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	<title>Comments on: Out of Iraq? Why Are They Doing This?</title>
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		<title>By: Vladimir</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-105472</link>
		<dc:creator>Vladimir</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Sep 2008 04:49:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>I would first like to talk about your comparison of the terrorists with the Nazis and the Communists. First let me define all three:
1. Terrorists: Al-quada for example, is a group of Islamic extremists that use the element of terror to receive obidience from their subjects.
2. Nazis: National Socialists, not talking about those motherf***ers with mohawks and sh*t but the crazed people that believe in socialist state consisting only of one race. Practically, their actual goal is to drive all manner of minorities out and live in a country with a pure race. (Same culture, same race, same views, no/less clash between people)
3. Communists: People who wants to live equally. The cliche &quot;all people are equal, but some are more equal than others&quot; that many anti-communists use to mimick Communist leaders, don&#039;t understand or have even been introduced to the fact that most of these dictators are totalitarians not true communism. This is the only reason people view communism as hell without even caring to understand its views of true equality, and eventually through sucess, true freedom. 

Secondly, the war does not worth it. The war has killed numerous youth full of vision and dreams. While majority of your people are sitting by there computers or playing soccer, this americans that actually know what true freedom feels like are having their heads blown up by fighting their azz off against the crazed portion of your race. So why don&#039;t the U.S. send you M-1 garandes and m-16s and your people fight your war. About the suicide bombers, fight fire with fire. Liberty and freedom comes at a price. Instead of U.S. paying the price. Why don&#039;t u guys do so. If you guys get suicide bombed, then suicide bomb the Talibans and all the other azzholes. And also this War may be ended temporarily but never forever for those crazy people pops up everywhere like crazy. So if you guys really wanna get ride of those extremists, make a concentration camp (not the Nazi or the Stalin ones ) where they work and eat good meals and get payed fairly.aka make an excluded society of those maddened retards.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would first like to talk about your comparison of the terrorists with the Nazis and the Communists. First let me define all three:<br />
1. Terrorists: Al-quada for example, is a group of Islamic extremists that use the element of terror to receive obidience from their subjects.<br />
2. Nazis: National Socialists, not talking about those motherf***ers with mohawks and sh*t but the crazed people that believe in socialist state consisting only of one race. Practically, their actual goal is to drive all manner of minorities out and live in a country with a pure race. (Same culture, same race, same views, no/less clash between people)<br />
3. Communists: People who wants to live equally. The cliche &#8220;all people are equal, but some are more equal than others&#8221; that many anti-communists use to mimick Communist leaders, don&#8217;t understand or have even been introduced to the fact that most of these dictators are totalitarians not true communism. This is the only reason people view communism as hell without even caring to understand its views of true equality, and eventually through sucess, true freedom. </p>
<p>Secondly, the war does not worth it. The war has killed numerous youth full of vision and dreams. While majority of your people are sitting by there computers or playing soccer, this americans that actually know what true freedom feels like are having their heads blown up by fighting their azz off against the crazed portion of your race. So why don&#8217;t the U.S. send you M-1 garandes and m-16s and your people fight your war. About the suicide bombers, fight fire with fire. Liberty and freedom comes at a price. Instead of U.S. paying the price. Why don&#8217;t u guys do so. If you guys get suicide bombed, then suicide bomb the Talibans and all the other azzholes. And also this War may be ended temporarily but never forever for those crazy people pops up everywhere like crazy. So if you guys really wanna get ride of those extremists, make a concentration camp (not the Nazi or the Stalin ones ) where they work and eat good meals and get payed fairly.aka make an excluded society of those maddened retards.</p>
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		<title>By: Mainer</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8377</link>
		<dc:creator>Mainer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 16:03:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8377</guid>
		<description>@Proctor
Can you provide a URL to the source of that quote?
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Proctor<br />
Can you provide a URL to the source of that quote?</p>
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		<title>By: ttj</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8376</link>
		<dc:creator>ttj</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 14:41:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8376</guid>
		<description>From reading these posts, it&#039;s clear that opinions remain divided over the best course of action, and will probably remain divided. The U.S. and Iraq need consensus and compromise from both sides of the aisle in congress. The biggest proof of this is that the Democrats failed to gain enough votes to override Bush&#039;s veto on the Iraq funding bill. The Democrat leaders are now all recognizing that they need revise their position. The major parties in the U.S. should stop making Iraq a centerpiece for their presidential campaign efforts. The &quot;war&quot; can end if all interested sides, Democrats, Republicans, and the Iraqi government, cooperate. To Mr. Behrend, thanks for the sermons. We all read your &quot;pedigree&quot; and it doesn&#039;t look any more impressive than anyone else&#039;s who has posted here. Beyond that, it&#039;s clear that Omar represents Iraqi opinions just as much or more than you represent American or &quot;world&quot; opinions.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From reading these posts, it&#8217;s clear that opinions remain divided over the best course of action, and will probably remain divided. The U.S. and Iraq need consensus and compromise from both sides of the aisle in congress. The biggest proof of this is that the Democrats failed to gain enough votes to override Bush&#8217;s veto on the Iraq funding bill. The Democrat leaders are now all recognizing that they need revise their position. The major parties in the U.S. should stop making Iraq a centerpiece for their presidential campaign efforts. The &#8220;war&#8221; can end if all interested sides, Democrats, Republicans, and the Iraqi government, cooperate. To Mr. Behrend, thanks for the sermons. We all read your &#8220;pedigree&#8221; and it doesn&#8217;t look any more impressive than anyone else&#8217;s who has posted here. Beyond that, it&#8217;s clear that Omar represents Iraqi opinions just as much or more than you represent American or &#8220;world&#8221; opinions.</p>
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		<title>By: cav</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8375</link>
		<dc:creator>cav</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 May 2007 02:09:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8375</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s over. The Iraqis had four years with backing of the US to get things done. If they really wanted it, they would have it. If the &#039;bad guys&#039; are just a small fraction, they why haven&#039;t they been rubbed out? When the Colonies revolted against British rule, we needed some help from France, but France didn&#039;t have to come in do all the fighting for us, because we wanted our freedom bad enough to take care of business ourselves.
To the British person who mentioned the size of our military allowing other countries to have smaller standing armies: that is simply going to have to change soon. People are going to have to look out for themselves,and America will have to start keeping a lower profile. You might favor it, but I&#039;m sensing (like a sledgehammer) that the world is pretty much sick of America projecting military might. We&#039;re going broke, heck we are broke. We&#039;re seven trillion dollars in debt, and we&#039;re going down the tubes in a dozen different ways. We&#039;re done.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s over. The Iraqis had four years with backing of the US to get things done. If they really wanted it, they would have it. If the &#8216;bad guys&#8217; are just a small fraction, they why haven&#8217;t they been rubbed out? When the Colonies revolted against British rule, we needed some help from France, but France didn&#8217;t have to come in do all the fighting for us, because we wanted our freedom bad enough to take care of business ourselves.<br />
To the British person who mentioned the size of our military allowing other countries to have smaller standing armies: that is simply going to have to change soon. People are going to have to look out for themselves,and America will have to start keeping a lower profile. You might favor it, but I&#8217;m sensing (like a sledgehammer) that the world is pretty much sick of America projecting military might. We&#8217;re going broke, heck we are broke. We&#8217;re seven trillion dollars in debt, and we&#8217;re going down the tubes in a dozen different ways. We&#8217;re done.</p>
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		<title>By: cornel</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8374</link>
		<dc:creator>cornel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 16:09:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8374</guid>
		<description>check out this solution -&gt; &lt;a href=&quot;http://groups.google.com/group/Phase-7/web/iraq-war-and-illigal-immigration-is-a-win-win-situation-for-us?hl=en&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://groups.google.com/group/Phase-7/web/iraq-war-and-illigal-immigration-is-a-win-win-situation-for-us?hl=en&lt;/a&gt;

