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	<title>Comments on: The Eye of the Needle</title>
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	<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
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		<title>By: Eggplant</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56408</link>
		<dc:creator>Eggplant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 23:45:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56408</guid>
		<description>Buddy,

Thanks for the link to the Brian Schul story.  It&#039;s clear that Schul loved his SR.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Buddy,</p>
<p>Thanks for the link to the Brian Schul story.  It&#8217;s clear that Schul loved his SR.</p>
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		<title>By: Marcus Aurelius</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56397</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcus Aurelius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 22:22:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56397</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Whether derived from the pitot tubes, the onboard radar or downlinks, an airplane flies on information as much as lift.&lt;/i&gt; Information -- the driving force behind so much we do, flying or otherwise. No matter how far we&#039;ve come in terms of being able to get and process information it always seems we are far away from being where we want to be in terms of information.  That sucker hole in the clouds could be a literal or it could be a supposedly solid stock with a low price.

Re helicopters, I taught with a guy who attended an avionics/aviation engineering school. On a trip we took together he noted the same about helicopters it&#039;s a miracle they fly.

As far as finding the blackbox, I am quite certain it will be found  this is good practice for the Navy in locating vital things on the ocean floor. A book by the name of Blind Man&#039;s Bluff is a fascinating read on the underwater skirmishes we fought with the Soviet Union -- in the areas of subs penetrating Soviet waters, locating critical items (such as lost submarines both US &amp; Soviet), and espionage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Whether derived from the pitot tubes, the onboard radar or downlinks, an airplane flies on information as much as lift.</i> Information &#8212; the driving force behind so much we do, flying or otherwise. No matter how far we&#8217;ve come in terms of being able to get and process information it always seems we are far away from being where we want to be in terms of information.  That sucker hole in the clouds could be a literal or it could be a supposedly solid stock with a low price.</p>
<p>Re helicopters, I taught with a guy who attended an avionics/aviation engineering school. On a trip we took together he noted the same about helicopters it&#8217;s a miracle they fly.</p>
<p>As far as finding the blackbox, I am quite certain it will be found  this is good practice for the Navy in locating vital things on the ocean floor. A book by the name of Blind Man&#8217;s Bluff is a fascinating read on the underwater skirmishes we fought with the Soviet Union &#8212; in the areas of subs penetrating Soviet waters, locating critical items (such as lost submarines both US &amp; Soviet), and espionage.</p>
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		<title>By: buddy larsen</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56353</link>
		<dc:creator>buddy larsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 16:36:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56353</guid>
		<description>Not seeing that apparition, that&#039;s a helluva thing to not see, and a helluva non story to not tell!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not seeing that apparition, that&#8217;s a helluva thing to not see, and a helluva non story to not tell!</p>
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		<title>By: buddy larsen</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56343</link>
		<dc:creator>buddy larsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 15:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56343</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ll look for it, Dave. That dancehall, that&#039;s where the Aggie walked in carrying a fresh hot steaming cow pattie dripping through his fingers, and announced &quot;Hey, y&#039;all, look whut I almost stepped in!&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ll look for it, Dave. That dancehall, that&#8217;s where the Aggie walked in carrying a fresh hot steaming cow pattie dripping through his fingers, and announced &#8220;Hey, y&#8217;all, look whut I almost stepped in!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: wretchard</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56311</link>
		<dc:creator>wretchard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 13:11:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56311</guid>
		<description>John K,

Thanks.

W.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John K,</p>
<p>Thanks.</p>
<p>W.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56292</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 10:10:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56292</guid>
		<description>Quick follow-up:  Bell Aircraft was told not to let any of those Muroc (now Edwards) trainees see them fly that jet.  Good trick in virtually unlimited visibility.  

Bell&#039;s Chief Test Pilot Jack Woolums had a brainstorm.  Whenever he saw a training flight, he would slip on the top half of a gorilla suit, put a derby on his head, pull up alongside them and make like Groucho Marx with a cigar.

Now if YOU are a 19 year old aviation cadet in 1942 are YOU going to report;&quot; There I was at 18000 feet when suddenly alongside me was an airplane without a propeller being flown by a gorilla wearing a derby and waving a cigar.&quot;?????????????

And if any spies are in the vicinity are they going to believe that tale??????????

And I just happen to know one of the guys who 
obligingly failed to see that apparition. 
He was busy strafing a Japanese Cruiser in the Mojave Desert at the time.  

