Robert Gibbs – 1991 North Carolina State BA in poli sci (that’s it for the education indicated on his Wikipedia entry) – is the latest political operative to be seriously questioned on the metastasizing Climategate scandal. Of course, the man happens to be White House Press Secretary, so his response should be of some moment. But Gibbs’ first instinct was to hide behind Director of White House Environment and Climate Change Policy Carol Browner – herself an English major – who has insisted AGW is settled science because thousands of scientists said so – an inane argument in itself. When a reporter noted that thousands of scientists disagreed, Gibbs basically stamped his foot and insisted “I think there’s no real scientific basis for the dispute of this,” – as if this man would know in a million years.
At least during the Middle Ages the public discourse on scientific/religious disputes was held by intelligent people (or mostly). This was ridiculous, as you can see for yourself in the video below. In a way I pity poor Gibbs, because if ever a man was over his head, he is here. He probably believes AGW settled science, but who knows? Who knows what anyone believes these days? So much money and time has been invested. And we all know how unwilling most people are to back down anyway, except for, evidently, Obama’s Science Czar John Holdren who warned in 1971 that a new “Ice Age” was coming. “Ice Age” then, “Hot Spell” now. As John Belushi used to say, “Do the Locomotion.” Meanwhile, on this video, Gibbs seems more like a deer in the proverbial headlights explaining what the administration hopes to achieve in Copenhagen. Maybe he should have spent the time “Doing the Locomotion.” Now there’s a thought. (Hey, he could be the next Belushi.)
UPDATE: The Washington Times has the startling news that Gore has decided not to attend the Copenhagen conference. (Sother surprises in second half of article>)
And speaking of the Locomotion, just for the memories….
This is where Robert Gibbs argument has absolutly no merit, when he says that thousands of scientists agree on global warming, he seems to be forgetting that if the hacked emails are authentic, these scientists would have been baseing there hypothesis on flawed and or manipulated data. Therefore there hypothisis would be wrong. I don’t understand how the White House can simply blow off such damning evidence. The scientific community needs to demand a serious independant investigation into the matter prior to any more globe changing treaties are signed. The world leaders must take a step back, and make absolutly sure that they havent been the victims of some very treasonous activity.
As sadistic and UN-ladylike as what I’m about to write sounds, here’s a little fantasy of mine:
Another Belushi? Nevvah!
And, does Gibbsy-boi even keep up with the current news? Cripes! These tards are never prepared for semi-tough but fairly obvious questions.
These are the people who didn’t take math or science and they are trying to explain things to people who did. It will never work but, maybe if they hurry, they can spend some more money before the general public figures it out.
Intellectual curiosity dies when it becomes more important to advance political opportunism, than it is to advance the truth.
This does seem more and more like the West’s version of the Lysenko genetics scandal in the Soviet Union during the 1940s and early 50s. The only difference, I suppose, is that this attempt to game the scientific results to meet already-decided-upon theories is a little more bottom-up than top-down, as it was in Stalin’s Russia.
Gibbs’response makes sense when you accept that the Whitehouse does not care about science or facts. It makes sense when you see that they are on a mission to expand government power at the expense of individual liberty. Any pretext will do. And if the pretext is revealed as fraud, just smile and keep marching. That is what the Whitehouse is doing. Who dares to stop them?
It is understandable that many people have latched on to the emails, but in their defense the people at CRU indicate that the emails are ‘without context’ or somehow ‘normal banter’ in a scientific institution.
The program code however is different.
It is the actual program code, the modeling code that contains the most damaging evidence. I am not talking about the ‘comments’ in the code but rather the actual computer program source code itself.
Unlike comments and emails the computer code can only be interpreted in one way. Unlike the comments and the emails the computer code is whole unto it self and requires no external context.
So now everyone has the code.
However now CRU have somehow ‘lost’ the world’s raw climate data that they used in their modeling.
It may have been necessary for them to have lost the raw temperature data. If the raw temperature data was available then they might be asked to reproduce Exactly The Same Results, in front of skeptical witnesses, as they had used in their peer-reviewed publications that were distributed to the world. This might have been impossible without using some infected modeling code, which an investigating scientist might discover.
If the results can not be reproduced the paper that used the results should be withdrawn. Then every paper that cited that paper, and so on until the whole web of pseudo-science that can be traced back to the original fabrication has been purged from the libraries
It is not scientific unless an independent body can reproduce the results.
For information on the possible code infection see:
Anthropogenic Global Warming Virus Alert.
http://www.thespoof.com/news/spoof.cfm?headline=s5i64103
Lies, damned lies, and statistics.
The falsification of data and the conspiracy to commit same etc, constitutes serious criminal activity. Further, the granting of public funds for research warrants a federal investigation. I’m hoping the perpetrators, including possibly Professor Michael Mann, director of Pennsylvania State University’s Earth System Science Centre and a regular contributor to the popular climate science blog Real Climate, and their facilitators will be tracked down and prosecuted to the fullest extent the law allows. — Michael Santomauro
What do you think the empty Nobel was for? Just as we couldn’t stop Bush from marching off to war based on faulty intel.. Obama will do the same.. His friends and core supporters have all cashed their cheques.. Best we can do is make the president of the planet earth a one term President and rip up his climate change dog and pony show..
I don’t understand how can anyone say that the email contents is normal talk among scientists. I’m nearing retirement on that activity (a few more weeks), and in my professional life I would have blushed and be disgusted with myself if I had just accidentally _thought_ what these guys wrote down.
