See How These Christians Shove One Another
The third person of the Triune God needs room to work, and also our trust, which we Christians are frequently slow to give. When Nancy Pelosi announced a visit with Pope Benedict XVI, many Christians assumed she would score a good-PR bonanza, but the Holy Spirit had other ideas. Currently, convinced that President Obama’s speech to Notre Dame University will provide him with cover to enact his wayward Freedom of Choice Act, Christians are once again forgetting the Easter lesson: that sometimes some things must be permitted, in order for other things to happen.
A thoughtful Newt Gingrich, in suggesting that prayer groups and nationwide pro-life meetings be scheduled for the hour of Obama’s speech, recently exhibited the mind of Christian exile to which we are called, and the sort of sharp-edged faith and trust that our political engagements with the world have dulled:
It may well be that President Obama may accidentally trigger the spark that creates a nationwide awareness on that day in a way he and his schedulers could never have imagined. … Maybe this day will turn out in a way to be a blessing by God, and maybe it’ll turn out in a providential way to be exactly the right conversation to have at Notre Dame and across America.
This is a more constructive response than petitions and rants; it is a response that brings Christians together before God, in a positive and co-creative way, in keeping with our calling.
Earlier, I suggested in this space that Christians not waste this issue with the predictable cries of outrage that have proved ineffective in changing hearts and minds about abortion. For that, I was accused of being “a tool” of both Obama and of Satan, one who did not sufficiently love Jesus or babies.
Those accusations made me wince for the sake of Christianity. In the first century, Tertullian wrote, “See how these Christians love one another.” Would a historian observing us lately be tempted either to those sentiments or to explore a life of faith?
At Easter we reacquaint ourselves with wonder, humility, and supernaturalism; perhaps some political introspection would serve us well, too. Have we Christians, meaning well, made idols of our ideologies and put our heads above God’s? Are we so engaged in “process” that — by our manner and actions — we repel rather than attract those who, but for us, might be Christ’s?
Christians have a duty to prayerfully assess the state of our own souls and consider that we are meant, first and foremost, to be reflections of the love of Christ, that his peace may reign. This is a good time to ask: how are we doing with that?
A most wise reflection, Elizabeth. Another way of looking at it: we have be careful of the battles we choose and the ground on which we fight them. We also have to consider our methods as well. I honestly do not think that the president’s commencement address at the University of Notre Dame will offer up any palliatives for his policy. I think he’ll steer clear of it, and instead deliver the usual pap that happens at commencements. I plan on not reading his words or listening to any of it on the news. I’m in the habit of tuning him out, because I find him utterly offensive.
It is better for us to use the occasion to talk among ourselves and refine our own minds for the battles ahead.
I think the ascendancy of the Left in America may serve a larger purpose: first, maybe as a chastisement for our sloth and intellectual torpor. Second, perhaps to slam us into reality and wake us up, allowing evil and devolution of society to shock us into reforming our lives and cleansing our minds.
Personally I think that the Lord God Almighty would enjoy watching a few robust Christian Conservatives kicking liberal Democrat butts for a change.
Why? Even His patience has limits.
Beginning with school prayer, after 60+ years of waiting for someone to stand up and stop the destruction and ridicule of His Commandments it is clear that the time to “rip the tax collectors temple games to shreds” is at hand. That would also save letting another great nation fall and/or having to build another ark.
What happened in Germany in the 1920s, and in the 1930s? There were people like Dietrich Boenhoeffer who were laughed at when they tried to maintain a
voice for what is eternal, in the public square.
Plus, things were not helped when Heinrich Bruening was rebuffed by Hindenberg. The plan was so that a grandson of Kaiser Willy would occupy
a position similar to the British King, but there would a regents council.
The inner conflict for Christians who want to respond to events in our nation has nagged at me since the election.
I have never before entered in to efforts to discuss (or cuss) political/national issues like I have in the last 8-10 months. In making the effort, I have discovered anger and sarcasm in myself that is indeed at conflict with the understanding that God WILL discipline His people and WILL punish nations in His times and in His ways.
So I’ve been thinking about how to retain the legitimate expressions of disgust and opposition while acknowledging the bigger picture on which God Himself is working.
It’s been quite an exercise. Frankly, one of the reasons I keep commenting (to more or less effect) is to sharpen my thinking and my reasoning and to demonstrate (to myself if no one else) that I WILL take the opportunity to take a stand against the lies and destructions that we are being engulfed with.
When push comes to shove where evil (in all its degrees and iterations) is concerned, Christians DO need to “shove” back. But our classic passivism over the generations(with the political world itself wanting to silence us)has left us “sort of stove up when it comes to shoving back”. I attribute some of the disorder she describes to simple lack of experience. (And I’m obviously not referring to the Dobsons or Falwells or Gingrich’s who DO have such experience.)
I agree that just being outraged all the time is not effective and never has been. One of the apparent gifts of the left is that they do indeed have a capacity for being perpetually angry and always have a target in mind for that anger, logic and good be damned. We don’t have the instinct for that. So it has made me wonder how we are going to sustain our resistance. Based on conversations with fellow believers, I believe we’re learning and will get better at it.
“for both the president and the press to declare Christianity’s influence on American and world culture as vastly diminished.”
And you are falling for it.
The media? Please. They find anyone wanting that doesn’t agree with them. Obama? The One that went to the church for 20 years that he did?
Shame on you. We are also called to be wise as serpents and good stewards. You’re being neither.
I understand that Christianity is Counter-Cultural and is apart from this world. It is not a political doctrine, but infuses the way in which Christians view the world and their place in it.
However if Christians are assaulted in their Belief and forced through taxation to underwrite programmes antithetical to their Creed, the failure to engage in the democratic process leaves only open revolt and civil war as the alternative.
Modern society is quasi-totalitarian in its obsessive drive for conformity in a way that previous eras have not attempted. The use of mass-communications have tried to drown out conscience, and merely retreating to the inner citadel and inwardly rebelling brings us to the passive acquiescence in manifest evils.
The fact is that politicians like Bush used and abused Christian organisations as block votes rather than conscience voters and discredited many issues by association. The fact that Europeans do not understand that Protestants fled Europe to preserve their consciences from uniformity demanded by Established Churches does not suggest that Protestants today should align themselves with State Power…but there is nowhere left to flee…..no new Plymouth Rock. If there is nowhere to go but the sea, then you must stand and fight.
Clearly the State must be shrunk to allow individuals to live, yet Bush expanded Big State and force-fed deficit-funded stimulus packages throughout his term….he did not preserve the Republic in its conception but expanded Federal Government and its deficits without finite limit
The Anchoress (if I may call you that, for that is what you will always be to me!) is not falling for anything. Go back and read the article again. She is calling for faith in the Lord and trust in the Holy Spirit. She is asking us to let go of our anger and put our priorities back in order. Let the Holy Spirit work. Take care of our own faithfulness and be vigilant. Happy Easter to all.
“We are also called to be wise as serpents and good stewards. You’re being neither.”
That is correct. Elizabeth Scalia needs to provide some examples to support her argument. There is indeed a fine line that should not be crossed. Nonetheless, those who adhere to traditional values cannot afford to allow the leftists to control the political agenda of the nation. One can vigorously fight for what’s right without abandoning their principles. Scalia seems to be defining love as mere mushy sentimentalism.
Life is often comprised of many “little battles”the loss of which have large and very lasting consequences. The selection of a judge maybe on the surface no big deal to most. “Roe v Wade” a very big and lasting decision. Christians need to be identified with what the they believe and that needs to be done in a spirit of love but stand we must. I am certain that when Christ through the money changers out of the temple that “proper” society wondered “what was his problem?” Remember the biblical admonition that Salt that losses it’s Saltiness is discarded.
The occasional “shove” Elizabeth is good for the spirit and I believe is not as off putting as you feel.
It’s nice to see a Christian who understands that followers of Jesus have strayed from the path, and wants to correct the error.
Peace.
DS
Save the unborn so you can send them to war.
This Easter, Christians might reflect upon whether getting involved in bare-knuckle politics and activism has actually hurt their cause.
Sure. Leaving the field wide open for atheists and Muslims will work.
You know folks – just a small thing worth noting in this little cultural battle: Google replaces its logo with a special little alternative logo for absolutely every little day worth any mention. Christmas, Valentines Day every artist’s birthday, every special “toe nail clipping celebration day” by every sub culture known to man. However, on this day – the one Christian holiday that can’t really be secularized, a day celebrated by billions of Christians, the day we remember the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ – nothing. Google considers Easter less important than Salvador Dali’s birthday and Groundhog Day.
We as Christians are not causing this. The US was created as a Christian nation – and remains so – despite the vocal but extremely small minority who wish it were not. It is a simple matter of historical fact. We are not a theocracy – because (unlike other religions) one must choose to be a Christian – Christianity can not be spread by the sword. But nonetheless, we were created as and remain a nation built on Christian values and a nation where most people consider them selves Christian.
Look around the world. Show me one Non- Christian nation that isn’t a sewer. Show me the formally atheist, Islamic, Hindu or Buddhist country you would live in. Show me one of those countries that would permit you to be anything else. Show me any of those countries that would even permit a discussion of the validity of the founding religion.
The US is a Christian nation. It is great in large part because of that fact. You should thank God for that fact – even if you are not Christian. Our nation would not be free otherwise.
It is clear to me that the cultural Marxists have been successful in wiping out the symbols and practices within our culture that once served to anchor us to the true reality of the history of salvation. Objectively, it no longer is a Christian nation. But that does not mean that there are not still a lot of Christians and their churches. As a Roman Catholic, I appreciate what Elizabeth Scalia is trying to inspire in her column. I have at times in the past been lax in the practice of my faith, but recent events have so jarred me that I am determined to return to a much more regular participation in the life of the Church. And I decide to live counter culturally. This is what we must do. In so doing, we become the leaven.
