that foreskin.
http://www.bluecollarphilosophy.com/2011/05/san-francisco-liberals-cutting-foreskin-is-bad-cutting-off-penis-is-good.html”
Thank you for posting this, it’s is a PERFECT example of the reasoning of the “Gods” who are modern day liberals; reasoning that has been SO darkened that they cannot even begin to see the hypocrisy and inconsistency.
Or even more frightening: they do see the inconsistency but don’t care because (sorry, it bears repeating) they’re “God.”
Why are you in such a rage?
Instead please think and answer to yourself quietly.
This is the manifestation of the hardcore, antisemitic Marxism.
Sure, it is.
Q:
Who are the chief purveyors of Marxism-Leninism?
Who are the chief financiers of most radical Leftist groups?
What do the affected ethnic group says?
Do they have anything to say at all?
ACLU? Southern Poverty Law Ctr.? ADL?
Who are the organizers of the anti-Israeli groups in the US?
The answer is up to you; – so is the conclusion.
134. MAJMike
This is right out of Julius Streicher’s “Der Sturmer”. Why must people hate the Jews so much? I don’t get it.
**************************
I hope I’m not blocked or banned for saying this but here’s what I think.
First of all: Satan is behind it all. Always has been, always will be.
He knows that to persecute Christians (which happens every day, and will spread to this country before it’s over) will serve no purpose…to attack the Body of Christ does not touch Christ Himself; that is, it cannot harm Him the way Satan would like. Christ is risen and is forever beyond the reach of death or Satan.
Satan’s next best option: try to derail the prophesied revival of national Israel as the nation of Messiah, which will happen when He returns. Therefore Satan is desperate to do whatever he can to attack Jews…even though he knows many of them are not right with God according to their own religious traditions, there will be a remnant of Jews from among them that figure in to the end times prophecies.
Satan has no way of knowing which Jews these will be, or even if they’re alive at this point in history.
So he does what he can to move world opinion against them and orchestrate their utter destruction before the return of Messiah to His covenant people, which will signal the soon end of Satan, forever.
That’s my belief on the true root of all antisemitism, anyway.
These creeps would do Ernst Rohm proud.
Who made the decision for all the infants around the world that they didn’t really want part of their cocks? I think that to try and follow the archaic teachings of foolish religions the infants have no claim to, (other than thru their skewed parents) is nuts. I’m neither islamic nor jewish but would be very pissed off if my parents had cut off part of my cock (and steal part of my my sexual pleasure)to try and fit me into their classic ideals. There is no modern reason or scientific reason to remove part of an infants rigt to sexual pleasure in the future….the end. How would you like it if I just suddenly removed half your brain because some mythical man in the sky said you shouldn’t be that smart…same principal, differnt outcome.
“How would you like it if I just suddenly removed half your brain”
Maybe you could tell us what it feels like, Dan!
@139 Gary Rosen
He just did.
@139 Gary Rosen
He just did.
Have you tried some other hobbies to broaden your pleasure zones, like model trains or building your own little one man airplane? Or camping? Never saw such obsession with having 99.99% but being shattered at the absence of the .01% – and that .01 % which has no bearing on the correct functioning of the 99.99%.
DO you like have a fainting couch to swoon on every time something miniscule isn’t perfect in your latte?
The stupid thing is, that package down there is meant expressly for the purpose of “be fruitful and multiply.” That means KIDS, not a selfish search for the perfect self-pleasuring … for nothing. That’s dead sex.
KIDS are NOT San Francisco. They require self-sacrifice, love and years of protection, teaching and care, everything the dying San Francisco doesn’t represent or honor or promote. Families are fleeing SF – JROTC was run out, Happy Meals, yet SF protects sticking private parts that are supposed to stay CLEAN, into raw fecal matter, the world’s #1 vector for disease. Huh?
If you had five kids in the house, fussing over your lack of foreskin would never be an issue. Fathers do NOT have TIME for that nonsense.
Should add this: the fact that so many Jews are actually working for Satan and against the Scriptural predictions regarding themselves proves nothing about Jews specifically; it only illustrates further the corruptibility of all humans generally. How many times in the Old Testament did Israel fall into idolatry against God, copying the pagan Gentiles who surrounded them? LOTS. Never once, though, did He break his covenant promises to them. He won’t now, either. You’d think Satan would know that but apparently he doesn’t or it’s hidden from him, as it’s hidden from so many otherwise intelligent, knowledgeable Jews and Gentiles today.
“How would you like it if I just suddenly removed half your brain because some mythical man in the sky said you shouldn’t be that smart…same principal, differnt outcome.”
Losing half a brain and losing half a penis would clearly be the same thing, in your case, and would have the same result.
Listen, I live a half an hour from the city, but because of its continuing refusal to turn over illegals who have committed crimes, I and my family have stopped visiting it and have been encouraging our friends to do the same. Three members of one family were wiped out by a criminal illegal who the city let loose because he was an illegal and other illegals have continued to use the system at the expense of the rest of us who want an orderly society for our kids.
The city “leaders,” from the mayor to the supervisors, cater only to their narrow constituencies, which more and more are not families, who after all, have an interest in creating a society that promotes individual responsibilty and normalcy for their kids (the families have begin an exodus from the city because of its crime, filth, and craziness) but rather the “city leaders” cater to druggies, homeless advocates, panhandlers who are nothing more than malingerers, gay activists, assorted sexual perverts such as those who throw the sado-mashochism fair, “business” people making a killing on medical marijuana, etc.
And now, there’s this proposed ban on circumcision, with proponents arguing that sexual pleasure for uncircumsized men is greater than for those who’ve undergone the procedure. BTW, the guy who initially came up with it is gay and a subset of the gay pop. in SF is behind it. Of course, they don’t care that HPV, which is much more likely to be passed to women by uncircumsized men than by circumsized men, is the primary cause of cervical cancer. You’d think they’d at least care about their sisters and mothers and aunts.
So, I’d suggest if you think that what SF proposes and what SF has devolved into has gone far enough (take a look at history–what starts there always spreads) that you do as we do. We boycott the city. Enough people do that and the city’s restauranteurs and businesses that rely on tourism, the city’s major industry, and the politicians will change their tune.
The city is a mess. BTW, it’s incredibly dirty, litter all over the place, pandhandlers bugging you…Guiliani cleaned up NYC. A guy like that is needed in SF, but I won’t hold my breath.
Gonna add to that comment:
It was reported that Obama’s mother died of cervical cancer, the blogger baldilocks mother also did of same.
In common these two strangers? Both mothers were married to LUO men. The tribal people the Luos are traditionally are uncircumcised and have a higher HIV/AIDS infection rate.
The international stats verify this. Curious how it touched Americans, and of all Americans …
You know Detroit? That’s what SF is going to be in about 20-30 years at the current rate.
I’m wondering about some things about Obamacare. The liberals, especially in San Francisco, want to ban circumcision, they banned Happy Meals, they are trying to outlaw smoking everywhere, they want to dictate what we can and cannot eat or drink, all of this for supposed health reasons: Getting rid of all these behaviors will cut down on health expenses when Obamacare kicks in. Since the taxpayers will be paying for our healthcare, they say the government has every right to ban behaviors that will increase the expense for those who don’t engage in these behaviors. Since HIV occurrence is higher among gays than it is among heterosexual men, and given that treatment for HIV is very expensive, will the liberals at some point ban homosexuality because it’s a behavior that only some engage in, but puts great strain on the financial state of our healthcare system? Just asking.
Oh, Dan, you’ve already lost most of your brains!
(By the way, what about abortion? That’s some pretty drastic decision making, for a kid who can’t speak up.)
The next thing you know, people will be allowing their children to decide if they want to be a boy or a girl. Oh, that’s right, we already have people doing that! That “comic” book is horrible and disgusting. We all need to stand up for the Jews so that when they come for us, there will be someone to stand up for us.
I mean, Dan, even with the brains you have let, you can surely see that someone making a decision to end their life, is far more drastic than merely removing a flap of skin—and the kid isn’t consulted in aboriton at all.
Okay, please tell me, in light of this “comic,” Obama siding with the Philistines to go back to 1967 borders and promises to send billions to fund the Islamic “Arab Spring,” why do so many Jews wholeheartedly support the left?
Why are Feinstein, Boxer, Waxman and Harman so rabidly leftwing?
Because in America, politics trumps EVERYTHING.
Because, like the New York Times’ new editor, they grew up in homes where the Times substituted for religion.
Pretty much overtly anti-Semitic. Unfricken believable.
The bolder speakers among us often claim that, when you boil it all down, the only god liberals have is the penis. There’s truth to that, but it’s more accurate to say that the individual himself/herself is the “god.” The penis is indispensable to their faith but it’s only the altar or idol at which they worship self.
“Voluntary adult male circumcision has emerged in the past decade as a “critical” tool to prevent HIV infection, according to a United Nation AIDS agency study.
The 139-page report said male circumcision offers a 60 percent reduction in HIV risk and the benefits are life-long. The number of people with HIV, the virus that causes AIDS, rose 27 percent, to 33 million, between 1999 and 2009, according to the report.”
So I predict that San Francisco’s effort to impose foreskin conformity rather than prick diversity will only result in another gay Aids holocaust on Polk Street. Faster, please, get the measure passed, the more deviation the less population among the intolerant.
worthy of Der Sturmer 1938.
The social plans are all different; the social planners are all alike.
This is a hate-filled attack on G-D. G-D is the One in the Bible who commanded Jewish males to be circumcised. The nasty, revolting comics are an attack on every Jew. What a very sad day for America.
I bet the cartoonist is Jewish, hates Israel, and proudly votes for the Democrats at election time.
With the RINGY DINGY THINGY REPORT.
Yes ladies and gentlemen I am going to interview my ringy dingy thingy here in public and give you all the answers. First of all both my ringy dingy thingy and I salute the good women of America, those that support circumcision.
Q: Now ring dingy thingy, do you believe that this comic was anti-Semetic?
A: After being silent in deep thought, “thingy” indicates that he would spit in the eye the authors of this comic.
Q: After all these years of silence why are you coming out and commenting on this subject now?
A: “Thingy” just shrugged.
Q: Do you have any other comment you would like to make before the end of this interview?
A: “Thingy” indicates “Piss on the anti-Semites.”
Wasn’t that a great interview? All the ladies out there in agreement with Ringy Dingy Thingy please give him a hand (or what ever else you would like).
Now a parting comment from me. America is a great place. It is a place where all the schmucks can hang out together or not.
Highly offensive, clearly anti-semetic. I’m not religious and WASP on both sides. My reading over the last decade has changed my opinion about circumcision. It is an unnecessary procedure in the modern world, but not dangerous, more than momentarily painful, and very meaningful to literally billions of people (Jews and Muslims), unlike female circumcision which is illegal except where medically advisable which is illegal and should be. I’m shocked that there is even a movement to make it illegal, but horrified by this anything-but-comic cartoon.
California’s a Jew-hating hell hole, the Bay Area especially.
California’s colleges and universities are hotbeds of anti-semitism, with Berkeley and San Francisco State among the foulest of them all. Many of the Jewish faculty members in them are rabidly anti-semitic crazies themselves.
Don’t hear a peep out of Jewish faculty on this circumcision Jew-baiting. It’s pathetic.
