The Propaganda of the Deed
WKYC has links to the actual criminal complaints filed against Connor Stevens, Brandon Baxter, Douglas Wright, Anthony Hayne and Joshua Stafford in connection with an alleged plot to blow up the Route 82 Brecksville-Northfield High Level Bridge and perhaps to subsequently attack targets in Chicago in connection with the coming NATO summit.
This is the complaint against Wright, Baxter and Hayne. A second and very similar complaint was separately lodged against Stafford and Stevens.
The complaints are worth reading to gain a glimpse into the more extreme fringes of Occupy, to whom some of the suspects belonged or even had leadership positions in. In that universe, the enemy is the Federal Reserve, the One Percent, Fusion Centers and other targets. Since these proved hard to attack it is alleged the suspects decided to focus on the measly bridge.
According to the criminal complaints, the suspects allegedly discussed ways of communicating secretly, spoofing their IP addresses, using untraceable electronic transfers and using peer-to-peer networks to avoid detection by the Man. However, they neglected to avoid the acquaintance of an FBI confidential human source, who has a criminal record for the possession of cocaine, robbery, and multiple raps for passing bad checks. The confidential human source was employed to infiltrate the suspect’s ring and paid $5,570 plus $550 for expenses and seemingly nullified all their hi-tech precautions by wearing a wire.
Although the suspects were described as “anarchists”, they were not bereft of organizational links and gleefully described to the FBI informant how a “shitload” of people would be coming to Cleveland and it would be “off the hook” for the week, leaving the downtown in a “pile of rubble” prior to moving on to other cities and giving them the same treatment.
Interestingly Occupy Cleveland which says they are “not representative of the group” cancelled a planned May Day event, perhaps out of uncertainty for how many individuals, still at large, might be motivated to carry out the suspect’s plan.
“While the group arrested Monday evening by the FBI were associated with Occupy Cleveland they were in no way representing or acting on behalf of Occupy Cleveland or the event that was planned for later today at the GE Lighting building. The May Day Event that was sponsored by Occupy Cleveland, the North Shore AFL-CIO, Cleveland Jobs with Justice, Fight for a Fair Economy and SEIU Local 1 has been cancelled because of the alleged actions of the autonomous group arrested last night. Occupy Cleveland has had affirmed principles of non-violence since its inception on October 6, 2011.”
The criminal complaint ultimately provides very little information on how far beyond the circle of suspects the conspiracy extended, if it extended at all. Was it all crazy talk? Or is there a hard core of wild guys who are half-tolerated by the mainstream protest movement to provide a degree of deniable intimidation for the group as a whole? The Wikipedia article on anarchy and the Occupy movement discusses the media debate about the role of “anarchists” in Occupy.
David Graeber, an early organizer of the movement, is a self-proclaimed anarchist. Graeber, writing for The Guardian, has argued that anarchist principles of direct action, direct democracy and rejection of existing political institutions are the foundations of the Occupy Wall Street movement. Graeber also believes that radical segments of the civil rights movement, the anti-nuclear movement and the global justice movement have been based on the same principles. The Occupy movement sprang from the WikiLeaks initiative to Open Knowledge and give public access without regard for authority.
In November 2011, approximately 100 people participated in the “Anarchist General Assembly” and discussed ways to spread anarchist ideas and how to interact with police. The organizers of the assembly published a flier that read, “This is a call to the anarchist and broader anti-authoritarian community to reconvene in assembly and continue to develop ourselves as members of a larger network here in Portland.”
But other media commentators say there is no relationship.
Michael Kazin, writing for The New Republic, analyzed the composition of the Occupy Wall Street movement. He argued that Occupy members are different from political activists of the late 19th century and early 20th century counterparts, citing contemporary rejection of violent methods as the main difference. Kazin described the Occupy Wall Street anarchists as “ultra-egalitarian, radically environmentalist, effortlessly multicultural and scrupulously non-violent”, describing them as the “cyber-clever progeny of Henry David Thoreau and Emma Goldman.
