In Benghazi
The Washington Guardian has more details on the attack on the US consulate in Benghazi.
The two former SEALS, Tyrone Woods, 41, and Glen Doherty, 42, were not employed by the State Department diplomatic security office and instead were what is known as personal service contractors who had other duties related to security, the officials said.
They stepped into action, however, when Stevens became separated from the small security detail normally assigned to protect him when he traveled from the more fortified embassy in Tripoli to Benghazi, the officials said.
The two ex-Seals and others engaged in a lengthy firefight with the extremists who attacked the compound, a fight that stretched from the inner area of the consulate to an outside annex and a nearby safe house — a location that the insurgents appeared to know about, the officials said.
The officials provided the information to the Washington Guardian, saying they feared the Obama administration’s scant description of the episode left a misimpression that the two ex-Navy SEALs might have been responsible for the ambassador’s personal safety or become separated from him.
“Woods and Doherty weren’t part of the detail, nor were they personally responsible for the ambassador’s security, but they stepped into the breach when the attacks occurred and their actions saved others lives — and they shouldn’t be lumped in with the security detail,” one senior official said, speaking only on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to speak publicly about the State Department.
One can only hope the families of the deceased SEALs don’t get a form letter from the President signed with an electric pen.
A State Department spokesperson corrected herself and acknowledged that protection for the consulate had been provided by a British firm employing Libyan nationals.
QUESTION: You also said there was no contract with a private security firm in Libya, and yet apparently some British security guards were hired. Is that your way of saying you didn’t contract with a firm but you did hire individual security guards?
MS. NULAND: Thank you for that, because there was an error in what I said. The external security, external armed security, as we have been saying, outside of the perimeter, was fully handled by the Libyan side. There was no contract – contracting out of that. There was a group called Blue Mountain Group, which is a private security company with permits to operate in Libya. They were hired to provide local Libyan guards who operated inside the gate doing things like operating the security access equipment, screening the cars, that kind of thing.
According to Breitbart, the firm had been selected because they were amenable to State Department Rules of Engagement which specified that the guards have no bullets in their guns. If so it was understandable that they took to their heels. Who wouldn’t? However, the SEALs, not being part of the “robust” security cordon around the consulate, may have a had a few magazines between them and made the best of it.
Well here’s to the Libyan guards with no bullets
and the SEALS who had only a few.
It was tough to hold back hundreds,
But if Hillary only knew!
She had a perfect plan
Which had they known they wouldn’t have ran.
But of what avail is a Libyan rube
Against hatred from YouTube
Nah, let’s let Rudyard Kipling do it. He’s much better.
There were thirty million English who talked of England’s might,
There were twenty broken troopers who lacked a bed for the night.
They had neither food nor money, they had neither service nor trade;
They were only shiftless soldiers, the last of the Light Brigade.They felt that life was fleeting; they knew not that art was long,
That though they were dying of famine, they lived in deathless song.
They asked for a little money to keep the wolf from the door;
And the thirty million English sent twenty pounds and four!The poor little army departed, limping and lean and forlorn.
And the heart of the Master-singer grew hot with “the scorn of scorn.”
And he wrote for them wonderful verses that swept the land like flame,
Till the fatted souls of the English were scourged with the thing called Shame.
Shame? No. There’s none of that any more.
Belmont Commenters
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While you were writing… Breitbart, and now Drudge, are indicating that he mastermind behind the Ben Ghazi attack is a released Gitmo m#therf#cker. Released by the m#therf#cker in the White House.
This is pure speculation but this might explain why they lied so vehemently about the attack, and tried to divert attention onto a man they persecuted with the full force of the State.
Our Chinese ambassador attacked today, this spiraling debacle, nary a peep from the MSM about America speeding into the black hole created by our historic first black asshole president.
Please restore the ability to enlarge the type size of your posts. My old eyes are strained trying to read them. Thanks.
