There is the quaint notion that practicality or sheer necessity will eventually wake a dreamy ideologue and bring him to his senses. That theory took a hit when Berkeley’s Peace and Justice Commission adamantly refused to let 3M service their public library checkout counters until the company signed on to its “nuclear free disclosure form”. Mark Steyn writes:
“Berkeley’s public library will face a showdown with the city’s Peace and Justice Commission tonight over whether a service contract for the book check-out system violates the city’s nuclear-free ordinance.” How’s that for an opening? In the entire history of civilization, has any human society so ordered its affairs that it would seem entirely normal to combine those words in that order in a single sentence?
The answer of course, is yes. It is entirely normal to read sentences like that when the lunatics are in charge of the asylum. But don’t laugh. The success with which institutions like the “Peace and Justice Commission” have met underscores the unpleasant fact that irrational demands are more often granted than rational requests. Sheer pressure gets results. Reason has nothing to do with it. The real rules are apparently that whoever screams the loudest and makes himself the biggest nuisance gets his way. Today your library checkout. Tomorrow the world.
A little slice of heaven, Berzerkeley. Now if they’d just pass a requirement that hippies bathe. Ah well.
So long as one caters to the wishes of the screamers, children are taught to scream. So long as one caters to the wishes of bullies, children are taught to bully. So long as one caters to the wishes of terrorists, children are taught to terrorize. When children are rewarded for a behavior, they repeat it.
So, if our political system rewards people who act unreasonably, reasonable people learn to act unreasonably because unreasonable behavior becomes the only effective means to gain reasonable results.
There are many oppressed people who have waited their turn, but it’s been the screamers’ turn, then the screamers’ turn, then the screamers’ turn and then the screamers’ turn. It’s always the turn of somebody else for justice, for everybody except those who truly need it. So here’s the question. Where is the breaking point for those who had hitherto asked nicely and yet are getting ignored?
Oh well.
Short note.
“FAIRFAX, Va. – Some changes are coming for Fairfax County (web | news) public school students that could make getting straight-As a much easier task.
Thursday night, the Fairfax County School Board voted unanimously to abandon the traditional grading system and go to the more common ten-point system.
“A student in Fairfax County may earn a 90 to a 93, and in Montgomery County (web | news) that would be an A. Other schools it might be an A-. In Fairfax County, that’s a B+,” said Megan McLaughlin, President and Co-founder of FAIRGRADE.
Mclaughlin is the mother of three and a former undergraduate admissions officer at Georgetown University. She led the charge to move the county to a 10-point grading system, one that includes pluses and minuses.
“If it was 90 to 100 to get an A, I know my grades definitely would go up. It definitely would affect me because right now, I have an 83.99 in history,” said Kylie Stewart, a student.”
“Parents have pressured the school board for the last year to change the grading system, arguing that the new system will make it easier for students to get into college and obtain scholarships.”
http://www.news8.net/news/stories/0109/588040.html
This is actually true. One of the funnier things is that the parents as a group attended the school board meetings all dressed in white to represent “white-out’ so to speak to white out the bad grade. The majority of these well meaning parents supported BHO. I wonder if there was any sense of irony if a white sheet was worn.
Anyhow the notion that the Berkeley City Council and practicality have anything in common is a joke.
“Sheer pressure gets results.”(W) Now that’s a truth I certainly respect.
Have a look at this.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/49b1654a-ed60-11dd-bd60-0000779fd2ac.html
There will come a time, very soon now, when corporations (and consequently, the citizens who run them) will have to closely examine their underlying principles, and decide not to let their need for business and turning a profit twist themselves into giving sanction to people who ultimately want to destroy them.
To paraphrase something I believe Lenin said,”The capitalists will sell us the rope we use to hang them.”
3M should just say “Thanks, but no thanks. We don’t do business that way.” And walk away. This is terribly hard, as some regional sales representative really wants the Berkely library account. It could mean his job if 3M doesn’t get it.
But as Alexis implied, someone has got to say “No!” to the screamers.
In most communities in my area, there is a “Human Rights Commission.” Not a Civil Rights Commission but a Human Rights Commission.
What are the human rights that such a commission upholds? Since it does not uphold civil rights, which are U.S. law, but human rights, it appeals to a higher law, such as the UN Charter of Human Rights. As a result, the Commission periodically pronounces upon various violations of human rights, whether the violations are in violation of civil rights or not. Homophobia, of course, in all of its insidious guises, is a violation of human rights.
