Gay Creeps, Black Thugs, and Horrible Women: The Left’s Idea of Tolerance
When homosexual bully Dan Savage unleashed a foul-mouthed tirade against the religious beliefs of a group of teenagers at the National High School Journalism Convention in Seattle last month, he exposed the lie behind the Left’s idea of tolerance. Savage used obscenities to describe passages in the Bible he disliked and displayed either ignorance or dishonesty in talking about the role of Christianity in advancing the cause of freedom. Then, with what would be creepy bad manners in any adult talking to young people, he called students “pansy-assed” for walking out on him. The so-called anti-bullying activist’s use of such sexually loaded language, and his frequent accusations that his opponents are secretly gay, bespeaks a deep level of self-hatred (why else would he think calling someone gay is an insult?); and the fact that he venomously attacks Christians and is never seen standing up in front of Muslims to curse out the Koran suggests that, like most bullies, he’s a coward as well.
And yet, as Ben Shapiro expertly illustrated at Breitbart.com, the Left’s mainstream media mouthpieces quickly went to work recasting Savage’s disgusting and childish performance as somehow justifiable while making those who protested against it seem thin-skinned.
Why? In what world — in what cause — is it even vaguely acceptable for a grown man to bully teenagers for their spiritual beliefs in that manner? We need only imagine Rush Limbaugh making his points in such terms and in such a place to know the reaction from the Left would have been much different.
Andrew, I wish Dan Savage were courteous, tactful and willing to use the simplest rules of persuasion — or that he would devote himself solely to supporting his husband and son and his It Gets Better Project, which is aimed at inspiring gay teens to live to adult despite being bullied.
However, fulminating against him is going to bite everyone on the Right who does it in the ass because gays have a much larger portfolio of examples of ideologically-motivated brutality, including religious extremists who drove their own children to their deaths. For example, please explain why a few dozen teens who were insulted by a valid challenge to their beliefs is more heinous than Baptist Pastor Sean Harris telling his North Carolina congregation on April 29 to punch their four-year-old boys if they seem effeminate, make them dig ditches to show them how to be real men and post YouTube videos of them to humiliate the gay out them? Because there were gay teens in that congregation who were out of their minds with fear over these threats and walking out to express how offended they were would have been life-threatening to them. Who on the Right is defending those children? Besides me, I mean. I am going to be calling out everyone on the Right who defended teens who were offended by a reasonable challenge to their beliefs offensively stated but refuse but condone the deadly behavior of people whose verbal and physical attacks on gay teens kill some and scar the rest for life. One of those things is not like the other, Andrew.
Dan is just as much a creature of social conservatism as he is of the Left because social conservatives are responsible for populating the majority of the Left with the demographics who do not serve their will to their satisfaction: gays, Jews and women — all natural constituencies of fiscal conservatism. He is rough because he has been so roughly treated himself. It is unfortunate he said “pansy-assed,” but his astonishment at the disproportionality of the response is genuine because gays endure treatment that is so much worse.
If Dan were wise, kind and tactful, he could have raised exactly the same point in a way that social conservatives would have to address, instead of diverting the world’s attention from it by histrionics. To wit, to use the Bible as an irrefutable argument to justify forcing gays into second-class citizenship, damaging the lives of all gay people and killing many, is cherry-picking passages that suit an agenda that is otherwise indefensible because it is so … non-good.
The other question that Dan does not know how to ask because he is a Leftist and unwilling to harken unto conservative lesbians like me is, “What business does religion have using the powers of government to impose its beliefs using the coercive powers of government on people it has not been able to persuade voluntarily?”
The gay community is a model of fiscal conservatism because we will never be able to depend on the support of our own families, religion and government as straight people can. That is why we create our own charities and non-profits to serve our community’s needs and why so many gays are entrepreneurs. That is why over 30 percent of gays voted Republican in 2010. And it is why conservatives must stop equating “gay” with “Left.”
By the way, thank you for being the first conservative to welcome me into the conservative world at CPAC in 2009 when you were a panelist for Conservatism 2.0 and told the audience that the conservative movement needed to be doing more outreach to gays — and I popped up from one of the front rows to speak. So many of us are on the Right and fiscal conservatives already. It just has to be safe for us to say so. But for now, the anti-gay battering from the podiums of events like CPAC is much more vicious and destructive than anything even than Dan Savage has to say because it causes real deaths and the majority of people who are offended by it are too frightened to identify themselves.
Cynthia, Dan is a bigot. He should be called out, not defended. Doing so only shows how bigoted his defenders are.
Dan is simply a wanker, period. We should have no hesitiation on calling him by a truthful identifier.
Props to the kid in the Captain American shirt for turning his back – literally – on the pasty, self-hating man on-screen.
Yockey, your lengthy, excuse-laden post proves Klavan’s entire point.
Bigot? explain (bet you can’t)
If it needs to be explained to you, you probably would neither accept or understand it.
The difference between us isn’t our defense of our own life views. The difference is you defending a bigoted bully because he’s gay, while decrying the bigoted bullies who are not. Ironic, no?
You are simply wrong about this vile person. He took obvious pleasure in his words and actions. He was out to bag some Christian straight kids, and he sure did. Tough guy that he is. The supposed preacher you bring up as a compare and contrast is of course off his rocker if those charges are true. How does that “nullify” this pansy ass and his stance towards defenseless kids at this event. It doesn’t. You are wrong.
Cynthia, please stop making excuses for Dan’s abusive behavior. He is a bully of the first order.
And, he is an anti-bullying activist and should be held to a much higher standard.
Those who blame their own despicable behavior on past experiences of abuse find themselves in the company of some of the most egregious characters in history.
Guys like Dan are revered in thier spheres of influence as heroes because society has been dumbed down from the higher moral standard of its leaders across the board, from pulpits to presidents, activists to acedemics. the floor and microphone are now open to the lowest unqualified common denominator.
What a total crock! Cynthia, Dan Savage is not fit to address teenagers on ANY topic. Period. The victims here are the kids he verbally abused. The pathetic rationale you use to justify this creep is utter hogwash. And your inane comments about the gay community–oh please! You need to get out of that victim-hood cocoon you’re living in and join the real world.
Folks, please know that many gays and lesbians have condemned Savage and his so-called anti-bullying agenda. Don’t take this lady’s views as representative of the opinions of conservative lesbians and gay men. Despite the self-promotion, she is a community of one.
Those of us who are sane, literate and in love with our Lord, Jesus Christ, want desperately to convince homosexual persons to repent and live christian lives, confining sex to monogamous, heterosexual marriages. The bible is clear that those who do otherwise will be eternally punished. We would not want to see anyone punished eternally. So we try to persuade those in error to the truth because we choose to love them; hence care for their spiritual welfare. Every christian is commanded to evangelize. To fail to do so is to disobey Jesus Christ, and He saves those who obey Him.
Not everyone shares your belief in Jesus or what the bible does and doesn’t say on homosexuality. We don’t live in a theocracy.
Nor do we want you to. Why do gays and other liberals always cry “Theocracy” when Christians say “that may not be a good way to live!)? We refuse to accept homosexuality because it is bad for the individual and for the civilization. Period. Furthermore, we can offer plenty of evidence for why this is so – evidence that is not necessarily based on Scripture (e.g. the sexually-transmitted nature of AIDS). If you wish to argue the point, please do so on the facts, don’t descend to an ad-hominum attack.