This might be best for everybody involved, since the harm is done and the Iraqi Government is corrupt and incapable to work as is.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>check out this solution -&gt; <a href="http://groups.google.com/group/Phase-7/web/iraq-war-and-illigal-immigration-is-a-win-win-situation-for-us?hl=en" rel="nofollow">http://groups.google.com/group/Phase-7/web/iraq-war-and-illigal-immigration-is-a-win-win-situation-for-us?hl=en</a></p>
<p>This might be best for everybody involved, since the harm is done and the Iraqi Government is corrupt and incapable to work as is.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8373</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 10:46:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8373</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Denise D: This is a war on TERROR- do you know what that means?&lt;/b&gt;

Denise, some of the best minds in the world have grappled with this question for years now without coming to a clear and internationally acceptable understanding of what it means. I&#039;d be curious to hear your definition.

While you&#039;re at it, how does this &quot;war&quot; compare to other (metaphorical) wars, like the war on &quot;drugs&quot; and the war on &quot;poverty&quot; -- two problems that have produced far more misery and suffering and deaths at home and around the globe than &quot;terror&quot;? Do you think it will be more successful in the end than those other vaunted American political projects? If so, why?

Also, how does the U.S. release of Luis Posada Carriles on bail, despite his being wanted for a crime of &quot;terror&quot; that took 73 lives in an airliner bombing, fit into your understanding of the US GWOT? Would you support a raid and kidnapping by the special forces of another country to whisk him from Texas to a closed detention centre in Cuba for interrogation for five years with no charges being laid, no visits from family or friends, no access to the protections of Cuban law?


