Read Him in Huffington Post, Read my Challenge to Him Here
It was only a matter of time before someone would try to make some political hay out of the very curious obsession that the American (Arab-backed) mainstream media has with honor killings when and only when they are committed by Hindus.
And now, the Huffington Post has given none other than John Esposito the bully pulpit on this one. Professor Esposito teaches Islamic Studies at Georgetown, where he is also the founder and director of the Prince Alwaleed bin Talal Center for Muslim-Christian Understanding. (“Hath not a Jew eyes?” Why are Jews not included in this project of understanding?)
From 1988-1992, Esposito served as the president of the Middle East Studies Association of North America (MESA). Needless to say, this association is a radically left, pro-Palestinian, anti-Zionist, and anti-Semitic group. It is certainly not a feminist group. Please read Martin Kramer’s excellent book Ivory Towers on Sand, which examines MESA’s activities and point of view.
But of course, who else, who better, to speak for women? Who can better express the feminist point of view? And on an American left-liberal website?
This is precisely the high ground that Esposito seeks to claim. He is now concerned with “violence against women.” He writes:
“Gender equity and violence against women are two issues rightfully attracting more attention in the mainstream press, but in the court of public opinion, Islam is seen as an instigator of women’s oppression. Studies show that gender equity is cited as a reason for the public’s mistrust of Islam. … Such violence refers to crimes committed against females and cuts across numerous faiths, cultures and societies.”
Therefore, to redeem the honor of Islam and earn his Saudi money, Esposito describes a particular honor killing, assuming that most readers will assume that it has been committed by Muslims. But, he explains, this tragedy has been perpetrated by Hindus!:
“Women are murdered in so-called honor killings everyday, and the public has a right to know more about these crimes and their victims. Take India for example. On Saturday, the first-ever Indian Peoples’ Tribunal on so-called ‘Honour Killings’ gathered prominent lawyers and activists from major Indian non-government organizations, including the Human Right Law Network, the Women’s Legal Forum and the Women’s Christian Association of India, to raise awareness for these crimes. The event followed an incident earlier this summer when two young people from different backgrounds pledged to marry one another but were killed by their loved ones. Family members perpetrated the so-called honor killing to restore their communal standing. Some praised the murderers as heroes, and authorities treated the crime with impunity.
“Were the victims Muslim?
“No. That’s the point.”
John Esposito, to my knowledge, hasn’t found a single Imam, not to say 100, who have issued a fatwa against the torture and murder of women.
Is there a Muslim leader in the world who will speak out against what is happening to an innocent woman in Iran?
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/06/world/middleeast/06iran.html?scp=1&sq=iran%2099%20lashes&st=cse
Esposito is a non-Muslim Islam apologist. He’s a despicable person and this really should come as no surprise– except, if you think about it, it makes sense. Hindus who do honor killings do it because of cultural issues and it’s not mandated by their religion. It should be condemned, of course. But, Muslims who do honor killings are following sharia– if it’s believed the children won’t grow up to be good Muslims, they can be killed; it’s mandated by Islamic law and Islamic law cannot be changed or altered since it’s the eternal perfect word of God. So, in a perverse way, this makes sense.
Keep up the pressure Phyllis. Islam’s treatment of women really IS one of the most visible of their many despicable characteristics. Also, through their failure to condemn the Misogyny of Islam, it is powerful evidence of the hard left’s failure to honor the equality of women…. a value they profess, but fail to uphold.
I wonder if Mr Esposito has any opinion on this?
http://theopinionator.typepad.com/my_weblog/2010/09/i-have-written-several-blogs-on-the-horrific-abuse-suffered-by-the-kaffir-maids-at-the-hands-of-their-sponsorsemployers-in-s.html
One thing that is disgusting about this story about Esposito and Georgetown is the twisted hypocrisy of the left regarding women’s rights. It is not unique to Georgetown but instead pervasive among the American left, in both the media and academia. Islam is mostly hands off for criticism. Imagine the thousands of articles and documentaries from the leftist media and academia we would have seen by now if Christians or Jews engaged in “honor killings” as long as Muslims have all over the world, including in America. What explains the left’s silence other than its visceral hatred of traditional Christianity and Judiasm? Another area where this is found is regarding separation of church and state issues. Why is the left not criticizing New York politicians for offering public help to the ground zero mosque developers? They would be expected to do so if a church or synagogue was being offered such help. What about accommodations to Muslims on the campuses of American universities for prayer times and locations, foot baths, etc., while they sue to stop any such accommodations to Christians or Jews.
