The Ridicule Is Both Obvious and Ineffective
August 28th, 2010 - 5:04 pm
Dear Washington Post hacks…
A sea of people rallied at the hallowed site of the Lincoln Memorial on Saturday as conservative commentator Glenn Beck and other heroes of the “tea party” movement honored Americans serving in the military and delivered impassioned calls to turn the nation back to God and to protect the traditional values that they said make the country exceptional.
…after a year and half, you can take the scare quotes off from around Tea Party. And then I can stop calling you hacks.
Deal?
Yours,
-S.
Jeebus. I had exactly the same reaction when reading the quote. Enough with the fracking scare quotes already.
But they’re still hacks. No matter how hard they try.
Gosh, their scare mongering knows no bounds does it? Hacks, lol.
Tea Party was born legitimately…
WaPo Hacks and their compatriots…..sketchy
Glenn Beck is full of shit. This has nothing to do with turning away from God. God is part of the problem here because both the Islamists and guys like George Bush think the world operates on the basis of such fantasies.
Praying isn’t going to fix the economy, stupids. Medieval countries had real crappy economies and they were way into that God thing.
Dear Mr. Macker: Think you need to find out a little more about God and prayer before you make silly comments. Cheers!
Cooksia,
Did you think your comment had any content whatsoever? How about you clarify and I will then demolish your claims.
I think it is football players, Jews, Christians, Muslims and Glenn Beck’s that need to learn a little about prayer. Yes, and also guys in foxholes. Praying doesn’t make you bullet proof, and doesn’t make your football team not suck. It also doesn’t fix the economy.
Why do you think all these theists are confused about prayer? Could it be what they were initially taught about it? Are they confused? Maybe it’s you who is confused about the claims being made about prayer.
Nor will “turning back to God” fix the economy.
I very much doubt that anyone who wants the country to turn back to God has any doubts about their own standing vis-a-vis God. When they talk about turning back to god as the salvation of the nation they aren’t talking about themselves. They are talking about other people.
Such calls are like saying we whites need to get back to White values. Do you really expect non-Whites to get behind that message? Don’t you think they would get a little upset with the scapegoating.
Actually before the calimaty of the 14th Century, the medieval world was the scene of an economic boom; that whole high middle ages thing. And of course Western Europe and America managed to build the richest most powerful civilization the world has ever know while being almost entirely Christian. But I won’t bore you with facts since it is pretty appararent that that whole reading and facts and knowledge things are just so yesterday for people like you.
Seriously, do you know how stupid you sound? Don’t they give better trolling lessons over at KOS before they send you people out?
There were economic booms long before Christianity was invented, and busts in the very best of Christian nations full of the faithful. There is no correlation, and even if there were that wouldn’t prove causation. That’s the point.
Yeah, Macker, because our current administration, including those on Capitol Hill, who profess no religion, at least none of the traditional religions (hello, Statism), is doing such a bang-up job with the economy.
Can you honestly say with a straight face that our country has changed for the better since we have turned away from God, or at least turned away from the morals and behavior established or inspired by Christianity and Judaism?
This economic situation has nothing to do with whether Johnny masturbates to porn, or has two mommies.
Did someone here say it did? You’ve never actually read this blog, have you?
Funny, I don’t remember anyone saying Glenn Beck wrote this blog. I’m one of the original commenters back on Vodkapundit dude. I’m criticising Becks statement that blames this on the lack of religion, just like the Islamists blamed the tsunami on a lack of faith. It’s idiotic.
“Yeah, Macker, because our current administration, including those on Capitol Hill, who profess no religion, at least none of the traditional religions (hello, Statism), is doing such a bang-up job with the economy.”
See this is the kind of idiot statements I expect Beck to make. Obama professes to be a Christian.
Anyone who professes to be an atheist has a ice cubes chance of hell of being elected. Yet you think the country is governed by them. Talk about a fantasy world.
Socialism wasn’t invented by atheist, nor communism. Both were Christian in origin. You wouldn’t know that because you are so damn ignorant. Christians want to take credit for an good things that arose under their hegemony but none of the bad things. Just like the Muslims claim credit for accomplishments that had nothing to do with Islam. Your religion has mostly been a brake on progress.
You forget that the reason so many professed to believe in God in the past is because the penalty for not doing so was death, and worse.
Many of those you claim to your fold were deists and it was dangerous enough being heretics in that regard without being called full fledged atheists. They knew the bible was a fabrication. You think a merciful god would commit all the atrocities claimed of him in the bible? If Darwin had come before Jefferson I very much doubt he would have even remained a theistic Deist (which probably is why there aren’t too many around now days).
“Can you honestly say with a straight face that our country has changed for the better since we have turned away from God, or at least turned away from the morals and behavior established or inspired by Christianity and Judaism?”
Yes, it did improve when we turned away from religion during the Great Awakening. Yes, it did improve when we turned away from religion and towards science. Constant improvement. The less power religion has over our lives the better and that includes religions like Marxism.
What makes you think this is about praying the economy better? All you’ve shownb is your own monomania and bigotry.
“What makes you think this is about praying the economy better?”
The tea party movement is about economics. Beck is trying to make it about religion. What alternate interpretation do you have. It’s amazing how many of these religious kooks want to jump out in front of the parade on this and make it about religion, talk about monomania.
Yes. As I understand it, the Tea Party movement is really about three things; (1) fiscal responsibility, (2) Constitutional government, and (3) nationalism (by which I mean that Tea Partiers think the US should act like a real country, with real borders, and that Americans need not apologize to anyone for being Americans). Religion has nothing to do with any of these things. If the religious types divert it from these straightforward and practical fiscal and political matters, the Tea Party will have failed. There are other possible failure modes, of course, but I see this as the most insidious one.
Exactly
THe monomania of atheists is one of the many reasons why they are annoying when they try to change the subject.
I’m trying to change the subject back. Back to economics, not religion. This is about Rick Santelli, and the Bush + Obama bailouts of rich fatcats to the detriment of free market economics. It’s about the fact that the stimulus, and socialist programs are making things worse, and we knew they would.
It’s not about some crazy lady like “Chaplain Desiree Bernstein” getting up in front of an ranting about religion, and anti-gay marriage stuff. If you want that kind of garbage join the Westboro Baptist Church.
The best way to loose this is to make it about religion. That’s the small tent way to go.
Brian Macker, you’re right on, and I don’t think someone has to be an atheist to get it, either. The religious right wants to hijack the Tea Party movement, and it’s time to call them out.