</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Denise D: This is a war on TERROR- do you know what that means?</b></p>
<p>Denise, some of the best minds in the world have grappled with this question for years now without coming to a clear and internationally acceptable understanding of what it means. I&#8217;d be curious to hear your definition.</p>
<p>While you&#8217;re at it, how does this &#8220;war&#8221; compare to other (metaphorical) wars, like the war on &#8220;drugs&#8221; and the war on &#8220;poverty&#8221; &#8212; two problems that have produced far more misery and suffering and deaths at home and around the globe than &#8220;terror&#8221;? Do you think it will be more successful in the end than those other vaunted American political projects? If so, why?</p>
<p>Also, how does the U.S. release of Luis Posada Carriles on bail, despite his being wanted for a crime of &#8220;terror&#8221; that took 73 lives in an airliner bombing, fit into your understanding of the US GWOT? Would you support a raid and kidnapping by the special forces of another country to whisk him from Texas to a closed detention centre in Cuba for interrogation for five years with no charges being laid, no visits from family or friends, no access to the protections of Cuban law?</p>
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		<title>By: Gregg E.</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8372</link>
		<dc:creator>Gregg E.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 09:12:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8372</guid>
		<description>Omar, one easy way to help is for Iraqis to e-mail letters to the editor to newspapers all over the USA, UK, Canada and other countries. Forget about the really big papers like the New York, Los Angeles or London Times. They&#039;re antisemetic and pro-terrorist to their deepeset core.

This article of yours would be just perfect as a &quot;Reader&#039;s View&quot; submission to a paper like the Idaho Statesman. idahostatesman.com
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Omar, one easy way to help is for Iraqis to e-mail letters to the editor to newspapers all over the USA, UK, Canada and other countries. Forget about the really big papers like the New York, Los Angeles or London Times. They&#8217;re antisemetic and pro-terrorist to their deepeset core.</p>
<p>This article of yours would be just perfect as a &#8220;Reader&#8217;s View&#8221; submission to a paper like the Idaho Statesman. idahostatesman.com</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8371</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 06:13:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8371</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;@DeniseD&lt;/b&gt;

(1) I do, in fact, hold a U.S. passport in addition to my NZ one. My (Mormon genealogist) family traces its roots in North America back to before the colonial revolution. Like many early settler families, we also (claim) to have a spot of Amerindian blood connecting us to the indigenous population of &quot;America&quot; that was so nearly destroyed by Euro-American disease and genocidal policies. I also have Norwegian, Alsation, Lithuano-Prussian and Bavarian forebears who came to the US in the 1830s and 1840s, plus Irish immigrants from the 1870s. If you require a U.S. pedigree of anyone that you will discuss American history with, then I definitely qualify, however much I wish I didn&#039;t.

(2) I am a teacher, not a cattle or sheep man, living in one of the most urbanised countries in the world. You should have at least a smidgen of knowledge about something before you use it as the basis for a racial/ethnic stereotype and slur.

(3) If you operate on the principle that only the citizens of a country have the right to talk about it, then I would expect you to have nothing to say about Iraq or Palestine or Venezuela... or New Zealand. But I&#039;m sure that&#039;s not how you think. You, as an American, seem to feel you have a right to speak authoritatively about any other people or place, despite the near total lack of relevant knowledge - historical, cultural, linguistic, religious, political....


</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>@DeniseD</b></p>
<p>(1) I do, in fact, hold a U.S. passport in addition to my NZ one. My (Mormon genealogist) family traces its roots in North America back to before the colonial revolution. Like many early settler families, we also (claim) to have a spot of Amerindian blood connecting us to the indigenous population of &#8220;America&#8221; that was so nearly destroyed by Euro-American disease and genocidal policies. I also have Norwegian, Alsation, Lithuano-Prussian and Bavarian forebears who came to the US in the 1830s and 1840s, plus Irish immigrants from the 1870s. If you require a U.S. pedigree of anyone that you will discuss American history with, then I definitely qualify, however much I wish I didn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>(2) I am a teacher, not a cattle or sheep man, living in one of the most urbanised countries in the world. You should have at least a smidgen of knowledge about something before you use it as the basis for a racial/ethnic stereotype and slur.</p>
<p>(3) If you operate on the principle that only the citizens of a country have the right to talk about it, then I would expect you to have nothing to say about Iraq or Palestine or Venezuela&#8230; or New Zealand. But I&#8217;m sure that&#8217;s not how you think. You, as an American, seem to feel you have a right to speak authoritatively about any other people or place, despite the near total lack of relevant knowledge &#8211; historical, cultural, linguistic, religious, political&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8370</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Behrend, Auckland NZ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 05:46:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8370</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;oscar77&lt;/b&gt;, let me just respond to one or two of your highly non-reflective &quot;answers&quot;. my point isn&#039;t to debate you or reject your points, but to suggest that there is more to these questions that you have considered in jotting down your quick notes.

