Tariq Ramadan-Supporter Diana Eck Leads the Charge Against Fired ‘Islamophobic’ Professor
The evil of small minds has triumphed over all that is good intellectually and morally at Harvard.
Professor Diana L. Eck is a supporter of smooth-talking radical Islamist Tariq Ramadan, whom she describes as “one of Europe’s deepest and most articulate Muslim thinkers… one of the most powerful exponents of a reformist, self-critical, spiritual and dialogical Islam.” She is also a defender of Boston’s notorious Roxbury Mosque (whose former and current trustees, mullahs, and congregants have known ties to terrorism and to preaching violence). Now she has successfully led the pack against Professor Subramanian Swamy. Last year, in December, he was dismissed after twenty years at the summer school on the basis of an op-ed piece he wrote in an Indian newspaper about the obvious and growing danger of Islamic terrorism in India, including the 2008 and 2011 jihadic massacres in Mumbai.
Eck is a professor of comparative religion at Harvard’s Divinity School as well as a professor of law and psychiatry. She is known for her “interfaith” work. She, other professors, and some students decided that Swamy’s piece was racist, Islamophobic, nationalistic, religiously intolerant, and in favor of violence and, as such, should be treated as unprotected hate speech. Eck and the students do not believe that Harvard should be associated with anyone who holds such views.
Who is Swamy? His biography is very distinguished. In 1964, as a full scholarship student, Swamy obtained his Ph.D at Harvard. He worked with Nobel laureate Simon Kuznets, and jointly authored papers with Nobel laureate Paul. A Samuelson. He has subsequently served in the Indian parliament for five terms and was also a cabinet minister for Commerce, Law & Justice. Swamy, the president of the Janata Party, is also a linguist and is proficient in Tamil, Hindi, English and Chinese.
Swamy is the author of many acclaimed books and papers. In 1971 Swamy published Indian Economic Planning—An Alternative Approach; in 1973 he released Economic Growth in China and India 1952-1970: A Comparative Appraisal; in 1989 he published an updated Comparative Appraisal of China and India (1870-1986). In addition, he has published numerous papers, including one with Paul A. Samuelson in the American Economic Review.
In addition, Swamy is also something of a swashbuckling hero. In 1976, Swamy exposed and challenged corruption in Prime Minister Indira Gandhi’s “emergency authoritarian” rule in India and had to flee the country twice as a result. However, due to his campaign Gandhi allowed long overdue elections. In 1972, Swamy lost his professorship at the Indian Institute of Technology, New Delhi, due to his crusade for both academic freedom and for the union rights of non-teaching Institute employees. After twenty years of litigation, the courts reinstated Swamy with full honors.
Between 1978-1985, Swamy visited China nine times. This led to the normalization of relations between India and China. In 1982, Swamy became the first Indian political leader to make a trip to Israel. Due to his efforts, India opened embassies in both China and Israel; these countries reciprocated..
Not surprising at all to read about heavy-handed actions against free and independent speech/thought at Harvard.
It would be a real treat to see Ms. Eck, hand in hand with her wife, the Reverend Dorothy Austin, strolling past the Taliban Morality Police or perhaps slow dancing at one of Saudi Arabia’s best clubs or perhaps making out in Tahir Square in front of a Muslim Brotherhood political rally. I’m sure her expression of “interfaith outreach” would be well received!
Eck and her ilk can only survive in the hot house of academia. The wind that blows in the real world would rip all her petals away.
It is fascinating that the socialist/marxists in government and academia think they can partner with totalitarianesque Islam and share power with them over the unwashed masses. Their heads will be missing their bodies once Islam becomes dominant as Islam shares power with no one.
We should always judge Islam by their actions and not listen to the smooth talk of Eck or others whose opinions of Islam are not backed by facts or truth.
Just for the record, the Professor’s name is pronounced, “Eccch!”
Also fascinating that she is completely blind to the homophobic intolerance of Islam.
What does this tell us about scholarship at Harvard? However, judging from our current occupier of the Oval office there isn’t any! Any transcripts released by Harvard, at this late date will certainly be DOCTORED! Except the courses on being present.
Oh Darn! I thought it was Ick!
Diana Eck, and the many other dishonest morally corrupt Western (culturally Christian-European (Christian and post-Christian)) people who are currently holding, and propagating, the bigoted racist wrong views that Diana Eck is holding and propagating, and who, in the cases of those of the people such as her who hold positions of power in political, academic, and journalistic, institutions, are engaging in totalitarian censorship of people who are accurately warning of extreme danger, hold the perverse wrong view: “The powerful evil deceitful Jews are persecuting the beatific innocent wronged ‘Palestinian’ Arabs who are being justly avenged by the noble savage Muslim warriors.”
Just as, in the 1930′s, the many people such as Diana Eck – who, in many cases, were self-described “Pacifists” – and who, in the cases of those of the people such as her who held positions of power in political, academic, and journalistic, institutions, engaged in totalitarian censorship of people who were accurately warning of extreme danger, held the perverse wrong view: “The powerful evil deceitful Jews are mongering for war against the beatific innocent maligned Germans who are honorably redeveloping their own nation.”
Western anti-Jewish racism (a legacy of Christian anti-Jewish racism) is profound and deep, and is currently endangering the whole world, and must be honestly addressed and countered.
I do not appeasingly pacify evil.
I oppose evil.
I advocate non-violent action. I advocate beneficial skillful action.
I just want to clarify,
When I referred to people such as Diana Eck as being morally corrupt, I was referring to the lack of integrity of Diana Eck and people such as her. I was not referring to the homosexuality of Diana Eck. I do not view homosexuality as being morally corrupt. To whom one is sexually or romantically attracted is to whom one is sexually or romantically attracted. To whom one is sexually or romantically attracted is not a choice. Although, whether or not the establishing of a form of legal marriage between members of the same sex is beneficial for society, and, therein, whether or not the establishing of such a form of legal marriage is right, is another topic. And if the establishing of a form of legal marriage between members of the same sex is beneficial for society, then what would be the beneficial, and therein right, legal terms, and beneficial, and therein right, legal privileges, of such marriages is also another topic.
Also, Israel, as the liberal democratic country that it is, grants equal civil rights to all of its citizens regardless of the sexual orientation of its citizens, and Israel protects the human rights and civil rights of its citizens who are homosexual.
Muslim states persecute homosexual people. Many Muslim states, officially, by law, punish homosexuality by death, in accordance with authoritative Islamic law.
That Western homosexual so-called liberals excuse, and glorify, Muslim states and Islam and the so-called “Palestinian movement”, and hate, and vilify, Israel, and believe perverse absurd lies that vilify Israel, is a manifestation of the deeply engrained anti-Jewish racism that is a part of the cultural of Western societies. Western Israel-haters who are contemporary so-called “Liberals” now hold the perverse wrong view that Israel – the liberal democratic nation of the Jewish people – the physical, and cultural, and symbolically representative, main collective of the Jewish people – is reactionary, totalitarian, supremacist, and evil – which are qualities that those “Liberal” Western Israel-haters associate with whom they view as being “Conservatives”. Western (culturally Christian-European (Christian and post-Christian)) “Liberal” Israel-haters, whether or not they are Christian, and whether or not they are religious, have reverted to medieval Christian-European Jew-hatred.
And about the current Jewish fellow-travelers of such Western (culturally Christian-European (Christian and post-Christian)) “Liberal” Israel-haters: their behavior is a common type of behavior among Jewish people. Almost all Jewish people are experiencing, to various degrees, a deep profound form of Stockholm syndrome. Jewish people who are suffering from this Stockholm syndrome to severe degrees are fervent propagators of, and are the most influential propagators of, perverse malicious lies that vilify the collective of the Jewish people who are under attack at that time.
A prominent historical example of a Jewish person who was experiencing this Stockholm syndrome to a severe degree was Theobald of Cambridge, who was an ethnically Jewish man who lived in England in the 1100′s, and who was a Christian convert, and who was the inventor of the murder-and-cannibalism-of-Christian-European-children libel (“The Blood Libel”) that European people propagated against the Jewish people for several hundred years.
