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	<title>Comments on: I Challenge Noah Feldman to a Debate about the Islamic Headscarf.  Will the New York Times Sponsor It?</title>
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	<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/</link>
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		<title>By: Chesler Chronicles &#187; A Day in the Life of the New York Islamic Times: The Subject is Anti-Semitism.</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-2821</link>
		<dc:creator>Chesler Chronicles &#187; A Day in the Life of the New York Islamic Times: The Subject is Anti-Semitism.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 23 Jun 2008 17:40:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-2821</guid>
		<description>[...] have written about Feldman before HERE and HERE. This time, Feldman argues that Muslims are, regrettably, becoming &#8220;pariahs&#8221; in Europe [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] have written about Feldman before HERE and HERE. This time, Feldman argues that Muslims are, regrettably, becoming &#8220;pariahs&#8221; in Europe [...]</p>
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		<title>By: pixologic</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-759</link>
		<dc:creator>pixologic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 16 Feb 2008 01:22:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-759</guid>
		<description>Hijab isn&#039;t really a big deal, since it only covers your hair.  It&#039;s the burkas that are problematic.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hijab isn&#8217;t really a big deal, since it only covers your hair.  It&#8217;s the burkas that are problematic.</p>
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		<title>By: PCM</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-758</link>
		<dc:creator>PCM</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Feb 2008 18:03:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-758</guid>
		<description>You wrote:

&quot;The information coming out of the UK about this sets the number of honor murders yearly at 17,000 world-wide.&quot;

You are wrong.

The report states that up to 17,000 women in Britain are being subjected to &quot;honour&quot; related violence, such as kidnapping, beatings, and sometimes murder.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You wrote:</p>
<p>&#8220;The information coming out of the UK about this sets the number of honor murders yearly at 17,000 world-wide.&#8221;</p>
<p>You are wrong.</p>
<p>The report states that up to 17,000 women in Britain are being subjected to &#8220;honour&#8221; related violence, such as kidnapping, beatings, and sometimes murder.</p>
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		<title>By: 4infidels</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-757</link>
		<dc:creator>4infidels</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 03:45:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-757</guid>
		<description>Noah Feldman said:&lt;i&gt; &quot;The best possible refutation of the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible would be to point to an existing government where liberal and Islamic values work together.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;

And the overwhelming evidence supporting the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible:  There are no societies in which Islamic values and democratic values work together.

All 57 nation-states of the IOC provide evidence that refutes Mr. Feldman’s baseless optimism.  The degree to which any of these states embody democratic values is directly related to the degree to which they suppress the influence of Islam in public life (Turkey throughout much of the 20th century) and/or the degree to which those countries have non-Islamic religious and cultural influences, either from minority populations or from their pre-Islamic traditions that still have an effect on local attitudes (Indonesia and Malaysia).

In both Turkey and East Asia, the trend is toward more Islam, which will lead to the loss of rights and freedoms for religious minorities and women and further limitations on free speech and free expression of religion.

Nothing more clearly depicts Mr. Feldman’s foolishness than the constitutions of Afghanistan and Iraq that he played a major role in drafting.  By including a provision that no laws can be made that contradict Sharia (Islamic) law, Mr. Feldman effectively nullified the entire democratic, egalitarian and pluralistic wording in those constitutions.  Thus it is consistent with Sharia law that apostates and critics of Islam receive death sentences as we have seen recently in high-profile cases in Afghanistan.  The only reason those harsh judgments have been overturned or commuted is the desire of Kabul to continue receiving American aid, not because the rulings are contrary to the Islamic values of the Afghani constitution.

Simply put, core Islamic values such as jihad, the status of the dhimi, the role of women, the superiority of Islam over all other faiths and Sharia law are completely incompatible with Western notions of democracy.

That the New York Times gave Mr. Feldman space in its Sunday Magazine to turn a personal slight or misunderstanding regarding his Jewish high school into an indictment of Orthodox Jewish values is highly irresponsible.  That Mr. Feldman then chose to tie his perceived rejection by his high school alumni newsletter—not having his picture with his non-Jewish wife published (or was the crime disrespecting a Harvard Law professor who has the power to use the Times for payback)—to an alleged relationship between Orthodox Jewish values and the rare act of terrorism committed by an Orthodox Jew (Baruch Goldstein) and the assassination of Rabin certainly makes him unfit to practice law in any legal system in which evidence and logic are required.

