The Consequences of Media Failure: Demopaths Setting the Global Agenda
Mind you, it’s not like Rosemary is a wallflower, incapable of interrupting people and giving them a hard time. Here she is with Israeli spokeswoman Miri Eisin during the Lebanon war of 2006.
Not only will she interrupt, she’ll do so with a ludicrous claim that Israel could just shoot the thousands of rockets coming from Lebanon out of the sky — no need to endanger Lebanese civilians even if Hizbullah uses them as human shields. Eisin is in such profound “apologetic” mode that it doesn’t even occur to her to say something like: “Excuse me? What did you say? Where are you getting your information?”
So rather than challenge his comparison of Israel to the Nazis and Gaza to a concentration camp, Rosemary reads him Mark Regev’s comment that Gaza is not in a state of humanitarian crisis and asks for his response — which essentially is a repeat of his previous remarks, with emphasis on “love for the whole world.”
By this point in time, the footage of the fellows on Qashoo’s boat singing a jihadi song — promising the Jews that Muhammad’s army was coming back to do to them what he did to the Jews of Khaybar (i.e., massacre the men and sell the women and children into slavery) — was released.
And if she, or anyone else at CNN, had done their homework and looked carefully, they would have seen Osama himself waving his fist with the rest of the peace-loving group.
In other words, Qashoo is a particularly unambiguous case of a demopath: someone who presents himself and his companions as pacifists and lovers of humanity even as he chants jihadi songs about wiping out whole populations. Even to Church he shows his hand, by claiming that nothing will stop them, and that they will treat the Israelis as pirates if they try. Demopathy is perhaps jihad’s greatest weapon, precisely because we are so receptive to claims of good will and peaceful intent. Identifying demopaths is one of the most pressing needs of the 21st century, and one of the reasons for that importance is that behind the demopathic façade that invokes human rights and respect for the Muslim minority lies another reality.
This song the fellows on the Mavi Marmara were singing is not just an oddity of that group. It’s a chant of global jihad, sung right under the noses of progressive protesters in the U.S., in the streets of Europe, and around the world. Perhaps the most notable occasion was in London in February 2006, when crowds promising the Europeans a holocaust chanted it in front of the Danish Embassy. These folks made no bones about their intention: their signs promised to bring Europe its very own, well-deserved holocaust. The poetic fancy of the ditty, translated into the European idiom, was visible on a number of signs:
“EUROPE YOU’LL COME CRAWLING WHEN THE MUJAHADIN COME ROARING.”
If Church, or anyone at that billion-dollar operation, had done even the slightest amount of research, she could have embarrassed Osama with some well-chosen questions. Of course it doesn’t help that the current administration doesn’t even want to discuss these matters.
Church, therefore, along with many others, cannot identify a demopath lying to her face, and certainly cannot flush one out with well-informed, hard questions. Indeed, rather than pursue Qashoo’s threat to treat the Israelis as pirates as a clue to his intentions, she actually eggs him on: “Well, Osama, Israel does want to stop you.”
Point of order:
This is not a question of media “failure”, as indicated in the title of the article. It is, in fact, a question of the media actively participating in anti-Israel, anti-West and anti-American disinformation and propaganda.
Indeed Rusty Bill.
Mr. Landes:
I am so happy that I discovered this…it makes laugh so much!!
what difference does it make if the media is not talking as much
about Iran, North Korea and or Muslims killing each other..
does this give Israel the right to excute people point blank like they did?
Look here Richard: the following government and Organization
are terrorists, murders and dispacable
Hamas
Egypt
Jordan
Hezbulla
Sauid Arabia
Iran
Yemen
Somalia
Iraq
Sudan
did I mention Syria
the crme these governments commited againsy humanity is unspeakable
However Mr. Landes in case if you did not know the crimes the Israeli government commited to humaity puts Nazi to shame.
There you have it
“However Mr. Landes in case if you did not know the crimes the Israeli government commited to humaity puts Nazi to shame.
There you have it”
The question is , is she delusional or is she uninformed. Since I think that you are informed, you must be delusional. Why not throw in blood libel and organ theft while you’re at it.
Israel in its whole history hasn’t done 1/1000th of the terrible things you moslems do to each other in a week. The number one cause of death for moslems is other moslems. The number one cause of suffering for moslems is other moslems. If moslem societies were any good people would be clambering to go to live in those countries. Instead they are clambering to get out of those countries.
