iTalk
I’m not a Macintosh guy, but I’ve always been sympathetic to the Cause. So I hope John Dvorak is right about Apple’s position:
In the short term, the problem for Apple is not to kill its sales during the transitional market. In other words, what happens to the left-over PowerPC machines? The company got through this once before when it switched from the 68000 to the PowerPC. It did it with add-on cards, specifically the Power Macintosh Upgrade card. So I expect a similar product this time. Still, this process is going to be bumpy, but with iPod and iTunes mania propping up the company, this is the exact right time to do this. The company can weather any storms in the process.
The iPod may, as Bill Gates thinks, turn out to be a flash in the pan – a big hit before microdrive-enabled cell phones become out portable mp3 players. But that won’t happen for probably another couple years. Meanwhile, those fat profits ought to keep Apple afloat during the changeover period.
The big question is, could Mactel
I disagree that Microsoft ending Mac Office would spell certain doom. Corporations do not buy Macs in great enough numbers for the nixing of Office to mean anything. Secondly, with OpenOffice 2.0 coming out soon, there will actually be some competition for Office. I say some because the killer app is still Outlook. I think the main thing that is starting to swing in the Macs direction from a corporation perspective is Total Cost of Ownership. A corporation spends X number of dollars on IT staff, software and hardware to keep the Microsoft Infrastructure secure. If Apple can sale the message that Mac OS X is cheaper by a large margin in TCO, then the pendulem and swing towards the Mac side pretty quickly. I believe that sale start happening now. Intels CEO has already made comments to that effect.
Certain doom? Certainly not.
Apple’s got some big stuff coming. Think iTunes, except for video. Streaming video wirelessly from your Mac to your TV at DVD quality. Movies that can be downloaded and played in a few hours. The technology’s already here, it’s just the legal issues that are keeping Apple from doing this now. That’s gonna generate a big chunk to help ease the changeover.
If Microsoft stops making Office for the Mac, then Apple has the resources to replace it. So far, Microsoft has already said that they will support Office on Mac/Intel.
Besides, Keynote and Pages are much better than PowerPoint and Word.
I don’t think the whole CPU switch thing makes much difference. A Mac will still be a Mac, and the translation between PowerPC and Intel will be almost seamless. Apple’s had this thing planned for a very long time, so it’s not like they’re getting caught flat-footed or anything.
And you think Apple is NOT going to have an ipod cell phone because?
This thing has been in the pipe for quite some time.
Security is a major problem on windows networks. That is incontestable.
But heres the thing – I remember having almost exactly the same problems on old macintosh networks – anyone remember that really nasty worm back in 97? At the time I had a few graphics shops under my watch – and let me tell you – the stuff Ive learned trying to keep PCs from exploding on their users and spilling corporate and private credit information out onto the internet would have been really handy to have on that Mac network…
Security rules for PC networks still apply to mac networks – you just have different services/apps to watch out for – and not so many worms (all pretty much using the same 5 or 6 vulnerabilities that have been patched for … well… in some cases years)
The apparent security of an apple platform isnt going attract say – an investment bank – toward investing in the platform. Its not so much that it couldnt be done its just that it wont. Most large businesses are more concerned with other things that limit the introduction of the macintosh such as application availability, management tools, and well – ease of development.
If you want to kill the PC – kill the development tools that MS and others support – they are amazing – and can generate pretty sweet applications on a tight budget under time and under cost…
If Microsoft killed off the entire Macintosh Business Unit today, the effects really wouldn’t be felt for two or three years, maybe as much as five years. See, Microsoft Office 2004 is already out there. It reads and writes all the Office file formats. Yes, Microsoft could (and probably would) change the file format at any time, but in doing so they’d create a huge headache for their own installed base of customers. It’d probably take half a decade for the new file format to be a factor. After all, there’s still a lot of Office 97 out there.
So I hope John Dvorak is right
Oh, Steven. You may as well hope that the clouds turn to butter and fall from the sky. Dvorak is an industrial-strength fool.
Losing MS Office support certainly would be painful to Apple. Not “Certain Doom”, but “Significant Anguish”. The first question I get from people thinking about buying an Apple as a home pc is “will I be able to open and work on my documents from work?” Inevitably those documents are Word, Excel, or Powerpoint.
The way around any sort of Microsoft “extortion” is to give your hardware and OS the ability to run Windows software seamlessly. If you could throw a Windows version of office on your xMac that would be…well it’d be dandy.
Microsoft is converting all the Office apps to XML format in the next major revision (I’ve no idea why; it makes so much sense, it can’t be a Microsoft idea), so MS format may not be such a bugaboo going forward like it’s been for the last 15 years.
If nothing else, easy file compatibility could help make an expanded version of Apple’s iWork suite a reasonable substitute for Office in the future.
TO: Stephen Green
RE: What To Do?
With Power Macs?
Answer: Any number of things.
[1] Donate to charities.
[2] Sell to organizations that refurbish and sell them to third-world countries.
[3] Slide them off to other activities. This is my favorite. I’ve got old Macs doing all kinds of other things. Including playing old games that I loved but no one bothered to bring up to the new plateau. Not to mention recovering archived files that cannot be recovered under the current regime.
