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	<title>Comments on: The Campaign Gets Hotter Still&#8230;</title>
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		<title>By: The Campaign Gets Hotter Still… &#124; PoliticsMuch.com</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-6357</link>
		<dc:creator>The Campaign Gets Hotter Still… &#124; PoliticsMuch.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Oct 2008 22:24:43 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: dangoorevitch</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-6059</link>
		<dc:creator>dangoorevitch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 04:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&quot;Free of Pisistratus, we choose a knave or a eunuch to rule over us.&quot; (Pound)

Is this how we vote - father, son, father, son, in turns?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Free of Pisistratus, we choose a knave or a eunuch to rule over us.&#8221; (Pound)</p>
<p>Is this how we vote &#8211; father, son, father, son, in turns?</p>
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		<title>By: TLM</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5989</link>
		<dc:creator>TLM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 20:42:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>cfbleachers,

Many good points. The right wing fringe elements have been irrelevant since the 90&#039;s, and even then had little sway. Their stupid acts of violence (McVeigh) left them completely discredited. The recent Supreme Court ruling on the Second Amendment will assuage moderately conservative gun-clingers (I&#039;m one of them). I agree we don&#039;t need -- and never did -- a radical fringe on the Right. 

The left wing fringe has always been more surreptitious, at least since the 60&#039;s (Obama&#039;s past is typical in this respect).  They now wield a great amount of influence in politics (Democratic party), the media and academia. An honest and frank discussion of where this country is headed is not in the picture for the foreseeable future, I&#039;m afraid.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>cfbleachers,</p>
<p>Many good points. The right wing fringe elements have been irrelevant since the 90&#8242;s, and even then had little sway. Their stupid acts of violence (McVeigh) left them completely discredited. The recent Supreme Court ruling on the Second Amendment will assuage moderately conservative gun-clingers (I&#8217;m one of them). I agree we don&#8217;t need &#8212; and never did &#8212; a radical fringe on the Right. </p>
<p>The left wing fringe has always been more surreptitious, at least since the 60&#8242;s (Obama&#8217;s past is typical in this respect).  They now wield a great amount of influence in politics (Democratic party), the media and academia. An honest and frank discussion of where this country is headed is not in the picture for the foreseeable future, I&#8217;m afraid.</p>
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		<title>By: Sharpshooter</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5988</link>
		<dc:creator>Sharpshooter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 20:16:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5988</guid>
		<description>&quot;Once I wrote a Wall Street Journal op-ed supporting Bill Clinton’s foreign policy, despite not voting for him, and was duly impressed with his welfare reform and the surplus that emerged during his presidency.&quot;

Clinton&#039;s welfare reform was done by the Republican Congress and Clinton had to be dragged kicking and screaming to the table to sign it.

Further, his &quot;surplus&quot; was an artifact of several factors, none of which was his doing:

* The S&amp;L bailout through the RTC went from a cash outflow under Bush 41, to a cash inflow during Clinton&#039;s regime.

* The &quot;Peace Dividend&quot; from the fall of the Soviet Union just a year and a half before he took office.

* The tech boom that, much a factor of the Reagan years, in many ways Clinton destroyed - his tax hikes and the onerous and idiotic FCC rules on Telecoms.

* A Republican Congress in his last six years. Note that Congress creates yearly fiscal policy. Note, too, that the stock market was flat, from 1993 until almost the day that the Republican Congress was sworn into office in January, 2005.