These times call us out to live in defiance of the trends. Let us live faithfully. We must live more lovingly, for what better way is there to verify the truth of the Savior’s example? And we must claw away in the darkness to cling to the strands of hope extended to us – and I quote a line from a song by Bruce Cockburn: “Got to kick at the darkness ’till it bleeds daylight.”
David wrote: “Elizabeth Scalia needs to provide some examples to support her argument… those who adhere to traditional values cannot afford…”
She provided the only example that is necessary: God’s Word Made Flesh, carried by the Holy Spirit. Unpack that a lot or a little and the point is the same: God has done, is doing, and will continue to do mighty works that surprise both His supporters and detractors. To the degree that we elevate things — even *good* things, like ‘traditional values’ — above Him, we run into trouble.
Happy Easter to all!
“Elizabeth Scalia needs to provide some examples to support her argument.”
Did you read this part? “I suggested in this space that Christians not waste this issue with the predictable cries of outrage that have proved ineffective in changing hearts and minds about abortion. For that, I was accused of being “a tool” of both Obama and of Satan, one who did not sufficiently love Jesus or babies.”
I don’t understand why this article is appropriate for PajamasMedia. Its more appropriate for a religious site, not a politics site.
Ms. Scalia:
“Christians are supposed to be “in the world but not of the world.” By embracing the political methods of “the world,” we set ourselves up for defeat, for scripture tells us it is Satan who offers “all the kingdoms of the world in their magnificence” (Matthew 4:8).”
It is not we who will be defeated, but Satan.
It is not we who will be victorious, but the Almighty.
The Holy Ghost does not need the likes of us to give it room to work. It works as it will.
Whether we share in Satan’s defeat or the Lord’s victory is largely a matter of our actions.
What good we may do in this world belongs to God.
The evil we commit belongs to us.
And it may not be so easy for us to discern which is which.
Is this not why we He has offered us His Salvation through Confession, Penance and Redemption?
I may be carrying a cross also, but don’t think for a minute that I don’t know that I fully deserve to be nailed to it.
What makes me Christian is not MY punishment, but HIS.
He was blameless, and I am not.
And if He deems me worthy of it, I ask His forgiveness.
I believe that he will grant it. For He has indicated that that is His will.
And that, too, is what makes me a Christian.
13. GDT . . . Hey, G, Jesus here. You need to shut your piehole. You’re making me look bad. America wasn’t created as a Christian nation. It was created as a nation free of a single religion. That’s why my name doesn’t appear anywhere in the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution.
You say, “One must choose to be a Christian – Christianity can not be spread by the sword.”
But you folks haven’t been doing a very good job of that now have you? More people have been killed “in my name” than any other. Why do you keep doing that?
You say, “Look around the world. Show me one Non- Christian nation that isn’t a sewer.”
Is that really what you think of your brothers and sisters in nor out of Christ? Is Israel a sewer? Is Japan a sewer? Is Iraq a sewer now that you’ve won the war and everything has been solved there? (Unless the war isn’t really won, in which case I’ve been hearing things I shouldn’t be hearing.)
Judge not lest yo be judged, G. If you’re a Christian, you can’t just pick and choose which parts of my philosophy you like . . . or the ones that are convenient to your lifestyle. You’re either in or you’re out. That’s how you see me, right? I’m an all or nothing deal, right?
Of course, that’s not how I see me, but you’re not meant to understand everything, only that which you are capable of understanding. For some people, all they need is those 10 Commandments. KISS . . . Keep It Simple Supplicant. Other people respond to other forms of invitation . . . other doorways . . . those things you call religiion. You see, the only thing you have to do as one of my humans is to recognize the presence and power of god. How you get to me is your business.
So stop being exclusive. Stop being violent. Stop killing people as if you’re doing me a favor. Don’t worry about the gays . . . they’re nice people just like you. Don’t worry about guns . . . worst thing I ever created. Don’t listen to the crazies . . . in church or out of church. And don’t feign a Christian lifestyle when your only interest is in controlling or forbidding the behavior of people who aren’t like you. That shit really pisses me off.
Now give me two Hail Mary’s, a novina, and 50 push-ups and get the hell out of here.
TO: Elizabeth Scalia, et al.
RE: Silence?
“This Easter, Christians might reflect upon whether getting involved in bare-knuckle politics and activism has actually hurt their cause.” — Elizabeth Scalia
Neither John the Baptist nor the Christ were ‘silent’ about what they recognized as being ‘wrong’.
And why should we care what the World thinks of us? Christ warned us that it would hate us.
As the disciples stood before the Sandhedrin, governors and kings and were beaten and killed for their faith, why should we shirk? I’m particularly reminded of Stephen who was falsely accused and murdered for his bold statements against his equivalent of our Congress. And I have to wonder, are you setting the stage again? Here?
But what should we care? What or rather Who should take priority in our lives and beliefs? This band of latter-day Pharisees we have in Congress? Or Someone else?
Hope that helps.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[So that we may boldly say, The Lord is my helper, and I will not fear what man shall do unto me. -- Hebrews 13:6]
TO: one on her own
RE: Judgment
“Judge not lest yo be judged, G.” — one on her own
We do not judge. Nor do we condemn. But we do speak out against men (and women) who do evil and call it ‘good’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter! -- Isaiah 5:20]
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Well Said
“And that, too, is what makes me a Christian.” — Bilgeman
Indeed….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[He is risen!]
TO: All
RE: Oh. Great….
“It’s nice to see a Christian who understands that followers of Jesus have strayed from the path, and wants to correct the error.” — David S
A ‘minister’ from what looks for all the world to me to be The Church of the Poisoned Mind knows more about Christianity than all the REAL christians here.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. If you doubt this analysis of David S, check out his reply to my simple question asked of him at….
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/obama-the-pitchfork-operator-a-remake-of-the-soviet-classic/comment-page-1/#comment-236673
Item #173.
P.P.S. I used to think that the ‘S’ in David S stood for ‘stupid’. But in his comment at #170, he intimated it stood for something much worse. Hence my observation about the ‘church’ he ministers too…..
TO: Meryl
RE: Keep It Up!
“…one of the reasons I keep commenting (to more or less effect) is to sharpen my thinking and my reasoning and to demonstrate (to myself if no one else) that I WILL take the opportunity to take a stand against the lies and destructions that we are being engulfed with.” — Meryl
As it is written….
Iron sharpeneth iron; so a man sharpeneth the countenance of his friend. — Proverbs
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Welcome to the 'Party', pal! -- Bruce Willis, Die Hard]
Thank you, Cunnel.
Noted that David S. and my own grody little blog-slave are two who presume to judge those they accuse of judging.
You are fulfilling your Blog-Master’s commandment well, my little mutant pet.
You make yourself more offensive and ridiculous by the very hour.
I am entertained.
By all means, continue in your unclean acts of public self-pollution.
19. one of my own: Thanks so much! You make my point better than I ever could.
Loud, foul mouthed demagogues without a point who simply oppose everything that is good without an alternative are sad in the extreme. I feel sorry for you.
Try to have something to be “for”. It is easy to be against.
I imagine that this helps explain some of the resistance to organized Christianity in this day and age. Personally, I have pretty much given up on all of the mainline protestant denominations because I know if I go in those churches, I will be fed a steady stream of left-leaning pablum masked as religious doctrine. On the other hand, I don’t seek out ultra-conservative churches, because my views on religious matters aren’t of the fundamentalist variety, nor am I comfortable in mega-churches or charismatic ones. Although I respect Pope Benedict, I have no interest in Catholicism (because I am much more of a protestant by nature). I’m sure I’m not the only one who feels this way.
TO: All
RE: Heh
Working on the Easter feast and listening to good Christian music and listening to the Newsboys hit, “I’m Not Ashamed”.
Scalia’s article is tweaked by the lyrics….
“I’m not ashamed to let you know.
I’m not ashamed to let it show.
I’m not ashamed to speak the name, of Jesus Christ.”
One verse in particular stands out….
“What are we sneaking around for?
Who are we trying to please?
Shrugging off sin;
Apologizing.
Like we’re spreading Some kind of disease.”
From reading her article, I get the distinct impression that maybe….just MAYBE….Elizabeth is somewhat ‘ashamed’. Perhaps something to do with ‘peer pressure’?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[He is risen!]
TO: GDT
RE: one on her own
“19. one of my own: Thanks so much! You make my point better than I ever could.” — GDT
That business on her part was very illuminating. I doubt if any REAL christian would be so ignorant of Christian ethics, let alone Christ and try to come across as THE Christ. And do such a shoddy job of it.
Not that I’m judging her, but I wouldn’t want to have to do the ‘tap-dancing’ I suspect she’s going to have to do before the Judgment Seat. I’m not that good at ‘dancing’. Maybe she’s better….but I have serious doubts…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[It's not nice to mince words. Especially Christ's.]
Happy Easter Everyone.
Religion and politics dont mix, have never. Politics is the art of compromise, religion does not tolerate compromise. When these two forces meet, the result is tragedy and terror and always will be, History has too many examples.
If Christ wanted bare knuckle fights, he could have simply spoken out. He did not. He found a better way, feeding the soul and body. And he didnt bother asking them what religion they were…they were simply taken in and fed, housed, clothed and if infirmed cared for. He spent his time with prostitutes, beggars, lepers and criminals instead of Kings. If he wanted to spend time with his own he would have never left Temple, instead he travelled among ghettos and landscape of Israel.
I wish there had been more left of what Christ actually did, instead of so many books trying to interpret his teachings, The examples speak volumes.
Happy Easter.
TO: GDT
RE: one on her own and Elizabeth Scalia, Together At Last
“Hey, G, Jesus here. You need to shut your piehole.” — one on her own
I’m reminded of what Klavan argued in his PJTV item….
http://www.pjtv.com/video/PJTV_Daily/Klavan_on_the_Culture%3A_Shut_Up/1612/
….Shut Up!
