The headline tells half the story: Israeli guards aboard Italian cruise ship repel pirates off Somalian coast .
A German-Italian cruise ship with 1,500 people on board fended off a pirate attack far off the coast of Somalia on Saturday, in which the vessel’s private Israeli security force exchanged fire with the bandits and drove them off, the ship’s commander said yesterday. … Domenico Pellegrino, head of the cruise line, said Msc Cruises hired the Israelis because they were the best-trained security staff, the ANSA news agency reported. Security work aboard cruise ships is very popular among young Israelis just out of the army; the job is seen as a chance to save money and travel at the same time. Hundreds of veterans and reservists of elite Israel Defense Force units, including the naval commandos, are employed in security work on cruise ships and oil rigs in areas subject to pirate attacks.
The other half of the story is hidden in the BBC’s account. “Samantha Hendey from Durban, South Africa, told the BBC that her sister Tabitha Nicholson was on board the ship during the attack and the situation was ]pretty dramatic’. ‘She said that there were lots of passengers on deck watching it unfold and they even took action themselves by throwing chairs overboard, trying to hit the pirates,’ Samantha said.” While deck chairs are not exactly effective antiship weapons, the incident seems to suggest that while the Israeli security men were brave and professional, there was no inherent inhibition in the European, nor indeed the human genome, against self-defense. All it needed to awaken was leadership and example. Then the pirates beat a hasty retreat. If the pirates have been gaining against civilization of late, it probably has less to do with the timidity of peoples, who after all, are cut from the same genetic cloth as the hunter-gatherers of 10,000 BC, then with defects of politicians, who imagine themselves to be above it all.
Getting weird about fighting pirates is really odd–I am a lawyer–that pirates are to be killed is a foundation of international law–I don’t really understand what’s happening to the West. Indian Navy sunk that pirate ship last fall and then got criticized–what do I call a Thai fishing boat that’s been taken over by the pirates–ahhh–a pirate ship, liable to being sunk!!
I think a lot of this has to do with the Euro-weenies being afraid that if we uphold traditional international law and “go to town” on the pirates, this will legitimize our (i.e., USA’s) treatment of AlQaeda–e.g., Guantanamo/Bagram, etc.
India has been being attacked by Muslims for the past 1200 years–Americans should do more to team up with India (well, I am an American now, and, yes, Indians can be weird on this topic b/c they’re too much (IMO) into Gandhi). But the USA could do well to leverage average opinion in India to help out with the GWoT.
A start would be teaming up to crush these Somali pirates, “old-school” style!!
Is it an awakening due to the presence of leadership and example, or the fact that the Israelis provided a greater sense of security. Although it is reassuring that the passengers took an active role, albeit highly improvised, in repelling the pirates.
RaviT, is it not so much the Euro-weenies being afraid of legitimising the treatment of AlQaeda, but maybe more the management of their perception. The destruction of a vessel sends a strong message, both to the pirates and the world, but is it the message that countries are willing to send out to the world?
I’m not sure what you mean by this “management of their perception” issue–can you say more?
Talk about audacity! 5-6 of these punks were so confident in their ability to dominate that they were going to take on a huge cruise ship of at least 1500 people. These wolves have had it very easy with nobody tending the sheep at all, until now.
A few mother ships of these Islamopirates need to be sunk. This really is getting ridiculous. It won’t take much to seriously deter them. Ships have to be armed, particularly French and American flagged ones after the death threats. I wonder if there are any American flagged vessels left besides official humanitarian ones and yachts though.
“A few mother ships of these Islamopirates need to be sunk.” –Sam
I agree. I think a catastrophic mid-night “work accident” could be arraigned for these mother ships and no civilized nation would care. The open sea can be very dangerous for pirates.
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Looks like a few good Israelis know
how to “Christianize, Civilize and Uplift”
The ‘Yurps.
Sooner or later there will be some form of awakening in Europe. It can’t come too soon.
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The reason people don’t fight back is because fighting back creates winners and losers.
Winners: men, particularly fighting men and weapons makers.
Losers: Women, Gays, various non-White groups (historically non combatants), Elites, SWPL Yuppies.
It’s as simple as that. Europe is dominated by people who LOSE politically if they fight back. So they don’t fight back. They meekly surrender to maintain their social power.