Three men are standing on the Deck of the Titanic!
The “Unsinkable” Luxury Liner has just struck an Ice Berg!
The first man beleives with all his heart what the Engineers have told him, “This Ship is Unsinkable!”
The second man beleives with all his heart that the damage is too great and the ship will sink before the night is over.
The third man has yet to make up his mind.
When the Second man tells the third man that it is in his own best interest to get into a life boat, while he still has an opportunity to do so…
Is it Hate, Pride, or a Concern for the third man’s well being that motivates him?
When the First man insists that the third man is a total fool and should not even be listened too…
Is it Hate, Pride or Concern for the third man’s well being that motivates him?
I do realize that you must be honest with yourself (something that is difficult for a liberal) in order to answer those questions correctly, but try!
Are you talking about global warming or what? I thought the discussion was about intolerant liberals. The Titanic metaphor could apply to a lot of things, most urgently here and now, our national debt. This gay stuff is just overhyped hysteria on all sides. Tolerance is letting people make asses of themselves and not feeling they’re your enemies.
Look at what I am replying to and the context of the article fool.
If you think Really Really hard you’ll be able to understand the analogy!
spell check please!
Belief in Christ does not equal a theocracy. Please direct your comments to the nearest mosque. Thank you…..
Cynical Wonder: Maybe not, but it does explain why the Christians are outspoken on the subject of homosexuality (and many other issues.)Whether you agree or not, you have to agree at least, that if someone believes another person will burn for eternity in a fire which does not consume, but only torments, and yet does nothing to warn the other of that place or to try and turn them from behaviour that will lead to such torment, they are not only unloving, they are criminally negligent, in the eyes of the God whom they believe in, perhaps He would have them up on manslaughter charges too.
They don’t expect everyone to believe, but they do want to give everyone the choice, through their sharing.
Having said that, it isn’t sin that causes us to go to hell, because we are ALL sinners against our Holy God, our Creator, every one of us, the Bible declares, and it took only one sin for Adam to be cast out of Gods’ Presence.
It is refusing Gods’ remedy for sin that will cause people to go to hell-Jesus paid the price for our sins on the Cross-the Sinless One for us sinners. If you do not through faith and repentance accept Jesus into your life, you are refusing the greatest gift God has to offer. Moreover, in my experience as a depraved human-being (which I was, in so many ways,) He takes away the desire for the things that destroy too and fills the sinner with His own Holy Spirit, so that you love like He loves and love what He loves-all things become new.
Take it or leave it-its up to you. I lose nothing.
I believe this “man” is possessed as was Legion. He will not abuse Muslim faith because Jesus is the one that demons know of,and fear,but the human part of him is godless; therefore God means nothing to him.
Thank you for that nearly pointless, smugly moralizing, condescending, self-contradictory, and hypocritical exercise in depicting conservatives as wahhabi Muslims because they are not fully on board with a microscopic view that thinks 24/7 of the life of gays, not to mention not being thrilled with Jews and women. Normally for that type of doublethink I have go through the trouble of pushing a button which brings me to a hate-site like The Root.
Cry me a river, Cynthia. So it’s the fault of social conservatives that Dan Savage is a demented little tool. I think not; he’s everything wrong with your sainted movement. He’s an obnoxious in your face pig who demands an audience for his twisted views. He sets the movement back years every time he opens his yap.
Cynthia,
Dan Savage is an admited Bio Terrorist.
He deliberatly volunteered for a Republican re-election campaign and proceded to rub his bodily fluids over surfaces, telephones, he even licked doorknobs in order to spread his influenza to all of the staff working for the republican.
Noting how many people discover that influenza is fatal each year, there is no other term for his actions than Bio Terrorism.
The man is without excuse!
Tu quoque is never a pretty fallacy.
Cynthia, I’m sure you are tired of this thread already but I have to say that the way Dan Savage behaved towards those kids is inexcusable. If a teacher had acted that way in a school assembly he/she would either have been fired or should have been fired. The man needs to be disavowed by the gay community for stupidity and lack of self control if nothing else.
Cynthia there is an ongoing Homosexual and Lesbian was against heterosexuality, marriage and Christianity and you have just confirmed that you are part of it.
Ooops that should have read ‘WAR’ of course not ‘WAS’.
So, the was is over? Good. Because was is hell.
Cynthia,
Throughout history, lots of minority groups have faced discrimination and harassment. But each minority group had a CHOICE as to how to respond.
Dan Savage has made the wrong choice. He has CHOSEN to respond to hate–with hate of his own.
But as Dr. Martin Luther King proved, in the end, it’s those who maintain their peaceful dignity in the face of such harassment who will not only win in the end, but be remembered in history.
I feel safe in predicting that even 50 years from now, Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. will be remembered in American history books. Dan Savage won’t even be a footnote.
I’m not at all interested in the opinions of someone who self identifies by way of a sex act.
amen, lolly. +1million
Goodness – I just thought Savage was another queer taking advantage of the swing over to giving them everything they want.
Simply put, Cynthia. People are not kind to perverts and, whether it’s deserved or not, queers are seen as perverts. Nothing that Savage does is going to change that for the better (for the queers) and much that he’s done has changed it for the worse.
If you think carefully about it, it was was the rise of creatures like Savage and the disgusting behavior of the queers in response to Prop 8 that sparked the slight, short-term uptick in gay bashing.
Were it that being “gay-homosexual-lesbian” was just a sexual preference, it wouldn’t be near the issue it is publicly. But it’s not “just a sexual preference. It’s an in-your-face-I-am-what-I-am-and-I-don’t-give-a-damn lifestyle. I have been married to the same woman for just short of 33 years. To date I, and I’m quite certain, she, have never spoken one single time about what we do behind our bedroom door. While we are moderately affectionate to each other in public, we give no cause for others to be embarrassed for our actions. I am also just as certain that there are vast numbers of gay persons who can claim the same public chastity. No one would know the difference…hence “don’t ask, don’t tell”. Unfortunately what we end up discussing, reference the gay agenda, is not so much your (gays) right to do whatever you please in the privacy of your bedroom, but how much of it you chose to shove down our (heterosexuals) throat. It doesn’t have to be about you and your public display of your preference, but it is. There is nothing new under the sun about being gay. It’s been around since mans beginning, and yet no society that has ever managed to leave a positive stamp on the annuls of history has ever publically condoned what should be kept in private. You can do as you chose behind your door, it isn’t necessary that you try to teach my children that it is morally acceptable, or that I must tolerate it being done. Personally, I don’t care what you do, nor with whom, just don’t tell me about it. I’ll oblige by doing the same. I’ll be happy as well to leave you to your agenda….until it conflicts with mine. I don’t need to see your rainbows, I don’t need to see public displays of your life style, and I wouldnt tolerate one of your flaming front “men” verbally abusing one of my kids. Not that they would tolerate it either, all being quite capable of recognizing deviant behavior on their own.And that no thanks to your agenda trying to remove the barriers between the his and hers stalls in their school restrooms, your agenda being pumped into them in the classrooms, but rather a sound morale foundation being taught to them at home. And yea maybe the preacher you singled out is a nut, but he’s a small nut and his words down penetrate deep into society. For the most part, I think people would leave you alone if you would just reciprocate and stop trying to justify your actions by trying to force people to accept what they find unacceptable.In shorter words, do your thing, keep it private, and shut up about it.