In hindsight, would Mr. Hanson say Clinton&#039;s foreign policy was a positive, or nearly as much an abject failure as Jimmy Carter&#039;s?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Once I wrote a Wall Street Journal op-ed supporting Bill Clinton’s foreign policy, despite not voting for him, and was duly impressed with his welfare reform and the surplus that emerged during his presidency.&#8221;</p>
<p>Clinton&#8217;s welfare reform was done by the Republican Congress and Clinton had to be dragged kicking and screaming to the table to sign it.</p>
<p>Further, his &#8220;surplus&#8221; was an artifact of several factors, none of which was his doing:</p>
<p>* The S&amp;L bailout through the RTC went from a cash outflow under Bush 41, to a cash inflow during Clinton&#8217;s regime.</p>
<p>* The &#8220;Peace Dividend&#8221; from the fall of the Soviet Union just a year and a half before he took office.</p>
<p>* The tech boom that, much a factor of the Reagan years, in many ways Clinton destroyed &#8211; his tax hikes and the onerous and idiotic FCC rules on Telecoms.</p>
<p>* A Republican Congress in his last six years. Note that Congress creates yearly fiscal policy. Note, too, that the stock market was flat, from 1993 until almost the day that the Republican Congress was sworn into office in January, 2005.</p>
<p>In hindsight, would Mr. Hanson say Clinton&#8217;s foreign policy was a positive, or nearly as much an abject failure as Jimmy Carter&#8217;s?</p>
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		<title>By: cfbleachers</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5987</link>
		<dc:creator>cfbleachers</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 16:07:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5987</guid>
		<description>Change I can believe in:

1)When the information I receive in order to make informed decisions on national issues of global significance....doesn&#039;t read like a Pravda approved script, that would be change I could believe in.

2)When the information I receive doesn&#039;t include hidden agendas, vast and glaring omissions, intentional deceit, photoshopped pictures, and a strong slanderous undertone about my country, my military, our objectives and our achievements, that would be change I could believe in.

3) When one party ceases to own the information stream and ceases to allow it to be raped repeatedly to advance their social engineering causes and hides their inexorable march toward social democracy as well as their pocket-lining cronyism and earmark slush funds, that would be a change I could believe in.

4) I have absolutely no use for the fringe right in this country.  The KKK, Timothy McVeigh and/or their ilk are a shameful addition to our melting pot.  But they have very little influence on our culture compared to the fringe left.  The fringe left are much more dangerous because they are much more powerful.  The information stream is dominated and controlled in Academia, Hollywood, alphabet news stations, major media papers and periodicals as viceroys for the imperial &quot;message&quot; of the Socialist throne.

If we could ever get to a place where exposing this fraud was a part of the national dialogue, that would be change I could believe in.

5)The Iraq theater and the achievements, goals, the threats and opportunities have been slandered since its inception.  This intentional deceit presents a myriad of dangers to our country and to my countrymen.  The dialogue on these issues of utmost importance has been debased to a depth of cocktail party gossip and infused with a bar stool logic that is at once puerile and yet dangerously destructive at the same time.  If we could elevate the discussion and infuse facts instead of slander, that would be change I could believe in.

6)The &quot;bailout&quot; is a leaky bucket on a sinking ship.  It seems we are being told (not by any leading economists, by the way...they are AGAINST this move from what I&#039;ve seen...although not by the Pravda media)that this will &quot;save&quot; the financial institutions, &quot;save&quot; our economy, and &quot;save&quot; homeowners from foreclosure.  I have my doubts about all of it.

We are going through a market correction...along the same lines as we did with the sugar buzz infused crash after the high...(binge and purge economic bulimia)...of junk bonds, dot coms...and now mortgage junk securities.

The leftists wanted to threaten ECOA suits for giving easy credit on the biggest ticket item to folks who don&#039;t earn enough to qualify under normal underwriting standards.  Now...they want to have the diligent and responsible act as &quot;taxpayer trustees&quot; in which the debt for the yet again failed social engineering project is saddled on the poor sap who owns a small business or has succeeded in making a nice living.

All the while, being slapped repeatedly in the face ...so, he or she will be DOUBLE TAXED...having every conceivable taxation (inheritance, capital gains etc.)...AND being saddled with paying back a debt he/she didn&#039;t cause, in a crisis he/she didn&#039;t make or contribute to, and EVERYONE ELSE...gets off scot free.

The &quot;rich&quot;, of course...will be blamed...as will the Republicans...who apparently are too weak willed and too clumsy to articulate the truth and fight back against yet another slander.  If someone would stand up and say NO MORE...that would be change I could believe in.

7)The current &quot;crisis&quot; is a correction that was badly needed and easily forecasted.  The current solution, loaded with earmarks for ACORN and La Raza is a slap in the face.