"Effortlessly multicultural, scrupulously nonviolent" or The Useful Losers?
Well apparently the debate continues and it is fair to say that the suspects, if guilty, do not agree with Kazin. In fairness to Occupy, there are probably a certain number of crazies who attach to any social movement. The profile of the suspects suggest that none of them would ever have become leaders of note or successful at anything. They were not the next tycoons, politicians or legends — not the coming men of the next generation.
The traditional role of losers has been to lend themselves to use by the players and abandoned to their fate thereafter. Perhaps the best known example of a throw-away loser was Gavrilo Princip, “born in Obljaj, a poor part of Bosnia … his parents, Petar, a postman, and Marija … had nine children, six of whom died in infancy. His impoverished parents could not provide for him and sent him to live with an older brother in Zagreb, now the capital of Croatia”.
That made him a perfect stooge for the Black Hand, which was playing a much larger game of power politics. They trained a number of disposables, one of whom was Princip — also described as an anarchist — and the rest, as they say is history. Once used, Princip was forgotten. When he died, “Princip weighed around 40 kilograms (88 lb), weakened by malnutrition, blood loss from his amputated arm, and disease.”
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Prediction: the left will blame the confidential informant for everything, claiming he planned and instigated everything, then betrayed The Movement.
The accused will become heroes to the left — ostensibly because they’re “political prisoners”, but really because they admire the Will To Violence exhibited by the wannabe terrorists.
The inversions of out times:
If a single guy like Timothy McVeigh bombs something, it’s an indictment of the entire American Right Wing, even if McVeigh is shown to have little or nothing to do with the Right Wing, it still is an indictment of the Right from that point on.
If a single guy like Anders Breivik bombs and shoots 72 people to death, it’s an indictment of the entire Norwegian Right Wing anti-Sharia anti-Islamization movement, even if Breivik is later proven to be basically insane, and shown to have drawn his influences from Islam itself, al Qaida, Wiki, and Left Wing anarchist hand books too, the anti-Islam movement takes the brunt.
BUT…
If an branch of an avowed Left Wing organization, one with links no less directly to the sitting President of the United States (#Occupy;Van Jones et al; Vallerie Jarrett, Hussein Obama), is discovered in a blatant terroristic bomb plot, stories immediately emerge which sever the association and links which might harm the cause. The would-be bombers are no longer members or leaders in good standing within #Occupy, but become ephemeral “anarchists”, a word which seems designed to obfuscate and conceal the fact these guys are Left Wing terrorists in a group suppported by and directly linked to the sitting POTUS.
The same dynamic applies to thousands of black on white murders, or blacks being 50 times more likely than whites to commit violent crime. This fact is easily countered by a single manufactured story about a “white Latino” hunting down an innocent bushy black eyed teen.
A lone pastor in Florida threatens to burn a book, tens of thousands of Muslims riot and murder across the globe, and Christianity gets tarred with the label “intolerant”, the Muslims are labelled “aggrieved victims”.
Given all things, it could certainly happen that the GOP will hold the House, and take the Senate and White House. Not a lock, but certainly a reasonable possibility.
I become daily more convinced that if that happens, we will soon see political violence on a level not seen in many of our lifetimes, certainly since 1975 or so, which is nearly two generations.
This, I think, will happen not despite the fact that OWS radicals will have been repudiated by the vast majority of the American public, but rather specifically because of that. They had both Houses and the Executive for a very leftist Democratic party, and they STILL will have failed utterly. Thus they will have to choose: did they fail because they are in fact wrong, and they live in a country whose population as a whole will simply never buy what they are selling? Or did they fail because they are obviously, totally, and eternally right and just, everyone else is wrong, and now they have ultimate proof that “the system” will never allow the “justice” they seek peacefully, and thus violence is in fact the only answer?
Those are their two stark choices. Gee, any bets on which route huge numbers of them will choose, in spirit if not actually action? And of course the actions WILL follow to some levels.