Please check your Hijab, it must be wrapped around your head too tight.
I’d love to see miriam attempt to prove that Israel has attempted to take over half a continent, attacked peacefull countries without warning, and killed 10′s of millions.
OF course, she does continually claim that killing a half dozen jihadists who attacking Israeli soldiers is way worse than killing hundreds of innocent civilians.
As time goes on, miriam gets more hysterical and more innaccurate.
First off Israel executed no one.
Secondly it’s hardly surprising that she wants to ignore hundreds of deaths in order to concentrate her hatred on Israel alone.
That’s one of the key characteristics amongst die hard anti-semites.
the crimes the Israeli government commited to humaity puts Nazi to shame.
By this statement alone, ms. miriam demonstrates that her hatred has totally melted her mind.
Can you name these crimes by Israel please? I would really like to see what you think is worse than what the Nazi’s did.
” I seek no victory, for the honor of my soul and character consists in deviating from the paths of fools, but not in conquering them. ” Maimonides
Simply ignore Maryam. She is only looking for attention. Sad really.
Have no problem what ‘word’ is used; as long as they continue to excute these nasty HAMSASS terrorist buggers. BTW helen isn’t there a barstool somewhere in Lebanon that’s missing you? Got a shinny new broom – want it for your ride home? Nothing but first class to match your style dearie!
So brave are these nasty dirty terroist buggers, that the next boat stopped and complied with Isreal instead of being humanly killed, heh.
WTF! I am amazed at your delusional comments, que miedra, I am very for Israel because as a nation they have to deal with people like yourself, pendejas. Que muhammad come caca, buey.
Oh Miriam…que lastima
Puts Nazi’s to shame huh?
So Israel gases men, women, and children on a daily basis and carries out experiments on POWs?
You’ll have to prove that Israel has managed to make more kills, and atrocities than Nazi Germany.
I’ve seen many posts that can only be described as “repellant” but this one might take the blue ribbon. The lengthy list of nations and organizations that you include are almost all unabashedly dedicated to destroying Israel and killing as many Jews as possible. Israel’s posture viz-a-viz these committed enemies as been one of almost total defense for sixty years. Your attempt at finding some sort of moral equivalence between these entities and Israel is odious to say the least. However anyone who can write “the crimes the Israeli government commited to humaity puts Nazi to shame” is either an institutionalized crank, a moral dwarf or an individual incapable of rational judgement and historical insight. If you want to propagandize for Hamas then by all means do so but leave such disgusting observations in the ideological gutter where they belong.
“does this give Israel the right to excute people point blank like they did”
What the hell does ‘excute’ mean?
I really marvel at how misinformation specialists like yourself think you can continue to operate in the modern world. We’ve all seen the videos. Terrorists tried to break a barricade. Their ship was peacefully boarded by soldiers carrying the minimum self-defense weapons, and the soldiers were attacked by terrorists on the ‘peace’ boat.
Nobody buys your lies.
do you drink as you type?..just wondering where the jibberish comes from.
There you are. Another example of moon god worship, and why it should be outlawed.
i think it may be possible that Miriam is being bitterly sarcastic(?).
if not, then we really do have an amazing, almost schizophrenic ability to recognize the unspeakable crimes against humanity committed by terror countries (listed) and still obsess over the killing of 9 jihadis. but it’s easier to read this as sarcasm. i this were published at the Huffington Post, then maybe…
miriam has been posting for several weeks. She’s dead serious. She actually believes this garbage.
oops. i guess i’m too generous. but then the contradictions in her post suggest a mind capable of holding radically different ideas in the forefront without any awareness of how they contradict.
Miriam Rove,
I do not know what crimes Israel has done in self-defense of at least 10 mortal attacks on her borders in sixty years. Has anyone attacked your house 10 times to kill all your family and push your family into the nearest large body of water? If you defended yourselves against murder of yourself and your loved ones, would that be a crime in your eyes? So not including what Israel did in self defense against mortal threats (hundreds of them) to its mortal existence, what exactly are these crimes that put the imperialistic Hitler and his Nazis to shame. (They took over or tried to take over at least a dozen countries, and no one on their borders was immune, except Switzerland bordering Austria). So what were these Israel crimes. Be specific please. And discount self-defense. That is not a crime.