Sen. Obama has an open ear for fringe leftists his whole life.  Frank Marshall Davis, Jeremiah Wright, Louis Farrakhan, Bernadine Dorhn, Ayers, radical professors at college ...this is the energy behind the base of his campaign and his upbringing his entire life.

He also has an open ear for very strong anti-Israel sentiments.  Brzyzinski,  Samantha Power, O&#039;Malley, the late Edward Said, Ali Abunimah, Anthony Lake, Tony McPeak, Susan Rice.

He doesn&#039;t merely &quot;hide&quot; his association with Ayers...he hides (with complicit Pravda arm backing his ploy) his associations and beliefs with all of the above.  A frank discussion on those things...would be a change I could believe in.

In summary, I have zero interest in becoming a social democracy.  But, at a minimum...I would like to have an open, honest and frank discussion on our inexorable march in that direction.  I would like our information stream to not be a Trojan Horse for that march.  And I would like accountability for the treasonous villains who have stolen it.  That...is the change I could believe in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Change I can believe in:</p>
<p>1)When the information I receive in order to make informed decisions on national issues of global significance&#8230;.doesn&#8217;t read like a Pravda approved script, that would be change I could believe in.</p>
<p>2)When the information I receive doesn&#8217;t include hidden agendas, vast and glaring omissions, intentional deceit, photoshopped pictures, and a strong slanderous undertone about my country, my military, our objectives and our achievements, that would be change I could believe in.</p>
<p>3) When one party ceases to own the information stream and ceases to allow it to be raped repeatedly to advance their social engineering causes and hides their inexorable march toward social democracy as well as their pocket-lining cronyism and earmark slush funds, that would be a change I could believe in.</p>
<p>4) I have absolutely no use for the fringe right in this country.  The KKK, Timothy McVeigh and/or their ilk are a shameful addition to our melting pot.  But they have very little influence on our culture compared to the fringe left.  The fringe left are much more dangerous because they are much more powerful.  The information stream is dominated and controlled in Academia, Hollywood, alphabet news stations, major media papers and periodicals as viceroys for the imperial &#8220;message&#8221; of the Socialist throne.</p>
<p>If we could ever get to a place where exposing this fraud was a part of the national dialogue, that would be change I could believe in.</p>
<p>5)The Iraq theater and the achievements, goals, the threats and opportunities have been slandered since its inception.  This intentional deceit presents a myriad of dangers to our country and to my countrymen.  The dialogue on these issues of utmost importance has been debased to a depth of cocktail party gossip and infused with a bar stool logic that is at once puerile and yet dangerously destructive at the same time.  If we could elevate the discussion and infuse facts instead of slander, that would be change I could believe in.</p>
<p>6)The &#8220;bailout&#8221; is a leaky bucket on a sinking ship.  It seems we are being told (not by any leading economists, by the way&#8230;they are AGAINST this move from what I&#8217;ve seen&#8230;although not by the Pravda media)that this will &#8220;save&#8221; the financial institutions, &#8220;save&#8221; our economy, and &#8220;save&#8221; homeowners from foreclosure.  I have my doubts about all of it.</p>
<p>We are going through a market correction&#8230;along the same lines as we did with the sugar buzz infused crash after the high&#8230;(binge and purge economic bulimia)&#8230;of junk bonds, dot coms&#8230;and now mortgage junk securities.</p>
<p>The leftists wanted to threaten ECOA suits for giving easy credit on the biggest ticket item to folks who don&#8217;t earn enough to qualify under normal underwriting standards.  Now&#8230;they want to have the diligent and responsible act as &#8220;taxpayer trustees&#8221; in which the debt for the yet again failed social engineering project is saddled on the poor sap who owns a small business or has succeeded in making a nice living.</p>
<p>All the while, being slapped repeatedly in the face &#8230;so, he or she will be DOUBLE TAXED&#8230;having every conceivable taxation (inheritance, capital gains etc.)&#8230;AND being saddled with paying back a debt he/she didn&#8217;t cause, in a crisis he/she didn&#8217;t make or contribute to, and EVERYONE ELSE&#8230;gets off scot free.</p>
<p>The &#8220;rich&#8221;, of course&#8230;will be blamed&#8230;as will the Republicans&#8230;who apparently are too weak willed and too clumsy to articulate the truth and fight back against yet another slander.  If someone would stand up and say NO MORE&#8230;that would be change I could believe in.</p>
<p>7)The current &#8220;crisis&#8221; is a correction that was badly needed and easily forecasted.  The current solution, loaded with earmarks for ACORN and La Raza is a slap in the face.</p>
<p>Sen. Obama has an open ear for fringe leftists his whole life.  Frank Marshall Davis, Jeremiah Wright, Louis Farrakhan, Bernadine Dorhn, Ayers, radical professors at college &#8230;this is the energy behind the base of his campaign and his upbringing his entire life.</p>
<p>He also has an open ear for very strong anti-Israel sentiments.  Brzyzinski,  Samantha Power, O&#8217;Malley, the late Edward Said, Ali Abunimah, Anthony Lake, Tony McPeak, Susan Rice.</p>
<p>He doesn&#8217;t merely &#8220;hide&#8221; his association with Ayers&#8230;he hides (with complicit Pravda arm backing his ploy) his associations and beliefs with all of the above.  A frank discussion on those things&#8230;would be a change I could believe in.</p>
<p>In summary, I have zero interest in becoming a social democracy.  But, at a minimum&#8230;I would like to have an open, honest and frank discussion on our inexorable march in that direction.  I would like our information stream to not be a Trojan Horse for that march.  And I would like accountability for the treasonous villains who have stolen it.  That&#8230;is the change I could believe in.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Kean</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5981</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Kean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:12:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5981</guid>
		<description>5</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>5</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Kean</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5980</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Kean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:03:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5980</guid>
		<description>Number 5 wins.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Number 5 wins.</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Kean</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5979</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Kean</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 03:02:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5979</guid>
		<description>Gaisan