The French could well have conducted a fighting retreat. De Gaulle perhaps self-servingly noted in his War Memoirs that his plan for a fighting retreat to the South, boarding every ship that would float to Algeria, in his own version of Dunkirk, would have preserved the core of the French Army.
It would however have sacrificed most of the personal wealth, belongings, property, standing, and good life of most every politician in the Third Republic and so surrender was the order of the day.
Meanwhile, Balkan nations like Greece and Yugoslavia, with less to lose, fought and fought and fought, because most saw winning in the fighting, not catastrophic loss.
Europeans do not fight because fighting means a loss for their ruling groups. It’s the same reason Obama’s backers don’t want to fight.
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hey
the p.c. world is power and control-period.
step outside their established norms and you got the power over your life. take their word for how the world should be… and the power is with them 4 ever. neat game huh.
like 95% of blacks vote for obanga and they’re not racists ???? how does that work ???
No, Downtowndubai, 95% of black votes for Obama is not racist. It is a failure to capture the imaginations of those voters by others opposing the politics of folks like Obama.
It is the failure of the vision of politicians dealing with “black problems” and constituents allowing the politicians to define it as “black problems” v. representatives actually representing their constituents. Diversity sucks.
What is probably the greatest fear among black constituents is that if they fight and “lose”, they fear seeing nearly every civil rights gain they worked for rolled back in the name of “national security” or some other reason. They don’t want to see the playing field rolled back to a pre-1950s existence. And they’re so invested in preventing this problem that they don’t see (and if they did, don’t care) about the pirate problem, since it is not one of their most immediate concerns.
samIam
This really is getting ridiculous. It won’t take much to seriously deter them. Ships have to be armed…
Imagine the effect on piracy of opening a locker to arm every adult male passenger and crewman with an M-16 and ten clips. Those who don’t want to fire on the raiders would be put to work reloading clips.
Oh, the fuisilade from 500 automatic weapons directed toward a small boat (even if not top notch marksmanship). That’s a lot of zinging.
Jeez, it’s a great idea for “seaborne safaris.” Equipped with its own fast chaseboats (Cigarette-type with .50s mounted). I’m writing the business plan here. Self-funding.
$15K/per passenger for two week cruise. Gourmet food 24/7… finest accomodations and service… regimented exercise programs tailored to your age (floating fat farm?)…weapons training in hand guns, long guns and shotguns. Self-defense courses for all ages; part of every day at sea. Everybody issued colorful chic uniforms. Expert trainers/security personnel are readily available for hire, and eager according to the article.
Maybe we could bring our own favorite weaponry with a special permit, and cruise close to the coast. Probably need a letter of marque for this new type of “volunteer” Q-ship. A no cost solution.
Wow, the fortunes to be made by smaller cruise lines. Pupose-driven cruises(tm).
Richard,
Your right sidebar is cutting off the right side of the comment field.
There was a movie on TV a while back about the hijacking of the cruise ship Achille Lauro, and the murder to Leon Klinghoffer, a wheelchair-bound Jewish man.
Assuming it was somewhat accurate, I was stunned by one scene. Before the terrorists attacked, the passengers were passing the time by means of various recreational endeavors, one of which was skeet shooting.
Skeet shooting.
With shotguns.
And yet they let the terrorists take over. Admittedly, a shotgun is a poor weapon compared to an AK-47, but it is a whole lot better than a deck chair.
What they lacked – except, apparently for Mr. Klinghoffer – was anyone willing to oppose the terrorists. No leader, no guts, except an old guy in a wheelchair who was willing to tell them where to go.
By the way, do a search and find out what happened after Ronald Reagan sent the USN to capture the terrorists. Italy let them go, including one they let out of jail to go see his family for a weekend and, canyabelieveit, did not come back.
Yup, I agree. The gutless politicians are the reason so much piracy, terrorism and dictator’s flourish.
“Losers: Women …”
“…opening a locker to arm every adult male passenger …”
sigh
12. geoffgo:
Also, shark attractant would enhance the risk reward equation.
And what about the television rights?
geoffgo, an M-16 accepts a magazine, not a clip. A minor quibble, just like when the MSM shows a picture of a self-propelled gun and captions it a tank. Oh what’s the difference, guns kill who cares if the language is correct.
