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	<title>Comments on: The Cars that Leftists Drive</title>
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	<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
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		<title>By: Alex Bensky</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-829</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Bensky</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Dec 2008 17:21:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-829</guid>
		<description>I drive an &#039;02 Chevy Prizm, basically a Corolla but made by union labor in California. I love it. Since 1987 I&#039;ve had the same car under three different names and they were running fine after over 100,000 miles until I gave one to my nephew and the second was totalled.

But yes, this is hardly the sole area where the left bruits its support for the working people without actually supporting them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I drive an &#8217;02 Chevy Prizm, basically a Corolla but made by union labor in California. I love it. Since 1987 I&#8217;ve had the same car under three different names and they were running fine after over 100,000 miles until I gave one to my nephew and the second was totalled.</p>
<p>But yes, this is hardly the sole area where the left bruits its support for the working people without actually supporting them.</p>
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		<title>By: heather</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-818</link>
		<dc:creator>heather</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 18:32:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-818</guid>
		<description>My (admittedly personal) experience is that Lefties don&#039;t know anything about vehicles (they ain&#039;t Joe the Plumber for sure.)  But they know what is stylish, and American brand cars are so... you know... dull, boring.... so American, so ticky tacky.  

Better to buy a sophisticated Euro car, so much more cosmopolitan, my dears.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My (admittedly personal) experience is that Lefties don&#8217;t know anything about vehicles (they ain&#8217;t Joe the Plumber for sure.)  But they know what is stylish, and American brand cars are so&#8230; you know&#8230; dull, boring&#8230;. so American, so ticky tacky.  </p>
<p>Better to buy a sophisticated Euro car, so much more cosmopolitan, my dears.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan D</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-815</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 15:27:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-815</guid>
		<description>The Detroit Three do not pay the wages and benefits of the current UAW workforce, and the benefits of the much larger pool of retirees.  The customers do, the corporations and their managements are just the middlemen.

The benefit structure was developed in a different world, when lots of car buyers and fewer, weaker competitors made it appear to be a reasonable option to improve the workers&#039; economic situation to that extent.

No more, the customers have too many strong options, and they do not want to pay the cost of those very generous benefits any longer.

No point in blaming union or management, each made deals they can&#039;t sustain.  If they can adapt quickly enough, they can survive.  But nobody wants the party to end until absolutely necessary, so they put off adapting until it may be too late.

Just to be clear, the $73/hour is what it costs the automakers per hour of labor, that is fully loaded cost, the current worker&#039;s share of that is significantly less, the retirees and health plans get the remainder.

And even the green, sophisticated, liberal folks are not willing to pay the bill any longer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Detroit Three do not pay the wages and benefits of the current UAW workforce, and the benefits of the much larger pool of retirees.  The customers do, the corporations and their managements are just the middlemen.</p>
<p>The benefit structure was developed in a different world, when lots of car buyers and fewer, weaker competitors made it appear to be a reasonable option to improve the workers&#8217; economic situation to that extent.</p>
<p>No more, the customers have too many strong options, and they do not want to pay the cost of those very generous benefits any longer.</p>
<p>No point in blaming union or management, each made deals they can&#8217;t sustain.  If they can adapt quickly enough, they can survive.  But nobody wants the party to end until absolutely necessary, so they put off adapting until it may be too late.</p>
<p>Just to be clear, the $73/hour is what it costs the automakers per hour of labor, that is fully loaded cost, the current worker&#8217;s share of that is significantly less, the retirees and health plans get the remainder.</p>
<p>And even the green, sophisticated, liberal folks are not willing to pay the bill any longer.</p>
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		<title>By: David Thomson</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-805</link>
		<dc:creator>David Thomson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 06:50:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-805</guid>
		<description>&quot;It has nothing to do with unions. It has everything to do with quality.&quot;

The UAW benefits have been so costly to American manufacturers that they must focus almost exclusively on how to keep these cost under some sort of control---before they can even spend a few minutes on trying to improve their vehicles.  An auto expert remarked a few years ago that GM needed a CEO who was primarily an expert in benefits management.  The individual&#039;s ability to manage the other aspects of the business was deemed of secondary importance! 