SamW
While you were writing… Breitbart, and now Drudge, are indicating that he mastermind behind the Ben Ghazi attack is a released Gitmo m#therf#cker. Released by the m#therf#cker in the White House.
This is pure speculation but this might explain why they lied so vehemently about the attack, and tried to divert attention onto a man they persecuted with the full force of the State.
Our Chinese ambassador attacked today, this spiraling debacle, nary a peep from the MSM about America speeding into the black hole created by our historic first black a$$hole president.
The SEALs probly came from bitter Clinger, pick-up driving, gun owning, Bible in the house type families. Not Yale/Berkeley/Harvard elite types, able to see beyound uder-American bigotry.
Desert One for Carter, Black Hawk Down for Clinton and Mr. Hillary and President Satori…er..Obama have Benghazi.
While you were writing… Breitbart, and now Drudge, are indicating that he mastermind behind the Ben Ghazi attack is a released Gitmo m#therf#cker. Released by the m#therf#cker in the White House.
This is pure speculation but this might explain why they lied so vehemently about the attack, and tried to divert attention onto a man they persecuted with the full force of the State.
Our Chinese ambassador attacked today, this spiraling debacle, nary a peep from the MSM about America speeding into the black hole created by our historic first black asshole president.
SO SORRY! It seemed to crash each time I hit submit and i thought it wasn’t accepting (possibly due to severe potty mouth)
Kind of hard to work up to shame when one is feted with golden champagne bottles.
To enlarge the font, irrespective of site, you can go to view/zoom/zoomin or sometime ctrl-shift-+
I’ll talk to the PJM people and try to get them to put in a clickable control for fonts.
#1, #3 and #5 – Morton D – I believe I’ve heard he was released from Gitmo in 2007, which would make it President Bush’s watch – the reports I heard said he was released into Libya’s custody to be held, but he was released in Libya.
Wretchard, now I am furious all over again re the SEALs and that the Ambassador’s protection was contracted out to Libyans on the inner ring. I understand the host country protects from outside the “Embassy or Consulate grounds.” But INSIDE? Urgh!
OT: this is weird, but I was just called (on my landline, at dinnertime) by a Mike Huckabee robot that started asking me questions, and apparently did OK parsing my verbal “yes” and “no” answers.
(unless it was faking and didn’t really care – but I think it did and adjusted subsequent questions in response)
BTW, its first question was whether I was pro-life.
Shouldn’t it have been asking me if I’m pro-robot?
It didn’t solicit anything at the end, not even a vote, I wonder if I might have disappointed it.
#9, #9, #9… You are so right, i jumped the gun when I saw “released in 2008″, and mistook that for Obama. Released in 2007 to Libyan custody, and released by Libya in 2008 (after only partial rehabilitaion, Libyan version of “Hope and Change”, apparently).
Of course our Presidents are elected in even years and actually take office in odd years… It would be more accurate to say that Bush capitulated to the hysteria of the Left and the manipulation of our Muslim allies and commenced releasing the effluvium of Gitmo, each to his terrorist nation of origin for Jihad power-ups.
Again, sorry for trampling the thread with bad posts!
The ex gitmo detainee that participated in the attack was release in 2007. By bush. AS were most gitmo detainees release by Bush. Obama inherited the extreme hardcore AQ. Even he figured this out and has not released very few.
If the man behind the Rape of Benghazi was previously in Gitmo custody then we should know his home and tribe. Justice should be comprehensive.
We must find something appropriate to name after Doherty and Woods.
Remember when the SEALs rescued Captain Phillips of the MS Maersk Alabama, killing three Somali pirates? Obama tried to prevent that and it only went down when the ship’s Commanding Officer gave the go order on his own authority, without giving the White House a chance to stop it. The result was a near orgy of coercion and intimidation directed at the military, especially Special Forces. Does anybody know what happened to the Navy ship’s CO? If I recall that was followed by the repeal of DADT and the Democrats arranging the sequestration bomb that will soon gut the US military.
