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	<title>Comments on: Let me tell your fortune</title>
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		<title>By: CornFuzed</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28798</link>
		<dc:creator>CornFuzed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 13:01:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28798</guid>
		<description>Its clear why your handle is &#039;Staring In Disbelief&#039;,   Seems as if you are mesmerized by the facts staring back at you and have little or no understanding of them .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Its clear why your handle is &#8216;Staring In Disbelief&#8217;,   Seems as if you are mesmerized by the facts staring back at you and have little or no understanding of them .</p>
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		<title>By: Lowell</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28767</link>
		<dc:creator>Lowell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 06:43:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28767</guid>
		<description>It seems that there are two popular explanations for what happened.  One side says &quot;Too much regulation--the markets should rule!&quot;, and the other side says &quot;Too little regulation--capitalists are all corrupt!&quot;

I say it was a combination.  There was too much regulation in some areas--where it was not necessary (see the Community Reinvestment Act, CAFE fuel economy standards, and dozens of other areas).

Meanwhile, there was too little regulation in other areas--where it was made necessary by the government taking on risk.  Bank regulations are necessary as the mechanism by which the government keeps watch over its risk.  If the government is going to guarantee bank deposits, then the government needs to do the due diligence that we would expect from a free market player making a large investment in a bank.  The same thing is the true for Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae (the GSEs).  So long as those institutions appeared to be solvent, Democrats swore that there was no government guarantee--therefore no need to regulate them.  Of course, once the they became insolvent, then everyone stepped up and said they were too big to fail.  So, we got the worst of both worlds.  We had the government &quot;investing&quot; in the GSEs without doing its due diligence while &quot;capitalists&quot; took advantage of the fact that the risks were covered.

So we have &quot;too much&quot; regulations that don&#039;t have to do with covering government risk and we have &quot;too little&quot; regulations that do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems that there are two popular explanations for what happened.  One side says &#8220;Too much regulation&#8211;the markets should rule!&#8221;, and the other side says &#8220;Too little regulation&#8211;capitalists are all corrupt!&#8221;</p>
<p>I say it was a combination.  There was too much regulation in some areas&#8211;where it was not necessary (see the Community Reinvestment Act, CAFE fuel economy standards, and dozens of other areas).</p>
<p>Meanwhile, there was too little regulation in other areas&#8211;where it was made necessary by the government taking on risk.  Bank regulations are necessary as the mechanism by which the government keeps watch over its risk.  If the government is going to guarantee bank deposits, then the government needs to do the due diligence that we would expect from a free market player making a large investment in a bank.  The same thing is the true for Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae (the GSEs).  So long as those institutions appeared to be solvent, Democrats swore that there was no government guarantee&#8211;therefore no need to regulate them.  Of course, once the they became insolvent, then everyone stepped up and said they were too big to fail.  So, we got the worst of both worlds.  We had the government &#8220;investing&#8221; in the GSEs without doing its due diligence while &#8220;capitalists&#8221; took advantage of the fact that the risks were covered.</p>
<p>So we have &#8220;too much&#8221; regulations that don&#8217;t have to do with covering government risk and we have &#8220;too little&#8221; regulations that do.</p>
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		<title>By: Niko</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28717</link>
		<dc:creator>Niko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 00:26:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28717</guid>
		<description>What happens when the Fed can no longer roll over treasury bonds and the tax base is too small to fund spending? What happens to the military?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What happens when the Fed can no longer roll over treasury bonds and the tax base is too small to fund spending? What happens to the military?</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Hardin</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28705</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Hardin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 22:37:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28705</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;If the Chinese government decides to spend [our] IOU’s and take a loss now rather than later given the inflation we will not be able to sell those bonds unless the interest rate shoots up.&lt;/i&gt;

I don&#039;t understand foreign exchange (currencies ought to change value in response to transportation costs involved in buying from the cheapest source, in my opinion, and they seem not to), or why the Chinese like to hold surplus dollars rather then spend them; but if the Chinese want to sell the IOUs, what do they get for them?  Dollars.

The only thing on God&#039;s green earth that you can do with dollars is invest them in the US economy, or buy something from the US economy.  Both of which solve our problem.