Typical ‘progressive’ response when they can’t refute what is being said.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. I had no idea Elizabeth was a ‘progressive’……
#26 GDT:
“Try to have something to be “for”.”
What my grody little blog-slave is “for” is the idle entertainment of his betters.
He is like a deaf and blind obese stripper with a harelip and a club-foot.
Not what you expected,and not what he imagines, but fascinating to observe all the same.
And just think, he performs his mutant freak-show here for free…
I highly recommended to all and Elizabeth Scalia a very good book to read, “The Closing of the Western Mind: the rise of faith and the fall of reason” by Charles Freeman (not to be confused with another Charles “Chas” Freeman). It’s a great, engaging read and certainly help you understand how Christianity really came to be between 1st and 5th centuries.
TO: Bob
RE: Missing the Point, You Are
“….help you understand how Christianity really came to be between 1st and 5th centuries.” — Bob
This is the 21st Century, Bob.
Most of us—particularly the REAL christians—understand “how Christianity really came to be”. Only the ignorant might care to read that book. And, based on ‘gut feeling’ on my part, that book probably won’t help those people become more knowledgeable about Christ than the likes of David S or one on her own.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Speaking of “The Closing of the Western Mind”, I’d suggest that title sounds more like projection than anythink else.
How so?
Because who has the more ‘closed’ mind? Someone who believes in hope? Or someone who says there is no ‘hope’?
Captain Phillips has been freed.
Thanks to the Navy, and Thanks to the Lord.
*ouch*
We have blasphemy on Easter Sunday?
Yaknow, just when I think I’ve seen it all on the ‘internetz’ someone goes and proves me wrong.
Well, all I can say is God loves us [warts and all] but he has a temper and he/she does get angry and it’s a good thing he gave his only begotten son for our sinnin’ ways [which I certainly don't deserve but am mighty glad for the sacrifice of God's ultimate gift of pure love and forgiveness].
I’m just very glad I have the freedom to pray to my Lord, share my opinions and give thanks for the blessings I have. God has been far too good to me and I’m humbled that he has bestowed me with so much goodness.
God bless us all and God Bless the USA.
Delia
#30 Alex: Point well made. The Jews expected the Messiah to come to earth as a political leader. Instead, He came to earth as a heart and soul leader. Change the heart, save the soul, and good politics should follow.
We have been “blessed” (if you want to call it that) with free will. We can choose to follow Jesus or not. Once a follower, we can choose to implement His teachings in our daily lives or not. We can choose to teach the same way He taught, or we can avoid all discussion of our faith with non-believers.
God could have created us as creatures of total obedience to him. Instead, he gave us free will, so that when we choose him, it’s done with our own hearts, rather than a false-devotion, devoid of willing conviction and commitment. I don’t know about other people, but I would rather have people love me of their own free will, not because I have ordered them to love me.
By the way, One of some one’s own: when Jesus said “Judge not…” he wasn’t talking about withholding judgement from people’s wrong doing. He was telling us to not judge other people’s hearts or their faith in God, as no one person is capable of really knowing what’s in another’s heart. Only God has access to it.
Silence in the face of evil is not virtuous. Pray and sign petitions and protest abortionists in power. Do not obey demands of silence because evil flourishes in silence. It is not all rosy and sweet being a Christian. The ones who advocate for evil will always hate Christians as they hated Jesus before us. This work of protecting the innocent is the Holy Spirit working through us.
Its always white , Republican Christians or George Bush in whom the fault lies. And we accept that fact . We are flawed ,failed sinners and we strive for the things which resonate in peoples hearts. The fact is though we be sinners , we know the glory which awaits us. Grace and faith have been granted to us and at some future moment every life will be transformed instantly. I get a thrill just thinking about that.
Of course most of you dismiss this as childish nonsense . That marks the distinction between us and you and when the moment comes you will wish you had found some faith.
TO: Bilgeman
RE: [OT] Thanks for the Heads-Up
Just posted the flag on the front porch.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[God bless the SEALs!]
TO: Alex
RE: Ignorant You Are
“Religion and politics dont mix, have never.” — Alex
I offer you this truth…
All law is based on morality. All morality is based on ‘religious’ perspective.
Think upon it….
….and learn.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Those who would treat politics and morality apart will never understand the one nor the other. -- John, Viscount Morley of Blackburn]
P.S. If you read this in a particualr manner, you begin to realize that the so-called ‘progressives’ have NO morality, i.e., they are sociopaths…..
Thanks Chuck(le) for adding that. I meant to include that point in my little diatribe, but forgot.
It is comforting to see many truth filled comments based on faith and knowledge. There are many… but #41 really sticks out doesn’t it?
#37 Moogie,
I agree with what you wrote. About the comment of “one of my own” re. the “judge not…” I’ve seen this kind of slippery use of scripture before. The cultural Marxists are trained well. They use this, not because they believe in Jesus’ words or deeds, but seek only to use them to keep us from criticizing their behavior and lifestyles. We have clear standards, which are not negotiable within a post-modernist framework of epistemology. It does not mean that we hate the sinner. But we are to speak the truth to power, regardless of who holds that power. And just because we Christians are sinners too does not absolve us from the responsibility of speaking the truth and being, however imperfect we are, prophetic and moral in our judgments.
I see.
So I should just keep quiet and ignore the killing of innocents in the womb, even when my employer tells me to kill them or lose my job.
So I should just keep quiet when the powers that be ridicule and distort what Christians believe because our quiet monogamous life is a threat to the “sex and the city” idea of sexuality.
so I should just keep quiet and ignore when the government gives taxpayer money to NGO’s that will intimidate and bribes the elites in Catholic and Muslim countries to implement abortion on demand and forced sterilization for population control.
No, no political involvement here, folks, just keep quiet.
TO: tioedong
RE: Yeah….
“So I should just keep quiet and ignore….” — tioedong
…as Klavan pointed out in his PJTV item, I cited in item #31 in this thread….
….Shut Up! Elizabeth Scalia and other ‘progressives’ around the world do not care to hear what you have to say about their mass murder for the sake of selfishness.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Keep the Faith!
P.P.S. Anyone here want to ‘talk’ to me about any of this, I’ll be at the C’Springs Tea Party this Wednesday. Look for the banner that reads….
Stop the Insane Jackasses
Counter culture, what a laugh. The worst enemies of Christianity are the theocons who signed on to the whole GOP Bush agenda. You compromised your religioned by serving the war, business and government industry. You got what you deserved, you have the gall to call yourself prolife while bragging about your guns and cheerleading us into more war.
Some people just don’t have the intellect or integrity to notice just how ironic they are.
Pelto
What about mass murder for the sake of an unnecessary war?
You are such a petty little mind, the classic theocon.
Those people in Toronto who replaced the name of Jesus and who purposely disregard most of the things that typically go on at Christian churches, aren’t Christian. They are about as Christian as Richard Dawkins or the Dalai Llama. They can call themselves Christians all they want, but they aren’t. N. Korea calls itself a Democratic Peoples Republic, but it’s not Democratic, it’s not a Republic and it’s not for the people.
As a human being, Elizabeth, if you saw a fellow human being go to “hell” or any such bad place would you not do something to warn them and attempt to stop that? At the end of our lives we will all be accountable for own actions so as a human being you have no obligation to stop them from going to hell.
As Christians, however, we have the obligation to share the Good News of salvation that keeps all of us from going there. Christianity has the answer but for many in this forum and including perhaps you, all want to be left alone and attempt to stifle the only news that can save. Yes you can shut me down and there will be a time very soon when you will not have the Christian message of hope to hear any more, but until then let us all be salt to this wicked and perverse world…
#45 Chuck Pelto:
Re: Check fire!
“Elizabeth Scalia and other ‘progressives’ around the world do not care to hear what you have to say about their mass murder for the sake of selfishness.”
Hang on a minute, there, Pancho!
Ms. Scalia isn’t, to my knowledge, what is popularly known as a “Progressive”, and I’ve been reading some of her copy for years.
In fact, her blog, The Anchoress, is held in very high esteem in the regions of the Conservative Values Blogosphere that I’ve haunted in the years since you and I would swap wisecracks over the hue and cry at m.a.m.
My take on Ms. Scalia is that she represents a very deep and strong tradition of monastic Catholicism…the “Anchoress”,see?
As such, she’s probably of the stripe who would rather wall off the world outside and devote her time to prayer and study of the divine.
When you’ve lived most of your life cloistered in a convent, Times Square would be rather a fundamental shock to one’s system.
Ms. Scalia looks out of her window and sees ugly people doing uglier things, and is perhaps reminded of WHY her cell looked so good in the first place. She’s apparently asking us why we also do not retreat to a “happy place”.
I’d characterize her post here as a reaction to what she sees. I appreciate her point of view, but the cells that I inhabit are not always by my own choice, and are not always places of refuge and peace.
She’s a lucky woman to have the luxury of disengaging from the world.
Not really a Progressive, but rather someone who is apt to float far above it all, and wonder at all the smoke and noise down below, where hard-nosed and thick-skinned veteran assh+les like you and I think nothing of joyously piling up heaps of virtual human numb-skulls.
That all said, her warning IS relevant and well-received. If we’re not very careful, we can become the very dragons that we do battle against.
Chuck Pelto writes . . . “We do not judge. Nor do we condemn.”
Do you mean today? Hope so, cuz I’m gonna put that quote aside for future reference. Don’t make yourself out to be a liar. You know, when you say things like . . . “Shut Up! Elizabeth Scalia and other ‘progressives’ around the world do not care to hear what you have to say about their mass murder for the sake of selfishness.”
Wow, that didn’t take long. Didn’t even have to wait for the Easter Exemption to pass. You just can’t help it, can you? I’ll add some more gong forward.
