When Choosing a Candidate Means Losing a Friend
When I turned 18 and was looking forward to voting in my first presidential election, my father gave me a bit of advice: “Don’t ever tell anyone who you are voting for.” I smiled politely, the way teenagers do when they think their parents have no idea what they’re talking about. Of course, I didn’t take his advice. I told anyone who would listen that I was voting not for Reagan or Carter, but for John Anderson. And then I learned a valuable lesson: My father was right.
This place used to be a Republican stronghold. Our county was part of a very strong, powerful Republican machine that loomed over us like a monster. You wanted a job, you had to register as Republican. Wanted a favor? Register Republican. So telling people you were voting for John Anderson was like wearing my teenage rebel idiocy on my sleeve. No adult took me seriously. Instead, they took me aside and lectured me on the virtues of voting party line.
That was my first experience in dealing with people judging you over your politics. I was branded a liberal, a hippie, a free thinker who was going to be the ruin of this country. But I was 18, I wanted to be those things. I wanted to be an outsider. And I really didn’t care what most adults thought of me.
It wasn’t until many years later that I found out people will not just chastise you for your political beliefs, but they would literally cut you off from their lives. I saw it happen in 2004. People who had been friends for years were parting ways over the election. I was dumbfounded. Here were people who forged friendships even though they had different ideals — their views on religion, abortion, taxes, guns were completely different, they had maintained a friendship through all that, and suddenly, a vote for a president tore them apart.
I lost a good friend in 2004. I lost touch with some interesting acquaintances, too. We had shared interests that kept us together. We had kids the same age. We watched the same television shows. We loved the same foods and listened to the same bands. Superficial things, but enough to form a friendship over. But it all fell apart. I could understand why people would question the way I was voting. I could understand their trying to talk me out of it, even. What I couldn’t understand was the way they used our friendship as a threat: Either I vote their way, or it was over.
It was over.
And so it goes. I’m seeing it now. I’m feeling it now. The look of disdain when I say, against my father’s advice, who I am voting for. The eye roll, the disbelief, the “how could you?” lecture. I feel people slowly backing away from me after, of course, telling me all the reasons that I was insulting them by voting against their candidate.
“”"I’ve weighed my options and I took into account my own life, my own situation, my family, concerns and he turned out to be the best candidate for me.”"”
The politician that robs Peter to pay Paul can always count on Pauls vote.
I’m sure what was good for the country was in your quote there somewhere. Probably “family, concerns” … the “concerns” part. Probably. Yup. As to the whole relationship thing, think how Peter feels about his best friend Paul.
HEY, Catalano:
Based on your last paragraph,
“Yes, I am voting for Obama. And if this for some reason makes you walk away from whatever kind of friendship we have developed, be it a close, personal relationship or one based on IM chats and forums, then so be it. Just know that I am not judging you on your vote. But I am judging you on your behavior.”
YOU STILL HAVE LEARNED *N*O*T*H*I*N*G* FROM YOUR FATHER.
TYPICAL OBAMA VOTER. WHAT A “maroon”!
We have a secret ballot for a reason, by the way I live on Long Island and you do understand that the Democrat version of rich is middle class out here.
Hey, it is your vote – it’s more fun when you get into these kinda arguments with your spouce! Vote how you will, I’ll still read your column
“There are some friends I have that are intelligent enough to be able to separate politics from everything else,”
Can’t be done. Your friends that think politics can be separated from anything in daily life are dumb as a post.
IIRC, the orginal greek meaning of the word politics is something like ‘daily life’.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics
Look at 5a. on this link;
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politics
Nevermind, I’ll snip it;
”
Main Entry:
pol·i·tics Listen to the pronunciation of politics
Pronunciation:
\ˈpä-lə-ˌtiks\
Function:
noun plural but singular or plural in construction
Etymology:
Greek politika, from neuter plural of politikos political
Date:
circa 1529
1 a: the art or science of government b: the art or science concerned with guiding or influencing governmental policy c: the art or science concerned with winning and holding control over a government
2: political actions, practices, or policies3 a: political affairs or business ; especially : competition between competing interest groups or individuals for power and leadership (as in a government) b: political life especially as a principal activity or profession c: political activities characterized by artful and often dishonest practices
4: the political opinions or sympathies of a person
5 a: the total complex of relations between people living in society b: relations or conduct in a particular area of experience especially as seen or dealt with from a political point of view
Getting out of bed in the morning is a political decision. It goes downhill from there. When you consider that more people have died from politics then any single other cause, you need to reconsider what you mean when you use the word friend. Since Ohhhhh……BAAMA! has decided to start a civil war, you need to be very careful about what you mean by the word friend. A mistake there could cost you your life. Of course as an Obamabot that isn’t worth much. Ohhhhh…….BAAMA! is a socialist and now that he has your vote, you are worth nothing to him. You will see over the near future that I am right. Nothing has a shorter shelf life then a useful fool after the Usurper has grabbed power.
Obama is another Hitler or Stalin and traditionally those guys kill off the useful fools after they grab power. That is so the useful fools cannot be used against them.
Since I returned to the USA after 23 years in Canada I have lost people I once considered best friends, mostly fellow American immigrants, simply because I champion the USA and question the dogma of the left. For the first time in my life my stepchildren have insulted me and a distance has grown between us. I have learned never to mention politics to my ex or I will hear an echo of Amy Goodman’s lastest fantasy. I told her she was intellectually lazy. Big mistake. Insults will not bring around a thoroughly indoctrinated liberal or an Obama supporter, only life experience or jolts like 9/11 can do that. So, let’s aspire to a higher level of discourse than what is displayed in the first two posts.
Morons for Obama. Why work when the pies are free.
Hey lady, they don’t want your friendship. Get over it.
I don’t know why you are surprised by all of this. The parties and candidates stand for very different things. And if you are passionate in your beliefs about one party it really means you have a fundamentally different view on life than those passionate about the other side.
I have many friends and I am much closer to the ones that vote like I do then the ones that don’t. I have three kids and two vote one way and one the other. There is a barrier between me and the two that vote differently than I do. We still love each other and get along fine but there is a divide that will always be there.
Its not about picking a candidate its about picking a philosophy. In my youth I thought the parties where much closer than they are now. The country is very polarized and it will harm us greatly in the long run.
Ms Catalano is dismayed that she has run into people with core values and convictions deeper and stronger than those she learned watching Sesame Street as a child?
Moral relativism turns the brain to mush.
If you have a small company and you will surely loose money under obamba, and probably you can also loose the company altogether among the laughs of the moronic obamba voters that are in the queue to get their hard earned government handouts, why you should be bothered to be friends with them?
they are the cause of your ruin.
not to mention that probably they think reverend wright wasn’t that wrong after all, that you are racist because you don’t vote for obamba, that ayers is a respectable individual, and you cling to guns and religion.
I mean, who needs friends like that?
(The other “Kirk” comment is not from me…)
My wife and I are going to cancel each other out on Election Day again… we manage to have respectful conversations about politics and the candidates. We agree on more than we disagree, and if I were voting on social issues, I’d be voting for Obama. But I believe the Democrats are not serious about national security.
Part of the reason I started blogging is to explain my McCain support to friends in my blue town in a blue state. I haven’t encountered any overt hostility, but some people have made it clear that they don’t approve.
I wish more people were willing to engage in political discussions in a civil way. But the temptation to “go negative” is so great because ridicule can be very effective (cf. Palin, Sarah).
An excellent story, but it works both ways. I am shocked and amazed by liberal friends who have known me for years who hurl the worst form of degenerate political generalization about my party and candidate and ascribe it to me. We have always enjoyed a lively political debate, but its different this year. Its personal.
On November 5th, if Obama has won, I will email each of my friends with congratulations — not that I agree — but as a friend I recognize the importance to them. I’ve already been told by one that the good sportsmanship will not be returned.
What a sad state of affairs.
I have a pro-Obama nephew who is also running for a seat on our tribal council. I’ll continue to be “nice” to him, but I will not vote for him. Why? Because he and Obama believe they have the right to take money I worked for and give it to the bums on our reservation.
Also, Ms. Catalano, it is the left/liberal/progressive/Democrat/ObamaParty that is the home of “political correctness” – just ask Sarah Palin and Joe the Plumber. Better yet, watch “Indoctrinate U” on the Documentary Channel.
Ms. Catalano,
If you wish to support a Marxist who would hug the next Hitler (Ahmedinejad) and sit by while the next Holocaust happens, and who would sing Kumba-ya with Putin, Chavez, Assad and Kim as Eastern Europe, Taiwan and South Korea are gobbled up, it says a lot about your moral values, or lack thereof.
I shall kiss you good-bye, the way I did to Michael Smerconish, to whom I used to enjoy listening.
I feel sorry for people who don’t recognize the power of love and friendship surpass the politics, which they will be disillusioned with later. Look at the passionate Bushies, now for one reason or another have been deflated for the most part. Now we have the passionate Obama fans whom I can *guar-on-tee* they will be resigned, dissapointed and silent by 2010 if not by June of next year.
Why? because politicians are human. Therefore full of bs. I’m not voting for Obama nor McCain but I believe either one will do what they have to do as president once reality sets in (though admittedly I trust McCain more than Obama). My fiancee knows how I lean, but I told him he means more to me than politics, so if he thought O was best for the job, then vote for him.
I believe most people who don’t blog just want it to be over with. They are burnt out on the current president, and want to go on with their lives. Expect to see the SAME thing come 2012.
The cemetery it would take to hold all of the aborted babies since Roe v. Wade would measure 100 miles long and 100 miles wide (almost 40 million) . . . and Sen. Obama claims to have a “righteous wind” at his back? This nation needs a fervent prayer for God’s guidance . . . all of the experts who think they have the answer, and all of our citizens who believe them and dutifully follow along for the thrill of the moment, are sadlly mistaken. Our recent financial meltdown is but a symptom of a declining society, and the “change” that is promised is not going to be a pretty sight to most of us.
Your conservative friends/family/whatever are the ones shunning you? In my experience, it’s the lefties that tend to do that kind of thing most often… And, yes, you really should have listened to your father. Why you insist on blabbing to others about your voting is beyond me. Your father probably had an inkling that you’d make yourself stand out like a sore thumb one day.
Personally, I don’t believe that anyone who seriously voted for the Right can ever start voting for the Left. It would mean regressing as a person. It would mean lazy logic. Not all lefties are bad people, don’t get me wrong. I used to be a very right-of-center Dem myself. But, now a conservative, it is impossible for me to ever imagine voting for the Left again as it currently stands. It would mean going back to living only for ”me, me, me” and forgetting that there are things out there more important than victimhood.