So a US ambassador was left with no security in an area known to be infested with AQ affiliates on the anniversary of 911 days just days after we had taken out a key AQ asset in another region for which AQ had pledged vengeance.
Only fools and amateur travel writers like metrosexual m j Totten would call the matter ” appeasement”
The issue is State Department – incompetence
1-Ambassador Stevens stated many times that he was on an AQ hit list
2-The Benghazi area has long provided AQ militants to attack US troops in Afghanistan and Iraq
3-Clinton and Rice claimed for a week that this was not a terrorist attack-just a side effect of a demonstration against a u-tube video
The issue is incompetence by the State Department- Ambassador Stevens was a valuable US asset left without protection in a hostile zone
2. SamW
Font size is controlled by YOUR browser. The site just has a standard which your browser uses unless told otherwise. I use Firefox, which is {Ctrl +} for larger and {Ctrl -} for smaller. It has been so long since I used anything else that I have forgotten the commands. Go to your help files and search on ‘font size’.
Fools, all of them. Lying is stoooopid. You always get caught and normally folks are more upset about the lie then whatever they are lying to cover up.
Look at what just happened with “fast and furious”. After months of stonewalling and silly lies, they gave up a couple bodies to the wolves. That might have worked a year and a half ago but all it does today is whet the appetite of the wolves.
Same with Embassygate. Somebody fooked up by the numbers and 4 people died. Whoever that was (Hilldebeast?) is trying to dodge the heat. Ain’t gonna happen. Fox did a instant poll and 91% thought the attacks were a planned terrorist attack.
The cover-up isn’t working. Someone higher up the food chain now has to decide what timing works best for political purposes. Throw some bodies off the wagon now in hopes it takes the air out of the room or stonewall until after the election. The latter option has to look attractive, what with a tame press. If Obama loses, everybody grabs their Solyndra stash and leaves the country. If he wins, Obama makes it all go away. The next person up the food chain has to become a part of a criminal conspiracy if they decide to stonewall. Now they have turned a stooopid mistake into a felony. That’s why we call them the clown posse!
Apparently the White House valued the lives of those two ex SEALS at about a nickel each. Political spin and slippery obfuscation came way before honouring those two men simply by telling the straightforward story of what they did.
There are black-hearted bastards in the Administration.
Another English poet gave us a near-perfect description of this feckless president:
I was playing golf the day
That the Germans landed;
All our men had run away,
All our ships were stranded;
And the thought of England’s shame
Very nearly spoiled my game.’
Captain Harry Graham
The lonely deaths of the former SEALs, fighting off howling savages, reminds me of this bit of Sir Harry Newbolt:
The sand of the desert is sodden red, -
Red with the wreck of a square that broke; -
The Gatling’s jammed and the colonel dead,
And the regiment blind with dust and smoke.
The river of death has brimmed his banks,
And England’s far, and Honour a name,
But the voice of schoolboy rallies the ranks,
“Play up! play up! and play the game!”
10. Josh
I’ve had several calls from Huckies ‘bot. No idea what they are asking. I have Party Rock on a stick for my walkman that I use while doing my laps.. All robo-calls get placed in front of the headphone speakers. When I hear a dial tone, I figure the robot has had enough Party Rock and hang up the phone. Evidence is that robots like to Party Rock;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4zJWA3Vo6TU
Charlie don’t surf.
Hillary is looked at by the usual suspects in the chattering class as the smartest, toughest, most astute Secretary of State ever (or least since FDR’s
commie). In reality she’s a third rate stooge; Madelaine Halfbright redux, but a bigger bitch. Throw in Susan “Fried” Rice and Mrs. Sunstein, Samantha Power and you wonder why the world is in flames.
Posters yu can enlarge the font on your screen by pressing the “CONTROL” and “+” keys at the same time
While I think State majorly screwed up, some of the fault does lie with Stevens himself; allow me to add a bit of context to the episode in Benghazi.