I don’t mind that he’s pointing a finger at the Hindus. It’s long overdue for the Hindus to receive some scorn for their after-hours brutality. They also murder Christians on the spur of the moment, just for some excitement. Lets keep up the pressure on all these bone-heads.
JJ Joseph
[They also murder Christians on the spur of the moment, just for some excitement.]
Joseph, where do you live? In what neighborhood? Do you practice any religion there? Has anyone come lately to convert you to another religion, right in your vicinity, using tricks and deceit and money, has anyone from another religion arrogantly come in your neighborhood lately to create havoc and dissension among the poorest in the community? And if yes, what would you do?
When Hindus murder Christians on the spur of the moment? For Christ sake so few Christians have been murderer!!!!
I have found them myself in India often. The American missionaries, arrogant, Christ-self-loaded, full of ego, looking down on everyone, the messengers of the righteousness, dispensing free services with conditions and converting the poor by trick of a religion that thrived hundreds of year before Jesus was even born.
Mother India (Bharat Ma!) is not perfect, but isn’t this the land where Jews were welcomed for thousands of years, where the remnants of the Zoroastrians still thrive (only there!) after being exterminated in Persia by the Muslims, where Catholics in Goa live in peace and the most powerful person in the land is a Catholic Christian woman from Italy named Sonia Gandhi, and the Prime Minister is a Sikh, a member of a minority of the population. Isn’t this the country where Christians and Muslims thrive and often (very often) abuse the native Hindus.
When do you hear of the Hindus in the US? When? They go to their temples and worship. Do they intimidate, demand, molest, law-fare, honor-kill, even say anything? Aren’t they, finally, the perfect immigrants to this country?
MiamiMan: ” . . .looking down on everyone, the messengers of the righteousness . . .”
I think that sounds more like upper caste Hindus looking down on the untouchable Dalits. Hindus frequently become enraged at uppity untouchable Dalits or Sikhs who happen to stand too close to an upper class, or allow their children to play near a temple. Suitable punishments include gang rape, pouring boiling dal on low-caste women and children, and outright murder of disrespectful lower classes. Hindus also become crazed by Christians who tell untouchables that they are valuable human beings who don’t need to remain in slavery. Hindus are just as intolerant of others as muslims are. They, in fact, deserve each other.
http://www.hinduyuva.org/tattva-blog/2010/07/orissa-in-the-crossfire-kandhamal-burning-preface-by-vrndavan-parker/
Check the Deeds of Christain Missionaries in India… How Great the A Hole of Christ are in INDIA.
Read the book page by page to learn how creat things Missioneris in india are doing..Read man Go and try it..
Let’s not forget the enlightened caste system the Hindus created, this advanced their civilization right up to the feudal kingdoms that were once enlightened India when the British found them. And let’s not forget that womenfolk’s lib was founded on the belief that white men should not marry India women.
http://www.lulu.com/content/paperback-book/orissa-in-the-crossfire-kandhamal-burning/7879596
Orissa in the Crossfire-Kandhamal Burning provides many vital details related to the Hindu-Christian violence that has swept Orissa’s Kandhamal district. The book also highlights the history of Orissa and its tribes. While many have familiarized themselves with the propaganda that has fictionalized the events surrounding the Kandhamal crisis, few have had access to the facts. The true history of Kandhamal and the struggles of its people deserve a fair hearing in the court of public opinion. Is the Kandha religion sinister or sacred? Are they bloodthirsty savages or a people of a noble and ancient heritage? Can the tribes people of Kandhamal rise up out of their undeserved shame and be seen for who they really are? Long labeled as ‘a cruel human sacrificing tribe of ruthless savages’ it is time the truth be revealed.
