Get PJ Media on your Apple

The PJ Tatler

by
Howard Nemerov

Bio

April 26, 2013 - 10:17 am
Page 1 of 2  Next ->   View as Single Page

Department of Homeland Security ammunition buying is back in the news. Republican House members questioned the amount of ammo being bought, alleging DHS agents use more than Army personnel.

Republican Rep. Jason Chaffetz said Thursday that the Department of Homeland Security is using roughly 1,000 rounds of ammunition more per person than the U.S. Army, as he and other lawmakers sharply questioned DHS officials on their “massive” bullet buys.

Democrats called this allegation “conspiracy theories.” Which brings us to today’s lesson on politics and reality, usually two different animals.

According to Rep. Chaffetz, “the DHS is churning through between 1,300 and 1,600 rounds per officer” on an annual basis. This translates into between 108 and 133 rounds per month for their 70,000 agents. We’ve easily shot 200-300 rounds during a one-day tactical training, topping 500 rounds in a weekend. Others report shooting even more. Since shooting skills are perishable, 108-133 rounds per month for professionals isn’t unreasonable.

Nevertheless, Senator Jim Inhofe (R-OK) and Congressman Frank Lucas (R-OK 3) have introduced legislation banning federal agencies from “stockpiling.” They allege that massive ammunition purchases by federal agencies contribute to what’s become an effective gun ban: Working firearms need live ammunition to be functional, and manufacturers haven’t been able to adequately supply the civilian market for months, leading to sharp price increases.

The DHS “categorically” denied it’s buying ammo targeted for American citizens. But “categorically” is a new-speak term, the verbal equivalent of crossing one’s fingers behind one’s back. Which category does this denial exist within? Is it DHS’s interpretation of reality on the day it made the denial, which can shift as soon as somebody rationalizes reality into another form?

But comparing the historical trend towards less liberty versus political rhetoric exposes more important considerations than whether you can buy ammunition today.

The issue of DHS shooting jacketed hollow-point during training is a red herring. Many agencies train with the ammunition they use on the job. The only issue here is that they are buying more expensive training ammo because they’re not paying for it, we are. Then we have to spend more discretionary after-higher-taxes income for our own ammunition that cost half as much a year ago.

Comments are closed.

All Comments   (39)
All Comments   (39)
Sort: Newest Oldest Top Rated
The numbers are probably correct. Contrary to popular belief, the Army doesn't spend that much time on shooting. Certain MOS do get range time, but a lot of Army personnel only qual every year and even then its 100 rounds downrange and go home.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
DHS probably has some deal with the Mexican government whereby they trade ammo for ritzy vacations.
Or it could be extortion: More videos of DHS having sexual escapades with Mexicans could be in a safe deposit box in Cancun.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
I've noticed that the online ammo sellers are starting to get more supplies in, especially .223 and .22LR. The prices are reasonable, but they sure soak you on those UPS shipping charges.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Have you heard the latest? Three days ago Obama signed an executive order banning the importation of ammunition and firearm components from other countries. I believe that he has become irrational in his pathological obsession to disarm the American public. How could he be so foolish and short-sighted? His executive order will severely handicap every police force in this country, many of which are already outgunned by the drug gangs. This executive order will have no effect on the criminal element, because guns and ammo will continue to be illegally transported across the wide-open Mexican border along with the heroine and cocaine.
But it will affect not only law-abiding citizens, but every police force in the country as well. This is not the act of a rational leader.
Now I understand why he ordered the Marines to carry unloaded weapons at his last inauguration. A Commander In Chief who fears his own military is a danger to everybody.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Link to the exec order?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
That's a rumor based on a non-professional interpretation of a proposed regulation, plus the usual conspiracy theories from Infowars, which was one of the first to push this DHS ammo buying story. There's no credible media report, nor comment from the NRA on this.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
We weren't allowed to use hollow point ammunition in Vietnam, it causes massive tissue damage. I doubt we are using it in Afghanistan; why is DHS using it?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Because the Hague Conventions only apply to the military. DHS is not military.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
So that when they shoot you there is less chance you will be around to sue.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Don't make excuses for them....they are NOT the army..... NOT police.....just customs and border patrol......why would they need monthly 'practice' for most employees?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
They are licensed law enforcement officers. So yes, they ARE police. They have the same arrest powers and many other responsibilities common with other police officers. Customs and Border Patrol can find themselves in violent confrontations just like municipal police officers, which is why cops carry guns and train with them. Now, if you want to discuss WHY DHS has 70,000 licensed officers, that's a useful discussion for another column.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Great idea for a discussion.
The weapons instruction for Park Rangers must be a point of assessment, also.
This training does not include encounters with the local wildlife; Only hostile park visitor encounters.