I sincerely hope I am wrong, but I don’t think I am. And as events unfold, there is really one primary fact that conservatives and libertarians need remember – Like the common cold, but FAR more virulent and deadly, the Marxist virus will never, never, NEVER, NEVER, NEVER go away or be beaten. Ever. EVER. The more conservatives succeed, the better they repair the economy and create wealth, the more nitwits will listen to that eternal siren song, and tell themselves we will all be so much better off if only everyone else is forced to give them the authority to make it so, by force.
Your great-grandchildren will fight this battle. Count on it. And interesting times are, I think, closer than many realize.
Wretchard – you all but asked “who sent these clowns” – I am curious what or who you think that might be – I wonder myself (perhaps related: “The Coming Insurrection”)
http://www.amazon.com/Coming-Insurrection-Semiotext-Intervention-Series/dp/1584350806
Yah just never know, nineteen guys with box cutters could cause a lot of trouble if you don’t act on what you know.
I presume if the FBI wanted info on these guys it probably had micro-sensors up their butts for the last six months, spoofed IPs or not. Or maybe that’s just the romantic in me.
And what’s a “Fusion Center”?
http://www.dhs.gov/files/programs/gc_1156877184684.shtm
http://www.aclu.org/technology-and-liberty/whats-wrong-fusion-centers-executive-summary
Oh. Nothing to do with magnetohydrodynamics at all, hardly.
–
lc @ 4:
http://www.amazon.com/Coming-Insurrection-Semiotext-Intervention-Series/dp/1584350806
Yah whatever, litcrit pomo stuff, where art is not quite crime and crime is not quite art, and bite me. Still, I read one of those every now and again, for laffs.
1 @Rob Crawford
Seems like the obvious choice. That’s what they’ve been doing to CI Brandon Darby for years.
“…in fairness to…” and I ask why one would be ‘Fair’ They usually are not. Just try engaging them. All you get is a regurgitation of carp. Kinda fishy don’t you think…..
Personally I think the goals of Occupy are quite limited. They are a crowd of Rent-A-Losers whose unstated job description is to provide newsworthy street theater. There are unspoken limits to what they may do, so if the mob is just funning, knocking in a few storefronts, chasing a few old ladies down the street, there is no foul, and the Players just turn a blind eye.
Every now and again a few celebrities come on down to make the crowd feel they are part of Something Important. For a few bucks a few crackpot Marxist academics can be encouraged to address the crowd to lend a kind of costume dignity to what would otherwise be a clown show.
But the limits must be observed. Ultimately the Players want to remain in control. And the Leftist Players, the guys behind the action, are about as One Percent as it is is possible to be. The problem is there are a few losers who never get the word; who actually believe the stuff they hear, are taken in by the twinkling fingers and the fine rhetoric. They’re not smart enough to see the setup. They don’t understand the unstated limits. So they take the Marxist crackpot academics at their word. They read so much of their bilge that they literally take leave of their senses. They become imbued with the idea that the Important People are behind them. And they walk right into it.
What they don’t understand is that they are just political Kleenex. There to do the dirty job. There to pose for the dramatic news photo showing their hair on fire. And eventually some of these poor losers start thinking. ‘Duh, maybe we should blow up the Man. Duh, let’s get some C4. I know I guy I met at Occupy who seems, duh, wired.’ You that last part right.
I genuinely sympathize with these guys at a human level. They are earnest and stupid. These guys have have Tool written all over them. Of course, they could have hurt someone. Princip actually started the Great War, for instance, and indirectly killed millions. But to the end he never quite understood either the means nor the ends. He only knew that he was lost. Someone gave him a hand. But you have got to be careful in these cases whose hand you take.
Wolves or tools… can anyone sort them fairly? They’re lucky they’re not Egyptian, or they’d have been sent to Syria to join the losing side. Granted it was “only” a bridge they were targeting and not their fellow man.