Nahncee,
Mea culpa. It’s just automatic for an old geezer like me…I still hold open doors for women I don’t know to permit them to proceed me.
Clearly, I meant every passenger who signed up for the seaborne safaris. I’m modifying the business “plan” to incorporate female participants in the battle plans, and remove sexist language; thanks to your insight. B^)
Has anyone noticed this happened 180m north of the Seychelles? Seems kind of far for Somali pirates.
Whiskey says:
Europe is dominated by people who LOSE politically if they fight back. So they don’t fight back. They meekly surrender to maintain their social power.
programmer asks:
Could you (or have you already in previous posts) elaborate on this concept. Pardon my obtuseness, but this seems non-intuitive, at least to me. Surrender implies loss of power in my unsophisticated view of the world.
Boiled Cabbage,
No need to chum, as the pitates will be bringing/becoming their own supply.
And what about the television rights? you ask. Well, I’m searching for the right name for a weekly show – something like “No Survivor” or “World’s Most Wanted” or “Pirates of the Indian Ocean – a Retrospective?” Johnny Depp? Nah, it won’t be make believe.
Of course, the more successful the TV series becomes, the more far ranging its reach can be. Malaka, The Med…
@16. NahnCee,
I get much less pain by just skipping those entries (they are all the same anyways…gays, women, etc etc)every once in a while a good point three or four paras down, but rarely anything new.
@17. Boiled Cabbage, I like the idea, maybe automatic chum ejectors combined with a wave generator to capsize the pirate boats. It would be fun at first, but I think it would get old after a little while.
#12 Geoffgo:
A friend and I were talking over just such a proposition last week: a “letter of marque cruise”. I hadn’t thought of the uniforms and exercise classes, but that’s a good addition. I can’t say I’m proud that Rambo wannabes would pay money to take a cruise on such a ship, but I believe it is the case. I think the next question is, would raising the ante on the pirates’ predations just be met with greater firepower? I believe it would. These guys, after all, have made millions off their piracy with very little investment. Having seen how lucrative it is, perhaps a little more investment on their part would seem a small price to pay for continued operation. F
Hey Jrod,
I’m writin the biz plan – tellin the story to potential investors. I got people to write the specs. Section iia(d) covers all that.
Besides, some of the potential investors will be confused, wonderin why half the boat would be fiddling with “magazines” in the middle of a gunfight. At least deck chairs can be thrown with some effect, while magazines tend to flutter. B^)
WRT the attitude of European ruling classes:
See Rebecca West “Black Lamb and Gray Falcon”. If you don’t have a weekend handy, just the forward and suffix.
I’d feel much safer if the ratios were reversed – if 1,500 pirates were concerned about approaching just a boat with six Westerners. Maybe if those six were known to be Israeli they would be concerned. Dorsai!
F
I can’t say I’m proud that Rambo wannabes would pay money to take a cruise on such a ship, but I believe it is the case.
I, on the other hand would be real proud that some patriots (investors, crew, passengers and Nahncee) decided that defending life and property on the high seas is a worthwhile and just cause.
would raising the ante on the pirates’ predations just be met with greater firepower? I believe it would.
Me too; but only temporarily. We have better armaments at our disposal. The jihadis/pirates won’t know which are the Q-ships. And, they’ll all likely be armed going forward.
Are you suggesting that piracy should be a continuing enterprise? Or, that arming up in defense causes the predators to arm up in response? If they intend to sink rather than ransom the ships, then it’s war not piracy, and the USN will be called.
What you worry about seems not to have happened when suitable deadly force was used against pirates in the past, say 2,000 years.
I dont care if politicians fancy themselves “above it all” just as long as they dont try to fancy every one else in the civilized world to be “above it all”
becuase its done at the cost of our lives not thiers.
its the ingrained soft lefts disdain for the sheep dog
No, it really isn’t. Your overwhelming desire to make sense of a chaotic world has caused you to latch onto the the first explanatory principle that makes sense to you, and to willfully ignore all evidence which might suggest that you don’t understand as much as you think. Your fear controls you and is creating a belief system immune to evidence and persuasion.
The world is NOT easy to understand. People are not easy to understand. It’s all complex and chaotic, and nothing is “as simple as that.”