As for Office…that POS may be the ‘world standard’, but as your momma said, “If the rest of the world is jumping off a cliff, would you join them?”
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[In the world...not of it.]
TO: bender
RE: Security Issues
“Security is a major problem on windows networks. That is incontestable.” — bender
That’s a problem with their OS. Not their hardware.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[When Microsoft finally makes a product that doesn't suck, it'll be a vacuum cleaner.]
If Microsoft pulled Office for Mac, two things would happen:
1) Apple would release iOffice or some such, just like they did with Safari when MS stopped developing IE:mac.
2) The core user base of Apple’s products wouldn’t care. We’re entertainment gurus, not accountants.
No OfficeX won’t spell doom for Apple, but using Intel processors just might. It’s going to be interesting to see exactly how the user base, and altivec-using software vendors react.
My own reaction has been less than rosy, but it’s not like I can use doze to do my job, nor would if I could.
I doubt Apple would put their software on PC’s. They make too much money on their hardware. 30″ widescreen LCD anyone? Only $3200.
Of course, that 30″ screen will work on any computer that’s got the graphics oomph to drive it. It’s not specific to the Mac.
TO: Mr. Lion
RE: iOffice
“Apple would release iOffice or some such, just like they did with Safari when MS stopped developing IE:mac.” — Mr. Lion
Apple stopped that back when it took the $150M from Bill Gates.
AppleWorks, I suspect a version I didn’t get to see, was a serious contender for replacing Office at US WEST (the RBOC/Baby Bell for the western third of the US, less California and Nevada).
When the deal was announced, suddenly the IT types stopped talking about AppleWorks for every computer in the company.
I’m sure they could touch it up and roll out a product that would blow Microsoft Office half-way to Alpha Centari….if you’re a B5 fan.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
As luck would have it, I had an expensive new Powerbook enroute as the rumors started flying last Friday. MacMall said I can refuse delivery, which is my plan.
I figure I can always decide to buy it in a few weeks — for much less.
Kathleen
Why do you think it will be cheaper in a few weeks, Kathleen? Apple hasn’t announced any price changes, and certainly won’t do so based on their past decisions.
“Apple stopped that back when it took the $150M from Bill Gates.” – Chuck Pelton
Microsoft hasn’t been an investor in Apple for many years. They sold their non-voting shares for a huge profit.
As far as we know now, Apple is under no obligation to avoid competing with MS-Office. Actually, we have evidence to the contrary otherwise there would be no such thing as Keynote (PowerPoint) or Pages (Word).
Dell: P4, 19″ LCD etc etc 699.
Apple: P4, 19″ LCD etc etc 1799.
98% of Consumers: Dell please.
Sucker: Apple please.
Wow. Bruce isn’t a fuckoff at all, is he?
But heres the thing – I remember having almost exactly the same problems on old macintosh networks – anyone remember that really nasty worm back in 97?
What, the Autostart worm?
Yeah, I remember it. ’98, not ’97. It wasn’t a big deal- I noticed some odd network activity on the server, ran Etherpeek for ~15 mins, determined which machine was infected, manually deleted the worm, and removed it from my server partitions.
It was an interesting way to spend an afternoon, but that’s about it.
Apple would be kinda’ nuts not to develop an emulated Win32 library so that Windows apps like Office would run without change under MacOs XI. And the emulated apps would run at native speeds on the x86 chip architecture.
If Apple doesn’t do it, Connectix or some bright teenage hackers will.
I’m hearing rumors that it might be possible to boot windows on the thing. Not that I’d want to for anything other than a few slightly obscure games….
I’m a Mac only guy because, well, I’m an artist (Musician: All university edumacated with post graduate degree and everything), not a “sucker” as Bruce must think. I like having Office X for opening Word docs that people send me from time to time, but it wouldn’t be a tragedy if I couldn’t use it (Didn’t my old OS 9 Mac document program open Word docs though? I removed OS 9 from all my Macs, so I can’t even remember now). Probably used PowerPoint to view a couple of attatchments I’ve gotten over the years, but I don’t think I’ve ever even OPENED Excel (I really don’t understand the concept of a “spreadsheet”; have no idea why anybody would want or need one, just know I don’t).
I often make the comparison between Harley Davidson and BMW motorcycles (I own two Beemers, natch): Everybody without an imagination and who can’t really ride jumps on the PC/Harley bandwagon and gets something that is unreliable and crashes when the corners get tight. Real motorcyclists who can actually RIDE are the BMW/Mac guys who get a sophisticated machine that is reliable and handles beautifully. The only fault with that comparo is that Harleys are ridiculously overpriced and PC’s are as cheap as the dirt they are.
I’m just glad I put off buying that fully loaded Mini I’ve been wanting. My old Cube (Massively upgraded over the years) and 23″ Cinema HD Display will just have to soldier on until 2007 (Not a bad life for a vintage 1999 computer!).
They still make bitchin’ tube gear!
So they can’t be that bad…
I expect some nice price cuts as the first Intels near release. What Apple has done in the past doesn’t really apply. Folks will hold off buying Apples until the new machines start coming out, and Apple will need to move out the old inventory. Ergo price cuts.