Correction:
I wrote:
Which should be:
It was wrong of me to write, in my previous comment, anything about legal marriage between members of the same sex.
I, in principal, do not oppose the principal of the establishing of legal marriage between members of the same sex in a free authentically liberal society.
However, I am currently horrified by the contemporary anti-Jewish/anti-Israeli racism, and, involved with that, totalitarianism, of the political groups of the Gay community, as a whole, in Western societies, and, because of that, I am now cautious about supporting the political agenda of the political groups of the Gay community in Western societies.
It should be “in principle”. Not principal. Y
Dare to speak the truth and you will be silenced, one woy or the other: publicly mocked and villianized or screamed down and not allowed to be heard. The people grounded in faith are now the radicals. Two good first steps to sanity would be getting US out of the UN and disbanding the federal DOE.
Harvard has shamed itself once again.
Islamophobic: an irrational fear of Islam. Because we all know that Islam does not breed terrorists or terrorism. Sure. Who’s irrational? Right up there with “progressive.” Nothing could be further from the truth.
Don’t you just love how some people voluntarily remove themselves from the gene pool? This is how they reproduce, teaching other peoples children at universities.
Even people like Eck must realize their own irrelevance.
I don’t think it was Prof. Eck on her own who made that decision. As far as I understand, the decision to exclude Prof. Swami was made by a democratic vote among the faculty’s senior members. In this sense you’re right. And it is highyl unfair of Prof.em. Chesler to make Prof. Eck a scape goat. Sounds to me like some private axe which Chesler tries to grind here.
By the way: Has anyone at all read anything by Prof. Tariq Ramadan? Do. It’s highly enlightening.
Hard hitting facts that Harvard can hardly ignore. An excellent piece nonetheless. Phyllis please write more on the how islam is not only contributing to the spread of terror but slowly dismantling the very fabric of democracy around the world.
Time for Harvard to clean up its act and give back the taliban petro $ to the prince of Saudi Arabia. Its absolute hypocrisy that Harvard & Eck show. How can they accept millions of petro $ when women in the Middle East do not have even the rights that camels in that country has? ban of bananas/cucumbers as they can seen as phallic symbols. give me a break. Oh! by the way, I dare Eck to show her intimacy with her partner in Saudi where its punishable by death.
I’ve had enough with Harvard idiots. OBama’s the latest given respect where none is deserved. They have 38 Billion + in their endowment and the greedy bastards bow down to islamists for more $. I recall a few years ago when MASS was proposing a 2.5% tax on the endowment and the VP of Finance at Harvard cried foul – said something like – not fair – that would be like taxing success!. Freaking hilarious.
Dr. Swamy clearly said how to wipe out Islamic TERROR. He did not say wipe out Islam.
BTW Dr. Swamy is right simply coz a terrorist attack of this magnitude cannot be possible without LOCAL SUPPORT..
Diana Eck completely exposed in this article. Excellent post by PHYLLIS CHESLER. We need many more such writers with such mindset who can educate people about truth.
I believe Eck has done yeomen service to Indian and world politics, by forcing Dr. Swamy to direct his attention to Indian politics where he’s needed more. He’s aging and a lot needs to be done in India.
Which is more important, teaching economics/ math to a bunch of already talented students at Harvard (who will get another good Prof anyway, hopefully), or helping India rid itself of its corruption in politics, when almost no one else is able to do what he’s doing?
Harvard has done the right thing by dismissing Dr. Swamy from its services, though for wrong reasons.
Very well said, Mr.G! Harvard’s loss – India’s gain. btw, Excellent article – many thanks!
Dr. Swamy is a giant of a man. He is a hero for India and the entire Free World! He would make the best and greatest president for India ever. If only Dr. Swamy could be president of America!
U do not need big intelligence to understand Islamic terrorism. All and any fire points around the world, including in Arabic world – one side is a Muslim. They fight with Hindus in india, Christians in philippines, Jews in Israel, Buddhists ans Jains in Thailand etc and with themselves (Shia Unni) in their own ciuntries this has to be stopped. But then who will pay salary of eek except saudi bin laden?
I met Diana Eck many years ago and she said that she knew sanskrit but apparently thats not true – how can she have the nerve to write on indology unless she thinks its her christian right to colonize. The truth is Diana Eck hates the idea of intelligent autonomous indians who care about their civilization and cleansing the country from corruption & islamic terror as their mediocrity and will to power would be challenged. Furthermore accusing Dr Swamy of ‘rascism’ and on the other hand supporting an islamist supremacist speaks lengths about her bigotism and ability to deny the genocides practised by islam on the original people of india, sind etc. May I remind her that in 1947 there were 51% hindus in sind as well as parsis jews sikhs. Still it was declared an islamic state. Today 1 % is left. Basically Eck though she claims to fight for women and is an open lesbian has no empathy for those women, lesbians and gays killed by islam, yet uses the politically correct card to cover up her own colonial attitude
It is not accurate to suggest that in Egypt, churches are not allowed – the Copts are about 10% of the population and there have been several lethal attacks by fanatical Islamicist gangs on church members while leaving their churches, which are public buildings, not covert. Saudi Arabia is of course a very different story.
I guess it depends on the degree of freedom you expect in the word “allowed”. I would not say they are allowed, more accurately I think would be something like “tolerated”. It’s virtually impossible to build a new Christian church in Egypt. It is also very difficult to repair existing buildings. To build a new Christian church anywhere in Egypt requires security clearances and a presidential permit. None of which are likely to be granted by the current government. Repairs require permission from the local governor and security forces. You can certainly quibble about the correct word describing the state of churches in Egypt but I think the article is an accurate one.
@Ken C
Let me add that not only do Egyptian Christians face a nearly impossible process to gain permission to repair their churches, they also have to answer to the local mobs who demand changes to the historical structures that eliminate any distinctively Christian features visible from the street.
One recent riot was touched off because the Christians refused to remove a dome and other identifying features of their historical structure. After the Muslims rioted and destroyed the church, it was the Christians who were blamed for destroying interfaith harmony in the community.
So it goes whereever Islam dominates. The world of reality is completely inverted and twisted into a surreal funscape where the rules are dictated to always and in everything to favor Islam.
I haven’t read the article by Dr Swamy so I won’t say yay or nay about it. However, I think that all cultures have a right to resist their subordination to another. Rising in defense of one’s own culture does not have to equal hatred or bigotry.
You can quibble about the correct and most appropriate words in description of the state of the Church in England; but, . . .
Tom, the simple fact that a centuries-old church is a visible public building does not have any relevancy when discussing the realities of Egypt’s every day life. The Christians in Egypt are being systematically squeezed out by an intolerant culture that has been emboldened by the recent post-Mubarak success of the Muslim Brotherhood. While there will be no “official” policy that condemns Christians and other religions, the reality on the street will be very different.
I think it would be splendid if President Obama would embark on an “interfaith outreach” and send Eck and her wife to Egypt and Nigeria on a fact finding tour. I’m sure this dynamic duo would report back to congress that the Christians in these countries should have all foreign aid cut off for having provoked the peace loving Muslims by not respecting sharia, by failing to preach/promote acceptance of gay marriage and refusing to allow pedophiles positions as Boy Scout leaders.
Dear Phyllis Chesler,
Dr.Swamy’s Virat Hindu concept articulated well by him which was the basis on which Harvard showed him the door, is similar to Darwin theory of evolution, which was challenged in US Supreme Court in 1920s. During the hearings of the case, the US Judge intervened to remind of the person in the witness box defending teaching of Darwin’s theory in schools- “Mind you, he is a Harvard Professor”. In this case I want to remind Harvard, “Mind you, Dr.Swamy is a Harvard Professor”. His virat Hindu concept cannot be challenged in any court, for that’s the truth & challenge if anyone can, if anyone wants to. Let Harvard focus on education and leave religious concepts for questioning, at the expense of freedom of speech, to the courts of law. Harvard University has succumbed to a pressure group led by Eck. Question Eck’s motives. Question Harvard’s right to question freedom of speech. One should not enter into the domain of religious misconceptions that take away the main point – Harvard is at wrong.
