As Barry Rubin wrote about this week at his blog, we’ve reached an age where to state what used to be common sense about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict will get you labeled a bigot. To acknowledge that the Palestinians do not want peace with Israel and have rejected every very generous deal put in front of them means you’re “racist against Muslims.”
But just as cultural Marxists invested decades in obscuring the reality of Palestinian intransigence, they also worked to confuse people about the sordid reality of unrestrained male sexual nature. State what used to be common sense for women to avoid sleazy men and all of a sudden you’re the American Taliban blaming women for provoking their rapists.
In my blog post yesterday — What Father Would Permit His Young Daughter to Wear a Bikini? — I knew what paragraph would provoke the most anger and confusion, the one that simply restated the conventional wisdom we all know to be true but don’t like to acknowledge:
But let me spell it out for those who want to deny it: when a woman wears a skimpy swimsuit, she is sending off the signal to every man and boy that she is a self-proclaimed slut and the most interesting thing about her is her body. If a woman didn’t want a man to look at her breasts, if she did not want to use them to attract the kind of men who have no self-control, she would not flash them around.
I find this statement to be a huge over generalization, to put it kindly. Look, I am married, in my 30s, educated, and I wear a bikini. I’m not a slut, and I don’t think my choice of swimwear projects that to anyone. Bikinis are worn all over the world, by all sorts of women. I doubt all of us believe the most interesting thing about ourselves is our body. I certainly don’t.
In the passage you quote I didn’t say “bikini” I said “skimpy swimsuit.” Not every bikini is going to make the woman wearing it look like she’s offering herself up for the world. I’m not saying that every time a woman wears a bikini she’s telling the world she’s a slut. That would be nuts.
Don’t some bikinis scream “I’m a tramp looking for attention from the wrong kind of men” more than others? As a man I certainly see the ones that do versus those that are tasteful. For little girls though I don’t think they should be wearing 2 piece swimsuits at all, though, but maybe I’m being too harsh?
[… A second comment from me later following up…]
“she is sending off the signal to every man and boy”
I am not saying that you or anyone who wears a bikini is a slut. What I am saying is that when a woman wears a sexy, skimpy swimsuit she is giving off the hint to the men around her that she is more sexually liberated than a woman who is not showing off her body. Again: I’m not making a moral judgment with the observation here, just stating what should be common sense. Wear a sexy swimsuit, and men will think that you’re more interested in sex than a woman who wears a modest swimsuit. Girls need to know that when picking their swim wear.
Vesta could tell that I had a moral objection to promiscuity hiding behind my argument, but the point I was trying to make remained out of view when she responded. She was still thinking about the real world — instead of the male world.
‘Don’t some bikinis scream “I’m a tramp looking for attention from the wrong kind of men” more than others?’
Followed later with,
“Again: I’m not making a moral judgment with the observation here, just stating what should be common sense.”
Honestly Dave it does sound like a moral judgement. And besides, those sorts of bikinis garner attention from practically all men, not just the ‘wrong kind’
We are all guilty of making snap moral judgements against others based upon what they are wearing, myself included. I just don’t think you could go to the beach and determine which women are more interested in sex by what type of swimsuit she’s wearing. Here’s an example – a few weeks ago while on a weekend vacation, I was at the pool early in the morning. I had on a bikini. A woman sitting poolside in a utilitarian one piece was reading Fifty Shades of Grey. I’m gonna say she was more interested in sex than me.
Geez, how did we even get on this topic? I think we are both in complete agreement that young girls in grown up bikinis conveys a message the girls themselves don’t understand, and that has the potential to be very dangerous.
What is actually true is not what gets filtered though the male sex drive. My last comment:
Well I have no problem making the moral judgment that women should not live as sluts sleeping around promiscuously. Don’t you? But that’s not the point that I’m making here. I’m making the practical point about male sexual nature and how men view women: the more of your breasts you reveal in public the more we think you want us to think about sex. That’s the hard truth, no pun intended. So when it comes to bikinis, the skimpier the bikini, the sluttier we are going to assume the woman wearing it is.
That does not mean that every bikini makes a man think you’re a slut. There are worlds of difference between a skimpy thong with tiny triangles for a top and the more normal bikini you were probably wearing.
“I’m gonna say she was more interested in sex than me.”
I’m not talking about objective reality, I’m talking about what men perceive. The man seeing you across the pool has no idea what she’s reading. He just sees you and you attract his attention and judgments whether you intended to or not. I’m talking about the practical world here.
Vesta is right that these 3 swimsuits are all going to attract male attention. But one of these three women is much more likely to draw in men who will disrespect her and try and seduce her.
Maybe the one whose fashion sense is most influenced by prostitute culture?
Bikinis featured in above illustration available at Amazon:
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