You simply cannot lump all women, gays, and “various non-white Groups” into one bucket. As I have mentioned in other threads: Does Wretchard look white to you? Was Margaret Thatcher not a woman? Don’t John Kerry and Tony Blair stand to lose status if the Left is discredited? My wife (who clearly isn’t gay) is a non-white woman, and I assure you that if she were elected President (not that she’s eligible, being a naturalized citizen) the children of the Somalian pirates that survived what followed would whisper our name in fear for a thousand years.
Your theory is complete crap. It’s time to accept that and move on, even if that means that the world is a less predictable place than it used to be; even if it means that it’s now hard to put people in your mental buckets. If you actually seek truth, this you must do. These lies you tell yourself only provide psychological comfort to you while leaving your objectively less safe and your would-be allies alienated and offended.
I say next time the pirates take a ship we send in Obama to personally negotiate the captive’s release. I always like to link authority and accountability that way.
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“I am a lawyer” but an ignorant one, France doesn’t care of your international conventions on piracy, beside we have a tradition of “corsaires” and their soirit is still dictationg our reaction as far as piracy and or hijacking our ships or planes—> no quater, booommm !
“I think a lot of this has to do with the Euro-weenies being afraid that if we uphold traditional international law and “go to town” on the pirates”
yeah, read that in “Pif the gadget”
Whiskey’s problem isn’t that he hasn’t correctly identified the problem – he has, or at least a significant component of it. It is that after identifying the problem, he doesn’t offer any suggestions other than stockpiling food and ammunition, and hiding in the basement until you can see which way the wind is blowing the mushroom cloud.
It’s not just him – a lot of people on the right seem to have given up. I’ve certainly felt that way. We can and must reach out to women, minorities, etc., somewhere between alienating them and pandering to them.
If the pirates have been gaining against civilization of late, it probably has less to do with the timidity of peoples, who after all, are cut from the same genetic cloth as the hunter-gatherers of 10,000 BC, then with defects of politicians, who imagine themselves to be above it all.
If you haven’t done so yet, please read The Coming of the Fourth American Republic. The author correctly identifies the problem, the one underneath whiskey’s hypothesis. It is that all special interest groups – even the one we like, The Pentagon – are all fighting each other for more of the pie. As the pie shrinks the harder they fight.
How else can we explain the spectacle of a billion dollar warship impotently staring down four teenagers in a life raft for several days? The best answer they can come up with is the bloated, hideously expensive Littoral Combat Ship – $500 million a pop. The only thing different about it is that its impotence would be on display for the cameras much closer to the shoreline.
For that kind of money we could buy hundreds of small boats, slap some armor and some .50s on them, and end the piracy off Somalia in three months.
What the West lacks is solid leadership – someone who can stand up to all of these groups and say ‘no more.’
“It’s as simple as that. Europe is dominated by people who LOSE politically if they fight back. So they don’t fight back. They meekly surrender to maintain their social power.
The French could well have conducted a fighting retreat. De Gaulle perhaps self-servingly noted in his War Memoirs that his plan for a fighting retreat to the South, boarding every ship that would float to Algeria, in his own version of Dunkirk, would have preserved the core of the French Army.
It would however have sacrificed most of the personal wealth, belongings, property, standing, and good life of most every politician in the Third Republic and so surrender was the order of the day.
Meanwhile, Balkan nations like Greece and Yugoslavia, with less to lose, fought and fought and fought, because most saw winning in the fighting, not catastrophic loss.
Europeans do not fight because fighting means a loss for their ruling groups. It’s the same reason Obama’s backers don’t want to fight”
funny you said that of de Gaulle, some others would swear that de Gaulle was sold to the commies, and, yes, they also would vent that they had read de Gaulle’s war memories ! LMAO
the truth is de Gaulle had no decisional power, he was just a colonel that ride a tank in the ardennes, far from the very battelfield of Belgium, now his upsetting on those that signed the “cessez le feu” is righteous, just that the war had to be carried on a larger perspective, a single country couldn’t make it by itself, or if it wanted to commit suicide, I don’t think it was de Gaulle project, he cared enough of the french population for having himself been actor in 2 WW, and that’s why he decided to join Churchill, in spite of all the barreers of misunderstandings between the both men.