“People would leave you alone” you say.
Nonsense. Not very long ago one of the heroes of the second world war, Alan Turring, the man who decoded the Nazi’s secret code, was prosecuted for homosexuality, which was against the law. He was forced to take female hormones as an alternative to prison. He eventually committed suicide. This is just one example of how “civilized” society has behaved in the recent past.
Klavan says we SHOULD be broadening our definitions of love and relationship, and I agree whole heartedly
i am appalled that you are making excuses for him. that type of behavior is not acceptable in polite society. if i want to go to a club in vegas and listen to some comedians with a mature presentation, that’s fine. that would be a choice. i don’t blame them for leaving. he was rude crude and abusive toward his audience.
Forget Jesus; what would Sam Adams or Andy Jackson have done to this poofter? Darwin was surely wrong — there’s no evolution going on in the US.
Very, very well said! Left-wing “tolerance” is an oxymoron.
This has been said before: Left wing tolerance is really defined as requiring unconditional acceptance of liberal beliefs.
B-b-b-but (*sniffle, snurk*) who is going to stand up for the downtrodden rights of the thugs?
After all (*whimper, whine*), they’re just sweeeeet, lovable little munchkins just trying to shriek — er, um — “eek” out a living in an oppressive society that doesn’t appreciate their uniquely shall-we-say-barbarian gifting and talents.
We must seek to understand their motivations and aspirations and what society has done to compel them to behav—… aeretm##liylw&*^@$#hynnw!!!!
Oh, who am I kidding? Even my fingers rebel at typing any more of this simpering Libtard nonsense.
Doctors do not “tolerate” cancerous growths but recognize them for potentially fatal risks to the life of the individual and ruthlessly and aggressively seek to excise them before they eventually destroy their host.
Similarly, tolerance does NOT equal “approval and active endorsement” as much as these fools might wish it did.
Ah, but that’s why they’re called “progressives”. Tolerance had to progress to Acceptance As Normal, and now Acceptance As Normal has to progress to Celebration.
This constant need to “progress” and push the envelope has also led to it being “not enough” to be a gay male, and now the push is that one must be transgendered to be celebrated by the GLBT political agenda, lest one fall behind the march of “progress”.
This also extends to the left’s approach to fiscal policy, where a safety net wasn’t enough, it had to progress to a welfare state, which has to progress to socialism, which will have to progress to either Communism or National Socialism.
The title would have been stronger if you had written homosexual creeps.
Well written Andrew.
Your post is passionate, reasoned and respectful. As a Christian, I could have a dialog with you and feel comfortable. Thank you. I will admit that many Christians do not know how to engage gays effectively.
This does not invalidate their beliefs, however. I take exception to your comment: “To wit, to use the Bible as an irrefutable argument to justify forcing gays into second-class citizenship, damaging the lives of all gay people and killing many, is cherry-picking passages that suit an agenda that is otherwise indefensible because it is so … non-good.” If you don’t wish to believe the Bible that is your right and privilege. You say ‘cherry-picking’, but if I were to ignore Biblical injunctions against male/male and female/female sexual acts, I would be doing exactly that– cherry-picking. If I believe that the Bible is right, how can I ignore that? I either believe it is the word of God or I don’t. I can’t pick and choose as I “feel”.
The moral argument of the Bible is just one aspect however. Throw it all out and you are still left with the “unnatural-ness” of it biologically.
I don’t, though, think that gays should be discriminated against in the workplace or be excluded as non-family in hospital situations, or not have legal eguality in terms of taxation, etc. But to ask Christians and churches to redefine their sense of right and wrong and what constitutes marriage is unreasonable.
“But to ask Christians and churches to redefine their sense of right and wrong and what constitutes marriage is unreasonable.”
No one is asking the christians to redefine anything. However, your side is asking the state to impose your definitions of what is proper on those who may not share those beliefs. That will be ending soon.
Cynical Wonder,
You said, “No one is asking the christians to redefine anything. However, your side is asking the state to impose your definitions of what is proper on those who may not share those beliefs. That will be ending soon.”
Hmmmm….YOUR side is asking the state to impose YOUR definition of what is proper on those who may not share Liberal beliefs. Hopefully, that will be ending soon.
Don’t say silly stuff. Liberals, Democrats are doing everything they can to impose on ALL Americans what they believe is the right way to live. Liberals and Democrats think it is ok for them to do it, they just don’t like it when they believe Christians are doing the same thing.
Of course Christians are cherry-picking. Read the rest of Leviticus. It also says it’s a sin to wear clothing made from two different kinds of fiber. I’m committing a sin right now by wearing a cotton/polyester blend shirt.
Christians believe that Jesus and Paul absolved them of the duty to obey most of the ancient Hebraic laws in the Old Testament. They don’t have to keep kosher, for example. But they kept a few around, like the prohibition against homosexuality. I’m not an expert on Biblical exegesis, so I don’t know how Christians decided which to keep (homosexuality is a sin) and which to discard (keeping kosher).
It’s really easy. Jesus reminded us when fending off some Pharisaical trickery, “Have you not read that He who created them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, “For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh”
Jesus didn’t need to address homosexuality, already forbidden by Jewish Law, he simply reaffirmed the correct model; man and woman joining together and becoming one flesh.
I’m not going to allow your snide anti-Semitic wisecrack to go unchallenged, regarding “Pharisaical trickery”. Judaism is Pharisaism, and I have a conservative fundamentalist Christian preacher friend who agrees with me that Jesus himself followed “Pharisaical” Judaism, i.e., Judaism. I’ve never seen the phrase “Christian trickery”, have you? Didn’t think so. So please pull your head out of your a** and get educated, and, quoting Jesus, treat others as you’d like to be treated.
That was not one bit anti-Semitic. Jesus clearly showed the corruption of the Pharisees of the time, who were plotting his execution, by the way. He called them white washed sepulchers. They were trying to use the law to justify their sin and trying to get Jesus to agree with them, that’s why it was Pharisaical trickery. They were like Liberal American Jews who ritualistically practice a few Jewish rituals, and give lip service to Israel; or Barack Obama claiming he’s a Christian. I have great respect for real Jews, just not pretend Jews who get indignant at the slightest perception of “anti-Semitism” all the while putting a rabid socialist in the White House.
The connotation associated with “Pharisee” has changed somewhat, just like it has for Samaritans. Pharisees in Jesus’ time were the equivalent of “devout Christians” today; they took their religion seriously and tried very hard to do what God wants. Jesus demonstrated that many of them were too attached to the rules and had no love, no compassion for their fellow man. Christ attacked the Jim Bakkers and Bill Donohues, not the Billy Grahams and Charles Sciclunas.
Stow it. It’s part of Israel’s history that they went apostate and God judged them accordingly. Part of being an apostate means that people in power (in this case the Pharisee’s or spititual leaders) were corrupt. Christ ran circles around them in their attempt to trip Him up.
Uh… wrong. It is not forbidden in Leviticus to wear “clothing made from two different kinds of fiber.” It is forbidden to wear a blend of LINEN and WOOL. And to this day, we Orthodox Jews do not do so.
Whenever this sort of Bible argument comes up, along comes someone who shows how “weird” or “backward” the Torah is, also assuming that no one pays attention to such silly stuff nowadays, or should. Why not ask the people who not only still do, but have longstanding interpretive traditions under which it might not seem so silly?