The culture war, such as it is, is something we can only afford to waste our time and energy on when we’re in an economic boom. For now, I think that pro-free-enterprise atheists, religious people, and everyone in between, can agree that we need to stop the economic bleeding, restore real growth (not the false growth of over-leveraged bubbles like Dot-Com and Housing), and THEN we can go back to fighting our little masturbatory “battles” about crap like whether the Pledge should have “under God” in it, or should go back to the form it took before the phrase was added as Cold War propaganda.
There is some confused thinking going on. The 8/28 rally was NOT a Tea Party event. Granted there is a lot of overlap in the folks who are interested in both, but Glenn is pushing something much closer to the first Great Awakening. Conflating the two reflects a superficial understanding. The Tea Parties are concerned with politics, but the 8/28 rally addressed something much more fundamental: The need for commitment to something larger than ourselves – for many this is God. As a follower of Jesus, I look to many paths, not only government, to achieve that which needs doing in this world. Belonging to a Tea Party is but a fraction of my identity; politics, as important as that is at the present time, is only a portion of my concerns. And I’d bet the same is true for most of those who attended the 8/28 rally.
Here is a link to a brief analysis of the effect of the first Great Awakening on the American Revolution:
http://www.great-awakening.com/significance.htm
Jack Okie,
Read the first line of your link:
“The major effect of the Awakening was a rebellion against authoritarian religious rule which spilled over into other areas of colonial life.”
Glenn Beck is moving in the opposite direction.
I may be too late to the dance, but you seem to eb falling victim to one of the greatest and common false assumptions in post-1960 political thought: that everything anyone does is explicitly and inextricably tied to their politics. Yes, GB has advocated on behalf o fthe Tea Party, but AFAIK he explicitly made a point of telling folks to leave politics at home for this event. Do you see any Tea Party signage on hand? Did the content of the speaches and presenters address economic or Tea Party issues? Again, AFAICT this was specifically a faith-based rally that GB went to length to not be political in nature.
As for any link between religion and the economy, traditional faiths teach the values of austerity, looking to the future, caring for others, humility, work ethic, contributing to society, etc. These are all values, regardless of from where they are learned or reinforced, that I, too, think can positively contribute to our country’s economic health and success.
If it wasn’t political then why hold the rally in Washington? Why Glenn Beck? Come on, don’t pretend this wasn’t political.
Have you been ignorant all of your life? the inability of your kind to admit that your fantasy world belief system has produced double digit unemployment, a trillion plus dollar deficit, a failed education system and death panels.
Really? Austrian economics and a belief in commodity money has produced double digit inflation?
See, because you are a bigot you think that anyone who doesn’t worship your on particular god all share the same attributes. We don’t.
You and I probably both do not believe in leprechauns but that probably doesn’t reflect on any other beliefs. Do you feel responsible for all the murders the communists (a type of socialism) committed just because you and they both fail to believe in leprechauns?
Here’s a clue. I’m not a socialist, and I think Obama is worse than Bush.
Prayer: The audacity of hope!
The talk of God throws me sometimes, too, Brian, but I think you misunderstand Beck’s thesis. His point is that we need to re-establish the same philosophical foundation that underlay the Declaration and the Constitution: that all rights come from God; nowhere else. Our culture is adrift precisely because we recognize no absolutes anymore. If you don’t accept that rights come from God, then you have to accept that rights come from man, and that leads to chaos. Then rights can be anything that Tom Harkin or Nancy Pelosi or Barack Obama deem them to be, and you have, by definition, tyranny. I interpret Beck’s message not as one of just handing over to God our responsibility to fix things, but to stipulate that God granted and guaranteed the freedom of man. From that point onward, it’s our responsibility to make it all happen in accordance with God’s will.
Maybe that’s not what he’s saying, but I’ve watched Beck daily for about six months now, and that’s my take. I think the reasoning is sound. You may have a problem with the belief part, but that’s your problem.
First, I must say I love your handle, WillDoMathForFood. Second, you have added greatly to this discussion by acknowledging Brian’s thesis, then discussing why he might change his mind, without calling him names. This elevates the discussion and a applaud you for it. It may even win hearts and minds.
Just gotta say to WillDoMathForFood: Love the monicker. Back at ya.
“The talk of God throws me sometimes, too, Brian, but I think you misunderstand Beck’s thesis.”
Oh, I understand his thesis. He’s got a goat named Scape and that goat is an atheist.
“His point is that we need to re-establish the same philosophical foundation that underlay the Declaration and the Constitution: that all rights come from God; nowhere else.
Really, so you believe in the divine rights of Kings? Those are rights that come from god too.
“Our culture is adrift precisely because we recognize no absolutes anymore.”
You are adrift, not me. The economy is in bad shape because we are following bad policy, and not because we aren’t totalitarian in our beliefs. Believing in absolutes like “You mustn’t suffer a witch to live” isn’t the path to prosperity.
“If you don’t accept that rights come from God, then you have to accept that rights come from man, and that leads to chaos.”
Accepting that rights come from God doesn’t help because then the question is “who speaks for God”. Islamists believe that rights come from god as much as you if not more so. They just believe god handed down different rights. Ones enshrined in sharia law. So now where are you at? Nowhere.
Sorry but you do not have a direct line to god and therefore you can’t know what rights he granted.
“Then rights can be anything that Tom Harkin or Nancy Pelosi or Barack Obama deem them to be, and you have, by definition, tyranny.”
Or Muhammad in your alternative method.
You have proposed a false dicotomy. You believe that either rights come from god or they are granted by fiat from men. There are other alternatives. For example the natural rights upon which this country was founded. But you wouldn’t know that because you get you learning from guys like Beck.
“I interpret Beck’s message not as one of just handing over to God our responsibility to fix things, but to stipulate that God granted and guaranteed the freedom of man.”
That’s not in the Bible. The spirit of the Declaration of Indepenance isn’t there either. In fact, Christianity is perfectly compatible with slavery and was for nearly two thousand years. It’s also perfectly compatible with supressing women’s rights too.
“From that point onward, it’s our responsibility to make it all happen in accordance with God’s will.”
Who gets to decide what gods will is? That’s scary not comforting. Then it is merely a war of differing infallible opinions with each person putting words in the mouth of god. A recipe for disaster as our founding fathers knew all too well, but you don’t.
“Maybe that’s not what he’s saying, but I’ve watched Beck daily for about six months now, and that’s my take. I think the reasoning is sound. You may have a problem with the belief part, but that’s your problem.”