#3 Blindman – I live in the People’s Republic of Fairfax, and with one kid in college and another in HS, I’ve been following the grading fight. The administration fought it all the way and it is being forced upon them by the elected school board. It has been going on for much longer than the past year – I heard complaints about it from my eldest since he was in 8th grade.
The argument is colleges don’t always adjust grades from Fairfax students to compensate for the slightly easier grading policies of the surrounding counties. The policy would have boosted my older kid’s grades in a few courses – one blown quiz can cost you the A for a quarter, it will be of lesser benefit for the younger one who gets mostly A’s already. The new policy will also increase the bonus awarded for AP classes to 1 full point to be consistent with Loudon and Montgomery counties (and compete with their 5.0 GPA kids), and give a 1/2 point bonus for non-AP honors classes.So basically, all the fight was to apply similar grading policies as the surrounding school systems, on the theory the differences are somehow keeping our deserving kids from getting into the top in-state and out of state schools. Given how much of Fairfax winds up already at UVA, Tech, William & Mary, etc., I have my doubts it was ever a real problem. Which is why I ignored the whole thing.
I don’t think it’s going to make any practical difference at most of the colleges our kids apply to attend. Colleges assemble a class, and they will still be selecting whatever mix of the top Fairfax kids they were before. They’ll just have higher GPAs. It will just marginally boost incoming GPAs for their USNews rankings. The parents will feel better, the kids will, too, a few kids who were right on the B+/A boundary will see a real benefit, admission officers will continue to do what they do, and parents will b*tch about why their junior genius didn’t get into an Ivy (vastly overrated for the cost) or had to “settle” for JMU or Mary Washington (both fine schools) vs. UVA.
#7 Do not spindle
I have nothing but respect for the Fairfax School system. It is excellent and a model for others.
The families and the students are superb. Its the idea that the students could set up the grading system that fit with “irrational demands are more often granted than rational requests. Sheer pressure gets results. Reason has nothing to do with it. The real rules are apparently that whoever screams the loudest and makes himself the biggest nuisance gets his way”(W).
Just a mundane story that supports the thread’s observation. Granted Berkeley is much more of a circus.
“Peace and Justice Commission” sounds so much better than “Agitation and Discrimination Commissariat”.
I’d think those folks in Berkeley would finally just get tired of it all.
One good thing– it distracts them from hassling the Marine recruiting station in Berkeley.
Ironic that this Steyn missive appears in The Corner. Also appearing there is brilliant writer / observer #2, Victor Davis Hanson. (#3 is Theodore Dalrymple).
Alexis up there mentions “the screamers”. Hanson puts it thusly:
If anyone wished to know what the baby-boomer generation would do when, in its full maturity, it hit its first self-created, big-time recession, I think we are seeing the hysterical (“screaming”) results. After two decades of unprecedented economic growth, rampant consumer spending, and unimaginable borrowing to satisfy our insatiable appetites, we are suddenly going into even larger debt and printing trillions of dollars in paper money to ensure that someone else after we are gone pays the debt. As if the permanent solution to a financial panic and years of spending wealth we didn’t create were a government take-over of the economy in the manner we currently witness in Spain, Italy, and Greece—or the high-tax, high-spend ethos of a bankrupt California.
The reaction to the economic panic was sort of analogous to the call to ‘charge it!’ after 9/11, or to the Iraq 2006 upsurge in violence, when suddenly our leaders declared the war lost, blamed the nebulous “they” for tricking them into voting for the war, and calling for immediate withdrawals and retreats. Ditto the Stalag-Gulag Guantanamo that, by January 19, had ruined the Constitution, shredded the Bill of Rights, and forever tarnished our reputation. Yet, on the 20th, it was suddenly complex and problematic, and required a “task force” to do a year-long inquiry into the bad and worse choices confronting us. At some point in all this serial hysteria, we are beginning to see the problem is not in the stars of the economy or of the war, but in ourselves—a weird generation that, when it finally came of age, proved to be just about what we could expect of it from what we saw in its youth.