You bring up Leviticus, but ignore Romans.
The New Testament also condemns homosexuality.
and bearing false witness – and worshipping false idols – and coveting thy neighbor’s wife (or something like that)
Yes – Romans is THE how-to manual for living life as a Christian.
I take exception to your comment: “To wit, to use the Bible as an irrefutable argument to justify forcing gays into second-class citizenship, damaging the lives of all gay people and killing many, is cherry-picking passages that suit an agenda that is otherwise indefensible because it is so … non-good.” If you don’t wish to believe the Bible that is your right and privilege. You say ‘cherry-picking’, but if I were to ignore Biblical injunctions against male/male and female/female sexual acts, I would be doing exactly that– cherry-picking. If I believe that the Bible is right, how can I ignore that? I either believe it is the word of God or I don’t. I can’t pick and choose as I “feel”.
But it seems to me that this is exactly what Christians do: pick and choose which bits of the Bible still apply and which can be ignored. There are various practices that are tolerated and/or encouraged in the Bible but that we consider uncivilized today, such as stoning people to do death and slavery. You DO choose to ignore those, don’t you? Or do you keep slaves and administer stoning to adulterers?
Please note that I don’t say this to pick on Christians exclusively. Frankly, I strongly suspect that you can find this behavior in ANY religion. But there are a lot more Christians than Hindus, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. in my life so their selectiveness isn’t quite as apparent. It wouldn’t remotely suprise me if people in other religions are more than a little selective about which parts of their faith need to be practiced and which can be ignored. In fact, I have some evidence of that. For instance, a Muslim co-worker who lived in Egypt for a time told me that only about one-eighth of all Muslims in Egypt actually pray five times a day; the rest find some rationalization for not observing that aspect of their religion.
What you positively HAVE to understand is that the old testament deals with the Jews and their covenant with God. Those were THEIR laws. The new testament deals with us gentiles and OUR laws.
The 10 comandments still apply (remember that the first Chritians were Jews) but they were also pretty much covered by Christ new instructions to Christians (i.e. Love God with all you heart, mind, body and soul and the second is like unto it – to love your neighbors as yourself).
But remember – we are dealing with gentile secular law. Adultery was criminal – ifthe charges were brought you went to jail. But in the gentile world adultary didn’t carry the death sentence. Same goes for slavery – bible didn’t approve of it – but dealt with your ATTITUDE if YOU were the slave. Owners were encouraged to let them go.
In the old testament slaves were let go every 7 years during the year of Jubilee.
Again, it’s all a matter of how a Christian deals with a secular world and the laws in that world.
You say: “But to ask Christians and churches to redefine their sense of right and wrong”
It seems to me that Christians have lost a lot of their “sense of right and wrong.” My question to all the Christians out there who rail on about how wrong homosexuality is, do you also urge your fellow heterosexuals to stop getting divorced? stop committing adultery? stop having pre-marital sex? stop behaving in a number of other sinful ways? You may, but I’ll bet it’s with much less fervor.
Straight Christians need to stop using gays as scapegoats for all of society’s ills. Everybody’s got issues these days, no matter what your race, ethnicity, religion, gender, or sexuality happens to be. There are far more heterosexuals out there, and it is primarily their behavior that contributes to our decline.
Good article, it continues to amaze me how in-tolerant the Left is.
Hell, sin is sin. I’m a hetero and I’ve got my own sinful proclivities to deal with in order to move toward God, to be in the love of God.
Homosexuals and lesbians, assuming they are practicing, may be Christians, but they are also sinners. Deal with it. Stop your whining, and stop trying to steal my cultural/theological symbols (marriage).
Thugs, black or white, may end up full of holes if they phuck with me and my old, white pals. We all carry, everyday, everywhere.
The thing we must understand is our culture, modernity, is in decline. We are inexorably moving toward a telos. My guess is there’ll be a remnant; history tells us there usually is.
Thank you! You are correct.
The part of the culture that irritates me is the acceptance of sin. Fornication and adultery are every bit as sinful as homosexuality. So is lying and stealing. So is gossiping. They are all equally repugnant to God but liberals have inch by inch badgered society to accept sin as normal.
Accept as normal, except gluttony. It seems like all the other six Deadly Sins are now celebrated by the Left: Lust, as covered here and everywhere else; Greed, in that the grabbermint wants more and more of your money; Envy, because the entire Occupy movement is an exercise in envy; Anger, Jackson/Sharpton/Savage, etc; Sloth, who wants to work hard for grades or income any more? Pride is of course a struggle we all have. Every day, every hour, we have to try mightily to put God ahead of that wonderful person in the mirror. But humility doesn’t seem to be acknowledged as a worthwhile virtue any more.
He has a right to be as much of a jerk and a bully as he wants to be. He should step down from his anti bullying czar pedestal though. His behavior is unacceptable for such a position.
You’ve just highlighted the root cause of such issues. Being a jerk and a bully IS NOT A RIGHT, or privelege, or entitlement etc, If you think it is, then you are part of the problem and deserve the cold ugly cruel and unsafe world that creates. Enjoy!
I feel Dan’s behavior is well warranted – the Zombie-Jew cultists are freaks and need to be exposed. Dan is a great American and you suck.
What a well-argued plea for leftist tolerance!
Cynthia wrote: ” …..everyone on the Right who does it in the ass because gays have a much larger portfolio of examples …..”
On the lighter side, maybe you missed some punctuation or had trouble with word placement, but that doesn’t read quite right.
Cynthia, my own experience has been that school bullying is usually masterminded, and carried out, not by Christian kids, or their Christian parents, but by the cool kids, and their hangers-on. Bullies, both male and female, are often the most popular kids in the school. Their bullying seems inspired, not by any religious feeling (they hate religion, and mock religious people), but by hatred for anything different from themselves, and a quest for power—and public schools are very good at teaching hate, and treating most students as worthless. Golden Girl and Super Sports-Star Boy are the ones everybody loves, and approves of. Then, there are Golden Girl’s and Star Boy’s entourage, and hangers on. Then, the wannabe cool kids. Everybody else must accept their own worthlessness. When bullying occurs, the teachers will ignore it—again, not from any religious motivation, but because these are not the “important” kids. They will tell the victims to ignore it. Of course, sometimes the victims explode, and bring a gun to school—and everyone stands around wagging their heads, and wondering “How could this possibly have happened in our school?”
A few years ago, in a high school not far from where I live, a boy with learning disabilities was bullied, and committed suicide. No, it wasn’t because he was gay, and it wasn’t religious fanatics who persecuted him. I was the school jocks (the Super Boys.) I don’t think any of them were ever even expelled, for their treatment of him.
There is a lot of bullying going on in our schools, and it’s not all directed at gay kids, and it’s not being masterminded by Christians.
Disabled kids frequently have to take more s*t than anybody! But, they’re not politically correct victims (“Trig Palin, euuuuuuu, gross!”) so no one cares.
As I said, bullying happens because public schools are, essentially, set up to teach hatred (“If you aren’t cool, you’re nothing!”) and because the teachers simply aren’t interested in stopping it. By blaming the Bible, I think Savage is either fighting a dragon that isn’t really there—or he’s deliberately attacking Christians. By the way, you think some of those kids who clapped for his rant aren’t going to start bullying Christian classmates now? (If you’re Christian, you’re not cool!”)