GO MAN AND READ THIS BOOK . IF you have some Guts then you will read this book and tell me if i am Wrong…
Phyllis, you made a point about Esposito’s Al-Waleed bin Talal Center for Muslim-Christian Understanding that I have long wanted to make. Why are Prince al-Waleed and Prof Esposito not interested in “understanding” with Jews? Why are Jews left out if the goal is goody-goody interfaith understanding??
My guess is that it has something to do with the fact that Georgetown is technically, marginally connected with the Jesuit order.
At the time that the Saudis poured their ma$$ive beneficence on Georgetown, many alumni —particularly those who went to G’town back in the 50′s and early 60′s, when it actually WAS a Catholic university — expressed a good deal of concern about it. The left insisted that they were not promoting the interests of Islam, but were promoting mutual understanding. (Yawn….The usual BS.)
I don’t really have a problem in principle with an organization dedicated to Muslim-Christian understanding. There are, after all, organizations dealing specifically with Jewish-Christian relations. Not every interfaith outfit has to include all faiths.
The real problem is that so many of these outfits are simply fronts for anti-Western propaganda. The “Christian” side is often represented by post-Christian adherents of the Leftist Faith anyway. And it all goes down hill from there.
The Huffington Post. It compares to Der Stürmer of Julius Streicher.
“My Greek Wedding” greeky-accented, Uzo-drinking, garlic-smelly, Ariadna “Puffington” should go back to tend goat in Halicarnassus.
The Greatest Poster, number one poster of the “Puffington Post” is His Highness Sean Penn On-His-4 to Fidel, the buddy of Hugo Chavez. Penn, who lives in a fortress in California, and send his kids to very private school, always have great advise to us commoners on how to live. His friend Jack Daniels, who was incompatible with Madonna, attracts Harry Belafonte, Danny Glover (yes, the earthquake in Haiti was caused by global warming and was Bush’s fault), and Tom Sizemore and his friend Speedy Gonzalez.
“The Huffington Post. It compares to Der Stürmer of Julius Streicher.”
Your message is not falling on deaf ears, Phyllis.
Low-Blow Joe:
OK, if the comparison to Herr Streicher’s prestigious paper is too stiff for you…what about the “Völkischer Beobachter”?
The honor killings in India, if they exist are related to tribal and caste warfare, not because they are Hindus. Hinduism is the only religion which puts feminine form of God at the highest altar and to relate the social crimes that happens to be among Hindus to religion by people like him who is earning a living from Saudi Arabia is an abomination. Mr. Esposito is a fake who will not talk about the Saudi Arabian women who are wholesale deprived the right even to drive alone, forced to wear black robe and treated as property of men. Hindus and other Eastern religions in India do not need lessons from such perverts. These perverts will do anything for money and they sell their integrity, soul and the truth.
Regards,
Sekhar
Phyllis hits the nail on the head. John Esposito condemns Hindu honor killings, and glosses every so slickly over Muslim honor killings. He does that without blinking an eye because he’s paid by the Saudis to knit the wool to pull over Western and especially American eyes about the totalitarian nature of Islam. Furthermore, Hinduism is a rival religion of Islam’s, and just as irrational (although we’re not supposed to call any religion irrational, it’s a “private” matter, don’t you know, as private as believing in the power of a rabbit’s foot to bring good luck). Has anyone confronted Esposito with the stories and pictures of women and girls being honor-killed in America? I think he would need to be tied to a chair and forced to read the stories and see the pictures, for he certainly wouldn’t do it of his own volition. But, no, I don’t think that would work. He’d probably accuse the person who managed to bring those murders to his attention of “hate speech.”