Glad to see that the people and government of San Francisco have solved all the big problems facing their city, and now have the time to consider the small flap of skin on the end of the penis.
What a country, eh?
And yes, the people behind this initiative are definitely Jew-hating bastards.
I don’t know what to make of this.
It’s so clever, over the top, and ridiculous (a Mohel with armed henchmen!), that I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the author was Jewish.
Plenty of Jews are anti-circumcision, not very fond of the Orthodox, and some Jewish humorists are very fond of heroic Aryan/sinister Jewish mastermind tropes. This joke may have multiple targets.
It’s no joke.
No Jew will find this amusing.
Foreskin Man is not a new comic, nor was it created to be a campaign brochure for the circumcision ban in SF. It’s a series that’s been around for over a year. http://www.comicsalliance.com/2010/07/22/forkeskin-man-protects-baby-boys-from-circumcision/
That’s odd – I would have expected there to be more than 2 “issues” of a comic that had been around this long.
So to those who are saying JUST YOU WAIT THE THIRD ONE WILL PROBABLY BE ABOUT MUSLIMS OR SOMETHING, I’m wondering if maybe this is all the Foreskin Man we’re going to get?
I had a look at the first issue, which says that “next month” a “brit milah exhibit” is coming to the museum, followed by one on “African tribal rituals”…if a third issue ever does come out, that’s my prediction, and I can’t wait to see how they’ll handle *that* one in a racially-sensitive manner…
The cartoon rabbbi is shown with a pair of scissors. Correct me if I’m wrong, somebody, but isn’t it done with a knife? Not only Jew-haters, but ignorant Jew-haters, the kind of ignorance one usually associates with advanced degrees. I’d be willing to bet real money that the ones pushing this law all have at least a masters in GayLesbianTransgenderedPostmodernestFeministEcological Basketweaving Theory
I do have a friend who is a French Mohel who used scissors or rather pinking shears. He was known for the frilly dilly cut.
This isn’t the right way to protest against circumcision, although I am very against it. I can see rational moral reasons to be against circumcision, but other then religious reasons mainly an irrational defense mechanism that causes people to defend it. In order to be against it, a circumcised man must admit that something was stolen from him, take the psychological stance of the victim, which most men cant or will not do concerning a body part so precious to them. They cope by convincing themselves its the best thing since sliced bread(pun intended). Women also cant face the fact that they harmed their children, so it must have been for the best. Doctors that were required to start chopping away at boys in school, well, wont recognize any statistic or survey that suggests that they did little more than molest children with a knife and a clamp. Personally I am angry about the loss of my foreskin and the doctor who stole it without my consent and almost certainly without any pain killers. For non religious reasons, this barbaric practice should end….
I have another friend who is a Mohel. He saved all the foreskins that he cut. One day he decided to do something utilitarian with them and started sewing. When he was done, he had made a briefcase made entirely out of foreskins. Then he decided to patent the briefcase and took it to a patent office. The patent clirck was not having any of it when he was shown the briefcase. He explained that it didn’t matter what the briefcase was made of, it still was a brief case and had already been invented. My friend the Mohel explained to him, “If you stroke it a few times, it turns into a steamer trunk.”
I know its a serious subject; however, we Jews have learned to laugh no matter how bad things get.
That joke admits that the foreskin is sexual tissue – probably the prehistoric reason it was cut off, as some kind of sexual sacrifice, and certainly the reason it was medicalised the late 19th century, to prevent, punish and “cure” masturbation. It didn’t work of course, but the kids (boys AND girls) made darrned sure they weren’t caught at it again.
As masturbation hysteria (or as they called it “moral hygiene”, which was confused with real hygiene) faded, one medical “reason” after another followed.
Why is it any surprise that uber-libs hate Jews? Sorry if this duplicates any above post.
So all Jews are in favor of circumcision, is that right? Because while you seem to be pretty prejudiced against Blonde males, you seem to miss the point that… It is innocent Jewish boys that we would be saving. Preventing Stone age genital mutilation is hardly anti semitic, Any more that portrayingall Muslims as mad jihadist is Islam a phobic.
Ozzy, are you also part of the new group that is trying to make it illegal to cut dog’s tail or ears regardless of the breed, the animal cruelty thing? Are you also against medical experimentation on animals, the science thing? Do you believe that the Sacremento River Smelt should be saved? I think you should let it all out here.
Okay
Little Jewish and Muslim boys are not dogs and cats.
Thank you for allowing me to clear that up.
By the way, you might as well give up, it’s coming.
You want to mutilate children?
Have them do it of their own free will at eighteen.
It might be coming; however, this fits into the Constitutions guarantee of free of religion. We’ll see how this flies in court. I’ve seen plenty of elections overturned here in California by the courts.
Using sinister-looking religious stereotypes to promote anti-circumcision legislation is irresponsible, to say the least. It is downright stupid in terms of garnering votes in favor of the legislation. However, while the tactic is clearly misguided, the issue of circumcision is one that deserves a fair & complete public hearing. Perhaps this initiative will serve to begin a conversation that no one ever seems to want to have.
Circumcision, whether male or female, is a nice word for genital mutilation. It is inflicted almost exclusively on underage children without their consent – primarily infant boys in America, young girls in Africa & the Middle East. I believe it is wrong.
American, Jewish, & Muslim cultures stand alone in the world as places where male circumcision is routine. Regardless of the historical &/or religious reasons for this, there is no serious scientific or medical reason for its continuation. This fact has actually arisen from the medical & scientific communities, & is reflected in a dramatic decline in the number of newborns circumcised at birth in America – from above 90% fifty years ago to barely half today & still dropping.
The horror of female circumcision is only now infiltrating the public consciousness, gaining recognition even at the United Nations where it has been recognized as a major problem in some parts of the world. Several nations have now specifically outlawed it, using the word “barbaric”, & others are moving in that direction. It is only fair, right, & moral that the mutilation of infant males be similarly recognized & forbidden.
I don’t know if this particular bill is the “right” bill; I have yet to study it myself, but I urge everyone to be careful about sorting facts from propaganda & be ready when the matter comes to a ballot near you.
You better study some more, because you equal male circumcision with FGM, which, to use your rehtoric, those who have informed themselves about this KNOW aren’t the same, so to read what you’ve argued sounds phony.
The UN does run education about FGM, but not with male circumcision because FGM is grossly, wildly, NOT equivalent in ANY measure, and does cripple women for life.
One would think the SF City Council would be so moved to help women of color in the Third World by sending money to help the field educators work with women to get rid of FGM instead of shutting down an unrelated practice that will disporportionally affect religious Jews. They reveal their insidious bigotry by their choice of action.
18 United States Code Section 116: Female Genital Mutilation:
(a) Except as provided in subsection (b) whoever knowingly circumcises, excises, or infibulates the whole or any part of the labia majora or labia minora or clitoris of another person who has not attained the age of 18 years shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 5 years, or both.”
This sets out a right for females very like the proposed ban. It just needs the word “female” deleted and the words “or foreskin” added to the list to make it conform to the 14th Amendment.
Notice that it says “or ANY part”, so horrific African tribal rites are not at issue here. (The AAP ignored this last year when it flirted with allowing a token ritual pinprick of girls “much less extensive than neonatal male genital cutting” but was howled down) If you don’t like the word “mutilation” (and many people who cut their daughters don’t either), by all means substitute the word “cutting”.
The problem Zane by supporting the anticircumcission group you are also supporting the people who do believe in using Jewish religious stereo type propaganda. We are not asking that you support circumcission, we are only asking to be left alone to practice our religion. We don’t mutilate female genitalia nor believe in anything like that. Lumping us with that group is also very wrong. Typically this has been the type of attack that usually comes along with attacks on our Kashrut laws, which is also going on at this moment. To not recognize it for what it really is, is a horrible mistake. We are not asking you to do the things which bother you, just leave us alone.
Comparing male circumcision to female clitorectomy is like comparing cataract surgery to gouging someone’s eye out. Male circ is a procedure done in order to promote hygiene and cleanliness, whereas female clitorectomy (“female circumcision” is a weasel term) is done in order to mutilate and remove pleasure/sensory function.
As someone who was circumcised LATER IN LIFE, I can attest that my sexual pleasure and function are literally exactly the same, but my private parts are now infinitely cleaner, better-smelling, etc. The big sexual difference is that it’s now much easier to get oral sex. My parents were the anti-circ types too, which I sorely regret — only because biting the bullet and actually having the procedure done was a difficult decision, but after the fact I’m definitely happy to have done it.
Another thing to consider is the city’s embrace of homosexuality. Once a society, culture, and in this case, a city normalizes homosexuality no one can dare question the morality of the behavior. Case it point, it is gay pride month and the SF Giants have put out a PSA with the “It Gets Better” campaign.
http://www.bluecollarphilosophy.com/2011/06/the-san-fransisco-giants-come-out-with-pro-gay-psa-video.html
Dissent will not be tolerated.
This filth is being sold at Amazon, Barnes & Noble and etc. Will others join me in contacting these companies to complain? See the second link below to find the distributors of this filth.
Dear Amazon,
It came to my attention that you carry Foreskin man
http://www.foreskinman.com/links.htm
This is the same anti-semantic filth that is being passed out in San Francisco for the ban on circumcision.
Please remove this seller and their products ASAP.
http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/06/03/proof-that-s-f-s-circumcision-ban-is-anti-semitic
Thank you,
“Anti-semantic”?!
And why the **** shouldn’t Amazon sell it? If someone wants to buy it, who are you to say nobody should sell it to them?
The comic strip pulls its punch. As you can see above, Monster Mohel refers to “metzitzah b’peh” but the words are not translated and Foreskin Man thwarts him. Metzitzah b’peh is sucking (metzitzah) blood from the wounded baby’s penis by mouth (b’peh).
Some Jews don’t believe metzitzah b’peh was ever practised, yet it was an essential part of brit milah for nearly 2000 years, and some hasidic mohelim in New York still insist on doing it, even after one baby died of herpes as a result. Here is a video of a rabbi defending metzitzah b’peh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCAsAEwe1EU
Jewish anthropology professor Leonard Glick (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4UEbsg-k5Y) suggests that it was brit milah – and especially metzitzah b’peh – that gave rise to the blood libel. Christians seeing Jews doing that to their own children could only guess what they might do to Christian children, and he shows an old antisemitic woodcut of Jews crucifying a boy – and drawing blood from his penis.
Some day, I predict, Jews will find the idea of infant circumcision so repellent that, like metzitzah b’peh, they will consign it first to history, then to mythology. Speed the day!
Wow! And to think that my Dad (of blessed memory) fought the Axis powers as a Navy recruit! Oh, well! I guess we’re just supposed to forget the Holocaust, the pograms, and everything else to which we can’t attach a happy face!
the whole “do it at 14″ arguement is dumb. the reason people do it when they’re babies is so they don’t remember it! also, there ARE proven health benefits. go to wikipedia, idiots.
Dear FORESKIN MAN :
Thank you for your application for JSA membership. Your ability to STOP CIRCUMCISIONS FROM HAPPENING is highly impressive, but our roster is limited, and currently your talents do not meet our needs.
We appreciate your interest, however, FORESKIN MAN , and hope you will enjoy this complimentary JSA refrigerator magnet. We hope it will inspire you in your ongoing battle against JEWS !