#4, Meryl wrote “I agree that just being outraged all the time is not effective and never has been. One of the apparent gifts of the left is that they do indeed have a capacity for being perpetually angry and always have a target in mind for that anger, logic and good be damned. We don’t have the instinct for that. So it has made me wonder how we are going to sustain our resistance. Based on conversations with fellow believers, I believe we’re learning and will get better at it.”
This is a thoughtful comment. The left has boundless energy for anger because they do not have Christ.
Christians who do overembrace their anger like to use SINGLE example of Jesus’ anger, in the Temple, to justify their leftist-style ranting. In truth, Jesus engaged the politicians of his time with his wit and intelligence, not with bellicosity.
Is the faith wellserved by overattention to the political? When does it become idolatry is a good question. The church faced much worse persecution in its formation, when martyrs were passive and killed. It was their passivity and their LOVE, even for their killers, that turned hearts toward the Christian way. And Christ told us the world would hate us. When Christians can’t even be civil to other Christians unless they’re in perfect conformity with one’s own opinions, then we’ve gotten off track.
It’s certainly something to think about at Easter. Maybe we will need to be martyrs again. Maybe overangry Christians are simply destroying themselves as a group and making themselves unattractive to the world because they’re acting just like the world.
Chuck Pelto, et al?
Re: Silence?
Where did this writer tell the Christians they should be silent?
#48 HoWells:
“You are such a petty little mind, the classic theocon.”
And what are you? Albert effin’ Schweitzer?
Take some advice from someone who’s known Colonel Pelto for 15 years.
Disappear.
Right now, you’re the King of the Derelict Lifeboat with your rusty AK-47 charge of “Hypocrisy!”.
But you have no earthly idea of just how much ordnance is being trained on you, or the will to use it…wantonly and repeatedly, and then a few dozen times more, (just to make sure the point has been made).
Disappear…*poof!*
Like a beer-fart in a typhoon.
Best advice you’ll get all day, chum.
I think it is illogical at the least and scurrilous at best to attribute unarticulated beliefs to an author beyond what she has written.
All that I saw in Ms. Scalia’s article was the hope that we not forget that sometimes evil happenings bring great blessings. President Obama was elected because many of our centrist voters fell for the idea that he would govern from the center rather than from the left.
Sometimes, even God give us enough rope to hang ourselves. Sometimes we have to suffer the consequences of our actions before we can all “see” what our actions have brought about. So praying that God’s will be done, that millions of people who voted for Barack Obama might come to recognize his lack of experience and core far-leftist beliefs may be the only way to have a chastened and far more educated electorate voting in future elections.
Words, experience, and actually voting for and against, rather than present, matter. Please, God, let us all learn that before the next elections.
Here you go. I think this was a pre-teabag prayer meeting. Seeing this makes me even more certain that the right guy is in the White House and that the liberal movement has nothing to worry about in the near future. The first time somebody rolls a donut through the crowd the tea party will be over.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/04/12/tea-party-insanity-burn-a_n_185991.html
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Scalia as a ‘Progressive’
“Ms. Scalia isn’t, to my knowledge, what is popularly known as a “Progressive”, and I’ve been reading some of her copy” — Bilgeman
I’ve read her ‘copy’ here for some time too. And THIS item is indicative of something contrary to what I’ve seen heretofore.
Seriously. She’s proposing what? That we REAL christians should ‘Shut up!”?
It looks like that to me. And not only me, based on what I’ve read here today.
This item may be a misstep on her part. I hope to God it is and that she realizes its problems. But if she continues in this vein…..cuidado compadre.
We’ll see…..
In the meantime, my previous comments here still stand.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out....]
Elizabeth Scalia is NOT a “progressive” Catholic. It is very interesting that the secularists condemn her and the literalist evangelicals condemn her. Nowhere has she said to not publicly denounce the culture of death. All she is calling for is to not hitch our carts to any political machine or party. I agree with her. I’m a veteran of the Liberation Theology movement (I broke with Marxism in 1987)and I saw how Leftist Christians hitched their carts to totalitarian Marxist groups and governments, only to be disappointed and co-opted by the Communists. Some realized that they had been had, and reversed course back towards a more traditional understanding of the faith and to hew more closely to the Church’s social teachings rather than Marxist analysis. And some decided to leave the Church and cling to the Communists.
We have arrived at a point in our nation’s history where the vast majority of the young have been totally immersed in the cultural Marxism and imitation European hedonism of the late 20th century. We have to find a way to begin a conversation with them, on the intellectual and moral merits of our position, using theology, philosophy, and the sciences, and plant seeds in their minds which hopefully will bear fruit with time. This should be a much higher priority than trying to join ourselves at the hips with any political party.
Well, it seems to me that Christians in general, since the 60′s and thereabouts, have been mostly tolerant, compassionate and eager to try and amend their supposedly wrong-headed ways—so much so, in fact, that many of them, like the Episcopalians, watered down the faith so much, and became so sweet and all-inclusive that they’re: 1. Now a joke; 2. Losing their congregations, and, worst of all, 3. They’re alienated from Christ, existing mainly to push the progressive gospel of feminism, the gay agenda, abortion and “social justice” (i.e. Marxism).
Really, look at the mainline Protestant churches these days? Is there anybody, other than the Nation of Israel, they condemn, or take a stance against?
I believe Ms. Scalia really does believe that dialogue, and “showing we’re Christians by our love” can heal this, but, in order to have a dialogue, you need two speakers. The Left isn’t willing to talk to us supposedly redneckChristianista facists.
I invite the Anchoress to take a look at some of the posts on her earlier thread. The pro-abortion crowd didn’t really want to debate, they wanted to lay down the law.
It’s the 11th hour; sadly, the time for winning people over by compassion, and understanding, is, sadly, over. It’s time for straight talk, and not giving in. I have to agree with another poster, in that this post sounds more like sentimentality, and wishful thinking.
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Those ‘Darned(?)’ Dragons
“That all said, her warning IS relevant and well-received. If we’re not very careful, we can become the very dragons that we do battle against.” — Bilgeman
Always a potential problem. However, I’m perceiving that Scalia thinks we should ‘Shut Up!’. Why? Because she thinks it is ‘politically impractical’…..
….as if I gave a good d— about ‘practicality’ over the ‘Truth’.
We’ll have to see what comes of it. But….
….in the meantime…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[God is alive....and airborne-ranger qualified.....]
#60 fred:
“And some decided to leave the Church and cling to the Communists.”
Just out of curiosity, how’d that work out for them?
Talk about making the writer’s point for her!
Pelto – in my last comment I hadn’t realized that you’d hijacked the thread. Now that I have read all of the comments, I am worried about the state of Christianity.
Some of these comments make me wonder if you are leftists masquerading as Christians to give them bad names. When did Jesus say “be insufferable for my sake?”
Lots of talking, not much actual thinking. This essay doesn’t say anyone should shut up. Doesn’t say not to get political, but suggests that perhaps Christians are losing themselves by adopting leftist methods. It’s a fair question, being ignored, by Christians acting like Kos-style leftists spewing hate.
#62 Chuck Pelto:
” However, I’m perceiving that Scalia thinks we should ‘Shut Up!’. Why? Because she thinks it is ‘politically impractical’…..
….as if I gave a good d— about ‘practicality’ over the ‘Truth’”
Uh-huh…your eyes are glazing over.
Look, Colonel, you know that I enjoy your berserker rage more than anybody.
“Napalm!”
you shout into the radio…
“Drop MORE Napalm!”
And from the bilges of the loaded supertanker, I fire back:
“Comin’ right up, Cunnel!”
It’s fun and rewarding on many many different levels.
But I’m inclining in this instance to suspect that Ms. Scalia may have some of them there “Tactics” things in mind…ergo her idea of “practicalities”.
So she’s a pretty and delicate daisy growing in the middle of a free-fire zone.
She may not be a cleverly camouflaged Progressive at all.
She may indeed be just a daisy growing in a battlefield.
I happen to LIKE daisies.
A lot of people eventually become disillusioned with the vacuity of the post-modernist Left. For the intelligent, the sensitive, and the brave those moments of cognitive dissonance can pile up until one day the dam breaks.
Many of these kids and young adults have run from families and situations where Christianity was shoved down their throats without the possibility of “reasoning together” in order to arrive at those moments of insight whereby both Church doctrine and the wisdom in the Bible make sense to them.
The most difficult virtue to practice during a crisis can be patience.
64. Jbl: . . . “Pelto – in my last comment I hadn’t realized that you’d hijacked the thread. Now that I have read all of the comments, I am worried about the state of Christianity. Some of these comments make me wonder if you are leftists masquerading as Christians to give them bad names.”
And so it has come to this, wether it’s about the teabags or the Jesus, you’re so desperate/paranoid/lost/afraid of responsibility that you can’t trust your own. Yo have to set up some plausible deniability around E_V_E_R_Y_T_H_I_N_G. “It wasn’t us at our party, it was them.”
Reagan would be proud. Keep it up. Pretty soon you’re all gonna be living in Bilgeman’s house. (Don’t mind his collection of ordinance and hobby tools – he calls them dishwasher safe sex toys – he’s a good Krischun.)
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Perhaps….
….it’s a combination of my ‘berserker’, i.e., 100% Nordic genes, vis-a-vis time in the infantry, and a perception that Lizie has gone to the ‘hatchete-job’ form of ‘christianity’. Lord knows we’ve seen the Methodists and Episcopalians slip away from the Word.
I recommend that we pay closer attention to what ‘she’ says. As far as THIS item is concerned….
….it’s definitely, in my professional opinion, contrary to Christian ‘ethics’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[A tree is known by its fruit. -- Some Wag about 2000 years ago, whose resserection we celebrated this day.]
P.S. The Truth will out….
TO: Horace Wells
RE: Petty?
“What about mass murder for the sake of an unnecessary war?