This is a very interesting post. The point is that most bullying has nothing to do with prejudice against gays. Though gay kids may be victims of school bullies, they are only a small percentage of such victims.
The left has appropriated the resistance to bullying to make it essentially a support group for gay interests. This is unfortunate because bullying is a far more widespread phenomenon and is an area where schools should be more involved in preventing it.
In my experience it is the socially awkward kids that get picked on. They are often the kids who have problems in school and often have trouble conforming to rules in the classroom, either because of a learning disability, immaturity or simply not picking up on social cues. The teachers find such kids to be disruptive and annoying and many teachers react by frequently signaling them out and making little effort to hide their disdain. The other kids pick up on this and bullies take the teacher’s contempt for such kids as a license to harass them.
The teachers annoyance is understandable. Anyone who has taught or even coached little league sports knows how disruptive difficult kids can be. And for many such adults, it is easy to succumb to the temptation to encourage peer pressure to enforce discipline. Teachers do this everyday in every school in America. In many cases this actually helps the kids as the natural consequences of poor behavior push the kids to conform to more conventional expectations. But for kids with the inability to pick up on social cues, this doesn’t work very well and they fall into a pattern of being picked on since they simply have no clue as to what they are doing that causes others to single them out.
A great deal of tax payer money is devoted to special education. And there are many humane special ed teachers who are sensitive to the needs of kids with social problems. But there are also many such teachers who simply dislike kids who are different and see their role as correcting them. Such teachers and administrators often have memorized lines about tolerance and recognizing the special individuality of each child but in practice they see such kids as abhorrent and it is their duty to make the kids shape up. They also tend to believe that the parents are responsible for their children’s odd behavior, often attributing it to a failure to discipline them. The result is a downward spiral for the kid in which daily criticism from the teacher and getting picked on by other kids becomes the routine of daily life.
It is unfortunate that some of the money that is set aside to pay for teachers to help these kids is spent on the salaries of people who are more suited for work in the Department of Motor Vehicles. On the other hand, it is fortunate that in many cases there are kind people who may be custodians or gym teachers or helpers around the school who have great empathy and are able to reach out to these kids and help them get through this difficult part of their life without being scarred too much.
Kindness is something that comes from the heart. It is not a function of ideology or formal education. It is not owned by liberals or conservatives, religious people or atheists. It is not something you can purchase. But in school situations, it is often something in very short supply.
Dan Savage is not a kind person. His purpose was to humiliate those who were different from him. Whatever valid criticisms he may have had of those intolerant of gays, his message was one of meanness against people who had been raised to be religious. That is not tolerance. It is bullying. And the so-called anti-bullying campaign is largely a crock.
Stellar post!
Superbly said!
The only observable purpose Humans have on this planet is to reproduce. Look around, every other living thing is doing it. No animal species that is too stupid or selfish to do so will survive past the current generation. Survival of the fittest I suppose. This alone should be enough to compel the state (not bent on its own self destruction) to advocate functional families on the matter of children. For all of our futures sake. Even the future of those who have no children of their own.
No Bible verses required.
Like the leftist never tire of telling us, “its for the children.”
Exactly procreation is the only purpose of any animal and we are all animals. If Homosexuality was the norm then there would be no mankind. It was after all Adam and Eve who started it all if it was ADAM and STEVE then none of us would be around to talk about it.
Many species of God’s creatures exhibit homosexual behavior. Even actual intercourse between males. For example, bonobos (a species of ape) commonly exhibit both male homosexual and female homosexual behavior.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals
That hasn’t driven any of those species to extinction. A species survives when *enough* offspring grow to adulthood and reproduce. Far more offspring fail to reproduce due to being killed by disease, starvation, or predators, than due to homosexual bonding.
Our Biblical ancestors didn’t know about any of this. So they formulated moral laws *in the absence of modern scientific knowledge*.
Primates hurl poop too. Some primates brutally kill other primates. Some animals rape other animals of their same species. Some animals kill the offspring of their own species because they weren’t their offspring. Should this behavior be condoned because animals do it? Seriously, I’m not sure what thought process goes into deferring to the animal kingdom when defending behavior. Sounds regressive to me.
Has it ever occurred to you that there is a probability (let alone a possibility) that homosexuality occurs naturally in some individuals, whether they be in the animal kingdom or among us humans?
No they don’t – they rut on each other in a show on DOMINANCE! Please understand the difference.
Besides, we are not animals.
Furthermore, Savage was invited there to talk about bullying, and journalism; he wasn’t invited (at least not officially) to critique the students’ religious beliefs. And, sorry, no, I don’t think you can blame the bullying, and abuse, that goes on in our public schools on the Bible. I think Savage has that wrong. He has a bug up his rear end about religion; because it makes him feel guilty, because it makes him feel excluded, because he can’t stand the fact it doesn’t agree with him—whatever.
The fact that no adult asked him to get off the stage when he began abusing the kids, shows that, instead of being bullied, and looked down on, homosexuals are actually approved of, by the administration. Also, Savage has a column called “Savage Love”, that runs in several free papers, wherein he discusses the joys of non-monagamous sex, the yuckiness of females, how to have threesomes, foursomes, anal sex, etc. It’s not like he hides his general sleaziness, or his contempt for Christianity; the school administration has to have known what this guy was like when they invited him to speak—and they did so, anyway. This actually indicates to me that this particular school’s administration is pretty well disposed towards gays—maybe not so much towards their uncool, religius students. Where is the real bigotry, here?
To understand Leftist intolerance and hatred one must understand the root of Leftism – it is Rousseau, not Marx. Rousseau philosophized about the perfection of nature and man, and that his barbarity were attributable to the fault of the way society was organized and operated, not because of any inherent flaw (as in sin nature or Original sin.)His followers formed the Jacobin Party and sat on the Left in the French Assembly. Their counterpart were the Girondists on the right, who followed a more Biblical view of man and were more akin to the writings of Edmund Burke, Thomas paine and the US Fathers. If only you could get the right enlightened humanists to seize power, the Jacobins pined,they could, through the agency of the State, transform society and create utopia. Of course, those evil Girndists would never allow such a seizure of power, hence utopia will never happen…unless we get rid of them. Hence, Dan Savage, Bill Maher, the whole sad cast of thug Leftists. Hence the Terror and the massacre of the Girondists.
I remember disucssing this (the perfection of man and nature) in a high school philosphy class. It always puzzled me how if there was perfection in man and nature, how did inperfected institutions and societies come about in about the first place.
Actually, the answer to Rousseau’s hypothesis was shown quite clearly in the 18th century with the Revolutions of America following the Girondists philosophy and setting up a Republic and the French following the Jacobinist philosophy ending in the Reign of Terror with the killing of tens of thousands of people.
Actually, I have read Dan’s sex column fairly regularly over the years in the local hipster free rag and find it surprisingly enlightened. He is not a woman or a hetero hater. Yes, with him the sky’s the limit when it comes to weird and icky bedroom pursuits but he has strict rules about safety, mutual satisfaction etc, and he regularly shows no mercy to those who write him to try and get him to justify their urge to cheat on their partners, or indulge in bizarre, exploitive, or abusive sexual practices without first clearing it with their lovers beforehand. Believe it or not, what he writes in his column actually makes sense. You will never hear him make excuses for rape, pedophilia, autoerotic asphyxiation, or philandering (to name but a few).