Like I said over week ago, the bubble is growing in frequency and size (http://hamptonroads.com.nyud.net/2012/05/beating-church-and-brambleton) OWS, Anarchist, the demise of OBL they are just another tool being turned and twisted to make this November 0bama’s (one way or another…) Reality like Google Goggles will have very little to do with our elections this November.
I can smell the patchouli oozing out of those pictures.
There go I but by the grace of God.
I was lost, but now I’m found.
Really, we need to take pity on young men like these. I see them all over the Haight-Ashbury district in San Francisco. They all lack, it seems, the sense of incorporation into a team of men doing good.
But what honest team with a real mission would want to bear the cost of making men of them? Instead, they must flay to make themselves of importance and it is easier to destroy than to create.
There is NO way that these guys could have passed the rigid qualifying standaeither become part of the Occupy movement
Two guys can share a silent delusion. Five guys will almost always get you 10 or maybe 20. SEIU is way too close to the throne for any OWS related operation to go forward without their hand in it.
#11 Captain Ned
I can smell the patchouli oozing out of those pictures.
They do resemble the male members of the Manson “Family,” don’t they?
In the late 60s the SDS led to the weather underground
In the 70s and 80s the environmentalists led to the deep ecology movement which spiked trees, crippled loggers and burned property.
The Green Party in W Germany was created by the E German Stasi
The Occupy groups have led to a neo anarchist movement.
Unfortunately the 16 to 24yr old are vulnerable to such madness.
French Premier Georges Clemenceau (1841-1929) captured it well–
“Not to be a socialist at twenty is proof of want of heart; to be one at thirty is proof of want of head.”
This quote is often inaccurately attributed to W Churchill-he did quote it.
Unfortunately Georges Clemenceau also rammed through the disaster of the Treaty of Versailles-
-which led directly to the demoralization of German politics and the horrors of WW 2.
Fortunately our kids have survived the virus up to their early 20s–and like smoking-if you are hooked by then – then you will probably never smoke–same with socialism or “Blood and Soil” fascist movements
“Blood and Soil” ideology-whether in Germany, Israel or elsewhere ends in tears.
The Jesuits start much earlier –” Give us a boy until he is 6 years old and we will have him for life”–true–to an extent
-but the Jesuits are benign.
8 @Wretchard
I think that’s an excellent analysis, but I’m not so sure about your penultimate paragraph. While I do believe that a large majority of Occupiers are the Useful Idiots that you describe, I also think that there is a small but significant percentage that are best described by Alfred in The Dark Knight:
Most of today’s poster boys for reenacting Project Mayhem would probably fit this category.
“The profile of the suspects suggest that none of them would ever have become leaders of note or successful at anything.”
You have just described Osama Bin Laden. No matter how successful he was at his father’s business, it still would be his father’s busienss and he only one of a very large family, and no matter how successful the family, a vast gulf would exist between them and the Saudi Royals.
It’s a case of deciding it is better to rule in hell than serve in heaven.
And it appears that near the end of his life OBL still dreamed up terrorist plots while realizing that the only people who would follow him were even bigger losers than himself.
It’s really a case of making sure that their losers don’t beat our losers, because no matter what we do, our losers will eventually put one of their own in charge of all of us. We can get by with losers in charge once in a while if we have enough Design Margin built up.
My perception is that the character and motivation of the OWS crowd runs the gamut from a few genuinely gentle anti-violence , anti- Wall Street peacenik/ environmental types to many overtly threatening nihilist and anarchist types with a strong predominance of the bad guys. OWS is definitely a de rigueur fashion statement among the Leftoids, and I imagine a serious Lefty would not want to be on the outside looking in.
Whether Democrat party or Union apparatchiks had a direct hand in this plot is anybody’s guess but it’s hard to believe than the Party/Union apparatchiks were completely unaware of these guys given the clueless braggadocio of the suspects. The sad truth is that there are likely thousands in all the major OWS networks who fit the mold of these five. By endlessly glorifying the 60′s radical anarchists as the highest form of patriotism, our Nanny State/ Educational systems have produced a lost generation of clueless brainwashed chumps who can no longer perceive the bright moral line where political speech ends and wanton evil begins.