Buddy, if you can find a picture of the &quot;Muroc Maru&quot;,  I&#039;ll call off Beevo and
restore your Teasip standing.  

Seriously though, reopening the old Silver Spur Dancehall to go with the current Silver Spur Dude Ranch is a bit newsworthy, I would say.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Quick follow-up:  Bell Aircraft was told not to let any of those Muroc (now Edwards) trainees see them fly that jet.  Good trick in virtually unlimited visibility.  </p>
<p>Bell&#8217;s Chief Test Pilot Jack Woolums had a brainstorm.  Whenever he saw a training flight, he would slip on the top half of a gorilla suit, put a derby on his head, pull up alongside them and make like Groucho Marx with a cigar.</p>
<p>Now if YOU are a 19 year old aviation cadet in 1942 are YOU going to report;&#8221; There I was at 18000 feet when suddenly alongside me was an airplane without a propeller being flown by a gorilla wearing a derby and waving a cigar.&#8221;?????????????</p>
<p>And if any spies are in the vicinity are they going to believe that tale??????????</p>
<p>And I just happen to know one of the guys who<br />
obligingly failed to see that apparition.<br />
He was busy strafing a Japanese Cruiser in the Mojave Desert at the time.  </p>
<p>Buddy, if you can find a picture of the &#8220;Muroc Maru&#8221;,  I&#8217;ll call off Beevo and<br />
restore your Teasip standing.  </p>
<p>Seriously though, reopening the old Silver Spur Dancehall to go with the current Silver Spur Dude Ranch is a bit newsworthy, I would say.</p>
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		<title>By: buddy larsen</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56253</link>
		<dc:creator>buddy larsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 03:22:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56253</guid>
		<description>Great SR-71 stories, y&#039;all. For those who missed it, here&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://blogs.jobdig.com/wwds/2007/11/19/sr-71-now-that-was-some-airplane/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the famous Brian Schul &quot;Libya&quot; story&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great SR-71 stories, y&#8217;all. For those who missed it, here&#8217;s <a href="http://blogs.jobdig.com/wwds/2007/11/19/sr-71-now-that-was-some-airplane/" rel="nofollow">the famous Brian Schul &#8220;Libya&#8221; story</a>.</p>
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		<title>By: John K</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56246</link>
		<dc:creator>John K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 01:51:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56246</guid>
		<description>Correction:  Vmo (velocity or speed maximum operating) should be MMo (maximum mach operating)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction:  Vmo (velocity or speed maximum operating) should be MMo (maximum mach operating)</p>
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		<title>By: John K</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56245</link>
		<dc:creator>John K</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 01:36:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56245</guid>
		<description>Richard, that business of coffin corner being only 28kt wide in an airliner is seriously exaggerated.  I&#039;m type rated on the RJs, which have similar performance numbers to a heavy, and am looking at the AFM operating speeds chart right now for the CRJ700, and it gives a maximum Mach # (Vmo) of .85 above 32000 ft.   The A-330 is similar (the very fastest airliners are up around .88, but .83 to .86 is typical).  The A-330 has a max cruise of 41000 ft, but normal cruise will be in the 30s.  Even if they were at 41000 ft the indicated airspeed at Mach .85 is 250 kt in standard conditions.   I don&#039;t have the Airbus stall numbers handy, but the flaps up stall on a heavy is going to be somewhere in the region of 130kt, maybe 150 kt tops (being indicated airspeed, the value is constant).

So the margin above stall at max Mach# and max cruise alt is more like 100kt indicated. Plus there will be an ample safety margin between Vmo and the critical Mach # (the speed at which airflow first becomes supersonic), maybe 20 to 30 kt, before mach buffet would start.  In practice the cruise is probably more like .8 for fuel economy reasons, which is a slower indicated airspeed but that means the margin below Mach crit is more, so the coffin size doesn&#039;t change.

So &quot;coffin corner&quot; in an airliner is actually well over 100kt wide, not 28 kt.  The 28 kt applies to airplanes like the U2 which cruise at 70000 and have a low Mach Crit.


