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Would you abolish government intervention in healthcare? Government programs directly cover 27.8% of the population (83 million), including the elderly, disabled, children, veterans, and some of the poor. If you won’t, then you agree some of your tax dollars will continue to subsidize someone else’s healthcare. If you want to give them a “free ride,” go ahead. I’d like to see those engaging in risky behavior pay their part.
“do get back to me on that “freest country on the planet” thing.” Umm, “freest” is meant to be relative to all OTHER nations, not to your interpretation of free. What other country is freer? France? UK? China? Costa Rica? Name one. Please! And as you warmly invited me to move to Canada (if they’d have me), I’ll extend you the same courtesy to wherever you believe you’ll actually enjoy more freedoms than in the US.
“So the government has the authority to force hospitals to work for free.
Surprise!!! Yes Chileno…” I was being sarcastic. I’m well aware of EMTALA and what it means to ER physicians. Why do doctors have to work for free? Is that true in any other profession? I guess healthcare IS something “special” after all, no?
“YOU are NOT the “paying customer” any more.” When I go to the hospital, my insurance is “overcharged” to offset the cost of non-paying customers. Guess who the insurance company is going to pass on that charge to, as higher yearly premiums? From Wikipedia: “The costs of treating the uninsured must often be absorbed by providers as charity care, passed on to the insured via cost shifting and higher health insurance premiums, or paid by taxpayers through higher taxes.”
“I recognize that welfare programs exist…These programs will likely always exist … That’s not the point. The point is that you want to expand them” When, oh great “goy” who thinks I live on a farm, did I say I wanted to EXPAND any social program? The only thing I’ve said to support is an increase in the smoking tax or a snack tax, specifically to cover the rising cost of medicine, given that those who engage in these behaviors will be more apt to use the healthcare system. I’ve been asking you if you’d repeal existing programs, and you grudgingly admit you would not. Well, at least you wouldn’t starve the poor. Good for you.
“There’s no conceivable reason you can offer that absolves individuals of the responsibility for paying their own way for these things… Part of your responsibility as a citizen is to maintain your health.” Yes! I agree it is your responsibility to maintain your health! But some are unable or unwilling to do so. That’s my point with smoking/obesity! If many in the underclass are going to benefit from the welfare system (that includes Medicaid) which you yourself would not abolish, shouldn’t we find a way they put in a little more into the collective pot? In terms of epidemics, wow, you had to go all the way back to 1918 to support your case -to an epidemic for which doctors had no cure, and little understanding. Why not talk about government-sponsored free STD clinics to stop the spread of syphilis? Or government clinics for DOT therapy for TB -to make sure patients actually take their meds and stop spreading the disease? Or government sponsored vaccines, like the flu shot for the elderly, or the nationwide campaigns to vaccinate kids for polio, or measles in the 1950s (some funded with private money)? What about the Ryan White funds for low-income AIDS patients? (The latter will not be cured, but can greatly reduce their risk of transmission if on treatment) And you have the gall to say I’m selective, and have to read up on MY history?
Do you know ahead of time precisely when you’re going to need a new car? I may not know the date, but I know the cost. Replacing a car is predictable in the sense that unless you’re well off, you know it will NOT be more than $50,000.It’s essentially capped. If you’re uninsured, health care costs could be 50k, but they could quickly balloon to 300k or more. Add to this lost wages, particularly if you’re in the hospital for weeks on end. And during your convalescence, your spouse may need to help you at home, so he/she may have to take time off work as well. Healthcare is NOT like replacing a car, it’s more like replacing a house. Do you have homeowners insurance? I bet you do, because you know that, though unlikely, if your home were ever to burn down you’d be hard pressed to replace it. Same goes with health care. The fact is, in 2001, medical causes were cited by about half of bankruptcy filers in the US. I bet replacing a car didn’t even make the top ten.
“Insisting that people pull their own weight is not “libertarianism”, it’s simple common sense.” Yes, I’d agree! If you can, you should! The point is, some CANNOT (the elderly, the disabled), and others have simply made dumb decisions in their lives (I’d like to see this group taxed more, but you think that’s wrong. What would you do? Leave them to die with their disease? Oh, that’s much better.) Given the staggering costs, which have NOT risen because of insurance company schemes, the government is the only institution that can help these people.
Why have costs gone up so fast? Technological advances, high cost of labor, high cost of litigation (or fear of litigation), as well as the high cost of end-of-life care. I’d add perhaps overuse as well. We’ve become accustomed to having “free” medicine (e.g., the ER, ) or seek treatments that benefit our lives, but perhaps are not essential (Viagra?). The pharmaceutical industry pushes new drugs that are slightly better than the old ones, but cost triple (in part to cover R&D, litigation, but also to increase their bottom lines). Ultimately we get into the law of diminishing returns: progressively smaller increments in benefit vs. large increments in cost.
Despite your apocalyptic vision of the future, you admit some form of welfare will continue to exist. So you admit your tax dollars will continue to be spent on someone else’s healthcare. You can choose to either A) have everyone foot the bill equally, even though some disproportionately consume more resources, or B) have those who consume more healthcare dollars pay a little more. Well, you could settle for a third choice: to grow a beard and move off to that mythical “freer” nation you claim exists. Please! Send me a postcard!