What are the alternatives? 1. Monarchy?  We don&#039;t think anybody&#039;s that cool and nobody&#039;s pulling swords out of stones.  2. Oligarchy?  Who would they be and how would they get there? Possible though.  3. Theocracy?  There would have to be a very charismatic Christian or a lot more Muslims. Judaism is probably out of the question. 4. Anarchy is possible in the short run but usually leads to... 5. Totalitarianism?  Most likely through threats, intimidation, and violence. 

Number 4 probably wins.

TLM

Sadly, it&#039;s a pity that we&#039;d have to find some sort of crime to do anything punitive to them.  Mob rule is worse than them beating the system. 

In Douglas Feith&#039;s book, he talks about Bush&#039;s decision to fight the terrorist enemy but still not change the system of freedom, rights and privacy, the capitalistic system, checks and balances.  

After 911 another president might have made this a martial state depriving us of certain liberties.  Many accuse Bush of doing just that.  But I think those people are nuts.

So during and after this different yet debilitating crisis, there should be no radical changes in our way of life.  Hopefully no panic.  Hopefully cool heads.  If crimes are found, prosecute.  

They took $500 million dollars from Michael Milken and he wasn&#039;t even guilty of much.  The east coast banking houses hated him because he carved out and took a whole market for his group. The east coast institutions graduated into governmental positions and the old buddy network did him in. 

I just wish McCain would quit campaigning and be a full-time senator indefinitely.  He put packages together that some of us conservatives didn&#039;t like but he made a lot of people satisfied a few times. 