You are such a petty little mind, the classic theocon.” — Horace Wells
Show up in C’Springs this Wednesday for the Tea Party, and we can go for drinks at the Phantom Canyon Brewery an discuss your misconception in a more convivial environment.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Show me your Mensa membership ID card, and I’ll buy the first round of thinks…..
TO: Jbl
RE: Where?
“Where did this writer tell the Christians they should be silent?” — Jbl
Maybe you should go back and (1) open your mind and/or (2) improve your understanding of English as a teritiary langauge.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[One of the joys of English is it is so much 'fun' to understand what is being said. -- CBPelto]
TO: Jbl
RE: Worried?
“I am worried about the state of Christianity.” — Jbl
Talk to Him. Maybe He can help you.
Certainly anything He decides, I cannot overcome.
Pray, ‘brother’. Pray for me…..that I’m doing what is right…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Prayer helps.....]
TO: one on her own
RE: Judgment
“Do you mean today? Hope so, cuz I’m gonna put that quote aside for future reference. Don’t make yourself out to be a liar.” — one on her own
I think we’ve crossed paths in this thread often enough that you know the truth of our discussion and, more importantly, my statements.
So…..
….how is it that you think I’ll lie about Him?
Or is it just ‘wishful thinking’ on your part?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out....and one on her own is NOT going to like it.....]
#67, I wasn’t looking for plausible deniability. I was being ironic and trying to tell my fellow Christians that they were THAT troubling to me.
You’re paranoid too.
#54 JbL:
“The church faced much worse persecution in its formation, when martyrs were passive and killed. It was their passivity and their LOVE, even for their killers, that turned hearts toward the Christian way. And Christ told us the world would hate us.”
Their hatred of us is no reason for us to change who or what we are to satisfy their demands, and nor is it reason for us to endorse, by commission or omission, their agenda.
They will hate us regardless.
It is not my tradition, but another poster mentioned another faith that has essentially neutered itself and stands on the brink of schism by doing just that.
I reject their hate and I reject their false premises, because apparently anything we say or do will be characterized as “hate”.
We are also citizens of this country, and have as much right to advance our agenda based on what common values we share based on our faith, as they do to peddle whatever bogus hokum they’re selling this week.
The Christ sent us out as sheep amongst he wolves. What you have to acknowledge, though, is that some of us have the courage to be warriors, but not he courage to be martyrs.
Even those early Christians did not practice their faith in public, so by the very act of hiding, what were they saying?
It’s a fine line between martyrdom and suicide.
#67 Grody Little blog-slave:
“Bilgeman’s house. (Don’t mind his collection of ordinance and hobby tools – he calls them dishwasher safe sex toys – he’s a good Krischun.)”
No, blog-slave, I am actually a pretty poor Christian.
But I try.
And I’m glad to see that you found the pagan “Easter Basket” I prepared for you.
I know that you’re uhhh…lonely.
You’ll have to figure out how to use them on your own, though, since the instructional video that they came with would have only confused you further…there were no wall urinals, institutional toilet paper holders or electric hand-dryers on the studio set.
And I know that your usual environment for intimate human contact involves all of these elements.
Your Blog-Master was thinking of you, little mutant…have a Happy Easter.
Things are going to happen the way the Lord means for them to, regardless of our (or anyone else’e) ranting. Let the Holy Ghost work His will, His way. That’s the whole idea behind “having faith”. Faith isn’t just believing in the Heavenly Father; it’s believing that He will make thing come out in His way, in His time. I really believe that He always answers our prayers, we just don’t always get the answer we want, or like. Patience. Trust. That’s faith.
TO: one on her own
RE: Actually….
“Reagan would be proud. Keep it up. Pretty soon you’re all gonna be living in Bilgeman’s house.” — one on her own
I could use a few more men familiar with weapons and explosives at MY place, too.
However, I’ll bet dollar against Krispy Kreme donuts you don’t have a ‘proverbial’ clue as to what use such skills would be.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Be prepared.....-- US Boy Scouts, i.e., young men with a purpose.....]
TO: Jbl
RE: An ‘Ironic’ Question for You
“I was being ironic and trying to tell my fellow Christians that they were THAT troubling to me.” — Jbl
Has the Christ come in the flesh?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. It’s a ‘Yes’ or ‘No’ sort of think…..
P.S. Lest I forget….
“You’re paranoid too.” — Jbl
A healthy sense of ‘paranoia’ keeps a soldier alive on the field of battle.
[If your not paranoid, it's because you aren't paying attention.]
I am sick and tired of the Liberal, Christianphobes who claim that more people have died thanks to individuals who have used the name of Christ in order to excuse their wars. This is the biggest, biggest lie every told by the left in the media, colleges, movies, etc, etc, etc. Sadly enough, people are so incredibly ignorant, that they swallow anything that is sold to them by someone they consider better educated than them.
THE FACT of the matter is that more people have died in wars that had nothing to do with religion than wars that had to do with religion. Most of human kinds’ wars have been about conquering, about politics. Look at all the wars during ancient times!!!! nothing to do with religion.
Learn your history! in a battle between Hannibal forces-Carthage against the Roman Empire, more than 70,000 people died in about 3 hours!!!!
Additionally, wars waged by under the flag of Islam have killed more people than any war waged under the flag of Christianity.
May want to look at the wars of the 18th, 19, 20 and 21st Century,99 percent of these wars were about politics, expansion, colonies revolting against their original country, etc. Very few were about expanding Christianity. The French and Indian War, the American Revolution, the Latin American colonies revolting against Spain and Portugal, WWI, WWII, Vietnam War, Korean War, Iraq War, Gulf War I, etc, etc, etc, etc all had to do with either politics or in one case, WWII, a nation, a group of people, the Nazis, using Darwinism to come to the conclusion that they were superior human beings and it was their duty to conquer everyone else.
It is so incredibly sad the amount of ignorant people that graduate from our universities. They are brainwashed by crazed out, foaming at the mouth, Liberal professors who have an agenda.
Christians leading political issues in protecting marriage, family and human life do not have to even use the words of God to argue their points. Every one of God’s laws that have been broken in this culture has clear social consequences of suffering. A young man, when going through college, was losing his faith. Some of the commandments no longer made sense to him after being beaten down daily in left wing classrooms and dorms. A friend suggested he investigate every one of the ten commandments to see if they were true – if there were really dark consequences for those who break them and for society at large.
He prayed, took the suggestion and dove into the project. His faith was restored. All the ten commandments matter to human life and society. Even the “intolerant” first commandment, which many Christians have a difficult time addressing with leftists, have obvious consequences. One I never thought of before was that it leads many to be harmed as they seek false gods and dark powers in harmful cults.
Finally, we, as Christians, are supposed to judge right from wrong based on the Bible and speak about why it is wrong in terms of consequences – what danger is presented to the people. But we are not to condemn people nor ourselves when we act wrongly. That is God’s job. It does no good to say to a non-believer that “it is wrong cause the Bible seys so” because that has no meaning to them.
Chuck,
They just cannot get over the war. The one that liberated over 50 million human beings. The one that continued after the Gulf War Truce was violated so many times we lost count. Before that, they protested the one that was waged to prevent the Communists from over running the Republic of Vietnam. Or the continuation of the Cold War when we were moving new weapons into Western Europe to check the Soviets. Yeah, I was on the Left in those days when the very same people were acting on Soviet dezinformatzia to protest Reagan’s countermoves.
The Left is only interested in “liberating” your property, your wealth, and your businesses. It’s called plundering. They are nothing but high class brigands and I spent ten years of my life in their company, quietly reading, watching, learning, questioning, and eventually deciding… that they were wrong about everything.
And, Ms. Scalia, it’s not the tactics some Christians are using that’s turned the Left against them; the Left does not like Judeo/Christianity. Never has, never will. Look at the persecution of Christians in Communist countries.
They’d be gunning for us, no matter what sort of tactics we use, and all the soft soap in the world isn’t going to make them like us.
Yes, CJ, Islam and Communism between them managed to kill off far many people than the Inquisition ever did.
It is, however, completely politically incorrect to point that out.
(It’s true, though).
Impressive that an article that questions Christian participation in politics includes an Easter picture by a Mormon artist. That can be taken so many interesting ways.
This supports my contention that too many professed Christians are too ready to use Caesar’s sword to do the Lords work.
Not too long ago our Roman Catholic Bishop called for more taxes to increase welfare spending. Charity is not a part of our Constitutional Government.
We are arguing over marriage licenses when we should be asking why the churches are allowing the Government to have a veto power over their sacraments.
We Christians are not helping the cause when we use the corrupt worldly means of Political Power to bring the Light to the world.
I believe that one of the prophecies in the bible is dealing with what the churches will be like when the time of the end is upon us. Many churches will be lukewarm and some will be cold. I do not believe all of them will be, but many are like this now. Jesus is knocking on some of their doors and they do not let him in.
About one out of every eight verses in the bible deals with prophecies, that is about 12.8 % is talking about the times we are living in now. This is what I truly believe.
I will not give up my beliefs for any person, or government et .al. It would be the same as giving up my eternal life in heaven and I will not do it. I will not bow down to any man, and I believe that we have the wrong leader for our country. I will fight for my beliefs, and I know I will not give in to evil. I believe we are not supposed to bow down to evil, not any kind of evil, be it an insane government or some murderer trying to kill us, but we are supposed to fight back. I also believe that Jesus will come back before things get bad for us. I know he will come twice.
I do not hate people that believe differently than I do, but I think they are wrong, and I know I am right for one reason, and that is my bible. I was taught in Sunday School that any person could be an angel and that I should treat all God’s children as I want to be treated, and I have always tried to do it, even looking on the homeless laying on a street as a possibility of good and not evil.
I think many of the televangelist are wrong, and I believe that many of them that are not preaching about the prophecies in the bible is not showing the light that is clearly there for all to read. They are doing this to sell a book or make more money, and they will not make the money in the collection plate if they tell the people things they do not want to hear. I think they are one of the lukewarm churches in the bible.