2. miriam rove
“does this give Israel the right to excute people point blank like they did?”
point of FACT: Isreal navy REPEATEDLY asked them to stop before they boarded…which the flotilla IGNORED..repeatedly(navy was told to “go back to auswitch”..real nice bunch of people on that flotilla)!!
Then…now WATCH the video..as the first commandos get on board..before they start shooting…they are attacked with clubs, knives, ect…SOOO the commandos opened fire! How is this Israels fault??? Again reread what i just said..they were warned repeadely, then when boarded attcked first…
Seems like the flotilla didn’t want to take responsibility for there actions of ignoring warning or take responsibility for attacking first.
Flotilla could have listened to the warning and with nothing to hide been seached and on their way.
So again 2 questions:
1: How is this Isreals fault when the flotilla willfully ignored warning and the people on said floittila attacked first?
2: Wasn’t their mission (to help suffering people) more important than ignoring the warning and just be searched so they could more speedily get back to helping people??
Don’t confuse her with the facts. Its only going to cause her to have a wet spot on her prayer carpet.
miriam, you obviously have no conception whatsoever of the Nazis.
Nice hyperbole used to disguise a non existant argument.
The good news about CNN is nobody’s watching.
So glad no one is watching CNN. Sanchez glorifies all illegal aliens and all South American countries. I wonder why he doesn’t move back to Cuba where his family came from. Instead he stays here and tries to make America more like them. I doubt that Sanchez could even get a job on TV in Cuba or Venezuela.
The so-called “relief flotilla” would not have been launched if it’s sponsors had not been sure in advance that it would yield supstantial propaganda benefits. They could not had this assurance if they had not first vetted the opionin of the “elite” media and been reasonably sure that anything resulting from their actions would reflect badly on Israel. Had the flotilla been allowed to sail into port without challenge CNN and others would probably have headlined “Unchallenged flotilla landing shows weakness by Israelis and solidarity of pan-Arab coalition.
It is pretty clear that most of the international media and an increasing percentage of our political class have written off Israel and would be happy if it would somehow just go away. It reminds me of the scene in “Bad Day at Black Rock” where Spencer Tracy’s one-armed stranger tells John Ericson what he thinks of him. (If you recall most of the town wants Tracy dead because he is dredging up a terrible secret.)
“I know what your problem is. You’d like me to die quickly without wasting too much of your time, or quietly so you won’t be embarrassed or even thankfully so your memory of it won’t be too unpleasant.”
That is rapidly becoming the default position of our elites concerning Israel. Just go away and don’t make us think about it.
“The truth will never find its way to your tv” from “We con the world”.
Does anything need to be added?
Seems to me CNN get a crackpot to post an outrageous message and thereby divert attention from the thrust of the article i.e. CNN nice one!
Had to go the web to find a defintion of demopath, even wikipedia didn’t have it.
This site has a good defintion and description:
http://www.theaugeanstables.com/reflections-from-second-draft/demopaths-dupes/
Especially telling is this paragraph:
CHARACTERISTICS:
- Radical imbalance between their insistence on asserting their own rights, and their lack of interest in defending the rights of others.
- Moral rhetoric expressing great indignation when appealing for personal rights.
- Tendency to tell demonizing tales of the enemies (of “human rights”)
- Tendency to think in conspiratorial terms (they are conspirators themselves), and to project ill will onto opponents/enemies.
- Do minimal (required) work protecting the rights of others, especially opponents/enemies.
Wow, am I a dunce or what? I always thought that was the definition of Demo-CRAT.
I don’t know guys. You know, when I see Rosemary (with the sound off, of course) I get feelings that take me back to a time before I changed my ways. I’d kinda like to get her in the Rodeo position and see if I could hang on for 8 seconds!
She is hot, but the point is she is stupid. Plus, you have to call her by another name first, then hold on.
Ride’m cowboy!
Giddy up thar!
CNN? They’re still on the air?
This is “positioning – the battle for our minds” as some insider authors called it long ago. The name game.
Same thing in Australia. Illegal immigrants are ALWAYS called asylum seekers or refugees here. Um, no, until those legal determinations are made- they’re just boatloads of illegal immigrants.