For reasons that are complex the Boomer generation was brought up to worship the idea that to be American was to be provincial and to be first European and then foreign was to be sophisticated. This was done at the same time that dead Europeans and European Civilization were being excoriated as the roots of all evil. The Left are not hobbled by consistency. Nothing was seen as more progressive then the anti-nuclear efforts of the Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament. In fact the CND was run right out of the Lubyanka just as the fevered ravings of troglodytes such as Joe McCarthy would have claimed.
Thirty years ago the New Zealand government fearlessly broke the ANZAC treaty and threw the US Navy out because we refused to indulge them with the scrap of paper that they apparently offloaded to the Berkeley Council. New Zealand pioneered driving the point of European sophistication home by being a South Seas Grand Fenwick where the denizens of Christchurch can be more English than the English. If the Americans had treated them like adults instead of indulging them then it would be easier to deal with the same boorish behavior at home. Creative lawyers should be able to think of a series of charges that could be brought against the Berkeley government, from the Logan Act to Secondary boycotts and denial of due process.
To be clear, we refused to indulge the demand to certify we are nuclear free and did indulge by meekly accepting the expulsion without retaliation. For decades the Japanese have routinely read a statement that they insist on Japan being free of nuclear weapons and we have blandly replied that it is our policy to neither confirm nor deny the presence of nuclear weapons. That allows both sides to go on with honor satisfied. That is exactly what New Zealand rejected.
What would such a declaration actually mean? To take a narrow interpretration: “3M hereby declare that the book checkout system serviced by us is free of radioactive materials and that no such materials are used during such servicing.”
Of course, it might be in order to do one’s best to make the members of the commission as free of radioactivity as possible. However, given that the main source of radioactivity in the human body is potassium-40, this policy might have some slight side effects…
Chris @1 wrote: “A little slice of heaven, Berzerkeley. Now if they’d just pass a requirement that hippies bathe. Ah well.”
According the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, the word “berserk” is a backformation of “berserker”, defined as “One of a band of ancient Norse warriors legendary for their savagery and reckless frenzy in battle.” The Indo-European root from which “berserker” descends is given as the “Old Norse berserkr”, the feminine of björn, bear + serkr, shirt.
Now the “bear” is interesting because that is the UC Berkeley mascot- the Golden Bears to be precise.
Hum-m-m, people buy emotionally and then apply logic to appease themselves. Just because Berkley bought it, should the Fairfax County school system buy into it too? Hum-m-m-m. Or perhaps Fairfax should create a second set of grades, one for the parents and students and one for the colleges. Just like truck drivers do, or Enron did. Or they could simply add a grade above the ‘A’ for those who do all the extra credit and get mainly perfect scores on the tests, say ‘A magnumb’ or ‘A robustus’ sorta like saying their is an A+ something greater than just A.
or the parents could take pride in knowing that due to higher standards their children will no doubt have the ability to actually do and learn and really maybe impress someone with good performance, despite that “b minus or b plus” in lit arts and social sciences.
Oh yeah, I would check out your books from a different library. Or you just stand and turn your backs to the library board during board meetings, I you have the time or interest.
Andrew, very nicely put. Charge it.
If we didn’t have Berkeley against what could we measure our sanity?
Berkeley also provides us with inspiration for the “good old days” when the screwballs were contained to a few square miles in Northern California and not Washington, D.C., when terrorists only bombed unoccupied Bank of America storefronts at 3 AM, and when sex and drugs were forbidden fruit and not part of the curriculum of public education.
Maybe the fact that we can still laugh at Berkeley indicates that the Culture is not as far gone as it often seems to be.
I wonder what they do about that nuclear fusion ball that rises each day?
Well…
3M could fill out a form declaring that every atom in every molecule in every piece of paper, every binder, every box, and every computing device provided contains exactly one nucleus.
They could also append a statement that the amount of radioactive nuclei provided would be, at worst, the amount naturally present in their source materials and equivalent to the amount freely available in the soils surrounding Berkeley.
Anyone ever wonder why such people don’t require Iran and North Korea and the like to certify that they are nuclear free?
Anyone ever wonder why such people never accuse the Black Panthers of being racist?
Anyone ever wonder why such people recommend imposing withdrawal deadlines on the enemy instead of us?
Obviously, it is not because they are afraid of looking silly.
RWE ponders:
Anyone ever wonder why….
programmer responds:
Fear, RWE, plain, unadulterated fear of the beast.