I know that Oprah is completely wrong when she said that there are many ways to get to heaven, and she is not a true Christian, there is no way she could be one and say what she said.
There is one way to get to heaven, and it is through Jesus Christ our Savior. This is my belief and I will not “Change”.
So sure and so smart, riddle me these:
Why did god make some people gay?
Is Mohammed in heaven? Is Buddha?
Did Jesus LOOK Jewish?
If someone dies and sees heaven and then comes back to life, did they really die in the first place?
Yeah, life has some big questions.
Wayne Anthony Ross said, “If a guy can’t rape his wife…who’s he gonna rape?”
Who is Mr. Ross? Sarah Palin’s pick for Alaska’s Attorney General. He’s a good Christian, too. Takes his faith very seriously.
Of course we all know that she’s a REAL American. And a REAL Christian. Just like you folks. You’re so lucky to have her and such insofar as things like this great country are concerned where job creation is the core of this amazing amazing productivity we call the American dream to be alive and well gosh wouldn’t you know just dandy from where I’m standing is all I can say to that.
# 41. Chuck Pelto:
TO: Chuck
Re: Read and research before posting
“All law is based on morality. All morality is based on ‘religious’ perspective”
This is your quotation, Stating that “All morality” is derived from “religious” perspective, and is patently false. franky am surprised nobody else called you on this ridiculous statement.
Morality derives from ethical theories, beliefs of universal right and wrong, philisophical teachings, and
the evolution of applied and situational ethics. There can be religious influence, but a blanket statement such as yours is patently absurd and flied in the face of human History and what we know of codified law such as Hammurabai and summurian writings.
The works of Plato and Aristotle are the foundation for much of western societies philosophy and ethics, and can be argued were one of the cornerstones to english law which is the basis for our present court system. If you wish to illuminate yourself, this would be a good place to start.
#88 grody blog-slave:
Your whining feeble attempts to vex your betters is almost endearing, but on the off-chance that you truly are seeking knowledge, let me, your Blog-Master, vanquish the hobgoblins that would bedevil your sputtering and flickering intellect:
“Why did god make some people gay?”
What makes you think that God made them thus? Earlier generations referred to them as being deviant and/or perverted. It may be that God did not make them so at all, but rather that Satan twisted them and led them astray from the path they should have taken.
“Is Mohammed in heaven? Is Buddha?”
Why do you care where they are? What should consume your conscience is whether YOU are going to Heaven or not.
“Did Jesus LOOK Jewish?”
Does it matter? His message was lived and spoken and written.
FWIW, though, his lineage back to King David was pretty thoroughly established through his mother Mary, so being that he was %100 Hebrew, he probably looked like a 1st century Hebrew, (which is not the same as “looking Jewish” at all).
“If someone dies and sees heaven and then comes back to life, did they really die in the first place?”
Don’t worry about it. One of these days you’ll find out for yourself.
Send us an e-mail or drop us a postcard.
“Yeah, life has some big questions.”
None of which seem to concern you. You just get hung up on trivia.
There, blog-slave, you can now resume your calling of making a pestiferous laughingstock of yourself with an untroubled mind.
91 Bulgepump . . . 0 for 5! Wow, that’s quite a hitting streak. No wonder you go through life with such certainty . . . you don’t think about anything. Ah, the serenity of an empty head. (Well, I guess your head isn’t empty ALL the time, is it Mr Gloryhole?)
And, trust me, the media would be examining Christians every Easter, no matter what they do. Why? They simply do not approve of us. The totalitarian Left has never liked Christians, or Jews; look at the history of the 20th Century. In their minds, we stand in the way of Utopia.
If Christians did become more loving, filled with the Holy Spirit, they would dislike us even more. I’m not saying that wouldn’t be a good thing, but you never, ever, try to change in the hopes that more people will like you. That never works (I’ve seen that close up, in the Episcopal Church). You change, because it’s the right thing to do, realizing all the while that those who disliked you before will dislike you ten times as much afterwards!
Jesus Christ (the Son of God) said–”Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brothers eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? How can you say to your brother, ‘Let me take the speck out of your eye, ‘ when all of the time there is a plank in your own eye? Mathew 7: 1-4 NIV
I feel any person can call out to Jesus and be saved, and he is there for all people. I believe Jesus died for all sins, for all mankind and any person can be saved. Jesus is King, but he did not spend his time on earth on a throne, he was walking with the poor and the meek, and teaching them. We are all sinners, and that is why he died for our sins.
Politics are very important to us, it does not matter what we are or who we are, and this is including Christians, because I know Israel is our timepiece and we are not supposed to turn on Israel. There are too many warnings in the old and new testaments and it is clear to me when I read it.
Jesus Christ is no pretty, effeminate, namby-pamby creature but a muscular man who could display rage against the moneychangers in God’s house and physically assault them to drive home his point. One of the reasons that the poll-taking critters are developing this ‘diminishing Christianity meme” is because they categorize people who belong to non-denominational churches as “not Christian” – and I wonder if they really care to hear what Catholics have to say! Since we are firm, for the most part [pandering politicians aside] and don’t mince words when pressed. I think at some point each individual must choose what works best for them. I make every effort to lead a Christian and good Catholic life of kindness and tolerance toward others, trying to hate the sin but love the sinner. I don’t ram my faith down other people’s throats, nor do I tolerate gross insults to Catholicism by the ignorant. At age 67, I feel entitled to be forthright and blunt in my locutions. What are people going to say? That I’m senile? I could give a rip!
Nice article. The bottom line is _faith_.
A question: how can we know that the Holy Spirit does not want us to be outspoken at this time and age? I find this quite difficult. Better to do our best and pray for God to guide us and use us as instrument of his peace.
Dear Anchoress,
As usual your writing inspires, uplifts, encourages, and exhorts. Thank you for the time you take to blog and to write.
Unfortunately, the Net has also given a platform to those voices who harbor anger, rage, bitterness and hatred and seek any opportunity to shower this acid rain on others.
It would be nice if rhetorical discourse were reawakened in the political arena – where transcendent morals could be discussed without the vitriol, but alas the Left continues in their shrill and base intonations, seeking to intimidate and marginalize all who disagree with them.
Keep writing, and be encouraged!
Dee
“you never, ever, try to change in the hopes that more people will like you”
WHERE did the writer say anyone should “change so more people will like Christians?”
Seems to me the piece is about changing to be more like Christians.
“This is a more constructive response than petitions and rants; it is a response that brings Christians together before God, in a positive and co-creative way, in keeping with our calling.”
Christians who truly love the Lord and have experienced a daily walk with Him would respond in this way. The problem is there are far too many Christians in name only, who’ve never experienced the life changing experience of the Holy Spirit. They might believe the biblical stories, or they were raised in a certain church, or they see Christianity as a social club. The person who truly seeks the will of Jesus daily; by, studying His word, would prayerfully ask Him to show the best way to respond in any given situation. We must stand against sin but we don’t do so by hating the sinner. Where is the love?
My biggest question is why doesn’t the leader of the Cathoilic church take a stand against evil?
Former Catholic.
Excellent, excellent reflection!
God Bless!
Heather
Jbl
Some quotes from the article: “Earlier, I suggested in this space that Christians not waste this issue with the predictable cries of outrage”, which, as she explains, will just alienate others, and just fall on deaf ears.
She also talks about the current Easter articles criticizing Christians, and goes on to say, “That Christians are seen as such is partly our own fault.” And, she quotes, “Christians are supposed to be in the world, not of the world.” Which, in this context, I can only take to mean, “Get out of the world, already, Christians!”
The entire jist of this article, and her previous one about Obama going to Notre Dame, seem to be that she’s telling us we should stop protesting against evil because our activism is offensive, and puts people off. Oh, she’s doing it very nicely, but this does seem to be her message; Christians, behave yourselves, and stop making the media not like you! People will like you better if you’re quiet. Which, maybe they will, but, like Olecram, I wonder if it really is silence that the Holy Spirit wants from us right now.
And, Jbl, I would like to suggest respectfully that when you, and the Anchoress, start laying down rules as to what are the proper ways for Christians to protest, and what does, and does not, constitute acting more like Christ, you’re frankly getting in over your heads. You’re also guilty of the same ranting, scolding behavior you allege too many pro-life Christians display.
hopeful, what evil in particular do you want the pope to take a stand against? There’s a lot of it out there.
And, if he does, you’ve got to promise not to get at him for “ranting”, or “acting just like our enemies.”
As for the church, just by being the church, it stands against evil; “And the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it.”
Talkinkamel – you didn’t get it. You can quote it, but you didn’t get it.
That seems to be the problem with a lot of Christians. They can quote it but they don’t get it. Saying “give the Holy Spirit room to work” is not the same as “get out of the world, Christians.”
But it’s all you hear.
That’s ego. That’s the Christian putting the world and his understanding of it before the possibilities of the Holy Spirit.
I’d tell you to think about that, but you’d just tell me it was “ranting, scolding behavior.”
Typical…when she writes a column criticizing other Christians for getting involved in politics, it’s OK…when she is criticized for those columns, she “winces for Christianity”…do as I say, not as I do…Jesus said “the world hated me for I testified of it’s wickedness…how much more will they hate you for being my desciple” and “those who seek seek the approval of men will get it at the expense of the approval of God”.
This is a Christ hating world and to rage against it’s wickedness is exactly what we are to do. As for the abortion debate, we won that long ago except for the courts where we have been betrayed by either bad judgement (Reagan appointing O’Connor) or appointees who betrayed their earlier decisions (Souter & Kennedy).
She is right about one thing…Satan is the ‘god’ of this world, so trying to curtail our activities or principles or poliltics to gain the approval or better image of Jesus’ sworn enemy makes no sense to me.