Sorry the minute he made economic failures about not believing in his religion then he is full of shit. He’s scapegoating others on criteria that have nothing to do with economics. Beck is saying that even if ala Rick Santori’s rant, I pay my own mortgage, then I’m still a problem because I didn’t believe in his religious absolutes.
When he tells me I’m part of the problem when I work hard, pay my debts, save, and know more economics than he does and of course it will make me think the obvious, “This guy is full of shit.”
I know it’s not obvious to a lot of you but that’s just because you are a bunch of narrow minded bigots. That’s not name calling but a precise usage of the word.
You sound like a cracker, Macker!
Aren’t crackers stereotypically southern baptists?
I guess, Brian, that you believe the man who wrote the following is also “full of shit”:
That man was General and President George Washington… the original George W.
Go look up some quotes from some of the other founding fathers on Christianity. Start with Jefferson and work your way to Thomas Paine.
Jefferson:
Paine:
Next?
He also wrote stuff critical of Christianity, and Thomas Paine wrote an entire book on it. I don’t think “Creator” and “God” mean the same thing to them as to you. Many of the founders were deists specifically because they had rejected Christianity, and of course the Christians liked to call them Atheists even though they were theists. Look for the disparaging quotes, not just the ones that confirm your bias.
You just made my point for me.
You’re clearly the one looking only for the quotes that confirm your bias.
The founders were not one-dimensional men, as you seem to think. Many of them had problems with some established churches. So what? I gotta news flash for you… I have problems with some established churches. So did such notable Christians as Martin Luther (remember the 97 theses?), and even Peter and Paul disagreed on some parts of church doctrine… as you’d know if you bothered to do your research.
In any event, I’ve successfully unmasked the beam in your eye–not that it was difficult–so I don’t think I’m gonna waste any more time or bandwidth on you.
Clear to a religious bigot like you who wishes to scapegoat atheists for our economic troubles. Idiots like you are constantly ranting “Christian Nation! Christian Nation!” when it is clear that many ideologies had input into the founding of this nation. In particualar, Deism which was an anti-christian movement. In fact, Thomas Paine was called an atheists and well may have been. Read “The Age of Reason” and you will understand. I could spend all day taking quotes out of that book to debate modern Christians on their most cherished fallacies.
Non-believers and non-Christians have had quite a positive role in shaping this country, you bigot.
Fearful of the concept of being held accountable for what you’ve done with your life, eh? Fascinating.
Jsallison,
“Fearful of the concept of being held accountable for what you’ve done with your life, eh? Fascinating.”
Hoping that you will live forever in a paradise where you will live like some undeserving fat cat. Sounds greedy to me. Hoping that someone else will settle your scores for you. Being suckered by the Greatest Nigerian Scam Known to Man, Etc. Fascinating.
The only think I am fearful of is that religious nuts will try to infringe on my natural rights, as you have tended to do for several thousand years, and are still doing.
Macker, you will always be somebody’s bitch.
I don’t think that the rally was just about the economy, Brian. Broaden your view. The world operates per various bases, including morality, which is informed by religious views. They are important. They are relevant. They differ.
I don’t mind using your moral beliefs to inform your political decisions. For example, I understand why some believe abortion to be murder and therefore do not which federal funding for it or even for it to be legal. What I don’t like is scapegoating. If you took out a loan you couldn’t repay then that’s your fault, and not due to a lack of belief in god on my part.
I think it is idiotic to alienate 20% of your potential political base because you want to flaunt your religion, and denounce others as immoral by implication.
That God stuff is dangerous. He won’t come to the rescue; we have to do that ourselves. People who wait for magical outside intervention are the types who will settle for “a man on a white horse” (as the phenomenon has been known historically) when He fails to intervene personally. And then things really go to hell.
You’ve just described the voters who elected Barack Obama. Frankly, I don’t think the Tea Partiers are waiting for a magical outside intervention, as they will prove in November.
You know Brian, there are a lot of lessons to be learned from “That God Thing”. You may not be a believer, but the constant name calling and belittlement of your fellow citizens will not help get the economy or anything else in this country back on track. Do you have any constructive information to add to the dialog?
Kathy S.
Yes, I do have something constructive to say and have done so on numerous occasions. Please tell me what is constructive about scapegoating non-Christians for this economic collapse. Do you personally believe that the problem with this economy was that you didn’t go to church enough, or do you think it is the other guy?
Stop being a hypocrite. How about you say something constructive instead of blaming this on OTHERS lack of morality.
I’m not saying the economy suffered because you believe in god, since I think it is irrelevant. You can pray your heart out, go to church, read the bible five times a day and the economy still would have tanked around you.
The problem is economic and if you read my comments around the intertubes you will see that I have a lot to say about that. That I don’t like being blamed for this economic mess had better be clear to you by now. Beck should keep his ignorant pie hole shut in this regard.
I’m trying to find video because I don’t trust my memory, but I was watching the Sharpton rally yesterday, and I thought I heard the speaker from the Department of Labor use the term “teabaggers” to refer to the other rally. He was a deputy undersecretary or something.
The Sharpton rally had two speakers from the administration, Arne Duncan and the Labor guy. ANSWER and Code Pink were also there, so it was a nice mix of commies and traitors.
The “Washington Post”, a traditional “newspaper” published a denigration (oops, sorry, I’m sure that’s a racist word) of the Tea Party movement and Glenn Beck in a “article” written by a “reporter”.
The more they hammer out the propaganda, the more ridiculous they look. Odd, and pathetic, to watch them destroy their brand in such an embarrassing manner.
Dear Brian,
After almost two years of Obamanomics, I am ready to give prayer a chance.
Sincerely,
Patrick
–
Amen to that, brother.
Dear Patrick,
You. Rock.
v/r,
Linda
Obama is a Christian. Apparently prayer doesn’t work.
Der Brian,
I’m inclined to see the President more as a cynic than a Christian. For example, he claims to have sat through 20 years of anti-American Sunday morning rants and not to have heard a single word. This strains credulity, and sounds more the story of a man who went to a particular church in order to advance his political career than that of a man tending his immortal soul.
BTW, that statement about crappy medieval economies, can you back it up? Primitive maybe, but crappy? For example, the black plague to to Europe from China. This suggests a pretty sophisticated trading environment. Maybe not as sophisticated as ours, what with out jumbo jets and all, but nothing to sneeze at either.
Patrick
–
Being anti-American is perfectly compatible with being a Christian. Look at the Westboro Baptist Church.