And when any U.S. agent does shoot a human with a hollow point, that's a war crime prosecutable in The Hague.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
No, its not. The Hague Conventions only apply to the military. DHS is not military.

I am amazed that people keep referencing the hague without any clue as to what it means.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Shhh, Harald.
We can spread disinformation as easily as they can.

The amount of ammo compared to ammo used in Iraq by the troops, would sustain a 20+ year war. And with all the "sequestration" being enforced, why is DHS allowed to stockpile ammo and equipment at this rate?
AND; DHS buys AR15's with full auto capability for "PERSONAL DEFENSE" weapons; Not "assault weapons".
See:
http://www.lookintoit.org/DHS-Preparing-For-7-Year-War-Against-American-People.html
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
I worked four years as a security officer contracted to the Federal Protective Service. We always used the same hollow point ammunition for firearms qualification, as the duty ammo we carried. Having close contacts with federal agents, while working that job, I can say that it was their policy also. That said, it would certainly save a lot of money if they used cheaper ball ammo, for training. I haven't noticed any point of impact change between ball and hollow point ammo, at normal handgun ranges out to 25 yards, using fixed iron sights. That would include using the different bullet weights in each caliber, so using ball shouldn't have an adverse effect on training.

1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Generally, its not about the ballistics. Its about maintaining two kinds of ammo in the supply system. Its just easier to maintain and distribute one kind. As for cost, at the quantities involved, the difference between ball and hp is only a couple of cents.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Well, 'it is fun' to go to the range and shoot a lot. It could also be work, but when the federal government is trillions of dollars short each year, it's time to cut back on the 'fun' just a wee bit.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Okay, even if I buy the argument that that amount per "officer" is justified, answer me this - why hollow-point?

1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Less chance of a shoot-through, since they flatten and bleed off more energy.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Well sure, that a given, but for target practice? What necessitates the use of hollow-point?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
You want to make sure that what you shoot when it matters to feed, eject, and shoot to the same point of aim as what you use in practice. FMJs are a lot cheaper, but they feed more reliably, and depending on bullet weight, may not hit the same point 25 yards away.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
1. THESE hollow points are NOT for long range.
2. Hollow points may not be used for any government entity against humans.
3. This ammo could be used in urban combat; But, what is DHS anticipating?
4. At time of contract, this ammo MAY have been cheaper. BUT, when this ammo gets dispersed, what's to keep it from mistakenly commingling with the main stream ammo?

5. ANOTHER OBAMA ADMINISTRATION PROGRAM DESTINED FOR FAILURE. (And M U R D E R).

6. Can We impeach yet?
TREASON is an impeachable offense, unless Congress has passed new legislation that hasn't been made public.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
#2 is absolutely wrong. Where do you get that crap?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Tried to buy .44 specials this past weekend for my new Henry. The Gun Shop shelves, which usually are overflowing with ammo, were all but empty. I managed to get one box of Winchester silver tips. But that was all they had.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Couldn't even find 30-30 for my kid's lever Winchester today.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Maybe we all need to hone our reloading skills.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Wouldn't help. You can't get powder or primers, either.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
Tried to buy any brass lately?
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
I've tons of brass, and nothing to put in it.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
I went to a local informal shooting range that used to be littered (in the worst sense of the word) with brass. There's almost nothing there now. The combination of a very bad economy and absurd prices for brass means it has already been mined.
1 year ago
1 year ago Link To Comment
1 2 Next View All