This Diana typifies what actually is wrong with PC thinking. It has caused the demise of UK as a “liberal” country and will eventually engulf Europe & US in its midst. Americans have to raise a voice against this for their own good sake. As for India we will take on the world. Sad to see that Americans have already forgotten who caused 9/11 !
I forget what was the Quranic punishment for homosexuality. Is it stoning to death or a painless beheading?
Extremes meet. Eck is a pro-gay, pro-tolerance activist who has joined the most anti-gay intolerant forces of persecution. She reminds me of Ron Paul, who has joined up with leftist extremists to oppose American foreign policy and, in effect, Israel’s existence.
The answer to the mystery of why far left individuals align themselves with radical Islam still evades me. Does not Diana Eck not realize that if she lived in an Islamic country she would be either publicly whipped or executed for her open lesbian lifestyle? Maybe you can’t fix stupid after all.
“The answer to the mystery of why far left individuals align themselves with radical Islam still evades me.”
Eck, the Havard administration and Islamists are united by their anti-reason, anti-Westernism, anti-capitalism, and anti-Americanism. This trumps everything else. Obviously, Dr. Eck and the rest of them take for granted the freedoms granted by American institutions (military, police and courts) which protect them from anti-homosexual Islamists.
To think that most Americans (that Eck and her associates probably completely distain) continue to consider Harvard professors as our country’s elite challenge one’s natural optimism and hope for the future.
David Wall has it exactly right. What unites the Left with radical Islam is not any thing they value in common, but what they hate in common: western civilization (and the elements of it that Mr. Wall has pointed out –reason, capitalism and individualism).
Is this to say that, they are united in hatred? — a curious combination, . . . who’d a’ever thunk?
But here Eck went after someone who is not Western not Christan, and showed no sympathy to the non-white, non-Christian, non-European Indian Hindu civilization that faced 1000 years and counting of Islamic jihad.
So what makes people like Eck side with Muslims and Islam over non-Muslims who are non-Western, non-American, non-Christian, non-White, who never invaded Muslim lands or colonized Muslims, but instead were invaded by Muslims and brutally colonized and enslaved by Muslims for centuries?
So right you are Ray. Nostradamus, who was a Jewish converted to Christianity, a doctor, scientist, believer, prophet, researcher I mean TRamadan needs many lives more to approach such degree of intellect and wisdom combined with utter compassion, envisioned all that in extraordinary ways.
I will be honest and say that in my lucid dreams, references or images referring to all religions were made. each time, Islam was clearly and bluntly associated with Evil. What is Evil? It is the culture of death and oppression, slavery and cruelty, anger, frustration, envy, non intellect, non progress.
Mr. TRamadan is an Alchemist of Lie. Do people see his incredible aggressive mimics, the ways he stares at people, like a ferocious teacher imposing his rule to children ? He doesn’t talk. He stones with words. He can’t dialogue. He is doing what Nostradamus said : using the most repellent seductive high speed logorrhea. This seduction is today hypnotizing many people, the very educated or the illiterate. Like a draft of the more powerful ante christ to come (or already there). Hypnotisis is only possible for weak minds. The kind of people who can’t be hypnotized are usually genuine scientists, artists or free thinkers. I can easily imagine how higher spirits like Thomas Mann, Newton, Benjamin Franklin or the like would have reacted at Tariq Ramadan manipulative speech.
Unfortunately, high spirits are rarest today. Universities are full of “scholars” despising Christianity. Which is the very reason genius is gone.
The best western universities of the past were full of real thinkers, mostly Christians. Mr. Ramadan wants to be the new universal islamic guru. period.
Like millions of islamists he is repeating he is a Swiss citizen as if that was enough to make him equal to Erasmus from Rotterdam, Dante, Alexander Pope or the many genius German thinkers.
The western today’s intelligentsia is morally responsible to devote endless attention to those people. They love attention so much they cause social clashes like recently at the Belgian ULB university. Once again Mr. Ramadan suceeded in seeding the “pomme of discorde” or “zizanie”.
Zizanie is the Art to foment endless social unrest, quarrels and conflicts. That is exactly what you can read in Q’ran. Create unrest. Divide non muslims between themselves. Muslims being already desintegrating themselves for centuries.
I am amazed at the number of comments in such a short time, peple are bothered , concerned worried, what harward does become a precedent……….free speech is a casuality……..
Diana Eck is a crackpot. She thinks she is married to a woman, the Reverend Dorothy Austin, which she is not – the birds who mate on my balcony always mate male to female, as do all sexually reproducing animals. She is a bigoted ignoramus – why is she on the faculty of Harvard?
She’s at Harvard because she is a highly-credentialed, politically corect-thinkng bigoted ignoramous.
Dr. Swarmy should sue Harvard for racial discrimination and wrongful firing, and Diana Eck for slander and racially motivated harassment.
Well, he does not have time. Indians are indeed grateful to Harvard for freeing two precious months of his time, where he is busy filling the jails with the corrupt rulers, single-handedly fighting the establishment as a private individual in courts.
These constant charges of islamophobia are diversion from the REAL problem: kaffirophobia! Hardly a month goes by in the US that another jihadist plot is uncovered to slaughter the kaffir. Sometimes, the jihadists are successful, but their actions are met only with silence by the Apostles of Conspicuous Compassion and muslim “civil rights” groups. We kaffir aren’t worth much.
um – what’s a kaffir?
A kaffir is an (unclean, awful, terrible, dirty, pagan, wretched, death-deserving, Allah-hating) unbeliever in Islam. I guess you must be one since you obviously don’t know whom to hate for being unclean, awful, etc. etc. Now, however, you can be one by choice.
A kaffir is a derogatory term describing any unbeliever in Islam. The more I learn about Islam, the more I despise it.
Simply put: if you do not believe in the Qur’an, if you do not believe in the words and deeds of the prophet Mohammed, if you do not believe or accept that he is the Messenger of Allah and that Allah is the greatest of all, and if you have not submit to Allah or not willing to submit to Allah, then therefore you are a kaffir.
At its root this is about sharia compliance. Harvard is already well on its way to becoming a sharia compliant campus with its female Muslim segregated gym hours, so why should it come as a surprise that they would yield to sharia blasphemy laws against criticizing Islam.
Phyllis mentioned the influence of Tariq Ramadan, Islam’s travelling snake-oil salesman, but let’s not forget the influence of Saudi Prince Alwaleed Bin Talal. He has been going around buying, I mean investing in Ivy League universities.
For a long time Harvard banned ROTC from the campus, but yielded now that the banning of gays from the military has been officially lifted. Defense Secretary leon Panetta recently ruled that Junior ROTC [high school level] had to allow female Muslim members to wear the hijab with their uniforms. It’s only a matter of time before this ruling floats up to the college level ROTC which shold make Harvard’s acceptance of ROTC even more palatable.
The sad thing about all this is that during WWII Ivy League universities produced some of our most dedicated and decorated members of the Armed Forces with many serving in the most dangerous clandestine operations. This was a proud tradition of these institutions – no more.
“dialogical Islam”
Oh wow, Diana, what an obscure way to say talking about Islam.
Obscurantism, the hallmark of the idiotlogue.
Islam (given its insistence on it alone as the definitive word of God) isn’t really interested in dialogue…interfaith or any other kind.
Besides lying through taqiyaa, what is there to talk about ? Hasn’t Diana read the Koran ?
Also, Swamy clearly states that “Islamic terrorism is India’s number one national security problem….and already the successor to Osama bin Laden as the al-Qaeda leader has declared that India is the priority target for that terrorist organization and not the USA.”