What IS a problem at that altitude is that the low indicated airspeed (cruising at 230-250) is close to a point called &quot;back side of the power curve&quot; where decreases in speed require increases in power to maintain the level.  If speed starts to decay, and you&#039;re maxed out on thrust, you have no choice but to go down and convert altitude to speed.  If the airplane is on autopilot and pitching up to hold altitude in this condition, and the crew is not paying attention to the decaying speed, the autopilot will take the aircraft right up to the stall warning threshold on its own.   A Pinnacle airlines crash of a CRJ200 was due to just that.

Cheers

John</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard, that business of coffin corner being only 28kt wide in an airliner is seriously exaggerated.  I&#8217;m type rated on the RJs, which have similar performance numbers to a heavy, and am looking at the AFM operating speeds chart right now for the CRJ700, and it gives a maximum Mach # (Vmo) of .85 above 32000 ft.   The A-330 is similar (the very fastest airliners are up around .88, but .83 to .86 is typical).  The A-330 has a max cruise of 41000 ft, but normal cruise will be in the 30s.  Even if they were at 41000 ft the indicated airspeed at Mach .85 is 250 kt in standard conditions.   I don&#8217;t have the Airbus stall numbers handy, but the flaps up stall on a heavy is going to be somewhere in the region of 130kt, maybe 150 kt tops (being indicated airspeed, the value is constant).</p>
<p>So the margin above stall at max Mach# and max cruise alt is more like 100kt indicated. Plus there will be an ample safety margin between Vmo and the critical Mach # (the speed at which airflow first becomes supersonic), maybe 20 to 30 kt, before mach buffet would start.  In practice the cruise is probably more like .8 for fuel economy reasons, which is a slower indicated airspeed but that means the margin below Mach crit is more, so the coffin size doesn&#8217;t change.</p>
<p>So &#8220;coffin corner&#8221; in an airliner is actually well over 100kt wide, not 28 kt.  The 28 kt applies to airplanes like the U2 which cruise at 70000 and have a low Mach Crit.</p>
<p>What IS a problem at that altitude is that the low indicated airspeed (cruising at 230-250) is close to a point called &#8220;back side of the power curve&#8221; where decreases in speed require increases in power to maintain the level.  If speed starts to decay, and you&#8217;re maxed out on thrust, you have no choice but to go down and convert altitude to speed.  If the airplane is on autopilot and pitching up to hold altitude in this condition, and the crew is not paying attention to the decaying speed, the autopilot will take the aircraft right up to the stall warning threshold on its own.   A Pinnacle airlines crash of a CRJ200 was due to just that.</p>
<p>Cheers</p>
<p>John</p>
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		<title>By: buddy larsen</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/06/08/eyeoftheneedle/#comment-56240</link>
		<dc:creator>buddy larsen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Jun 2009 00:24:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=4370#comment-56240</guid>
		<description>okay, Dave, that aggie bit stung, so i went to work and found a beautiful film of America&#039;s very first jet flight.

The Bell XP59A --Autumn of 1942. 

The craft flew so smooth the instruments kept sticking --so one of the field mechanics had the bright idea to install a two dollar doorbell ringer in the dash panel --which provided enough vibration to unstick the needles. If the test pilot needed to know something, i guess he had to ring the doorbell &amp; hope a gremlin didn&#039;t answer.

Whenever they had to move the secret prototype along the roads they made it wear a big old wooden propeller. It already looked like an Airacobra so i&#039;m sure that ruse worked just fine. 

Here it is (Go Longhorns!):

http://www.videosift.com/video/Americas-First-Jet-Flight-October-1942</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>okay, Dave, that aggie bit stung, so i went to work and found a beautiful film of America&#8217;s very first jet flight.</p>
<p>The Bell XP59A &#8211;Autumn of 1942. </p>
<p>The craft flew so smooth the instruments kept sticking &#8211;so one of the field mechanics had the bright idea to install a two dollar doorbell ringer in the dash panel &#8211;which provided enough vibration to unstick the needles. If the test pilot needed to know something, i guess he had to ring the doorbell &amp; hope a gremlin didn&#8217;t answer.</p>
<p>Whenever they had to move the secret prototype along the roads they made it wear a big old wooden propeller. It already looked like an Airacobra so i&#8217;m sure that ruse worked just fine. </p>
<p>Here it is (Go Longhorns!):</p>
<p><a href="http://www.videosift.com/video/Americas-First-Jet-Flight-October-1942" rel="nofollow">http://www.videosift.com/video/Americas-First-Jet-Flight-October-1942</a></p>
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