IOUs sold to Americans, at any interest rate, are not a national burden.  The debt is to ourselves, and cancelled exactly by assets, namely the IOUs themselves.

The hazards are populist campaign issues they might threaten; and actual misallocation of resources by government spending in the first place.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>If the Chinese government decides to spend [our] IOU’s and take a loss now rather than later given the inflation we will not be able to sell those bonds unless the interest rate shoots up.</i></p>
<p>I don&#8217;t understand foreign exchange (currencies ought to change value in response to transportation costs involved in buying from the cheapest source, in my opinion, and they seem not to), or why the Chinese like to hold surplus dollars rather then spend them; but if the Chinese want to sell the IOUs, what do they get for them?  Dollars.</p>
<p>The only thing on God&#8217;s green earth that you can do with dollars is invest them in the US economy, or buy something from the US economy.  Both of which solve our problem.</p>
<p>IOUs sold to Americans, at any interest rate, are not a national burden.  The debt is to ourselves, and cancelled exactly by assets, namely the IOUs themselves.</p>
<p>The hazards are populist campaign issues they might threaten; and actual misallocation of resources by government spending in the first place.</p>
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		<title>By: Unsk</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28692</link>
		<dc:creator>Unsk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 21:22:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28692</guid>
		<description>There is a good post from Francis Cainfrocca, &quot; Revisiting the Supply Side Thesis&quot; on 1-06-09 at Redstate that explains why the Obama stimulus package won&#039;t work.

His main points are:

•   We have entered a period of extreme risk aversion, due to the Fannie/Freddie Collapse, particularly in the financial sector,  and similar to that experienced in the Great Depression.

•   The Obama stimulus package and his likely policies do little to make  the market less  risk averse and in the case of many his policies  like his proposed higher payroll tax, make it much worse. 

•   The stimulus package may improve GDP numbers, but it won&#039;t affect unemployment, because in effect the economy through the stimulus package may be buying less goods for more money.


The hallmark of a socialist bureaucracy is to increase the risk for investment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is a good post from Francis Cainfrocca, &#8221; Revisiting the Supply Side Thesis&#8221; on 1-06-09 at Redstate that explains why the Obama stimulus package won&#8217;t work.</p>
<p>His main points are:</p>
<p>•   We have entered a period of extreme risk aversion, due to the Fannie/Freddie Collapse, particularly in the financial sector,  and similar to that experienced in the Great Depression.</p>
<p>•   The Obama stimulus package and his likely policies do little to make  the market less  risk averse and in the case of many his policies  like his proposed higher payroll tax, make it much worse. </p>
<p>•   The stimulus package may improve GDP numbers, but it won&#8217;t affect unemployment, because in effect the economy through the stimulus package may be buying less goods for more money.</p>
<p>The hallmark of a socialist bureaucracy is to increase the risk for investment.</p>
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		<title>By: joe buzz</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28691</link>
		<dc:creator>joe buzz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 21:02:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28691</guid>
		<description>Freaky Frank should lose his job for blocking efforts to reform Freddie and Fannie, instead he gets fluffed by 60 Minutes as the &quot;smartest man in congress&quot;. You cant make this crap up. I cant even watch the evening news anymore without cussing. I&#039;ll be in the basement hand loading ammo for stress relief.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Freaky Frank should lose his job for blocking efforts to reform Freddie and Fannie, instead he gets fluffed by 60 Minutes as the &#8220;smartest man in congress&#8221;. You cant make this crap up. I cant even watch the evening news anymore without cussing. I&#8217;ll be in the basement hand loading ammo for stress relief.</p>
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		<title>By: Jay</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28690</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 20:57:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28690</guid>
		<description>Ron Hardin, My post was to tell the folks that the economists I know who are good and not part of the Fed gang do not believe that the Fed will be able to sanitize (sop up) all that cash that will fuel an inflation.
 Plus since are savings rate is near zero our debt in Treasury bonds is being carried by China and to lesser extent Japan and the rich Arabs. If the Chinese government decides to spend are IOU&#039;s and take a loss now rather than later given the inflation we will not be able to sell those bonds unless the interest rate shoots up.
 The neo Keynsian macro argument for government spending depends on the country having positive savings.
 The fundamental problem with all the macro models is that they assume a linear economic system and use a very simple model of dynamics. An economy is a highly nonlinear system with millions of states in the state space.
 The problem is with modern economics and modern egotistical economists and not with socialism. As we move left the problems will get much worse.
 That is why I am concerned with hyperinflation and its chaotic consequences.
We were a law abiding hard working society in 1932. Now we have young population that wants the easy life and has never seen hard times except for the criminal subclass. Those of us who are old generally can not depend on our children or our family to help the way the Japanese society reacted to their bank crisis.
 Where I live there are Mexican (not US citizens) gangs who roam around robbing and killing whenever they can find a soft target.
 Thinking people are afraid of Obama and his policies, especially older people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ron Hardin, My post was to tell the folks that the economists I know who are good and not part of the Fed gang do not believe that the Fed will be able to sanitize (sop up) all that cash that will fuel an inflation.<br />
 Plus since are savings rate is near zero our debt in Treasury bonds is being carried by China and to lesser extent Japan and the rich Arabs. If the Chinese government decides to spend are IOU&#8217;s and take a loss now rather than later given the inflation we will not be able to sell those bonds unless the interest rate shoots up.<br />
 The neo Keynsian macro argument for government spending depends on the country having positive savings.<br />
 The fundamental problem with all the macro models is that they assume a linear economic system and use a very simple model of dynamics. An economy is a highly nonlinear system with millions of states in the state space.<br />
 The problem is with modern economics and modern egotistical economists and not with socialism. As we move left the problems will get much worse.<br />
 That is why I am concerned with hyperinflation and its chaotic consequences.<br />
We were a law abiding hard working society in 1932. Now we have young population that wants the easy life and has never seen hard times except for the criminal subclass. Those of us who are old generally can not depend on our children or our family to help the way the Japanese society reacted to their bank crisis.<br />
 Where I live there are Mexican (not US citizens) gangs who roam around robbing and killing whenever they can find a soft target.<br />
 Thinking people are afraid of Obama and his policies, especially older people.</p>
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		<title>By: Late Bloomer</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28688</link>
		<dc:creator>Late Bloomer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 20:34:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28688</guid>
		<description>After WW II, the US had a baby boom.  In the eighties, the baby boomers entered their peak earning years.  Since the baby boomers were well educated, well fed, and well parented, they were quite productive.