Thank GOD we need not rely upon the cowardly butt-weasels of the American Establishment Media to defend ourselves and defeat the Islamic death cultists in the ongoing global JIHAD that they have openly declared upon us. We can do this ourselves, WITHOUT the likes of Helen Thomas, Robert Fisk, Dan Rather, the assorted traitorous scumbags at the New York TImes, Keith Oberman Matthews Maddow, The King of France, The King & Queen of Jolly Olde Englande, The American Entertainment Industry., Desmond Tutu, Kofi Annan, & Whoever is In Charge of the United (non-democratic) Nations at this point in time … … We can assure ourselves that the American People are ready to the challenge. We are not like the rest of the world. We are something different. Look out.
Israel will be ok, God’s got there back.
This is just more evidence of the MSM’s penchant for filling their news with press releases – especially when those releases agree with their own philosophical bent – shallow as it is. Church is no mental powerhouse – I envision her chewing bubblegum – and blowing bubbles during off camera time.
Given the meticulously & indisputably-established reality of the WWII Holocaust. Given the horror — the atrocity — of all that, how can we POSSIBLY be holding the miniscule Jewish state to these impossible double standards of sovereign conduct?
Answer: it is not US, it is the leftists, and the self-pitying Muslims, and the anti-American autocracies of this Earth that insist upon scapegoating of the Jews (and, thereby, America) for humanity’s problems.
Does any serious person believe that the workaday life of your average Muslim on the street would improve IN THE LEAST if Israel were to disappear tomorrow? Hell no!!! They would still be bloody basket cases. They would still be a MASS of unhappy, miserable, underperforming human beings. Even more so, because they will have destroyed the ONLY prosperous, democratic, liberal enclave in their midst.
STOP BLAMING ISRAEL FOR EVERYTHING THAT IS WRONG IN THIS WORLD!!!
Jews are blameless for all of this. Jews are a tiny minority of the world’s population. There is no “global” Jewish conspiracy — Okay? It does not exist. It never has existed. WAKE UP!
Aw, the Hell with it.
Enough is enough.
Too many cogent arguments are losing their effectiveness due to sloppy syntax, slothful spelling and poor punctuation; including this one.
We, the Grammar Ninjas, are imposing disciplinary action on language abuse in the cause of advancing correct thinking — which advances much more quickly when the communication is correctly stated.
In short, your argument loses its effectiveness if you don’t state your case properly.
We want to see the right argument prevail. Therefore:
1) We will see you when you post something like “How is this Isreals fault” (posted by steve4libertyinsc at post No. 3) — and we will point out that, first of all, it is “Israel,” not “Isreal” (although the argument could be made that Israel IS real); and, secondly, it should have read “Israel’s fault.” Learning proper possessives is NOT rocket science, and neither is proper spelling.
2) Those who are not native English speakers get a partial pass. That is, we Ninjas will correct you, but will allow a reasonable length of time to learn the proper presentation.
We hereby declare guerrilla warfare on lax language wherever we see it. This campaign includes writers of the original essay, as well as those who comment.
We are conservative to the core and, therefore, believe the conservative viewpoint is the correct one. We do not wish to be accused of operating on the same ignorant level as trolls. Our communications must reflect a higher standard. We believe that part of being conservative includes a belief that mankind constantly strives to elevate itself, and that includes all of its (not “it’s”) endeavors. Conservatives wrote the rules of good communication; it is incumbent on us to adhere to them. In that way, our viewpoint delivers the check-mate — the coup de grace — on our pitiful opponents, with force that cannot be matched.
You may consider the (admittedly) lengthy diatribe above to be a manifesto, of sorts. Herein, you will not see any more explanations. From now on, the Grammar Ninjas will operate by stealth. We do not wish to answer tiresome complaints of “small-mindedness” or “pedantry.” Correct language is correct language. From now on, you will see the following:
2. miriam rove
Mr. Landes:
[]…it makes laugh so much!!
“It makes laugh?”
Mark the Great’s repl[ies]:
” … attacked peacefull [only one L in "peaceful"] countries without warning, and killed 10’s [10s, no apostrophe] of millions.”
“As time goes on, miriam gets more hysterical and more innaccurate.” [should be "inaccurate"]
AtheistConservative
“does this give Israel the right to excute people point blank like they did”
What the hell does ‘excute’ mean?”
“Excute?” People who were formerly cute, but aren’t cute now?
chambers
I’ve seen many posts that can only be described as “repellant” but this one might take the blue ribbon.
It’s “repellent.”