So your understanding of the stakes just show your narrowness and orientated view on a “feminised societye”, funny the persons that are so harsh on women are often gays that don’t want to come out LMAO
Brock,
Whiskey’s hypothesis is supported by voting patterns/political positions of certain demographic groups. You can’t rebut that by mentioning prominent exceptions. And certainly not by derogatory characterizations.
As to why the left-wing elite prefer eventual societal suicide to a loss of status that would be immediate, they expect to have died of natural causes before the societal suicide affects them.
Yes, Whiskey has for the most part identified the problem. Throwing up outlier counterexamples at the far end of some bell curve doesn’t negate his analysis (come on now, that’s a lefty trick!).
In terms of this issue, the dispersion of the nuclear family (defined as husband, wife, child) and the rise of the postmodern family (defined as state, child, woman) does not create a fertile ground for individuals and social systems which can generate an historically Western style of exceptionalism and defense (as per VDH). The effect of gay men may be overstated by Whiskey (due to their small numbers, IMO), but the corrosion brought about by emasculated urban men subservient to leftist women in order to get sex – colloquially known as metrosexuals – is also correctly indicated in his analysis. And the public sector’s and trust fund elites’ roles in this are pretty much self-explanatory.
In critique of his thesis, I would say that Whiskey’s analysis does not give proper emphasis to the Gramscian termite damage that makes this breakdown easier, but that is ultimately a lesser (though intriguing) point on the greater theme.
The question then becomes, what CAN be done about it?
Admittedly, Whiskey does not propose a solution. That’s hard for can-do types (I would include myself in that category) to swallow, even depressing. Whether he does not do so due to reason or despair, or a bit of both, is irrelevant. Personally, I won’t categorically rule out the idea that there may be a solution to this mess. But what?
Several years ago I was talking with a couple of friends that I consider bright people, with conservative leanings all. I put it to them; how do we of the West keep women free, but at the same time inspire them to get married at an age when they are fertile and have at least three kids if they are able to, despite possible economic hardships, decreased lifestyle, fewer material possessions, delay of careers, and diminished status?
Because, absent that occurring in the next two or three generations, the West goes away.
Sad to say, none of us had an answer. Nor have I seen a real model for how accomodating women’s gains in rights but getting them into stable families and reproducing just the same articulated anywhere.
So I’ll put it to those who question the “Whiskey theory”. What is your solution? Not some idealized, “if the world were this way” solution, not some “if I were in charge for a day I’d kick some ass” nostrum, but a plan that takes into account the reality of how many women AND men have opted out of a truly Western outlook and understanding of responsibilities, and yet still live here and have a hand in steering politics?
Emasculated societies don’t last. How (in the real world) do we pull away from the one we have become?
Whiskey makes an interesting case — one worthy of serious consideration. What I am not sure is whether he is describing cause or effect.
There is no doubt that traditional masculine pursuits (eg hunting) have been on decline for decades. Hard now to imagine someone like Teddy Rooseveldt posing with his trophies. When someone who did pose with trophies came along recently, it was a woman. And the media hunted Mrs. Palin down more steadily than TR ever pursued a lion.
Is the underlying problem the feminization of society? Or is it the living dead idea of socialism? Or the decline of Christianity in the west? Or is it simply class warfare — with a self-selected proto-nomenklatura imposing itself on the rest of us?
As to what is to be done — maybe we have to accept that not all problems can be solved. Change is inevitable. Maybe all we can do is make sure that the knowledge of what once existed is not lost, so that it can serve as a beacon for future humans.
K-
Is the underlying problem the feminization of society?
As I have pointed out in previous posts, it is erroneous to call it feminization. Leftist women do not – repeat, NOT – want feminized men, they want emasculated ones. This is a very important distinction.
Your point about TR is a very good one – what is hated is the masculinity, but that doesn’t necessarily translate into women wanting a man to be exactly like them (ie, feminine). You’ll notice that other than the extreme feminists, the people who really, REALLY hated Palin were metrosexual men. She was, in effect, more of a man than they were.
From the women’s point of view, better to remove the man’s sexuality entirely (except in the case of an alpha male they can bed for genetics and status). No threats, and no competition, either.
As to the rest of your list – why can’t all of those be factors?
It’s true – not all problems have solutions. To believe otherwise is intellectual hubris. I hope that this crisis and these times have a positive end strategy. But I’m not so arrogant to believe that they MUST.