Sparrow:
Are you serious? Why is Hinduism a rival religion of Islam? Where do you get such a crazy idea? It is Islam that is incompatible with any other religion, but Hinduism is the most tolerant religion ever. The only religious persecution in India was done by the Muslims and the Mughals, Hindus in India have always tolerated other religions, often to their chagrin.
Why? Is the Christian religion “rational”? Really? With the story of the resurrection of Christ in the flesh, and the unbelievable future heaven? The constant dogma that prevent spiritual growth. Very rational, indeed.
Miami Man: Perhaps I should have emphasized or mentioned that I am an atheist (raised in a Catholic home), and so regard any religion as irrational, regardless of its record of tolerance. And, if Islam didn’t consider Hinduism a rival, why do its members continue to attack Hindus? One doesn’t attack what one doesn’t consider a threat. The Quakers and the Amish are not conducting mass executions and fire-bombings of each other, so they might be deemed more tolerant than are Hindus. The most one can fault the Quakers and Amish is that they’re pretty dull dressers. As for Christianity, I always thought the parable of Christ cursing the fig tree ripe for satire. Then there’s the story of Moses and the burning/talking burning bush, and being mooned by the Almighty. And, Moses was basically as barbaric as Mohammad, for example, having ordered his soldiers to slaughter all men, women and non-virgin girls, and allowing his soldiers to have the virgins for themselves. There’s that obsession with virgins again. Great instance of the civil treatment of women, indeed!
Good luck this year in 8th grade, Sparrowhawk.
Forgot to mention in my earlier post, in Saudi Arabia, Koran *is* the constitution. Go figure what John’s credibility speaking on human rights with their money in the pocket. Also, Saudi Arabia spend about 100 billion in just last 3 decades and we are sacrificing our soldiers defending the terrorism caused by that country. Just since 9/11, Saudi sponsored terrorism killed more than 76,000 people and 115,000 people injured and so much money loss. Have this guy read Koran, Sira and Hadith and brutal Islamic history. These people are pests of free society living off the crumbs from the people who are set to destroy our civilization, our freedoms and our cultures. If he looks in the eyes of his children and realize what Islam is doing and plans to them and to all of America, he might change. But you never know!
Regards,
Sekhar
The honor killings in India, if they exist are related to tribal and caste warfare, not because they are Hindus. Hinduism is the only religion which puts feminine form of God at the highest altar and to relate the social crimes that happens to be among Hindus to religion by people like him who is earning a living from Saudi Arabia is an abomination. Mr. Esposito is a fake who will not talk about the Saudi Arabian women who are wholesale deprived the right even to drive alone, forced to wear black robe and treated as property of men. Hindus and other Eastern religions in India do not need lessons from such perverts. These perverts will do anything for money and they sell their integrity, soul and the truth.
In Saudi Arabia, Koran *is* the constitution. Go figure what John’s credibility speaking on human rights with their money in the pocket. Also, Saudi Arabia spend about 100 billion in just last 3 decades and we are sacrificing our soldiers defending the terrorism caused by that country. Just since 9/11, Saudi sponsored terrorism killed more than 76,000 people and 115,000 people injured and so much money loss. Have this guy read Koran, Sira and Hadith and brutal Islamic history. These people are pests of free society living off the crumbs from the people who are set to destroy our civilization, our freedoms and our cultures. If he looks in the eyes of his children and realize what Islam is doing and plans to them and to all of America, he might change. But you never know!
Regards,
Sekhar
StopHonourKillings.com displays a Documentary … by AlJazeera … about such (Hindu) Murders,
which sounds even funny. Why don’t display one about THEIR OWN Murders,
which are spreading all around the World, together with their totalitarian, dictatorial, political Ideology?
***
I was looking for Quotes of Osho on such Murders (he talked about them in his Speeches,
he relates them to the Concept of religious Obedience, which should, obviously be removed),
and I found that: http://freethoughtnation.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=160:osho-sex-is-sacred&catid=40:general
Please note a Comment by an Islamic Nickname (who wrote “Osho was a Charlatan”), and now have a Look to those that (Truthfulness): http://dttj.blogspot.com/2010/06/osho-on-islam.html
***
Lovliest Regards and a lovely Life.