No way.
“Obama is another Hitler or Stalin”
More perceptive commentary from the jammies crowd.
Michelle, don’t worry about the people here, they are not too swift and are a big part of the partisan problem–along with 911 truthers on the other side.
Personally, I think anyone who votes for Obama is a traitor to this country. The Dems/Libs are so rabidly against Pres. Bush, they are willing to give Obama a pass on a lot of things. Obama is a socialist, who is already taking away freedom of speech (Joe the Plumber was attacked for daring to ask a question), freedom of the press (the tv reporter in Orlando, FL who dared ask Joe Biden some tough questions, the reporters who were tossed off Obama plane because their newspapers endorsed McCain). Obama wants to “spread the wealth around”. All of this reminds me of the Soviet Union/Russia where speaking your mind is not permitted, can even be dangerous. Next they will be coming for our guns and religion. Obama broke his promise about taking federal campaign financing. Apparently a man’s word doesn’t mean anything anymore. At least not when it comes to a Dem/Lib. God protect us from Obama’s socialist/radical agenda.
Michele Catalano: Is there anywhere you would draw a line on friendship and politics? David Duke? Eugene Debs? Bill Ayers? Sirhan Sirhan? Meir Kahane? Communist? Fascist? Neo-Nazi? Terrorist?
If one of your friends supported one of the above, would that cross a line? Just curious.
Eric,
People like are the reason why we cannot have an open debate and find middle ground in this counrty. You deliberately insulting someone in this manner is sad. Just because a person is liberal does not mean they are Hilter loving Marxists (which is a contradiction as Hitler did not much care for communists).
GROW UP!!!!!!
Well, we weren’t “friends” to begin with, so there’s no “friendship” to lose.
I won’t dislike you for voting for Obama, it’s your choice. You may well be perfectly charming or perfectly horrid, I have no idea.
However, it’s inconceivable to me that I would ever take your opinion or judgment seriously on any matter affecting politics or liberty after learning that you have chosen to support an avowed socialist dedicated to undermining the national interests of the United States and the free world abroad.
Please, go join your comrades on the Huffington Post, who will undoubtedly be more congenial to you.
Cato @ 23 *2
“Personally, I think anyone who votes for Obama is a traitor to this country.”
This is just stupid. You actually think that more than half the nation is made up of traitors? Perhaps you should reexamine your worldview. Also, Kathy, you have a naive idea of what freedom of the press and freedom of speech are–you do not get freedom from criticism. Stop whining and start thinking.
But you got me. I’m coming for your religion. Please leave it on your doorstep. Boogity.
Get Real:
You should “get real”. Ahmedinejad has vowed a second Holocaust, and his Hezbollah proxies have vowed to kill Jews everywhere.
Obama has NOT taken back his promise to meet with him.
Most Obama supporters like to call those of us who oppose him “racist” or “Nazis”, but he has vowed to meet the true Nazi.
And Hitler and the Nazis WERE Socialists. And proud of it.
After the Iranian nuke obliterates Tel Aviv and another several million Jews are exterminated, what will you and Michelle say then?
That it was worth it so Obama could give you a tax cut?
I live in NYC and I’m a moderate Dem voting for McCain/Palin. In other words, I’m a PUMA. I haven’t lost any friendships, but some of my relationships have become, shall we say, strained. We have a mutual agreement not to discuss politics, which does, as another commenter noted, put a damper on things. OTOH, I have gained newfound respect for the Republicans that I know and I see clearly how smug and condescending liberals can be, at least here in this sea of blueness.
I haven’t disclosed my vote to everyone I know, but I have been open about the fact that I do not support Obama. I find that I’m OK with lukewarm Obama supporters – it’s the ones who drank the Kool-Aid that I can’t stand. Unfortunately, my mother is one of those. I find that generally Republicans have a better sense of humor and more tolerance for opposing viewpoints. Perhaps that’s just my NYC perspective since Republicans are a despised minority around here.
It’s particularly frustrating for my son, who is 23 years old and a registered Republican. In that age group, and living in this city, it can be pretty lonely. Fortunately, his girlfriend and best friend are also voting McCain. He totally blew people’s minds at a party a couple of weeks ago. They were shocked – shocked, I tell you! – that he was proudly voting for McCain/Palin. He said it was obvious they had never met a Republican before. We New Yorkers pride ourselves on being so worldly and scorn the “flyover states”, but we are seriously sheltered.
Regardless of the outcome of the election, I am rather dreading the post-mortem conversations. I plan to nod and smile enigmatically when in conversations with Obama supporters. And I’m actually grateful, again no matter what the outcome, that this election season has opened my mind and given me the opportunity to look at things from the other side.
I experienced this phenomenon recently with a coworker. A professional making six-figures, he’s supporting Obama for a single issue: health care. He has a younger perpetually unemployed sister (but Ivy League educated – “volunteering” occupies too much time for her to be able to find work that fits around her society-changing schedule) who discovered she has some serious medical problems. Lacking a health care policy (but living in a decent apartment with family money), she now has some serious bills to face and a pre-existing condition. My coworker believes “the government” (c’est moi) has the obligation to provide for her health care services – it is a right no different than those in the constitution.
When I asked if she had a HDTV, my coworker was incensed at my lack of sensitivity and our friendship threatened. I found it somewhat perplexing that my wealthy coworker (who certainly meets Obama’s recent $150K definition and combined with his wives earnings, meets the $250K standard) and his family funded his sister’s lifestyle but not basics, and sought me to provide for her basics. In our family, we lack the HDTV, PSP, ATVs our neighbors have, drive two paid-off cars, but sink our money in healthcare policies, 401Ks, 529s for the kids college savings and IRAs to the max.
I’m constantly pissed off at the grocery store when staples are bought with the state food stamp card, followed by movie rentals, lotto tickets, beer and cigarettes with “their” money. Now with Obama, we’re lumping health care and retirement into that welfare model? Obama 2008: What’s yours is mine.
I have had the same thing happen to me. And my dad said the exact same thing years ago. And like the author I paid no attention and got into it. The only differnece is I am voting for John McCain. I have had friend quiet recently go so far as to tell me that she and her husband no longer socialize with people who voting for Mccain. How sad. How much as a country have we lost. When we no longer can afford to hear the opposition. When “Group think “rules.
I have a daughter in the United States Navy . She will serve under the next President. And much of her destiny will be in his hands. I will vote for the Man I think she will be safest with. For me it is John McCain.
I was born and raised in liberal Massachusetts in a democratic union card carrying Irish Catholic family. Poltics is in the blood. In fact most of my friends and family are genuine in the admiration and respect they feel for John McCain. But that is not enough for them. They kept repeating the matra change but some how never quite nknew what is was. Issue by issue as we discussed them my family and friends agreed with mine. From experince to infants born who survive abortion, to who they actaully think would be the best President. Chracter? intergrity? Record? All were high marks for John McCain. Yet all of that was to be willingly put aside by them as they deliberatly cast their ballot for Barrack Obama . They are fully prepared to do so. Here in lies the problem. here in lies the anger. For like it or not, they “know” in thier hearts who is the better candidate. And “That” is a very incomforatble feeling. And the real reason for thier vote became increasingly clear , revenge against George Bush . Revenge was the motivation. But as the election cycle went on, many grew angry not because they disagreed with me but rather because they seemingly did not to want to”know”. It is as if not knowing would free their conscience. For to really “know” casts on the voter the ominous responsibility for outcomes of their vote.
Change costs and for the country the cost might be grave but for the military the cost of Barack Obama’s inexperience might be dire.
Seemingly so many Obama voters do want to pay the price with ownership of their vote. They are angry because they wil be accountable. For what happens after this election for good or for bad has been impacted greatly by those who cast their ballots. So many Obama supporters do not want to see and know much beyound election day victory as they make him our President. In their inner soul they worry what the change might bring. They want to put it aside. But much like the character in The Edgard Allen Poes “the tell tale heart ” it will not go away. And down the road, when thier vote really does count there will be doubts for all of us , and as Joe Biden says “mark my words ” there will be a lot of regrets .
When you vote for Obama, you are voting for the guy who promised to take my money out of my bank account and put it in your lazy, non-working hands. That’s why I won’t be your friend no more. I hate watching the way you waste my money that I worked so hard for.
One of Obama’s terrorist friends is going to nuke New York City. Bush has kept us safe but Obama has promised to change that. I’m leaving town to live and have a job some place safe. You used to be my friend so be careful.
You made your bed, my former friend. But be careful not to sleep in it because Obama’s friends want to make a statement and New York City is a their number one target.
May God welcome you soul.
So. Good number of the comments prove the point of the article. Loved the original, still love it now.
The more I think about it, the more this article seems link an exercise in narcissistic self-righteousness.
Ms Catalano’s father was far wiser that his daughter. It is better to just keep your potentially controversial opinions to yourself if you seek universal approval. Provoking, then demanding acceptance and approval is a bit arrogant and self centered.
I believe Catalano is the Italian word for dingbat.
Like I keep telling my son, if somebody says “Do X or I won’t be your friend anymore,” the correct response is “I’m sorry you feel that X is so important that you would throw away our friendship over it. It was nice being your friend and if you ever change your mind, let me know.” People who would try to manipulate you by dangling friendship in front of you are not people you want to have for friends.
“One of Obama’s terrorist friends is going to nuke New York City.”
Just when you think the comments can’t get any stupider….
I like the end where you say: “Just know that I am not judging you on your vote. But I am judging you on your behavior.” Me, too.
French President Nicolas Sarkozy is very critical of U.S. presidential candidate Barack Obama’s positions on Iran, according to reports that have reached Israel’s government.
Sarkozy has made his criticisms only in closed forums in France. But according to a senior Israeli government source, the reports reaching Israel indicate that Sarkozy views the Democratic candidate’s stance on Iran as “utterly immature” and comprised of “formulations empty of all content.”
[Note: Sarkozy is a conservative and will likely get along very well with McCain and Palin.]
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1031943.html
2008. The year The One (Barack Obama) … Lost.
I never ever tell anyone who I’m voting for. I never ever discuss politics with anyone. Because people take politics far too seriously and the easiest way to avoid the whole thing is to never say anything.
I don’t care who votes for whom. You want to vote for Obama, have at it. You want to vote for McCain, go ahead.
OBAMA TELLS SAN FRANCISCO HE WILL INTENTIONALLY BANKRUPT THE COAL INDUSTRY!!! Audio Unearthed
YOUTUBE ^ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hdi4onAQBWQ
ATTN: Coal states Virginia , Ohio, Pennsylvania, Colorado, Indiana and more guess what Obama told San Francisco about you.