This cruise line is descended from the cruise line of the Achille Lauro. So this cruise line evidently has a low-key security on the cruises in the Indian Ocean. Obvious they decided never again but did not advertise the security. The Israelis young veterans think the are on vacation except on this rare occasion.
“…how do we of the West keep women free, but at the same time inspire them to get married at an age when they are fertile and have at least three kids …”
Start a brood mare/creche program where women who *want* to have babies and be taken care of can do that while being pampered and adored by the state. Resulting children will then be raised by the state until a certain age whereupon they will be granted emancipation and can choose if they want to go into higher education, a profession, or some kind of hand-skilled labor job.
John Williams @ 11: “What is probably the greatest fear among black constituents is that if they fight and “lose”, they fear seeing nearly every civil rights gain they worked for rolled back in the name of “national security” or some other reason.”
That is a rational fear, and completely understandable and somewhat predictable.
“They don’t want to see the playing field rolled back to a pre-1950s existence. And they’re so invested in preventing this problem that they don’t see (and if they did, don’t care) about the pirate problem, since it is not one of their most immediate concerns.”
Pirating on the high seas, may not be a big concern but pirating of liberty is. From which party do they stand to lose the most liberty and from which do they stand to gain the most? For someone like me (described as one of the whitest white boys ever iow naive), that is a no-brainer. Yet for most blacks I think the answer is not so easy. A choice between the siren song of socialism and the struggle to prove oneself individually? I don’t think most would agree to phrase it that way but I think it still applies. What it the alternative? Certainly it would not be the 1940′s or even the submit or lynch attitude of post reconstruction. Enough of America is past that so it could not repeat itself without a tremendous legal and physical fight.
The number of minority owned business is not so great these days, and the parallels with other minority groups (Vietnamese or Irish or even Russian immigrants) is telling wrt black inclusion in the (formerly) American Dream.
My thoughts are given the condition of post Jim Crow, including the slums and dependence of the Great Society what more is there to lose?
Wretchard: While deck chairs are not exactly effective antiship weapons, the incident seems to suggest that while the Israeli security men were brave and professional, there was no inherent inhibition in the European, nor indeed the human genome, against self-defense. All it needed to awaken was leadership and example. Then the pirates beat a hasty retreat. If the pirates have been gaining against civilization of late, it probably has less to do with the timidity of peoples, who after all, are cut from the same genetic cloth as the hunter-gatherers of 10,000 BC, then with defects of politicians, who imagine themselves to be above it all.
What remains to be seen (and I’m surprised no one here has brought this up yet) is what sort of legal repercussions await the cruise line, the Israeli security personnel and the chair-throwers for having the intestinal/testicular fortitude to fight back. Can the will to do so be broken by a determined state, employing a strategy of “hang one, warn a thousand” to scare its subjects into submission? I get the feeling we’re about to find out.
Nahncee-
Treating women like “brood mares” sort of negates the equal rights stuff, does it not?
At any rate, the current system in place is what you describe, it’s called the welfare state/public schools. That hasn’t worked, and that model should be jettisoned utterly.
I’m not talking about derelicts who want to breed and substitute the state for a real father and a real family. I’m talking about the majority of women who are intelligent and moral and family oriented marrying and raising kids without government subsidy even if it requires that they (and not so incidentally, their husbands) take a lifestyle hit. What would it take to get to that point?
no mo uro/43
NahnCee can’t amswer. She ain’t the family type. Her post was a tongue-in-cheek. Sort of.
Do we have here family oriented women? I’d like to hear their take.
She ain’t the family type.
a bizarro type of “she” LMAO
someone please remind me of what we are actually afraid of should the USN blow a few pirate mother vessels out of the water.
Personally I believe that their are a lot of women and men that would gladly fight back except they have been told, socialized that fighting belongs to a specific group or authority and they should not do themselves.
This is part of the civilization that specializes tasks, rather then the individualist that learns how to do lots of skills since he is Harry homeowner.
Self-defense has gained a lot of support or has whiskey and others ignored the 30 states state that has CCW laws and the rush last year for castle doctrine.
Americans love to fight, our criminal class does it all the time it is part of our violent psychology. Our military just channel the desire to fight into a disciplined force. But the military is a small portion of males that grow up and want to fight and win. Paint ball is very popular among those who like to fight and win and it is safe also.