However Mr. Feldman, who can portray two high-profile incidences of barbaric political violence in the mid-1990s by Jews—notable at least in part because these types of acts by Jews are so rare—as arising from Orthodox Jewish values, cannot seem to make the connection between the many thousands of terrorist acts committed by Muslims since Sept. 11, 2001 with essential elements within Islam that are fundamentally at odds with Western values.  He goes to great lengths to convince his readers that the Muslim clerics he talks to are struggling with the relationship of religion and democratic politics just as are Rabbis and other spiritual leaders…and he cheers the election of Rep. Keith Ellison, whom he compares to a Muslim Joe Lieberman.

Pretending that Islam as it has been understood, interpreted and practiced by Muslims throughout the past 1300 years is compatible with democracy doesn’t make it so.  Much work has to be done—by Muslims themselves—beyond setting up elections, introducing parliamentary government and writing constitutions to transform Islamic politics, religious practice and attitudes into something that is democratic in nature and can peacefully co-exist with non-Muslims.

Pretending that a marathon is only one yard long doesn’t mean that after a few steps you are close to the finish line.  As long as Mr. Feldman is considered a serious voice on Islamic issues, his fantasies regarding Islam will continue to endanger women, non-Muslims and Muslim apostates living in Muslim-majority countries while preventing the Western nations from taking the necessary steps to protect itself from those it should rightfully view as posing a threat to its core values.


