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	<title>Comments on: Ho ho ho</title>
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	<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/</link>
	<description>Just another Pajamasmedia.com weblog</description>
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		<title>By: philw1776</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2858</link>
		<dc:creator>philw1776</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 31 Jul 2008 19:55:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2858</guid>
		<description>Add me to those recommending Anthony Watts blog 
whatsupwiththat.com
He is a skeptic but not an ideolog who uses his years as a meteoroligist to examine and criticize those very ground &#039;truth&#039; weather stations that make up the data net used to feed in temperatures.  It&#039;s shocking how badly sited many of them are.  Lots of interesting, somewhat technical but readable information.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Add me to those recommending Anthony Watts blog<br />
whatsupwiththat.com<br />
He is a skeptic but not an ideolog who uses his years as a meteoroligist to examine and criticize those very ground &#8216;truth&#8217; weather stations that make up the data net used to feed in temperatures.  It&#8217;s shocking how badly sited many of them are.  Lots of interesting, somewhat technical but readable information.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2750</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 20:08:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2750</guid>
		<description>For those interested in the projection abilities of Climate Models might want to check out

http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=3361

Lots of other good stuff here too including Solar Scientist Leif Svalgaard.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For those interested in the projection abilities of Climate Models might want to check out</p>
<p><a href="http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=3361" rel="nofollow">http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=3361</a></p>
<p>Lots of other good stuff here too including Solar Scientist Leif Svalgaard.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2731</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Jul 2008 06:29:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2731</guid>
		<description>When it gets hotter, it&#039;s evidence of global warming.  When it gets colder, it&#039;s evidence of global... warming?

So it looks to me like AGW is not capable of being falsified, and so (per Karl Popper anyway) can&#039;t be considered scientific.  As if there were need for more reasons to be suspicious of a &quot;consensus&quot; maintained through the suppression of dissent.

Western Europe is ramping up its use of coal. Al Gore owns at least 3 huge gas guzzlers.  Mere elitism, or evidence that they don&#039;t really believe it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When it gets hotter, it&#8217;s evidence of global warming.  When it gets colder, it&#8217;s evidence of global&#8230; warming?</p>
<p>So it looks to me like AGW is not capable of being falsified, and so (per Karl Popper anyway) can&#8217;t be considered scientific.  As if there were need for more reasons to be suspicious of a &#8220;consensus&#8221; maintained through the suppression of dissent.</p>
<p>Western Europe is ramping up its use of coal. Al Gore owns at least 3 huge gas guzzlers.  Mere elitism, or evidence that they don&#8217;t really believe it?</p>
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		<title>By: bobal</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2632</link>
		<dc:creator>bobal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 06:09:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2632</guid>
		<description>I too was taken with the global warming idea for awhile. And, I have tried to follow the argument best I can. There is a big disagreement on the facts. One thing that has been pointed out to me is what a gold mine the idea is for social planners. This I think is very scary. 