Now the baby boomers are leaving their peak earning years.  They are followed by less well educated and less well parented children (the rise of divorce and out of wedlock children).

To add to the problem, the babyboomers were used to living well and did not save much.  Unless we can increase productivity and savings in this country, we are going to have to learn to live with less.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After WW II, the US had a baby boom.  In the eighties, the baby boomers entered their peak earning years.  Since the baby boomers were well educated, well fed, and well parented, they were quite productive.</p>
<p>Now the baby boomers are leaving their peak earning years.  They are followed by less well educated and less well parented children (the rise of divorce and out of wedlock children).</p>
<p>To add to the problem, the babyboomers were used to living well and did not save much.  Unless we can increase productivity and savings in this country, we are going to have to learn to live with less.</p>
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		<title>By: Eggplant</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28685</link>
		<dc:creator>Eggplant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 19:54:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28685</guid>
		<description>Wretchard said:

&quot;Over the really long term, rising population growth and technological advancement probably guarantee a return to economic growth.&quot;

Rising population constrained to a world with finite resources is a Bad Thing.  Petroleum is about $48/barrel.  Unfortunately this low price is due to demand destruction from the depressed world economy.  Peak Oil is real and will eventually kill what&#039;s left of our economy if we don&#039;t transition away from fossil fuels.

Appropriate technological advancement is a Good Thing.  However, keep in mind that nuclear proliferation is an example of inappropriate technological advancement.  There are a whole bunch of technological booby traps waiting out there, e.g. weaponized viruses, the artificial intelligence &quot;singularity&quot;, fissionless fusion weapons, total loss of privacy (every conversation is computer monitored), etc.  A big problem that we have in the United States is not enough money is being spent on higher education and advanced technological research and development.  My profession is aerospace engineering.  Most people don&#039;t realize this but aerospace engineering went moribund around 1972 after the double whammy of the Apollo Program being terminated along with cancellation of the Boeing SST.  Concepts are still coming out, e.g. UAVs, hypersonic propulsion, rovers on Mars, etc.  However almost all of those concepts were initially developed on paper before 1972, e.g. hypersonic propulsion was invented by Antonio Ferri in the early 1960s.  We&#039;re drawing down ideas from a reservoir that is not being replenished with new concepts (eating our seed corn).  