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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Noah Feldman said:<i> &#8220;The best possible refutation of the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible would be to point to an existing government where liberal and Islamic values work together.&#8221;</i></p>
<p>And the overwhelming evidence supporting the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible:  There are no societies in which Islamic values and democratic values work together.</p>
<p>All 57 nation-states of the IOC provide evidence that refutes Mr. Feldman’s baseless optimism.  The degree to which any of these states embody democratic values is directly related to the degree to which they suppress the influence of Islam in public life (Turkey throughout much of the 20th century) and/or the degree to which those countries have non-Islamic religious and cultural influences, either from minority populations or from their pre-Islamic traditions that still have an effect on local attitudes (Indonesia and Malaysia).</p>
<p>In both Turkey and East Asia, the trend is toward more Islam, which will lead to the loss of rights and freedoms for religious minorities and women and further limitations on free speech and free expression of religion.</p>
<p>Nothing more clearly depicts Mr. Feldman’s foolishness than the constitutions of Afghanistan and Iraq that he played a major role in drafting.  By including a provision that no laws can be made that contradict Sharia (Islamic) law, Mr. Feldman effectively nullified the entire democratic, egalitarian and pluralistic wording in those constitutions.  Thus it is consistent with Sharia law that apostates and critics of Islam receive death sentences as we have seen recently in high-profile cases in Afghanistan.  The only reason those harsh judgments have been overturned or commuted is the desire of Kabul to continue receiving American aid, not because the rulings are contrary to the Islamic values of the Afghani constitution.</p>
<p>Simply put, core Islamic values such as jihad, the status of the dhimi, the role of women, the superiority of Islam over all other faiths and Sharia law are completely incompatible with Western notions of democracy.</p>
<p>That the New York Times gave Mr. Feldman space in its Sunday Magazine to turn a personal slight or misunderstanding regarding his Jewish high school into an indictment of Orthodox Jewish values is highly irresponsible.  That Mr. Feldman then chose to tie his perceived rejection by his high school alumni newsletter—not having his picture with his non-Jewish wife published (or was the crime disrespecting a Harvard Law professor who has the power to use the Times for payback)—to an alleged relationship between Orthodox Jewish values and the rare act of terrorism committed by an Orthodox Jew (Baruch Goldstein) and the assassination of Rabin certainly makes him unfit to practice law in any legal system in which evidence and logic are required.</p>
<p>However Mr. Feldman, who can portray two high-profile incidences of barbaric political violence in the mid-1990s by Jews—notable at least in part because these types of acts by Jews are so rare—as arising from Orthodox Jewish values, cannot seem to make the connection between the many thousands of terrorist acts committed by Muslims since Sept. 11, 2001 with essential elements within Islam that are fundamentally at odds with Western values.  He goes to great lengths to convince his readers that the Muslim clerics he talks to are struggling with the relationship of religion and democratic politics just as are Rabbis and other spiritual leaders…and he cheers the election of Rep. Keith Ellison, whom he compares to a Muslim Joe Lieberman.</p>
<p>Pretending that Islam as it has been understood, interpreted and practiced by Muslims throughout the past 1300 years is compatible with democracy doesn’t make it so.  Much work has to be done—by Muslims themselves—beyond setting up elections, introducing parliamentary government and writing constitutions to transform Islamic politics, religious practice and attitudes into something that is democratic in nature and can peacefully co-exist with non-Muslims.</p>
<p>Pretending that a marathon is only one yard long doesn’t mean that after a few steps you are close to the finish line.  As long as Mr. Feldman is considered a serious voice on Islamic issues, his fantasies regarding Islam will continue to endanger women, non-Muslims and Muslim apostates living in Muslim-majority countries while preventing the Western nations from taking the necessary steps to protect itself from those it should rightfully view as posing a threat to its core values.</p>
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		<title>By: TomG</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-756</link>
		<dc:creator>TomG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Feb 2008 00:01:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-756</guid>
		<description>Prof. Feldman&#039;s crackpot political theories do not surprise me. A few years ago they would have, but not now. I&#039;ve listened to and read too many anti-Israel Jewish academics for too long to be surprised by much at this point. (Though I was taken aback by the Bishop of Canterbury&#039;s recent condoning of certain aspects of Sharia law in England.) It is hard to believe that there are, in fact, a number of anti-Israel/pro-Palestinian Israeli academics, such as Ilan Pappe, but, indeed, such people do exist.
My take on this kind of thinking is that it is a neurotic attempt to be fair to the less fortunate. On another level, it is old lefty thinking habits that are hard to break, and are a faith in and of themselves. Unfortunately those habits are being taught and codified daily in our centers of higher learning (e.g. Israel stole the land). The Western apologists for Muslim and Islamic terror can take such positions because they are protected by a set of rules and beliefs (and democratic governments with armies) that radical Islam would tear asunder and replace with tyranny. But because they are protected from the dire consequences that would result if their theories were put into action, they can pretend they are fair minded, working for peace, and holy, so to speak.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prof. Feldman&#8217;s crackpot political theories do not surprise me. A few years ago they would have, but not now. I&#8217;ve listened to and read too many anti-Israel Jewish academics for too long to be surprised by much at this point. (Though I was taken aback by the Bishop of Canterbury&#8217;s recent condoning of certain aspects of Sharia law in England.) It is hard to believe that there are, in fact, a number of anti-Israel/pro-Palestinian Israeli academics, such as Ilan Pappe, but, indeed, such people do exist.<br />