India is a much closer target of opportunity, more accessible, to AQ morons.
To me it seems like Harvard is now following the 21st century version Spanish inquisition or the procedures used in dealing with Galileo….The rise of appeasement of unacceptable Islamic militant interests in return for endowments in U.S. academia is quite alarming.
Oil money buying chairs at American universities (how ironic) and grateful recipients bending over and spreading ‘em, propagating lies about Islam.
I don’t think Swamy should wait for an apology from Harvard.
I’d say he’s lucky to be out of that nest of vipers.
I am very concerned about the lack of longterm clarity shown by individuals like Eck. They do not perceive that by condemning Swamy’s article as “Hate Speech” and by successfully removing him from Harvard they are in fact perpetrating the same crimes that they are supposedly trying to police. Her acute sense of paranoia over appearing Islamaphobic has made this decision a very biased one. This story illustrates that it is okay to criticize religions-just not fundamental Islam.
Diana Eck is yet another in a very large crowd of fellow travelers and useful fools, blind to the damage she causes while she goes about her goody-two-shoes business.
So sad to see almost the entire world putting its collective head in its arse and hiding from creeping sharia. The problem will engulf everyone and we will have one religion by 2040, unless we act with intelligence and courage, unfettered by the greed for petrodollars. When the Islamists take over
Swami is an Indian he gave his opinion to eliminate Muslim terrorism FROM INDIA whether it is hate speech or not it is entirely related to India only did any Indian student irrespective of religion complained about swami article NO it is only foreign cunning students who want to bend india complained we dont need saudi or pakistani students opinion on india related issues and this ekk reacted only to make the money donors happy
In the guise of left liberalism and pandering to Islamic terror,American Universities are committing a crime which History would not pardon.
Dr Swamy is also fighting world’s biggest scam worth USD 35 Billion dollars and taking on mighty politicians. He is also a lone voice in a compromised society fighting against Islamic terror.But he has been receiving overwhelming support from the silent majority.
Harvard deserved Dr Swami and not Dr Swami deserved Harvard
Saudi funding is okay and Diana Eck is the torchbearer of what Harvard stands for today- muzzling of free speech and blatant surrender to Islamic fundamentalism. Americans have short memory.9/11 is history now.
If Harvard has any respect to be regained it must restore Dr Swamy to place of honor and explore ways of getting rid of Islamic supporters spreading their virus of condescending attitude to Islamic terror
Pathetic, liberal white guilt is what motivates Eck and all the pc left these days. I marvel at the tradition these folks have of fighting for church state separation, while islamofascism is so baldly hateful toward anything even remotely sensible. Eck and all the hypocrites make the religious right look like a study in reason.
As I point out in the blog below, the most astonishing thing about the Harvard faculty’s censure of Professor Swamy is that the members of a faculty of a university in Massachusetts are so arrogant that they believe they should ostracize a citizen of another nation for what he writes about his country’s internal politics in a publication in that country.
http://cantheseboneslive.blogspot.com/2011/12/harvard-cosmopolitans-gone-wild.html
You left out this part:
“The Muslims of India can join us if they genuinely feel for the Hindu. That they do I will not believe unless they acknowledge with pride that though they may be Muslims, their ancestors were Hindus. If any Muslim acknowledges his or her Hindu legacy, then we Hindus can accept him or her as a part of the Brihad Hindu Samaj (greater Hindu society) which is Hindustan. India that is Bharat that is Hindustan is a nation of Hindus and others whose ancestors were Hindus. Others, who refuse to acknowledge this, or those foreigners who become Indian citizens by registration, can remain in India but should not have voting rights (which means they cannot be elected representatives).”
Add his call to remove 300 mosques and it is over the top. Perhaps one should choose one’s allies and battles a little more carefully than this.
People cry that Muslims don’t want churches built in their countries but when a Hindu calls for the destruction of 300 mosques it’s not a problem. Is this really the free speech you want to defend? If so one is not using reason to define a side but simply the side to define the side.
Please do not read the passages out of context. What he said was – if islamic terrorists continue to bomb hindu temples(there have been numerous examples of this in recent times) then as a retaliation and as a deterrent those temples that were destroyed to convert to mosques should be rebuilt as temples once again- By doing this the islamic terrorists will realise(hopefully) their methods are counter productive.
To be fair to Dr. Swamy he only wrote what most hindus and patriotic Indian muslims feel and talk in private when they lose their loved ones following repeated terrorist attacks in India.
It is not out of context; this is what it says:
Goal 2: Blast temples, kill Hindu devotees.
Strategy: Remove the masjid in Kashi Vishwanath temple and the 300 masjids at other temple sites.
This is clearly punishment of all Muslims and their mosques for the crimes of a few. It is against the law in America, it is against the law in India and with good reason. He is clearly calling for 300 mosques to be destroyed in retaliation for a few temples bombed and not only if 300 Hindu temples are bombed.
Sam, a masjid or mosque is not a holy place, even acc. to Islam. Its a facility to worship. A temple on the other hand IS a holy place acc. to Hinduism. The mosque currently standing at Kashi Vishwanath temple at Varanasi has been built by Muslim invaders at the site of the HOLIEST Hindu temple (similar to Vatican/Jerusalem for Christians)by destroying it. Infact Swamy has asked Muslims themselves to remove these mosques on holy Hindu sites. Mosques can be broken and rebuilt and its common occurrence even in Islamic countries. Please read the article in an Indian context.
What semantic nonsense: not a holy place but a place to worship. What you approve of is illegal in India. Is that enough context?
Semantics? Poor excuse for ignorance I’d say. Even countries like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan break mosques every now and then and you say India can’t! Now can you imagine the land of Mecca breaking mosques if it were holy? Indian law only protects places held holy and not random places/ facilities to offer prayers.
It is nevertheless illegal in India and there is no legalism separating a place of worship from a structure where worship is performed whatever the hell that is supposed to mean.
You are a moron, Sam. A mosque is not a holy site, it’s a place of worship for local Muslims. They can convert any old building, church, or temple not in use into a mosque. Heck, they can turn an abandoned parking garage into a mosque if they wanted to. On the other hand, in case of India’s history, there have documented stories of Muslims destroying, ransacking, and converting Hindu temples into mosques by conquest or sheer mob force. These former Hindu temples were already holy to Hindus. You’ll find it in the Qur’an and ancient authoritative Islamic sources (still acceptable today) that Mohammed declared that Allah abhors all religions and it’s the duty of Muslims to wage jihad against other religions in order to make Islam the only “true religion” of the world.
When Mehmet II conquered Constantinople in 1453, the first thing he did was headed straight for the Sophia Hagia Church and upon entered it, he went down to his knees, declaring the shahada (Islamic profession of faith) on the floor of a great, holy Christian church, and commanded that the entire church be converted to a mosque afterward.
Followers of Islam are determined to destroy and replace all religions with only Islam.
Bob, it is illegal in India to make such a distinction; what about that do you not understand? Hindus control gov’t, it is their law.
You are playing word games.
Herge: Hindus in India do not control government, government is controlled by a Catholic Italian lady named Sonia Gandhi. Mr. Singh is merely a puppet, also a member of the Sikh minority.
Luckily for India, a match to these corrupted politicians is, has emerged in the name of Anna. May Mahasaraswati bless his soul, and the mantra now is :
Lokpal ahead, Lokpal not under government, or scrutinized by the government, and government totally under Lokpal.
Is it ok to have temples destroyed and mosques/ churches built on them as part of a bloody conquest? Isn’t a mosque or church just a place to gather and read quran/ bible? A temple is much more than that and they were destroyed by Monotheist religions, precisely for that differnce.
Hindu values are pluralist in Ideology and this value is worth fighting for.
When one becomes a citizen of USA they have to take oath to bear arms for America.Is that morally right for a pacifist who doesn’t like wars? Will you protest against this requirement?
