Only if you define your world as the absurd little echo chamber of the American know-nothing, Islam-obsessed blogosphere. Appreciate the gesture, doug, but it’s frankly a waste of time to point out to the ignorant here that

– France is far more repressive than we are toward its muslims,

– French judges have vastly more power than ours and use it severely,

– French racial discrimination is not only widespread, it’s standard behavior that goes unpunished

– the rioters are primarily black sub-saharan third-generation africans, not recent jihadist-inclined arrivals from the arab world…

… and on we go. Arguing these points here is like trying to discuss economics with the Kos Kidz.

I am placed in the uncomfortable position of feeling like Rodney — Can’t we all get just get along .

I don’t see Thibaud as ‘defending’ Islamists, just saying that this particular situation is not really all about them. However frankly I am tired of ‘Muslim’ problems. We all have our ‘crosses’ or in their case ‘crescents’ to bear, and I can’t help but feel that there is a component of Islamic nutbarism involved in ANY violence perpetrated by a large group of Muslims.

Granted the French may not care overly for these ‘noirs’, indirectly imported from North Africa, but the very real self-exclusionary tendencies of Islamic behaviour can not be ignored. It takes two to tango and apparently some Muslims don’t tend to lead very well.

Many forms of Islam appear to me to be a problem. They may not be THE main problem in the current French ‘disorder’, but you can hardly blame many for jumping to what is at the least a relatively ‘logical’ conclusion,based upon empirical evidence from other world areas.

But can’t we try to remember who the enemies really are,and save the ‘insults’ for those who really deserve them? I really don’t think that they tend to post here. But I could be wrong.

Again.

Just imagine if it were Le Pen’s shocktroops torching France & running amok! Would Thi-B be slamming Sarkozy for hurting their feelings? No, because sentimental libs have one standard for white rioters, & another for brown rioters. Because really, the brown ones can’t help themselves.

Thibaud: You keep coming back to this Jew thing. This may come as surprise to you but North Africans really don’t give a damn about Palestinians or their cause. I don’t really think they carry any special hatred of Jews beyond their general hatred of the European other. So your statements to the effect it can’t be about Islam because they aren’t torching Synagogues are nonsensical. If Muslim conflicts are with the west are all about the Jews then explain these events over the past few week or so…

- Christian school girls are beheaded by Muslims in Indonesia…No Jews there.

- Muslim terrorists bomb and kill in Thailand…No Jews there.

- Muslims attack open air markets in India…No Jews there.

Islam is at war with all cultures not just the Jews and they really don

However, given the rioters’ single-minded focus on torching their neighbors’ cars (also a few shops and schools, plus one synagogue)– many hundreds of cars torched every day– it seems obvious that this is far closer to joy riding than to any kind of political “uprising.”

France has seen sporadic orgies of this kind of urban violence from the projects for over two decades now. There have also been waves of attacks on French jews. These riots clearly are another example of the former. Though this time around, and at this stage, the kids seem to be having a lot of fun. Sort of like midnight basketball, only with gasoline.

As you’re probably aware, France is heavily centralized and does not have a federal structure like ours, which means that primary responsibility for restoring order rests with the Interior Minister: Sarkozy. As I’ve said, Sarkozy’s tough talk + weak stick shtick has contributed to the perpetuation of a crisis that others started. That’s a worse combination than a weak stick without crude tough talk, or a big stick with crude tough talk.

In what way does that harm the idea of it being political motivated and coordinated? Your claim here — as it’s expressed — is that if anyone expresses any enjoyment in their violence, then there’s no one else behind it. I think that’s wrong; you can’t proclaim a connection between the two, or even claim the existence of one rules out the other.

You complain that everyone is holding a myopic view of the riots in France and Islamism but you always manage to blame Republicans for everything.

Further, simply because you present your side of the debate does not require anyone to accept your premises based on the idea that you feel entitled.

You are starting to sound a tad ridiculous.

Now you are blaming Sarkozy? Is he telling these poor unfortunate misunderstood youths to go out and burn down Paris???

What is next? Are you going to say the Devil made them do it?

I have to say I am disappointed in you.

Atrocities seems to think this is some kind of a game in which we root for our favorite team to ride high in oipinion polls, when in fact my point re Sarkozy, repeated several times now, is that he was foolish to call the kids “thugs” because of the effect of such language– if not backed up by competent and overwhleming force– on the african community and in perpetuating this crisis.

Sarko may well have received an increase from racist elements on the left, the stalinists and trotskyites who voted for Le Pen but would never support an RPR politician. Perhaps popularity will rise as the crisis gets worse. Worked for Nixon. A real shame for France, though.