What is it about leftists that they all seem to read the same playbook? How is it that there can be such uniformity of thought about AGW? Are they that stupid or just like-minded about wanting to bring down capitalism and create a world government? I am not sure how to see trading tin for gold as good intentions.
Does anyone remember the mini series “V”. It was about an alien invasion. One off the side plots in the show was how the aliens railroaded any scientists that disagreed with how things were being run and soon all scientists were seen by humans as criminals and then hunted down like dogs and put in prison for their crimes against humanity. The only difference in our reality is these scientists(not all of them) have committed crimes against humanity and should be hunted down like dogs and thrown in prison. People have to literally stop buying into green BS to stop all this and elect reps that do not believe in climate change. We should take care of our planet and it can be done by applying common sense.
They knew all along it was based on bogus science.. Why should they care now.. Bribe the 3rd world with trillions for their support.. Get all their commie sleepers into key posts.. tap into the overt leftism in our universities.. Appeal to the bitter liberals (Bush) in the MSM.. and you got world government.. sad our standard of living is heading for the toilet with the cost of living going up by 1/3rd..
The Democratic Party politicians and the atheistic secularist have been building up this lie for decades, to enable them to redistribute wealth from the United States to other nations.
What many poor Democratic Party constituents/voters believe was a redistribution of wealth “within” the U.S. from the rich to the less rich…the world is full of gullible people who are more than willing to take others hard earned money, but it is almost poetic justice to see these Democratic Party voters/constituents money go out of their paychecks/banking accounts and tax refunds to be “redistributed” outside of the United States.
What a bunch of uneducated non-critical thinking U.S. citizens we have been grooming in our socialist public schools for three generations now. Way to go, NEA.
Horrendously disruptive global warming happens every year in the world….it’s called SUMMER…when the cold chill of Winter gives way to the Warmth of summer. If I’m not mistaken, the only people who regret the suddenly onslaught of this global warming are skiers, snowboarders, and people who make money supplying heating oil for homes. Most of us are quite happy to have things a LOT warmer. So, overall, if the Summer and Winter warm up a bit, what’s the harm? I’m from Wisconsin where it swings from as low as -50F in the Winter to a hot and humid 100+ in the Summer, and back again in the Winter…a swing every year of as much as 150 degrees. If we can survive the twice yearly change from Winter to Summer, surely we can survive an overall increase of a degree or so…regardless if it’s caused by man, the Sun, or aliens like Robert Gibbs. It’s called “adaptation” and mankind has been doing it for many millenia.
A 21st Century Psalm
December 7th is coming fast
We must act, before Copenhagen is passed
If that Treaty is law I guarantee
Another occurrence of infamy
As they strip away democracy
We wish to debate the natural state
It was warm for awhile, but cold as of late
The scientist tried to hide the decline
Deny debate through deceit and design
The science was settled and the data deleted
All opposition was effectively defeated
From checking the facts, and results repeated
Who could prove the science was cheated
Man Made Global Warming is a lie
The CRU e-mails and codes do testify
The purpose, a Carbon Debt to apply
Kiss your money, technology and freedom goodbye
The silence is deafening across the land
As the revelations the public now understands
The weathers a carrot meant to disguise
A corrupt agenda before our eyes
And now we see light shining in Truth
Politicians, media, and search engines declare moot
You can glimpse the extent of the hypocrisy
In how they declare there is nothing to see
So much for transparency
Climategate Googlegate Copenhagengate
Who gave you permission to decide our fate?
Censoring discussion denying debate
The Spirit of Truth you desecrate
In all debate Truth intervenes
Asks does the end justify the means?
Demands that honesty remains supreme
That commitments aren’t made on fraudulent schemes.
It’s time for the passive acceptance to end
It’s time to stand for freedom as free men
It’s time to expose the lies and deceit
It’s time to take it to the streets
Do not commit sedition do not get jailed
Non-Violent revolutions do not fail
The voice of the Prophets, Gandhi and King
Are calling for you to get marching
Or just sit back and take the vaccine.
Either way Obama is in trouble.. Push it through and he will lose the next election and keep his friends.. Stop it and he will lose the mext election and lose his friends.. He has dinner parties and meal tickets to think of.. He has his Nobel for nothing tucked under his arm and he knows his leftist friends will take good care of him.. Expecting him to see the light when he is so far undergrond that it looks like a distant dim star..
Like I said the nect election will be our chance to make things right..
Does anyone else find it fascinating that these guys ridicule Religious belief because of lack of scientific evidence and yet their own political DOGMA will not allow them to see the fraud that has occurred. Anything to get there way and if I heard Mr. Gibbs correctly the administration does not intend to use any current evidence in making his decision. So who is simple now?
Roger – “Whaddaya want” from poor Gibbs; we all know he’s in over he’s head, but then so’s his boss.
Andrew @#7 – I think you are being too kind to these “scientists.” I think the e-mail go beyond normal banter. Your comments on the code are well appreciated. They also got me to thinking that if other climatologists were using their bogus “massaged” data because the original data set was unavailable, it would not be surprising that there is a “consensus” on AGW. AS for Ms. Browner, who thinks science is a popularity contest, she needs to enquire as to why 2,500 “scientists” think there is AGW. They might have all been using the same bogus data set, in which case here 2,500 are really zero.