Andy Gump (formerly Oscar the Grump)
Don’t confuse her with the facts. Its only going to cause her to have a wet spot on her prayer carpet.
Dude. “Its only going” should read as “it IS going” … which means you need an apostrophe.
4. Michael
miriam, you obviously have no conception whatsoever of the Nazis.
Nice hyperbole used to disguise a non existant argument.
It’s [IT IS] “non-existent.”
*************
We think we have made our case.
**************************************
You’ve been warned.
GN, as an editor and full time pedant, philosophically, I am sympathetic to your aim. On the other hand, blog comments are a very impromptu form of writing, and a number of our readers are not native English speakers; many of the rest are products of the American education system, and so are only slightly better off.
Furthermore, while I am philosophically sympathetic to your aim, I’ve also noticed that spelling and grammar flames rarely produce a good and virtuous result, often lead to pointless flame wars, and in any case quickly become tiresome.
I approved this one, but don’t be surprised to find that future exercises in this narrow little literary ouvre increasingly seem to have seen a Boojum.
omg…ROFL..get over it. I cant type for crap and fully admit it. If you are that much of a nazi about grammar, how does that help our cause? The left will still say we are ignorant no matter how well we write. Best thing to do is ignore them and keep on keepin on! (better fix that last sentence for me)
Blogging is a very loose form of communication and allows everyone to express their views however they may.
Attitudes like this will not help our cause. Of course this is my 2c. OMG i said 2c…better fix that for me
………………
while I prefer to read posts with proper grammar and spelling, I also prefer to read posts about the topic- many people who cannot spell well or write perfectly edited ENGLISH, can still have a point to make, something worth hearing and are entitled to express their opinions. For God’s sake, this is the internet where people are often typing quickly or poorly, where @ is used for at, and 8 for ate. Shorthand is acceptable.
It is impolite (RUDE) to correct people for grammar, as it is to point at them in person, or make fun of them for having a speech impediment.
Your post is off topic as well in this stream, also rude. No one assigned you to monitor the posts, no one cares as long as the meaning can be gleaned from the post.
Act like a grownup and just ignore other’s people’s poor spelling and make your own posts as you like-> ABOUT THE TOPIC
Dear Sirs: Ha.
Sincerely, a-cat
I agree “correct language” is important especially when replying to miriam rove. Incorrect spelling & improper punctuation could send an irrational bigot over the edge.
HaHa! Grammar Ninjas
Are you one of these guys?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj-x9ygQEGA
(They appear at 1:16)
Of course, yr piont is wel taken.
Rosemary Church has shown anti-semitic animus for many many years – one of the reasons I never watch CNN international (which we get here in New Zealand along with Fox News, on the Sky satellite service).
CNN international by the way, for you home-bound Americans is a thousand times worse than the already execrable domestic service. It is much more anti-American than the more objective Al Jazeera (!).
The Moslem is very adept as telling lies. The Koran and Hadith request that lies and subterfuge are used in the cause of Islam. They give the example of Mohamed entering into a treaty while weak and then breaking treaty when strong. Arafat refered to this following the signing of the Oslo accords!
The media being of the Left have no moral compass and so do not see evil only differing opinions!
In the words of the Prophet, “War is deception”.
For those who are interested here’s some facts:
From How Hamas fooled the West
In 2001, Jean-Louis Bruguiere, the prominent French counter-terrorism magistrate, said at the trial of the “millennium bomber” that IHH had played “an important role” in the plot to blow up Los Angeles airport.
In 2006, the Danish Institute for International Studies reported that Turkish security forces had raided the IHH’s Istanbul bureau and found firearms, explosives and bomb-making instructions, as well as records of calls to an al-Qaida guest house in Milan.
Amazing how the “free press” works deceiving one and misleading on the stand to be taken on important issues.
The real tragedy is the world wide antisemitism – so automated in the media, and so well illustrated by Richard Landes here. Of couse no one in the media actually would admit to just the slightest degree of antisemitism, but what other name could this consequent bias have?
What are the causes? Why are the educated and supposedly enligthened journalists and editors (don’t forget their responsibility) so stupid as to repeat the tragedy of the 1930′es? Why can’t they see the patterns in their coverage? Why is it that whatever Israel does, Israel is always to blame?