First, I have a pretty good source that tells me Ambassador Stevens was the kind of guy who liked to have the smallest security detail possible and may have been circumventing State’s rules regarding security. And I understand that mentality to a certain extent. It’s almost impossible to get anything done when you have super restrictive security measures in place that do not allow you to travel; it makes you almost completely ineffective at your job if you can’t travel. Just ask the US Embassy staff in Kabul, who are only allowed outside the embassy compound if they fly directly to their destination, which is usually a secure FOB somewhere. Additionally, if you look at Stevens’ biography, he seemed to be one of those idealists who thinks that because his intentions are pure, everyone around him will reciprocate, which also might have led him to play fast and loose with the security procedures set by State. Lastly, though it may seem counter-intuitive, I can’t stress enough how easy it is to get complacent about security when you operate in scary countries year after year, so I do understand why Stevens and his team may have been a bit cavalier about the dangers they faced.
As a prime example of this, take those South Africans that were killed in that suicide bombing in Kabul a few days ago. They had lived and worked in Kabul for years and got so complacent that they drove the same route every day at the same time. They also didn’t see the need to hire any physical security guards or security consultants for their mission, which is probably why they ended up breaking security rule #1, which is DO NOT set movement patterns.
Whoever was in charge of security in Benghazi also broke security rules #2, #3, #4, and #5 (and many others) which are: NEVER rely on locally-hired security to remain in place when sh*t goes down, ALWAYS have a plan B, C, and probably D to fall back on, NEVER underestimate a protest, demonstration, mob, or riot, and ALWAYS have more ammo on hand than you think you need.
I keep hoping that one of these days State figures out the happy security medium between hunkering embassy staff down in heavily secured compounds and leaving them dangling out there to the wolves like so much fresh meat.
I wonder what role (if any) Huma Abedin had in this major screw-up? Since she’s deputy chief of staff and Hillary’s aide, and suppoedly her family has ties to the Muslim Brotherhood? Just a coincidence, I’m sure….
It isn’t clear to me why there is an embassy in Libya at all – working on the theory that embassies are needed only in those countries where the interests of the US are at stake. Of course, I realize that requires a foreign policy based on those interests.
Anybody thinking of serving in a Embassy or Consulate in the MENA should spend a couple of hours and watch the movie Khartoum. The Muslim Brotherhood are the direct desendants of the followers of the Mahdi (who fancied himself the 12th Imam, somebody ought to tell the Nutter in Iran about that). For thirty years they ran a bloody land of terror and destruction in the Sudan and southern Egypt. This all took place just over a century ago, a better reflection of the difference in time-scapes between the Western mind and that of the Muslim would be hard to find. We seem unable to remember the past, they live in it.
The Brits, in their usual style of too much too late, sent a large military mission to crush them years after Gordon was besieged and killed. They crushed the followers of the Mahdi and supressed the rebellion (however the Muslim Brotherhood lingered on and had a warm and friendly relationship with a similar violent, evil cult; the Nazis)
The Resident won’t even send a Predator Drone.
THIS JUST SUCKS!
Will this explode into the full-blown scandal of incompetence that it should be, or will Romney making some true statement override it?
Why bother commenting on this or any of the numerous and blatant lies and cover ups by this Administration! If 0bama gets re-elected and even if the house stays Republican and IF the Senate changes hands there will be no “Come to Jesus” truth investigation on any of these atrocities! If Romney is Elected it’ll be “Quid pro Quo” and everything is forgotten and swept under the rug. This is just one of the many reasons our Government has gotten worse. The soonest “Leo III” change takes hold the better but I fear (and believe) as I mention before it is too late, if 0bama gets re-elected, there will be Voter Fraud involved in a bigger scale than in 2008, there will be no “Real” investigation that will change the outcome no matter how blatant it was (see Al Franken, senator from Wisconsin) and it will only provide for the collapse of our voting system (becoming the sham it is in Chicago) and the Grass Root Change that Leo III is trying to force will be circumvented, it will assure 0bama’s historical third term and our societies fall (scrapping of the Constitution), leading to our first American Dictator (not an Emperor).