Jesus talks about His sheep knowing His voice and responding to it in a calling out of the world. To me the religious right, so despised and hated by the media and the rest of the ‘world’ system is that flock being called out of the world…who know their Shephard’s voice and are responding…
to TalkinKamel,
The evil of which I speak is the awarding of an honorary degree from the world’s foremeost Catholic University to a president who is against life, freedom and the pursuit of happiness. His first day in office he signed legislation which uses our tax payer dollars to pay for international abortions. He is robbing our children of their future and us of our liberty. The Pope either stands for life or he does not. By remaining silent while millions of his flock are crying for leadership is wrong.
Former Catholic
A sign that we live in a country founded by Puritans: An article like this generates additional efforts to curse the darkness rather than to light a candle.
God is love not hate. God gets angry and his anger turned to love because he truly loves us. How many times have you gotten angry at your own child? How many times have you gotten at yourself [god's child]. We are imperfect. God is perfect and he was disappointed that his children were not and therefore it made GOD imperfect which made god angry with himself. He made many imperfect individuals including Lucifer.
So? Does this make GOD imperfect for making imperfect creations? NO. Imperfection is the humility for which we humble ourselves before GOD. God, our creator loves us and judges us and forgives us by the sacrifice of his own child. He gave us ‘free will’ and found that with that ‘free will’ we were sinners.
I’m a sinner. I’m not worthy of God. -But, I pray to him and hope for his love and forgiveness just the same.
P.S. God knows humility too otherwise he would not have sacrificed his only begotten son. God has a heart and he weeps for us. He created us with love not realizing that hate could also exist but he forgot his own temper and he was in love with us. God listens if you believe. I’m a prime example of someone surviving an incredible journey of hurt and pain and overcoming it.
We can fight. We can even fight hard, a outrance, unsparingly.
But we must be happy warriors, not an aggrieved former majority longing for the glory days.
And we have a wonderful reason to be happy warriors. Really! We do!
As we make war against every heresy, every prideful attitude, every confusion, every lie, every evasion, that raises itself up against human dignity and the knowledge of the love of Christ, we must (by God’s grace) keep watch over our inward demeanor.
When our spirits begin to resent the effort required — when our flesh begins to mutter and whine “Why do I have to expend such effort? Why must I struggle so? It’s not fair!!!” — that is the time to “give it up to God.”
That is the time to suddenly relax (feel our shoulders lower and our brows unfurrow) and realize that — amazing thought! — if we are uncomfortable and if trials abound, it means that (right here and right now) we’re racking up crowns in heaven and participating (in some tiny but tangible way) in the sufferings of Christ, for His glory and our betterment.
Which is to say: We’re okay. In fact, at that moment, we’re better than okay: We’re at our post, responding to the call, growing in grace. (Have you really thought, really felt, about how fantastic that reality is?!)
Happy warrior, indeed, who fights the good fight against all the nasty libels of lying mass media with a smile in his soul, because he knows he’s where he is supposed to be, and that the unfairness is serving a purpose, and that God is in control, is sovereign, and still — still!!! — has the whole world in His hands.
Elizabeth should take more note of the other sins in America:
It should be good news that at least one sector of our economy is thriving but, unfortunately for pre-born human life, that fact represents very bad news.
With approximately 50,000,000 legal abortions already performed in America since Roe v. Wade, the leader in the highly lucrative business of killing the pre-born has announced its bottom line is looking just peachy keen. “The Planned Parenthood Federation of American [PPFOA] released its annual report for 2007-2008 last week, revealing record net assets of $1.014 billion and an increase of 15,560 more abortions in 2007 than the previous year:” http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=46449.
Rendering that success even peachier, that CNS report includes what may be a revelation to some, namely that “The American taxpayer also contributed more than ever before, with $349.6 million of Planned Parenthood’s funding coming from government grants and contracts.”
The PPFOA is right up there with politicians as the most deceptive and hypocritical group in our country but, whereas politicos are generally understood to be liars and cheats, the PPFOA is considered fairly reputable. Witness that $349.6 million of hard earned taxes which goes into its coffers, thanks to you, me, and everyone else, which monies would never be funneled into a disreputable organization, right?
Why is the PPFOA deceptive, hypocritical, and disreputable? Let’s start with its very name which suggests it is an altruistic association dedicated to “planning parenthood” when, in truth, it has achieved over a billion dollars in assets largely by virtue of ending not planning the prospect of parenthood, that is, by aborting human lives. Using the word, “virtue” in the same breath with the PPFOA must in itself be immoral.
Avid supporters of avid abortion supporter, Barack Obama, the PPFOA proudly reported that it had outdone itself by performing 15,560 more abortions in 2007 than it had in 2006, or 305,310 versus 289,750. That 2007 number accounts for fully 25% of all induced abortions in America. Regrettably for the PPFOA, (and for the pre-born), it has a great deal of competition in the baby murder business. Still, 25% is anything but a shabby total and reflects the truly outstanding job they’re doing for people intent on “planning parenthood.”
The PPFOA was founded in 1925 as the American Birth Control League, ABCL, by radical eugenist/racist Margaret Sanger who sought to rid the world of “inferior” species, principally although not exclusively, Black people, via sterilization and extermination. Ironically or not so ironically, Sanger is belatedly succeeding since her brainchild today caters to, again principally though not exclusively, to minorities. Some have referred to those efforts as Black genocide: http://www.blackgenocide.org/sanger.html
Numbers can be very deceiving, especially when the Abortion Lobby publicizes them. For example, . . . (Read the rest at http://genelalor.com/)
One of my own: Why are you so angry? I thought liberals were supposed to be the folks who loved everyone, not hated everyone. According to you and many of your political pursuasion, us conservatives are racist hatemongers. But your responses to our dialogue are so full of anger and hate.
Why is that? Do we pose some kind of threat to your well being? I seriously doubt it. Do we threaten your political standing at this time in our country? No – the liberals are in power now, and we are having this discussion here today because those of us with conservative values and a Christian faith are worried and frightened about the future of our country and about how our children are going to fare in this world.
Is that so unreasonable? Do we not have a right to voice our concerns and discuss our faith?
So why so much anger and so much hate towards us?
Jbl, it is ranting, scolding behavior.
You strike me as a rather self-righteous, lay-down-the-law type—good at telling others what to do, but not so good at the sort of Christian hope and charity, etc., you say we ought to practice.
Look, I like a lot of Ms. Scalia’s writing—but I can disagree with her, and you, and not be a bad Christian. Your sort of attack reminds of the bullying that goes on at LGF, when somebody dares criticize the Lizard King, or one of his courtiers.
Well, Hopeful, we can certainly agree on that. And that is the point of this thread; is the pope, and the Catholic Church, pro-life, or aren’t they? And, if so, why are they inviting a pro-abortion speaker to Notre Dame?
Moogie, the anger and hate is because liberals cannot tolerate a viewpoint other than their own.
And at this blog we have the wackos come out!
Republicans make the worst Christians.
TO: Alex
RE: Probably….
…because intelligent people recognize the truth of it.
Too bad for you….eh….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out....]
TO: Moogie
RE: Why?
Three guesses. First two don’t count.
In psychological parlance, it is referred to as ‘projection’…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The Truth will out....]
TO: Moogie
RE: Additinally….
….we DO pose a ‘threat’ to their political standing.
Something to do with an old axiom I came across some time ago….
And I’ve seen it proven time and again as I look back down the corridors of history. I see it today, with the efforts of the so-called ‘liberals’ trying to squelch ANY dissent or disagreemnt.
As Andrew Klavan put it in a recent PJTV item….Shut Up!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[If you can't beat them, 'kill' them.]
TO: acj
RE: Got It Bass-ackwards
Considering the last general election, it is more likely that….
Christians make the worst Republicans.
Why?
Because Christians, at least the REAL ones, have a moral code that they will not break. Whereas Republicans, with their selection of, in my honestly held and supportable opinion, traitorous Senator McCain, have no moral code.
Furthermore, I’m giving the Republicans until 2010 election to get their act together. Otherwise, there WILL be a third party in the running in 2012 and the Republican Party will go the richly deserved way of the Do-DO.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Republicans are for both the man and the dollar, but in case of conflict the man before the dollar. -- Abraham Lincoln]
P.S. Too bad the Republican Party seems to have forgotten that axiom…..
BILGEMAN, CHUCK PELTO, FRED, MOOGIE,TALKIN KAMEL, ET AL…
I just wanted to offer you guys my sincere thanks for
consistent, intelligent, logical moral discussion on this
site. Would that there were more of youout there…
Semper Fi !!
S.M.
TO COL Sebastian Moran
RE: Heh
We can thank the godless, vaunted American public education system for THAT deficiency.
Time and again, I sit in on meetings of a county-wide commission and hear how the K-12 people promote their ‘successes’ in ‘education’. And next the local university rep speaks and people hammer him about why the higher-education people have so many ‘drop-outs’.
Go fig….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Education, v., Replacing an empty mind with an open one.]
P.S. Not THESE days…..
TO: All
RE: A Possibility
I know that Bilgeman doesn’t agree with me about the possible import of Scalia’s article here….that Christians are a threat.
However, I can’t help but think that there is a possible connection between Scalia’s article, which looks to me to be ‘anti-christian’, and the other items coming up here and there in the web and on the media and from the government. For example, the 20/20 mocking of self-defense, the DHS item that if you disagree with the federal government you could be a threat to national security. The latter specifically mentioning anyone who opposes abortion.
My finely honed intell-spidie senses tell me something is ‘afoot’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Don't you love it when a 'plan' comes together?]
“…the DHS item that if you disagree with the federal government you could be a threat to national security”
I figured PJM would cover this soon, and promote the lie that this document covers moderate conservatives in some way, such as your statement suggests. I have already read the document, so I know that asking you to prove your statement would be pointless because it cannot be done. I am sure that by tonight there will be an article up, and there will probably be a long discussion.
TO: RV
RE: Yeah?