Esposito believes he is a part of the superior race and intellect.
He fits right in with the Islamic belief system…that “Infidels, whether Hindu, Sikh, Jewish, Christian, Buddhist or any non-believing sect, are inferior and untouchables”.
Never mind the caste system. The caste system in India is being replaced and Hindus are racing towards democratic values that are appreciated and respected in the west.
According to a Washington Post article; “Who could have imagined that, after 3,000 years of caste discrimination, an “Untouchable” woman would become chief minister of India’s most populous state? Yet that has happened twice and looks likely to happen again this year when the northern state of Uttar Pradesh goes to the polls. In 2004, India witnessed an event unprecedented in human history: A nation of more than 1 billion people, after the planet’s largest exercise ever in free elections, saw a Catholic political leader (Sonia Gandhi) make way for a Sikh (Manmohan Singh) to be sworn in as prime minister by a Muslim (President Abdul Kalam) — in a country that is 81 percent Hindu”.
Book recommendation: “In Spite of the Gods: The Rise of Modern India” [Paperback]
by Edward Luce, Amazon.com
Ms. Chesler — You quote Mr. Esposito as saying: “Take India for example. On Saturday, the first-ever Indian Peoples’ Tribunal on so-called ‘Honour Killings’ gathered prominent lawyers and activists from major Indian non-government organizations, including the Human Right Law Network, the Women’s Legal Forum and the Women’s Christian Association of India, to raise awareness for these crimes.” If what Mr. Esposito says is indeed factual, then the answer back is simple: Can you imagine the same thing happening in Saudi Arabia or Iran or Pakistan? Inadvertently, Mr. Esposito has pointed out the glaring difference between Islam and any other political system. Other systems can meet (as this one is in India) and condemn what is happening and try to change it without fear of injury or worse. You can’t do that in most Moslem countries, and apparently in places where they do it, they won’t. That is the difference between Islam and others systems.
Also, I might note, it is infantile to point fingers at others, and say, everybody does it. My children would do that when they were young. Whenever they would try that shtick on me, I would tell them, just because everybody does it, doesn’t mean that you have to do it. Eventually, they grew out of that stage.
It is indeed high time that the civilized world condemn such reprehensible practices in the Islamic world as murdering or severely beating women for the crime of having been raped, or for even the least suspicion (let alone reality) of premarital or extramarital sex — especially since no such penalties are levied upon boys who engage in pre or non-marital sex, and men are allowed to have up to four wives.
We also need to condemn, however, non-Islamic killing of women such as happens in India, where women have been pushed into fires because their families couldn’t afford dowry payments.
yes it is true that in some parts of india honour killing had taken place but only in the most backward states of india where there is lack of education and progress. there has been persecution in the name of religion also.I still havent heard of a christian person harming his fellow human-being on the grounds of religion in india.
It’s true there have been and are such barbaric practices among Hindus. Until recently the West has had a habit of responding properly to such things as well.
Sir Charles Napier faced this situation in India many years ago.
From the Wikipedia entry:
A story for which Napier is famous involves a delegation of Hindu locals approaching him and complaining about prohibition of Sati, often referred to at the time as suttee, by British authorities. This was the custom of burning widows alive on the funeral pyres of their husbands. The exact wording of his response varies somewhat in different reports, but the following version captures its essence:
“You say that it is your custom to burn widows. Very well. We also have a custom: when men burn a woman alive, we tie a rope around their necks and we hang them. Build your funeral pyre; beside it, my carpenters will build a gallows. You may follow your custom. And then we will follow ours.”
The only proper response to these acts of barbarism is to teach a very public lesson in the consequences thereof…
It’s sad the West has forgotten this.
Patrick
Patrick:
The little story that has been quoted here 100 times in different fashion. No, the “West” has not forgotten, it just happens that India is not a British colony anymore, so they can’t erect the gallows there.