San Francisco Gate Interview January
I agree that who somebody chooses to vote for should not affect a friendship that has obviously survived political differences until then.
As proof, let me say that I totally disagree with you, Michele… but you are officially invited to dinner with my wife and me any time you like. I find that some homemade bread, a hearty soup, pasta, and a little (?) home-brewed beer consumed in good company is much more pleasant than a night of political bickering.
Boris the only one making the conversation really stupid is you and read a million times what Antigone wrote
“Fortunately, his girlfriend and best friend are also voting McCain. He totally blew people’s minds at a party a couple of weeks ago. They were shocked – shocked, I tell you! – that he was proudly voting for McCain/Palin. He said it was obvious they had never met a Republican before… Perhaps that’s just my NYC perspective since Republicans are a despised minority around here. ”
SO MUCH FOR THE TOLERANCE, ACCEPTANCE OF DIVERSITY AND SUPERIOR MORALITY OF THE LEFT!!!
As it is always evident the leftist are a bunch of hypocrites.
I personally stopped hanging around with them because I noticed a pattern, they always wanted you to help them for free in whatever problem they had and they didn’t even bother to offer you a coffee to counterbalance the dozens you offered them.
Having a leftist friend is like having a hole in the pocket. They take very literally the sentence “what’s mine is mine, what’s yours is also mine”.
I grew up in a Democratic household and was a liberal until the late ’80′s. I remember being shocked when I found out a co-worker of mine had worked for a Republican Congressman (I lived in DC then) and was an enthusiatic Reaganite. I remember he told me, with some irritation, “Liberals always assume that people they like must be liberals too, because they believe nice, intelligent people don’t vote Republican.”
Well, 20 years later, we have flipped sides. Now he lives in LA, works in the movie industry and will vote for Obama on Tuesday, and I will vote McCain. But I have found that what he said back then is true.
I don’t bring up politics at work, but the Democrats routinely do. The director of my Department is a doctrinaire liberal and she makes exactly the same automatic assumptions that I made back in the ’80′s – that all good-hearted, reasonable people must believe as she does. In my experience, liberals do it far, far more than conservatives.
And yes, I lost a friend recently. It turns out that an ex-friend is a 9/11 “Truther.” She was emailing me all this bogus crap about 9/11 being an inside job and I finally told her that I have no more respect for the people who churn out that stuff than I do for neo-Nazis, John Birchers, or Communists. Haven’t heard from her since.
Well, I’ve personally Bush bashed more than most and regard McCain supporters are being utterly out of touch with reality, but in my more diplomatic moments, I reluctantly have to place much of the blame on what passes for the news media in this country. What you guys chronically vilify as the biased, liberal, blah, blah, blah “MSM” doesn’t exist — it’s properly called “the corporate media” and it’s characterized nowadays by sloppy, timid, lazy, and very deficient “coverage” of a small number of news items, and less and less true and thorough investigative reporting. But making things much worse is the supposed “new media” like highly political blog sites like this and Kos, YouTube videos, Twitter and all that — you would be better off calling all this the “boutique media” because of the way it caters to very specific demographics: whether you are an MIT student, retired Marine, wealthy liberal socialite, or Coors gulping redneck, there is a media outlet for you that will make you feel good about your beliefs.
This has made political “debates” pointless and antagonistic. Who caused the financial crisis for instance? If your a conservative, your news sources says it’s because of the Community Reinvestment Act, Democrats who blocked attempts at regulation in 2005, and maybe, possibly, if you’re in the finance business, “FAS 157″ (Google it). If you’re a liberal, you get to blame Bush and his people for not minding the store, and a Republican congress for never actually put out any regulatory bills to vote, and in particular Phil Gramm, now a McCain advisor, for blocked such bills while he was chairman of the Senate banking committee.
So who’s really to blame for all that, then? Well, I’m not going to say, and you shouldn’t be trusting anonymous posters for stuff like this anyway….
Hear! Hear! Susan!
Some people wave ‘hi’, some people reach out in a handshake. Leftists always approach palm up, asking for something.
Not only do they ask for help, they have a tendency to, when seeing you make a gift, or do something for someone else, ask, “Where’s mine?”
That phrase and the palm up is the official salute of the American Socialist Movement.
If you think a person is your friend, and if he refuses your friendship after you tell him how you are going to vote, he was not your friend in the first place, he was just a manipulative @$$#013.
You may be disillusioned, but that is a good thing. Your boat will ride higher in the water without him, and have more room for true friends.
I prefer to not get into heated discussions about politics with friends. IMO the candidates are so different this year that I have to wonder if people who support totally Obama actually share the enough of the same values/beliefs that I do to really be friends with.
Those Obama supporters who play the race card, dismiss anything negative as a “distraction” and consider my opinions as those of a stupid, bigoted, knuckle-dragging redneck neo-con reveal that they are people I don’t want to have as friends.
THE SENATOR FOR MCCAIN VS THE GENERAL FOR OBAMA
Listen closely, think carefully, abandon any emotional investment or agenda partisanship and do the right thing for the country on Tuesday.
http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2008/11/senator-for-mccain-vs-general-for-obama.html
I used to think it did not matter who people voted for. I have many friends that I disagree with politically, indeed most of them. At the end of the day I used to think politicians do not impact my day to day life.
I am from the New Orleans area and was body slammed back to earth on the importance of QUALIFIED politicians in office at local, state and federal levels.
So it is personal when someone disagrees with you over a candidate because it could mean the loss of a community or the roof over your head.
Antigone writes:
“I live in NYC and I’m a moderate Dem voting for McCain/Palin. In other words, I’m a PUMA. I haven’t lost any friendships, but some of my relationships have become, shall we say, strained.”
Antigone, you and other PUMAs have gained me as a friend, not that it’s a big deal. It will be an odd friendship, however. I despised the Clintons and still regard them with some suspicion. However, the spectacle of Obama and his thugs and their buddies in the MSM turning on the former darlings of the Left with such visiousness in the primaries was more than I could stand.
If for no other reason, it was just not the way one treats a lady, or a newscaster, or an average-citizen plumber, or an author, etc.
So, out of decency and respect for Senator Clinton and what she endured, I pledge to be cordial and respectful to those who still support her.
..oh, and by the way, at my work all of us supporting McCain/Palin (even those who supported Clinton) laugh at the Obamanistas when they gather in their furtive coffee-klatches and whisper their incredibly vicious remarks about Sarah Palin.
You know, maybe women have got it right when they talk about sexism.
The earlier comment that went
[If you wish to support a Marxist who would hug the next Hitler (Ahmedinejad) ... it says a lot about your moral values...] missed the point. Our dear Ms. Catalano would not be voting for Obama if she believed all that. Give her a little credit. This vote says NOTHING about Catalano’s moral values. What it says is that her crystal ball is showing a different future from yours. The future is less knowable than you think.
My best guess is that we’ll be sorry we elected Obama. But it’s just a guess. What I {know} is that friendships are valuable.
you did not mention your present age or perhaps i missed it. at age 26 i voted mcgovern and at age 62 i along time democrat voted senator mccain. guess what young lady as I assume you are much younger than I am. . I learned my lesson at age 62 and hope you dont wait these manyb years to leisten to your dad . nex elction i will not tell my coowkres for whom I am voting . .i am the only one on my floor that saw the light . . it has beenn quite uncomfortable and not next time .. I probably will be retiring any way. i also lost some friends and guess what i made new ones.. amen .
Michelle: I’m sorry; you’re being deceived.
I used to think Live and Let Live! Your politics or vote did not affect me one way or the other. It’s just a vote, right?
I used to say all of the time “It does not matter who is in our government because they do not control my day to day life.”
Until the day Hurricane Katrina came through my town and destroyed my community and way of life. Comptence DOES matter, experience DOES matter, judgement DOES matter. So if you look at these two dandidates who disagree on virtually every topic, it is indeed difficult for me to now say Live and Let Live.
By the way, I believe that the failings of Katrina start with the individual FIRST, then to the mayors, governors and finally the president. We had to go through alot of Democrats to get to George Bush.
Choose wisely all…
“””I’ve weighed my options and I took into account my own life, my own situation, my family, concerns and he turned out to be the best candidate for me.””
that’s the rub of the issue. Of my friends, I’m probably the most right leaning, though I consider myself more of a libertarian. Having grown up in Soviet Russia, I identify more closely with traditional Republican philosophies (except the social one). Majority of my friends are Democrats. But of those, there are two camps: those who espouse liberal thought for selfish reasons and those who do so out of sense of misplaced altruism or herd mentality. I can understand and accept the former, it’s the latter who drive me nuts the most and make me seriously question their intelligence and common sense.
Antigone,
Thank God there are others out there like me! I have always been a moderate Democrat who is socially liberal. I live in the left of center liberal capital of Washington State. For the first time since Reagan I am voting Republican. I have been ostracized among friends and aquaintances for this. My husband and I have friends who are voting Obama and it has strained our relationship. I am trying to take the moral high ground not reciprocate on the attacks to my character. As my friends crow about “being full of hope and a new day” My family is slowly backing up to get the hell out the door….
BTW, Is anyone else incredibly SICK of the attacks on Sarah Palin? I am starting a bumper sticker campaign: Everyone get two bumperstickers: one says “Sarah Palin is a better person than you will ever hope to be” put that next to the liberals’ favorite “Mean people Suck”. Touche!
USAFCaptain, it is an odd friendship indeed, but I’m enjoying it, and it does mean a great deal to me and to other PUMAs. We have been rejected by our party but welcomed by Republicans and we appreciate that. I think that one of the results of this election, regardless of outcome, will be the shifting of political alliances.
As for Hillary, I realized a few weeks ago that it is no longer about Hillary for me. I hate to see her stumping for Obama, but I’m pretty sure that Bill will be voting for Mac. It’s fairly clear that he loathes The One and in some of his comments has practically endorsed McCain.
I respect John McCain and trust him with our country’s future. Obama is just plain scary. I thought back in March when the Wright story broke that there was no way a man with anti-American associations, not to mention his empty resume, could possibly be elected President. And yet, here we are. Well, it ain’t over yet.
Re: the “liberal” Obama supporters’ remarks about Sarah Palin – the hypocrisy is quite stunning. I have been deleted from some liberal e-mail lists (good riddance!) because I have protested the denigrating remarks about Palin. I am personally pro-choice, but it’s not my main issue and I respect that Sarah Palin walks the talk. As for misogyny, I have seen more of it from so-called progressives in this election season than I have from Republicans in my entire life. And a lot of it comes from women! Suffice it to say, I am disgusted. The only reason I remain a Dem is because I live in a blue state with closed primaries and I like to vote.