What I wonder is whether these arrestees in my neighborhood are just an example of the next vanguard emerging as part of the common strategy to push a society leftward by means of terror following the usual pattern. That is, start movement advocating equality and citing grievances of a social justice nature. Then, once established, and once the insouciance of the Establishment viz these grievances has also be established, Escalate – let the protesting peaceful social justice crowds incubate bombers and violent rioters. Then the putatively non-violent, original folks decry the methods of their violent comrades, but praise their motives, they share, and declare that only compromise with their demands will stop the regrettable violence. Thereby the whole of society can be moved leftward. It seems like the second phase is starting. Could be a powerful momentum to have in place if our economy becomes destabilized enough in the next couple of years.
This sounds a lot like another Hutterie Militia case to me. It takes a lot more than a couple of blocks of C4 to take down a major bridge structure. It would take a week for a demolition company to set it up. Sounds to me like a bunch of OWS losers talking smack to a confidential FBI informant who sets up said losers so the FBI can grab some headlines and more budget.
Sorry guys this case is BS.
Geez, I once lived down the road from that bridge, and drove over it from time to time. Looks like the crazy years are coming back (perhaps better known as the 60′s, 1965 -1968, to be exact).
Yeah, deez guys are jes’ tools, ya know? Who sent dem, huh?
“Sorry guys this case is BS.”
And so it begins…
“The May Day Event that was sponsored by Occupy Cleveland, the North Shore AFL-CIO, Cleveland Jobs with Justice, Fight for a Fair Economy and SEIU Local 1 has been cancelled because of the alleged actions of the autonomous group arrested last night. Occupy Cleveland has had affirmed principles of non-violence since its inception on October 6, 2011.”
Translation, “We got caught.”
Whitehall 12,
That is why I believe in 6 months of universal basic military training at age 17. Not for military efficiency, it wouldn’t be, but to to give some of the lost a chance to move on and up.
I love those mug shots and the four tragic haircuts. I know you can’t judge a book by its cover, but all these guys look like clowns. It might be a big mistake but I’m sorry, I would laugh out loud if I saw this gang walking down the street.
t @ 21: Sounds to me like a bunch of OWS losers talking smack to a confidential FBI informant who sets up said losers so the FBI can grab some headlines and more budget.
I agree it’s probably around 50% home security theater, I guess if you’re the FBI you have to do this, and when you catch them you have to do something with them, but lord knows what real justice is under the circumstances. Crucify them in the town square, I guess, judging from recent news reports, that or six months on a road crew clearing weeds and eleven years probation.
“Thank goodness for the FBI informants. They are the only ones that consistently pay their dues. The party would be crippled without them.”
18 USC § 371, conspiracy, carries a penalty of up to five years. 18 USC § 844 (i), use of explosives affecting interstate or foreign commerce, is 5-20. Whoops. Looks like a long time in the big house for our merry band of pranksters. And as for this tdiinva character who thinks this is nonsense: if their attempt had killed anyone, then they’d be looking at the death penalty.
Michelle Malkin posted this excellent cartoon with the same theme:
http://tinyurl.com/3ry4t
Gavrilo Princip was indeed a tool, but no fire’s hot enough to burn him properly. I hope he’s still burning someplace. That evil, fanatic SOB applied the match to all of civilization.
The OWS “movement” is nothing more than the same tired old street cadres of the same tired old will to power posse. Commies of every flavor, from national socialists to the transnational and international gaian variety, have been running this game with anarchists for big government movements forever.
SOP is to scare the proles into choosing the lesser contrived evil, and the usual suspects embrace them closely — at arms length.
It’s “Choose us, or get them”…Suckers.“
There is, thankfully, another way that our Founding Fathers gifted to us all.
It’s time for choosing: http://youtu.be/UAqnGmgKq00
El Jefe (30),
Well, yes, but he wasn’t the one who left huge piles of flammable tinder stacked all around the continent.