I&#039;m going to be voting for McCain. He at least is not fearful of the words nuclear energy. If we want to clean up our environment, that is the way to go. All the other ideas like solar and wind are good too. Let&#039;s get something done. I don&#039;t see that the democrats and Obama have any ideas here, other than to say &#039;no&#039; to everything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I too was taken with the global warming idea for awhile. And, I have tried to follow the argument best I can. There is a big disagreement on the facts. One thing that has been pointed out to me is what a gold mine the idea is for social planners. This I think is very scary. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m going to be voting for McCain. He at least is not fearful of the words nuclear energy. If we want to clean up our environment, that is the way to go. All the other ideas like solar and wind are good too. Let&#8217;s get something done. I don&#8217;t see that the democrats and Obama have any ideas here, other than to say &#8216;no&#8217; to everything.</p>
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		<title>By: PharmaGuy</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2631</link>
		<dc:creator>PharmaGuy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 05:57:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2631</guid>
		<description>As a practicing chemist I have followed the whole AGW &quot;discussion&quot; with much interest and a large dose of skepticism.  One quite interesting book I am reading now is &quot;Plows, Plagues and Petroleum&quot; by William Ruddiman,(2005, Princeton Univ. Press) a retired Professor of Environmental Science at U-VA.  The subtitle of the book is &quot;How humans took control of climate&quot;.  Control isn&#039;t quite the right term, but Ruddiman makes an interesting case that human activity, especially agriculture, has been significantly influencing climate for the last 5000-10000 years, long before the industrial revolution of the last 200 years.  Lots of charts of orbital precession, wobble and ellipticity to explain the natural cycles upon cycles that will put a lot variability to climate over 1000s of years, the evidence for 40-50 glacial episodes over the last 2.5 million years, etc.   And how the methane and CO2 data dont fit what up then had been well behaved, cycles. Haven&#039;t finished it yet, but the style so far has been scientific- complete with doubts and uncertainities expressed honestly.  Well worth a read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a practicing chemist I have followed the whole AGW &#8220;discussion&#8221; with much interest and a large dose of skepticism.  One quite interesting book I am reading now is &#8220;Plows, Plagues and Petroleum&#8221; by William Ruddiman,(2005, Princeton Univ. Press) a retired Professor of Environmental Science at U-VA.  The subtitle of the book is &#8220;How humans took control of climate&#8221;.  Control isn&#8217;t quite the right term, but Ruddiman makes an interesting case that human activity, especially agriculture, has been significantly influencing climate for the last 5000-10000 years, long before the industrial revolution of the last 200 years.  Lots of charts of orbital precession, wobble and ellipticity to explain the natural cycles upon cycles that will put a lot variability to climate over 1000s of years, the evidence for 40-50 glacial episodes over the last 2.5 million years, etc.   And how the methane and CO2 data dont fit what up then had been well behaved, cycles. Haven&#8217;t finished it yet, but the style so far has been scientific- complete with doubts and uncertainities expressed honestly.  Well worth a read.</p>
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		<title>By: RWE</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2626</link>
		<dc:creator>RWE</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jul 2008 01:28:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2626</guid>
		<description>Fred:   You are absolutely right.  Follow the money is the name of the game.  Some would have us believe that it was a complete coincidence that so many of the people who opposed Operation Iraqi Freedom were either being bribed by Saddam or otherwise had a financial interest in seeing that Iraq remained as it was.  
 
But it’s worse than that.  I am fully convinced that one reason that Global Warming is so popular is that it forms a basis for outfits such as insurance companies to request a government bail-out.  After all, if hurricanes cause billions of dollars in losses to them and the cause is NOT an “Act of God” but is accepted to be due to “all of us”, well, who ya’ gonna call?  Or blame?  The bail-outs of the bad housing loans is a precedent.  Next, I could see farmers asking for Global Warming bail-outs, and retailers, and so on.  It just never stops.  And they intend to see that it never does.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fred:   You are absolutely right.  Follow the money is the name of the game.  Some would have us believe that it was a complete coincidence that so many of the people who opposed Operation Iraqi Freedom were either being bribed by Saddam or otherwise had a financial interest in seeing that Iraq remained as it was.  </p>
<p>But it’s worse than that.  I am fully convinced that one reason that Global Warming is so popular is that it forms a basis for outfits such as insurance companies to request a government bail-out.  After all, if hurricanes cause billions of dollars in losses to them and the cause is NOT an “Act of God” but is accepted to be due to “all of us”, well, who ya’ gonna call?  Or blame?  The bail-outs of the bad housing loans is a precedent.  Next, I could see farmers asking for Global Warming bail-outs, and retailers, and so on.  It just never stops.  And they intend to see that it never does.</p>
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		<title>By: fred</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2620</link>
		<dc:creator>fred</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 23:21:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2620</guid>
		<description>RWE,