You must have learned English as a tertiary language.
Or could you explain this paragraph from page 2 of 9?
So….
….please explain how someone who disagrees with the federal stance on abortion or immigration is not ‘suspect’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Looking forward to engaging you in whatever shows up on this topic here on PJM tomorrow….and if nothing….then here…..
P.P.S. See how that paragraph ties in so smoothly with Scalia’s anti-christian polemic here? Think about the ‘abortion’ matter…..
#121 Chuck Pelto:
“However, I can’t help but think that there is a possible connection between Scalia’s article, which looks to me to be ‘anti-christian’, and the other items coming up here and there in the web and on the media and from the government. For example, the 20/20 mocking of self-defense, the DHS item that if you disagree with the federal government you could be a threat to national security. The latter specifically mentioning anyone who opposes abortion.”
You sniffing a Christian-flavored “reprise” of the bad old “militia” days?
Could be. Lord know Clinton made enough mileage from it. And the scumballs who made their rice bowls from seminar-ing to anyone with an institutional bank account haven’t disappeared into thin air.
To crib one of your favorite old lines:
“Intelligence preparation of the battlefield”.
Sigh…the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce.
“See how that paragraph ties in so smoothly with Scalia’s anti-christian polemic here? Think about the ‘abortion’ matter…..”
Yeah…got it. IF, (and it’s a big if), you take Scalia’s observation about us sometimes being our own worst enemies as a premeditated anti-Christian screed.
Fact is, Colonel, sometimes we ARE our own worst enemies. That isn’t an earth-shattering revelation.
It’s true for every group of like minded folks in every field of human endeavor…we will always have our “ten percent”.
I’d keep an eye open for abortion clinic burnings throughout the South and West in the summer of 2010.
That would be a truly amazing coincidence, wouldn’t it?
#119 Col. Moran:
“I just wanted to offer you guys my sincere thanks for
consistent, intelligent, logical moral discussion on this
site.”
Glad you enjoyed my efforts.
(Jeeze…two colonels on one thread…why do I feel I should be sitting at attention? Last time a colonel actually spoke to me, he said:
“Hand me the nine-iron.”.)
I personally dont think anyone will think any worse for Catholics if they petition and protest Obama’s visit.
If that were the case then why even have a pro-life day rally every year in DC?
…as for Tertullian, nt to mention Origen, both are fathers of the Church, but they both did fall away from the established Church and ended as heretics, so it is nice & pleasant to have rose colored glasses but be careful for what you wish for.
Jesus does expect us to act with dignity but also does not mean for us to be milk-toast or too be naive. Prayer as well as action are both good methods to change the world, and we cannot do it with only one method. The Jesuits and the Benedictines both have had their successes and are both important to the work & history of the Church in the world, as well as being important to the conversion of millions. Even the monks had the knightly as well as the contemplative religious orders.
cheers
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Could Be
But then again, maybe not.
And some Timmy McV’s caught? [Note: I consider McVeigh to have been a dupe for a Riechstag-fire event to help boost an omnibus anti-terrorism bill through Congress, as it was in committee at that time.]
Am I a conspiracy theorist? Isn’t everyone who worked in military intelligence? It’s a field where you realize that there ARE people who are out to ‘get you’.
And in all these things—DHS Reports, 20/20 Anti-Gun garbage, and Scalia’s maybe you Christians should “Shut-Up!”—I see interesting ‘coincidence’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[I believe in coincidence. I just don't trust it. -- Garrack, Cardacian tailor/tinker/soldier/spy on ST:DS9]
It’s interesting and totally predictable to see the catch phrases trickle their way into this blog.
Levin says “Statists” and you all say statists.
Savage evokes the “Reichstag Fire” and you all say Reichstag Fire.
Sean Hannity says “Tea parties will be infiltrated by leftists to make us look bad” and you all say says “”Tea parties will be infiltrated by leftists to make us look bad”
Right or wrong, it should give you all pause to address whether you’re thinking for yourselves, or whether you’re incapable of independent analysis and just being led around by the snoot for the amusement and profit of the right wing corporate media.
To everything there is a season,
a time for every purpose under the sun.
A time to be born and a time to die;
a time to plant and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
a time to kill and a time to heal …
a time to weep and a time to laugh;
a time to mourn and a time to dance …
a time to embrace and a time to refrain from embracing;
a time to lose and a time to seek;
a time to rend and a time to sew;
a time to keep silent and a time to speak;
a time to love and a time to hate;
a time for war and a time for peace.
ecclesiastes 3:1-8
The season is now
Chuck, I am sorry that the document is not clear. It is a poorly written document, and really serves no purpose. But the section you quoted does CLEARLY state:
Rightwing extremism in the United States….
It doesn’t say moderate conservatives…
It doesn’t say moderate republicans…
Unless, of course, you consider moderates to be extremists, which I do not. Now, the document should have identified those that are Rightwing Extremists, such as the Klan and such. But it didn’t, which is one of the reasons it is poorly written. But nowhere in the document does it say that those who disagree with the federal government are extremists; it does say that extremists may be those who disagree with the federal government, which is of course true.
#131 RV:
“But the section you quoted does CLEARLY state:
Rightwing extremism in the United States….”
Don’t be cute, chum. How is the term “Right-Wing extremism” DEFINED?
THAT is the issue here.
You can play semantics all you like during your boxcar ride to the re-education camp.
Colonel Chuck Pelto and I have seen this same language before from the Feds, and saw what came after it.
Maybe you were too young or maybe you were asleep, or maybe you just don’t GAS when someone gets added to some civil servant’s “Designated Enemies of the State” list.
TO: acj
RE: 11. Save the unborn so you can send them to war.
Military service (in the USA, as of now) is voluntary. And, even if there was a draft there are provisions for conscientious objectors.
So the life that was free to be born, would be born free indeed. Without the mother choosing to abort her, would be free to become a baker, a poet, a blogger, a community organizer, etc.
But I guess the point of the snark is to show some kind of hypocrisy with the personal opposition to ending a life before she has the chance to be born, with that of the ugly necessity of a nation – through democratic and international sanction – to conduct warfare?
“And you shall hear of wars and rumors of wars: see that you be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.”
TO: RV and Bilgeman
RE: [OT] Poor Reading Skills?
It SAYS….
Hope that helps.
I believe in States Rights. I’m opposed to federal laws that override them. I’m opposed to federally mandated abortion on demand, as I see such a law as being under the Tenth Amendment of the Constitution of the United States, a state-level decision.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Bilgeman, maybe you haven’t read the document, so the ‘tertiary language’ remark doesn’t apply to you. I know you a tad better…..
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Back on Scalia
I have to wonder what ‘form’ of Christianity she practices.
My readings and understanding lead me, and the members of my Friday Morning Mens’ Bible Study group to the idea that christians, the REAL ones, don’t “shove one another”.
Why does she think we do?
Does a body, barring cancer, war within itself? Hardly…..
So, I take exception to her statement. And I think she’s got a LONG ways to go in her walk of faith. The point here being:
(1) She’s blatantly wrong.
[2] She may be a ‘tool’ for people who are opposed to the REAL christians.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. Attended TWO tea-party events. Both had more participants than I had expected.
TO: RV
RE: [OT] Just To….
….drive my point ‘home’.
It doesn’t matter whether you or I ‘consider moderates to be extremists’. I doubt if you or I can call down an squad of BATF, FBI or mech infantry to enforce the proverbial ‘law of the land’ on an individual.
Rather it’s what the government ‘feels’ is ‘extremism’. And, according to the passage I quoted in item #134 of this thread, they obviously consider me and a number of others—you might consider ‘moderates’—to be rather ‘extreme’.
Am I paranoid? You betcha. 27 years in the infantry, combined with IPB, taught me well, how to stay alive.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Even paranoids have enemies.]
P.S. And when the federal government identifies me as a ‘possible enemy’, I pay REAL CLOSE ATTENTION…..and check my OPLANs…..
#135 Chuck Pelto:
“Attended TWO tea-party events. Both had more participants than I had expected.”
So I guess that puts you on Napolitano’s “Right Wing Extermist DOUBLE Secret Probation List”, huh?
Whattayou? Trying to make me jealous? I was flying yesterday.
FWIW, in soldari-tea with y’all, I ordered tea,(and since airplane coffee is invariably unutterably vile sludge).
Chuck Pelto:
Re: Scalia
http://theanchoressonline.com/2009/04/16/he-says-it-so-much-better-than-i/
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Heh
Recognizing the ‘human factor’? Now?
So humans play a part after all? It wasn’t the Holy Spirit that did it, there were people who marched and sang and sounded instruments as an integral part of the ‘process’ to destroy Jericho.
Nice of her to remember that.
How do WE figure into this?
I recall a report from the 1990s, where a group of REAL christians prayed outside an abortion clinic that it would cease its operations.
A year later, the sisters who operated the murder mill died of cancer.
Not that the praying christians asked for THAT particular solution. As I understand it, they just asked that the murders stop.
Afterwards, the story has spread amongs the christians that our actions do have a useful function. But are they limited to prayer alone? I hardly think so.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. By the way, the only Guy I know who was perfect got nailed to a tree for His temerity…..the powers that be in His time on this ball o dirt were jealous…..
TO: Bilgeman
RE: Heh
ToGA! ToGA! ToGA! ToGA!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody's part.]
P.S. And I’m the guy to do it…..
P.P.S. Maybe I’ll send her some nice chamomile tea. That should calm her down. I’ll send her an envelope of loose leaf. That’s the VERY best…..
…whether she calls in the HAZMAT team and sics the BATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Flowers) on me remains to be seen…..
TO: All
RE: I See It As….
….an interesting indicator that Scalia has not been very present in this discussion.
The implication being that if anyone opposes what she ‘believes’, she’ll take her own advice and ‘Shut Up’!
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Faith is more than mere words.]