And Rosignol: I don’t want to dual boot Windows. I want to run Windows programs under OSX. Pull a Rosetta style deal with them. Hey I can dream.
I predict that Apple will be abandoning OS X in a couple of years and become a Linux house.
Bruce must be one of those 98% if folks who haven’t figured out that you get what you pay for. Your $699 Dell will:
1. Be running XP. (and probably XP Home at that. Ick.)
2. Look like, well a Dell. Hope you don’t mind cables.
3. Have no iLife suite.
4. More than likely (I did this exercise a while back and it was true then) have no DVD burner, less memory, smaller hard drive, no firewire.
5. Not include the $200 or so worth of security software you’ll need with XP.
6. That 19″ Dell monitor won’t look like a 20″ Apple monitor. I’ve seen both next to each other.
7. Did I mention that it will be running XP and not OS X?
By the time you add the upgrades needed to make the comparison fair, the price difference is probably less than $200. And Dude, you’re still just getting a Dell. With XP.
Ah, Mac users, probably the primary reason I never have and never will own a Mac.
Tom says
“never have and never will own a Mac”.
That’s another reason why the comparison is specious. Not only do most Wintel users not realize you get what you pay for, they don’t really know what they’re missing. They haven’t bothered to look. All they have to go on is price. You can buy a lot of poor quality stuff that way (I’ve done it, believe me).
No insult to Windows users is intended, it’s just the constant resort to bottom line price without further consideration that seems dumb. You wouldn’t buy a house or car that way would you? But it seems like 90% of the PC buyers write off the Mac because of price without looking further.
I no longer buy Windows computers myself, but I use XP every stinking day for 8 hours or more, thanks to my employer, and I’ve done that with some flavor of Windows for over 10 years. I still have Wintel boxes in my home. I know both platforms very, very well. I believe my opinion is backed up by actual experience.
I hear VERY few cases of people who use both platforms daily that prefer Windows. Well, none actually.
Going back to Stephen’s original point: I hardly think Office leaving the Mac will happen because Microsoft makes a lot of money selling it, and there is no other commercial competitor. At the same time, most Mac users probably aren’t doing serious Office type stuff. Besides, if Apple can pull out a fully formed Intel version of OS X without it being widely known, they could pull out an Office killer too. Actually, a spreadsheet is all they need. I bet it exists somewhere, just waiting for the day that Bill takes his ball and goes home.
Wow. People still get shirty when you you point out that they squandered an unnecessary 1200$.
Get real cult members.
Computers are commodities. $399 will get you a Dell with a 17″ LCD this week.
For 399$ you could buy nothing from Apple. Ok. Maybe an iPod.
I look forward to the Apple benchmarks insisting that an Apple P4 is faster than a Windows P4 because the Apple case is prettier.
“That 19″ Dell monitor won’t look like a 20″ Apple monitor.”
Well … Dell’s 24″ widescreen is better than Apples 23″ widescreen and 300$ cheaper.
But go ahead. Pay the Apple tax.
Bruce, don’t be an ass.
This comment thread didn’t start out as (yet another) PC vs Mac flame war – until you showed up.
Being an ass here is for me to do; that’s why I pay for the bandwidth.
What has clearly driven this decision is that Apple has acknowledged that IBM isn’t going to produce a G5 with low enough power and heat to get into a laptop any time soon. The G4 laptops are now clearly trailing the Intel world in power, and they have maybe another year left in them before this is obvious to everyone. In addition, the Pentium M has raised the bar somewhat: Windows laptops are sleeker and lighter then they were a year or two back when they were typically running mobile Pentium 4s. This means that even if IBM can produce a G5 that will fit into a laptop, it is going to be a more power hungry and hotter chip than the Pentium M and Apple is probably going to have difficulty matching (say) the nicest Sony and Fujitsu laptops in terms of style. (And even Dell is getting better in this regard – the Inspiron 700m is quite a nicely designed machine). And all this is happening at a time when laptops are becoming a steadily greater portion of the entire PC market, and when Apple is a company that traditionally makes nice laptops.
In the desktop and workstation market, Apple was in far less trouble. The G5 is pretty competitive. Yes, it isn’t running as fast by now as Steve Jobs may have hoped a couple of years back, but the Pentium 4 isn’t running nearly as fast as Intel had hoped either, so there is no huge problem there. The G5 was good for three or four more years on the desktop if Apple waned to play it that way.
But there was clearly an imminent laptop crisis. And Apple is jumping to try to avoid it. If it had to happen at some point, now is not such a bad time. At this point in time OS X is clearly a much better operating system than Windows. Post Longhorn this might not be the case. (Or it might – right now we don’t know).
I think what does scare Apple is that most other portable music players support the Windows Media Audio (.WMA) format, and most of the competing online download music stores will offer .WMA downloads. Yahoo’s new online music store uses the .WMA format, and if other online music stores follow suit Apple will either have to allow the playback of .WMA files on the iPod or I can just see the Yahoo music store start getting exclusives on certain very popular artists and that could drive Apple nuts.