Norman Podhoretz … you remember him – John’s pop … the guy who wrote all those books about the literary life and maybe was the first of us lefties to leave the reservation. Or one of the first. He and his wife ran this mag that might best be described as the antidote to People. (In fact, I gather he’s still editor-at-large.) Anyway, this “codger” – who still seems to have more of his marbles than the rest of us; he must have had a lot of them to begin with – hasn’t been reading his Cook Report or paying much attention, if any, to the latest Newsweek poll. He has the temerity to write the following on Commentary’s Contentions blog:
In spite of what the polls supposedly tell us, I strongly suspect that the Democrats may already have blown the 2008 election. Unlike the late Senator Aiken of Vermont, who proposed that we declare victory and get out of Vietnam, the Democrats want us to declare defeat and get out of Iraq. This, they imagine, is what the American people were demanding in the congressional election of 2006.But it seems far more likely that the message of that election was not “Get out,” but rather “Win, or get out.” In any case, the position the Democrats are now taking can only have the effect of revivifying and reinforcing the sense of them as weak on national security. And this was the very factor that led to the ignominious defeat of their presidential candidate, George McGovern, in 1972, when they also misread the public temper by paying too much attention to the left wing of their party.
Er… what can I say? Except, as Albany had it at the end of Lear:
The weight of this sad time we must obey;
Speak what we feel, not what we ought to say.
The oldest hath borne most: we that are young
Shall never see so much, nor live so long.
Would that this were true, but the problem is the ‘alternative’ available. In a ‘functioning’ democracy, unhappily, you pretty much have to chose from the preferred options. Even if the options are distinctly unappealing.
The Republicans have for years been running on the implied program of hey, look, we suck, but at least we’re NOT THEM . Like everything else in life tends to do, that has grown increasingly old, and now has outlived its shelf life. And the Republicans literally have NOTHING ELSE. What programs they do advocate are not very popular, and they are indeed both captivated and captive of a so-con wing that IMO is heading towards ultimate self-marginalisation. It will likely take the Party with it.
The 2006 results were (objectively) a wake-up call to the Republicans, as they LOST to a morally and intellectually bankrupt opponent, but rather than deal with an unpleasant reality, they simply have hit the snooze button and retreated to Fantasy Island where delusional behaviour is considered acceptable. The Republicans are really in a rebuilding phase, but they are not rebuilding, and will not until the bottom falls completely out of their bubble. That is how organizations operate, more’s the pity. They have to hit bottom even though they can clearly see the bottom approaching form a great distance off. Inertia rules.
Cue 2008 which will be much worse for the Republicans than 2006. EVEN the WAR will not be enough(and in the best of worlds, it probably shouldn’t be), as most people would rather believe that disengagement is possible if done correctly. And they will rationalise reality until the ‘correctly’ card turns itself up.
That the US has been cursed with these two USELESS Political Agents at a time of historic crisis is both troubling and discouraging. Fred Thompson recently said “You ever wonder why, when our politics are getting bigger, why so many of our politicians seem to be getting smaller?”
Does anyone not instinctively appreciate what he said ?
I agree with dougf. The Democrats didn’t win in 2006, the Republicans lost. The Democrats never had the 2008 to blow. It’s up to the Republicans to reearn the respect and trust the American people gave them and they squandered over the last dozen years.
Weak on defense? Now why would they be that????
Just because they’ve cut deploying star wars to Poland and the Czechs to the bone, which means it’s not going so they can aid Pooty-Poot and the Zeropeans……
Via Malkin/Oh, criminey, looking up that story and found this, I thought we have no money…….
Dems Offer Reparations to Guam For Japanese War Crimes
That’s correct… Democrats are bringing legislation to the floor this week to pay Guam citizens for the crimes committed against them by members of the Imperial Japanese military forces during World War II!
H. R. 1595 -To implement the recommendations of the Guam War Claims Review Commission.
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“…and they are indeed both captivated and captive of a so-con wing that IMO is heading towards ultimate self-marginalisation.”