I’m guessin’ in a very short time you’ll do another column about how you regret THIS vote too. You might want to look back over your voting record and realize you aren’t very good at choosing candidates. Oh, and listen to your father next time.
You know, I’ve never seen so many people get the vapors over what is essentially nothing more than a standard Democrat vs. Republican Presidential race.
Obama, should he win, isn’t going to usher in a Marxist Regime or the Reign of the 12th Mahdi. And McCain, should he be the victor, won’t be able to do DICK with both the House and the Senate firmly in Dem hands.
Worst case is McCain wins, dies suddenly…and Sarah Palin is an impotent, public humiliation and a disgrace to America for a couple of years. After 8 years of Bush, we can probably handle that…even though the title of “Dumbest. Superpower. Ever.” is really getting stale.
So, everybody chill. Eventually, all of your friends will get over thinking that you’re a mindless dupe, and you will grudgingly forgive them — sooner or later — for being retarded pod-people, assuming they ever wise-up.
Well, Michele, I still love your writing as much as the first time I read about your strange dreams about Glen Danzig. You’re damn good at what you do and you shouldn’t give a damn what anybody thinks. I’m surrounded by people of the exact opposite political dogmas, but I love it. It makes me think and debate and argue and scream and cry, etc. It’s so boring living in an echo chamber.
I am still one of those one-issue national defense guys, so you know where I’m going. It’s probably all for naught anyways (we’ll see next week). I love my friends no matter what they think. Keep up the good work!
From my experience, it’s not the McCain voters who get nasty when you say you’re not voting for their candidate: it’s the Obama ones. But then again, I work in academia where intolerant leftism rules the day. I know very few McCain voters in my office.
Rotwang, I have a feeling that the only impotent one is you, and I am not talking about politics.
I can’t want to see an arrogant sub par intellect like zerobamba making an a$$ of himself in front of some disaster.
If you think that “USA is the laughing stock of the world” with bush think twice, you ain’t seen nothing yet with obamba.
IN reading all the comments , I am impressed by the tone of almost each of you.Iam a independant voter , with republican leanings , concervative in most things..but , yes i also noted the o-bamm-a voters do not address the rev.wright issue that stands out in my mind. also barney frank on the military cuts just waiting to happen. the most troubling of all is ms. polosi.. Iam so ashamed of her. this GREAT COUNTRY OF OURS , is in dire need of McCAIN TO WIN , ..A ALL DEMOCRATIC SENATE-HOUSE , WITH O-BAMM-A IS VERY BLEEK …THERE ARE SOME REALLY QUALIFIED BLACKS TO BE PRESIDENT…I wish CONDI RICE WAS IN THERE ..SHE HAS IT ALL , EXPERENCE , KNOWLEDGE OF GLOBAL AFFAIRS, ….”OFF TOPIC”..THE POLICE , SWAT TEAMS ARE PREPARING FOR RIOTS ELECTION NIGHT ,…BEING A GUN OWNER , I WILL PROTECT MYSELF AND FAMILY !..GL2YALL
Memo to Catalano: Shut up. Nobody cares. Just understand this: when the civil war that your side has started finally comes to a neighborhood near you, be happy with the side you’ve picked. I sure am, ’cause my side is the one that *hasn’t* chosen to disarm itself in order to build a more prefect Socialist Utopia. As my legal-immigrant grandmother would have said, “Va’a fare in culo.”
There’s a lot of hate in these comments. Did you people even bother to read the article?
Rotwang,
you’ve proven many of the comments here to be valid with your ridiculously insulting remarks about Governor Palin. Read about this impressive woman before you continue to stick your foot in your mouth.
The reason many friendships will be ended over this election is because you can’t remain a friend with someone who thinks you are a moron and continually calls you one to your face. I will not permit someone to spit in my face then shake their hand. That’s not what Christ meant when he said “turn the other cheek.”
Antigone, possibly the reason you feel comfortable is many of us have been where you are now. I thought myself a dem. in the 60′s and early 70′s, but felt a widening gap between me and party. The final break came when I attended a speech by Reagan at UW-Oshkosh during the 76 primary race. like him, I thought the party left me, too.
I’m afraid what this country is going through is like an open wound. the infection must come to a head and finally burst, letting all the pus drain before it heals. it’s not going to be pretty, but I’m afraid it is going to be necessary. I just pray that the patient survives the cure. Then people of goodwill on all sides can find solutions to our problems by sincere discussion and mutual respect.
I saw a bumper sticker recently “The problems we face will not be solved by the minds that created them”
Michelle wrote: “This isn’t about you. My vote against your candidate is not a vote against you.”
Don’t be naive. Yes, it IS about me. I LIVE here. Obama’s parents were socialists, he has been surrounded by socialits and communists all his life. He is anti-American.
Michelle, I DO NOT WANT TO LIVE IN A SOCIALIST COUNTRY. With Reid and Pelosi, tell me how that is not going to happen?
Sorry about you losing your friends, but can you really blame them when the stakes are so high? This is not just another election.
someone75, the only hate is the one spread by your racist candidate and his black suprematist reverend
Liberalism is a mental disorder!
I want to keep the rights I have now, I do not want taxes to go up for anybody,I do belive in life, I want to keep my guns,I do not want the govt. dictating to me who i should help out , …you can keep your CHANGE, ..KEEP OUT OF MY POCKET !
ACTORS, ARE OVER PAID BRAIN DEAD PEOPLE,…KINDA LIKE ..BARNEY FRANK`S LOVER , A VERY HIGH UP ”OFFICIAL” THAT IS WITH FANNY-FREDDIE”’……I DO NOT WANT A DICTATORSHIP , ..OUTCOME OF A ‘PREMIER OHNOBAMMA”…PLEASE DO NOT OVER LOOK THE REV……WRIGHT ISSUE !…GOD DAMM AMERICA…I HAVE COME TO BELIEVE IN SOME WAYS OHNOBAMMA IS THE ANTI-CHRIST…….LIKE THE SNAKE IN EDEN , SMOOTH TALKING , SLIPPERY, ..DO NOT EAT THAT ”APPLE” HE WANTS TO GIVE YOU ..
“I HAVE COME TO BELIEVE IN SOME WAYS OHNOBAMMA IS THE ANTI-CHRIST”
Well, of course you have!
Saul Alinsky’s belief, that the personal is the political, has triumphed with many in American life. It is a core belief of the left, and in do-unto-others-after-you’ve-been-done spirit, many on the right are adopting it as an ethos too.
It’s quite a lovely ethos. What it means, ultimately, is that if you disagree with me politically, it’s on, it’s a fight, it’s war. The premise of this is that political disagreements are not about mostly trivial issues, but that they are a vital matter of life and death, good versus evil. I’m right, and you’re evil is the premise. In its reductio ad absurdum far reaches – a place all radical politics end up sooner or later – it is a justification for political violence. What the heck, your enemies are evil, right? So why not…
Has it ever occurred to you that the triumph of the left, its long march through the institutions, has brought us to this strait? You happen to be voting for the guy who is, from all indications, a stellar practitioner of Frankfurt school neo-marxist philosophy.
And yet wonder why your friends on both sides of the aisle have rejected you. Here’s a hint: they practice Alinsky’s aphorism as a way of life – you know Alinsky, right, the Bill Ayers mentor? – and it’s trickled into the rest of modern life regardless of our politics.
No, I don’t hate you for your vote, but I wonder why you, a otherwise literate author, are seemingly unaware of the pedigree of the nasty habit your father warned you about, as well as your candidate’s schooling in that philosophy.
suzy scuderi, I hear ya. I think that this election season is particularly trying because Obama “the great uniter” is in fact an extremely divisive candidate. He started out by dissing the Clintons and accusing them of racism, meanwhile expressing his admiration for Ronald Reagan. Yet at the same time, this man has built his career with terrorist and anti-American associations. There’s a hug disconnect here.
Look, I know all politicians lie to some extent, but Obama has advanced it to a new art form. I have been following the campaign closely for many months, watched every Democratic debate (at which, btw, Obama sucked although the MSM always declared him the winner), and I still can’t tell you what this man stands for except himself.
I can’t recall an election which set Dems against Dems in this manner since 1968 when I was a kid growing up in Chicago. (Speaking of 68, I think the Obama camp is using extremely dubious judgment having their election night party in Grant Park – but whatever. I won’t be there and it’s not my problem).
Big Red, I think you’re right. I’m at that point Reagan was many years ago: I didn’t leave my party. My party left me. Many Dems feel the same as I do. I don’t know any Republicans like the author of this piece; all the Repubs I know are towing the party line. Seems to me that more Dems are abandoning the party this year than at any time since 1980. I hope it pays off this year in the form of a McCain/Palin win, but if not, it will surely pay off in 2012 (assuming we survive an Obama Presidency).
Boris, it’s probably best not to take these folks too seriously. The regulars here are the militia types who believe that Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii, isn’t a Christian, and will dispatch his Nubian overlords to enslave America’s white women.
Sort of your standard wingnut mandingo wet dream, you know? These people, especially the crazies who insist on writing in all caps, are fools — and I, for one, look forward to their despair on Wednesday morning.
I think your father probably believed, “actions speak louder than words”, which is why he was not a liberal democrat and you are. Someday, perhaps you will listen to him.
I have a brother who says I must be a racist since I won’t vote for Obama. My own brother! I’m sure glad I won’t see him on Thanksgiving. Whoever wins on Tuesday, our relationship won’t be the same. Ever.
If you were writing this article in say 1965 I might agree with you. But I recently found that my lawyer had an Obama sign on his front lawn, I fired him the next day. To even think that the USA would consider a person like Obama (who is so ill prepared and personally flawed) to be the next president of this country reveals to me an agenda on the left that is more interested in power than what is best for our nation. And, the methodology used by the left to gain this power, reflects the corrupt nature of those who seek to put Obama in the White House and will occupy his administration.
Antigone writes:
“USAFCaptain, it is an odd friendship indeed, but I’m enjoying it, and it does mean a great deal to me and to other PUMAs.”
..as does the incredible support you all are providing for McCain. It has shown me the value of the “center” of the political spectrum as opposed to the extremes. In visiting some of the PUMA sites — and getting past the Anti-Obama rhetoric (which is a welcome treat to read, believe me) — I feel that there are some points where the center-right and center-left might differ but where, at least, a civil dialog will take place. It is, given the present climate, an invigorating feeling to know that these conversations could possibly lead to the betterment of this country.