I think the point of all this, is easy to miss.
When you have a fake construct, finding out that the foundation is built on a pile of shifting sand doesn’t change the game. The game was never to find the truth, nor…really…to look for it.
The game is, was and always will be to act the scold to the “bitter clingers”. To be morally exalted on the altar of utopian schoolmarmism.
To be the SuperNanny.
Our dear legacy media has proven time and again that the truth is an irrelevance…and being found out…time and again, is of no consequence. They don’t care if you unveil every distortion, they don’t care if they go broke continuing to shill for “the message”.
Denial is not even a matter of degree, it is an absolute with this crowd.
You could catch them standing over a body with powder burns on their hands, blood spattered on their shirts and a smoking gun in their hands and they will not only tell you that your are wrong, but that you are a crazy, racist, homophobic, right wing zealot, for even THINKING that they did the crime.
It’s not about catching them. It’s about making the charges stick. It’s about finding a jury of our peers…our countrymen and convincing them that the New Big Lie is so widespread, it covers every aspect of our lives.
It’s about our crooked and corrupt information stream. Global Warming is a trifling issue compared to the whole of it. (not in a vacuum, of course…but as a small piece of the larger scam)
If we don’t address the larger issue, they will keep escaping, like Houdini, from the “being found out” on the individual issues.
This is simply another example, lie…get caught…then look us straight in the eye and say WE are the ones with the problem.
Bondservant, that is an awesome poem! I’ll spread it far and wide, but I hope you put it on YouTube with a few pretty pictures, and maybe some music. Do NOT miss the song for those of us who have been awake for soooo long and are glad to see all these sheeples waking up:
“Hide the Decline”: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEiLgbBGKVk
This present White House is a partner with anti-capitalist, anti-western, anti-western religious groups, to turn this nation into a subservient society on a par with all other 3rd world subservient societies. Check out http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/Boo2WZSIHI for another take on the reality we are facing today.
It’s now time for the public, generally, to conclude that politicians who continue to speak in the gibberish of Anthropogenic Climate Change are much too stupid to hold public office and relieve them of this burden
SUPERLATIVE post, Roger!
Next time someone tries to lecture you about your carbon footprint ask them what is the first order differential equation that determines the temperature of the earth? When they give you a blank look explain to them the hazards of believing in something they don’t understand. Then tell them the rate of change of temperature times the heat capacity of the earth equals the incoming solar radiation less the outbound thermal radiation. Ironically the same equation has the identical form as the one that describes the rate of change of dampness if you wet your pants worrying about something that ain’t gonna happen.
This is consistent with the Obama doctrine; say anything you want as if it’s a fact; ridicule the questioner when you get caught.
Many of us have been saying this was all rubbish for years. On behalf of every one of us I offer a big, fat, “I told you so”.
AGW or GloBULL warming is about population control – liberals, socialists, marxists, Obama-wannabees all want the same thing. To tell you how to live, while they squeeze the people on this planet til they are dead.
There are good and sound reasons to more aggressively expand the use of alternative energy in a measured and responsible way that would get a great deal of support. What is most frustrating isn’t the idea that global warming is still up for debate, but that those who contend it is not absolutely insist that the consequences of not imposing draconian solutions are dire and without historical precedence. Common sense informs most thinking people that, 1. This is likely not the case, and, 2. Even if it were there is no easy way to address the issue in a fundamental way within a timeframe short of decades.
Supporters of stronger action who simply believe that global warming is absolutely proven science without dispute will obviously ignore all evidence that might challenge thier beliefs, making it akin to religion. What is laughable is that many of these same individuals are those who oppose projects like windmills off Cape Cod or giant solar projects in the southwestern deserts based on a different set of environmental concerns. To say the least, they also oppose nuclear energy because, well, it’s nuclear. You might think these folks are ready to live in caves, but actually you can often see them driving their SUVs in the Hamptons or Cape Cod itself adorned with Save The Planet and Obama/Biden bumper stickers.
Gibbs is an entertainer of the far left. He has NO credibility, credentials, or character (other than that which Axelrod accedes.
What a waste of perfectly good saltwater.
Oh for the middle ages. And more English majors
“…she needs to enquire as to why 2,500 “scientists” think there is AGW.”
Follow the money. The scientists pushing the global warming agenda are very well paid. They possess large bank accounts and most assuredly are heavily invested in green technology stocks. Dissenters have usually had their careers destroyed. There is another question that should not be avoided: is this intellectual corruption the norm in other academic disciplines—especially in the softer sciences?
AGW is a farse, hoax, and plain old power grab that needs to be stopped. Any politician that voted for the Cap and Trade bill in the House of Reps needs to be voted out of office. And, by the way, Robert Gibbs reminds me of “Baghdad Bob” of Gulf War I….lol.
Obama and his team care nothing for fact, truth, science, logic. They care only for the narrative of their own agenda, no matter baseless or even just plain false. These are the worst people to ever occupy the whitehouse, and that is really saying something…..
When the scientists on the Lewis and Clark expedition returned to Jefferson they didn’t tell him about the big bears and pretty flowers they saw. No, they shot the bears and picked the flowers and paddled them up rivers, carried them over mountains and brought their data back with them. For proof.
And I am to believe that in this age where all the data could have been digitally stored in a suitcase that today’s scientists had to throw out their data “to save space”?
Really?