“Thank you for the question! Yes, every thing I told you is a festering heap of dung! And thank you for putting it in your headlines and your news stories and spreading it all over the world! Now, here’s the correction you can run on page A17. Thank you for your cooperation and now forget about it.”
It’s how it’s done. It’s how endoltment works.
#22 ” … some of the fault does lie with Stevens himself” -E2
I suspect there is much much more we’ll eventually learn about al Stevens, but some of it may well prove toxic to discussion due to PC fascism… Nearly everything I’ve learned so far sounds like a man doing his best immitation of TE Lawrence, with all that may imply, down to the smuggling of arms to Wahhabi terrorists, his clandestine involvement at the heart of a Wahhabi terrorist insurrection, and the toppling of a regime and the enthroning of a Wahhabi revolutionary regime.
Even the widely reported rape by his captors is eerily similar story content, and in broad terms, both men were raped by the civilization they adored. Of course in Stevens’ case both his literal death and metaphorical destruction occur in much closer proximity than al Lawrence. When Stevens’ history is written, it will probably be couched in similarly reverent and gauzy terms, brushing aside some of the mysteries which crowd. It may be too explosive to discuss why such men seek such company in such places.
1) God bless the Seals. Always running towards the sound of gun fire.
2) Who thought it was a good idea to send a gay ambassador to a Muslim country? Anyone? Bueller?
3) How about we give everyone 24 hours notice to leave Benghazi, then have a B2 drop one of those 30,000 lb fuel air explosives set to air burst at 1000 feet, and then ask “Who wants to be next”? We are gonna have to fight these guys sooner or later, and, as John Mitchell reportedly said, “If you know you’re gonna have to eat s&^t, you don’t want to take small bites”.
#12
Buckie, the Bush administration was pressured to release the GITMO detainees by the Democratic Party stalwart’s pressure. The Democrats demagogued the issue. Remember when Dick Durban (D-crookistan) compared GITMO to Auschwitz? It is fair to blame Bush for giving into the Senator Obamas of the world but not for the result. The Department of Defense and the National Security Staff warned the public that it was very likely that many of the detainees would return to terrorism. This is just more of Obama’s chickens coming home to roost.
I wonder if Hilliary allows her security team to carry live ammunition when she travels abroad? If so, then the double standard seems pretty outrageous. Will the MSM notice?
27. CharlesWhite
“(see Al Franken, senator from Wisconsin)”
Minor quibble.
Franken belongs to Minnesota, unfortunately, as do I.
hd @ 28: “endoltment” Love it!
Let’s just accept reality. The marriage has reached the point where the two parties are not even talking to each other any more. Yes, the mother-in-law goes on & on about how wonderful her spendthrift dishonest slut of a daughter is — but only her daughter is listening to her now. This ends in divorce, and then both parties will be much happier.
Well, one party will happier & more free, but much poorer. Meanwhile, she gets to live for a little while in a house she can’t afford, drinking herself into an early grave in the company of an increasingly downmarket bunch of spongers. But her mother still will cry at her funeral.
It’s time for the rest of us to move on.
Excuse the OT but I’ve seen this before:
Are Obama insiders secretly making retirement plans for the Obamas with the expectation the president will lose his bid for re-election in November?
Very quietly, Obama’s chief financier, Penny Pritzker, has entered the Hawaii housing market to buy a retirement home for the president and his family that will be available not in 2016, but in January 2013, according to a confidential source within Pritzker’s Chicago organization
Pritzker, a wealthy Chicago business executive and heiress to the Hyatt Hotels fortune, served as national finance chairman for Obama’s 2008 campaign and is the co-chairman of his 2012 effort.