Also, I would not write off Hillary. She is very adroit at a good “soft-pedal” pull. This is from bicycle racing where you go to the head of the peleton and act like your are working 100% but you are not. Meanwhile the three-rider break that includes one of your team mates gets further and further down the road.
You doubt politics and circumstances, take a look at at Joe Lieberman.
If Obama wins next Tuesday, he will find it very diffucult to levitate this garbage-truck thugocracy for four years. I am thinking Carter II and forsee a run at him by HRC in the primaries. You can count on my support for her by my re-registering as a Democrat and working for her during the primaries so that she can unseat him (and I live in California).
We’ll oppose each other in November (probably) but at least we will be able to discuss our differences.
Big Red,
Red,
Your comment about a wound opening and the pus draining is an excellent metaphor. You’re right; it’s like the all the venom has to come draining out before the healing can begin. And, no, it’s not all Bush’s fault. Bush is the convenient target of the left’s anger, but if Gore or Kerry had been elected, he would have been the convenient target of the right’s anger. It’s like the country’s anxiety about terrorism, the economy, whatever, is all being channeled into a hatred of people with different political views. I hope the public discourse is more civil in the 2012 election, but I”m not hopeful.
50. USAF Captain:
“..oh, and by the way, at my work all of us supporting McCain/Palin (even those who supported Clinton) laugh at the Obamanistas when they gather in their furtive coffee-klatches and whisper their incredibly vicious remarks about Sarah Palin.”
I find that many women who supported Clinton and many of us who support Palin, who have little or nothing in common politically, are becoming sisters in our shared dismay at our misogynist culture and media. Some of us are making new friends from across the political divide. Where this will lead, who can say?
For the sake of our daughters, something has to give.
The regulars here are the militia types who believe that Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii, isn’t a Christian, and will dispatch his Nubian overlords to enslave America’s white women.
Heh, indeed. I’m a white professional woman who lives in a very blue neighborhood in a blue state and I believe none of the above.
Your reading comprehension skills are very limited. But then, the Democrats have been in control of public education in this country for a long time, so that’s not surprising.
If we don’t end up in a civil war it will become a socialist country. I’ll never accept socialism,and I’m sure there are many more true Americans like me.
TO: Catalano
RE: With Friends Like These…..
….you don’t have friends.
A friend is someone who will accept what you have to say without getting upset with you. Even if you are saying something totally inane….or worse.
But in order to have a friend you have to be a friend as well. And therein lies the proverbial ‘rub’. That’s why smart people recognize the truth in the saying….
Hope that helps….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. -- Thomas Jefferson]
Thank you for succinctly stating an unfortunate phenomenon that occurs everyday from both sides of the aisle. I do, however, think your piece would have been more poignant and seemed more ingenuous if you had not stated your own voting preference.
You definitely echo my own sentiments over people who have acted aggressively toward me as if my unapologetic choice of candidate were somehow an affront on them. For that I appreciate your piece. The problem I have is that it comes off as an endorsement and a veiled attack on the opposing candidate’s supporters–as if that were a phenomenon unique to the Republican party. I assure you it is not and I have the e-mails, IM’s, and blog comments to prove it.
I give you the benefit of the doubt that this was not your intent though. I’m just trying to explain why such a piece received some of the reactions that it did. The negative associations throughout your piece solely of the Republican party seem like a one-sided attack. I think you would find that making the piece politically neutral, it would be something that we all could agree with, regardless of party line.
Even though this article came from someone on the other side of the aisle. I appreciate it. I feel like you’ve spoken to my frustrations over the last few weeks.
This is the ugly face of intolerance, which is what Obama and his camp have been deliberately planting in America since the beginning of the campaign. I’ve just posted an article on this yesterday and hope that more people will realize how divisive Obama has really been and how much damage his campaing has already brought to our society.
http://drslogan.wordpress.com/2008/11/02/the-true-name-of-barack-obamas-change/
Well, Antigone, we seem to be of a similar age. Yeah, Lincoln Park…the ghost of Abbie Hoffman must be laughing his ass off
And of all the things I could say about Clinton, “racist” would be the last thing I could come up with. I’m voting against Obama because of his policies, not his color, and I’m tired of being called racist. Good thing is, like the boy who cried “wolf”, the day is coming when the race card is meaningless. We survived the 70′s and we’ll survive whatever happens tuesday. A lot of people today have no historical perspective, so they can’t tell “bad” from “real crappy”.
Though I vote repub, I am conservative first. I remember Scoop Jackson, humphrey, and other dems of conscience and reason. I’m afraid Joe Lieberman is the last of that breed.
I’m a little wary of what will happen when Obama doesn’t live up to his promises. The crowd has a way of turning on messiahs that don’t meet expectations.
As the years roll by, I get more and more folks talking about “friendship” as the ultimate human endeavor. I think it’s a boomer angst gambit to settle a lot of subconscious uneasiness. How do I know this, because it’s usually (after drawing people out a bit) the “unconditional” nature of it that they deem so special. This really gripes me.I tell them “unconditional” is for babies and puppy dogs. I ask them “do you think that if you told me you hit someone over the head with a lead pipe for no reason I’d ever talk to you again?” They just look a me…and then get a little mad, but they never answer.
Politics should be discussed openly and honestly. People’s education on politics, and especially philosophy are watermarks of their characters. Take someone that uses terms like ‘the greater good.’
They are collectivists, and have sacrificial mentalities. These are the same people that want to raise or redirect your taxes for their programs that they believe in. Who’s going to pay for those programs? Blank out.
Politics is the essence of man. When in mass, it represents his finest stupidities. You can see this in the way people compose themselves at campaign rallies; ready to be steered by Caesar at the raise of a hand.
In the individual, politics represents their resolve for the system as they believe it should be. And, that’s always great, just so long as you don’t drag me into your hair-brained scheme for the ‘sake of the greater good.’
I can be friends with people that think we should talk more to foreign powers. I can be friends with the ones that think negotiations backed by superior firepower are the way to go. I can be friends with people that think those making over $250K a year should pay more in taxes, although it’s harder to be friends with those that think that money should be a handout to the nonworking. I can be friends with people that think it’s ok for gays to marry, or who think it’s not. I can NOT be friends with people who think it is ok to kill babies, their own or other peoples. And Obama is SO far to the left on this issue that a vote for him goes against the fundamental values of my core being to such a degree that I will be more distant and drift away if I know you voted for him. Just like I could never be friends with a pedophile, no matter what other attributes they had.
Something to think about. Morals are very very important to some people, and rightly so.
I’m in Canada, and in our recent election, all of my friends voted NDP or Green party (left to far-left). One of my friends starts lecturing me about the evils of corporations and capitalism almost every time we are together. Sometimes I things get heated, but we won’t stop being friends. Maybe things are just different up here, although I know many people on both sides of the aisle who act the way this article is talking about. Mostly hardcore party liners.
“Boris, it’s probably best not to take these folks too seriously. The regulars here are the militia types who believe that Obama wasn’t born in Hawaii, isn’t a Christian, and will dispatch his Nubian overlords to enslave America’s white women.”
lol, I know. Mostly I make fun of the paranoia, but considering that Michael Savage gets 3 million listener, there are a lot of these people out there. And that scares me.
susan:
There it is – the charge of racism. Thanks for showing your true colors.
I understand how you feel. Between my two closest friends, one is voting Obama, and one McCain. My mother is voting for Obama. I am voting for McCain. While my mother wants to have screaming matches with me in an issue of politics, we can separate ourselves and tell each other jokes, and even laugh at SNL skits together. My friend voting for Obama and I have had very civilized discussions of why we are voting for our candidates, and she is still a dear friend I love, and can agree with on everything else, from our favorite novels to movies, and to music. It is such a shame to see friendships go over a vote.
momof3:
Morals are important to me as well. So is intelligence. Looks like we are not destined to become friends.
Oh, you sad sad people. I’m going to miss you after Tuesday.
The personal acrimony, divisiveness and political correctness that has seeped into American political life, both on the left and on the right, is really quite irritating. Having someone drop you from their friends list because of your political choice makes about as much sense as them dropping you because you don’t like the same kind of ice cream as them. Yes, its a stretch of an analogy, but the point is that each person’s choice is up to them and nobody else. To shun people because of their vote is petty and pointless. It doesn’t change the vote and you lose a friend in the process.
Michele, I think you would find some company on neo-neocon’s blog as her story is similar to yours, only from the opposite side of the fence. Personally, one of the things that I devilishly enjoy about being a libertarian is that I can claim fealty to neither “major political party” and I get to laugh at the partisanship on both sides. Ironicly, my friends who are suffering from partisanship are the last to see the partisanship displayed in their own behavior and conversation. Yet, I get to continue in the discussion because I’m one of those “third party kooks”. I’m neither voting “for” their guy or “for” their enemy.
The whole culture has been moving in this direction of increased acrimony, ad-hominem attacks and personalization of debate. The talking heads on TV don’t talk anymore, they shout and scream over top of one another. Its been a really long time since I’ve seen a civil discussion of politics in the media, whether it be “lefty” television or “righty” talk radio. Where is the likes of William Buckley’s “Firing Line” or the original CNN “Crossfire”?
Michele’s comments are apt because this year, there is an unusually deep cultural divide separating voters. This is not a purely political election; it’s about core values, the things we inherited from the Enlightenment.
Boris (25) asks whether anyone believes half the nation is actually made up of traitors; he’s ignoring the precedent of the Confederate States of America. Yes, is is thinkable because it can happen, and it will if the culture war gets hot enough. And yes, Boris (35), there are people who want to nuke NY, and while they are not Obama’s friends, the question as to whether he is their implacable, permanent enemy is legitimate (he wants to talk to them, which is frightening, because it’s an insane Utopian notion). The voters are entitled to require that their president be utterly committed to crushing Islamofascism. Obama is not rooted in that ethic; he seems to think any community can be organized into compliance. His naive attitude plays into the hands of fanatics and lunatics, and portrays the USA as weak and unable to commit to its self-defense. That invites attack.
Rotwang (60) is utterly mistaken when he states that this is a “standard” GOP-vs-Dem contest. It’s much deeper than anything in recent memory; we had a taste of it with the Kerry candidacy, and now things have moved from serious to critical. How the losing side reacts will determine just how critical. Erica Jong is predicting blood running in the streets if her side loses, which seems both unethical and insane — but then consider the source; the woman is deranged. Unfortunately she’s far from alone. For a rational counter to much of the nonsense here, see Jabba The Tutt’s questions (21).