How many times do we have to go over this??? It’s George Bush’s fault. The data, the peer review, the hacks, CO2, and global warming itself.
This article is perfectly Named, The White House Stonewalls with Stupidity, Now did anyone here expect different. This is the most arrogant administration I have ever seen or heard of. They tell us we know whats best for you and we can fix the problems, things get worse, they say no no were doing the right thing, and things still get worse.
Climategate, Healthcare, Cap and Trade, Stimulous, All failures or doomed to fail, Trillions spent, and still things get worse. When do we say enough.
If the law is in your favor, argue the law. If the facts are in your favor, argue the facts. If neither the law nor the facts support you, call your opposition names.
This explains Obama and his radical associates.
Real scientists don’t act like in Climategate. Nor does a real President.
Political correctness is in! Facts, Truth or Common Sense plays no role in our society today. Climate change is just 1 more left wing plot to exert control by the smart and elite over the common masses!
As an astute commenter on another site noted, there’s an easy way to tell politics from science.
Quantum Physics is a theory.
Relativity is a theory.
Evolution is a theory.
But “AGW is settled science” and “the debate between capitalism and socialism is over.”
None of the pols REALLY thinks AGW is all that much of a threat. No, the pols stand behind AGW because it’s a perfect issue to fear-monger on; a way to get people to contribute to your campaign and to get out the vote. And even more importantly, it’s a BEAUTIFUL pretext for a massive tax hike. Anybody wonder why virtually none of the $650B in new taxes to be raised by Cap & Trade goes to fund clean energy R&D, or windmills, or…basically…anything to do with stopping climate change? Noooo….the majority of the $650B is earmarked to fund Obamacare. How ’bout that!!
By coincidence, North Carolina State U is where Rajendra Pachauri, the head of the IPCC, did all his education.
His last sentence sums it all up, “There is no real scientific bases for the dispute of this”. What??? If there was no real scientific bases for the dispute of this, then the models that have been predicting warmer temps for the last 10 years would have been correct. Instead the models have NOT been correctly predicting the lower temps, so the models are flawed; meaning that the science is flawed. I’m not a scientist, but I am a computer scientist and garbage in/garbage out is very applicable here. If you are making up the data and not getting good numbers, it doesn’t matter what the output says, it is worthless.
I knew for years that the co2 stuff was total BS. There was and is tons of evident pointing to other more powerful factors and these factors are all natural. I remember during the election on CNN Campell Brown started going down a list of Palin beliefs. When she got to global warming Campell said, we all know that there is global warming so we will not even go into this one. This was soooo irritating and dismissive. Now I see next to zero coverage of this topic. I would like to see it covered more on FOX even! This is one of the biggest stories ever and it is being ignored.
We all knew this was a swizz to start out with. Wasnt NASA caught rigging the temperature data a few years ago? The Aussies did a six year study trying to verify the mechanism—HOW carbon dioxide affects climate—and came to the conclusion that it didnt. People with ‘settled science’ are eager to debate and eager for their data to be public but from the beginning the Warming Weasels have refused to debate or produce the data that their conclusions are based on and have conducted a McCarthyite purge against anyone in the scientific community who had the temerity to disagree with the party line. Why did they have to fake half the names of scientists on the IPCC report? The fact is that a ‘settled science’ that so perfectly serves a political motive should be doubly suspicious. The proof is that even with the science under fire the Obamunists are steaming full speed ahead with their redistributionistic plans. If we dont cough up and pay we’ll die in a giant tidal wave. Yeah right.
The administration’s reaction to the collapse of the great global warming scam would be comical but for the fact that trillions of dollars and our basic liberties are still at risk from the warm-mongers.
What i heard Gibbs say is that several thousand scientists agree there is Climate Change and that that isn’t in dispute!
Huh!?!?
REALLY, the climate changes!??!
WOW
Hard to believe.
Its not even the argument.
This whole issue continues to morph, like Health Care Reform to Health Insurance Reform.
Soon it will be “possible Global Warming Maybe casude in part by US and possibly reversible if we give up our way of life”!
This is so stupid, the discourse of fools.
The earth is warming; the arctic has just had 4 or 5 consecutive years of record low summer ice. Or do you think that is not real either?
But everyone here thinks it’s a plot.
To falsify or manipulate data is called fraud. If this were to happen in a Univeristy or corporate setting, they would be fired and discredited for the rest of their “scientific” careers. Only with the lunny left is it acceptable to falsify data and then attack your accuser. There is no argument, these are not scientist, they are political Hacks with a leftist agenda. They hide behind a falsified vail of science. That the media and others are giving them a pass only adds to future deceit and corruption. As a scientist I am truly ashamed of these individuals. They have done more damage then they can possible comprehend. Global Warming or sorry its now Climate Change crowd(because its obvious that the temps are getting cooler)is akin to the Salem Witch hunts and their masters. As one of my colleages put it “No data, No conclusions” If this data was “lost” then the experiment/model cannot be independently verified, then it is settle science, start over. No scientist worth is degree will accept a paper or theory without the data to back his conclusions. SO SORRY AL.
Let us use Occam’s Razor.
Politicians’ rhetoric misdirects our attention, thus enabling an age-old agenda. These masked men, if not fairly evaluated post-term (as in Athens via “euthunai” (lit. straightenings)) will never divulge hidden agendas. Mass media covers them up because they share a common set of interests. Money = power = more money.