The disfranchisement of Indians who deny their Hindu heritage is not wrong if you look at India’s history. India gave up 1/3 of it’s territory to make Pakistan and Bangladesh as the Islamic majority of these countries couldn’t live in the Hindu majority of India.
Didn’t Abraham Lincoln fight to keep the South from Seceding the Union?
Are you ok if the Mexicans vote to secede from America and form their own country out of California, New Mexico and Arizona?
Mr. Fellstef says, “Perhaps one should choose one’s allies and battles a little more carefully.”
I’m not sure you understand the nature of the battle. It’s not whether Dr. Swamy’s views are correct or even reasonable; it is whether he has the right to hold such an opinion (or any opinion other faculty members don’t approve of) without fear of being sacked. The battle is about academic free speech. Indeed this opinion of his was not even expressed in his capacity as a Harvard professor, but in an op-ed in an Indian newspaper.
I’d bet money you wouldn’t go to bat for a Columbia professor who said it’s okay to demolish all churches in Egypt for one or several terrorist attacks by Christians and published it in an Egyptian newspaper. A Muslim apologist, Joseph Massad, who I despise, was give a grilling by his school for far less than what this guy did. Massad survived, this guy didn’t.
Professor Massad was accused of intimidating his students and down-grading them for not agreeing with his political views. Was professor Swamy accused of something like that? No. Swamy was removed simply for an editorial he wrote that appeared in a newspaper half way around the world.
From the standpoint of one’s responsibilities as a professor, it was Massad who was accused of abusing his position; and yet the fact the he survived whereas Swamy didn’t seems to bolster Phyllis Chesler’s point, doesn’t it?
No, had Massad written such an article he would’ve been in trouble although it should be noted that he did write an article published in Al-Ahram Weekly that as much as suggested that Israel’s Mossad was behind the New Year’s Eve church bombing a year ago in Alexandria. Mossad is a bigot, of that there is no doubt; but he keeps his head down. No one has ever been charged with the bombing.
There are limits to free speech at academic universities and one limit is hate speech, as the despicable Ward Churchill learned.
follow the money-how much $ has Harvard received and from whom
We may get to know the ‘price’ when the Harvard president visits India in Jan.
Dr. Chesler,
This is an outstanding piece! Thank you for researching and writing it. Shame on Harvard and every PC knucklehead employed there.
I don’t think most Americans are aware of the Hindu genocide. I’ll share this with my circle.
Excellent article. Another disgusting example of the suppression of free speech by the “elites” in America.
When will they ever learn?
And what is wrong with them anyway?
The people who shut down the livelihoods and the reputations of those they disagree with are nothing more (or less) than modern day bookburners, plain and simple. They are cut from the same dark cloth of intolerance and moral certainty that renders them very dangerous to a modern civilization and its lifeblood–the open exchange of ideas.
Excellent article! Its outrageous and shameful to see that self-proclaimed South Asian experts like Diana Eck who have absolutely no idea of the very intricate fabric of the local dynamics can vote out a faculty member in a free democratic country for having expressed his thoughts in his own free democratic country. Absolutely shameful and disgusting!!! Harvard university president ought to be held accountable for allowing such stupid and hateful decisions by its staff and sack them first. Call and email the president Drew Faust with your protests today: (617) 495-1502, president@harvard.edu
Above article, Eck: “As I stood under the great dome of the mosque at Roxbury Crossing, I prayed, as a Christian, for its speedy completion… Boston is part of the Islamic world.”
Boston is part of the Islamic world? She prayed as a “Christian” for the mosque speedy completion? Christians in Egypt; Hindus, Christians and Sikhs in India and Bangladesh live in daily fear from Muslim attacks: Kidnappings; rapes; forced conversions to Islam; atrocities, and barbaric murders. Their places of worship, attacked and destroyed by Muslims and this woman prays for the speedy completion of the mosque instead of praying to God for His protection for severely persecuted terrified non-Muslims?
Eck must be a lot holier than the Pope because one of the conditions the Turks made when he visited Hagia Sophia in Istanbul was that HE NOT PRAY. For a Christian to pray in a mosque means it is desecrated. Perhaps Prof. Swamy’s concern is based on the fact that every single mosque in India was either built with the rubble of a Hindu temple torn down by the invading savages or is a Hindu temple forcibly converted to a mosque. He might also be concerned with the fact that at partition the Muslim population of India was 8%, the Hindu population of Pakistan was about 10%. Sixty years of persecution and harassment in Pakistan, particularly the 1970 murders of millions in East Pakistan has reduced the Hindu Population to about 1% whilst the Muslim population in India has jumped to 14.6% and is expected to go to 18% by the end of the decade.
Hypocrite elites are ruthless and cruel in their refusal to speak out for desperate, TERRIFIED non-Muslims. SILENCE IS CONSENT.
humanrights.asia: PAKISTAN: A lawyer from Hindu community is missing and police refuse to register the case claiming that the abduction of Hindus is of no consequence.
The Hindu community remains under threats of abduction, forced conversion to Islam and persecution.
Forced conversion to Islam by the abduction of girls and their forcible marriage to Muslims is common.
Fear has spread among the Sikhs and Hindus of Pakistan after the atrocious beheading incident involving a young Sikh man because of his refusal to convert.
The Asian Human Rights Commission has estimated that every year more Christians and Hindus are forcibly converted to Islam.
http://www.humanrights.asia/news/urgent-appeals/AHRC-UAC-252-2011
Response to Subramanian Swamy’s comments on Islam
http://www.islamhinduism.com/responses/other-responses/139-response-to-dr-subramanian-swamys-comments-on-islam
solution to stop terrorism is forcebly convert all Muslims to new or Hindu world peace will prevail then only
An Islamophobe is a person who believes that:
ALL people must have human rights.
and
ALL people must be equal under the Law.
Media and government leaders condemn and demonize us because this is what we believe.
As I recall Dr. Eck bested Martin Luther at the Leipzig Disputation and then went on to secure a papal bull of excommunication which Luther then burned in public.
Indirect payback for pursuing corrupt politicians in India. Eck is a pawn. Harvard’s name tarnished as a result of bowing down to $ and PC. Lets see who has the last laugh.
There is a concerted effort by the anti-Christian factions and their apologizers to elevate Islam as the principal belief, starting with the Tehran embassy takeover in 1979. The movement was given new life after 911 when the Bush administration sought to soft pedal Islam as a ‘religion of peace’. From the Cordoba House initiative to the so-called ‘Arab Spring’(read Islamic Uprising), combined with socialists-backed OWS and Mr. Obama’s lust for autonomous power, a dangerous and predatory influence is spreading like wildfire across the globe and we are at risk for a war of ‘biblical’ proportions. Just sayin’, is all.
Harvard (along with the world of higher education in general) has, for many years, self-selected its way toward the politically correct, toward leftist dogma, and away from the respect it SHOULD desire as a bastion of free and open inquiry. Once an institution defines itself as a gaurdian of any flavor of dogma, credibility will be lost, perhaps forever. If Harvard continues to pander to political correctness in this shameful way, it’s possible that one day people may scoff at a Harvard education rather than revere it. Harvard should publicly apologize to Professor Swamy, beg his forgiveness, and hand Professor Eck her walking papers.
The Koran commands Muslims to conquer all nations and all peoples and subjugate hated non-Muslims under excessively cruel Islamic sharia law where defenseless non-Muslims have no human rights and females are regarded as inferior. In the Koran, jihad is an obligation for every Muslim.
Historian Will Durant:
“The Islamic conquest of India is probably the bloodiest story in history. It is a discouraging tale, for its evident moral is that civilization is a precious good, whose delicate complex of order and freedom, culture and peace, can at any moment be overthrown by barbarians invading from without or multiplying within.”
In the the last 1400 years, Islam killed 270 million people: 120 million Africans, 60 million Christians, 80 million Hindus and 10 million Buddhists.
And God said, “What have you done? The voice of your brother’s blood cries out to me from the ground.” Bible, Genesis 4:10
And who was counting up 80 million Hindus in medieval India? These numbers are without meaning.