We need to point out in the smallest detail every bias in every newspaper and in every news channel until the tide is turning. That day must come, but it will certainly not come by it self. We need to continue the work that Richard Landes took up here, and we need to continue continuing it for years ahead.
Maybe then we have a chance of getting things right.
Like the social insects, journalists in the West function with the strengths and weaknesses of a group mind. Think of them as younger, more attractive versions of Helen Thomas. There is something called JournoList that is sort of like a secret society for lefty scribblers. In their emails to one another they thrash out the line to be taken on whatever the issue is. Here is an example: After promoting Obama as a cool rationalist above the fray as he must be as leader of a nation with an evil past to live down and one that needs relationships reset with the rest of the world, the oddly-named mainstream media is giving us a revised picture of the jaw-clinching ass-kicker in the Oval Office, a man capable of becoming vewy, vewy angwy.
The rabbi that filmed Helen Thomas has been getting swarmed with hate mail! Anti antisemitism is growing world wide and here in the USA.
Many things are coming to a head globally and domestically that has me very worried for the future of western civilization.
A friend from New zealand once asked….do you think the US will survive…he asked this about 7 yrs ago. My answer was and still is…i am not sure! I am even less sure today.
I never said I was a good or great speller.. but if you get the message so what…. and by no means I hate Israel.. beilive it or
not, the Israeli can not and should not put their gaurds down otherwise they will be swalloed by Arabs..but they are also
not doing the right thing by blockading Gaza.. a lot of people
are hurting… I understand that Hammas is a terrrost organization
out there to destroy Israel… but there needs to be a better
sulotin. i do not know what, but things can not go on like this
I just quit giving you a hard time, and I don’t care how you spell.
So far, the scoreboard across the last couple of weeks shows your posting name is Miriam, which I assume is female, you’ve posted you have a jewish girlfriend, you love jews, are a muslim or are of muslim descent since you are an avowed atheist and not a ‘liberated muslim’ as someone asked, and now you claim Israel is as bad as the Nazis and the boarding party of marines executed passengers at point blank range. Oh, but Israel shouldn’t back down and give in to Hamas and the other Islamicists calling for its destruction.
For clarification, please explain the following:
a) Is Israel a Nazi-like regime or does it have the right to defend itself against the likes of Hamas? If it’s Nazi-like, please provide links at a minimum, demonstrating how Israel has achieved this level of infamy, and also please then reconcile your first statement (Nazis!) with your last (right to defend itself!) and how you can seem to not hate a Nazi-like regime.
b) Please elaborate how the Israeli marines were executioners in light of the following facts- They gave the vessels ample warning about being boarded and searched, including an offer of escort to a secure port for offloading and delivering of supplies. They did not shoot first. They did not even board with weapons drawn, and they did not fire until they were surrounded an in immediate and mortal danger with some marines already casualties.
To be executioners, the marines would have had to overwhelmed and incapacitated the passengers before killing them (there are quite a few videos out showing what executions really look like, most of them posted by Islamists, in case you need a reference- I’d advise not watching them though). Do you have direct evidence that this is what happened? Or do you simply believe that defending yourself with the only sidearm you have (a gun) is somehow a “disproportionate response” and therefore equivalent to murder? As side exercise, consider carefully what you would do if surrounded by men with knives who had just chanted about a holocaust for your people before attacking your comrades who had not even drawn, let alone discharged, a weapon.
c) Referring back to part a)- If you answer that Israel has the right to defend itself, how does lifting the blockade achieve this? Yes, supplies are tight in Gaza, but Israel does something few other nations ever have in the event of a blockade- they are supplying tons of food and necessities to their enemies in Gaza (I saw a statistic that the floatilla was less than 10% of the daily supplies sent by Israel itself? Does anyone have confirmation on that?). Also, Hamas directs the flow of supplies within Gaza, and there are some reports that their distribution is far less than fair. Regardless though, how does letting vessels go unsearched assist the sercurity of Israel, as we know that Iran has and will arm Hamas by any means it can? Note: This should also include a reasonable explanation of what you think the purpose of the blockade is and an alternative method for Israel to keep Iranian or other arms out of the hand of Hamas militias.
I apologize for the long-winded response, but I felt that perhaps you believe there is a coherance to your postings that others of us have failed to see. While this might not resolve all of the issues, hopefully it will provide clarity as to what you really think and give a starting place for something more like intelligent argument and discussion.
The activist’s were in international waters.They have a right to self defence as well.
