There is nothing out of hand or complete in my rejection of the above posts. The point I make is that there are violent examples of behavior described in the Koran as well as in the Bible. The following argument is not a form of moral relativism rather a discussion of what matters when we use only the literary religious primers as examples for how to live our lives.
Look at the politics instigated by both Islam and Christianity and you will find thugs prone to violence using both texts as their primers for how to behave. Jesus led a reckless and arrogant life in which he presumed to argue how to break his eternal covenant with G-d. This sin is no less serious then the sin of eating of the fruit of knowledge. Still, Jesus did not live a violent life even if some of his words are easily construed, as they have been many times in the past, to forgive violence. Jesus himself is only responsible for the sins he himself committed. His way of life has historically been an example to societies that have enacted crimes against people that leaves no ground on which to suggest any moral superiority to Islam. That said, we must cultivate among Muslims who know the evil that is inherent in Jihadi Islam the strength to stand against all barbarity. These good people can provide an example and the ideas behind how a Muslim can behave as a civilized human being and still remain Muslim. The fact is that in the last thousand years there are examples of great piety among the Muslims. One wishes for more such examples.
This following quote by Morton Doodslag is wrong, “There will never be a reformation of Islam. Islam cannot endure a reformation. It is, at its very core, a violent, xenophobic, hatred based ideology. It is a merciless form of government. It is a creed which eternally divides the world into “believers” and “non-believers”. The “non-believers” are relegated to a perpetually inferior status. Women will never have any equality in any Islamic state. Islam cannot tolerate other religions. Muslims will never truly integrate with others as long as they adhere to Islam.”
Mr. Doodslag, you have some study of history to make yourself. When the Muslims, under Uthman, conquered Persia and then the later conquest of the Byzantines, they arrived with a far more tolerant brand of ideology then those dynasties they replaced. There are examples of very fine, articulate and tolerant forms of Islam. Don’t mistake knowledge of this for an error in recognizing the threat of today’s, politically dominant expression of that religion. I do not submit to Islam nor do I recognize Mohamed as G-d’s prophet. My observation is that those whose faith follows Jesus’ teaching are in a battle for souls with Islam and wish that the sins of their religion be forgotten along with the goodness that has historically been expressed in Islam, however meager that may be. If history provided no examples of good Muslims then I might view Mr. Mansur with a different attitude. But, I have seen good Christians in spite of its history and I have seen good Muslims in spite of its current condition.
All three religions have texts that teach their followers how to behave. If simply read by we who hardly merit literacy then we often interpret these words as we please. If you were to look at the number of Jews today who merit stoning according to G-d’s laws for us, you would have to also argue that Judaism is an intolerant and evil religion. Abraham was willing to sacrifice his son because a voice in his head told him so. If you take the Christian Bible at its word then Jesus walked around with a form of dementia in which he believed he was a new Hercules, the literal scion of a deity. One must account for interpretation of these texts and how effective the oral traditions have been in recognizing the need for tolerant and humane interpretations in justice. Hillel said, back in the days before Jesus, that a Jewish court that convicted and executed a man within the last 70 years was considered a brutal court. Keep in mind that many Jews in Hillel’s day were Hellenized and lived a life-style quite difficult to distinguish from the Greeks and Romans living in Judea of that day. Yet, this great man; who had spent his life living and teaching according to a book that insists you not to suffer a witch to live, to cut the foreskin of your infants, to sacrifice animals, to destroy the nation of Amalek and many other practices that many today consider intolerant, was asked by a Roman what the main lesson of Judaism is. Hillel responded, a full generation before Jesus was born, “Do onto others as you would have them do onto you”. I still believe that one can read evil and good in the Bible and in the Koran. I still stand on the idea that we cannot eradicate Islam without becoming ourselves hateful and intolerant. We must direct our attacks against the specific actions and intentions of our enemies and try to nurture understanding with those Muslims who have the will for such dialog. But, you are correct. I aught to complete my reading of the Koran and them move on to the commentaries so I can better understand of what I write. Still, one can hardly comprehend a religion if lacking intimacy with its oral traditions.