My take on this kind of thinking is that it is a neurotic attempt to be fair to the less fortunate. On another level, it is old lefty thinking habits that are hard to break, and are a faith in and of themselves. Unfortunately those habits are being taught and codified daily in our centers of higher learning (e.g. Israel stole the land). The Western apologists for Muslim and Islamic terror can take such positions because they are protected by a set of rules and beliefs (and democratic governments with armies) that radical Islam would tear asunder and replace with tyranny. But because they are protected from the dire consequences that would result if their theories were put into action, they can pretend they are fair minded, working for peace, and holy, so to speak.</p>
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		<title>By: David Thomson</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-755</link>
		<dc:creator>David Thomson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 21:59:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-755</guid>
		<description>There is something else that one should know about Professor Noah Feldman: he is the type of legal scholar most likely to be appointed to the U.S. Supreme Court by a Clinton or Obama administration.  Do you want folks like him interpreting the laws of the United States?  Many of you were thrilled concerning the Roe vs. Wade decision.   The fact that it was logically incoherent was deemed irrelevant because it legalized abortion.  The end presumably justified the means.  Oh well, the stuff is now really starting to hit the fan.  Radical legal scholars like Noah Feldman and Harold Koh will literally destroy the country.  And no, I am not speaking rhetorically.  I indeed do mean literally.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is something else that one should know about Professor Noah Feldman: he is the type of legal scholar most likely to be appointed to the U.S. Supreme Court by a Clinton or Obama administration.  Do you want folks like him interpreting the laws of the United States?  Many of you were thrilled concerning the Roe vs. Wade decision.   The fact that it was logically incoherent was deemed irrelevant because it legalized abortion.  The end presumably justified the means.  Oh well, the stuff is now really starting to hit the fan.  Radical legal scholars like Noah Feldman and Harold Koh will literally destroy the country.  And no, I am not speaking rhetorically.  I indeed do mean literally.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-754</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 20:59:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-754</guid>
		<description>Professor Feldman is perhaps an example of how real world experience trumps academic credentials. The guy&#039;s background looks very impressive on Wikipedia. Yet he seems very naive about the core nature of Islamism and it&#039;s essentially predatory and genocidal nature. He states:
&quot;The rising global Islamist movement is embroiled in its own epochal debate about whether an authentically Islamic government can and must respect individual freedoms and the equality of all citizens&quot;.
Excuse me? Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran and Osam Bin Laden are debating about &quot;respecting individual freedoms and the equality of all citizens&quot;?
Debating?
Is that why Iran hasn&#039;t murdered the two young women yet by stoning? The Mullahs must be engaged in a thoughtful debate about women&#039;s rights and liberal democracy!
Professor Feldman continues:
&quot;The best possible refutation of the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible would be to point to an existing government where liberal and Islamic values work together&quot;.
Really??
Bin Laden will be so relieved to hear this! &quot;Thank goodness, we can have liberal democracy AND Islamic Fundamentalism!&quot;
If he had known this, there might have been a vote to decide whether to cut off Daniel Pearl&#039;s head while he was alive, or would it be more humane to knock him out first?
Mr. Feldman must be brilliant, looking at his long list of academic accomplishments. But when you listen to what Walid Shoebat, Tawfik Hamid and others who have actually lived in that world say, he is DEAD WRONG.
They all say that the head scarf is a symbol of Islamic superiority and power. They all say the west is making a suicidal error in thinking that Islamic Fundamentalism is just another religion like Methodism or Quakerism or Hindusim that should be accomodated and respected.
That&#039;s like confusing the Peace and Freedom Party with a regiment of Nazi SS.
Little Red Riding Hood showed better sense and wisdom than Professor Feldman. She knows a wolf when she sees one.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Professor Feldman is perhaps an example of how real world experience trumps academic credentials. The guy&#8217;s background looks very impressive on Wikipedia. Yet he seems very naive about the core nature of Islamism and it&#8217;s essentially predatory and genocidal nature. He states:<br />
&#8220;The rising global Islamist movement is embroiled in its own epochal debate about whether an authentically Islamic government can and must respect individual freedoms and the equality of all citizens&#8221;.<br />
Excuse me? Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran and Osam Bin Laden are debating about &#8220;respecting individual freedoms and the equality of all citizens&#8221;?<br />
Debating?<br />
Is that why Iran hasn&#8217;t murdered the two young women yet by stoning? The Mullahs must be engaged in a thoughtful debate about women&#8217;s rights and liberal democracy!<br />
Professor Feldman continues:<br />
&#8220;The best possible refutation of the claim that Islam and democracy are incompatible would be to point to an existing government where liberal and Islamic values work together&#8221;.<br />
Really??<br />
Bin Laden will be so relieved to hear this! &#8220;Thank goodness, we can have liberal democracy AND Islamic Fundamentalism!&#8221;<br />
If he had known this, there might have been a vote to decide whether to cut off Daniel Pearl&#8217;s head while he was alive, or would it be more humane to knock him out first?<br />
Mr. Feldman must be brilliant, looking at his long list of academic accomplishments. But when you listen to what Walid Shoebat, Tawfik Hamid and others who have actually lived in that world say, he is DEAD WRONG.<br />
They all say that the head scarf is a symbol of Islamic superiority and power. They all say the west is making a suicidal error in thinking that Islamic Fundamentalism is just another religion like Methodism or Quakerism or Hindusim that should be accomodated and respected.<br />
That&#8217;s like confusing the Peace and Freedom Party with a regiment of Nazi SS.<br />
Little Red Riding Hood showed better sense and wisdom than Professor Feldman. She knows a wolf when she sees one.</p>
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		<title>By: George Jochnowitz</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-753</link>
		<dc:creator>George Jochnowitz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 20:27:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-753</guid>
		<description>Islam in its current radical version is a blind faith.  It is anti-political.  Although it has a political agenda, it is based on the assumption that faith supersedes politics.