According to Dave Hardy http://armsandthelaw.com/archives/2009/04/gun_and_ammo_sa.php and
http://www.ammoland.com/2009/04/22/usa-buys-enough-guns-in-3-months-to-outfit-the-entire-chinese-and-indian-army/
IN the last 3 months of 2008 enough handguns and long arms were bought per NICS checks to arm the Chinese and Indian armies combined.
The hottest item bought is the military style rifle (AR15) and similar long arms.
So does that show that men and women are ready to lie down and be victims? No it shows that people are getting ready for whatever may happen.
I have friends who sail around the world and when they were last in the Caribbean and were having drinks with other sailors. The French and others said my friend was not in danger from robbery since all knew Americans carried guns aboard ship. My friend did indeed have a shotgun aboard. American believes in having a gun, as protection is second nature. The 16 year old who circumnavigated around the world from California had made a sat call t his parent since he thought a pirate was attacking him and he had his pistol in the dark cabin with him. That was a 26 year old alone and knew he should have a gun aboard.
If it was not for the merchant companies prohibiting arms. Americans would have at least personal arms on board.
There has been a world wide effort to eliminate the ability to have small arms and the shippers bought into that especially since they are afraid of mutiny.
The success in protecting the ship and passengers will encourage other cruise lines to do the same thing and hire security in case of danger.
The USN is suggesting that shippers stop asking them to send navy ships and instead increase their speed and instigated watches, which used to be standard sailors duties.
Now the USN and Petraeus is saying the shippers need to have arms board and shoot back. It really is a simple concept.
Pirates will have a motivation that now they have a danger beyond storms in attacking a ship.
Think of this, six young men with guns felt they could control a liner with crew and 1500 passengers. They could only think of that if they were trained by the cowardice of crews and the ransoms that shippers paid.
Simple cause and effect. They learned it was very profitable and no resistance from their victims. Now they have a new business model and the pirates cost have increased.
Now if only the shippers would stop being so cheap and get security details or traine the crew in arms and defense then we would not have to spend millions to send navy ships to chase after pirates. It is no US shipping that is primarily targeted but other countries. Why should everyone expect the USN to save them? They are only obligated to US flagged ships like the Maresk and Capt. Phillips.
You want women to have more kids?
1) Cut taxes – a lot
2) Stop all college aid programs.
This isn’t all, but these two things would help a lot.
Plato thought – on a reasonable reading of the REPUBLIC – that the liberation of women required the abolition of the family. Evidently many 70s and later feminists agree, except that in our case these events are happening in the reverse order, with the liberation coming first and causing the abolition.
Individual couples can have children, raise them properly, and be socially and politically active in imploring their neighbors and friends to do the same. There’s not an easy answer, though Sam Hall’s suggestions are good. Being free is hard work, people. This time the face of tyranny looks a little different, that’s all.
Geoffgo’s “seaborne safari” idea: Damn! and me without $30K for Mr. Bother and me…. Can we get a discount if we bring our own toys? Oh, and I think you’ll want a small army of therapeutic massage therapists, for all the stiff muscles your passengers will earn. As Marie Claude said, “no qua[r]ter, booommm !”
Steeple, I doubt if anyone here is afraid of anything that might come of the USN blowing away the occasional pirate. Few people in Washington, DC would agree. World opinion, and all that. Therein lies our problem.
Re: children, is the problem that Americans need to have more children, or that the children they have need to be more self-sufficient, resourceful, energetic — in short, well grounded in the virtues of Western civilization? At the risk of sounding like a broken record, I believe we would get more of the type of kids we’d like to see if we could somehow take back their education from the teachers’ unions and those who consider themselves “educators” rather than “teachers.”
> I put it to them; how do we of the West keep women free, but at the same time inspire them to get married at an age when they are fertile and have at least three kids if they are able to, despite possible economic hardships, decreased lifestyle, fewer material possessions, delay of careers, and diminished status?
There is no other way. Three kids is a commitment of lifestyle sacrifice. I should know, I have three with the fourth imminent.
And I am lucky to have a wife (whose college degree in education is still being paid for) who stays at home, homeschooling our oldest boy (8), minding the daughter (6) before and after her parochial school day, and also looking after our formerly-youngest son (4) when he’s not going to his pre-school/daycare two days a week.