Who benefits? Recipients of grants-in-aid,
corporate grifters, racketeers in suits, pseudo-scientific corporateurs covering up the move- ment of vast amounts of public money into
the private production of useless paper and real cash into hidden bank accounts; a white-collar mob, i.e., the “overworld,” which is a semi-legitimized arm of an unrecognized, global underworld, free of restraint.
When Bush 2.0 gave us an even grander debacle than the S&L catatrophe, our press fails to connect the dots. Oil money diverted into
corporate entities (Carlyle, Blackwater, Halli-
burton, et. al) is pay-off for mismanagement.
Obama? Chicago. Rezko. Illegal immigrant labor legitimized becomes fodder for the “service
industry.” More voters for whoever pays off
our “lawmakers” (lawbreakers).
Lest this end so dismally, let us note, we are once more seeing a cycle of dither that has a precedent. We are shifting from petroleum to
a natural gas-based economy that will disenable Middle Eastern terror, Russian retro-commie blackmail and the Chinese attempt to sequester
all of Africa with floods of unredeemable yuan
in an attempt to keep the Leviathan afloat.
Natgas and lighter alloys will put the US on top after the build-out is complete.
We will re-build our rail system and thus re-chape our cities. Re-invented machine tools will be used to create an agriculture based on saving every drop of water (drought is coming to the Midwest and West, just as in the ’30′s)
and we will shift our aerospace and automotive
design science into carbon-carbon skins in lieu of aluminum and steel. Cermets will be used to
make engines. Malthusian models are wrong. There is plenty to go around. More people means
more brain power. Mass media makes us dumb so the cartels can rule with fear.
Turn off your televisions. Free your minds.
Over at the CBS blog the liberal damage control T-Cells are running amuk. Is the foundation starting to shiver?
I remember toward the end of the Bush administration that questions of his administration “politising” science came up.
Wow!
The Obama administration has simply done away with science.
How do you all like the solf Dictatorship our President is running?
Those “2500 scientists” are another rhetorical gimmick. The reference is to the approx. 2500 members of the IPCC, but only 50 or so are been actual scientists. The rest are politicians, bureaucrats, apparatchiks and activists. Chairman Pachauri is a railroad engineer, fer the luvva Pete!
And those 50-odd scientists have been (with a few honorable exceptions like Lindzen), hand-picked club members, ordained clergy in the Church of AGW. One reason the Climategate files are so damning is because these are the big guns: Jones, Mann, Briffa, Tommy W, Schmidt- these *are* the IPCC scientists, chirpily discussing how they warped and manipulated the reports.
If everyone wants to get rid of these kinds of fraud, vote liberals out of office in the next election by voting conservatives into office.
Bohemond,
Yes, many people not familiar with the facts may not know this. The people involved in the scandalous e-mails would constitute the president, his inner political circle, and the most important cabinet members if this was a washington political scandal. This scandal does not go to the top of man-made global warming proponents, it IS the top. As the Lindzen article in WSJ states, additional CO2 in the atmosphere could reasonably raise global temps by 1 C in the next 100 years, not 4-7 C as proposed by the IPCC or Al Gore.
I now live in the Philippines and it is scary how brainwashed the third world is with this junk science. All the “experts” here have agreed that our active typhoon season this year is due to global warming, er climate change. I hear how we will all be underwater here in a few years unless we “do something”. They cut the power in Manila for an hour to observe “Earth Day”. I feel like a voice crying in the wilderness. I have to hand it to Al Gore, he’s a charlatan without equal in our time, except perhaps for the President.
Delia writes:
“As sadistic and UN-ladylike as what I’m about to write sounds, here’s a little fantasy of mine:”
My fantasy is far more vicious and destructive of Gibbs’ self-esteem and long term self-interest. I want to get into the room with him and question him about climategate. I would have him in tears in five minutes. Same for Browner.
What’s the deal with the media people in the room with Gibbs. Is there some kind of understanding that they must not ask questions that annoy or upset Gibbs? Whatever the answer, those media “professionals” are truly worthless. Yeah, give me five minutes of questions with them too. They would be demoralized – permanently.
Andrew writes:
“It may have been necessary for them to have lost the raw temperature data. If the raw temperature data was available then they might be asked to reproduce Exactly The Same Results, in front of skeptical witnesses, as they had used in their peer-reviewed publications that were distributed to the world. This might have been impossible without using some infected modeling code, which an investigating scientist might discover.”
What a smashing, excellent point. They won’t permit other scientists to attempt to reproduce their results for they very reason that they cannot reproduce their own results. That can only be called science in the pit of hell.
Do not overlook, in the celebration of the discovery of some of the proof that AGW was indeed a conspiracy of liars, that the political portion of the conspiracy meets in Copenhagen next week. At that meeting, representatives of most of the governments in the world, including the U.S. government, will be invited to sign off on a treaty surrendering power to an agency of the United Nations, power to enforce environmental lunacy across the world. That treaty will, if put into effect, create a world government of radical environmental lunatics, socialist tyrants and bureaucratic monstrousness unseen before in human history. Consider if the most extreme proposals to prevent AGW were made law and that law were to be administered by men and women just like those who make up the U.N.’s other agencies. If you doubt what I write, read around about the underlying documents, the pre-conference meetings and the resulting briefing papers for the organizers of Copenhagen. If enough nations sign off on this Copenhagen Treaty to give the U.N. something resembling the military power to enforce it, you can kiss the freedom and independence of the West good-bye. You can say hello to a “1984-style” world so dismal, dull, empoverished and horrible that living in the old Soviet Union as a state prisoner at a Gulag would be an improvement. This is the underlying purpose served by the liars, cheats and tin-horn tyrants: to create a monsterous bureaucracy which cannot be defeated short of war, and they will have the armies. I hope to be wrong, but don’t bet anything you don’t want to lose on me being wrong.