Put on your headphones, turn the volume up and see why they fear (starts kind of slow)
The Beast
I lost my last line on the previous post. It is:
The Left tries to keep the leash tight.
o/t sorry; O is as we speak signing the Lily Ledbetter Fair Pay Act. He’s doing it “…to keep food on the table”. Wonder how much food won’t get on the table via jobs that this act will cause to never be ?
Buddy,
The Lily Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, and others like it, are prime movers in outsourcing jobs over seas, IMHO. I can believe that laws like this are part of some deeper game.
Of course, I am a conspiracy theorist any way, and if I don’t hear of a new conspiracy on the web every day, I try to start one,….
“There is the quaint notion that practicality or sheer necessity will eventually wake a dreamy ideologue and bring him to his senses.”
Is this the same quaint notion so many seem to be counting on as the eventual solution to the takeover of the country by Obama and the Left? If we just email our representatives, if we just write letters to the papers, if we just join groups of like-minded people, if we just speak politely to argue our point of view, if …
But never screaming. “Not with a bang but a whimper.”
Buddy: do you know the vote tally?
Programmer:
Of course they are a part of a deeper game. It is call Marxist-Leninism.
It will not be stopped until the public decide it wants to stop it, assuming that this day comes before it is too late. On a more cynical note, if that is possible, it would be nice to know the holdings of lawmakers in outsourcing and offshoring companies.
I think it is a inevitable now that anything that can be moved off shore will be. The brunt of this is of course borne by the middle class worker and small business operator. It actually plays into the hand of larger firms.
I imagine that quite a bit of financial employment that was previously here will move off shore. Sorry about that, buddy.
I think for the better healed whites now the boom business will be NGO’s, non profits and consulting in government. None of this produces wealth at all, it just drives away decent, honorable work and the productive folks. The elites could care less as long as they have their bucks. It has become fashionable here on the east coast to not work in a for profit industry. Come the revolution, this swamp needs to be dried up.
The poor and the rich against the middle classes.
Of course it is intentional. If it is not then our “leaders” are as dumb as bicycles. Either way their is not consolation to be had.
The whole parasitic system has to be done away with, and the assault on all that is good has to be turned back. It is an almost open war now.
well heeled (well that too)
In my capacity as the chief of a very large department of psychiatry in northern California (and I’m only a stone’s throw from Berkeley) I spent most of yesterday in a meeting in Oakland, where we tried to figure out how to address the problem caused by a small number of parents who have been agitating (understandably enough) on behalf of their children, who suffer from a serious disorder, which does in fact need treatment. The problem is, only a small portion of the required treatment falls under the purview of medicine; the largest contribution comes from the education (of a very special kind) that the child requires. But since our California educational system is on the verge (if not actually over the edge already) of bankruptcy, the agitating parents, accompanied by a state regulatory agency and a huge phalanx of lawyers, is demanding that the medical care system take over this educational function. To do so would approximately double our budget (add about $300 X 10^6) and would be tantamount to saying that the needs (again, very real needs) of this tiny fraction of the population “count” as much as the needs of all other diagnoses (about 99.99%) of the population.
Jamie Irons
ledbetter is like minimum wage, which union contracts peg to, and so get auto wage gains against private employers whenever gov’t ups the MW. The last raise cost a few dozen jobs for teenagers just in the one small biz and it’s local suppliers that i happen to know of via a kid part of the mgmnt plenary sessions where the decisions were made.
i have a feeling that the Dems are not averse to a complete discrediting of the capitalist model –ledbetter is a stealth ploy in that direction –the audience is so soap-opera’d it can’t derive three step sequences, so Ledbetter and MW are at the same time the deep ploys, and photo op freebie cred builders. neat, pretty neat. where’s the press? oh thats right –gone.
So now, if we can get on a docket somewhere, if we are the favored identity group, we can sue the boss for fair pay, and also payment of the gap between fair pay and actual pay all the way back to the start of the employment? well, if an activist judiciary throws in with this, capitalism will have a stroke, and the stroke will prove it is an unhealthy system, and needs you-know-what to replace it. THAT’s the idea –not more beans for Lily. Hell, screw Lily –if helping her was the object, you’d encourage economic growth that could also employ her loved ones and give them a future with the security of accumulating assets.