Just for the sake of truth and balance…
It appears that the dismissed professor, Subramanian Swamy, is just as big of an intolerant bigot as his detractor, Professor Eck–as well as the radical Islamists he so ironically criticizes.
Professor Swamy is a radical Hindu. He advocates “Hinduist” policies in India which would be nearly as oppressive as the typical Islamist sharia state (forced obeisance to Hinduism, outlawing of conversions from Hinduism, etc.)
For those who are not aware of this: In India, HINDU terrorism is almost as big a problem as Islamic terrorism. Christians are often the victims of acid-in-the-face attacks by Hindus. Another favorite attack method of Hindus has been to douse Christians with gasoline and burn them alive. The only reason the West is not more familiar with this problem is because Hindu terrorism is almost completely confined to India.
It appears that this may be a case where neither party is worthy of our sympathy, and both of our condemnation.
Uncle Irv,
I think that what you wrote as being what is the case about Subramanian Swamy may, in fact, be the case about Subramanian Swamy, and if what you have described as being what is the case about Subramanian Swamy is, in fact, the case about Subramanian Swamy, then I, too, think that this is a case where neither Diana Eck nor Subramanian Swamy are worthy of our sympathy, and that this is a case where both Diana Eck and Subramanian Swamy are worthy of our condemnation.
Thank you for writing your comment. Thank you for your integrity. Your integrity is helpful to me, and a support for me.
I think that my accurately describing, on this particular article, the bigotry and lack of integrity of people such as Diana Eck was premature of me and unwise of me. I apologize for having done so prematurely and unwisely. I apologize if my having done so was unbeneficial and harmful.
It was wrong of me to say that I thought that Subramanian Swamy may be what I called as being “worthy of our condemnation”.
I apologize for saying that I thought that Subramanian Swamy may be what I called as being “worthy of our condemnation”.
I don’t know what, in fact, are the political views held by Subramanian Swamy. And it was wrong of me to express speech that made it seem as though I was intending to speak for others – especially in this context, where I did not, and do not, know what, in fact, is the case about the political views that are held by Subramanian Swamy, who I made statements of judgement about in regards to political views that I thought that he may hold.
I apologize.
Uncle Irv
First, understand the fundamentals of a religion. Christianity and Islam, both, preach hatred and conversion of “infidels” / “kafirs”. This is at the root of violence on the planet. Before Christianity and Islam happened there was no violence in the name of religion on the planet. Where are the Incas, Mayans, Aztecs? What happened to your own pre-Christian history? Where has it gone? Do you know anything of your own ancestors from the pre-Christian days? Do the Muslims in Saudi Arabia or elsewhere know anything of their pre-Islamic days? Why did you guys wipe out your history and butcher so many people? It was the Islamic and Christian invaders who ravaged India, not the other way round. India gave the world the supreme principle of peace: “EKAM SAT VIPRA BAHUDA VADANTI” – that, “Truth is One, the Wise phrase it differently”. This means we accept all religions as true, we dont condemn any religion or prophet. But Christians and Muslims call us pagan, infidels, kafirs etc., worthy of conversion or butchering. When Pope John Paul II came to India (if I remember right, 2002), he rejected the equality of religions and emphasized that Asia “must be conquered in the 3rd Millenium”. Christianity and Islam formally, specifically and forcefully oppose religious diversity. Europe is secular because of Secularism and Secularization. But India is secular because of the principle of “Ekam…” that I mentioned above. You are very young civilization compared with India or China. You dont quite understand the principle of peace, and hence you have killed and wiped our entire civilizations from the face of the planet like Mayans, Aztecs, Incas and “Red Indians” from the Americas, the “Aboriginees” in Australia. Canada was running “conversion schools” right into 1960′s to wipe out all traces of native civilization and language. India is not so. We embrace the distressed and downtrodden and the threatened. The Parsis found shelter in India. The Jews found shelter in India – the ONLY country where they were not persecuted. The Tibetans found shelter in India – we respect and rever their spiritual leaders, and their traditions, we treat them as our own brothers. Not that we hate Christianity or Islam. Not at all. We are built to love, not hate. That is the reason you find Hindu culture in most of Asia, not just in India, like in Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand etc., our culture is there, but we have not colonized them!! Many of our swamis have published works to draw parallels between our scriptures and Bible (ref: The Holy Science of Sri Yukteswar Giri). What we say is simple: Find the common ground, where you and I agree and live in peace. I dont call you an infidel or condemned. You dont call me one! Simple, isn’t that so? (Note: Many people think “mlecha” means infidel, no it does not. It means “dirty”. Indians originally used that word for Arabs because they bathed only once in a week. The word is no more current, it is not a “scriptural” term at all. Just a social slang of contempt towards the invaders. We dont use it for our compatriots, or for that matter even Arabs of present day!)
“Before Christianity and Islam happened there was no violence in the name of religion on the planet.”
I almost wet myself laughing at that one.
Talk about ignorant.
As for the peaceful, tolerant, Hindu India fantasy…
“Major post-independence communal conflicts include the 1984 Anti-Sikh riots, which followed Operation Blue Star by the Indian Army; heavy artillery, tanks, and helicopters were employed against the Sikh partisans inside the Harmandir Sahib, causing heavy damage to Sikhism’s holiest Gurdwara. According to the Indian government estimations, the assault caused the deaths of up to 100 soldiers, 250 militants, and hundreds of civilians.[94]”
“This triggered Indira Gandhi’s assassination by her outraged Sikh bodyguards on 31 October 1984, which set off a four-day period during which Sikhs were massacred; The Government of India reported 2,700 Sikh deaths however human rights organizations and newspapers report the death toll to be 10,000-17,000. In the aftermath of the riot, the Government of India reported 20,000 had fled the city, however the PUCL reported “at least” 50,000 displaced persons.”–wiki
Just one of many examples I could give.
Compare and contrast with a place like the United States.
I’m afraid old Siva doesn’t have the slightest idea what he’s talking about, even when it comes to his own country.
I spent 3 months in India in 2009/10: out of the 14 Third World countries I have spent 7 years in, it was the filthiest. At Varanasi, the holiest city in India, people threw garbage in the “holy” river like it was a 55 gallon drum and one takes one’s health into one’s hand to bathe in it.
I too find the idea of no religious wars or empires predating Christianity laughable and wonder what you use for a brain. Happily I find myself not included in your “we.” If Hindus never colonized then why is Bali Hindu and why was Java Hindu?
If you read Bernal Diaz you’ll find him describe a quite deadly arsenal in Montezuma’s possession and that they were steeped in religion, including human sacrifice and also slavery.
“If Hindus never colonized then why is Bali Hindu and why was Java Hindu?” -
No sir, you are wrong.Read the history , you will know why you are wrong.Hindusim spread to Bali because of the trade, it spread extensively in Indonesis but by then trade again converted many in Indonesia to Islam.The spread of Islam in Indonesia was never violent , hence the reason why even today many Indonesian muslims can recite Ramayana better than many Hindu Indians.When religon spread on its own accord, there is very little skirmish.Hindus believe all invocation to lord Almighty be it Jesus or Allah or Rama or Siva leads the believer to the same path.He is present in all forms and manner.as a Hindu, it is also perfectly acceptable not to believe in HIM, so long the tenets of peaceful co existence is followed.This plurality of thought in Hindusim reduced unnecessary wars,plunder,destruction and decimation in preIslamic India.The Hindu thought process however changed once they came under occupation which is a sad story indeed.
Dear Siva Shanmugam,
At different times, the most evil people, wicked God haters, took control of the church. Killing in the Name of God. Committing terrible acts; they blasphemed God. Filled with an all-consuming hate for Almighty God, they defied God and did the OPPOSITE of what God commanded in the Bible.
In the Bible, God stated His requirement for ALL humanity is KINDNESS:
Bible, Jewish Scriptures, Micah 6:8 And what does the Lord require of you but to do justice, to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God.