“Garbage in, garbage out” applies not only to Climate Cultists’ phony data, sneaky manipulations, asinine programming techniques, but Briffa, Hansen, Jones, Mann, Trenberth and all the other tapeworms lodged in the body politic, their rancid little coterie.
Science as a philosophy of the objective natural world, an empirical method of falsifying hypotheses, above all as a social endeavor charged with replicating results by recourse to panels of knowledgeable experts in a given field, will not be impugned but revivified by this debacle. When journals such as “Nature” and “Science” adhere to their own policies and procedures; when scientists themselves conduct experiments in all humility for submission to skeptical third-party review, “science” will resume its course.
Climategate is a late-blooming Boomer phenomenon, characteristic of the spoiled-brat generation born 1945 through 1964. No art, no music, very little writing, extraordinarily self-destructive collectivist Statist politics, and now a twenty-year Junk Science project worthy of J.B. Rhine, Trofim Lysenko, Immanuel Velikhovsky– as these Entitlement Drones turn 65 next year, they will discover that no-one owes them anything, and that no-one cares. But– you promised!
Grow up, guys, now that it’s too late.
It is dismaying how little the scientific method is referred to in this debate. Consider the fundamentals. The AGW people propose this hypothesis: Human-generated carbon dioxide is causing the Earth to warm at such a rate that catastrophe will result. There are three opposing hypotheses. First, the observed warming and cooling is within the normal and natural temperature fluctuations of climate. Second, even if the secular trend of temperature is upward, the rate is so gradual that no catastrophe will happen. Third, changes in Earth’s temperature are not caused by human activity, but by the same natural forces that have caused hundreds of temperature changes throughout Earth’s history.
All three of the opposing hypotheses must be proven false in order to accept the AGW hypothesis. Otherwise it makes no sense to adopt expensive and difficult policies to limit carbon dioxide production. The burden of proof is always on those asserting a new theory, in this case, the AGW hypothesis (despite the insistence of AGW hysterics that their new theory is true unless someone proves otherwise; that is the opposite of the scientific method). Passionate belief does not qualify as scientific proof.
All of the CRU’s work to date addresses the first two opposing hypotheses, and this effort is undermined by the emails. There is no, or very little, actual science addressing the third opposing hypothesis. The principle claim of the AGW people is that temperature and human-generated carbon dioxide increase together in their computer models and this proves causality. Sorry, it does not. Correlation is not causation and programming a factor as a causative agent in a model does not prove it to be so. Natural processes that obtained for hundreds of millions of years have not been proven inoperative during the last century. All three opposing hypotheses remain standing. The assertion that the science is settled and the debate is complete is fatuous!
I love the line from one of the top scientists. “We had to dump our data to make room.” When I use up my hard drive I go out and buy another one, maybe even compress the one’s I have. When we’re talking about spending trillions and changing the face of the world wouldn’t you think you would want to be kept in check with your data, unless of course you had an alternative agenda supported by trillions? See it’s not about the money; it’s about POWER and the rules by which to subjugate the entire planet. I could go one but I don’t want to miss another moment to see Mr. Gibbs wiggle his way around the room.
John Blake, as a boomer and an AGW skeptic I’m offended by your comments. I’d like to point out the majority of AGW skeptics are older people who tend to be more conservative with a lot more life experience to call bullshit when they hear it. You might do a little asking around and check who’s fallen head-over-heels in love with AGW – it’s younger people who tend to be idealistic and still have stars in their eyes dreaming of the grand utopia where no has to say they’re sorry. I feel I’m not entitled beyond what I myself have earned through hard work. I’ve had the great good fortune to be born in North America in a free and democratic society. My retirement in 10 years or so will be self-financed through savings. The most entitled and privileged generation is the one just preceding the boomers. They contributed the least to the social programs financing their retirements but will pull out the most. All the boomers I know are fully expecting to receive very little from any government pension schemes. Of course, I speak as a Canadian and your experience in the US will quite likely be different. Sorry for being completely off-topic but this really struck a nerve because I have been campaigning for years to get the truth out about the scam of AGW.
If you check the age range of the climate scammers at CRU you might find they actually fall into the Gen X age bracket.
Roger, that was my take too: Look who’s a maven. How anyone can take this mumbling fool seriously is beyond me; but I do think his, and O’s, sun is setting.
Good article, good points made. But…”proverbial headlights”?
Just say deer in headlights, we will understand the meaning.
Gibbs is a moron, and very annoying at that.
Trafamadore 48 sounds like another English Major citing a superficial statistic. As Plimer pointed out in “Heaven and Earth” the Antarctic continent is cooling as the Arctic warms–and that climate history shows that it is usual for one pole to warm while the other cools. Antarctica is adding ice. Arctic sea ice is melting but this does not contribute to rising oceans as melting of floating ice has no impact on ocean levels. Only melting of land based ice can raise ocean levels. I wish all politicians would read Plimer.
Bottom line.
If warming is occurring it is probably not man-caused and there is nothing we can do about it.