You guys should read some of Michele’s other articles before you write her off as a moonbat. I personally wish Obama were less of a socialist and had more experience. I might see my way clear to vote for him. Unfortunately, his life history shows me he will do anything and associate with anyone to advance his career. I really don’t think he cares about the United States as a country. He wants to be admired. That is not surprising considering he was abandoned by his parents. He has learned to be likable as a defense mechanism to guard against being abandoned again. It is not surprising so many fall under his spell. Try this little experiment – listen to his words, then read the transcript of his words. His delivery will sway you much more than the words actually do.
i had a good friend, so I thought, that was (is) a democrat to his liberal core… He could never hold a job, borrowed more money than he could ever hope to pay back from friends and relatives, and spent more time dodging bill collectors than I ever thought. Maybe I was naive, and I paid for it dearly, and once I was no longer going to “help” him out any longer, (i.e. give him money, shelter, help to get on his feet again) He started going around behind my back to all our mutual friends telling them what a horrible friend and person I was. And yes, he is/was smooth enough to make them believe his side of the story.
Hard lesson for me, but in the end, a world view , political view, and philosophy of life do matter. This country was founded on the ideals of personal liberty through personal responsibility, and a vote is not a flippant thing that you casually throw around. At this stage of our history, it’s not like a minor disagreement on the color of the carpet, this is a point where we look to the Justices that will be retiring soon, to a war where brave young men and women sacrifice all, and how much influence the rest of the world should have on our decisions.
We are the “Shining City on a hill” and we are it’s keepers.. we should be fierce about the right to vote and who the vote is cast for. Should we lose friendships over it? Probably not, but I can’t fault them for being that passionate either- the stakes are too high.
I keep my yap shut when my lefty friends are talking politics.
If I have something to say about politics, I say it to my dog. He never argues, and I know he’ll still love me no matter who I vote for.
someone 75
the only racism in this election is from obamba and his horrible wife.
what true colors? your candidate is racist to the core
No, you’d have to do a bit more than vote for a candidate I disagree with to make me dislike you.
i lost a very good friend as a result of my voting for george bush. we’d been friends since grade school. it happens the other way too. it’s not just conservatives who are mean spirited, so don’t make it out like it is.
Susan – don’t waste your energy responding to Someone75. Each and every one of its posts are insulting and just downright childish. Someone75 is just out to be a pest. It reminds me of a really persistant bluebottle.
Whatever the result this week, at least trolls like Someone75 will drop off – no more funds from Soros. So, whatever happens, there is at least a small silver lining…
You’re voting for Obama, Michelle?
Why…You don’t provide any rationale or reasoning. You can’t even explain away, just like the other Obamites why a guy could sit 20 years in a pew listening to the most sickening “sermons” by a Nazi of color and not have either the guts, the decency or the brains to walk away.
I’m sorry – but you certainly WOULDN’T be my friend. It isn’t a case of Kerry or Dukakis here. This is a guy who HATES America and I do believe if not an anti-Semite himself sure gravitates towards ‘em.
One more thing here – and the Obama supporters can howl or curse. I don’t care, but character is key. Here’s a story to illustrate that:
When I was 17 the administration and the PTA of my high school in a Southern California suburb of Los Angeles decided to have its Senior All-Night Party at a Country Club that excluded Blacks, Jews, and Hispanics – but would allow them to grace their doors for that evening alone.
I got up at an assembly and blasted the administration and the representative of the Country Club for their “gentleman’s agreement” policies. Now, mind you, I’m Jewish, maybe if I were a good Christian (and ignoring and voting for the Obama types this wouldn’t matter, right?). But I wasn’t just speaking for myself, I was speaking for the Black kids and the Hispanic ones too.
They chose to have it anyway, and about half of the Black kids went, not many of the Hispanics or the Jews did, though. And there were a few brave Non-Jewish kids too, that chose not to participate despite – yes, a lot of pressure (I even felt it too) from friends who urged us to go.
I chose character and that has guided me since then – your guy doesn’t have that, gosh, he didn’t even have the guts after those 20 years to serve in our military, yet he knew how to associate with those who hate.
No, sorry Michelle, its character that counts, and our country, stupid.
A P.S.
Read “Audacity of Hope”?
I have…
This guy speaks much more highly of Senator Byrd, he of the 14 hour filibuster against the Civil Rights Act, he who refused to serve in the military if Blacks were present (something he and Obama really do have in common – reverse Racism and Cowardice), and he of the White Sheets and the Klan membership than he did of Abraham Lincoln, whom he practically called a Racist!
Is this someone you want as President? I don’t. But then again, besides speaking out against prejudice I was beaten by junior Klan types for being “Jewish Nigger Lover” – something a coward and friend of Jew haters like Obama could never figure out in a million years, especially with those Ayers, Khalidi and Wright associations.
Wow, the comments left here really prove your point, don’t they? People are so angry.
Mature people disagree with each other and still co-exist.
I thank you for your honesty and openness.
Now duck!
After reading a number of these posts I have to say that I am ashamed of conservatives now as much as liberals. Those who can not allow other people to think differently than themselves might as fold up the American flag and put it in a cupboard. It has lost it’s meaning.
Reagan would be ashamed of you all also.
Good articles but keep whoever you vote to yourself. Funny thing, I am the opposite, I always got attack by liberal so I learned the hard list and keep politic to myself.
After 8 years of being personally attacked, risking my job, and physical attacks and destruction of my property for voting republican, I have no sympathy for you Catalano. None. You’re more afraid of losing your east coast liberal friends by not voting for the maxist. So, suck it up, whiny!
You call me a racist, then you want me to be your friend. NOT!
I think it’s okay to lose friends over politics because politics is personal. If you are determined to “get in my face” with your opinions, then I have the right to not be your friend anymore.
Friendship is a gift. It is not something that you are entitled to or something that can be forced.
Michelle, you need to grow up. You are going to lose friends over your beliefs because it says something about who you are. If you are an Obama supporter, then you should be naturally drawn to friendships with other Obama supporters. If you aren’t, this should tell you something.
You can work and be cordial with anyone, regardless of their political beliefs. This is basic civility. But when you get into the realm of true friendship, there has to be a common bond as the basis for the friendship.
Obama’s Socialist agenda and radical ties are really troubling to me. In fact, down right scary. I have spoken to people who I know are Obama supporters and quite interestingly, none of these people are my close friends. And now I know why. We have extreme philosophical differences. It’s impossible to have a close relationship with someone who is at the other extreme in their views. Oil and vinegar don’t mix.
This is the reality, Michelle, and you and everyone else need to accept it.
TO: Ex-fetus, et al.
RE: Indeed
You can’t separate politics from Life. You CAN learn not to despise people because they have a different political philosophy from yours. It’s part of christian ethics not to hate other people. And REAL christians practice that.
RE: The REALLY Stupid People….
…can’t understand that you can’t separate politics from morality. As all Law is based, directly or indirectly, on the morals of the society.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Those who would treat politics and morality apart will never understand the one nor the other. -- John, Viscount Morley of Blackburn]
TO: Okie Sister
RE: Really?
What if one discovered that the other was violating the law to pervert the election process? Or some other aspect of the Bill of Rights?
Would you just say, “Okay. Whatever….”? Or would you turn the bat-rastard over to the police?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Those who believe that the ends justify the means will always prevail over those who believe in the rule of law, if those who enforce the law allow them. -- CBPelto]
I’ll always love you Michele. We go back too far in the ‘net’ world for a vote to affect that cyber-relationship. That being said, my issue with your vote is not so much that you voted for Obama (my brother and parents voted for Obama as well) but WHY. You wrote:
A vote for Obama is not a vote against you. It doesn’t mean I think less of you. It just means that I’ve weighed my options and I took into account my own life, my own situation, my family, concerns and he turned out to be the best candidate for me.
This is where we differ. I have to consider which candidate is going to best for the COUNTRY, not just me. People like my brother cannot fathom why Joe The Plumber is voting for McCain when he’d get a bigger piece of the pie (right now) under Obama. It’s because JTP believes that McCain will be better for the United States, not just for him. That’s what I believe as well.
Obama is not a Jewish hater. Where do you all get this from. Just because the guy wants to take all positions in to account does not make him someone who hates Jews. He is a rational man who realizes that there are two sides to every story. The Palestians have benn messed over pretty royally as well. They were ejected from their homeland as they see it they have a legitimate right to be upset. I’m not saying that it is okay for radicals to strap a bomb to themselves and blow up innocents. The Koran says to kill one innocent is like killing all of humanity. To truly bring peace, we need to bring all sides to the table and see some common ground. If this page is representative of how the nation is divided, I fear we will never get to that point.
One more thought, if we want to achieve true racial harmony, all parties involved should feel a little uncomforatable because if you are too comfortable, someone else is extremely uncomforatable. This the essence of compromise and tolerance.
CAN’T we all get along?
I have one question? How does it make sense to liken Obama toa Nazi? Last I heard, the Nazis were just as willing to kill a black person as a Jew. Look at the propaganda put out by the Nazi regime depicting black as crazy ape like creatures who are intent of raping white wome. Just a question?
Calling a black person a Nazi is rather like calling Boston Red Sox fan a Yankee lover.
People, people, get real. I have one last thing to say, conservatives are not evil, I just think you are wrong. You think I am wrong. Okay, let’s agree to disagree. Now that we are 24 hours out from deciding a new president, let start a real dialogue designed to create solutions.
Peace
TO: concerned
RE: Yeah???!?!?
That’s why all those Koran loving Muslims keep killing women and children in Iraq, India, Pakistan, 9/11. Right?
What if one side bring firearms to the table?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[You cannot have peace when any side insist on war. -- CBPelto]
Boris, Someone75, Rotwang (these may all be the same person),
Why does this being nice and gracious only apply to conservatives? I would bet there’s not a similar article on DailyKos, TPM, firedoglake, HufferPost, etc. today. The only thing you see there is hate, hate, hate. The ultimate destruction of conservatives. Sow their fields with salt. Etcetera, ad nauseam.
I lived in Seattle in 2004. My co-workers were all Kerry supporters. When Bush won handily, there was despair and anger. One person learned I was happy with the election results and went on a profanity-laced tirade, at loud volume, and in the middle of the office. This was someone I had worked with for years, and the relationship, for me, was always colored by that rant. I know the feeling of not wanting to be friends or acquaintances was mutual after that, but I would have left it alone otherwise. Others, after learning of this, were not disgusted by his display, but glad for it. Just being inclusive of their idea, I guess. It certainly would have been easy to gloat and rub it in, but I was raised better. I know these same people would not hesitate to gloat had Kerry won.