Have they the right to bear arms to protect themselves,there is a lot of piracy around?
Israel chose to intercept in the night which added to the confusion.It was at least a botched operation.
They activists were shot a total of 30 times and five were killed by gunshot wounds to the head.
The results revealed that a 60-year-old man, Ibrahim Bilgen, was shot four times in the temple, chest, hip and back. A 19-year-old, named as Fulkan Dogan, who also has US citizenship, was shot five times from less that 45cm, in the face, in the back of the head, twice in the leg and once in the back.
The aid they where bringing were those items banned by Israel in it’s collective punishment of the people of Gaza.
Gaza has been under severe Israeli restrictions, preventing all exports and confining imports to a limited supply of humanitarian goods.
There are delays facing the delivery of even the most basic aid. On average, it takes 85 days to get shelter kits into Gaza, 68 days to deliver health and paediatric hygiene kits, and 39 days for household items such as bedding and kitchen utensils.
Among the many items delayed are notebooks and textbooks for children returning to school. As many as 120 truckloads of stationery were “stranded” in the West Bank and Israel due to “ongoing delays in approval”.
Government schools were reported to lack paper and chalk, while the UN Relief and Works Agency, which supports Palestinian refugees and runs many schools in Gaza, was still waiting to import 4,000 desks and 5,000
items considered a “security threat”.
Other items banned from entering Gaza, coriander, pasta, fruit juice, toilet paper, chocolate, cigarettes, seedlings, school books and uniforms ,wood for construction, cement ,musical instruments,size A4 paper
writing implements,notebooks ,newspapers,toys.
Pasta, which had been forbidden in the past, is now allowed.
Hospitals and primary care facilities, damaged during operation ‘Cast Lead’, have not been rebuilt because construction materials are not allowed into Gaza.
Roughly 90 percent of Gaza’s factories are closed or are functioning at less than 10 percent capacity because of the inability to obtain raw materials and the inability to export finished products .
Rather than targeting armed groups, the blockade mainly hits the most vulnerable, such as children (who make up more than half of the population in Gaza), the elderly, the sick and the Gaza Strip’s large refugee population.
World Health Organization (WHO) trucks of medical equipment bound for Gazan hospitals have repeatedly been turned away, without explanation, by Israeli border officials.
Goldstone said his central criticism of Israel is that its strategy intentionally applied disproportionate force in Gaza to inflict widespread damage on the civilian population.
His report found that the Israeli air and ground attacks destroyed 5,000 homes; put 200 factories out of operation, including the only flour factory in the country; systematically destroyed egg-producing chicken farms; and bombed sewage and water systems. “If that isn’t collective punishment, what is?’’ Goldstone asked.’
I hate to say it, but well, that’s kind of the point of a blockade, isn’t it? Denial of materials and support to enemies until the enemy has to give up? Were Hamas to stand down as a militia, quit firing rockets, and quit calling for the extermination of Israel and all Jews, then Gaza might have a chance to recover. I suppose I’m a bastard, but it’s on their shoulders, and especially the shoulders of the leaders of Hamas at this point.
As for the right of the ships to protect themselves from piracy (is there really that much piracy an area patrolled by well armed Israelis? And piracy against a flotilla that large? I somehow doubt it)- I’ll give you that one. However, the KNEW they were going to be intercepted. They KNEW they were going to be boarded. Had they complied peacefully, no one would have died. Again, it’s on the heads of the crew that refused to be inspected. The other ships allowed it- no one died on them. They could have protested by broadcast. They could have allowed an inspector aboard and then assuming they passed inspection, argued that they be allowed to go directly to a Gaza port, instead of the Israeli alternate- That would have at least been in a peaceful spirit of compromise. They didn’t. They attacked instead, and panicked marines shot a lot of rounds. Multiple gunshots to the people closest to the marines were going to happen. It was probably planned to do so by the activists. The only sympathy I have is for the passengers who didn’t realize they were part of a different sort of publicity stunt than they signed on for. And I don’t think I actually have much for them.
I do think the planners of the operation were suckered-in though. Probably the difference between thinking in relatively straightforward military terms, or thinking about garnering the most publicity.
This website is so fully owned and occupied by Jews and their pet goyim, that its funny to any who might try to balance the rhetoric.
I just came back from Normandy and Brittany – I spoke with the locals, and read the Euro press…. and guess what? — THEY AGREE WITH HELEN THOMAS!