The source told WND that highly confidential internal polls conducted by the Obama campaign indicate Obama cannot win re-election, despite public surveys that show him in the lead.
“The public polls are mostly political,” the source argued. “Obama radicals want Romney supporters to feel discouraged and give up. Truth is that Romney’s winning.”
And there’s more:
http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/secret-retirement-plans-does-obama-expect-to-lose/
Re. # 11. Morton D.
“…It would be more accurate to say that Bush capitulated to the hysteria of the Left and the manipulation of our Muslim allies and commenced releasing the effluvium of Gitmo, each to his terrorist nation of origin for Jihad power-ups.”
NO! He blubbed about “religion of piece” and within few weeks after military crashed Saddam’s army and Afghan clowns he eagerly rushed into “hearts and minds” nonsense we remained mired in ever since. He is made of the same bureaucratic cloth as his dad and all of them except, may be, Goldwater and Reagan. Although Reagan did (for no sound reason) set up 200+ boys in Lebanon for bloody clowns’ target practice.
Re. # 13. Blast From the Past
“..the Democrats arranging the sequestration bomb that will soon gut the US military.” They couldn’t have done it without Repubs knowingly agreeing to this.
two former SEALS, Tyrone Woods, 41, and Glen Doherty, 42
Glen Doherty had an interesting background:
Doherty was an “extremely active” member of the advisory board of the Military Religious Freedom Foundation (MRFF), an advocacy group that fights inappropriate religious proselytizing inside the armed forces, said founder Mikey Weinstein, a retired Air Force lawyer.
“He confirmed for me how deeply entrenched fundamentalist Christianity is in the DoD Spec Ops [Department of Defense Special Operations] world of the SEALs, Green Berets, Delta Force, Army Rangers USAF … and DoD security contractors like the former Blackwater,” Weinstein said in an email to The Huffington Post. Doherty “helped me on many MRFF client cases behind the scenes to facilitate assistance to armed forces members abused horribly by fundamentalist Christian proselytizing.”
So he dedicated much of his time (“extremely active”) to fighting against Christians who proselytized and worked for those poor victims of Christianity within the armed forces. (Fighting the good fight against the Christian Taliban, I guess!) I wonder if at the moment he was being killed by Muslims whether it entered his head that maybe he’d been a bit too hard on those Christians back in the USA.
Link
#34 brings up a point that has been bothering me for a while. Will either side quietly accept the outcome of the November election? The left has demonstrated its gleeful willingness to engage in vandalism and riot when they don’t get their way or are “provoked”. What about the right?
If the malignant fool is reelected he will be free to fully implement Obamacare and the Dodd/Frank mess for at least the next 4 years. We already have plenty of evidence that he cares nothing for constitutional checks and balances and that the federal legislature is unwilling to do anything to rein him in. He has plenty of support in the judicial branch and will almost certainly be adding 2 or 3 new SC justices. With a virtual state media in place I don’t see anything to stop him from imposing just about any regulation he wants. The red states will become targets to loot and then redistribute to his supporters. The borders, already sieves, will simply remain open and how far away can full amnesty be for the millions already here (followed quickly by granting of the franchise). National defense will be rendered impotent and the PC campaign already being waged in the military will escalate and drive out enough real warriors to reduce our magnificent military to a homosexualized/feminized travesty.
Do the red states simply roll over and accept the escalation of executive usurpation of power?
In my estimation the statement that this is the most crucial election since the civil war is not hyperbole. I don’t believe the left will engage in more than a brief spate of unrest (maybe not even that) but will simply continue their campaign to subvert and rot the republic from within confident that a Romney win will be no more than a temporary slow down on the road to utopia. But the right being up in arms is a much different matter.
Of course it could be that even the right is so far gone that nothing much will happen and the country will just continue down the road it is on. Maybe that is most likely. I don’t know.