Anytime you (singular) go to the loony left blogs I will expect you to apply your minimally sardonic wit to chastise them accordingly for their racist, intolerant, kooky rants. Please paste a copy of your screeds back so we can see them.
Thanks
Chuck,
You are refereing to a small percentage of Muslims.
Thank you Chuck, you have just convinced me that there is not point try to bridge a gap or extend an olive branch. I’m officially done with this forum because this is not about dialogue. It is about fear, blame and insults.
Small mindedness is the root of societal decline. When we label people and put them into boxes, we fail to see their humanity. Chuck, I see your humanity and I will pray for you and every closed minded American, liberal or conservative. You are all part of the problem. I will work on solutions from here on out.
TO: Alan Rockman
RE: Choose Your Friends….
….carefully.
After all, you tell your friends everything in complete candor. Because you should be able to trust your friends. They won’t rat you out.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Be slow in choosing a friend, slower in changing. -- Benjamin Franklin]
Good article, Michelle. I couldn’t agree more about friends who put politics before friendship.
But I also agree with some of the previous commenters: Try posting this article on some of the left’s favorite websites. Honestly, they need the lesson more than we do.
Remember the old saw: Conservatives think liberals are stupid; liberals think conservatives are evil.
TO: get real
RE: Try….
….to live UP to your nom des blogs.
RE: The Few, The Proud….
….The Mass Murderous
’nuff said on that.
By the way, do you walk down dark alleys in bad parts of New York City at night spreading peace and love? What do the denizens of such say in reply? Does it sound something like, “STFU and give me your money and watch”, while they display their instruments of ‘peace and love and redistribution’?
RE: Seekers of the Real
Spoken like a true ‘seeker’ of what’s real. Indeed, you just proved the point made by Okie Sister (above).
You’re not really interested in discussion. You’re just so much bombast and short temper with no patience for honesty. Anyone points out a fallacy in your position and you pick up your marbles, what few there are, and run away.
RE: A Monty Python Moment, Anyone?
Run Awaaaaayyyyy!!!!
RE: Small Mindedness….
You’re a fine example of that. Can’t stand and hold a position to save your soul.
RE: The Power of Prayer
The only closed-minded person I see in this discussion is you. And you’re projecting your lack of open-mindedness on anyone who points out errors in your REALity.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[A conservative is a liberal who has been mugged by reality.]
P.S. I doubt your promise to pray. Or if you do pray, it probably isn’t to the God, I’m familiar with….
Boris.
To paraphrase, your time of self congratulatory arrogance is nearly at an end, Boris.
People like you in the discourse are moving me, and people like me, to a state of mind that does not bode well for you and your ilk. You take that any way you like.
On topic, I have been saddened by the breaking of at least one friendship over this polarized election climate. If it is proven that Obama and the People’s Democratic Party really are the lying, fascist thugs I believe them to be(that would be you, Boris), then the destruction of a 20+ year relationship is doubly disheartening, because the break arises from a fabric of lies you people weave and because my lost friend is, after all, a weak minded sheep unworthy of friendship. Damn your eyes, both of you, for that.
Unlike the schism that wrought the Civil War, our current crop of traitors lives amongst us, are our very neighbors. There is no single region of the nation where the enemies of liberty reside apart from the rest of us, as was the case when the South seceded in 1861. If we again ever enter into the fratricide of the last watering of the Tree of Liberty, we will not have far to go to meet our foes, because we are in the same towns, on the same block. Lost friendships will then be known as the luxury that they are.
TO: Bugs, et al.
RE: The Conservatives vs. The
Liberals….er….’Progressives’You remind me of that other adage….
I’m confident that if the
Liberals….er….’Progressives’ take the Executive and Legislative branches of the government tomorrow, that we’ll see this played out.Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Liberals aren't. Progressives won't.]
P.S. The ‘Progressives’ are ‘projecting’…..
My parents (one Republican one Democrat) raised me to believe my vote was personal and private however I grew up listening to them debate each other and finaly one was won over. (They are now both registerd Rebulicans) I thought it would be possible to have a rational debate and tried to discuss opposing political views with my neighbors only to be shunned. The final comment from a neighbor was to go ahead and put a McCain*Palin sign in my lawn – only if I wanted my house to be egged. So much for open communication of ideas.
Discussion: an exchange of views on some topic; “we had a good discussion”;
I would like to have one. Does anyone know of a page I can go to discuss issues? This is not a discussion. Heck this is not even a debate. This is a people attacking each other.
I had a conservative friend. We had heated debates. We attacked each others points not teach other. Also, we listened with open minds acknowledging that we might be able to learn something form each other. I will say that I have become a fiscal conservative due to her arguements that made sense. She learned to see affirmative action in a different light as a result of our interactions. Before she died, she said to me, “I so am glad that I have a black friend like you who has helped me see another side of the issue. To often I have been attacked for not understanding. Thank you for being patient.” I wish I had told her the same.
In the end it is about respect. If two people respect each other, they will avoid hurting each other’s feelings, listen to each other, and find common ground when possible. It is not easy but it is doable. To my conservative friends, please don’t give up on me and I will not give up on you.
TO: concerned
RE: Actually….
A LOT of this IS ‘debate’. Debate IS attacking points of discussion.
If you want ‘teaching’. You have one of two choices:
[1] LISTEN to what the other side is saying and learn from them if their points are valid.
[2] Get thee to a school that TEACHES things you don’t already believe and LISTEN to what they have to say.
Indeed, you are already in an excellent environment to ‘learn’ something, if you have the courage to face up to the idea that other people have ideas that are different from yours and could well be right….if they can prove their point.
The biggest problem I’ve noticed in ‘progressives’ is that they can’t stand being proven wrong. And because of that, they tend to run awaaaayyyy like so-called ‘get real’ (above).
RE: R – E – S – P – E – C – T!
Really? Just ‘respect’? Then why don’t the ‘progressives’ respect conservatives?
Rather, I argue it’s about reality. Respect is part of it, if you want to learn something. But the bottom line is having a better understanding of reality when the dust settles; win, lose or draw.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[He has not learned the lesson of life who does not every day surmount a fear. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson]
TO: concerned
RE: As Evidence….
….about ‘respect’, I offer KMJ’s comment (immediately above your previous)…
Progressives do not respect ANYONE except their own. And that’s typical totalitarianism, which they are.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Are we learning yet?]
Michele,
I am not voting for Obama. You are not losing friends because you voted differently. How could they be friends if they do not allow you to think for yourself?
My experience has been that a number of people no longer have anything to do with me socially because I do no not agree with them politically. I don’t miss them at all. However, I have plenty of friends who are voting for Obama and it hasn’t hurt our friendship.
You will find out this is an effective screen to keep bigots out of your life.
I hope your candidate finishes second.
Your friend,
Lefty Flynn
The day after the 2004 election, I got an e-mail from one of my two very best lifelong friends, a one-liner: “I’m ashamed to be an American.” I sent back a short note saying how glad I was that we’d managed to maintain such a close friendship over the years as our political preferences had diverged. Two days later I got back a 5-6 page stream-of-consciousness rant, blaming me, personally, for pretty much every ill in the world, past, present, and future. Being perverse, as I can be, I’ve continued to send her occasional e-mails: photos of my kids, stories of my dog, whom she was great friends with, the occasional forwarded joke that I know she would love. But nothing back from her in almost all that time. Nothing quite like being thrown away by someone who I love like a sister.
TO: concerned
RE: Are We Learning Yet?
More evidence of how the ‘progressives’ “respect” those who disagree with them….
I can recall when one progressive figured out that I was a {HORROR!} Christian. They looked at me like I’d just sprouted horns, cleft hooves for feet and a long skinny tail.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out....]
You are what you vote.
There’s no way that a true conservative and a true liberal can be friends. They are at the extremes ideologically. If you talk about your views, you will argue constantly. (Who wants this headache?) If you don’t talk about your views, you are not being completely honest with each other. At most, you will be friendly acquaintances. But, true friends? NO.
We don’t pick our relatives. We don’t always pick who we work with. But we can pick our close friends.
TO: Theresa
RE: Let Me Guess…
….you’re a ‘progressive’. I say this because only a progressive would have such a low opinion of human nature.
Personally, despite all the failings I’ve found in progessives to date, I still have hope that a few of them can rise above their group’s predilection for hating other people.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Each one of us, ultimately, chooses the high or the low road -- that is, we rise above the madness of our particular culture and discover our true identity and destiny, or else we identify with our insane culture and revel in it. -- David Kupelian]
Ferdinand Chetler and Sheila:
Conservatives polite? Are you kidding me? I get flamed all the time. Just for posting legitimate positions that are contrary to what is written here. Yeah, sometimes I enjoy poking fun at people like Susan who are so transparently ignorant that I don’t understand how they can be living in the year 2008, but when I started posting, it was totally harmless.
Your people have been nothing but hostile, with a couple exceptions. Take a look at your own before you start pointing fingers.
TO: Someone75
RE: Flambéd?
Maybe it has something to do with the way you comport yourself, e.g.,
And all she did was cite the good reverend Wright. Are saying Wright is not a racist?
You see? A solid case could be made of your projecting.
Hope that helps…..
…or are you going to claim I’m flaming you too?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson]
The answer to Michelle’s question is easy. Some people have values that are not negotiable. Anyone attempting some sort of emotional blackmail (change your stance or I won’t be your friend) has proven themselves to be no friend at all.
Toss some hostility into the mix, and it’s easy to make an enemy. If that’s the price, so be it.
I have found that the two questions that get me in trouble with friends and neighbors for Obama are “tell me what Obama has done to prepare him for the Presidency in 2008″ and when the attack on Sarah Palin comes I then ask them “to tell me what Obama’s accomplishments are and compare them to Palin’s.” They aren’t my friends any more. It’s funny because my friends who can articulate something positive about Obama never go off after Palin and we are still friends.
When anybody goes after Palin I always tell them the following story about Winston Churchill:
Churchill is at dinner party and a minor baroness comes up to him and says “Mr. Churchill, shame on you. You are drunk.” Churchill retorts. “Madame, you are correct I am drunk but you are ugly. We shall both go home to bed tonight and when I awake I shall be sober but you will still be ugly.”
Moral: No matter what happens on Tuesday, Sarah Palin will be with Governor of Alaska or Vice President of the United States. We will remain pudknockers.
The people who are still my friends generally get the point whereas those who get insulted at being call nobodys go away mad.