Ron Radosh is not sufficiently cynical concerning America&#039;s left-wing community.   There is one central reason why they reject libertarian economics: a hands off approach to economic activity does little to provide them with power and financially rewarding careers.   Roosevelt&#039;s New Deal was a godsend to the &quot;elites.&quot;  It allowed these arrogant fools to ruthlessly exercise power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It has nothing to do with unions. It has everything to do with quality.&#8221;</p>
<p>The UAW benefits have been so costly to American manufacturers that they must focus almost exclusively on how to keep these cost under some sort of control&#8212;before they can even spend a few minutes on trying to improve their vehicles.  An auto expert remarked a few years ago that GM needed a CEO who was primarily an expert in benefits management.  The individual&#8217;s ability to manage the other aspects of the business was deemed of secondary importance! </p>
<p>Ron Radosh is not sufficiently cynical concerning America&#8217;s left-wing community.   There is one central reason why they reject libertarian economics: a hands off approach to economic activity does little to provide them with power and financially rewarding careers.   Roosevelt&#8217;s New Deal was a godsend to the &#8220;elites.&#8221;  It allowed these arrogant fools to ruthlessly exercise power.</p>
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		<title>By: Sir Lymond of Crawford</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-804</link>
		<dc:creator>Sir Lymond of Crawford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 05:15:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-804</guid>
		<description>Amen Pat J. Also M. Radosh ignores the fact that workers in Europe and Japan have healthcare, subsidized education, and state benefits that US auto workers only get if they are in UAW. So the comparison of wages is fallacious. Radosh and his ilk who think environmental conservation is a dubious personal virtue at best are part of what has contributed to a behind the times US auto industry. Chevy Volt? Little late folks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amen Pat J. Also M. Radosh ignores the fact that workers in Europe and Japan have healthcare, subsidized education, and state benefits that US auto workers only get if they are in UAW. So the comparison of wages is fallacious. Radosh and his ilk who think environmental conservation is a dubious personal virtue at best are part of what has contributed to a behind the times US auto industry. Chevy Volt? Little late folks.</p>
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		<title>By: Pat J</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-801</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat J</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 02:52:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-801</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m now totally convinced Ron Radosh is full of crap.  Typical conservative assclown railing on &quot;liberals&quot; as elitists, then putting down unions like a good little RW foot soldier.  Cry me a river!

Even sensible conservatives realize foreign-made cars are infinitely better than American cars.  I&#039;ve had my Tacoma since 2000.  It gets reasonable gas mileage for a medium size truck, it&#039;s a very good drive and I have maybe spent less than $2000 in repairs since I bought it.  Used!  Can&#039;t say the same for the American cars I&#039;ve bought. 

I avoid Starbucks like the plague.  I will continue to buy Toyota vehicles.  My next truck will probably be a Tundra. It&#039;s one big ballsy truck!  Other then that, I buy American every chance I get.  If I had a bike, it would be a Harley.  I try to avoid cheap crap from China as much as I can.  

The Big 3 got themselves into this mess by not building cars the average American wants to hang on to.  It has nothing to do with unions.  It has everything to do with quality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m now totally convinced Ron Radosh is full of crap.  Typical conservative assclown railing on &#8220;liberals&#8221; as elitists, then putting down unions like a good little RW foot soldier.  Cry me a river!</p>
<p>Even sensible conservatives realize foreign-made cars are infinitely better than American cars.  I&#8217;ve had my Tacoma since 2000.  It gets reasonable gas mileage for a medium size truck, it&#8217;s a very good drive and I have maybe spent less than $2000 in repairs since I bought it.  Used!  Can&#8217;t say the same for the American cars I&#8217;ve bought. </p>
<p>I avoid Starbucks like the plague.  I will continue to buy Toyota vehicles.  My next truck will probably be a Tundra. It&#8217;s one big ballsy truck!  Other then that, I buy American every chance I get.  If I had a bike, it would be a Harley.  I try to avoid cheap crap from China as much as I can.  </p>
<p>The Big 3 got themselves into this mess by not building cars the average American wants to hang on to.  It has nothing to do with unions.  It has everything to do with quality.</p>
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		<title>By: Tired Old Cliche</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-800</link>
		<dc:creator>Tired Old Cliche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 02:29:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-800</guid>
		<description>Ah, yet another &quot;I saw someone do something once, so I am now qualified to make sweeping generalizations !&quot; post.
Ho-hum ... 
The fact is, the German and Japanese car companies aren&#039;t doing all that well these days either, in America or world-wide.

The reason we have Japanese and Germans building cars in the USA at all is because their native workers in their home country plants are also unionized and payed a much higher wage than our UAW workers.  Unfortunately, American manufacturers cannot build non-union plants in Japan or Europe.