It’s when he segues into religion or politics that he immediately goes off the rails and becomes the caricature of the self-righteous, hateful, bible-stomping, self-pitying, chip-on-shoulder, angry leftist gayboy twerp. As such, he should not ever be given a pass on his behavior. I personally believe he started the “it gets better” movement for the purposes of self-aggrandizement, self-promotion and a chance to hobnob with stars and take another poke at straight society (even if he won’t admit it even to himself).
For my own part, from what I have observed over the years, homosexuality has nothing whatsoever to do with genetics. Human homosexuality is propagated vampire fashion, through childhood molestation by sexual predators. That goes a long way towards explaining why so many gays are such angry, vengeful, dysfunctional sexually compulsive characters.
There are plenty of angry, vengeful, dysfunctional sexually compulsive hetero characters, as well. Only we call them “pick-up artists” and “cougars,” and so make excuses for their behavior, when we refuse the same for gays.
Then again, given your pre-conclusion that, to be gay, one must first be molested, is it any wonder their response to you is so angry and vengeful?
Not a pre-conclusion, but a conclusion based on a number of studies that find homosexuals were disproprtionately sexually abused as minors.
I am missing something. Why is this an issue?…….
So, Dan is a lout. Alert the media. The Left’s idea of tolerance is never being discomfited nor subjected to disparagement or humiliation – i.e. being bullied. The proper response is not to buy into the concept to begin with. I see nothing that happened there that should be overtly threatening to self-possessed young men and women beyond a small clutch of school-yard quality insults. Here’s something virtuous and ‘manly’ to do that doesn’t include digging ditches or punching someone in the face: simply walk out. You can choose to declaim beforehand; “When you are through being stupid or otherwise verbally shatting yourself, maybe then we will have something to talk about”. Or words to that effect……..
Unfortunately many homosexuals are just projecting a version of their own hate onto others when they accuse others of hate. And they project a version of their own phobia (heterophobia) when they label others homophobes. A hard truth is that, like a female mind in a male body is clearly a sign that something went wrong somewhere, i.e., clearly points to a disorder, so a homosexual mind in a heterosexual body clearly points to a disordered state of being. Homosexuality should not be normalized. Indeed, the APA should never have removed it from its list of disorders. The APA used to consider homosexuality a disorder and it had reasons for doing so. Those reasons are still valid today.
Gavin Arthur defined 12 sexual orientations, six male and six female. This is a lot more subtile than the simplistic gay-straight categories we’re so hung up on. My challenge to Christians and others who believe that gay=sinful is, why did God make so many of them if he hates them? Remember we’re talking here of the psychological orientation, not the particular acts. People do not choose their unconscious tendencies. Though your religious beliefs may consider homosexuality to be abhorrent, it is perfectly natural and, the suffering involved is created by the conflict between that tendency of nature and the moral prohibitions of a particular religion.
Read Romans, it explains it.
In brief, when society turns its face from God then God gives society over to every debasement there is. It is a punishment to that society and a punishment that will destroy it. We have several examples of this already in history.
Shoot, it wouldn’t even be the first time in THIS country that we were brought to the brink of doom because of our vices.
Look at the Roaring 20′s! The nation as a whole was extremely well off and went right to h3ll! The decadence of the 20′s was SO unseemly that it’s taken us a good 80 years to get back to that level of slime.
But with that amount of sinning also came the ruin of the Great Depression and now we are looking into that black hole again. I don’t think it’s too big of a stretch to equate the sin of the country to it’s financial (and natural) ruin.
The APA concluded that assumptions about homosexuality being a “disorder” were based on societal norms. Further, they based their conclusion that homosexuality is a “normal variant” of sexual orientation based on years of research.
There are instances where the concept of “normal” would be better served by substituting for it the term “conventional.” IOW, it’s far more accurate to say homosexuality is not “conventional” to some groups than to throw the blanket statement “it’s not normal” out there.
Nightelf: “People do not choose their unconscious tendencies. Though your religious beliefs may consider homosexuality to be abhorrent, it is perfectly natural and, the suffering involved is created by the conflict between that tendency of nature and the moral prohibitions of a particular religion.”
Sounds reasonable to me.
Hey AK:
Great job and agree with the bulk of the article, however:
“and science is in the process of giving us a better understanding of the origins of sexual preference.”
I am unaware of the science. My guess that if it existed Dan Savage would shout it loud and shout it proud.
My experience/ intuition leads me to a slightly different conclusion.
Science has actually proved the opposite – that it IS a choice. In fact, it’s not until the act is committed that the brain damage (a scent gland is shrunk and destroyed) occurs.
On the other hand, gays now know that science cannot EVER find a gay gene, politically, because they know parents will abort those children. So, they say they are still searching and float the canard that it’s not a choice while knowing that it certainly IS a choice.
Absolute bulsh1t. I feel sorry for you and your incredible ignorance. Please get to know people outside of your ‘tribe’
I didn’t notice anything resembling a factual refutation of the previous post in yours, only the traditionally-leftist name calling. Here’s a news flash for you: just because you dearly wish something to be true doesn’t make it so.
Don’t presume to know me, my life experience or how I’ve come to my conclusions.
Fact is I know everything about gays because my best friend was one – he died of aides in 1989.
The brain damage I learned about first in the bible (it explains how the act of sin actually affects your health) and then saw it backed up in black and white at school in my physchology class (anyone whose taken Physch 101 knows it’s a biology class) and it was a gay man who made the discovery. He was most dispondant regarding his discovery.
His hypothesis was that people are “born that way,” and during the course of his research discovered that the damage to the brain only happens after the subject engaged in the act – not before. In his opinion it was a choice, but the act rather sealed the fate of those engaging in the act because “it set the palate,” so to speak.
more bull – this is a waste of time
God made me to show His goodness, and to make me happy with Him in Heaven. As far as I know, the ONLY person who can make a human being is God.
God made me a heterosexual. I know this, because I have always been attracted sexually to members of the opposite sex. This is no virtue on my part: if I felt about a woman the way I have felt about men, I’d be a lesbian. The ONLY person I know of that can make a human homosexual or heterosexual is God, and He does it a lot.
Homosexuality is a trait that can be found in in all kinds of animals, in low, persistent numbers, in about the same numbers as left-handedness. The best explanation I can find for that circumstance is that homosexuality is a trait that God put in our population, for reasons I do not understand.
It is not my place to critique God’s work. It is my place to love my neighbor, and the point Jesus made, was that I don’t get to choose which of my neighbors to love.
Dan Savage has behaved in a manner that is unacceptable for a person who is supposed to be teaching young people, and he should be fired. He won’t be fired for being homosexual, but for being a jerk.
Cynthia Yockey’s point, though, has some merit. She’s concerned that criticism of Dan Savage for being a “gay creep” is going to be instantly translated, in the minds of people who should be our natural allies, as “gay.” This is worth careful consideration, because she has probably observed this effect in action.
Thank you for your lovely, thoughtful post.
Sorry Valerie, I’m not buying it. God still tells us through his prophets of old that homosexual activity is wrong; just like lying, stealing, etc, etc…
People who are attracted to members of the same sex are simply struggling with a weakness just the same as someone with a strong proclivity to steal, or beat people up whom they don’t agree with. If I steal my neighbor’s car because I “just can’t help myself”, am I justified because I say “hey, God made me that way. I can’t help it”? No way. Homosexual behavior is just like any other sin. The act shouldn’t be tolerated, and the person plagued by the temptation should be helped to overcome it. Plain and simple. What was wrong 2000 years ago is still wrong today. Grow up and get over it.