I rode a desk,
Banned all the best,
When the Progs ruled,
And the correcters puled
One problem we have with OWS is that they have a point. IMHO, the replacement of Wall Street and the City of London (along with similar places in Tokyo and Frankfurt, perhaps) with piles of smoking rubble would be an improvement. Getting rid of parasites is always a good idea.
I can well imagine a remake of the film Wall Street, at the end of which a mob storms Gordon Gekko’s HQ and he ends up swinging from a lamp post. Finis.
27. toadold + 28. David Gillies: Do we know that “being on top of things” isn’t creating these people? Who is conspiring when only the dumb and the desperate seem to fall for these traps? If government is going to sponsor loser-recruitment programs, then they should push them toward healthy escapes like (*ugh*) peace corp activities or leaving the country.
Universities arguably functioned this way until they became too expensive. I’m sure professors view our military in much the same way. That crafty Wizard was probably doing a good thing by handing out fake diplomas and medals – it was to keep the queers from blowing themselves up.
These suspected progressive activists will likely become esteemed tenured professors in some acclaimed mid-western university 20 years down the road, arising every morning to defeat capitalism while drawing lavish salaries to educate your grandchildren….
34. Fletcher Christian
One problem we have with OWS is that they have a point.
If their “point” (and yours) involves mob violence and turning cities into “piles of smoking rubble,” then to hell with them. And you. Please keep your fantasies of hanging people from lamp posts to yourself.
37- don’t be so sensitive.
38. Baobo
Heh, interesting. I speak out against mob violence, and your reaction? I’m too “sensitive.”
Not really, but your irony meter definitely needs recalibrating.
39. Evil Otto
There are times and circumstances wherein mob violence is the only available action. I do not advocate violence but certain occasions require it. Our forefathers gave us the tools to avoid such problems but I fear that they have been left largely unused for the past half-century.
Mr Crawford (#23)
How is this different than the Hutterie Militia case?
“But what honest team with a real mission would want to bear the cost of making men of them?”
That used to be what the Army did but no more. The military has become so technical that it cannot use cannon fodder anymore. IMHO the authorities need to pick up the OWSer’s and ship them to Cuba. A reverse boatlift.
The Hutterite Militia analogy is not as strained as it may at first appear.
In 1976, during Cleveland’s turf war between the Irish and Italian mafia, 36 bombings were committed in and around the Cleveland area.
In 2012, anarcho-communists received an inert bomb from an FBI informant who directed them to place it beneath a bridge in a Cleveland area National Park. The not-a-bomb (not surprisingly) did not explode. The nonexplosion (not surprisingly) did not kill anyone–nary an Irishman or Italian, nor anyone else.
Quoting an FBI spokesman: “[A]t no time during the course of the investigation was the public ever in danger.”
The FBI had informers in each of these bomb/non-bomb dramas who helped to shape and direct events. This episode concluded peacefully, just as it did with the Hutterite militia; Fast and Furious ended badly, as did the Danny Greene bombing.
If the FBI is going to use agent provocateurs, it is better that they use unarmed ones who are planting inert bombs.
The problem with Princip, and with the Bad Hair Day Brigade pictured above, is that the rabblerousers who use such tools don’t think the fire will ever get out of control. They don’t understand the house can burn down. They had no part in building it, know nothing about how to build it or even do the routine maintenence. To them, it’s always been there, just with the wrong people living in it.
Getting rid of parasites is always a good idea.
But Fletch. People like the bombers and OWS are parasites themselves. The “parasites” you speak of have, at least, proven their utility. You may have a legitimate beef with Wall Street (as so many of us do), but the underlying concept of a stock and trade market for investors is a vital one, isn’t it? Would you rein in Wall Street and it’s UK equivalent, or destroy it?
Also, OWS “having a point” is not reason enough to grant them legitimacy. Plenty of sober people who are not defecating anti-semites hold similar grievances, but don’t smash Starbucks windows or dump tubs of human waste on bank steps.