Sincerely,
HR department, Justice League of America
Would’ve been funnier if you had decided on “JSA” or “JLA.” Earth One or Earth Two. Pick one.
Thumbs down.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, my bad. Like THEY can keep it all straight. Post-crisis Hawkman, anyone?
I don’t believe for a second this is official literature.
I’d also expect the author to be South Park Jewish.
now hold on a minute! this pamphlet is entirely anti-Semitic, obviously. but what does it have to do with the SF ban? is anyone officially connected to the ban effort involved with this cartoon?
Um, yes. Haven’t you been paying attention? This Mr Hess is the guy who wrote the initiative in the first place, and this cartoon is being distributed by the campaign.
My Anglo-Saxon dad was circumcised and never missed his foreskin. Ditto for my brother and I. I also saw my nephew being circumcised and the mohel spraying his little tip with a local first. He didn’t yell or anything. Which shows what a harmless ritual it has become. Hence, there can be no doubt that not only are the proponents of this measure Jew-haters who want to be able to single Jews out (and the comic is as anti-Jewish as was ‘Der Stuermer’) but singularly ill-informed Jew-haters as well!!!!!
So, this hess guy is anti-semetic but he also seems like a pedophile too.
He is against something that may or may not have any health benefits either way? Any complications are one in 3,000 children and very few of those are life-threatening. So, what is the point of wasting his time with this?
Plus he expects people to follow this comic on Facebook and twitter so everyone thinks they are pedophiles?
He is just crazy and his comic is very disturbing.
We lose our economy to China. We lose our domestic real estate industry to greed. Now we lose our Jews to hate. Wow, talk about a perfect recipe for bringing down a great nation. Fools, once you lose your Jews, you lose the ‘oil’ that germinates economic success. I’m packing and leaving. You turn the lights out!
This article is NOT about circumcision. It’s about the Jew Hate that is the foundation of this promotional material.Now where are all the oh-so- socially-conscious and anti-bigotry SF politicians who will denounce it?
I always thought there was some weird connection between left/libtards and nazis, and this proves it.
Wow! I may be a little late to the debate, but not the cause. I too wish I’d been left intact. I know the doctors at the time like to use the line “Well, you dont want him to look different than all the other boys in the locker room, do you?” Kind of a stupid argument, but it worked.
I will admit to thinking of filing suit against the hospital for performing an unnecessary medical procedure, but havent for fear of embarrassing my parents or for making them feel guilty about a decision they were pressured in to. Then I heard about the case of William Stowell and his successful circumcision lawsuit, against the doctor and hospital (that circumcised him as a baby). Hmmmm. I dont recall what state that was in, but it does sort of set a precedence.
Outside of certain religions and the US, it seems to me uncircumcised is the norm. It’s a foreskin, not a birth defect. Furthermore, it was MY foreskin and should have been my decision.
I am not all that religious myself and I do not hate anyone who finds direction, guidance, peace, salvation or whatever through religion. In fact, I have some admiration for those who can set aside their skepticism and just accept certain things solely on faith. I have very little use for anyone committing any of the heinous acts currently or previously done in the name of religion, ie war, rape, circumcision. And NO! I am not comparing war to circumcision. I am saying lots awful things are done in the name of religion.
I was baptised in the name of religion as well. It wasn’t by my choice, but I cant say I have any problem with that. But, then again, it didnt leave any physical scars either.
No, I dont support state funded abortion. If you want one, fine, it’s your conscience. But you figure out how to pay for it. If you make me pay for it, then I insist on sterilization. Just like kittens. Besides, I think adoption is a better answer. Not the perfect answer, just a better one.
I dont support anyone perpetrating an unwarranted vile act on another in anyone’s name, deities included.
And could someone please explain the justification of one heinous act by pointing to another equally heinous act?
Is comic book or whatever anti-semitic? I think so. Is the proposed SF law, I dont know. That’s really for the courts to decide. Which they most assuredly will if it passes. Are the people behind the proposal anti-semitic? Probably, at least some of them in some way. But does it really matter? There will always be one group who hates another for something.
What if the next religion that pops up requires an intact foreskin. And the STATE doesnt step in to protect them. What is that called?
Maybe we should stop doing circumcisions as a matter of routine, (I’m really glad no one has suggested following the money on this one,) continue obviously when medically needed, and if the father wants it done for a religious reason, then fine. Let’s stop with the wholesale brainwashing of mothers and leaving the decision up to them. Obviously, they are not men, and really cant understand. Besides, I think one could argue women are not truly in their right mind at the time of birth and sketchy at best during pregnancy.
Here’s a thought experiment. Suppose a boy is born, circumcised due to YOUR religious beliefs. The he grows up and has some doubt about the religion in which he has been brought up in. Then he discovers a piece of his anatomy is missing due to this religion about which he has doubts. Now, which way do you think he will be swayed? Maybe, just maybe if he was given the choice to be circumcised to remain part of the covenant, he may willingly give up his foreskin, or not. But is would be his choice, not something that was unconsensually forced.
TMI below – Read at your own risk.
You’ve been warned!
Let’s just say all men are not created equal. Regardless of the metric used, someone has to represent the lower end of any statistical sample. So what if that’s me. Not my problem. It maybe for someone else, but that’s just genetics. It’s always worked as intended for me, so to say, it is what it is, it gets me through life.
Now they say the surface area of the average foreskin is 15 square inches, (think 3×5 index card). Whatever fraction of that gifted to me by genetics was mine, and given the choice would still be mine.
I’m sure some armchair shrink has already diagnosed me with issues. Good for you. Like that was hard. We all have issues. But…..
Am I anti-semitic?
I agree with every word you said. Im a circumcised man who wishes that there were laws to protect me from doctors that performed a totally unnecessary and detrimental mutilation on me.
The arguments proposed for circumcision to non-jewish/non-muslim have evolved greatly over the decades, the modern proponent of non religious non therapeutic circumcision is a snake oil salesman with a surgery searching for a disease. There isnt a problem that needs fixing, so its a constant search for slight coincidental benefits.
Not to support this anti-semetic cartoon but it is true that jews in the medical field greatly played up the advantages of circumcision in the post ww2 years in order to ensure that it would become widespread and thus not be outlawed. Also I suppose it would make them feel less likely to ever be rounded up again with their penis being testimony to their jewishness as it was in Nazi Germany. Back then however they took a different strategy, they emphasized how much it reduced pleasure and more importantly your sons ability to masturbate in those hellish days before internet pornography. That generation happened to be one that was in the throws of a christian religious revival and liked the idea of stopping their sons from having too much fun in the bedroom. The practice has stuck because those men cant admit something was taken from them and have to mutilate thier sons to protect their self esteem.
Now the arguments reversed and they claim there is no loss of pleasure, the only real testiment being studies of African males circumcised in adulthood when they joined the military, who when interviewed before and after, rated their sexual experience and performance as 10/10.(these surveys were done with all the troops together, not separately interviewed).
One modern argument is that itll reduce penile cancer rates, which is soo rare to be neglible, but they put it on their pro-circumcision literature nonetheless for ignorant well intentioned mothers to read.
To be honest I bet that amptutating one testicle at birth would reduce testicular cancer (a far more common disease) by a significant margin, as well as a myriad of other testicular problems. The lowered testosterone levels (about 1/3rd) would also likely reduce the occurance of prostate problems, lower male sex drive (reducing STDs) and possibly lower the occurance of rape in one fell swoop. Easy to grasp at straws to justify mutilation eh?
People are arguing to amputate other tissue from men’s genitals to “protect women from HPV” etcetera. It may be true that stds will have a harder time getting through the thickening callous of keratin that your sons penis will be for the rest of his life.(growing less sensite by the year).
When I have a son I wont remove his birthright of a functional penis and a healthy sexlife to cater to shallow American women, or to protect promiscuous women from transmitting to each other a disease that they could easily be vaccinated for(HPV). Basically, get your daughter a shot, dont mutilate your son.
I’m a circumcised man who wishes that there were laws to protect me from doctors that performed a totally unnecessary and detrimental mutilation on me.
Being a doctor, I’ve reviewed the studies and decided personally that the benefits of circumcision are enough to justify it, considering there are absolutely no drawbacks (other than the risk of complications after the procedure, a very, very rare situation).
And how it circumcision “detrimental”?
If you are indeed a MD, you will know that not a single pediatric or state medical association in the world encourages non-therapeutic infant circumcision. (not even the Israeli medical association). The reason is that there aren’t enough proven and significant benefits to justify the risk of complication/infection…and in some opinions, the violation of the rights of the child. Some are fervently against it such as in Northern Europe and the others just make disclaiming statements about not being able to recommend it and to weigh the options yourself/with your doctor.
I trust that you were circumcised as a child/ or are a woman, so personally have no idea whether there is a loss of sensation or not. You obviously choose to believe that there isn’t. If you were right you would be morally correct to treat consenting adults with this surgery that had given you informed consent.
However, to perform a surgery on non-consenting children, who cant give their own informed consent should require tremendous, if not, life saving
benefits to the child. Depriving them of the choice of whether to permanently alter their bodies or not, risking their sense of bodily integrity and potentially harming them psychologically without such overwhelming cause is not morally correct.
So no, your personal opinion that circumcision of non consenting babies provides some benefit does not give you the moral right to do it.
The reason is that there aren’t enough proven and significant benefits to justify the risk of complication/infection…and in some opinions, the violation of the rights of the child.
No, the reasons are purely legal/political. I’ve followed the back and forth from the AAP concerning circumcision for the past 40 years and the only thing that is certain, is they can’t seem to make up their mind.
More and more studies show circumcision to reduce the incidence of STDs as well as infections and perhaps even some cancers. Of course these cases are rare, but considering you have yet to give one legitimate contraindication to circumcision, it’s an easy choice to me.
The reason is that there aren’t enough proven and significant benefits to justify the risk
Yet you admit further down the thread that incidence of infection for uncircumcised males is higher than circumcised.
That alone is reason enough given the fact you cannot produce a single tangible drawback. Parents make decisions for their children every day, that is the job of the parent. For you to allege they have no say in this decision is silly.
f you are indeed a MD, you will know that not a single pediatric or state medical association in the world encourages non-therapeutic infant circumcision.
The AAP doesn’t discourage it either. The state the decision is up to the parents, as it should be. It would not surprise me, however, to see them change their stance in the next few years to more supportive of circ.
If you want drawbacks of it, here you go. Inherent drawbacks such as the loss of 20,000 nerve endings, the loss of important sensitive structures such as the ridged band and the frenelum, and the exposure of the glans to friction and the development of a callous over it to protect it.
If you dont care that the children you cut wont enjoy sex as much, well then how about the potential side effects such as:
The removal of too much skin which causes painful erections/stunted growth.(actually very common, reason circumcised penis’s are on average 1/2 inch smaller).
Infection
Skin bridges
meatal stenosis
fatal hemourage
oh, and those not so uncommon common cases in which the head of the penis is damaged or partially amputated
Some of the side effects are not as rare as the conditions/diseases that circumcision is lauded to prevent
Then there is the debatable psychological impact, studies show that men circumcised without painkillers as children have a lower pain threshold and a higher rate of all sorts of anxiety disorders. (And more then 95 percent were/are circumcised without painkillers so that very valuable and nerve rich skin can be sold to companies that grow skin for surgical use/make skin lotions that sell for hundreds to thousands of dollars/ and studies on nerve cells which the foreskin has in abundance (they can sell for around 100$ each, ask your doctor))…
Apparently, much like playing music for babies can make them smarter, mutilating them without painkillers can make them more nervous and prone to psychological problems.