Mongoose @ #28,
In the animal body, when blood flow is diverted to dead-end diverticules, and the blood vessels swell and distend to accommodate the pressurized volume, it is called a Hemorrhoid.
The best way to get rid of a hemorrhoid is to let it swell, and allow the diverted blood to coagulate (it always does), and then encircle the base of it with a tight, constrictive rubber band.
The thing’ll dry-up and fall off, usually within a week.
I think this treatment, if we can translate its design into an effective socio-political constrictor, will work just as well against our nation’s raft of socio-political hemorrhoids as it does on the animal body.
The GOP’ll need its own set of circulatory specialists on staff to make this work. But, hopefully, unlike the surgeons on the Left (like Dodd, Franks, et all) the GOP’s practitioners will hold themselves more stringently to the trustworthy MD’s hippocratic oath…:
“First, do no harm to the Republic.”
From MSNBC: Obama today will sign his first bill into law — the Lilly Ledbetter bill, which eliminates the statute of limitations when women and others can sue for workplace discrimination. After that, Obama will stop by a reception (which is closed to the press) where Ledbetter and Michelle Obama will speak.
“Which is closed to the press”!! Transparency, indeed. I wonder what Madame Michelle will say in her speech? Wouldn’t you just love to be there?
Headlines.
MSN.com: “Stimulus gets big, fat O from GOP.”
Yahoo.com: “GOP defying Obama overtures of bipartisanship.” (ha ha ha!)
NYTimes: “House passes stimulus plan with no GOP votes.”
Ok, I got the template now. This is going to be spun just like the “government shut down” during the Clinton years. What was, to me, a rare moment of Republican party integrity and standing on principle was spun as “those hateful Republicans causing trouble for our noble leader.” Same deal here. This will hurt the Republicans, a lot.
Get this:
In addition to December’s NBC/WSJ poll, which showed that only 27% of the country viewed the GOP favorably (versus 49% who said that about the Dem Party), a new Gallup analysis of the 350,000 interviews it conducted in 2008 finds the Democratic Party leading in every state in the nation except in Alabama, Kansas, Nebraska, Alaska, Idaho, Wyoming, and Utah. (That’s right, even in some states McCain carried like Texas and Georgia, voters identify more with the Dem Party than the GOP.)
The GOP may shore up it’s informed, intelligent base with this stand, but the great unwashed middle will react negatively to it, wondering why those damn Republicans can’t let this good, honorable, oh-so-smart (and sexy!) man get us out of the mess George Bush left us with.
peterike –sadly true usually,but maybe different on this bill –see rasmussen poll yesterday –iirc 24% pro-bill, and i do recall, 54% anti.
OT, but since Buddy is around, Here’s The Answer To The Tree Problem On The Ranch
Peterike, I do have fears you are onto something, but there do come times, when you are truly right, that it is proper to go down in flames rather than pretend you are not just to earn the favor of 30 year old kindergartners.
As buddy points out, there may be some slippage in your all-too-cogent political framework. An unrelated but related fact: Drudge today links to the founder of the Weather Channel saying that we are entering a major “colding period”, something backed up by what we all have seen with our own eyes for the past two years.
http://www.kusi.com/weather/colemanscorner/38574742.html
The fact is, the Warmers can change “warming” to “climate change” all they want, it is “WARMING” that they have spedifically and clearly agitated against for over a decade now, and were VERY clear in “knowing” what caused this WARMING.
At some point, millions of people are going to start realizing how much they have been listening to and believing people who don’t know what the hell they are talking about. This can apply to much beyond climate (such as economics). And remember that 46% of the US voted for McCain in a time when the GOP had almost zero energy or overall driving force, unlike their opponents.
Keep in mind that, unlike every other Western socialist state, this time there is no “bigger brother” out there as a foundation. Socialism will either stand on it’s own, or not. And since leftism is so culturally entrenched, maybe it is time to start reading Saul Alinsky and his ilk, and following their apperently effective playbook.
I think the GOP could make huge strides with four simple words, repeated by EVERY CANDIDATE. “Scrap the Tax Code”.
Take that code out of the hands of the priesthood of lawyers and accountants, go with a ‘flat tax, sliding scale’, and the very lifeblood of the socialist regime is now in the hands of the people that are forced to pay for it, with great simplicity in adjusting downward (or upward) as is desired.