Frankly: screw the “Hutterite Militia” comparison. I have a very utilitarian interest in having these dud bombers being used as a tool to help demonize OWS, while at the same time persistently linking OWS to the Democratic Party and the current administration. We have our quadrennial cold civil war known as a presidential election going on, and we need to bring a cannon to a gunfight.
Considering what’s at stake in 2012, I have no use for nuance on such issues. If the neo-hippie anachronist/anarchists in this case win a reversal in 2013, I don’t really care, as long as it’s not before November 2012.
Don (46) (commenting to Fletcher),
It’s granting OWS too much to say they have “a point”. Yes, they’re right in suspecting some great injustice has been/is being done, but they’re wrong about the what and to whom.
And JMH (45), that’s a nice clarification/addition; thanks!
Hey all, can we get this straight: the militia group called themselves “Hutaree”.
Don- OWS was a trap. There was no “movement” before billionaires came up with a plan to exhibit god’s social refuse. It was mainly hopeless people who got sucked in and destroyed by the protests, and some number of good citizens now have “mistakes” in their past. There was no pressing threat that couldn’t have been handled by regular law enforcement. To top it all off, there is probably nothing wrong with our economy. It was just somebody’s idea of a joke, and now these guys are paying the price.
44. MALTHUS
Quoting an FBI spokesman: “[A]t no time during the course of the investigation was the public ever in danger.”
Before you place your trust in the FBI’s competence and ability to manage these types of operations, I strongly recommend you investigate a little more fully. A good example to start with is how the FBI’s “cleverness” helped cause the deaths of six people in the first World Trade Center attack/bombing:
FBI Blunders and the First World Trade Center Bombing
Don R:
You are the mirror image of the Obama Adminstration. The ends don’t justify the means. I believe in protecting everbody’s civil liberties. If I excuse the violation of OWS rights then somebody may choose to excuse the violation of my rights.
52. tdiinva
You are the mirror image of the Obama Adminstration.
No. I’m. Not.
I never said anything about intefering with the process of justice did I?
Exactly — thank you. I said that I don’t care what the judicial outcome of the case is, as long as it doesn’t interfere with the November election process. Clear enough?
I see no problem under the circumstances with tying OWS to the Democrats and the White House. Do you?
Baobo:
I’m not clear on what your point is in regard to the post you’re responding to. I’m only interested — within the context of this election cycle — of the effect of OWS and its activities, and how that can be turned against the President and the Democratic Party.
One difference between the Hutaree and the OWS insane clown posse (Cleveland Chapter) is that the Hutaree members were basically busted for first amendment mouthing off violations wherein they were recorded speculating in front of their friendly neighborhood eFBI informer regarding a possible future need for taking out local rogue police elements in defense of their community (a couple of them did eventually get ex post facto fished up on miscellaneous firearm related charges); while the OWS clowns -one of whom held a founding leadership position within the local organizational hierarchy of a national ‘movement’ with a well-documented track record of wanton property destruction and general breaking of a diverse array of laws- were busted after they allegedly conspired to, operationally planned, received into their possession, and placed on target what they believed were viable explosive devices with full intent to destroy a civilian bridge…And are also alleged to have conspired to carry out follow-on attacks in another state in support of the same supposedly compartmentalized movement.
Seems to me, one is not quite like the other.
…Though both groups did [typically] sucks at OPSEC.
The Smoking Gun has “unmasked” the supposed FBI informant: Shaquille Azir
This website once published two stories about a fake pedophile/Amazon author “Phillip Greaves” [1] [2] … So who knows if “Azir” is even a real person.
51. tharkun
“Before you place your trust in the FBI’s competence and ability to manage these types of operations, I strongly recommend you investigate a little more fully.”
Please note my reference to the deadly outcome of Fast and Furious.
stevesmith @25: “but I’m sorry, I would laugh out loud if I saw this gang walking down the street”
Probably a mistake. The day is coming when no one will be laughing, and you will either run or open fire.
I knew scads of guys like these, circa 1969-73. It scares the hell out of me that they have been able to reproduce.