I guess those Christians turned the “other” cheek(s) to Dan. I’ll bet Muslims are laughing haughtily at us. “Look what they’ll tolerate. They are weak. We’ll kill them first, and then the gays.”
As has already been pointed out, Dan Savage is not stupid enough to take his show on the road to an auditorium filled with Muslims. It reminds me of Penn Jillette calling out Seth McFarlane for criticizing South Park creators Trey Parker and Matt Stone for their Muhammad episode. The cognitive dissonance of liberals is frightening. You all are going to end up in a Theocracy and then you’ll be crying for Christians to save you. You’d best heed Cardinal Niemoller’s wisdom before it’s too late.
“We’ll kill them first, and then the gays.””
I think the premise is, they will kill the gays first. Isn’t that what it always comes down to. If the gays think that marriage is the reason they should vote for 0b0z0, they have to understand that he is culturally a muslim, but is a trained athiest and communist. So if you think you will be safe – think about it again. No worries about running for office – muslim brotherhood in the white house So what exactly do you think he has planned for you? Remember Iran has no gays.
Cynthia is a “victim” of society therefor she has the upper hand in castigating anyone who disagrees with her views in the name of tolerance
A pathetic example of “over reach justified because “im Gay – Muslim – Black – Hispanic – a societal Victim
The left has appropriated the resistance to bullying to make it essentially a support group for gay interests.
Yup. I was curious at the sudden big info push by anti-bully groups out of no where, with all the celebrity ads condemning bullies. Then, everything about the bullying started only referencing gay kids as victims. Nevermind the kids picked on because they are smaller or just ‘not cool’.
That made it all come together. This is the set up to attack Christians and the GOP as ‘intolerant’ and ‘bullies’ for not agreeing with leftist homosexual Democrats for this election cycle. The left is always tried to conflate dissenting speech with violence in order to shut people up. The gay rights crowd is expert in this tactic.
They conveniently leave out that black kids are generally a little tougher. If you are a little tougher kid the temptation to terroize other kids is overwhelming.
Here in California we have a slightly different phenomenon. White kids ae being terroized from taking HS Science because chinese ameicans students drive the curve up with their large brains and hard studying ways.
You know what would have impressed me even more than the kids walking out? If the kids stood up on their seats and shouted “You are wrong, you bigoted jerk!” Do you honestly think if the roles were reversed, that if a conservative were speaking on the stage and made some comments against homosexuals, that the supporters of homosexuals in the audience would NOT have disrupted the lecture and stopped it right then and there? THAT is how the left behaves, by silencing the opposition. One only has to see what “kids” on college campuses do when there are lectures against the Palestinians or illegal immigration. There are near riots in the halls and the people talking are not allowed to finish the lecture.
Now many of you out there may say, “Well, you’re only following bad behavior with more bad behavior.” And to that I would respond, “What’s your point?” People have to understand that unless conservatives start standing up for their rights and their views, the far left is going to crush us. The liberals already control the mainstream media, college campuses, and most of cable TV. With only talk radio, a few blogs, and FOX News on our side, it may not be enough. It is time for conservatives to not only take a stand, but to stand up and be heard, especially at public events. If conservatives and Christians do not do this, if we don’t have more peaceful protests and get more of our message out via the Internet, radio, and TV, then the left will do what it’s best at, and that is silence the opposition. People like Savage don’t deserve the courtesy of just having people walk out on him. People like Savage, in no uncertain terms, need to be told right then and there that what they are saying is not only insulting to a lot of people, but also vulgar and bigoted. Only then maybe will schools, the mainstream media, and TV stations begin to understand that you can’t have one set of rules for liberals and another set of rules for conservatives. We need more Andrew Breitbarts in this world, not less. Breitbart was willing to take the culture wars and throw it right back in the faces of the far left. That is exactly what we need to do now. Now is not the time to be silenced and it is our right to be heard.
I am not at all sure our interests as conservatives would be better served by acting like jerks. We already have the fight on our hands at dispelling the misguided notions forged by the left (& the complicit MSM) that we are a bunch of knuckle-dragging, boneheaded, back-country, toothless hicks who have no idea about how to run anything.
I’d be willing to bet it’s going to be a while before anyone invites Dan Savage to appear before a group of young people to speak on the subject of “bullying” or anything else. He was an embarrassment.
No – they would have been villified for denying this jerk his 1st amendment rights. They would have been pilloried for their hatred and they would have been crucified for their intolerance.
SGT Ted, I fear you’re right.
The very fact of being a Christian, and believing in the Bible, will be called “bullying”; this will be used as a weapon against Christians in general, with Christian students taking the brunt of it—”If you are Christian, you must be a bully! Your beliefs make all the gay students uncomfortable!”
Bullying, and sickening violence, have been going on in public schools for years (see my earlier post about bullying), and it’s only now anybody’s worried about it, and it’s only the gay students they’re worried about? What’s the real agenda, here?
The agenda is the training and recruitment of homosexuals.
Teachers in these classrooms start in kindergarten with story books called Prince and Prince pushing the homosexual agenda – they actually arrect parents who object.
Then in a few years they encourage kids to “come out” and then they celebrate them and make them feel “special.”
Then, if a kid decides they aren’t gay after all, school counselors tell them they ARE gay and are just in denial. Feeling trapped the teen takes his/her own life because they can see no way out. Then the shocked school staff blames it on Christian bullying. This, btw, is a true story and shows how evil and diabolical these people are and it’s happening all over the country.
The only bullies here are the adults in charge who are pushing the gay agenda to try and normalize gays.
arrect = arrest
SGT Ted, Jonathan Cohen’s earlier post on the subject of bullying is excellent, too!
As he says, one problem is that many teachers today are far more suited to be working in the Department of Motor Vehicles.
In an earlier, more genteel time, such behavior would have resulted in someone walking to the podium and delivering a stinging slap across his face, generally with a glove. Knowing that words have consequences tend to make people more polite.
I’m frankly tired of political correctness. Gay or straight, this man would have been made to pay for his rudeness.
An excellent column, but I’d like to add a couple of points.
Liberals tend not to walk out on conservative speakers; they try to shout the speaker down. And when this happens, it is called “free speech”.
To those who make the moral relativity argument that gays somehow have more justification to complain than the rest of us, let me say one word: NAMBLA.
Finally, let’s address the notion of tolerance on the left. That is the lie they want us to believe. They are no more tolerant in pushing their agenda than anyone else. I would argue that the conservative principles of equal protection under the law and equal opportunity are far more tolerant than the left’s wanting special privileges to their various most favored victim groups. Tucker Carlson made the point well, saying that genetic entitlement is wrong no matter what particular gene is being cited.
Are you equating all gay people with the child molesters at NAMBLA? If so, that’s a despicable statement and you should be ashamed of yourself.
Conservatives walk out, and suffer racist and vile comments, and take it in stride and that is the difference between liberals and conservatives.
Liberals would have shouted the speaker down, thrown objects at him and attempted to shut down the discussion.
So who do you prefer better, those that walk out, ignore the crap that is being said, and suffer the vile abuse, or the self righteous that seem to be for freedom of speech when it is something they want to hear, and will do all possible to shut down those that they disagree with.