Speaking of drinking the kool aid. The “so-con” are the fiscal conservatives, by and large. Get used to it, and you’ll be happier.
I think that Americans mostly do feel that we should either win or get out. With the exception of the American Revolution, Americans simply do not tolerate long wars.
Unfortunately for the Republicans [and the rest of us, I might add], the Bush Administration seems to have no idea how to do this. They have sidled up to the horrible Saudis once again, for reasons that are unclear. Politically, this move is a disaster in Iraq. Plus, the Bush Administration continues to seem to believe that progress can be made in Iraq without bothering to secure the Iraqi borders, which is completely idiotic.
See Hussain Abdul-Hussain’s column in yesterdays NY Times if you really want to get depressed about the situation in Iraq:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/05/07/opinion/07hussain.html
“Win or get out” ? Words carefully chosen to lie about what the choice is. The two choices are {win and get out} or {lose and get out}.
Although, of course, if we lose it’s not really clear what the value of “getting out” is. Once the caliphate is global, do the surrendercrats really think that the caliph is going to allow them to go to outer space or something?
I have to agree with dougf. I have no idea what the Republican party supposedly stands for at this point, except that they back the Iraq War and are somewhat anti-abortion (depending on which part of the “base” they’re talking to). That’s not much to vote for. I used to think they wanted smaller governments, less interference in personal affairs, lower taxes and less involvement in silly world affairs.
Instead, I find that the Republicans haven’t really delivered much on these ideals… they haven’t delivered much on the abortion side and Rumsfeld et all couldn’t deliver a competent solution to the issue of Iraq.
I don’t want national healthcare, I don’t want big government, I don’t want higher taxes… but I don’t want a bunch of idiots in power either. In my opinion, Bush is not a good president (he’s not the worst, but he’s not good at his job), Cheney is not a good VP (he ranks pretty high on the Not Good side), Rumsfeld was not good at his job (No matter what one’s opinion of the necessity of this war, Rumsfeld did a poor job in putting the plans together), and the republican Congress was a complete load of BS. At this point, I have respect for some Republicans (Rudi, Fred Thompson, Ron Paul etc), but the party as a whole has become a mess. I used to think McCain had some balls, but he’s become a waffling fool as well.
Maybe the parties have always been this incompetent and I was too naive to notice. I hope not… I’ve sort of grown attached to our country and would hate to see it collapse into a bedlam of idiotcracy.
On another note, I heard a theory which might be interesting to some.
1. After the past 7 years, I think that Republicans will probably lose the White House in 08, no matter who they put on the ticket. (I’d say that we’re somewhere in the 80%-90% likelihood)
2. I don’t think America is ready for a woman or black president. Besides, they’ve already started slinging mud at each other.
3. A dark horse, showing up at the last minute might be able to swing it, particularly if they are already popular and have a potent agenda.
Enter Al Gore and the Green Party, somewhere around spring 08.
Thoughts?
(Scares the hell outta me)
Well, as for what the Republican Party stands for, I can’t really say. I was once a libertarian, but now I am a single-issue voter, and my issue is islamofascism. The main characteristic of resisting islamofascism is that it is purely a reactive stance — they developed and continue to develop the intellectual support to wage war; they chose and choose to make and carry out their plans; they make the choices, while I only react to their choices. If they were to give up tomorrow, I would immediately stop having any need to resist them. (Of course I would be suspicious and watchful as is prudent, but ultimately my actions towards them will be governed by and controlled by their actions towards me.)
So, yeah, I suppose that makes me a reactionary.
cathyf,
So, yeah, I suppose that makes me a reactionary.