<>
You think he IS a Christian, or he SAYS he is a Christian?
Anyway, people who are afraid of religion seems just as silly to me as those who try to push it down other people’s throat. Both are equally adamant in their opinion about God’s existence, and equally impervious to reason.
So he’s a Muslim and he prays. What’s the difference? Nothing. Just as ineffective.
Christian? Really?
And, who said Obama actually prayed about the economy or what he should do as President?
Obama sure is praying about something. If he isn’t then I’m sure one of your half million Beck followers probably put their hands together and did so. Are you saying that all these people believe in the effectiveness of prayer and yet are to obtuse to figure out they should pray for an economic “miracle”.
Ha ha, very clever. If only things were that simple (which is like saying if only we lived in a different Universe).
Regarding prayer, it is a kind of work which can secure divine help God wants to give us, but for whatever reason, is conditional on our asking. It is condition on it being 1) God’s will, 2) our asking with real intent and 3)(this is the hardest part) being willing to follow the answer we recieve even if it contradicts our own dearly held worldview. I would also suggest that whoever does the praying should do their best to ascertain weather or not God truely loves us and has our best interests at heart (not impossible). This makes it much easier to follow step 3. I’m not especially brilliant or wise, but I have given this a lot of thought. One of my great fears is of following a belief system my whole life that turns out to be not true.
By the way, thanks for your point of view (I hate echo chambers). It is a point of view I might share if I hadn’t had answers to my own prayers so many times.
A good person offers help if they can give it regardless of whether they are asked and especially if it doesn’t involve much effort on their part. If you see a baby drowning in a bucket then how much effort is it to lift them out? Do you need the parents to ask first? How much less effort is it for God to pull the baby out? God fails this very simple test of ethics.
No, I think it is apparent that you have not done much thinking about this. Not critical thinking.
I appreciate your courtesy however.
#2 Brian Macker 8/29 @6:27AM. Mr. Macker – Christians overcame the Romans; the Barbarians; they brought todays European countries OUT of the dark ages not INTO them; helped create the period of Elightenment in the 1700′s; and created America – the greatest and most free nation of all.
In 2002, a prominent Chinese economist (Dr.Peter Zhao Xiao) studied America and concluded it was our values that made our economic progress possible. Further, that those values were based on Christian principles. Once a Communist, Dr. Xiao converted to Christianity as a result of his work. MORE IMPORTANT he’s now helping the Chinese Government apply Christian principles in China. He formed the Cypress Leadership Institute to help Chinese business persons apply those principles.
Return to Honor was intended to honor our country, our founding principles and raise funds for fallen warriors.
It is YOU, who are full of excrement, not Glenn Beck, not Christians, and not American Patriots. Go elsewhere to try to drive a wedge between us – it won’t work now, and IT WON’T WORK IN NOVEMBER!
What exactly are the Christian values that are applicable to economic policy?
There are some Christian values that are applicable but unfortunately their are also other contradictory values that are also applicable. Christianity therefore becomes a useless criteria for deciding. That’s why some Christians take the economic route of the Amish, others the Catholic treasure vaults, and still others the televangelist.
Should we get rid of money changers based on what Jesus did, or do we interpret that differently?
The original roots of both socialism and communism come from such interpretations.
Obviously one shouldn’t turn to the bible to learn Austrian economics, it’s not there. I was actually on a reptile forum once where some kid insisted the bible was the best book to use for herptile care, and I assume because some adult told him it was an infallible guide. Christians think these things without actually checking the entire context of the book. A book that instructs both good and bad is no guide.
So you admit that Beck is political and is trying to inject religion into the tea party movement. Well then thank Beck for the wedge.
I’ve been there from the beginning. I was at several of the first tea party protests. It’s all documented on the internet.
As to your communist Chinese expert, I’d take him with a big grain of salt. He spent his life sheltered in a single ideology, like many here. I don’t blame him of being ignorant of the christian roots of socialism and communism, but he didn’t take that into account. If he knew that I doubt he would make the claims he did. The christian communist Hutterites contradict his entire thesis.
The scare quotes are but one piece of evidence of their bias.
o The term “heroes” just prior to the scare-quoted tea party was intended to be sarcastic. We do not see that term used to reference leading figures in liberal movements.
o The phrase “hallowed site of the Lincoln Memorial” was intended to suggest a trespass on the part of the rally. Did we see that term “hallowed” used to describe Ground Zero in the various Mosque stories?
o I did not attend nor see the footage. I wonder if “turn the nation back to God” really was the dominant theme. If not, then having that suggested as the dominant theme was used to elicit the reaction we see from Brian Macker above.
One can argue with my observations. I certainly can’t prove what was in the heart of the author of the article. But I do believe that was the intent of the author.
Brian,
You are full of shit.
Yes, I am, but at least I know and admit it. Unlike those who speak for some infallible god. All my beliefs are questionable. I could be wrong on any one of them.
Hey Brian….you might want to add Obama to your list ….he does believe that “praying will fix the economy”:
Green Shepherd Obama
Filed under: Government, Obama, Religion — DRJ @ 7:57 pm
[Guest post by DRJ]
http://patterico.com/2010/04/24/green-shepherd-obama/
In the run up to his Presidential campaign, Barack Obama spoke about his religious faith and affirmed it would help him govern:
“But what I am suggesting is this – secularists are wrong when they ask believers to leave their religion at the door before entering into the public square. Frederick Douglas, Abraham Lincoln, Williams Jennings Bryant, Dorothy Day, Martin Luther King – indeed, the majority of great reformers in American history – were not only motivated by faith, but repeatedly used religious language to argue for their cause. So to say that men and women should not inject their “personal morality” into public policy debates is a practical absurdity. Our law is by definition a codification of morality, much of it grounded in the Judeo-Christian tradition.
……..and Obama apparently feels he needs “guidance from God” because of “all the stuff on his plate.”
President Barack Obama says he’s gone from praying nightly before going to bed to praying all the time because he has a “lot of stuff” on his plate and needs “guidance all the time.”
Obama made the comments in an interview to air Thursday on ABC’s “Nightline.”
………Obama not only seeks guidance…. from according to you Brian…the “stupid” practice of consulting God…..he feels he is God’s instrument:
OBAMA’S PRAYER
By the way, an alert reader spotted this exchange from Barack Obama’s January interview with Beliefnet.com:
Q: Is it difficult in the rough and tumble of campaign politics to stick to that, to live out your faith? And can you talk about whether you have a favorite prayer or what you pray about?