Jesus, who was a Jew, said in the Bible, Matthew 7:12 Treat people the same way you want them to treat you, for this is the Law and the Prophets.
I have the greatest respect and admiration for India in that India has NEVER persecuted Jews! Thank you so much, dear India!
May God forever bless and protect India!
Linda:
I hope the US and India, a new president and policy here perhaps, will realize that the 2 countries are natural friends. Add to that equation Israel, and we have the perfect alliance (Israel is already providing India with high technology weapons).
But not Pakistan, Pakistan will never be a friend of the US. Can’t be. Pakistan is a failed country, an abortion created by the pusillanimity of Gandhi, the wickedness of Jinna, and the stupidity of Nehru. The latter, really a Britisher and a Brown Sahib, took India on the path of socialism and the naive policy of “Hindi Chini Bhai Bhai”. How did China pay India? With war and taking a chunk of her territory. .
dear shiv,
majority of population don’t understand yukteshwar, yoganand , rajnish Osho and others, so no need to quote them.people dont have enough wisdom to understand them till they devote themselves to what they tried to explain.
Dr. Swami’s DNA piece is brief, we need more insight into Indian (sub-continent) history, the inner working of human psychology and Hindu traditions to understand his policy prescriptions. Whether we agree or disagree is our own democratic right, that is always there. Who destroyed the twin towers on 9-11-2001? We know who. Did we stand any chance? Did we have any methods and tools at our disposal to decipher the minds of these “terrorists”? No. We failed to extrapolate the meaning of the incident which we have conveniently forgotten – March, 2001. What is March, 2001? Well, that was when the Taliban destroyed the Bamiyan Buddhas. Who built those Buddhas? The ancestors of those very people who destroyed them! Why did these ignorant descendants destroy the wonderful work of art and enterprise of their own ancestors? Reasons are many, one of them is that they have now disowned their ancestry and consider everthing about their pre-Islamic history as worthy of destruction. This is also what the Arabians did. Can you find anything of pre-Islamic era in Saudi Arabia? No. They have destroyed everything. And they are proud about it! Do we know anything about pre-Christian Europe? About their “pagan” past? No. They have destroyed it after labelling it as bad and not worthy of memory or preservation or even recollection. This is BIG difference between East and West. Please note that Middle East passes for “East”, not so, by East I mean the Indian sub-continent, China, and other Asian nations. Here we value our ancestry. The ancestry question may not be so much valid in say Western Europe, the Americas or the Middle East today, because there is no survior from the complete conversion/butchering spree. But India being more resilient withstood the onslaught of both Islamic as well as Christian invaders and the native tradition is still alive and flourishing. Now, here, the problem of ancestry is important. Here we have neighbors (some, not all though) who disown and disrespect their ancestry in whose image I stand now!! Western audience should understand the problem now?! It is quite fine if somebody wants to be a Muslim or Christian, but he should not disrespect or disown his ancestry, else in due course of time he would tranform into the Taliban. The consequences of this kind of radicalization in a society like India where both the Native and the newer semetic cultures rub shoulders, they MUST have mutual respect and agree on a certain social common denominator. Commonality is a must for survival. Condemnation will result in discord, enmity and finally violence. We understand this, you Westerns dont because you dont have the context to understand this.
Siva Shanmugam,
I apologize for saying that I thought that Subramanian Swamy may be what I called as being “worthy of our condemnation”.
It was not my place to do so, and it was wrong of me to do so.
I don’t know what, in fact, are the political views held by Subramanian Swamy.
I think that it was not my place to comment on this article. I think that it was wrong of me to comment on this article.
I apologize.
I very much appreciate Indian culture.
Those of us who are Jewish who are aware of the reality of the situation that the nation of the Jewish people, Israel, is in, and who, as part of that, are aware of the whole situation in the world, are in a very difficult situation. We are in a very difficult position.
I have enough context to understand that, far from being hidden, there are libraries worth of history about pre-Christian Europe. Perhaps you’ve heard of Alexander, the Romans and Vikings. Go outside and learn rather than preach nonsense so easily brushed aside.
“We understand this, you Westerns dont because you dont have the context to understand this.”
Your myopic assumptions belittle the inherent common sense and intuition within level-headed people.
Your assertion that the pre-christian past has been willfully buried by the europeans is simply a prevarication of past events. I doubt many people know or care to know what their home town was like 30 years ago and certainly trying to reconstruct past civilizations which offered few enduring works of art and literature or architectual landmarks is of limited interest for societies today.
When India’s new wealth leads to the inevitable urban renewal you will then have the “context to understand this.”
Cheer up. Her head will be one of the first separated from her body when the Caliphate takes over.
well researched article. all i can say is Harvard has harmed itself and is a loser here. smells of conspiracy for the crusade dr. swamy has launched here in India. i am hopeful for his fearlessness and service to the nation he will get bharat ratna some day. one man army dr swamy has given hope to millions back here in India. he alone stood against the government and brought out the biggest scam in the history. may goddess saraswati be always remain blessed on him.
Ruchi, Unfortunately for our country, Sonia Gandhi will get a Bharat Ratna very soon. and Swamy will be maligned and tarnished years after he is gone.
Tell me the credentials of even one member of Gandhi family, though everyone has got a Bharat Ratna
swamy has enough work to be remembered but sonia has none , to supplement this she may be decorated with bharat ratna, and most of the bharat ratna awardee were alike. so we need not to worry about this.as much as mahatma gandhi is concerned , the poor fellow belongs to same group but missed this. i can criticise gandhi to thousand and one count, and he was not less than sonia and others in any way.
Don’t hold your breath waiting for an apology from Harvard.
It is beyond redemption.
Why would Harvard apologize to a guy who wants to destroy every mosque in India? This man is operating from the same intellectual space as someone who wants to destroy all churches or synagogues for what a few Christians or Jews do. He is a racial supremacist who believes that Hindu Muslims are a form of apostate. Sound familiar?
“Why would Harvard apologize to a guy who wants to destroy every mosque in India?” -
Either you have not read Swamy’s article or if you have read, you have made the above remark because of your preconceived notions.You are to be pitied.
There are pro-Islamist professors all over the U.S. who call for much worse toward Jews and Israel and Temple Mount. Does Eck object to any of it?
Have you read any of her work?
Looks like in west all intellectuals and leaders are unaware about ISLam.1400 yrs and islam converted a billion to islam killed 280 millions today 56 islamic countries where no other religion can survive. When a University like Harvard is misled by few Professors like ECk .Then Only GOd can help us. We are doomed due to teacher LIke ECK.
They should be terminated with out any delay.
Re the Indian gentleman who claims that the pre-Christian past of Europe was entirely erased (does he mean southern Europe, where there are masses of ruined temples? where you can visit the Colosseum today? where you can visit the Parthenon? where you can go to Delphi and where you know exactly what was done at Delphi? Does he mean northern Europe, where **Christians** carefully wrote down in books the pagan beliefs and the pre-Christian histories of their own ancestors. It was Christians who wrote down, and copied, and handed on the Icelandic Sagas, the Elder Edda of the Scandinavians, the Nibelungenlied, the High Deeds of Finn MacCool, the Mabinogion, and the saga of ‘Beowulf’.
We would probably have a lot more such things, except for things like wars and pirate raids that destroyed books; what we’ve got is what survived the simple ups and downs of human history. The entirely accidental fire in the Cotton library in the 17th century may have destroyed all kinds of things – the Beowulf manuscript is one of the treasures that was in that library, and was just barely rescued. What else was in there, that *didn’t* survive? No Christian set that fire…it was plain old bad luck).
I would like our angry Indian, intent on equating Christianity with the genuninely history-hating culture-hating anti-art project of Islam, to reflect on the fact that Christian Byzantium copied and recopied the manuscripts of Plato, the plays of Aristophanes, Sophocles, Aeschylus, Homer, the poetry of Sappho…that Latin Christian scribes copied the works of Virgil, Pliny, Ovid, Catullus, Livy, Tacitus, Cicero ….ALL thoroughly pagan works.