Islam nowadays resembles Marxism, but that&#039;s because Marxism too is a blind faith, albeit an atheistic faith.  Mao, Pol Pot, and the Kims crushed politics.  Chavez is trying to do the same thing but has failed, so far.

Jews and Christians today no longer have blind faith.  The Bible commands us to execute witches (Exodus 22:18) and homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13), but you cannot easily find a Christian or a Jew who will advocate a return to the days when people accused of witchcraft and homosexuality were hanged or burned.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Islam in its current radical version is a blind faith.  It is anti-political.  Although it has a political agenda, it is based on the assumption that faith supersedes politics.</p>
<p>Islam nowadays resembles Marxism, but that&#8217;s because Marxism too is a blind faith, albeit an atheistic faith.  Mao, Pol Pot, and the Kims crushed politics.  Chavez is trying to do the same thing but has failed, so far.</p>
<p>Jews and Christians today no longer have blind faith.  The Bible commands us to execute witches (Exodus 22:18) and homosexuals (Leviticus 20:13), but you cannot easily find a Christian or a Jew who will advocate a return to the days when people accused of witchcraft and homosexuality were hanged or burned.</p>
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		<title>By: Tom</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i_challenge_noah_feldman_to_a/#comment-752</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Feb 2008 20:19:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/phyllischesler/2008/02/10/i-challenge-noah-feldman-to-a-debate-about-the-islamic-headscarf-will-the-new-york-times-sponsor-it/#comment-752</guid>
		<description>Excellent idea and potentially good publicity for your cause!
Noah Feldman seems to suffer from
&quot;Western Suicide Syndrome&quot;, the etiology of which has not yet been discovered.
Here we have Noah Feldman, a professor at one of the most prestigious centers of higher learning in the world. He evidently feels an obsession with perfecting political ideals of civil and human rights on a global scale. Wonderful.
So...why is he going out of his way to promote a symbol of oppression used by a genocidal ideology?
Hasn&#039;t he done any research, as a professor at Harvard Law School should?
What is going on when a presumably intelligent, sophisticated, rational champion of the very highest humanitarian ideas suddenly takes a position which encourages the spread of one of the most backward, hate filled, oppressive, demonstrably predatory and genocidal military/political movements in history? (Islamic Fundamentalism)
Even more puzzling and bizarre: the fact that if this ideology wins...that he and his whole civilizaiton will be wiped out.
What twisted, labrynthine, psychological short circuits are at work here deep in the good professors brain?
It can only be yet another manifestation of &quot;Western Suicide Syndrome&quot;.




</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excellent idea and potentially good publicity for your cause!<br />
Noah Feldman seems to suffer from<br />
&#8220;Western Suicide Syndrome&#8221;, the etiology of which has not yet been discovered.<br />
Here we have Noah Feldman, a professor at one of the most prestigious centers of higher learning in the world. He evidently feels an obsession with perfecting political ideals of civil and human rights on a global scale. Wonderful.<br />
So&#8230;why is he going out of his way to promote a symbol of oppression used by a genocidal ideology?<br />
Hasn&#8217;t he done any research, as a professor at Harvard Law School should?<br />
What is going on when a presumably intelligent, sophisticated, rational champion of the very highest humanitarian ideas suddenly takes a position which encourages the spread of one of the most backward, hate filled, oppressive, demonstrably predatory and genocidal military/political movements in history? (Islamic Fundamentalism)<br />
Even more puzzling and bizarre: the fact that if this ideology wins&#8230;that he and his whole civilizaiton will be wiped out.<br />
What twisted, labrynthine, psychological short circuits are at work here deep in the good professors brain?<br />
It can only be yet another manifestation of &#8220;Western Suicide Syndrome&#8221;.</p>
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