I disagree… it makes you a terrorized person. It means that your psychological reaction (like the psychological reaction of many Americans) is exactly what Bin Laden and terrorists in general count on. The human consciousness can be modeled with four major “circuits”. The primary circuit is “Bio-Survival”, fight or flight/live or die. Terrorism attacks that specific circuit in an attempt to upset the balance of the entire psychological system. It’s the same tactic that leads to Iraqis protesting America after some Iraqi blows himself up and takes a few other Iraqis with them… the brain ceases to rationally consider actions and simply goes into survival mode. In actual reality, its extremely unlikely that a worldwide calliphate would ever happen. It’s extremely unlikely that Bin Laden and his gang of thugs would be successful in many major attacks. It’s very improbable that the Democrats will make us any more vulnerable than we already are. However, its perfectly normal to ignore that data and focus on getting rid of the perceived threat.
Reactionary is simply a stupid label. Almost everything that humans do is a reaction to some external stimuli.
I strongly disagree. I think that this world is just like Harry Potter’s world, consisting of three types of people:
1) Those who do evil.
2) Those who resist those who do evil.
3) Those who snipe at those who resist those who do evil.
It’s group #3 who are the terrorized, who have the psychological reaction which is exactly what Bin Laden and terrorists in general count on. Without group #3, the terrorists’ ability to defeat group #2 is much smaller.
And a classic form of sniping is to present false choices and then to attack the people in group #2 for “choosing” the wrong “choice.” In this particular case, there are actually two separate choices, with a contingency:
1) Win, and choose to leave,
2) Win, and choose not to leave,
3) Lose, and in the losing also lose the choice about coming or going, indeed lose the difference between there and here.
Another classic technique of group #3 is to ridicule the resistence of group #2 and the abilities of group #1.
So, yeah, I think in dclydew we have the canonical case of group #3 right here…
If anything I said could be mistaken for ridicule allow me to apologize right now.
I didn’t intend to ridicule you or anyone else. A perfectly normal reaction to a terrorizing situation is not something that should be ridiculed. I myself have periods of time where my Bio-Survival circuit kicks into gear. A couple weeks ago they found suspected terrorists living in Worthington, Ohio which is where I live. One person they arrested had phone numbers for people pretty high up in the AQ hierarchy. Since I often buy lamb and goat meat at the local halal markets, it was pretty scary to consider that there was a pretty high likelihood that this guy and I shopped at the same place. As a result, I haven’t been to a halal shop since. Its not a rational response, I mean its not like some guy behind me at the meat counter is gonna blow himself up in the market. Indeed, maybe that would be the safest place to be in an attack
My point wasn’t that you were wrong, stupid, evil or anything else… only that “reactionary” was an inappropriate label for your position. You should feel completely justified in caring only about the thing that you perceive as threat to your survival.
Now, if you’re getting your world view from Harry Potter… thats a different story
“Kos is right! Psychotic, but Right! We need to make a really stupid gesture on someone’s (Kos) part!”
Who knows, maybe when we leave Iraq, the “civil” war, between the Sunni entity and the Shia entity will explode into regional war between these two sectarian rivals, and embroil the two in the long overdue “Fight to the Death” match. Maybe the cynical Democrats have it right, or as Kos said (applying their standard to Iraqis and the rest in Muslim lands) “Screw Them!”
And maybe, just maybe, then the neo-con ideal can die its death and when the dust clears in old Middle Eastern land, we will have exploited their desire to “fight each other” to its fullest extent.
And “ScrewThem” to all Muslims there who are fighting to make a place of decency there. Like Kurds, Turks protesting the Erdogen govt. the Chaldeans, Assyrians, oh, Kopts in Egypt, Lebanese Christians. Greece, Ethiopia, Thailands Bhuddists, Hindi, Philipino, and every other place that borders the muslim lands where every conflict in this fourth world war are currently exploding.
Screw Them! Its Party political platform
Norman Podhoretz is exactly right from my point of view. Apply the force needed to win, which means kicking Iran in the ass and Syria. Now I am not so sure he means that but that is the only way the war will be won. We have to stop the flow of money, arms and men into Iraq.