Your welcome, TomB
Actually, I’m not referring to the extremely rare complications. Nor am I referring to the mythical “loss of sensation”, of which, your almighty AAP reports:
A survey of adult males using self-report suggests more varied sexual practice and less sexual dysfunction in circumcised adult men. There are anecdotal reports that penile sensation and sexual satisfaction are decreased for circumcised males. Masters and Johnson noted no difference in exteroceptive and light tactile discrimination on the ventral or dorsal surfaces of the glans penis between circumcised and uncircumcised men.
So perhaps, it is all in your (other) head.
But if you want to be hysterical about it. I’ll take a mild post-op infection if that means decreased incidences of UTIs, STDs, cancers, etc. later in life, for the rest of his life.
Your welcome sparky.
“Masters and Johnson noted no difference in exteroceptive and light tactile discrimination on the ventral or dorsal surfaces of the glans penis between circumcised and uncircumcised men.”
One “self-reported” study, which only accounts for the parts not cut off, says theres no change in some of the nerve response of what remains… this doesn’t disprove anything. Its a straw man argument. Regardless of if some of the remaining tissue is just as sensitive, it says nothing of the loss of the sensitivity of the tissue thats no longer there. Most of the circumcised have no base line to judge anything more sensitive then what they have…
I’m glad that you addressed your opinion toward post op infections, although they are minor as far as complications go(though potentially more serious than a UTI).. as are pretty much every potential benefit that you use justify the procedure. Penile cancer sounds pretty serious, it accounts for 0.1% of cancers in men. Although the logic that cutting off up to 50 percent of the skin covering a body part would reduce the rate of cancer sounds good:
“A study that concluded circumcision did not prevent penile cancer was done by Wallerstein, which reported that the risk of penile cancer in Japan, Norway, and Sweden (countries with a low rate of circumcision) is about the same (1 in 100,000 per year) as in the US.”
The jury is still out on many of the STD studies as well. The “down time” after an adult getting cut tends influence his chance of catching HIV in Africa that year for instance…. Its sorta redundant though because Europe and most of the civilized world do not do it, and they aren’t dealing with an aids epidemic… or any epidemic that I am aware of.
Also, I don’t believe that I’m hysterical in any way. Ive researched the topic extensively, and am passionate about stopping the procedure. Attack the argument, not the man. If my responses are long, its because I’m taking the time to actually disprove what you say, not a strawman argument that I make for you.
So, long (long, long) story short, you can’t show any long-term problems with circumcision. An adult circumcised penis is perfectly functional, has more than adequate sensation, is, in the US, absolutely normal looking and is less likely (even if you are to be believed, extremely rare) to suffer from numerous afflictions.
Sounds good to me.
I was circumcised as an infant, and I’m glad my parents made that choice. Why do you wish to force your choice on me? Why would you have wanted me to decide to be circumcised when I was 14 or 18, when it would have been much more painful for me to be so?
Why do you have the right to dictate what my parents should decide?
Ultimately, no matter what our parents decide, some of us aren’t going to like the decision! And that is going to be true, so long as parents have custody over children who are too young to make a decision on something as benign as circumcision.
You’re only anti-semetic if you try to get circumcision banned, since that forbids Jews from practicing their religion, and turns them into outlaws if they circumcise their sons; also, if you actually believe this idiot comic’s nonsense about eeeeevil Jewish mohels attacking children. (Please read my earlier comment about a ban on circumcision being, de facto, anti-semetic, whatever the motives of those pushing it.)
If you aren’t actively working to ban circumcision (thereby turning Jews into outlaws) and you don’t believe in Nazi style caricatures of Jews, you’re not anti-semetic, you’re just a guy with issues.
Soo is it racist or anti African to ban female genital mutilation when it is just as ancient and revered part of several African religions and cultures. Or are the jews just special?
jj,
Female circumcision is not done by Jews. A Jewish female is considered circumcised in a spiritual sense from birth, possessing the holy covenant within herself from the moment she is born. In Judaism, women are regarded as spiritually more evolved, and on a higher spiritual plane than men.
The reasons that it is performed in African and Arab Muslim nations is specifically to prevent a woman from experiencing sexual stimulation, so she will not be intimate with males other than her husband. This is not religion, it is a control issue.
Additionally, in those nations, they remove the entire clitoris, often mutilating her urethra, labia major and minor in an unsanitary, barbaric manner. Many girls bleed to death, die of infections, and many are traumatized for life. It is done when she has reached puberty and has had her first menses.
Further, male circumcision has been done by Jews for 4,000 years. We don’t die of it, and it certainly has not kept Jewish men from sexual enjoyment, fathering children, or any other activity.
I have to confess. I was circumsized when I was 8 days old and it left me unable to walk for nearly 15 months!
Autism facts: 1 in 110 children in the general US population is afflicted with autism. Why is this not being treated as an epidemic?
In military families the rates are 1 in 80, why?
Members of the military have to take many exotic vaccines.
If you go to the social security disability web site you will discover that vaccine injuries are a covered disability.
Am I the only one that sees a correlation here?
Yes, you are.
Will the piercing of babies’ ears be protested as well?!
The Left is consistent. It is against Israel, Jews and circumcision because it is opposed to differences between people. Sexual intercourse with any individual is the same no matter who that person is and what his/her circumstances are. Terrorist are the same as victims, rich the same as poor. There are no differences in needs between people who are smart and people who are less smart. Differences in outcome must be wiped out. Initial differences are unimportant. The fact that there are an infinite number of different paths to different outcomes or even the same outcome is of no account. In other words, the reality of differences must not be tolerated. Differences cause conflict instead of presenting an opportunity to express pride in self and develop tolerance for differences in others.
You people really need to grow up. So this particular issue of foreskin man just happens to be dealing with a Mohel. Foreskin man is a comic that represents intactivism against ALL forms of genital cutting. The Jews just happen to do their share of it as well! This is NOT an anti-semetic comic. If you just read the other issues instead of going by the images you see here, maybe you’ll see it.
The Jews just happen to do their share of it as well!
Ah, the sweet smell of stereotyping:
In America, over 90 per cent of circumcised men are non-Jewish.
Around the world, 70 per cent of circumcised men are Muslim.
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/268831/it-bird-it-plane-no-its-mark-steyn
By your own standard, the antagonists should be at least vaguely Muslim.
This ‘comic’ is most certainly anti-semitic. Kindly take a good look at the images of the Jews: blackened face and eyes, leering grins…notice their fingernails are claws. Take a look at the hero..blond hair, short fingernails, heroic muscles.
Oh – and how about the name of the Jew? Monster. Hmmm.
And you say that these images of Jews are not anti-semitic? Whew. What would make them anti-semitic for you?
It’s good to see the true San Francisco and its inhabitants come out of the closet. Why the fuss? We should encourage them in this. Let them exit the closet to reveal their true natures. Why attempt to shame them (they have no shame)? Why attempt to pressure them to accept the (to them) unacceptable? Let them expose themselves for who they are. I’m sure no one will judge them lest they be called “phobic.”
Yes, this particular issue of “Foreskin Man” (What a name for a superheroe!) just happens to deal with Jews—evil Jews—Jews who go around forcibly circumsizing kids, aginst their mother’s wishes—Jews drawn in the good ol’ Nazi “Jud Suss” style.
But it’s NOT anti-semetic. Yah, right.
/Sarc.
Perhaps a comic book called ” Anus Attacker ” showing a drooling homosexual luring a young boy with candy would be the appropriate response.
Please remove the abominable “Frisco” from the headline on the front page. Use S.F. or even SanFran but never “Frisco.”
St. Francis must find it loathsome that the city that bears his name has become full of abominations.
Will it be permissible to circumcise prenatally in SF if this law passes?
The Jewish god demands not only the mutilation of children (circumcision), but also the mutilation of animals (kosher), which is done deliberately to maximize the animal’s pain and suffering. Why does the Jewish god demand mutilation and blood? Why did Jews perform animal sacrifices in the past at their “temple” (and would like to do so again if their ‘third temple’ is built)?
Well, once you understand that each nation’s god(s) are merely an invention and reflection of the racial character of that particular nation, the question then becomes, “Why does the Jewish nation feel the need to mutilate children and animals?” And I think the answer is that part of the Jews’ racial character is the “need” to torture “inferior” forms of life. Jews see children and animals as especially vulnerable, which is why children are often the victims of extremist rabbis (http://www.altermedia.info/media-lies/hummer-rabbi-who-tortured-kids-expelling-demons-extradited-to-israel_1840.html).
And this behavior eventually got to the point that the Jews made religious rituals out of it that they still go by today and want everyone else to accept.
If we could stuxnet Iran …..
Ares – your comments are absolute ignorant racist garbage.
Circumcision is not ‘mutiliation of children’ but a medical procedure and has to be examined as such, both the pros and cons, only in that nature. The well-known practice of removing the tonsils of children – was that carried out by a ‘race’ and was that ‘mutiliation’?
Equally, the kosher (and halal) method of animal slaughter is not to inflict ‘pain and suffering’ and is no more painful, and possibly less (instantaneous due to severing of the jugular) than any other method of animal slaughter.
It is equally disgusting that you declare that the Jewish god ‘demands mutilation and blood’. Prove it. Jews reject consumption of blood.
As for your animal sacrifices, that’s equally garbage. No such thing. Equally, your comments that Jews, as a distinct ‘race’ want to torture animals and children are pure ignorant racism.
How have you managed to become, or stay, so ignorant and so prejudiced?
So typical of an atheist anti-Semite to equate the Creator of the Universe with the idols that He condemns as wicked and barbaric- the idols to which the heathens sacrificed their children by burning them alive and committed other abominations for. As for the animal sacrifices, they were instituted as a reminder that the wages of sin is death, as well as to establish a pattern of vicarious atonement, wherein the innocent could redeem the guilty by paying the debt of the guilty. This was fulfilled in the coming of the Messiah, who by His death destroyed the sins of all who believe in Him, and by His rising from the dead restored the lives of the same. Baruch Haba b’Shem Adonai!
Forget the comic. Of course it is anti-jew but what is important is the forced circumcision of male children. That in itself is a crime against nature. It is mutilation, pure and simple. When someone brings undisputable proof of this mysterious being called “God” for us to see then perhaps we can justify mulitating male members. Personally I have a few well chosen words for the bas&$@d. I happen to believe circumcision should be banned as a habitual practice. If you are stupid enough to believe in some assinine Progressive dribble about cleanliness or far worse some stupid religious belief based in superstition and ignorance, then have at it but leave my foreskin and my sons foreskins and my grandsons foreskins alone. It’s called a circumcision scar not a circumcision beauty mark and it is nothing to be proud of. It is in fact ugly to look at and unnatural. I am proud to say that I have saved more than one male child from the indignity of circumcision, the latest, my grandson. I am so proud that none less than Princess Diana championed the cause of keeping the foreskin where it belongs. She went against tradition and refused to have the future King circumcised. Bravo! Screw the whales! Save our foreskins!