Please come back from Rudyard Kipling’s time.
You act as though he thought is in any way wrong, or that the methodology is outdated just because the Raj no longer exists.
The tuth cannot be further from such. All that means is that it is now the responsibility of Indians themselves to build the gallows and purge the barbarians amongst them from their midst.
Prof. Chesler, you are doing a great job holding these pigs’ feet to the fire. Have you ever tried to get any of these guys to debate you? Now THAT would be awesome! I can see the headline now: “Fiery Professor Overwhelms Muslim Apologists in Debate.”
John Esposito, Saudi Arabia’s Man-on-Campus PLEASE EXCUSE THE CAPS LOCK…WHEN SHARIA LAW CREEPS UP TO YOUR DOOR KNOCKS AND YOU OPEN YOUR HOME TO IT …MUSLIMS WILL ENTER AND MURDER YOU AFTER THEY RAPE YOUR CHILDREN IN FRONT OF YOU AND THEIR MOTHER AND THEN THEY’LL RAPE BOTH OF YOU …ARE YOU READY FOR THIS ? IF THIS DOESN’T HAPPEN IN YOUR LIFE TIME IT’LL DEFINATELY HAPPEN TO YOUR CHILDREN’S CHILDREN AND LINEAGE WISE IT’LL BE HAPPENING TO YOU BECAUSE YOU John Esposito HAVE BETRAYED YOUR LINEAGE BY GOING OVER TO THE DARK SIDE. YOU STUPID IDIOT John Esposito ..YOUR GRAND CHILDREN WILL BE HOWLING ALLAH O AKBAR AND WASTING THEIR LIVES AND GENETICS BECAUSE OF YOU . ISLAM IS JUST VERY BAD LUCK. LOOK AROUND.
DO YOU KNOW ABOUT BESLAN/M ? LOOK IT UP EVERYBODY. PURE EVIL. PURE EVIL. PURE SHARIYA.
ISLAM MUST BE DESTROYED!!!
HOW WILL YOU CONTRIBUTE ?
A “phobia” is an irrational fear. Thus, “homophobia” is an irrational fear of homosexuality.
Which, of course, is silly on several levels. ISLAMOPHOBIA REFERS TO AN IRRATIONAL FEAR.
BUT FEAR OF ISLAM IS TOTALLY RATIONAL.
SO THE TERM ISLAMOPHOBIA IS NOT JUST SILLY, BUT IT IS MISLEADING, IN A HAZARDOUS WAY.
And let’s not forget how Mein Qurampf 4:34 is supposed to give penis-possessing mohammedans “divine permission” to beat the living crap out of their half-male, non-penis-possessing jihadist breeders:
Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them; then if they obey you, do not seek a way against them; surely Allah is High, Great.
As a bonus for anyone seeking to expose the inherent misogyny of mohammedanism, note that the beginning of the above sura starts with a claim to an alleged “superiority” of penis-possessing bedouin fascists over those born without such a dangling thing between their legs.
Don’t get your hopes up. Esposito won’t even bother to answer. Chesler is an islamophobe, and such people don’t even deserve the courtesy of acknowledgment of their existence much less their queries. Such is the intellectual structure that the liberal progressive classes of the sixties have built; it became a crime and a moral offense to question any tenet or belief or statement of a victim group.
Prof. Chesler: Thank you for your tireless work on this. It would be great to see you more on the forefront with this issue, possibly Fox?
So it’s okay to commit murder, just because members of your ideology are not the only ones who have ever committed such a crime?
It is ironic that John Esposito feels safe in making such a claim, precisely because he knows that we will not turn around and do the same to him.
Please don’t ever call them honor killings.
These men are afraid of shame? Give it to them.
Let’s call these “shame killings”.
Let’s call the murderers “shamed killers” or “shameful killers”
Let’s translate the term into every language. Let there be no escape. Let them know that if they are afraid of shame, their killings will bring the shame of the whole world on them, and on their sons and on their brothers, on their clans and on their villages, on their fathers and their fathers’ fathers.