Obama: The prayer that I tell myself every night is a fairly simple one: I ask in the name of Jesus Christ that my sins are forgiven, that my family is protected and that I am an instrument of God’s will. I’m constantly trying to align myself to what I think he calls on me to do. And sometimes you hear it strongly and sometimes that voice is more muted.
(OOOOHHHH MMMMMYYYYYY GOOOODDDDDD!!!,did he say he is an instrument of God’s will?,Ruuuunnnnn from the Crusader,Run awwwwaaaayyyy!!!)
…..Unfortunately….God may have decided to let the nightmare of the Obama take it’s course so that the American public can learn first hand how ignorant and dangerous it is to allow liberals to run the country.
Yes, Obama is an idiot too but I thought that was obvious.
Actually, Brian, Medieval countries were not so much into the “God thing” as you put it as they were the poor and downtrodden being controlled by the ruler du jour (sometimes that “ruler” being a so-called religious figure who was more interested in wresting power from said ruler). If everyone in this country had a good real understanding of history, and it’s propensity to repeat itself when not used as a learning tool, we wouldn’t be in the mess we’re in now. CHARACTER does matter. And, as I saw someone else comment yesterday – it doesn’t really matter how many/few people you think were at the National Mall yesterday, come November, you’re going to get a pretty accurate count. May God grant us what we deserve, and for my children’s sake, I pray it isn’t more of the same (or worse).
Nonsense, religion in 99% of history has been about justifying rulers and not tearing them down. That includes Christianity. Learn your history, the Catholic church was an extremely powerful political entity. Modern times are the exception to that rule and it is because we have thrown off the shackles of religion in politics.
Brian,
Does it hurt to be that shallow?
I’m going to pray for you this mornning.
Says someone who probably hasn’t thought outside the chains his beliefs put upon him. How’s that Doubting Thomas story working to broadening your shallow thinking?
Dear Brian Macker, you describe Glenn Beck (and thus by association the 600,000+ who attended) as “full of shit”.
How would you describe someone who made such a statement about an event without ever having WATCHED the event (other than packaged LameStreamMedia sniping)??
This phrase from the Declaration of Independence is the real key to Beck’s rally at the Lincoln Memorial: “Endowed by Their Creator with Certain Unalienable Rights…”
Try substituting “Endowed by Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi with Certain Rights…” and you will instantly see the problem. Whatever your faith or lack thereof.
Our Founders KNEW this. The feckless power-hungry politicians who scheme and dream to expand and extend their power at OUR expense cannot be whence our rights derive. Or we are doomed!
Restoring HONOR also means restoring the guarantor of our rights: the CREATOR.
I believe firmly and strongly in that Creator…in God. But even those who do not should take comfort in knowing someone OTHER than Obama or Piglosi has endowed their rights!!
Think long and hard on that. The rally was NOT about sitting back and praying to fix our problems…which you would have known had you watched the whole thing.
If a creator endowed our rights then they are alienable by him. They have already been alienated by God via Mohammad’s direct and infallible Quran, which came after Christ in order to do so.
Oops.
Now if only our rights were inalienable, not on the say so of words put in the mouths of dieties, but on the grounds of reason. That might just stick, and would be much easier to swallow than based on the claims coming from some guy who supposedly walked on water, and did parlor tricks like turning water to wine. Especially since Jesus never even wrote down the Bill of Rights. In fact, the bill of rights came out of a movement to use reason, NOT DOGMA, to determine what was right and wrong.
When will you fundamentalist Christians learn some history?
I’m looking on the bright side, at least they’re not calling them “teabaggers” anymore.
Brian Macker is full of shit. This has everything to do with our nation turning it’s back on our founding faith. God is the solution. I choose prayer. Brian and his ilk can do what they’ve always done, mock; belittle; ignore;etc….idiots.
So you want to go back to our Christian roots? That would be the Puritans and they were as bad as the Taliban. Be careful what you wish for. Women didn’t have the vote and I’m not sure their property rights were fully respected either.
Your comments are funny after a week in which the White House worked hard to persuade us that the One isn’t a Muslim.
Easily half a million people come to our Mall to discuss our highest ideals, our meaning as a people and you regard it as a primitive exercise all about our economy.
Apparently all your classes in Marxism has blinded you to non-economic human motivatiom
“Praying isn’t going to fix the economy, stupids.”
No. Getting the scumbag democrat maggot leftists who caused this mess out of office is what will fix the economy, you brainless bigot.
“No. Getting the scumbag democrat maggot leftists who caused this mess out of office is what will fix the economy, you brainless bigot.”
The leftist didn’t cause this economic mess, they only contributed to it. The Republicans bear a hefty share of the responsibility here. One of the people most responsible was Alan Greenspan and he’s hardly a leftist. In fact his roots are in Objectivism, he is an apostate from that atheist cult. I have no idea what his current religious beliefs are but they are hardly leftist.
Who took us completely off the gold standard? Richard Nixon, a republican and supposed anti-communist, a person who might as well have been a communist with his wage and price controls. The fact that we are not on a gold standard is one small factor in making the economy that less stable.
I know what is wrong with the economy and exactly how to “fix” it. The republicans almost always vote in economic idiots like Nixon, McCain, Bush, etc. What could be more clueless than McCain telling us the economy was healthy during the collapse. I knew it wasn’t healthy back during the Clinton reign.
Even though Reagan was far, far better than other Republicans and Democrats he still didn’t ken what would make the economy strong and stable, and allowed a massive buildup of government debt.
Just like the “maggot leftists” most Republicans don’t want the truth, don’t understand economics, and won’t fix the things that need fixing.
At this point I just hope for not making things worse. Bush allowed enormous stimulous and other programs to go through. Now Obama has done like eight times worse. The Democrats certainly need to be voted out but then we are stuck with the stupid Republicans again. They will be fixated on abortion, patriotic flag nonsense, putting religion into the schools, and other bad things instead of fixing the economy. Just like the democrats are fixated on their own non-economic nonsense.
While we’re on the subject of praying for a better economy, doesn’t it appear almost as if that’s what the Obama administration is doing? Wishful thinking will make it happen. The evidence of dozens of managed economies sinking further and further into poverty is clear for all to see. The evidence of economies like Hong Kong and Singapore that had very light government becoming economic powerhouses despite their pathetic size. But maybe if they just pray harder this time it will work, after all they intend well, right?