Between the cub scouts, brownies, homeschooling, “homemaking”, baseball, and other myriad responsibilities, we would both laugh at the naive idea of her staying at home being a “fun” walk in the park. It’s real work, and it’s more than a job, because you can’t leave it at 5pm.
That necessarily makes us a one-income household. Luckily, my income is enough to live a decent lifestyle, although I am not in the six digits per year.
I’m not sure what the answer is, although my opinion on the topic was the enabling factor, I think. I had told her all along that I wanted her to be a stay-at-home mother. It was not in the cards at first. She had a bachelor’s degree in education and was a teacher… for one year. Then “we” were unexpectedly expecting our second child, and that’s when she decided to hang it up and give it a try.
That one year when we had two incomes was nice. We had a nice lifestyle, what with only one child.
One child means little lifestyle changes. Two means lifestyle changes, but you still have a lot of options.
With three, you have no choice but to commit to the family life. Not to mention moving to “zone defense” with the kids.
I think the lifestyle change and the man’s opinion probably has the most to do with it. Men have to be willing to sacrifice their interests.
That’s really the unfortunate thing about the so-called “advancement of women.” Men used to be expected to sacrifice for their women, and that has now been removed.
Oh sure, there will always be women who want more for themselves, but I really do think they are in the very small minority. My experience has seemed to show that there are a great many women out there who, if their husbands were willing to give it all up for the family, and would treat them with respect, would be glad to give up their “professional” careers and be that stay at home wife.
Will they be that stay at home wife and bear three or more children?
Well now, that’s another problem.
Large families used to be considered “blessed.” Now, they are considered bizarre. One child is probably ideal. Two is fine (the boy & girl combo). Three is suspicious and will elicit the “playful” name-calling, unless you downplay your own family size. Four or more will result in a soft form of ostracization, unless you’re Catholic. It will come from both the left (overpopulation or feminization crowd) and the right (too many mouths to feed, probably sucking from the government tit, what are you, Catholic/Mormon?).
I hear far more negative comments (even if playful joking) on my family size than I do positive ones. That will have to change, along with the never-ending assault on “families” in general (e.g. constant bombardment of liberal sex + contraception, abortion, divorce, tolerance of gay lifestyles).
Here’s a good start at an idea I’ve been thinking about recently. Rework the social security structure so that your money, instead of going into some amorphous pot, directly benefits your elderly parents/grandparents and other closely attached elderly family members.
That kind of change will encourage larger families. The more children you have, the more you will have to take care of you.
Actually, that is the half-joking philosophy my wife and I have. If we have a lot of children, perhaps the odds are good that one or two will take care of us in our old age, now that 401ks can’t be relied upon.
@ 47 – Sam Hall:
> 1) Cut taxes – a lot
There’s nothing left to cut, except for social security and medicare/medicaid. My income is not far from six figures per annum, and I pay less than $5000/year in federal income tax. And that’s only with the standard deduction (because we rent).
After you subtract out the exemptions for children and apply the child tax credit, the income tax is quite low.
We live in Texas, which is income tax free, so property tax is really the next big bucket we have to worry about. But since that funds the local school district (whose services we sadly do not use), I don’t see a lot of necessary reform coming anytime soon. Nor do I see any meaningful social security or medicare/medicaid reform coming anytime soon, either.
> 2) Stop all college aid programs
This would produce a noticeable effect, I think.
Actually, the whole myth that “everybody should go to college” just needs to be stopped, pure and simple. Real apprenticeships need to be re-introduced and the trades need to be celebrated. There is a prominent implied idea that people who don’t go to college will be worthless ditch-diggers or will be somehow permanently stunted.
I hate that idea.
BAck to the thread – reading news reports that Russia has captured a bunch of Somali pirates. I wonder if the Ivans will take them back to Moscow to stand trial. I wonder, 2, when the Somali’s will figure out that it’s better to be captured by Americans than by Russians … and when they *do* figure it out, if we’ll be told about it.
Tee hee.
I hope, at the very least, they’re sent off to spend the rest of their desert tropical lives in a gulag in Siberia. Barefoot.
no doubt they’ll be punished with vodka, caviar, women, and sacks full of gold.
Picturing a Russian woman with one of those skinny teensy Somali teenagers.
just don’t type that into search –good grief –