Morton D. @ 11 said:
“It would be more accurate to say that Bush capitulated to the hysteria of the Left and the manipulation of our Muslim allies and commenced releasing the effluvium of Gitmo, each to his terrorist nation of origin for Jihad power-ups.”
I remain very much a fan of George W. Bush and put him on the same pedestal with Harry S. Truman. George W. Bush did many things right but also made some significant errors. IMHO, the Islamic Fascists held at Gitmo should have been promptly tried by military tribunals and then disposed of immediately. Allowing the fascists to fester at Gitmo simply created the later opportunity for someone like Obama to set them loose. I suspect the Bush administration transferred some of the fascists to their home country with the hope or understanding that their home country would dispose of them quietly. This was a vain hope. It’s not a surprise that many of these bad guys were simply released (there are excellent reasons why the Middle East is as screwed up as it is).
Gordon @ 35 said:
“The source told WND that highly confidential internal polls conducted by the Obama campaign indicate Obama cannot win re-election, despite public surveys that show him in the lead…”
I must reemphasize that I think it’s a disgrace that Obama is President and I will certainly vote for Romney. Obama is giving James Buchanan stiff competition for the distinction of being America’s worst President ever.
Having said that, WND is not a reliable information source. In terms of getting reelected, Obama is doing just fine and has the solid support of the MSM. Dislodging Obama from the White House required a relatively strong Republican candidate. Regrettably, Romney is not. I’m still scratching my head, wondering why we are in the situation of having Romney as our candidate against Obama.
Again, I will vote for Romney. Not doing so would be immoral and unpatriotic.
#35 Gordon
There is another option for the Hawaii property other than being a retirement home. It could well be planned as the Winter Palace for the President-for-Life if Obama wins or steals the election.
#39 scory
I can’t speak for more than myself, but I got my nom d’ blog after a captain of mine referred to me as being “to the right of Genghis Khan”. I demurred, saying that I was “to the right of his chief general, Subotai Bahadur, who was a real hard-a**”.
With my status delineated, I give an 90%+ chance of civil disorder and violence that could turn into civil war in the year after the election. If Romney wins, TWANLOC will not accept it, and violence [as usual,probably allied with our country's foreign enemies] will be sure. If Obama wins, not having to even pretend to give lip service to the law or the Constitution means that they will move into the realm of “Intolerable Acts” right quickly.
There is a reason for all the mass ammunition purchases by nominally civilian agencies. And how many SWAT Teams do the Social Security Admininstration, the Department of Education [which has nothing to do with being in actual schools since they just send out money and bureaucratic requirements], or the National Weather Service need?
One can make a reasoned argument that we are already approaching the neighborhood of paragraphs 2-30 inclusive of the Declaration.
One [of many possible] scenarios is here:
http://westernrifleshooters.wordpress.com/2012/09/11/what-i-saw-at-the-coup/
Short form, TWANLOC are probably already on a war footing with operational orders issued if Obama cannot win or steal the election. Patriots will take longer to reach the end of their rope, but when they do ….
And as in all historical turning points, it will depend on individual choices of sides and of actions.
“And only the Great Blue-Sky Tengri Nor knows what the outcome will be.”
Subotai Bahadur
I’d love to see the MSM explore the Susan Rice Rwanda-Libya link.
In a previous comment, I said that Ambassador Susan Rice’s reality-denying characterization of the Stevens killing reminds me of the Clinton administration’s determination to avoid labelling the Rwandan genocide as “genocide”, despite clear evidence it was genocide, in order to avoid US/UN intervention in Rwanda.