Yes it does and no it doesn’t. Obama is praying but he also is doing other economic actions. Incredibly stupid economic actions that amount to political payoffs. He was told the Cash For Clunkers program would only have negative effects and it it. The GM bailout negated the markets cleansing process, and rewarded greedy union members at the expense of frugal savers. Increasing government spending to obscene levels on the stupid theory that government make-work is equivalent to real work requested by purchasing power in the marketplace [power gained by making things other people voluntarily want].
Yeah Brian … leftist utopian socialism has proven to be so much better than Judeo-Christian values. Orwel be burned. Save us Big Brother.
Scot,
You are just another Christian bigot to ashamed to use your own name. Just because I’m not a Christian doesn’t mean I’m a socialist, you bigot.
In George Washington’s farewell address, he noted that we the liberty granted citizens under our Constitution, that religious morality was required. The past fifty years or so have provided ample evidence that he was right. “Anything Goes” from a personal and cultural standpoint has led us to the brink of collapse. And “anything goes” is pretty much the hallmark of the progressive movement.
We will bury you.
PS: WaPo hacks–there were 100x more people at Beck’s rally, yet you failed to mention it and concentrated on the race hustler Sharpton instead. How do you wake up in the morning and NOT feel like complete idiots?
While Brian is unnecessarily abusive of the former president and Christianity, he is correct in that the Tea Party movement has famously ignored issues popular with cultural conservatives, including “turning the nation … to God” and “traditional values,” which presumably include constitutional amendments against abortion and gay unions.
“While Brian is unnecessarily abusive of the former president and Christianity”
You know, Bush actually wanted to be president, just like Obama, without knowing jack about economics. He should have fired Greenspan on his first day of office for the stuff he pulled during the Clinton administration. I think he deserves quite a bit of abuse. I gave it too him while he was office and I will now. There’s a reason he was known as a drunk sailor. His stupid tariffs weren’t sound economics either.
Now Ron Paul, he’s a guy that knew something about economics who actually ran for president. The rest of them, including McCain are dopes. They deserve abuse because they are clueless of the fact that they do not have the qualifications to run the country.
Surely you don’t want me to go into the horrible past of Christianity, or even the present. It will be quite ugly. Would you like to learn about the Inquisition or Christian Reconstructionists? Don’t bother giving me that Catholic revisionist history either. We’re onto that, just like we’re onto the coverup with that pedophilia thing.
These are people who actually share your beliefs. It’s not like they are related to you merely by the fact that they fail to believe in leprechauns. If deep faith were the solution then surely the Vatican should be the model (or Iran) not the US constitution. Christian Theocracy is the way to go.
The Roman Inquisition or the Spanish Inquistion, Brian?
Is this an attempt a tu quoque? Guess what I’m not a Roman polytheist. So your direction here is going to fail on two accounts. Even if I believed in the god Jupiter that doesn’t make the Christian Inquisition right. It further fails because I don’t believe in Jupiter.
You know which inquisition since it is clear from context.
Also the Roman’s scapegoated the Christians for being atheists of their gods. I’m sure they also blamed you atheists for causing the “moral decline” of their country which was actually also an economic problem.
Tu Quoque fails because it justifies a wrong by pointing to another wrong. In this case I am showing your wrong by comparing it to another wrong. So this isn’t Tu Quoque, and not a fallacy.
What a wonderful, new example of snobby leftism you’ve discovered! The elite media has been full of it recently. For example, after hearing the attendance numbers for the “dueling” Sharpton event, I predicted the elite media types would headline yesterday as “Thousands Attend Two Rallies in DC” — with no distinction as to the real number of participants at either event. Three minutes later, I heard my prediction come true in an ABC radio news announcement. Details are here:
Over HALF A MILLION at the Restoring Honor Rally in DC Today.
That Brian is a really good troll. Feeding him makes his day. Troll = FOOL.
I’m a troll because I object to Beck’s scapegoating of atheists? Your argument works as well as those claiming you [and me] are racists for opposing Obama’s stupid economic policies.
Is there no virtue among us? If there be not, we are in a wretched situation. No theoretical checks, no form of government, can render us secure. To suppose that any form of government will secure liberty or happiness without any virtue in the people, is a chimerical idea. If there be sufficient virtue and intelligence in the community, it will be exercised in the selection of these men; so that we do not depend upon their virtue, or put confidence in our rulers, but in the people who are to choose them. – James Madison
I don’t view them as scare quotes. This is not literally a tea party. No tea is being served. I don’t like capitalizing the words, because I don’t want the movement to turn into another political party, concerned only with fund raising and winning elections, even if it has to sell its soul to do it. We need the tea party movement, which is the spirit of people who refuse to accept unjust and excessive impositions by government.
With the growth of the federal government from partner with the states into their master, our republic, i.e. government by the people, has subtly moved toward oligopoly. Our founders were aware of the temptations of concentrated power, and they attempted to place obstacles to it in the design of the federal government. The modern tea party movement, it seems to me, is driven by a desire to return to that original vision of a self-governing people.
I’m not a church goer, and I don’t care enough about religion to be agnostic or atheist. But I do see a country in deep trouble. When we joke about consecutive Illinois governors going to jail or that in Louisiana we have to “vote for the crook” because the other guy’s a KKKer, then we don’t just have corruption in politics, it’s indicative of a corrupt society.
The Restoring Honor rally was not about reforming politics, it’s about reforming ourselves. Once we better ourselves then we will have better government. Beck does think that you need religion & God to do that. I’m not sure he’s right or wrong on that, I don’t know. But his religiosity doesn’t bother or offend or threaten me. No one’s does (unless that includes hijacking planes & flying them into buildings).
What does threaten me is a politician who views our Constitution as merely a charter of negative rights that needs to be replaced.
The Restoring Honor rally was not about reforming politics, it’s about reforming ourselves.
Dead. On. Target.
As others have said, it is about acknowledging that the configuration of our unalienable rights is “above the pay grade” of any human being.
As others need to do, it is also about recognizing the limitations of human perception … and that we should stop blindly assuming that we are omniscient, as those who stridently deny the relevance of spiritual worldviews so often assume.
“The Restoring Honor rally was not about reforming politics, it’s about reforming ourselves.”
What’s this “we” shit paleface?
Your comment is a perfect example of the reforming we (including you) need. But I don’t expect you to get it.
Are you planning on outlawing jokes in your new moral demo-theocracy? The current economic mess is mostly due to government policies, and not jokes.
See how that works. If you insinuate a claim without spelling it out then I get to frame your comment. How about you make explicit what you were trying to imply about me based on my comment pointing out I’m not a member of this supposed group in need of reform, moral reform.