Christians like my own irish and Scots and Danish and German ancestors were perfectly familiar with much of the pre-Christian mythical world of their forebears; they remembered it and passed on the stories, as well as plenty of customs and traditions and practices that they had decided were good and innocent, or neutral; but they simply no longer worshipped gods that, among other things, called for human sacrifice. There are and have been, in human history, ‘gods’ that are surely unworthy of worship – ‘Odin Glutter of the Crows’, whose piratical warrior followers believed that only those killed in battle deserved paradise (Valhalla), and who worshipped him by mutilating the dead on the field of battle – ‘the blood eagle’. (The claim that there was no violence due to religion, prior to Christianity and Islam, is nonsense: why did the Greeks, the Romans and the Scandinavians, the Angles and Saxons, have gods of War, then? Odin/ Wotan, Ares, Mars? Whose task was particularly to prosper the cause of the nations who took them as patrons, over against other groups? The pagan Romans saw themselves as favoured by Mars; the legendary founder of Rome, Romulus, was the son of the war-god, Mars; Mars gave them victory in their wars of conquest and empire..).
I doubt that today’s Greeks would like to return to the adoration of Cybele and Bacchus – the former of whom demanded that her most devout male devotees must cut off their own genitalia, the latter of whom was worshipped by bands of frenzied women tearing live animals and humans to pieces in the woods.
The Incas, Aztecs and Mayans – but especially the Aztecs, who made themselves hated and feared by all their neighbours because of their habit of waging war to catch people to use as sacrificial victims – all practised human sacrifice (the Aztecs did it to war captives; the Incas did it to **their own children** – people keep finding the mummified bodies of such sacrificed children, on mountaintops, today); should we regret that their modern day descendants (and they were not wiped out, indeed they have PLENTY of modern day descendants, many still speaking the ancient languages as well as Spanish) no longer perform such sacrifices, and instead worship a god who became a human being and sacrificed HIMSELF to save the lives of his followers? – ‘the good shepherd lays down His life for the sheep’? In any case, quite a lot is known about the culture and history of the pre-Columbian civilisations, because western scholars have carefully decoded such things as Mayan writing; any Mayan, Aztec or Inca descendant can find all this out by reading the books, as well as by visiting many carefully-preserved locations where the old cities and temples still stand and the carvings still stand.
Our angry Indian should read the work of ex-Muslim Lamin Sanneh, who comments on the contrast between the attitude of Muslims to the native languages and cultures of African tribes, and the attitude of the Christians. The Muslims engaged in forced Arabisation; the Christians usually learned the native language and **translated** their scriptures into the vernacular, thus enculturating Christianity and very often enabling the native languages to resist colonisation. And almost universally you find that the best and most effective Christian missionaries were genuinely interested in the language **and in the non-Christian lore, history, songs and stories** of the cultures within which they worked. Among the Diyari tribe in the Australian desert, German Christians didn’t just translate the New Testament; they also composed a massive dictionary of Diyari, and a kind of encyclopaedia of local culture – including all sorts of frankly ‘pagan’ (and in some cases, frightening and violent) customs, practices and stories. It’s all there. History is history, facts is facts; this is what that particular tribe were at, good and bad together, so that is what the Christian historian wrote down. The same sort of thing happened in many other places.
My Dear learned friend,
you say that “Christian Byzantium copied and recopied the manuscripts of Plato, the plays of Aristophanes, Sophocles, Aeschylus, Homer, the poetry of Sappho…that Latin Christian scribes copied the works of Virgil, Pliny, Ovid, Catullus, Livy, Tacitus, Cicero ….ALL thoroughly pagan works.”
That is true. Though European absorbtion of Ancienct science and philosophy did not begin in Byzantium. It started after 1083, when king Alfonso reconquered Muslim Toledo (present day Spain, pls google, if you’re not familiar with it!). There he found an abundance of libraries with thousands of books (an average cathedral library of the period boasted abt. 400). These works were Arabic translations of the works you mentioned. Yes, Christians did eventually translate these ancient works. But only after they had re-discovered them in form of Arabic translations. And there were not only those Arabic translations of ancient wisdom. The Muslim world had by the beginning of the 11. century also further developed many sciences: physics (optics, astronomy), mathematiks (decimal system!), medicine.
I don’t suppose, you are a historian, my friend. Otherwise you would not give such a shall we say … loose summary of the history of science. But, by all means, don’t just take my word for it! Go to your local library, grab the first book on the history of science. And read it. All of it.
Eck did this to take advantage of liberal American constitution to show arabs and muslims that although she is lesbian but she is anti-hindu also and thus scored some browney points. She played her card well to please her muslim friends and will expect huge benefits from gulf countries.
I just returned from an extended stay at Bharat Ma (a place also currently known as India).
One of my stays was near a mosque in a predominantly Hindu town. Damned Muezzin woke me up, and the whole neighborhood for that matter, at 4:30 AM every day. No one complains. Mahatma Gandhi’s statement continues to live on: “the Hindu is a coward, the Muslin is a bully”.
Islam in India = Hindu holocaust = the scourge of the earth = millions killed, thousands of Hindu temples destroyed.
No wonder if one sympathizes with Bal Thackeray.
When you come to a European village, my friend, be prepared to be woken by a whole range of church bells. Damned church bells, to use your expression. Thei are being chimed at least once every hour. No-one complains. Because it’s part of our culture.
But Hanna, I have lived in a European village, in Spain, and that never happened. It was, on the contrary, very quiet. Europe is big and very diverse, as the Euro trouble is showing now. It must be your village…in what neck of the woods?
And here in the US, MiamA, this would be certainly cause for calling the police, due to breaking the noise ordinances, and where I was in India, a total lack of respect and consideration for your neighbors.
Well, church bells are no reason to call the police in Europe, my friend. We have freedom of religion here.
You don’t seem to be anybody’s friend, but the opposite, by your sarcastic and antagonistic posts.
Notice I never referred to church bells in the first place. It was you who brought this incredible comparison. The US has had freedom of religion since its foundation, your Europe has had its share of Fouches, Robespierres, Napoleons, Mussolinis, Pavelics, Hitlers, Francos, and other crazies.
Church bells also toll here, but, differently from India, the US is a country of laws, and there are “noise ordinances”, for here in MiamA, after 11 PM, and all through the night, no disturbing noise is allowed, such as church bells and crazy Muezzins, and when you call the police, they come within minutes. As per “Europe” it all depends on the area. Go to Albania and Bosnia and you will see.
A voice of profound reason is being stifled by Harvard. It is like one can hide oneself in a black room to deny sun’s existence. Such hypocritical thing can happen at Harvard? Who said we are not living in medieval era anymore? It is really shameful to vote against something which is common discourse on the dinner tables in India. The historical blunder by Harvard as an institution. It is akin to Nobel committee sees devils in Gandhi and decades later accept the mistake.
If calls to “wipe out” entire groups of people conform to your idea of profound reason, my friend, you must be an immensely great thinker.
Please sign the following petiton in support of Dr. Swamy –
http://www.change.org/petitions/president-harvard-university-honor-dr-subramanian-swamys-right-to-free-speech
The groves of Harvard academe are as weedy as I thought, and this Eck bird is like a crabgrass okant that spreads and spreads and spreads, unless eradicated root and branch.
*plant
on what account prof eck can claim that she knows religion .does she know , who she is? all these universities are the stages of fools like prof eck , who can claim that they know religion. actually there is no religion as islam , hindu , christian jew etc,this all is drama and religion is something else .stop discussing religion and meditate to know what it is.
swamy is badly needed in india and it was a simple reason to get him routed back to india for active participation.
An institution like Harvard has abased itself by surrendering to the foul cry of a small group. It shows that even Harvard is not untouched from appeasement. Where are those values and principles Ms. Faust ? upon which Harvard boasts to stand ?