Earth may or may not be warming but we should want it to warm.
A warmer earth is more livable and favorable to humans, plant life and animal life.
I’m a retired engineer not a scientist. I’m also a Ham radio operator and know radio frequency propagation is largely a function of sunspot activity. During the late ’80′s and early 90′s propagation was great. It was also a very active sunspot cycle. That’s also when the global warming alarm started. The past eleven years, radio propagation has sucked, mostly due to one of the least active sunspot cycles on record. Funny that the earth seems to have been cooling around the same time. Coincidence? I think not. To paraphrase the ragin’ Cajun “It’s the Sun Stupid!”
Interesting to see the way of the world just before Climategate broke. Please see:
http://thinkprogress.org/2009/11/18/palin-global-warming-limbaugh/
Palin was exactly right. Snake oil science indeed! Read on into the comments below. It is an eyeopener.
Sure Obama was fooled like millions of others. He trusted the scientists. But there is no excuse now for him to ignore the truth. Palin it seems never was fooled.
Mr. Robert Gibbs, November 30, 2009
White House Press Secretary,
Washington, DC.
Dear Mr. Gibbs.
I understand your recent comment about climate change, which was there’s “no real scientific basis for dispute”, wasn’t based on anything you know or understand personally, having gotten your BA in poli sci from North Carolina State in 1991. So you’re disqualified to make any substantive comment on the science of the topic since you’re not a scientist at all.
But perhaps you went to your administration’s Director of White House Environment and Climate Change Policy—that would be Carol Browner. However, I understand she’s an English major! I’m certain she doesn’t have the credentials to offer anything substantive on the issue either.
If you really said “I think there’s no real scientific basis for the dispute of this”, you’d have to make a public apology, preferably using the same forum in which you made the above statement. Why? Because you aren’t a scientist, and Ms. Browner isn’t a scientist, either. And if you’re relying on the scientists at the UN, you have been duped, sir. They get most of their information from the Hadley CRU at East Anglia. And that’s a big, big problem in light of recent revelations.
I can tell you as a scientist and engineer (BS and MS in geology, BYU and a BS and ME in mining engineering, University of Utah) that there is INDEED scientific basis for dispute of global warming, especially any attempt to stymie civilization based on scientific corruption. There’s absolutely no consensus unless you belong to those Climate Warming Deniers who won’t entertain a single alternative hypothesis to their apocalyptic fairytale. You really shouldn’t be proud of their obfuscation and rape of true science—it will destroy them in the end.
So I’m calling you out on this one, Mr. Gibbs, for lying about the most important issue of my lifetime (and that includes your lifetime, too, since I’m considerably older than you are).
I’m calling on you to apologize to the American people for the stupidest comment ever made from the press secretary’s podium. Why is it the stupidest? Because your statement makes you an accomplice to the fraud that has been found at what used to be the most prestigious climate research center in the world—the Hadley CRU. Of course, that distinction was BEFORE they were found to be some of the most corrupt scientists around. And after Climategate is over, you’ll be looking pretty silly. Wait, you already are.
And once the fraud has been completely uncovered, expect people like you who make statements supporting it to be pursued to the full extent of the law. Perhaps misleading people with distortions and lies doesn’t bother you, but it bothers me, and as a scientist and an engineer, I’m calling you out on this one, Mr. Gibbs.
Thanks for listening,
I think it’s now official: “Climate Science” is the “Women’s Studies” of the scientific community.
“Stupid is as Stupid Does” Forrest…..
I believe that Congress should hold hearings on this – that the scientists involved ought to be put under oath and compelled to explain the apparent FOIA violations and tweaking of the data to determine a result that are described in the emails.
Billions of dollars – much of it from the US taxpayer – have been spent and it appears that fraud was perpetrated. Someone should pay.
Time is getting short and it is coming down to the fact, that soon I will have to pray to the good Lord to maintain our freedoms an not allow our leaders to sign the Copenhagen Treaty, which will take away our liberties, let go and let God-this being a challenge to our Lord and Saviour? However, while there is still time to prevent the loss of a lifetime, perhaps loss of life it’s self – I will do what I am able to fight for our freedoms! The whole Climate change agenda is a proven fraud and racketeering, but the United Nations and Globalist governments don’t care as that is just the excuse instrument they have used to ensnare us! Has everybody out there become a tree hugger? Anyone out there want to fight and maintain their freedom anymore? Please do all you can to preserve freedom in North America!
Check out what Government is doing behind your back at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VebOTc-7shU
To request that PM Harper doesn’t sign the Copenhagen Treaty, thereby causing Canadians to lose
their Sovereignty and Freedom email the PM at: pm@pm.gc.ca
Any lawyers want to help out by filing this Copenhagen Treaty be classified as an illegal Treaty to help save Freedom in North America? ( Unlimited Promotion Opportunity Here For a Law firm to Gain a favorable high profile credibility! )
The last vestage of Enron
Almost two decades before President Barack Obama made “cap-and-trade” for carbon dioxide emissions a household term, an obscure company called Enron — a natural-gas pipeline company that had become a big-time trader in energy commodities — had figured out how to make millions in a cap-and-trade program for sulphur dioxide emissions, thanks to changes in the U.S. government’s Clean Air Act. To the delight of shareholders, Enron’s stock price rose rapidly as it became the major trader in the U.S. government’s $20-billion a year emissions commodity market. Enron Chairman Kenneth Lay, keen to engineer an encore, saw his opportunity when Bill Clinton and Al Gore were inaugurated as president and vice-president in 1993. To capitalize on Al Gore’s interest in global warming, Enron immediately embarked on a massive lobbying effort to develop a trading system for carbon dioxide, working both the Clinton administration and Congress. Political contributions and Enron-funded analyses flowed freely, all geared to demonstrating a looming global catastrophe if carbon dioxide emissions weren’t curbed. An Enron-funded study that dismissed the notion that calamity could come of global warming, meanwhile, was quietly buried.