49erDweet said:

&quot;The economy is controlled by “consumer confidence”. With its last few gasps the MSM will bugle how well the teensy messiah is doing “governing” his kingdom and fools will begin “spending” again.&quot;

Actually the economy has been driven by bubbles.  This is a consequence of our becoming a &quot;service economy&quot;, i.e. we&#039;re not producing anything new and only recirculating old money.  It used to be that a person could get rich by coming up with a better farming method, finding a new mineral deposit, opening a factory based upon a new technology or simply coming up with a technology that created new forms of wealth.  That ship seems to have sailed.  Now a person gets rich by coming up with some new Ponzi Scheme, e.g. the Dot Com, the sub-prime mortgage fiasco, Green/politically-correct technology, etc.  The name of the game is to sucker elderly people into investing their 401K retirement money and then scuttle off before the suckers realize they&#039;ve been had. 

49erDweet also said:

&quot;A move to Chile or Australia does look better, but those countries, too, will be affected by the gigantic “elephant” in the room.&quot;

I don&#039;t know about Chile but I lived in Australia for 7 years before returning to California.  IMHO, Australia is one of the best places in the world to live but a lousy place to work.  I left Australia because it was impossible to find steady employment.  If you are planning on retirement and have your money in hand then moving to Australia or New Zealand would be a ***Good Idea***.  However, I would advise keeping your money in Swiss Francs and only convert to the local currency as you need it, particularly if you opt for New Zealand.  Australia&#039;s fortunes will improve because the country is still very rich in natural resources such as high grade iron ore, bauxite and anthracite coal.  Also Australia and New Zealand probably will not get nuked when the Islamic fascist thing reaches its logical conclusion (minimal issues with nuclear fallout, mega-deaths, etc.).  However Australia&#039;s economic situation will change in 20 years as the country gets mined out but that&#039;s a non-issue if you&#039;re already retired and your money safely squirreled away.

Peter Boston said:

&quot;That’s when I noticed that the period from Cincinnatus - statesman, soldier, republican - to the patrician led and very public assault on Scipio Africanus - the man who won the war that could not be won - was 236 years. The time from George Washington to George W. Bush is about 232 years.&quot;