Clinton set a hard line against intervention in the Rwanda genocide; Obama has set a hard line against intervention in post-Qaddafi Libya. It turns out that Susan Rice was on President Clinton’s National Security Council as the Director for International Organizations and Peacekeeping from 1993 to 1995. Defining the problem frames the solution: Rice was instrumental in the US avoiding the defining label of genocide in Rwanda in order to avoid the solution of US/UN intervention. See Rice’s role described in PBS’s authoritative account of the Rwandan genocide that is required viewing in many intro poli-sci IR and international law classes: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/ghosts/interviews/desforges.html
Rice appears to be repeating the same strategy of defining the problem in Libya in the way needed to limit the US reaction to the Stevens killing and uphold Obama’s hands-off policy for post-Qaddafi Libya. Clinton was willing to concede genocide in Rwanda. Obama appears willing to concede an Islamist Libya.
@ 40. Eggplant
“I remain very much a fan of George W. Bush and put him on the same pedestal with Harry S. Truman. George W. Bush did many things right but also made some significant errors.”
I’m a liberal who’s a fan of Bush because he committed to a serious, thoughtful, and bold liberal strategy in response to 9/11. A major disillusionment has been the vitriolic attacks by Western liberals that undermined Bush’s definitively liberal foreign policy during the ‘golden hour’ after 9/11 when we re-took the initiative and Bush’s Freedom Agenda could have had the most impact.
http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2004/06/20040602.html
“For decades, free nations tolerated oppression in the Middle East for the sake of stability. In practice, this approach brought little stability, and much oppression. So I have changed this policy. In the short-term, we will work with every government in the Middle East dedicated to destroying the terrorist networks. In the longer-term, we will expect a higher standard of reform and democracy from our friends in the region. Democracy and reform will make those nations stronger and more stable, and make the world more secure by undermining terrorism at it source. Democratic institutions in the Middle East will not grow overnight; in America, they grew over generations. Yet the nations of the Middle East will find, as we have found, the only path to true progress is the path of freedom and justice and democracy.”
Given Bush’s policy balancing of anti-terrorism by and the stability of “friends” in the short-term with liberal reform by those “friends” in the long-term, how Bush would have reacted to the Arab Spring is an interesting hypothetical.
I view Bush’s decision for the COIN ‘Surge’ in Iraq the greatest Commander-in-Chief decision of my generation:
http://learning-curve.blogspot.com/2008/09/glimpse-inside-president-bushs-decision.html
I also understand why we struggled with the post-war after taking down Saddam’s regime:
http://learning-curve.blogspot.com/2010/04/documentary-combat-support-hospital-in.html
#34 and #39:
I think that of Obama wins we “53%ers” are going to have to withdraw our money from Blue states and invest it in Red states. Toward that end I would like to see a Red State Mutual Fund, or better yet, several, with that as a stated policy. LIII and his dad ought to get with Herman Cain and set that up. Mitt and Paul ought to be able to give some good advice as well.
We are also going to have to “Go Gault” and keep our money from being used against us, perhaps by the simple expedient of making less income. In an Obama Economy that should be quite easy.
There are other things to do as well, such as supporting the right schools and probably fostering “circuit riders” in various areas of expertise to help home schooling and decrease the power of the teacher’s unions.
Then there is holding Congress’ feet to the fire and supporting the correct politicians at every level
And finally, of course, ignoring regulations whenever it is feasible or simply necessary.
In other words, we are going to have to wage economic and political guerilla warfare designed to weaken the Fderal government and especially Obama voters and literally make them pay.
#44 RWE
Good ideas, with two caveats. First, if Obama is re-elected or otherwise holds on to power, the “53%” will be Kulaks and operating in a very different legal regime. Most of the things you list will be crimes. I know that the inclination is to disbelieve that such is possible, but ask the people who have lived through any Socialist takeover. I am not saying don’t do it. Just be ready to do it against the will of the coercive organs of the State.
Second,
“Then there is holding Congress’ feet to the fire and supporting the correct politicians at every level”
Congress is largely useless now. Any who remain in office after an Obama win will be hard core collaborationists. They are politicians first of all. Once a political system loses legitimacy; it is not restored by normal means.
Subotai Bahadur