Too bad his son didn’t get more of his dad’s brains and balls.
The main characteristic of resisting islamofascism is that it is purely a reactive stance — they developed and continue to develop the intellectual support to wage war; they chose and choose to make and carry out their plans; they make the choices, while I only react to their choices.
Maybe its time to stand for killing them? Killing them in numbers guaranteed to grab their admittedly short attention span…what with all those virgins lining up for them and all.
The American People need to finally stand up and say ok enough is enough. Every time one of your leaders threatens us we will take it seriously and there will be consequences.
Have always been impressed by the still smoldering anger of the families of the men who fought in WW2. I still know women who HATE the Japanese and wished that we would have killed more. Fighting spirit. We don’t have that fighting spirit…its almost like we are wounded and are trying to crawl away silently.
It seems that if a people are to fight a war then feeling the pain of the enemy is a pretty poor way to fight it. And it seems like there is a lot of that going around these days. Apologies for handling Korans incorrectly, submission on college campuses when it is discovered that we don’t have enough foot basins, taking away crosses from hospitals in Italy.
Perhaps we have forgotten the 1400 year long war we fought with the Islamic fiends. Oh well this comment is garbled from an overzealous application of Pinot…pardon the rant.
There is very little in the Islamic culture that serves as a conscience. No “knee jerk” reactions when murder and avarice is consuming their collective mind and their lives. Mr. Legrand, you point out how the west has perverted its own sense of conscience by the examples listed: Koran mishandling, foot basins, banning our own cultural icons etc. These appeasement jestures are the result of a confused effort to satisfy the extortionist face of Islam. When Islamists perpetrate carnage in Bagdhad or somewhere, the impulse that fears this evil seeks to appease it elsewhere.
An example is that when the canon first appeared, whole towns would surrender, rather than face the imagined horrors that this “super weapon” portended: bodies torn apart, in pieces, houses and buildings blasted apart. Appeasement to satisfy the survival instinct makes sense, when one has no other option. But kid glove treatment here, because of horrors one sees going on somewhere else, is just as irrational as the extortionist who, when he sees appeasement, has no corresponding gratitude: instead he sees weakness, so the threats and burning car footage continues apace.
The Western conscience has turned on itself and perceived that it is we who are guilty and must make amends. We are at war with ourself; overriding the survival instinct which should be: to kill the killers, and be more ruthless than the enemy is in attaining this aim. Democrat Party thinks that having the Military simply show up will force the enemy to start behaving itself, as though this is another nanny operation. Democrat Party voted this war. And they did the right thing.
Now Democrat Party want to have it both ways, in the same confused way they are about conscience: about who is responsible and who should be punished. You don’t react with half measures, you take the offensive. There were no guarantees we would win in World War 2. The average number of battle deaths in that war were 8000 per month. Whole fleets went down in storms. We first started fighting Nazis, not in Europe, but in North Africa!
What did North Africa have to do with the War Against Fascism? Answer: We went where the enemy was and killed him. In 1945, the Japanese commander in Manila was ordered, by Japanese High Command, to abandon Manila, and the Phillipines: to return to mainland of Japan, to bring his resources to defend the Islands. This commander, was trained in the Samurai warrior code, which stipulated that the Japanese soldier does not surrender, does not retreat. So he ordered a killing spree, and after it was over, 150,000 Phillipine citizens were hacked to death. Young, old, sick, poor, man, woman, and child. So that there was nothing left to surrender. He either disobeyed his order, or he fulfilled his warrior code. This and the recent sinking of the U.S.S. Indianapolis weighed heavily on President Trumans mind.
The Left thinks this is all an abstraction, and they can take the safe route and get an A on the test. But their Professor is Ward Churchill. The Fake Indian. These people get more people killed in their efforts to champion the precious Anti-American. The New York Times has an article “The Role of a Fort Dix Informant Draws Praise as well as Questions”…” About Legitimacy”.
rant at will and pass the ammo!