I wonder how his lightweight opponent is faring in the Senate.  I wonder if anybody is paying any attention to him?  Actually, I don&#039;t even want to know.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gaisan</p>
<p>What are the alternatives? 1. Monarchy?  We don&#8217;t think anybody&#8217;s that cool and nobody&#8217;s pulling swords out of stones.  2. Oligarchy?  Who would they be and how would they get there? Possible though.  3. Theocracy?  There would have to be a very charismatic Christian or a lot more Muslims. Judaism is probably out of the question. 4. Anarchy is possible in the short run but usually leads to&#8230; 5. Totalitarianism?  Most likely through threats, intimidation, and violence. </p>
<p>Number 4 probably wins.</p>
<p>TLM</p>
<p>Sadly, it&#8217;s a pity that we&#8217;d have to find some sort of crime to do anything punitive to them.  Mob rule is worse than them beating the system. </p>
<p>In Douglas Feith&#8217;s book, he talks about Bush&#8217;s decision to fight the terrorist enemy but still not change the system of freedom, rights and privacy, the capitalistic system, checks and balances.  </p>
<p>After 911 another president might have made this a martial state depriving us of certain liberties.  Many accuse Bush of doing just that.  But I think those people are nuts.</p>
<p>So during and after this different yet debilitating crisis, there should be no radical changes in our way of life.  Hopefully no panic.  Hopefully cool heads.  If crimes are found, prosecute.  </p>
<p>They took $500 million dollars from Michael Milken and he wasn&#8217;t even guilty of much.  The east coast banking houses hated him because he carved out and took a whole market for his group. The east coast institutions graduated into governmental positions and the old buddy network did him in. </p>
<p>I just wish McCain would quit campaigning and be a full-time senator indefinitely.  He put packages together that some of us conservatives didn&#8217;t like but he made a lot of people satisfied a few times. </p>
<p>I wonder how his lightweight opponent is faring in the Senate.  I wonder if anybody is paying any attention to him?  Actually, I don&#8217;t even want to know.</p>
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		<title>By: TLM</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5978</link>
		<dc:creator>TLM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 01:27:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5978</guid>
		<description>Addendum:

You decide. What punishment should we mete out to that Wall Street gang of thieves that ruined our economy and, possibly, guaranteed an Obama administration? Their RORI (Return On Reckless Investing) should serve as a fitting example to all the other greedy, money-for-nothin&#039; slackers in this country who participated in this disaster. Please send your suggestions to Comrade Paulson.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Addendum:</p>
<p>You decide. What punishment should we mete out to that Wall Street gang of thieves that ruined our economy and, possibly, guaranteed an Obama administration? Their RORI (Return On Reckless Investing) should serve as a fitting example to all the other greedy, money-for-nothin&#8217; slackers in this country who participated in this disaster. Please send your suggestions to Comrade Paulson.</p>
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		<title>By: TLM</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5976</link>
		<dc:creator>TLM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:59:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/victordavishanson/the-campaign-gets-hotter-still/#comment-5976</guid>
		<description>Why is it not raining bankers and brokers on Wall Street? Have these people no sense of shame? No pride? They were the captains of American Capitalism, the envy of the world and an inspiration to a generation of Americans. Well, an inspiration to a generation of gung ho narcissistic wannabee investors anyways, all of them itchin&#039; to &quot;pull the trigger&quot; on that next trade, bank a few mil and retire to the cocaine comforts of their own beach front estate in Costa Rica. But still, how could the Titans of Industry spoil the yuppie wet dream possessed of millions of their fellow citizens, and yet refuse to check out in traditional Street fashion? Must we throw the lot of these greedy, spineless little cretins from the parapets ourselves? Or should we, perhaps, leave them to a more politically correct fate, kowtowing, rice bowl in hand, to their new socialist masters in Washington?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why is it not raining bankers and brokers on Wall Street? Have these people no sense of shame? No pride? They were the captains of American Capitalism, the envy of the world and an inspiration to a generation of Americans. Well, an inspiration to a generation of gung ho narcissistic wannabee investors anyways, all of them itchin&#8217; to &#8220;pull the trigger&#8221; on that next trade, bank a few mil and retire to the cocaine comforts of their own beach front estate in Costa Rica. But still, how could the Titans of Industry spoil the yuppie wet dream possessed of millions of their fellow citizens, and yet refuse to check out in traditional Street fashion? Must we throw the lot of these greedy, spineless little cretins from the parapets ourselves? Or should we, perhaps, leave them to a more politically correct fate, kowtowing, rice bowl in hand, to their new socialist masters in Washington?</p>
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