Regardless, the major cost of an automobile is the components (many made in Mexico, China, and other foreign places now), and not the final assembly wage ... so the wage disparity (labor unions) IS NOT the base cause of American car company woes.

Now, all that being said ... I do agree with the author about &quot;hypocricy&quot; in not buying American ... but this hypocrisy applies to the left and right both.  Most everything the most workers in America enjoy today (the 40 hour work week, group health coverage, paid holidays and vacations) were hard fought accomplishments by organized labor.

For the record, I still have my 13yo Oldsmobile Cutlass (great car- almost problem free, and driver&#039;s seat comfortably worn into a perfect fit by now).
I also enjoy a good Starbuck&#039;s coffee every morning, but I have a good strong liberal manly Mondo (coffee with two added espresso shots), not a foo-foo sissy conservative style lattee, cappucino, or mocha.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, yet another &#8220;I saw someone do something once, so I am now qualified to make sweeping generalizations !&#8221; post.<br />
Ho-hum &#8230;<br />
The fact is, the German and Japanese car companies aren&#8217;t doing all that well these days either, in America or world-wide.</p>
<p>The reason we have Japanese and Germans building cars in the USA at all is because their native workers in their home country plants are also unionized and payed a much higher wage than our UAW workers.  Unfortunately, American manufacturers cannot build non-union plants in Japan or Europe.</p>
<p>Regardless, the major cost of an automobile is the components (many made in Mexico, China, and other foreign places now), and not the final assembly wage &#8230; so the wage disparity (labor unions) IS NOT the base cause of American car company woes.</p>
<p>Now, all that being said &#8230; I do agree with the author about &#8220;hypocricy&#8221; in not buying American &#8230; but this hypocrisy applies to the left and right both.  Most everything the most workers in America enjoy today (the 40 hour work week, group health coverage, paid holidays and vacations) were hard fought accomplishments by organized labor.</p>
<p>For the record, I still have my 13yo Oldsmobile Cutlass (great car- almost problem free, and driver&#8217;s seat comfortably worn into a perfect fit by now).<br />
I also enjoy a good Starbuck&#8217;s coffee every morning, but I have a good strong liberal manly Mondo (coffee with two added espresso shots), not a foo-foo sissy conservative style lattee, cappucino, or mocha.</p>
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		<title>By: chuck</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-799</link>
		<dc:creator>chuck</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:54:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-799</guid>
		<description>In the late &#039;80s and early &#039;90s Ford, Chevy and chrysler all had full size v-6s that got 31 mpg on the hwy. The news media nitwits never ever acknowledge this. They are all b-ll shi--ers of the first order.I presently drive a 1994 Ford T-Bird.I have been driving for 63 yrs. and it is by far the best car that I&#039;ve ever owned, in all respects.BTW I do not support the bail out.Better a bankruptcy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the late &#8217;80s and early &#8217;90s Ford, Chevy and chrysler all had full size v-6s that got 31 mpg on the hwy. The news media nitwits never ever acknowledge this. They are all b-ll shi&#8211;ers of the first order.I presently drive a 1994 Ford T-Bird.I have been driving for 63 yrs. and it is by far the best car that I&#8217;ve ever owned, in all respects.BTW I do not support the bail out.Better a bankruptcy.</p>
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		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-798</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:41:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-798</guid>
		<description>The premise of this article is bunk.  Japanese (and also Korean) automakers DO have to deal with unions.  They have to deal with Japanese (and Korean) unions.  The only difference is that the Asian automakers don&#039;t have to deal with *OUR* unions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The premise of this article is bunk.  Japanese (and also Korean) automakers DO have to deal with unions.  They have to deal with Japanese (and Korean) unions.  The only difference is that the Asian automakers don&#8217;t have to deal with *OUR* unions.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan Troxel</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/ronradosh/2008/12/04/the-cars-that-leftists-drive/#comment-797</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Troxel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Dec 2008 01:38:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/?p=299#comment-797</guid>
		<description>I purchased a Honda and then another Honda because I didn&#039;t want to directly contribute $2,000 to $6,000 to democrat politicians.  No American cars for me until this symbiotic relationship dies.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I purchased a Honda and then another Honda because I didn&#8217;t want to directly contribute $2,000 to $6,000 to democrat politicians.  No American cars for me until this symbiotic relationship dies.</p>
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