Simple choice.
I cannot for the life of me imagine that had my childhood been any different I would be attracted to men instead of women. It has to be something you are born with. I couldn’t get aroused by a man if my life depended on it. But the shape of a woman…absolute magic.
Actually, the nature-nurture issue regarding sexual attraction is complex and controversial. Gay folks want people to believe you are born with a certain sexual attraction, thus strengthening their argument that they are a protected class. There is some research that might support this position. But then there is a body of research on sexual behavior and sexual identification in prisons that suggest it is not genetic.
The prison system is an interesting one – i.e. all straight males and females say that you HAVE to be gay for your stay.
The prison system brings up an interesting dichotomy. All straight males and females say that you HAVE to be gay for the stay. They have to engage in the behavior while they are there to survive, but do NOT engage in it once they leave.
One finding is that the longer a person is in prison, the more likely that s/he self-identifies as being gay.
Homosexuality nor Christianity nor Heterosexuality is the problem.
The problem is that the anti bullying guy is a bully.
He and anyone like him has no place in that argument.
His position seems to presuppose that anyone who disagrees with his unimportant side issues is a latent or actual bully.
Indeed his bullying shows that he is the bully.
Correction:
“Neither Homosexuality nor Christianity nor Heterosexuality is the problem”
Fingers ahead of brain
To all who say that homosexuality is normal, because even some animals have homosexual traits, and because even a few little boys have the same, I will tell you why.
In believing the Holy Bible, you have the advantage in understanding what is going on in this world. For instance: the Bible says that God made man in His own image, He placed the man and woman in charge over all of His creation. When mankind fell (when Adam and his wife sinned) they produced a human race of sinners (to this day scientists cannot find the “gene” that causes death, they never will, because the cause is spiritual. “Death (spiritual and physical) entered the human race by sin.” the Bible says. This gave satan and his demons authority to rule over our world (which is why he tempted the woman in the first place-knowing if he could get her to disobey and Adam, they would be under his dominion.) We, as a result live in a fallen world: even in the womb, things can go tragically wrong-babies born deformed in various ways and yes, a spirit (demon) can enter the womb and cause this havoc; likewise, a demon of homosexuality can enter the baby forming in the womb. I believe some people are born homosexual-as a result of this. Even the animal kingdom is affected by the fall, they too can be possessed of a demon of homosexuality. For instance, there was no blood shed prior to the fall, now we have animals killing other animals and shedding blood and eating them. I had a friend (Hector Padilla) who was homosexual and went to a Pentecostal minister who cast the demon of homosexuality out in the Name of Jesus Christ, in one moment. His story was on the front page of the Sydney Morning Herald back in 1994-5 (I carried it for years, the clipping, and lost it.) He was set free in that moment. Today he is a happily married man with three grown children.
So, yes, a person CAN be born homosexual. They need deliverance though. I personally do not think most Christians are appreciative (& non Christians) of just how over-powering the lust emanated from demons of this kind really are-if they were, they would feel sympathy for homosexuals and lesbians. Yes, they need salvation-but we are all sinners, everyone of us, and Jesus laid down his own sinless life as an atonement for our sins. He is the sacrificial lamb that the Jews prototyped with their animal sacrifices for centuries.
In brief-yes, a person can be born homosexual, for a spirit (demon) of homosexuality can enter the womb of some babies and predispose them that way. Yes, there is a cure-like my friend Hector Padilla, they can have that spirit cast out of them in the Name of Jesus Christ by a devout Believer.
The cause is primarily spiritual.
Whilst I feel sorry for people who are lesbians or homosexuals, I agree entirely that kids should be kept away from Dan Savage and any other homosexuals like him.
I hate that they are teaching kids homosexuality in schools-kids as young as 7 y.o. No, not in a way to help them accept those folk, but teaching them it as a valid alternative. I know a classroom of children who were made to lie on their backs and visualise the whole world as being comprised of homosexuals-I kid thee not! Young kids growing up literally do not know whether they’re Arthur or Martha. It stinks.
plain and simple. keep him away from kids.
dan savage is a creep, a real .creep. keep him away from kids
someone who’s gay can’t be called a creep, and should be allowed to talk to kids like the creep that he is?
Look all these groups want is ratification not acceptance, and they want to gain it by force.
What they fail to realize is that the law can’t make others to care whether they live or die.
The definition you are using for “Tolerance” is merely rationalization. Tolerance and rationalization are not synonyms.
Exactly. Well said Tom. I couldn’t quite “vocalize” my own reaction to this article adequately. I don’t need to now.
Since the 1950′s high schools have grown from small units- graduating classes of 12 to 80 students, to the mega-schools of 3,000 students. There is a chance this is the largest grouping most people will ever be forced to endure. Adults talk about “soulless” corporations, being a number, being lost, in large organizations. Entire magazines and books and seminars exist simply to help grown people navigate the large enterprise. Why do we expect ease and comfort from immature teenagers, faced with a giant, hostile to -indifferent- maze?
We group 3,000 immature- by definition- IMMATURE- young people together, and we get upset when they behave immaturely. We know a great many of them have spent a majority of their time around their peers, and very little time interacting with mature, loving, interested grownups. Kids in daycare are measurably different than kids raised at home. Kids raised with at least one stay at home parent behave measurably different than kids raised with two working parents. Home-schooled children behave different than public school, or even private school, students.
Add in teachers in most states- lowest GRE scores, holders of remarkably destructive social engineering views- and notions…why wouldn’t kids be lost on an uncivilized plain? What usually impresses me is that they are trying to figure out how to deal with each other, with remarkably few guides, and nearly no hope. Not even from books- which is so sad- since in the previous 20 years YA has veered off into dystopia, grief, guilt and despair. If they are taught shakespeare- it’s never a courtly comedy- only the gore and destruction and betrayal stories. They do feel like they are inventing the world, themselves.
We don’t know what a society that allows gays looks like. I’ve tried to piece it together. John Bowlby has claims about the west up to the 13th century. The common practice was for the oldest son to inherit, and then the younger sons to undergo castration, to enter into Imperial service. Well, everything I’ve read says that homosexuality is more common in third and fourth sons- so, they weren’t all over the place. Their drives had been blunted.
Some greeks practiced child-kidnappings and rapes, as sort of religious ceremonies. Paul’s letters apparently refer to these practices- Christians do not kidnap, Christians do not rape children, Christians don’t go to pagan ceremonies……so I’m not seeing consenting grownups setting up house together.
We are grappling with things never seen in history. A commitment to letting everyone have full sexual expression is new. We’re trying to see how it all works.
Dear Ari, we DO know what a society of gays looks like, the twin cities, Sodom and Gomorrah were discovered a few decades ago, the archeologists & scientists said it appeared that a sudden catastrophic event had annihilated them both, simultaneously. Further, they said that the cities appeared to have been destroyed by fire fuelled by sulfur. This concurs exactly with the Biblical account in Genesis, where it is written that the Lord rained down fire and brimstone (sulfur) from above, on those two cities and destroyed everyone in them. (He had warned them and witheld his judgment until He could withold no more.) That is what a society of gays looks like-eventually.
Dan Savage isnt an Anti-Bullying activist, but rather a Promoter of Homosexuality…..just like Obama’s Safe Schools Czar, Kevin Jennings.