“If you are stupid enough to believe in some assinine Progressive dribble(sic) about cleanliness
Are you really saying that it is just as easy to keep an uncircumcised penis clean? If so, how do you explain the increased rate of infections with uncut members?
And it’s “drivel”, not “dribble”.
In early childhood the foreskin is bonded to the glans of the penis by adhesions which protect the head of the penis from exposure to feces during the period in which the child is in diapers. No cleaning is required until these adhesions break down. The foreskin cannot be retracted without breaking these adhesions which should not be broken because the glans of the penis are still forming(and not necessary until puberty).
In fact the first stage of a circumcision is the painful process of breaking these adhesions, which are much like those that hold your nails to your fingers.
So yes it is easier to clean and uncircumcised penis for perhaps the first 7-10 years of life, then it is a circumcision wound in a diaper exposed to feces.
Although later in life the incidence of infection is greater in the uncircumcised male, its still well below the the frequency of similar female infections. England stopped recommending infant circumcision because the cost of performing the surgery on the entire male population outweighed the cost of treating foreskin problems down the road. Its not only morally correct, but more economical to not circumcise.
So yes it is easier to clean and uncircumcised penis for perhaps the first 7-10 years of life,
Easier how? Once the would heals there is no place for material to accumulate in a circumcised penis. How does that make it more difficult?
then it is a circumcision wound in a diaper exposed to feces.
Huh?
Although later in life the incidence of infection is greater in the uncircumcised male, its still well below the the frequency of similar female infections.
What does that have to do with anything? You admit fewer infections in a circumcised male, but then you say it doesn’t matter because women get more? That makes no sense whatsoever. You need to compare apples to apples (or penises to penises). Vaginal infections are completely irrelevant.
That was my post.
Nothing can accumulate under the foreskin of a young child, as it is bonded by adhesions to the glans of the penis. It will separate later in life, cant be a hygiene issue until then.
Comparing the number of infections of an uncircumcised and circumcised penis to the number of infections in girls, shows that infections of either state is not a big issue. Boys get less infections then girls either way, Why isn’t it an issue that justifies surgery for girls? Because its not really an issue that leads to anything but mild discomfort for a short period for either sex.
In the debate about circumcision the numbers and statistics thrown around are misleading. lets say theres a 1 in 400 chance of getting a disease or certain issue if circumcised and and 1.27 in 400 chance of the same issue if not circumcised.. OMG a 27 percent increase if left intact, lets do surgery on all 400 babies.
Presenting proof of God to you would be casting pearls before swine, since you have already decided that your response will be to blaspheme Him.
OK Ares, I’ll bite (as it were), how is circumcision “mutilation”?
Here is the defintion:
MUTILATE
transitive verb
1: to cut up or alter radically so as to make imperfect
2: to cut off or permanently destroy a limb or essential part of : cripple
I don’t think the ban is antisemitic, but the propaganda certainly is. I wish they could have kept that out of it, and instead, focused on the science and medical information.
The propaganda is very anti-semitic. While many have their opinions, it is also important to consider the whole-life cycle. Many elderly men are circumsized if they are institutionalised or unable to properly care for this aspect of their health. In addition, the uniqueness of each individual means that some older children may be circumsized due to health issues and excess foreskin. It is not as simple as deeming the practice barbaric or not.
Lotta junk science on this thread.
Sorry, mount hood, we’re not just going to forget about the comic, and pretend it will just go away, if we ignore it.
Cleanliness is “progressive drivel?” Who’da thunk! I guess all those scientists who discovered germs, and developed modern hygiene were on the wrong track!
Ares is an anti-semite of the more rantin’ and ravin’ variety.
Ignore him.
“Defenders of the measure say it’s all about ‘human rights’ and ‘protecting babies’ from unnecessary procedures.”
What absolute drivel. These are the same people who champion “a woman’s right” to abortion: They think that the procedures used to abort a human fetus, aka baby, are “necessary”? They’re certainly much more invasive and destructive than those involved in circumcision: In an abortion, the child dies. In a circumcision, a small amount of flesh is removed from the boy’s penis, which may make him cry, but in the end, he’s alive — and probably kicking.
” “Defenders of the measure say it’s all about ‘human rights’ and ‘protecting babies’ from unnecessary procedures.”
What absolute drivel. These are the same people who champion “a woman’s right” to abortion: They think that the procedures used to abort a human fetus, aka baby, are “necessary”? ”
If you had read at least the last 20 comments and their responses,
you would realise just how ignorant your statement makes you sound.
It’s part of the Bono-Buffett-Bobby-Bill& Melinda “One Sabbath” campaign launched in the dead of night in Santa Monica last week. Google Creepy One World Religion AKA Universal Islam. Really. And the billionaire who funds the One Nation, One World, One Sabbath etc stuff is a quiet, folksy granpa type named George “Pension Pioneer” Russell Jr.
http://wwwtwosetsofbooks.blogspot.com/2011/05/bono-buffetts-bill-melinda-bloomberg.html
The proposed law is ludicrous but about what you would expect from the city on the hill which as usual is dancing to it’s own drummer and far out of the mainstream. The literature (and in this case I use the term very loosely) is pure Jew baiting and guarenteed to bring the fringe and neo’s out of their caves dragging their clubs.
What is so societally wrong with the U.S.that we cannot leave any one group alone to live and be as they would? Who empowers these strange few groups who would dictate morality as they see it and govern our lives as they determine what is best for us, etc.? What is the ‘Baby Rights” movement? The biggest social problem this country has are all the marginal individuals running around that are always fanning the flames over supposed RIGHTS. They have already gone way beyond the meaning or intent of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Give it a rest people, we have enough real problems without creating imagined new ones. Is there no sanity left in this country?
The most merciful and humane time to circumsize a male is on his 8th day of life. Scientifically, it’s been found that the clotting factor in the blood peaks on the 8th day after birth, and so the healing is very fast. I had two sons and allowed the hospital to circumsize the first one on the second day after birth, the customary hospital procedure, determined by convenience. It took that child a week to ten days to heal and the scab fall off. When my second son was born, a Christian dr. told me about the clotting factor as why God instructed Jews to circumsize their baby boys on the 8th day after birth. I requested this for my second son, and although that day fell on Thanksgiving and we had already been discharged from the hospital, a Jewish neonatoligist was willing to meet us back at the hospital on that day and do the circumcision. The difference was like night and day! Son #2 healed up in about 2 days! Much easier on the baby.
Neither of my sons remembers anything about their circumcisions, but every single male I know who has had to go and have it done as an adult has suffered, and expressed that they WISHED their parents had just done it when they were born.
Isn’t it wonderful that they provide the evidence for a lawsuit challenge?
Not that I buy anything from from San Francisco anyway, but I think I will boycott them until they repeal this fascist, nanny-state law.
Circumcision is at the heart of the Abrahamic Covenant. It is not optional. Asking Jews not to be circumcised is anathema to the core of their religion and should be protected by the first amendment. The covenant requires parents to circumcise their eight day old male child or be in danger of God’s judgement.
Ex. 4:24 ¶ At a lodging place on the way, the LORD met [Moses] and was about to kill him.
Ex. 4:25 But Zipporah took a flint knife, cut off her son’s foreskin and touched [Moses’] feet with it. “Surely you are a bridegroom of blood to me,” she said.
Ex. 4:26 So the LORD let him alone. (At that time she said “bridegroom of blood,” referring to circumcision.)
God was about to kill Moses because He was in violation of the covenant of circumcision.
To compare male circumcision with female genital mutilation bespeaks either a confusion about the human reproductive system, or a wish to mislead others. Foreskin is present in male mammals to provide protective tissue for the dangly bit, when not in procreative use. The female sex organ needs no foreskin to protect it while running naked through the jungle. All of the female organ is sexual and removal of any part is desensitizing and will reduce sexual pleasure. All female sexual mutilation is for the express purpose of reducing female sexual pleasure. It is not circumcision; it is mutilation.
Tissue removed in female genital mutilation is purposely removassociated with sensation during intercourse.
I actually composed a song for this blog’s subject, then I read the comments. All of a sudden it wasn’t fun or funny any more. The roaches have come out of the wood work and trying to feast on our discomfort. Up to now, I thought that this was a free country. Now I realize that this freedom also allows the lowlifes of this country to rub their sh*t in our face. I’ve grown tired of seeing this happen. I’ve grown tired of seeing our enemies gloat in our discomfort. I’m not alone. If I were any of these anti-Semites, I would tread lightly. The dog you stir up might come back to bite you in the a**.
We Jews have been practicing circumcision for 3600 years. The same for the Laws of Kashruth ( permitted foods and ritual slaughter ).
The latter kept us safe during the Black Plague. The former during the current sexually transmitted plague.
Of course circumcision does not protect from HIV but obedience to G-ds Law does.
Nobody has ever stopped us from obeying G-ds Law. Nobody ever will.
Several posters point out that in England the men are typically not circumsized. Actually, it’s mandatory, only thanks to the NHS, the waiting period is 80 years.
The depiction in this comic book appears anti semetic indeed and promotes prejudice and nasty stereotypes. But it is not “Proof that S.F.’s circumcision ban Is anti-Semitic.” The ban precedes and extends far beyond this comic and it’s senseless, idiotic makers. When
emotions overrun balanced arguments, you loose the game. Lets stay on top.
It’s not simply anti-semitic, it’s also anti-spirituality. As a Christian, I feel like it’s making fun of people who worship God. On a scientific level, medical science shows that circumcising males cuts females cervical cancer risk. I can’t believe that they’re actually VOTING on circumcision in San Francisco.
http://www.webmd.com/cancer/cervical-cancer/news/20110106/male-circumcision-cuts-womens-cervical-cancer-risk
I have a feeling this is not official campaign material. Quite possibly, this was created by the ban’s opponents to smear the ban campaigners. I’m against the ban, but it would surprise me that the ban’s proponents could be so naïve.
Are the Gentiles supposed to give a shit? These people are in control because the Jews helped elect them – now they act surprised???
People ban female circumcision, are they anti-African? There are many “laws” in Leviticus, most of which would seem ridiculous if people were told to adhere to them faithfully, yet those seem ok to not pay attention to while others are the most important thing. Stop cutting people’s pensises.
This comic strip is stupid. But it’s hardly the issue.
The command to circumcise all descendents of Abraham came in Genesis, not Leviticus.
The comic book designers forgot to characterize blondie doing the goose step.
Is this sort of law really neccessary?
We need more laws? We need politicians to determine personal or religious actions?
And how would you enforce this law and what would be the punishment for breaking it? CA prisons are at 200% capacity.Going to toss out a convicted murderer to make space for a baby pecker snipper? Will you hire penis police to visit the homes of 8 day old Jewish baby boys?
It is a parental choice ,not a mandatory or forced legal act.
For those upset by their parents choice ,a shrink can help you with mommy hate.I am sure your parents will apologize and feel guilty.
There are more important issues than your 20 yr resentment over missing something you have no memory of having.
And don’t compare FGM with circumcision plz.They are not even close.
Sorry, Paul, the comic is anti-semetic, not stupid.
And anti-semetism is very much the issue.
Liana, you raise some very interesting questions.