Those &quot;token measures&quot; will amount to one of the biggest wealth transfers in the history of humanity.  And these fines we will be compelled to pay will go to one of the most corrupt institutions in the modern world.  That money will neither arrest man made global warming nor do anything constructive for poorer nations, except make the middlemen richer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>RWE,</p>
<p>Those &#8220;token measures&#8221; will amount to one of the biggest wealth transfers in the history of humanity.  And these fines we will be compelled to pay will go to one of the most corrupt institutions in the modern world.  That money will neither arrest man made global warming nor do anything constructive for poorer nations, except make the middlemen richer.</p>
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		<title>By: RWE</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2618</link>
		<dc:creator>RWE</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 23:10:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2618</guid>
		<description>A few years back I recall seeing not one but TWO Democrat congresscritters - in series -  criticize the Bush Admin&#039;s economic predictions by saying &quot;Look, it&#039;s April and it snowed in Washington DC today.  We can&#039;t even predict the weather accurately and the Administration claims it can predict the economy.&quot;

And these are the very same people who insist that the Global Warming climate models are accurate 50 or 100 years out.

Navytech:  We have been observing the Sun scientifically for over 100 years and in a less rigorous manner for some thousands of years before that.  And the latest solar observations show that the currents
on the Sun that predict future sunspot activity are at the LOWEST LEVEL ever recorded.  By 2020 we will be at a solar minimum that could well be below anything ever seen before.  The Sun is throttling back.  But never fear, that is one reason why they are now calling it Climate Change rather than Global Warming.  So the immense bureacracy they want to create will be able to cover all the options.

The worrisome thing is, though, that the default position is now one to accept Global Warming to some degree. Even the people who think it is all just a big scam seem to have accepted that we will have to undertake at least some token measures.  

It&#039;s like someone said back in the 80&#039;s.  If the Democrats established a position that required the US Capitol to be burned down, the Republicans would counter-propose that the task be done in a series of small fires rather than one big one.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few years back I recall seeing not one but TWO Democrat congresscritters &#8211; in series &#8211;  criticize the Bush Admin&#8217;s economic predictions by saying &#8220;Look, it&#8217;s April and it snowed in Washington DC today.  We can&#8217;t even predict the weather accurately and the Administration claims it can predict the economy.&#8221;</p>
<p>And these are the very same people who insist that the Global Warming climate models are accurate 50 or 100 years out.</p>
<p>Navytech:  We have been observing the Sun scientifically for over 100 years and in a less rigorous manner for some thousands of years before that.  And the latest solar observations show that the currents<br />
on the Sun that predict future sunspot activity are at the LOWEST LEVEL ever recorded.  By 2020 we will be at a solar minimum that could well be below anything ever seen before.  The Sun is throttling back.  But never fear, that is one reason why they are now calling it Climate Change rather than Global Warming.  So the immense bureacracy they want to create will be able to cover all the options.</p>
<p>The worrisome thing is, though, that the default position is now one to accept Global Warming to some degree. Even the people who think it is all just a big scam seem to have accepted that we will have to undertake at least some token measures.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s like someone said back in the 80&#8242;s.  If the Democrats established a position that required the US Capitol to be burned down, the Republicans would counter-propose that the task be done in a series of small fires rather than one big one.</p>
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		<title>By: Pascal</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2616</link>
		<dc:creator>Pascal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 22:43:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2616</guid>
		<description>Doug: &lt;i&gt;One unassailable fact seems to be that if “Global Warming” IS caused by man made CO2, there is no known way mankind could do anything of significance about it.&lt;/i&gt;

LOL. Like our &quot;Progressives&quot; will take that for an answer. They&#039;re more like this:

&lt;i&gt;Talk? I don&#039;t expect you to talk Mr. Bond.  I expect you to die.&lt;/i&gt; </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Doug: <i>One unassailable fact seems to be that if “Global Warming” IS caused by man made CO2, there is no known way mankind could do anything of significance about it.</i></p>
<p>LOL. Like our &#8220;Progressives&#8221; will take that for an answer. They&#8217;re more like this:</p>
<p><i>Talk? I don&#8217;t expect you to talk Mr. Bond.  I expect you to die.</i></p>
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		<title>By: ZZMike</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2615</link>
		<dc:creator>ZZMike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Jul 2008 22:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/richardfernandez/2008/07/27/ho-ho-ho/#comment-2615</guid>
		<description>If this Global Warming thing keeps up, we&#039;re all going to freeze to death.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If this Global Warming thing keeps up, we&#8217;re all going to freeze to death.</p>
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