I question the idea that somehow I share the moral turpitude that you wish guiltily to bath in. You might be right about yourself since we are strangers I wouldn’t know. I’ll take your word for it. I do however know that you are blowing smoke about me since you know nothing about me.
I’m not on welfare, I’m not a drunk, I don’t smoke. I do have guilty pleasures like bacon, but I doubt that was the cause of the current economic collapse. No, I think instead it was due to the government trying to force morality, like charity, on the populous. The housing bubble is in part driven by charitable goals the government had.
Problem is that when government tries to force morality that doesn’t make the people moral. Morality comes from within. Christians, Muslims, Socialists, and Marxists all have a long history of attempting to enforce morality via law, and screwing up the economics of a country.
They are empty-headed, lazy hacks. J-schools across the land do not attract the brightest students. J-schools attract lazy students who, because they don’t know anything, become mockers.
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”
Our current leaders have neither morality or religion
to restrain them; That is how they got us into this mess.
The religious Left is afraid of the religious Right,
with good reason; The RL knows what they would do to
the RR, and fear (correctly) that the RR will do the
same to them.
Neither fringe element represents the centrist majority
of the US, and neither will ever gain political power.
Chill.
“God is part of the problem”
No the problem is what it has always been, people who won’t honor this…
“When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.”
“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed…”
Turn away from God, and you turn away from that. Turn away from that and the next thing you know, one man will own another man.
And, I’m not turning away from that just because some atheist nitwit finds the concept that there’s something greater than they are offensive and emotionally unsatisying.
What the DOI, the heart of America, says is worth something.
What atheists spew is prideful gibberish…at best.
Our creator is Natural Selection, so I don’t have a problem with that statement from the Declaration of Independence.
I wouldn’t however capitalize Natural Selection. Oh, wait a second, I would.
Our rights are derivable by reason not faith. The framers used reason to deduce that the Divine Rights of Kings doctrine was false, not religion. Faith allows contradictions.
“Turn away from God, and you turn away from that. Turn away from that and the next thing you know, one man will own another man.”
Your religion has corrupted your reasoning skills. Belief in god is perfectly compatible with slavery. God is compatible with any idea or state of affairs, and especially when married to faith which allows contradiction in. God is a universal explanation and therefore explains nothing. In can explain the need to kill the infidel, or the murder of a baby.
Tell me why god murdered all those babies during Noah’s flood? Answer: God works in mysterious ways, have faith. Result: God can be used to excuse or justify any atrocity, just as he can be used to justify any good thing.
“And, I’m not turning away from that just because some atheist nitwit finds the concept that there’s something greater than they are offensive and emotionally unsatisying.”
There’s plenty of things and people greater than myself. Tiger woods is a greater golfer, and the sun a greater energy source. What’s to find offensive or emotionally unsatisfying in that?
Sure it would be great if I could play golf as great as Tiger, but I wouldn’t presume to give golf tips as if I were him. You on the other hand seem to think that if you were a fan of Tiger that would put you in the position to give advice like a golf pro. Being a fan of an imaginary hero you like to worship doesn’t make your advice superior to others.
Your advice is just as fallible as the next guys and needs to be examined critically just like every other idea. That’s because humans are fallible, and that includes in their choice of religious belief.
I never asked you to throw away the Declaration of Independence, that you assume so shows that you are yet another bigot.
I rejected Christianity for the same reasons the Deists did. Why do you reject Deism? Science has moved on since the days of deism and there is really no longer any reason to believe that the existence of man and the creatures that inhabit the world requires a creator. So I reject Deism as well. That doesn’t mean I reject morality, or natural rights.
There are good reasons (think rationality and reason) for accepting morality and natural rights that are quite independent of who created me. If your father was a drunk and instructed you to beat your wife then I don’t think you should take the fact that he created you into account and as any indication of what you should do. Who your creator is does not imply who has moral authority.
Nor does power. Even if there were a more powerful alien society, or entity, that doesn’t necessarily mean they have moral authority. Especially if they go around killing first borne males, and drowning babies indiscriminately in floods. Is being born first a crime? Hell, how do you justify killing an innocent baby on discrimination in the first place?
The lesson of the bible in most places is might makes right, hardly a proper moral guide. Certainly not what the Declaration of Independence was about. No, those values were accumulated over time, and quite independently of most of the lessons of the bible.
“What atheists spew is prideful gibberish…at best.”
No, I just followed my conscience to discover that Christianity was false and immoral. Don’t mistake critical thinking and freedom of conscience for pride. I didn’t reject Christianity because I wanted free reign. I rejected it because it taught rules of thought that were prone to error, including moral error. Doubt and questioning is a good thing. If only the Muslims would do so with regard to Mohammad, but they to make doubt taboo, and questioning a moral crime.
Questioning cannot be a moral crime since we are born ignorant and need it to build our moral character.
thanks, brian, for hanging in there and putting up with the reflexive abuse from the ‘loving’ religious types.
i’ve said from day one that the tea party movement, as well as the GOP, need to stick to the issues of fiscal responsibility and smaller government if they/we hope to be successful..particularly with young voters. reverting to an old-time-religious-revival mode is a big loser, unless all you want to do is to goose the choir. for all the good points made at the rally, those messages were lost in the incessant calls for a mass return to an indoctrinate mythology. the biggest political movement of my lifetime is being hijacked by the preachers..how sad. it’s not too late to steer the ship away, but right now we’re headed into that same damned iceberg that we’ve rammed time and again throughout history.
Another aspect of the Tea Party that I found offensive at the rallies was over the overly patriotic symbolism, like signing the national anthem, god bless america, waving the flag, and the like. Patriotism is the first refuge of a scoundrel, and it is a waste of time to listen to speakers talk about how patriotic they are. Socialists do that all the time. In fact a socialist wrote the Pledge of Allegiance.
I am an atheist, and do have some heartburn about the religious baggage among the Tea Partiers, but I’m afraid this is inevitable. The “cold civil war” we are engaged in is, in fact, largely a religious war between the two major religions in the US: Marxism and Christianity. Unfortunately, it seems to take a religion to beat a religion. What we need is a new religion that Marxists can believe in. I propose a space alien cult:
http://home.earthlink.net/~peter.a.taylor/midrash.htm
“I am an atheist”
Believe anything you want, pal, but America was built around the ideas that…
1.) There is a God.
2.) We have rights given to us by that God.
3.) Governments exist to secure those rights.