How exactly do they intend to enforce this? Arrest all mohels? All doctors who perform circumcisions? Will the “Penile Patrol” go from house to house (and you just know they’re gonna start with Jewish homes!) yanking off little boy’s diapers, to see if they’ve been circumcised? Are they going to set up stings, by pretending to be Jewish parents who want their kids circumcised? Will all the rapists and murderers be set loose, so moms, dads, doctors and mohels can be imprisoned? Will schools be ordered to deny admissions to kids who are circumcised?
Isn’t this opening up an awfully big can of worms, and all just to make some guys feel better about their lost foreskins?
Wouldn’t make too much out of him being named ‘Hess’, it’s just a German name (like ‘Eisenhauer’…er, ‘Eisenhower’). When Hitler’s nephew was recruited for the US Army during WW2, the recruiting officer supposedly said, ‘Glad to meet you Hitler, my name’s Hess’.
The German-American Bund did get chummy with Hitler, but they were in the Midwest, not SF. This is more nutty leftism than Nazism, methinks.
this cartoon is against the practice and the neurosis circulating the jewish community and their circumcision rituals. its not antisemitic.
here’s why: 1. if the jews circumcised only consenting 18 year old (and older) men then there would be no issue. why? b/c what a grown man does to his own penis is NO ONES BUSINESS. not yours, not mine.
2. this cartoon doesnt attack the whole of Judaism. it just attacks that part of Judaism that attacks an infant’s basic human rights. that’s all. the method/the reasoning/the ritual (done before the age of 18) is absolutely wrong… whats wrong with attacking something that is wrong? thats what cartoons are for: to make light of a seriously wrong issue.
lets put some perspective on the issue so the light the cartoon sheds seems a little funnier:
american muslims feel just as strongly about female circumcision as jewish americans feel about male circumcision — the US GOVT has forced the muslim americans to stop circumcising their daughters on US soil. is the US GOVT anti-muslim and pro-jewish?
lesson of the day: stop taking ourselves so seriously, laugh at a stupid cartoon, and stop mutilating our children.
leslie – the cartoon is most definitely anti-semitic. Consider the facts:
The images of the Jews are gross: blackened faces, leering grins with long fang-teeth, and claws, yes, blackened (bloodied?) claws rather than fingernails. Named as ‘monsters’. Now, those images aren’t depictions of factual Jews – but Jews-as-vicious-monsters. That’s anti-semitic.
The ‘savior’ of the child is depicted as aryan, blond, good-looking muscles..oh..and short fingernails. Not bloodied claws.
If you want to attack the custom or have a debate about the ‘rights of the child’ and the function of circumcision, by all means – have such a debate. But not by vilifying one set of the debaters as non-human monsters, and not by setting up a situation where the argument isn’t about:
benefits or harm of circumcision
rights of child vs duty of parents
…but is instead, based only on two sets of images: Evil Jews vs heroic Aryan.
As for your argument about the rights of the child, parents have the responsibility to care for the child, and there are medical reasons in favor of circumcision – probably these medical reasons are the origin of the religious and cultural practice in both Judaic and Islamic peoples. The debate should be about these reasons.
Parents authorize vaccinations, tonsil removal etc, so you’ll have to expand your definition of ‘rights of the child’ to include parental care.
Furthermore, there is absolutely no comparison between female genital mutilation – which is not circumcision – and male circumcision. It’s a practice carried out in Africa – not bound in Islam – and found among pastoral peoples where the males are absent from the village for months at a time (herding the animals).
its a CARTOON. you have to personify to make a cartoon funny. its over exaggeration. everyone knows jews dont really look like that. to describe something via pictures w/o narrative diction you have to exaggerate the image. do you really think all intactivists look like that foreskin man?
the truth, that you dont want to say, is that nobody is allowed to crack a joke or make fun of a jew post ww2. jews have a monopoly over the victim card. its ridiculous.
its a cartoon. its funny. it ILLUSTRATES the passion of the intactivist movement — if it was antisemitic then the cartoon would conclude that foreskin man would be more than happy to let the rabbi mutilate the baby. c’mon. ive moved on from ww2. have you?
I can’t believe I responded to such a fool.
Yes, they were “just cartoons” when Hitler came out with them too. Just harmless little cartoons. And the speeches he gave were just words. Just harmless little words. And those ovens…they were just…uh, yeah, what were you saying? Idiocy.
I am utterly horrified that this is happening. As though NEVER AGAIN doesn’t MEAN NEVER AGAIN. This is how it starts. Hell, this is how it is halfway through.
I see, Annie.
Jews are “neurotic” for wanting to carry out their religious beliefs, and raise their children in their own traditions. You also drag in the Moslem female genital mutilation issue (which, by the way, we are continually assured by pundits, is not Islamic, just an old tribal traition—except in cases like these, when it suddenly becomes part of Islam), and try to equate it with male circumcision. The two things are not similar at all. Female mutialation is more like the old practice of castrating males taken into slavery. Circumcision It does not render men impotent, or unable to father children or turn them into eunuchs; it is not “mutilation.”
Then, you urge us just to laugh to at this squalid piece of garbage. Okay, I admit—I find it pretty freakin’ hiliarious! Aryan surfer dude (who looks like the love child of the Hulk, and Mighty Thor) rescuing foreskins for the good of humanity—that’s pretty hilariour right there. (And why are the Jews holding a bris in a poolhall?)
(Oh, yeah, nice slap at the U.S. government for being “Anti-Moslem.”)
What I find even more shocking (and few things shock me) than the outright Nazi propaganda itself, is the blase attitude of so many saying “Oh. Hm. That’s a bit weird.” WHAT THE HELL? THIS IS HEINOUS, and it DOESN’T MATTER WHERE YOU STAND ON CIRCUMCISION! Outright, blatant Nazi propaganda OUGHT to shock and disturb ANYONE seeing it in the modern world being put out in earnestness!
No, NEVER AGAIN and we MEAN IT.
I am an Indian Hindu. All most all the time I support Israel and/or Jews. But I am against circumcision. Unlike the first cousin marriages there is no real scientific data suggests the recommendation of male circumcision. This is one of the old, ugly, painful practice must be banned.
That’s fine if it remains an opinion. When you start enacting real bans against traditions that have remained intact for 5000 years in a religion that has been persecuted throughout history you lose credibility.
youre wrong, Anniee. wikipedia search ‘history of male circumcision’ and youll see the truth. obviously you are making uninformed comments.
do your own research. no one is going to spell it out for you. if you want to express emotions then use emotions in your writing. dont make false statements to express your emotions.
Oh FFS – are you KIDDING me? Before you go off on the ignorance of people you’re speaking to, you might want to do a quick “find” on their other posts on the subject? Because then you’d see I am WELL aware of both sides of the circumcision issue; hell, I was very much involved with men’s rights activists and I couldn’t have avoided it if I’d wanted to. Jeez!
And what exactly was “wrong” about what I said there? The tradition IS 5000 years old in Jewish LAW, and I said they have no business banning Jewish law which far predates our own and is outside the scope of the government to regulate. That is a subjective statement outside the scope of “right/wrong” – there weren’t any objective facts in there except the perfectly correct one about the law being 5K years old. So what are you TALKING about?
did you know about this? “Colorado has become the 18th State to acknowledge that infant circumcision is unethical and a wasteful allocation of resources by terminating Medicaid funding for infant circumcision.” — guess its better for you to stay in your stupid box than to wake up and see the light.
RESEARCH, fool.
Thank you for that bizarre non-sequitur. Reading comprehension is your friend.
The caste system is old, ugly and painful to its victims. Circumcision’s got nothing on that, and I say this as a circumcised gentile.
Oh, SNAP! When he first posted I was thinking of the caste system but I’m glad I didn’t mention it because that was sweet!
Whether or not one agrees with circumcision is besides the point–this is pure hate-peddling. The purpose for Matt Hess (who co-created the comic strip) is to foment hate. It’s obvious. If he were arguing a point, that would be one thing–but he is promoting anti-semitism in its purest form, directly taken from what the Nazi’s used to promote their agenda before and during WWII.
It’s pure and simple.
That’s what I’ve been saying, Beth. I can’t believe people would see that and say “Hm. That’s a little weird” – what the hell??!? It IS Nazi propaganda recycled for modern use, complete with the master race to save us from the monster Jews…frankly anyone who doesn’t find horror in that is anti-Semitic.
youre 100 percent right, indian. there is no reason to cut parts off that need to be there.
america is obsessed with it. first, appendix. then, foreskin, then tonsils… what’s next that we are born with that everyone wants to cut off??
its absolutely ridiculous. circumcision is about MONEY and everyone here is getting mixed up defending their pride in their mutilated genitals saying that its ok to mutilate others b/c they were mutilated themselves.
how many facial creams use infant foreskins? how much do they charge to cut it off? how much money are the FDA and associated drug companies making off of erectile dysfunction drugs that are a direct result from circumcision? think about the pornography and the brutal sex people are having — its b/c their first sexual experience was this: they were strapped down, arms and legs. the nurse tickled their newborn penis’ until they were stimulated into an erection. the doctor comes in with little to no painmeds and brutally cuts off the forskin. ((or if you had a bris then the rabbi sucks your bloody gushing open penis wound with his mouth))
and then ya know what happens? your brain chemistry is changed for over six months. you are set into panic, attack mode, from the beginning for the rest of your life.
you were just born — and being a mother i know that birth is the most loving situation a human can experience — and your uninformed parents hang you over to be sexually assaulted, brutally mutilated so that you can start your life living in panic.
idiots.
wikipedia search ‘history of male circumcision’ and see how and why the jews drastically changed the procedure. if muslims can deal with the female circumcision laws in america, the jews can deal with the male circumcision laws in america.
This is not a peripheral issue for Jews. It is one thing that even the most secular will do. It would not be good to have your child grow up , learn about the religion and then have to decide to do this as a young adult.
Idiots here who want to see something banned because it is an old “ugly, painful practice”. Need to watch what they say.
Ugly- beauty is in the eye of the holder and I dont know too many women or men in this country who think that a circumcised penis is ugly. Jews in fact have something of a reputation as…well besides the point.
Painful – They use anesthesia now.
Old- Oh we ban things for being old now?
The child’s choice argument does not hold at all. Infants have no choices about anything. Parents chose everything. The only role of the state is to prevent clearly demonstrated harm to children otherwise they have no right at all. In this case the benefits far outweigh negligible risks, which are less in newborns than adults.
The medical benefits are well documented. In fact it may be a harmful choice not to have your child circumcised.
http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/resources/factsheets/circumcision.htm
Indian maybe you dont understand how things work here. We dont make things illegal because you have a penis preference.
It’s pretty debatable about the anesthetic (not general, just local) – some do, some don’t (reasoning that the shot hurts as much as the procedure). So far as I’ve ever known, mohels don’t. But that isn’t the issue, of course. As you point out, we don’t make things illegal because they’re old or because people have a penis preference. There are cases to be made on both sides of the circumcision issue, but there is no debate possible in favor of Nazi propoganda or anti-Semitism, none. Full stop.
There are videos of circumcisions performed by doctors with anesthesia and without that you can watch on the internet (even youtube) and the difference is night and day in the babies reaction…the anesthesia makes a tremendous difference. That being said the way that the majority of doctors perform the operation compared to a jewish mohel results in a far longer and more painful procedure.
When a mohel does a circumcision he removes the adhesions, uses a clamp like guide only to isolate the foreskin, the makes one cut.