AND
to the man and woman… think Israel is the biggest threat to the world right now. People I spoke to thought that Iran should be held to the same standards as Israel — Israel has the bomb… why not Iran?
AND
The French President is a JEW!
HELLO! — is anybody getting information beyond FOX and Foxman around here?
christofer: I will be glad to.
yes iwas born in Iran and raised a Muslim. my dad went by the book.. so far is we were not allowed to listen to music!!!
I moved to states when I was 18 years old and that was the first time
I was able to get away from a brutal religion. Islam that is.
However my disdain is for all religions and had it not
been for religions, I honestly do not think we would have this
conversation.this whole notion of someone critizing the Iraeli government and being labled anti jew, anti semite and for those jews who critisze the Israeli government as self hating jews is plain
WRONG. it is so far from the truth it is not even funny.it is like saying everone who live down south is racsit and does not like blacks..etc
I have mentioned in the past that I am senior executive in a company
that has and is producing the single most recognizable brand in the history of television.. to that end because my line work is in enetrtainmet I work with Jews all time. the owner of our comany is a Jew and yes my daughter inlaw is jewish(levine) and I date a jewish woman for the last 5 years with the last name of Kaplan. it enrages me when I am being labled as some one who hates jews or anti semite.
look: I deal with ortodox jews in brooklyn and I can put ten million dollars in busness on the table on a Friday afternoon they will not touch it with a ten foot pole and I admire that. I also admire the fact a small population of the people(jews) have survived centures of persecution by muslims and chrstian alike.
Christofer: Not only Israel has every right to defend itself they
can not and should not put their guards down otherwise they will
be swallowed by the Arabs. and look Hammas is a brutal and
a terrorist Org. and a proxy of the dispable Iranian goverment
and I also don’t think the PLo is any better.. how evre they did shoot
people. lOOK: how badley their policies are hurting the very people(israelis) they are suppose to be protecting. innocent Israelis
are caught. they are not letting Israeli gays prade in Spain
just about every concert has been canceled like Elvis Costello
and today the Pixies canceled and left 15000 Israeli fans upset.
Israel needs a whole new set of leaders these old gaurds who running the show now are hurting Isreal a lot more that helping.
Look what israel needs is a good PR.
If I was running the show, this flitila that was sent to PORVOKE THE ISRAELIS, i would have turned it into a trumph not a disater it
is now. no one had to die, I would have insected every f… ship and alloewd them enetry: the Turks then made look like S… and morons.
Thank about it. I have to take a client out to lunch now and I hope I clarefyed everything. but let me tell you what is really sad, someone here will find a reason to call me anti jew, or make fun of my spelling.. or something.
NOW IF YOU LIKE TO SEE AN ANTI JEW, ANTI SEMITE PLEASE READ THE POSTION OF #24 GMARK. HERE IS SOMEONE WHO HATES JEWS.have a great day
Miriam,
I guess the reason you’ve been labeled at times as anti-semitic is for lines such as your last one in #2- ie, that Israel has committed crimes that are more horrific than the Nazis. That then doesn’t really jive well with your follow up about how many jewish friends you have in your professional and personal life. It’s one thing to say you disagree with Israeli policies. It’s something else all together to state they are worse than that long list of states you wrote out, and put the Nazis to shame. That is what comes across as anti-semitic.
Not to mention that you ripped the author of the article for making a valid point- Israel is getting it’s butt handed to it by the media (and the UN) for what amounts to a skirmish with allies of an enemy they are technically at war with (even if undeclared- if a group calls for your utter anihilation, that pretty much means you’re at war with them), and other countries and groups that have killed many more people within the same time frame, and much more brutally, get no attention from the media or the UN.
You say Israel needs PR? Well- spin that. It’s blatant, open hypocracy by the very people claiming to be championing human rights. Where’s the outrage against China? Where’s the UN investigation of Muslim-on-Muslim mass killings? Or Hidu-Muslim conflicts? You writing, in essence ‘Who cares? Israel is the worst out there’ again, could, perhaps, maybe, just a little, come across as anti-semitic.
At any rate- the Israeli Navy was trying to inspect and redirect the ship. That’s why they boarded it. There was no way Israel could have come out with good PR in this, unless they had found a cache of rockets or other heavy weapons on the vessel.