Carol Browner is just coming off her last job as a board member with APX, a carbon offset trading company.
What took everyone so long to come to the conclusion that I and others did long ago, Al Gore, President Obama, Carol Browner and others all have agendas. They think most of us are too stupid to question this “simple climate-warming bag of nonsense that was spewed. This is one of the reasons why I wasn’t fooled into voting for a silly, communist like Obama. Sorry Al, so much for an inconvenient truth, but then again with this administration, when the truth rears it’s ugly head–simply ignore it or label the really smart people troglidites. Shame on anyone who believed this nonsense of Mr. Gore’s. (He ate too many marijuana-laced cookies).
Lord Monckton has written an indispensible summary of the Climategate revelations so far.
Below is the link:
http://scienceandpublicpolicy.org/images/stories/papers/originals/Monckton-Caught%20Green-Handed%20Climategate%20Scandal.pdf
Compare the “official” graph of New Zeland’s temperature over the last 150 years with a graph of the raw data. This could be the reason the CRU trashed it’s raw data files.
The search engines seem to be part of it. As I understand it, they can be “paid” to move your search entry to the start of the search when you search for things like “climategate” or “global climate hoax”. I’m sure that paying them off is a pricey way to try to control public opinion but it is pretty clear that George Soros and his ilk are playing for keeps to rob us of what little liberty we have left.
I suggest you read the titles clearly because some of the warming propaganda is entitled in such a way that you might think it is providing the information you want but giving you a drawn out article that repeats the warming mantra.
At the end of the day it is all about integrity, and I have seen very, very little integrity evident here. First the CRU gang is exposed for the unethical thugs that they are, then their database and crappy fortran code is shown to be a very poor representation of “climate science” and lastly, to cover up for their sloppiness they subvert the peer review process so there is no one who can call them on it. First evidence of poor ethics.
Secondly, the mainstream media, sensing that their mantra has been seen through, and that their control of this issue is slipping away from them pulls out all of the stops to obfuscate the entire issue. Out come the “journalists” repeating the mantra “settled science” “settled science”. Second evidence of poor or non-existant ethics.
Lastly, our esteemed political leadership ignore the topic or hide behind their clueless spokesmen. “ahem, it is all settled science and copenhagen should go ahead”. Last and biggest evidence of poor ethics.
Thank goodness there are people with backbones down under that can serve is a good example of people protecting their liberty from the sleazy political opportunists that are seeking to make us all “world citizens”
Roger, you wrote:
At least during the Middle Ages the public discourse on scientific/religious disputes was held by intelligent people (or mostly).
Picking on Gibbs in this context strikes me as unfair- he is barely a subdeacon in the Church of Obama (itself a subdivision of Pseudo-Marxism.)
I honestly don’t know why a WH has a press secretary anymore- these press conferences are about as useful as watching chimps throw stuff at each other in the monkey-house.
Comment to President Obama & Senators
Claims of catastrophic anthropogenic climate change, are seriously questioned by a substantial portion of scientists and major portion of the public. See below. ClimateGate documents exposed serious corruption of climate science.
As a scientist and engineer, I ask you to redress these problems. Please insist on the following in USA legislation and at Copenhagen:
1) Absolute transparency and public access for ALL data, methods, adjustments, and modeling software for all climate models relied on for public policy.
2) Require the IPCC be subject to every country’s “Freedom of Information” legislation.
3) Require objective science with a level playing field including for ALL climate theories. This require remedial funding of minority positions to redress the serious distortion of objective climate science.
4) Include ALL natural and anthropogenic influences including ocean oscillations, complex solar influences, and galactic cosmic rays ignored by the IPCC
5) Require statistical validation of all climate models by independent statistical professionals. (Currently NONE are validated)
6) Explicitly quantify and exclude the Urban Heat Island effect. (GISS and HadCRU appear to systemically include UHI.)
7) Require minority reports that include data and models excluded by IPCC’s majority.
See Climate Change Reconsidered by Nongovernmental International Panel on Climate Change 2009 report 880 pg. http://www.nipccreport.org
9) Require comparison of effects and benefits of McKitrick’s T3 Tax (Tropical Tropospheric Temperature) and climate adaptation with cap and trade. Reject cap and trade as it is subject to political manipulation and fraud.
10) Insist on control of IPCC, UN and any climate agreement by democratically elected representatives, NOT unelected bureaucrats with no restraint.
——————-
See Rasmussen poll:
“Fifty-nine percent (59%) of Americans say it’s at least somewhat likely that some scientists have falsified research data to support their own theories and beliefs about global warming. Thirty-five percent (35%) say it’s Very Likely. Just 26% say it’s not very or not at all likely that some scientists falsified data. This skepticism does not appear to be the result of the recent disclosure of e-mails confirming such data falsification as part of the so-called “Climategate” scandal.”