When a doctors does it, they clear the adhesions, crush a line down the side of the foreskin with a tool that resembles needle nose pliers, they then cut along this line with surgical scissors. Then doctors usually fit a clamp(such as the mogen clamp) over the head of the penis and crush the foreskin for several minutes resulting in ALOT of pain, and then they cut along that crush line with a scalpel..
Although I do not recommend circumcision in any way, if your not using a mohel, get your child anesthetic and demand to see the procedure done yourself. Watch the video’s of the procedure online to know what your signing your child up for, and make sure their using a penile nerve block, not some inneffective topical crap that they mix in with the aneseptic solution pretending that it makes a difference to save money.
Oh, I agree, jj – I’ve already said several times that mohels are experts and they do it with a minimum of pain and far fewer complications than doctors – didn’t want to repeat myself again lol. But absolutely, if I were to do it all over and were still determined to do it, I’d absolutely demand anesthetic (I don’t think anyone used it then, though) and to see the procedure. Unless mohels do it for gentiles also; then I’d go that way. IF I were to do it at all, of course. You’re absolutely right that parents should *really* be informed and involved.
Yeah, leslie, that cartoon was so funny, I forgot to laugh!
/Okay, sarc. off.
Anniee451, like you, what I find truly shocking about this, is that so many “Intactivists” are not that bothered by it, and appear to be rather blase about the anti-semetism here. Oh yeah, it’s kinda gross, but chee, circumcision is, like, sooo icky. . .or else they do the, “But Jews do cut up babies!” bit. Ugh.
Yes, as I said, I honestly find it shocking, and few things shock me. Either people are a LOT more anti-Semitic than I thought or…holy crap, have people REALLY lost a sense of the horror of the Holocaust already? Since I was a little girl, learning things about those atrocities has always been part of my life, as has a love of Jews and Israel. Time hasn’t blunted it. But you hardly have to have some great love to recognize THAT for what it is, or to recognize THIS as the same thing. If it’s gone so far that people just shrug seeing the same exact propaganda that was used to justify genocide, if it’s gone so far that people are saying, “Yeah, but it IS true” then it’s gone way too much further than some Jewish jokes – it’s gone to red level dangerous, and time to load.
Yes, I am stunned and DISGUSTED with my fellow man. Thank God there are some like you who are still properly horrified at this.
You know, I have a close relative who is somewhat anti-Semitic (she knows it’s a flaw and she’s working on it) and her first reaction to this was “OH MY GOD! WHAT THE…” Well ok so I can’t repeat her actual words but she was astonished and disgusted and freaked. And that was just an immediate reaction. When even good people see it and shrug or start discussing the merits of the issue as though they didn’t SEE what they’re SEEING here is…dam, that’s sick. (And yes, I’ve discussed the merits of the issue, but not without pointing back time and again to – HOLY CRAP DO YOU SEE THAT?!? ARE YOU KIDDING ME?)
Female circumcision wase promoted by some in the medical community in this country but it is now generally reviled (and illegal). Let’s hope male circumcision follows the same course.
“The same reasons that apply for the circumcision of males are generally valid when considered for the female.”
Circumcision of the Female
General Practitioner, Vol. 18 No. 3, September 1958, pp. 98-99
“Circumcision [of girls] will relieve one of the greatest causes of masturbation.”
Why not circumcise the girl as well as the boy?
Texas State Journal of Medicine, Vol. 14, May 1918, pp. 17-19
exactly! finally someone sees it clearly. there are so many misinformed people on this site.
FGM = MGM = GENITAL MUTILATION.
YOU GET AIDS BY NOT WEARING CONDOMS, NOT BY NOT CUTTING OFF YOUR FORESKIN.
MEN CAN GET CIRCUMCISED AT 18 — EVERYONE HAS A RIGHT TO THEIR BODIES — YOU FREEDOM ENDS BEFORE THE TIP OF SOMEONE ELSES NOSE/FORESKIN. LEAVE BABIES TO MAKE THEIR OWN CHOICES.
Female “circumcision” is simply mutilation. It’s equivication to use the term along with male circumsion. They’re not the same. Secondly, there is a completely painless method of male circumsision involving a ring and a string. The skin dies and then falls off. My first born son had it done that way and he didn’t feel a thing and didn’t shed a tear. Why this isn’t the mandatory method, I don’t know.
The reason for the eighth day is as follows:
On the eighth day, the amount of prothrombin present actually is elevated above one-hundred percent of normal—and is the only day in the male’s life in which this will be the case under normal conditions. If surgery is to be performed, day eight is the perfect day to do it. Vitamin K and prothrombin levels are at their peak.
Shalom
And it’s just so lurvely that you’ve moved on from WWII, Leslie.
Millions of people, many of them Jews, did not.
Recycled anti-semetism is about as funny as funeral on Christmas Day. . .but, go ahead and laugh like a hyena, if that amuses you.
as soon as the UK came out with it that male circumcision was unnecessary and brutal the rate dropped to less than one percent.
go ahead, keep on keeping on… i dont mind if you stay exactly as you are… why try to help??
I am circumcised. I get it up and blast just fine. The procedure is not the equivalent of female excision. That is just a lie. Cutting off a clitoris is not cutting off a foreskin. One is a nerve center, the other is a little piece of skin. Think the procedure is cruel? Just ask Ron Jeremy or John Holmes. They did jut fine and dandy with the procedure.
This is just another example of people with no jobs and apparently too much time on their hands messing around with stuff that is not their business, in plain English. I mean, if I had my way, I’d like to see a lot of stuff made illegal, like naming a perfectly nice kid Lincoln or Sheridan. I mean enough kid named after limousines or main battle tanks, but I leave that alone. I have a job, a family and a life.
The equation they use, between circumcision and excision is like equating being against affirmative action with being pro slavery, like I saw Chuck Rangel do yesterday on TV. Hey I actually have stuff to do which is productive. So I need to go, but I’ll finish by saying, San Fran I hear is beautiful. Luckily, I know some place just as nice where the holes have not taken over yet. Hopefully, they never will and I urge other reader not to share anything publicly about the good place to live. If you find them, just enjoy them, and sit on the rock at night, looking up at the stars, gun in your belt, drink in your hand, your girl at your side and think, thank God I am not in California.
Yes, please, Leslie, don’t try to “improve” me.
I really don’t want to be at all like you—thanks, but no thanks.
Anniee451, there are times I think we’re right back in the 1930′s again. And it has reached the dangerous level.
I think some are so enthraled by their crusade to save the precious foreskin, and yatter about the merits of the case, they’re deliberately blinding themselves to what’s right in front of them. For others, this is less about foreskins, or having a right to one’s body or the “children” or any of the other buzzwords they throw out, than it is an opportunity to strike out at the hated Jews, and try, yet again, to destroy Jewish culture.
These aren’t blind at all. They know very well what they’re doing.
(NOTE: It didn’t work for Antiochus Epiphanes, or the Romans, guys; it will not work for you, either.)
But God bless you, and keep you always, Anniee; you see the truth.
do your research. stop being uneducated. save yourself.
Oh HONESTLY, SHUT UP. You’re what happens to people when their first memory is their mother holding them underwater.
Were you used as a basketball when you were a child?
Thank you very much, TK – that means a lot to me
All ANYBODY has to do for circumcision to be WHOLLY irrelevant to them is to NOT circumcise his child.
This imposition of the nanny-state by high-minded moralizers is precisely what this country was founded to escape.
How about we don’t cut anything of anyone?
I don’t really notice a resemblance at the end, other than it’s a frequent pose used in comic books and the artist has probably read a few. :-/
Sokpuppette: “The answer on abortion is pretty damned simple: a lump of cells is not a child. Get over it. You’ve picked a silly point at which to assign personhood. That’s based on facts about what people are and what makes them that way. The opinions of ignorant tribal shamans 2500 years ago are irrelevant. If there’s an abortion, NO PERSON EVER EXISTED AND NO PERSON EVER COMES INTO BEING.”
Which lump of cells do you mean? Perhaps you speak of the “lump of cells” known as a brain, crushed during PBA and extracted through a pair of scissors jabbed into a fully-formed infant’s skull. Or maybe you refer to the “lump of cells” removed during a D & E procedure at 7 and 8 months gestation? I must admit you are half right; the arms, legs and head that are crushed by forceps do come out in lumps. Fully formed and healthy, too. Oh, and the baby is never anesthetized and feels every inch the agony of the “procedure.”
Abortions are performed on healthy babies AND healthy mothers up to the moment of birth in numerous “clinics” throughout the U.S. (Tiller’s was infamous, but only one of many mills specializing in legal and dangerous late term abortions). Those unborn babies have fully-developed nervous systems and feel all the pain of the abortion – fetal pain is a proven and documented FACT. Thour argument is therefore not only stupid, its logic falls flat. If a law were passed making circumcision illegal, a woman could still have a bris. Just do it 8 days earlier while the baby is in the womb. You’ll not only remove the foreskin, you’ll kill the baby and remove a lot of other “healthy tissue,” too. And it will be perfectly legal. Planned Parenthood will be thrilled.
The trouble with people like you Sokpuppette is that you either know nothing about what goes on in the abortion industry, which makes you ignorant, or you know everything about what goes on in the abortion industry, which makes you evil. Take your pick.
It’s very obvious what is behind the origins of this bill. Anti-G-d, anti-religious, anti-Jewish hatred and bigotry. Studious who posted earlier, is right. And the comic book is nothing to laugh about; Mathews Hess is spouting Nazi anti-Semitic propaganda against Jews that is reminiscent of Julious Streicher. Probably the grandson of Rudolf.
It is interesting that the “anti-circ” crowd brings up circumcision as not being medically necessary. That is debatable, however it is not the point. As a Jewish woman, my belief is that observant Jews should be left alone and allowed to practice their rituals and faith in peace. Circumcision is precisely that: a religious ritual not a medical one. If you don’t like circumcision, no one is forcing you to make that choice for your children. We don’t dictate your faith; you stay out of ours.
VERY well said, Allemande.
Question, please: Is there a difference between a traditional Jewish circumcision done on the 8th day by a mohel and a hospital-style circ done by a physician? I ask because I have seen video of hospital circs, and they are horrifying. (FYI: I’m mother of adult son; I chose not to have him circumcised; I’m neither Jewish nor Muslim. I’m not anti-semite, and I’m appalled at the comic book graphics and see them absolutely as spewing hate towards Jews.)
I’ve heard from certified nurse midwives (CNMs) that — IF parents opt for circ — they recomment circ by a traditional mohel on the 8th day. I’ve heard CNMs say that, medically, the 8th day is the best day because of the body’s ability to stop bleeding and because traditional mohels don’t do radical circumcision. What I understood that to mean is that a traditional mohel will simply ‘clip’ the foreskin so as to get a small bleed, but that physicians in hospitals do a complete circular ‘trim’ around the penis.
Is there a difference? Is there anyone here who honestly knows?
Yes! Excellent post!
Wait–THAT’S the ‘Monster Mohel’? I’d commented here and there on this–usually making generalised statements about circumcision being treated like any other elective surgery–i.e. left until the patient can consent. I didn’t really comment on the comic because I didn’t get a good look at it.
But now–are you all crazy? The Monster Mohel looks nothing like Nazi propaganda cartoons. Hell, it wouldn’t take all that much reworking to use the exact same face for Loki(the Marvel version)–lose the beard, throw on the costume….pretty simple. Other than the clumsily added Jewish bits the character is a fairly standard villain type. Even his henchmen look like they’re cut-out mafia characters with jewish stuff stuck on.