Do not think for a moment that power will succumb to this lightly. But we’ve got a 46% base to work with. As the Obamedia wilts under the collapse of global warming nonsense and inevitable socialist failure, that 45% can become 55%.
All that is needed is a simple message and some strong messengers.
Jamie Irons: All out of the same playbook, like declaring carbon dioxide a pollutant and polar bears an endangered species. Or opposing the installation of a new defense communications system by insisting that the required environmental impact study include the effects of nuclear war.
The really bad part is that there are inevitably some government bureaucrats willing to go along with them, in search of power and money.
RWE, how bad is this new bunch gonna hurt the miltary, from say “not at all” at [1] and “you need to be scared shitless” at [10] –?
mongoose @ 28 “do you know tally?” –here’s a nice visual, scroll a bit
Dr. Irons, as a psychiatrist, what advice would you give to a uh, friend of mine, who uh, is spending too much uh, time on the internet?
#40 buddy larsen
If I may intrude on the question, I submit a rating of 12; we will be fighting alongside them at home for survival.
Subotai Bahadur
subotai, care to venture a time frame, and any thoughts on the catalyst?
One good thing about Berkeley’s rule is that it might stop a Moslem terrorist who has a nuclear weapon.
Imagine that a terrorist has a bomb in his car trunk as he is traveling from Canada down to Los Angeles to explode a dirty bomb there. Imagine further that he stops in Berkeley to use a library computer to look at pornography for a while.
If the library won’t let the Moslem terrorist use the library computer to look at porn until he after he fills in and signs a form stating that he does not have nuclear weapons, then it might happen that the terrorist would get confused and throw away his bomb.
I’m just trying to think up some possibly good things to say about Berkeley’s policy. We all shouldn’t be reflexively negative.
True, true –he would have to dismantle his bomb –otherwise that signature could get him sued. In another venue, up state or down, of course –one with a low roentgen courthouse and lead-plated jury box.
#43 buddy larsen
The storm clouds are gathering, the exact moment that the storm will break or what will trigger the deluge are in the hands of the enemy. We can be sure that we are going to be attacked at home by the Islamists, because of, not despite, Hussein Pasha’s grovelling. While I do expect to lose an American city in the next couple of years; Mumbai and Beslan are also likely attack modalities. In that case, American civilians will be fighting alongside our military against the foreign enemy on our soil. For which the government will call us racists at best.
Furhter, depending on the moment that Hussein Pasha pushes us too far, I expect that at least some of the military in that case will remember their Oath.
On another thread, Cannoneer #4 gave us a link to HR 645 introduced January 22 by Democrat Alcee Hastings. It mandates the establishment of “National Emergency Centers” on military bases to house civilians. Part of the stated purpose is national disasters, but I note SECTION 2 (b)(4) which lists the purposes and uses of the Centers:
(4) to meet other appropriate needs, as determined by the Secretary of Homeland Security.
When things start going Tango Uniform, what do you want to bet that somewhere Hussein Pasha will find that one of the many forms of National Emergency on the books will need to be declared? Since 1950, either by statute or by Executive Order [by a Democrat president mind you] once the statute was repealed; the President has had the power to declare an Internal Security Emergency and imprison Americans without trial, charge, or appeal for the duration of the emergency.
I do not know what particular incident would trigger “the moment”. There will probably be a lot of them that could. One of them will, just as Concord and Lexington were preceeded by a number of other clashes with HM forces. It may be a restriction of political activity on or about 2010. It may be the Muslim attack(s). It may be the economic collapse barrelling towards us, boosted by the looting of the treasury. It may [and likely will] be something that we don’t expect at this moment. Any or all of the above can be the shove that pushes us past the point of no return.
We know that those who hold power now have no respect for Law or Constitution, and have no intention of yielding power, ever.
All we can see now are the clouds of the eyewall, churning in the distance; and flashes of distant lightning. And the wind is setting towards us.
“Without a sign his sword the brave man, draws, and asks no omen but his country’s cause.” Iliad 12.283
Subotai Bahadur
wrote a long post back atcha, subotai, but despite efforts, it generates ‘wordpress error –duplicate comment, you’ve alredy said that’.
I’ll try again later –but wanted to acknowledge your reply.
STILL won’t post –now just disappears –no error from word press –
jamie irons – any of those special needs children / parents not-American-citizens?