I&#039;ve done the same analysis.  It&#039;s clear that we&#039;ve &quot;timed out&quot;.  Obama isn&#039;t smart enough and doesn&#039;t have the distinguished military career to be a Lucius Cornelius Sulla.  My guess is the American Sulla will appear after Obama hammers everything into the ground (our Sulla will be a handsome young man with several university degrees and a distinguished military record, e.g. a brilliant USMC officer, combat decorated for heroism).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wretchard said:</p>
<p>&#8220;Over the really long term, rising population growth and technological advancement probably guarantee a return to economic growth.&#8221;</p>
<p>Rising population constrained to a world with finite resources is a Bad Thing.  Petroleum is about $48/barrel.  Unfortunately this low price is due to demand destruction from the depressed world economy.  Peak Oil is real and will eventually kill what&#8217;s left of our economy if we don&#8217;t transition away from fossil fuels.</p>
<p>Appropriate technological advancement is a Good Thing.  However, keep in mind that nuclear proliferation is an example of inappropriate technological advancement.  There are a whole bunch of technological booby traps waiting out there, e.g. weaponized viruses, the artificial intelligence &#8220;singularity&#8221;, fissionless fusion weapons, total loss of privacy (every conversation is computer monitored), etc.  A big problem that we have in the United States is not enough money is being spent on higher education and advanced technological research and development.  My profession is aerospace engineering.  Most people don&#8217;t realize this but aerospace engineering went moribund around 1972 after the double whammy of the Apollo Program being terminated along with cancellation of the Boeing SST.  Concepts are still coming out, e.g. UAVs, hypersonic propulsion, rovers on Mars, etc.  However almost all of those concepts were initially developed on paper before 1972, e.g. hypersonic propulsion was invented by Antonio Ferri in the early 1960s.  We&#8217;re drawing down ideas from a reservoir that is not being replenished with new concepts (eating our seed corn).  </p>
<p>49erDweet said:</p>
<p>&#8220;The economy is controlled by “consumer confidence”. With its last few gasps the MSM will bugle how well the teensy messiah is doing “governing” his kingdom and fools will begin “spending” again.&#8221;</p>
<p>Actually the economy has been driven by bubbles.  This is a consequence of our becoming a &#8220;service economy&#8221;, i.e. we&#8217;re not producing anything new and only recirculating old money.  It used to be that a person could get rich by coming up with a better farming method, finding a new mineral deposit, opening a factory based upon a new technology or simply coming up with a technology that created new forms of wealth.  That ship seems to have sailed.  Now a person gets rich by coming up with some new Ponzi Scheme, e.g. the Dot Com, the sub-prime mortgage fiasco, Green/politically-correct technology, etc.  The name of the game is to sucker elderly people into investing their 401K retirement money and then scuttle off before the suckers realize they&#8217;ve been had. </p>
<p>49erDweet also said:</p>
<p>&#8220;A move to Chile or Australia does look better, but those countries, too, will be affected by the gigantic “elephant” in the room.&#8221;</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know about Chile but I lived in Australia for 7 years before returning to California.  IMHO, Australia is one of the best places in the world to live but a lousy place to work.  I left Australia because it was impossible to find steady employment.  If you are planning on retirement and have your money in hand then moving to Australia or New Zealand would be a ***Good Idea***.  However, I would advise keeping your money in Swiss Francs and only convert to the local currency as you need it, particularly if you opt for New Zealand.  Australia&#8217;s fortunes will improve because the country is still very rich in natural resources such as high grade iron ore, bauxite and anthracite coal.  Also Australia and New Zealand probably will not get nuked when the Islamic fascist thing reaches its logical conclusion (minimal issues with nuclear fallout, mega-deaths, etc.).  However Australia&#8217;s economic situation will change in 20 years as the country gets mined out but that&#8217;s a non-issue if you&#8217;re already retired and your money safely squirreled away.</p>
<p>Peter Boston said:</p>
<p>&#8220;That’s when I noticed that the period from Cincinnatus &#8211; statesman, soldier, republican &#8211; to the patrician led and very public assault on Scipio Africanus &#8211; the man who won the war that could not be won &#8211; was 236 years. The time from George Washington to George W. Bush is about 232 years.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve done the same analysis.  It&#8217;s clear that we&#8217;ve &#8220;timed out&#8221;.  Obama isn&#8217;t smart enough and doesn&#8217;t have the distinguished military career to be a Lucius Cornelius Sulla.  My guess is the American Sulla will appear after Obama hammers everything into the ground (our Sulla will be a handsome young man with several university degrees and a distinguished military record, e.g. a brilliant USMC officer, combat decorated for heroism).</p>
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		<title>By: Ron Hardin</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2009/01/07/let-me-tell-your-fortune/#comment-28683</link>
		<dc:creator>Ron Hardin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 19:49:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/?p=1735#comment-28683</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;inflation&lt;/i&gt;

That depends on what the Fed does when money starts moving again.  At the moment, the new money just winds up back at the Fed as a deposit by the banks, as the financial system deleverages.

Money that doesn&#039;t move in search of having the economy do something for it is money that doesn&#039;t count.   If you put dollars in your mattress, the Fed will notice the money supply is a little low and print a replacement.  If you then spend your mattress money, the Fed sells a little debt to soak it back up.

All the new money at the moment is going right back into a government mattress, and so isn&#039;t itself a cause of inflation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>inflation</i></p>
<p>That depends on what the Fed does when money starts moving again.  At the moment, the new money just winds up back at the Fed as a deposit by the banks, as the financial system deleverages.</p>
<p>Money that doesn&#8217;t move in search of having the economy do something for it is money that doesn&#8217;t count.   If you put dollars in your mattress, the Fed will notice the money supply is a little low and print a replacement.  If you then spend your mattress money, the Fed sells a little debt to soak it back up.</p>
<p>All the new money at the moment is going right back into a government mattress, and so isn&#8217;t itself a cause of inflation.</p>
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