The side-by-side shot really illustrates this–
Poster-
long, fleshy nose, hooked at the end, appears to hang over top lip
Card-
thin, straight nose, does not touch top lip
Poster–
Fleshy, sneering lips
Card–
thin, wide lips stretched over an insane grin
Poster–
Curly hair, beard
Card–
Straight hair, beard
And the Monster mohel appears to lack ears!
Oh, there may be–even probably are–anti-semetic feelings here–but the art isn’t delving into Nazi propaganda to show it.
Many peoples tried to prevent circumcision to Jews and those peoples were wiped out of the earth.
Pay attention to your act,you try to alter The Covenant between Abraham’s seed and The Almighty !
This Comic is definitely Anti-semetic & offensive. That is probably the intent, to offend.
That said, where is the evidence that this is the “the campaign brochure for San Francisco’s anti-circumcision ballot measure” or that itrepresents the average “intactivist” viewpoint? i can’t find any validation of eother claim.
Anybody can publish anything. That does not mean it’s official.
Everything is official when it’s written by the author of the bill.
Azathoth, you’re joking, yes?
The similarity to Nazi stereotypes is pretty obvious.
http://neoneocon.com/2011/06/04/anti-semitic-drawings-and-the-san-francisco-anti-circumcision-campaign/
Anti-semetic images from the Nazis; they do look awfully familiar. .
Also, take a look at the Nazi pics Zombie provides, at the beginning of the thread.
I know you’re desperately trying to prove it’s not so by nitpicking the details! “See? This one doesn’t have ears! This one’s hair isn’t curly!” But—so what?
We have eyes. We can see.
(Um, not to mention Aryan Muscle boy hero, who looks like an ad for “Join the Hitler Jugend, today!”
I continue to be shocked, and I really don’t like it. First the “Well, that’s weird, but circumcision IS mean” then “Well Jews DO cut babies up” and now “Oh there’s no similarity”???!?!?!?! WHAT?
That isn’t blindness that’s wilfully plucking out one’s own eyes. No, there’s NOTHING ANTI-SEMITIC about an evil, hook-nosed mohel who EATS foreskins after chopping them from innocent babies with an evil laugh. Nope, nothing anti-Semitic here, move along.
FOOLS!
I know, Anniee451, I know.
Hear no Anti-semetism, see no Anti-semetism (but speak lots of anti-semetism!) even when the evidence is right in front of you. Oh, but circumcision is just not nice, and how can you approve of cutting up poor little babies, who can’t consent to the surgery, and pay no attention to attention to those drawings of evil, hook-nosed mohels, hiding behind the curtain.
What’s next? St. Hugh of Lincoln, done as a Disney style musical cartoon?
Nothing should shock me anymore.
but it does.
Geez.
Anti-semitism is a reflexive stance of many leftists, so to note that the base behind this is anti-semetic is like noting that the sky is blue.
I was referring to the art.
Based on the pictures shown–the Nazi movie poster and the panels/card from the comic, the art of the comic does not resemble the art used in Nazi propaganda and further than the fact that the ‘Monster Mohel’ is Jewish. All the characteristics that were included in Nazi propaganda to indicate Jewish inferiority are absent. The classic stereotypical anti-Jew cartoon characteristics are absent. The artist may have WANTED to do such things, but he lacked the skill. So you get generic comic art with tacked on identifiers.
The hero mght be aryan, but he’s also a gay sexual stereotype. Buff blonds are common Tom of Finland types–but again, the artist is lacking…..so you get cheap standard comic art.
I had thought my comments made it clear that I was speaking only to the art.
On the other topic…
I am against infant/minor circumcision. And I take exception to the stone age practices of Muslims, Jews and any other faiths that demand mutilation of our children to show fealty to God. We routinely decry the medieval practices of Islam, and rightly so, so why can we not decry the medieval practices of Judaism? Because they’re our friends?
It is a shame that this can easily be used as an excuse for anti-semitism–or as a platform for it. But we should not let the actions of anti-semites stop us from saying that we think something is wrong if we think that.
I think widespread circumcision of boys–and girls is the result of various types of religious folk managing to institutionalise their belief that the pleasures of the flesh should be made a mite less pleasureable. But I accept the practice–so long as the patient is the one requesting it.
This will cause problems for Jews. So? We forced Mormons to alter their faith when it came into conflict with our laws. The reason that there are still FLDS families is because that family style is/was an important step on the path to heaven for Mormons. We’ve stopped all kinds of religious practices–not a few of them for their ‘medieval’ nature.
Is Yahweh such an impotent god that He cannot accept the sacrifice of the foreskin given willingly? Must it be done at the behest of the parents TO their child?
This cannot be spoken about without offending Jews. But it can be spoken about without irrational hatred of them.
“This will cause problems for Jews? So?”
but this isn’t irrantional hatred of Jews, oh, no indeedy, not at all, nup, nup, nup!
We lurves the Jews!
At least we will, soon as they stop being Jews, and worshipping that awful Yahweh!
But this isn’t anti-semetism, nup, nup, nup!
And I’m Marie of Roumania!
/Sarc.
Oh, and look at the art! It’s not Nazi-style art! it’s just generic comic art! It was gonna be anti-semetic, but the artist lacked skill, so it’s not really anti-semetic, no sireeee bob!
Nup, nup, nup!
/Sarc. Again. In this crazy age, lunacy is becoming truth.
lol – I know, the art itself isn’t anti-Semitic because…um, because the artist couldn’t copy the Nazi pictures very well. Well, except for the giant hook nose (which was certainly a feature the Nazis despised and found inferior). And also, except for the fact that he’s a MONSTER and totally evil. I mean, just look at the pictures, and don’t take note of what’s being said – mohels eating babies’ flesh, nothing anti-Semitic in that. Guess we’re supposed to be Good Germans.
You know, even the politically active leftists I showed the comic to were pretty horrified. Which says something good, I would think. Such in-your-face hatred is hard to deny.
The simple truth is this: this comic, and the associated bill, are anti-Semitic. The comic for obvious, well visible reasons. The bill, because it seeks to destroy a central tenet of Orthodox Judaism. Just as Hitler did when he outlawed the kosher butchering of animals. No one is as blind as those unwilling to see what it right in front of them.
Never Again.
Shalom
this is repugnant and shouldn’t be given the attention.
Azathoth you wrote:
“I think widespread circumcision of boys–and girls is the result of various types of religious folk managing to institutionalise their belief that the pleasures of the flesh should be made a mite less pleasureable. But I accept the practice–so long as the patient is the one requesting it.
This will cause problems for Jews. So? We forced Mormons to alter their faith when it came into conflict with our laws. The reason that there are still FLDS families is because that family style is/was an important step on the path to heaven for Mormons. We’ve stopped all kinds of religious practices–not a few of them for their ‘medieval’ nature.”
Why don’t you come out of the closet and admit that you are a vile and evil loathsome nazi-sympathizer who despises Jews? The fact is, nobody is interested in forcing you to circumcize your child, but why are you so hellbent (pardon the pun) on denying that religious right to Orthodox Jews and other Jews who make that choice? Think about that for a heil…I mean, for awhile.
For the record, because I am Jewish I have had the opportunity to discuss the issue of reduced sexual pleasure with a number of my Jewish male friends. It is a non-issue.
By the way, I have always totally opposed routine mandated circumcision for any gentile or Christian who does not want the procedure performed on their children. I have always believed it is wrong for hospitals to perform circumcision on children that are not of the Jewish faith.
I stand by that. I respect all religions and their dogmas and do not impose my beliefs on anyone. Don’t impose your beliefs on mine, please.
Azahoth, you are an anti-semite and so is Matthew (Rudolf) Hess who wrote the comic book with those horrific illustrations and who supports this anti-Constitutional bill. Oh, by the way, it will NOT stand up to Constitutional scrutiny because it violates the First Amendment guaranteeing freedom of religion. You nazis are SOL on this one!!!
Nice artwork.
Oh please, get your anti-Semitism straight. Others have already explained that the artist sucked, since he couldn’t get the Nazi propaganda right; he lacked the artistic skill. lol
Dont feed the trolls.
What ghey bastard came up with this shit?
Whatever or however this item got on the San Francisco ballot it violates the 1st amendment and basic health science.
During Vietnam I had the job of examining skinned back penises with the hospital corpmen. It is quite easy to understand why circumcised penises lead to healthier babies and adults. While smegma in the uncircumcised is normal; when not cleaned it is a host for a lot of std’s. It is frequently not cleaned. Sadly anti-Semites and other control freaks who try to dictate how others run their lives are probably the same types who got marked with “DD” during Vietnam. (that’s “dirty dick)
So I read through the 3 issues of the comic that is up. The anti-Jew sentiment really isn’t a surprise for anyone that’s been around the Intactivist lobby long enough. I know, everyone is SO surprised that they’re there, at least if they want to look legitimate. However, when you talk about studies done on the benefits of circumcision Intactivists will claim that every doctor, medical group, and study done that supports circumcision is done by a Jew, and therefore completely ignorable because Jews obviously twist the truth to suit their own end, which is somehow the circumcision of every baby boy (and yes, there are plenty of theories out there that it was Jews who introduced circumcision to America for that.) No matter what people want to claim, there are benefits. The argument in legitimate medical circles isn’t whether they are there but whether they outweigh the risks.
I also want to say that the artist obviously really doesn’t care. He’s never been around babies (the artwork confirms that. That’s a 2 day old? That’s a 7 day old? Really? Gah, deformed weird huge kids… and the young ‘children’ aren’t any better…) This comic book makes no arguments against circumcision, no intelligent recourse or discussion about it, it really should only be seen as a window into an extreme Intactivist’s sick view of the world (and it IS sick to advocate kidnapping and giving a baby to strangers over circumcision. It’s also sick to suggest a doctor would tie up a mother and perform a circumcision in a state of rage covered with blood. Not to mention sick to call for the death of Mohels.)
It’s about in the same league as Peta comic books. Something to shake your head at and keep away from the kiddies. Let them pat themselves on the back for being enlightened idiots.
Shouldn’t Vulva girl be a WOMAN?
I really miss my foreskin. I’m deprived the government should pay restitution to me and all other victims.
San Francisco liberals should jump off the bridge.
The comic parody, Smegna Man Gets Circumcised, (published at Smegmaman.com) is a lot funnier; has a great plot; and passes along sound information about the medical and cosmetic benefits of the procedure– and, in the end, the villains meet a very appropriate end.
Ed Margolis
It is really unfortunate that in commenting on a post of anti-semitism, many of the comments spill muslim hatred and islamophobia. Someone saying muslims are allowed to steal from non-muslim, wasn’t the exact same thing said about the Jews? Someone else saying “there is no such thing as a happy marriage in Islam”.
By the way FGT among Muslims has nothing to do with Islam, it is a cultural thing which some muslims carried on doing, it is a practice which was being done long before Islam, mostly in Africa, and among all religions, for example in Egypt Christians as well as Muslims undergo FGM. On the other hand in the middle east countries such as Saudi Arabia or Jordan it is virtually non-existant. Can’t we all just just discuss hate and antisemitism without demonizing another group?