I appreciate and respect your remarks Michelle. Please, as far as I’m concerned, the most important thing of all is that you vote.
(But, if Obama gets elected and it turns out badly, I do reserve the privilege of emailing you and saying “Neener, Neener”.)
Happy Election Day!
Check this out, picked it up on HotAir – just in case you had any doubts these trolls are nothing but paid blowholes
http://rightwingchicky.wordpress.com/2008/11/02/so-the-goal-is-to-create-apathy/
Keep your head up!! Anybody who will shun you as a friend becuse you didn’t vote the way they do has some serious mental issues.
Throughout history the country only progressed becuase people of all poltical stripes worked together. When they didn’t (say over the last 30 years starting with Reagan) things go to heck real quick and stay there.
All you can do is be yourself. It’s not your faul those people have decided to live in a hole.
Anyone who uses your vote against you doesn’t believe in the America our founding fathers left us. It’s one of the most un-american things someone can do.
TO: BravoRomeoDelta
RE: Indeed
I’m working on some t-shirt and bumper-sticker ideas all of them will say “Don’t Blame Me” with one of the following pictures:
• A bleeding Iraq
• A nuke cloud over Washington DC, NYC, LA, Las Vegas, Miami, or any other likely target
• A electrical bill for $1000
I’m open to other suggestions of what we can expect from an OPR [Obama-Pelosi-Reid] administration….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[If you think things are bad now, just wait until The One fixes them.]
Hey-
I get the same response when I tell my friends I am voting for McCain.
You’re voting for OBAMA!
Why, why, (SPUTTER, . . . . SPUTTER!) why you . . . .!
I’LL NEVER READ ANY OF YOUR STUFF AGAIN, SO THERE!
Nah. Just kidding.
My Ex and I are still good friends, and she’s disappointed I’m voting for McCain, but I explained to her — she’d always been an avid fan of Ayn Rand — theat I refused to vote for “The Ghost of Ellsworth Twohey.”
For those of you not familiar with Rand, Ellsworth Twohey was the leftist college prodessor who is one of the chief antagonists in “The Fountainhead,” a much more realistic and prescient book than the oft-touted “Atlas Shrugged.” Twohey is the embodyment of modern lefty academia, and Obama is, as someone more articulate than I stated, an effet academic weakling with — to me — a striking similarity to Twohey.
I think it’s reprehensible that some would shun you because of your choice for President.
Question your judgment? Yes. Remove you from the list of possible trustees for my kids inheritance? Of course.
But shun? Why remove a proven source of entertainment.
I’ve ended friendships with liberal friends in my 20s because I could no longer put up with their drug-taking, complaining, whining way of life. We had nothing meaningful in common.
Now, I put up with some democrats but our view of life is so different, it’s very difficult to find any common ground. How can you have a friendship in such a situation. So we enjoy the same coffee? We each like baseball?
Big deal. The structure of our political system and whether we are going to keep our constitution as is, IS important to whether or not we can be friends.
To use a wildly exaggerated example to demonstrate that losing a friend by the way they vote is not necessarily outrageous, consider this: Would you continue considering someone a “friend” who voted for a Nazi candidate? What about for a Stalinist? Yes, I agree, the more explanation is simple discomfort with differences in thought, but again, how important one’s politics are is a very personal thing.
Nobody knows who I vote for but me.
It’s a good way not to loose friends.
Politics and religion go to the very fundamental beliefs of a person, attacking either *is* attacking the person. When you speak of either, you reveal fundamental things about you.
What you reveal may show people that you are not the person they thought you were.
I think this phenomenon is largely due to the fact that our options are so bad. If you are voting for Obama, you are voting for some really bad ideas. If you are voting for McCain, you are voting for some, other, really bad ideas. I voted _against_ the guy I think is more dangerous, not _for_ anyone. I get the impression that this is true of many people. If the only reason a person votes for McCain, is because she is horrified at the idea of Obama being President, it starts to make a bit more sense that she feels that a vote for Obama is an attack on her well-being. Or vice-versa.
I was a Teenage Republican, organized my county for Nixon in 1972. But, in my life I’ve voted for candidates, not parties. So, when my Democratic friends try to “out me” (their phrase, not mine) as a Republican, I declare myself an independent and am certain I’ve voted for more Dems than they’ve voted Republican. Who are they to characterize me?
This is the sort of thing I hope NOT to hear from McCain supporers: 1) on inauguration day 2001, a close Democrat friend declared, “He’s not my President;” 2) I was in a coffee shop in Fargo, ND on a day when there was an anti-war demonstration on the bridge between North Dakota and Minnesota. Four participants of that demonstration came in and loudly carried on a conversation in which a) one declared, “Condeleesa Rice is not a human; she’s a lizard.” And, another said, “I’ve told everyone who might have a say — family, friends, co-workers — that when I die, I want to be cremated and my ashes dropped in the Pacific. It isn’t why you think; I don’t want my atoms mixed with the soil of this country.
I have never heard Republicans, conservatives, or other independents say such hateful things.
I think that holding to such fundamental decency will lead the country in the right direction.
We are better than that, and that is why we may win. And, the “we” is our country, not a party.
Obama won. McCain lost. Feel for tose who supported McCain. He is a great American and I believe he would have been a good president. Now let’s move forward together. There is a lot of work to be done to rebuild this country. America is the greatest country in the world because we find a way to come together.
I know that some of you will point out the error in my message but I know severl of you will agree with me even if you disagree with my politics.
My best friend is a farmer, a rancher and lives in a rural part of the Rockies. I was raised in the same social climate yet I live hundreds of miles away and own my own business. He voted for Obama and I did not. His reasons are his own and mine are my own.
He drinks his coffee black and I like cream and sugar.
He is my friend. I love him as if he were my brother and that will always remain.
chuck pelto, thanks for reading between the lines of the idiot pest stupid75.
Bringing up rev wright made him pronto scream at RAAAAACISM. And we all know that this is the symptom of the “no other subject disease”.
Other than that, I specifically searched for a conservative blog/forum because I stand there politically even if i am european and I can only add my 2 cents from abroad. I frankly cannot understand why the usual pests join the subject to bring nothing but hatred and ridicule. I bet in their gestapo run blogs and forum nobody from the republican side is even allowed.
But this how the world is, the leftist idiots hate you but they come back to you all the time.
Dear Ms. Catalano,
It is entirely appropriate that friends should separate over such basic issues as freedom, property rights, gun ownership, national security and taxes. These policies affect, profoundly affect, our lives, and more importantly, the lives of our children.
I do not take personal umbrage at your choice. I am not personally offended. My reaaction would be to disassociate myself from you because I despise the choices you have made for me and my family. It is unfortunate that your choice cannot bind only you. It must bind me as well. That, and not personal umberage, breaks the bond.
Fairwell Michelle, we hardly knew ye.
Yep, Been there. I lost friends who were very close, “bestest-buddy” kind of friends, over politics. It hurt. One I lost basically because I said I liked listening to Rush Limbaugh and agreed with him a lot of the time.
The other I’m not sure why, but he seemed offended that I thought the War on Terror was necessary and was being done for the right reasons. He never told me why, just sent an E-mail saying he wouldn’t communicate with me any more, and the reason was “obvious to a person with a modicum of intelligence” So he ended our friendship with an insult. I miss the good times we had before that happened, and I find myself keeping my views to myself, or only sharing them with people of like mind. I’m not sure if that’s a good thing. Perhaps this is the reason these subjects have been called unfit for polite company: Politics, Money, Sex, Religion.
If you find that friends leave you because of who you vote for. They are not your friends. Period. My friends and I have agreed to disagree. And those who go?…go..you were never a friend in the first place.
TO: Susan
RE: Der Gestapo Blogs
I put a hash-mark on the camouflage band of my helmet for every jump I made, when I was in the Army.
If I put such a mark on my monitor for every one of their blogs, and those of atheists, I’ve been kicked/banned/killed on, I’d need to by a bigger display monitor. Like 38″….
Everybody ought to have a hobby. Besides, they make for good, ‘mind-clearing’ entertainment between bouts of debugging code…..which is what I’ve been doing over the last 24 hours.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Like punning, programming is a play on words.]
I know where the writer is coming from. I’m an academic and to them the idea that someone would not be liberal is just so foreign as to be on another planet. Several members of my graduate committee, ie, they had strong influence over my career, were raving moonbat liberals. That’s okay. I never talked about politics at work, and if they ask, say ‘of course i voted for your candidate X’. For the last two elections my wife and i have canceled each other out voting wise (not so this time), and it didn’t really affect our relationship. To me, i act like a democrat but vote republican, and she acts like a republican and votes democrat. I should be surprised that some people are so shallow as to equate personal beliefs with friendship, but I’m not.
Speaking from the other side of the fence.. democrats were as guilty, if not more, of shunning McCain voters than vice versa. But being the bigots we are characterized we have more reason to (sarcasm). The tolerant/inclusive/progressive Democratic voters (more sarcasm) have none.
I am late to join this discussion as I just found you on twitter, was moved by your tribute to Kitty, and looked you up. I am a psychotherapist, and heard of a colleague whose patient had a meltdown after the therapist’s offhand mention of listening to Rush Limbaugh. Nothing the therapist said re: listening to both sides of issues, embracing our differences, it’s a free country, etc., assuaged the patient’s devastation at being “tricked and betrayed”.
Of course, the dynamics in therapeutic relationships are special, redolent with transference, which requires that therapists measure our word. Still, I can’t help but wonder something similar isn’t taking place when friends trash friendships over the vote.
Jamie I think you are talking to me because your e-mail was after mine about 30 min or so and you did mention Rush Limbaugh. Anyway you are right that my ex friend has mental problems or just depressed for various reasons. I mentioned something about his behavior after Obama was elected. And he became very bitter, and senitive about me mentioning his being down. And started doing the old turn it around and make it look as if I was the one who was down and depressed. He started saying things like. You hate every thing white and christian.It got ugly. There is not much one can do with someone who thinks Obama is the anti christ,and thinks he is a terriorist.
I thought the loosing friends article was very good I have lost friends over politics. I read the comments by some right wingers and it is some of the same crap they say Obama is a socialist, he was not born here. And on and on. The problem no one is talking about is why they think this way. It’s because they have been told by Fox news, Rush Limbaugh and others that these things are true. I am going to be rude and say that you right winger have got to pull your head out of your ass and get the real truth and stop being so dam blind. WHY DO YOU THINK THEY ARE TELLING YOU ALL THIS STUFF? TO GET ELECTED.
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