That’s the deal, and it was put to a vote, and everybody agreed to it, and we’re not going to change our covenant to satisy your peculiar beliefs.
“God is part of the problem”
Feel free to move to the PRC or Cubs; there you can experience the blessings of a system of governance that is Godless by design.
Enjoy.
Everybody? Only in your fantasies. The god language was just a socially acceptable form of communication, like using he to mean both genders.
The entire idea of natural rights came out of the Age of Enlightenment.
John Locke discussed natural rights in his work, identifying them as being “life, liberty, and estate (property)”. Sound familiar. Locke being a prime example of “The Age of Reason” did not use authoritarian edicts by God in order to derive his conclusions, he used mans natural attributes to derive his conclusions by reason, and rejection of religions prior claims. Locke did not proceed by claiming god said this and god said that the way Mohammad would.
Thomas Paine even wrote a book titled the “Age of Reason” that got him branded an atheist. His support of natural rights was instrumental to the revolution.
Since you are under the false impression that somehow god is require to deduce Natural Rights, how about you make your derivation without recourse to claims about human nature, and only refer to laws enacted by God. When exactly did God inform us that our rights are derived from nature? When did god, by edict, claim we have freedom of speech? When did he ever claim we had freedom of conscious, freedom of association, freedom of religion.
What a joke, the Christian god claiming that people have freedom of religion. LOL. Isn’t he the guy who burns you in hell for not polishing his ego.
“Feel free to move to the PRC or Cubs; there you can experience the blessings of a system of governance that is Godless by design.”
It’s Leprechaunless by design also. How about you move to Spain during the Inquistion or an endless list of other Christian hell holes.
Why is it that bigots can’t help themselves but try to instruct people to “go back to Africa” by analogy.
I wouldn’t want to live in North Korea nor Cuba because I’m not a communist. In fact, I object to communism even more so than I do to Christianity. It’s just another faith based religion to me.
Oh, and I mentioned the leprechaunless nature of communist countries because since you seem to share that lack of belief, and you think lack of belief is grounds for moving there, you’d want to consider it.
A belief in some power greater than yourself is a source of strength for many.
“There are no atheists in a foxhole” is universally understood by soldiers; prayer may not promise hope or a miraculous escape from death, but it often gives one the strength to go bear what must be borne.
This nation was founded on the highest of principles, and chief among them was the sure knowledge that Providence reflected in the deeds of our citizens would be the surest way to secure and keep our liberty, and our prosperity.
When we forget that, we will become a tyranny of the elite, a nation become a stranger to itself, and we will fail in this greatest experiment of Reason and Freedom ever to exist.
Lest some of you forget, this nation was born in blood. In 1861, the Union was tempered yet again in the blood og patriots and came out stronger than before. If it is to die, then I forsee that ending as violent as the birth.
B Dubya,
“‘There are no atheists in a foxhole’ is universally understood by soldiers”
No, it’s a bigoted statement like ‘Jews are greedy’.
Why should I believe in your god while in a foxhole? According to your beliefs God works in mysterious ways and may just decide to give me cancer while I’m in or out of the foxhole. Much more comforting to believe in a war god like Mars who is going to kill my enemies directly.
Of course, Christianity isn’t exactly known for being consistent so it is perfectly acceptable that Yehweh will behave as a war god. I think you can think of a few good bible stories like that.
That and god drowning babies which is one of the things the Deists found objectionable about the bible. They thought it was a defamation of god.
How about if the Amish came up with the slogan, “There are no Christians in foxholes” Do you think you’d like it. From their perspective it would at least be true. From your perspective you know that there are atheists in foxholes.
You think Stalin fought hitler and murdered all those people with theists? Come on, even I would grant there were a few atheists in the mix. I wouldn’t however call them out for lack of faith. They had faith in communism, another huckster ideology.
“thanks, brian, for hanging in there and putting up with the reflexive abuse from the ‘loving’ religious types.”
Spare me.
Your little buddy came in here spewing insults and bristling with hostility from his very first post.
Act like a rude, spoiled child…and, you get treated like a rude, spoiled child.
Exactly and what is more rude that Glenn Becks childish scapegoating of non-Christians [and your support of it].
What is more rude than designing your moral beliefs around the idea that others who don’t believe as you do deserve eternal torment. Glenn started this by scapegoating non-believers. You guys need a rude awakening that this kind of crap isn’t going to be tolerated.
Wake up, the Islamists believe in God just as much as you do if not more so and their economies are the biggest jokes ever. If pure faith and insistence on following Gods rules strictly were the answer then you should be happy about the coming of Sharia.
God and politics do not mix well. A lesson of the “Great Awakening” that you guys have never learned.
A fundamental fallacy here is the notion that “God-given rights” is a religious statement. It is not. It is Enlightenment-era shorthand meaning explicit rejection of the prevailing (at that time) notion that rights were granted by the grace of kings. Nowadays we would call it something more along the lines of “natural rights” – another general concept which means little more than the rejection of arbitrary human authority.
Founding-era thinkers would have believed that appealing to God for our rights was futile; they certainly didn’t expect Him to do anything to extend those rights to the populace – not even to white male landowners. No lights were seriously expected to knock the British ruling class off their horses. If the new state was going to happen, men had to make it happen by their own efforts. The same is true today.
Also, being back-country (or, in some cases, full urban) lawyers, the founders knew that a word like “God” stands for a nebulous concept. When people invoke God today, they really invoke a particular religion’s idea of God. The concept of “God” itself is too general; does one mean the God of the Old Testament? The New Testament? The Apocrypha? The Book of Mormon? The Koran? In theory, they are nominally the same, but their behavior and their laws as explicated to the Prophets are quite different. The religious men of the Enlightenment were, in the main, Deists. Deists ascribe little importance to Scripture; but that, of course, makes it difficult to determine just what God may have had in mind for the organization of human society.
Now, how to determine how one is going to act here in the earthly plane, and finding the inner strength to persist, is up to the individual. If religion helps one do it, fine, but that’s not the only way. Some men of the Enlightenment thought that strength and conviction could be based on philosophy. Some modern men think so, too. The Founders didn’t specify how we were to find our own inner resources. If they had wanted to specify that, they wouldn’t have gone to such trouble to deny the federal government the ability to maintain a state religion. They appear to have been wise enough to realize that other Americans could be fully functional while relying on internal beliefs which differed from their own.
Put it another way; I’m not a patriot because of belief in God, I’m a patriot because of belief in America.
“that rights were granted by the grace of kings.”
… and specifically a rejection of the belief in the divide right of kings.