(a) I assume that you have a healthy skepticism about &quot;spin&quot; - the self-serving way that government officials articulate and disseminate information/propaganda to us, the people. you may also harbour a deep distrust of the government as a matter of principle. if so, you shouldn&#039;t be surprised to learn that the government always misrepresents the cost of american militarism in a few basic ways:

1.	in arguments of this sort, they include social security in the overall budget, instead of excluding it as a &quot;locked box&quot; trust fund that stands outside the government&#039;s budget (check your next payslip and you&#039;ll see that FICA insurance and income taxes are separate - the government cannot touch SS, it is not part of the government&#039;s operating budget, it is a self-paying public insurance deposit fund);

2.	they exclude the cost of servicing the national debt, which is almost entirely the result of US wars and military expenses. you almost recognise this when you say that 70% of post-WW2 taxes have been spent on debt. ignoring the source of the debt reveals that your thinking about this point isn&#039;t comprehensive enough;

3.	the ancillary costs of US militarism must also be added to the military-related budget, including the on-going educational and life-long health costs that are given as special perquisites to those who are willing to fight and kill in america&#039;s hegemonic project.

altogether, it is estimated by critics (and not just gore vidal) that in peacetime about two thirds of your income taxes go to the military machine and its debts.

(b) alaska and hawaii were late (white) settlement colonies of the united states; they were seized and colonised for security reasons related to control of the pacific and the expansionist aspirations of japan and russia/soviet union. in this they are analogous to south africa in british history, except that the indigenous populations were more thoroughly disenfranchised and/or exterminated in the cases of hawaii and alaska. the fact that you don&#039;t think about america-the-colonial-empire playing catch-up by overpowering and destroying pre-existing nations and peoples during its last 200 years of imperial expansion once again suggests the propagandising power of the U.S. educational system and media. think &quot;iraq invades and annexes kuwait&quot;; now think &quot;united states invades and annexes northern mexico/hawaii/alaska/cuba/philippines &quot; (so many, many examples to choose from).

(c) of course i am talking about income redistribution - it&#039;s at the heart of any humanistic approach to the threats against freedom and fairness inherent in unrestricted wealth accumulation.

the other questions - your answers to which all sound as if they were written off the top of your head without any recourse to, or background in, scholarly literature or political-historical analysis - have similarly complex dimensions to them that &quot;talking points&quot; style answers don&#039;t even begin to address.

I would like to ask: are you more interested in understanding historical and social processes that involve the united states, or are you really just wanting to defend america blindly because you love it?

</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>oscar77</b>, let me just respond to one or two of your highly non-reflective &#8220;answers&#8221;. my point isn&#8217;t to debate you or reject your points, but to suggest that there is more to these questions that you have considered in jotting down your quick notes.</p>
<p>(a) I assume that you have a healthy skepticism about &#8220;spin&#8221; &#8211; the self-serving way that government officials articulate and disseminate information/propaganda to us, the people. you may also harbour a deep distrust of the government as a matter of principle. if so, you shouldn&#8217;t be surprised to learn that the government always misrepresents the cost of american militarism in a few basic ways:</p>
<p>1.	in arguments of this sort, they include social security in the overall budget, instead of excluding it as a &#8220;locked box&#8221; trust fund that stands outside the government&#8217;s budget (check your next payslip and you&#8217;ll see that FICA insurance and income taxes are separate &#8211; the government cannot touch SS, it is not part of the government&#8217;s operating budget, it is a self-paying public insurance deposit fund);</p>
<p>2.	they exclude the cost of servicing the national debt, which is almost entirely the result of US wars and military expenses. you almost recognise this when you say that 70% of post-WW2 taxes have been spent on debt. ignoring the source of the debt reveals that your thinking about this point isn&#8217;t comprehensive enough;</p>
<p>3.	the ancillary costs of US militarism must also be added to the military-related budget, including the on-going educational and life-long health costs that are given as special perquisites to those who are willing to fight and kill in america&#8217;s hegemonic project.</p>
<p>altogether, it is estimated by critics (and not just gore vidal) that in peacetime about two thirds of your income taxes go to the military machine and its debts.</p>
<p>(b) alaska and hawaii were late (white) settlement colonies of the united states; they were seized and colonised for security reasons related to control of the pacific and the expansionist aspirations of japan and russia/soviet union. in this they are analogous to south africa in british history, except that the indigenous populations were more thoroughly disenfranchised and/or exterminated in the cases of hawaii and alaska. the fact that you don&#8217;t think about america-the-colonial-empire playing catch-up by overpowering and destroying pre-existing nations and peoples during its last 200 years of imperial expansion once again suggests the propagandising power of the U.S. educational system and media. think &#8220;iraq invades and annexes kuwait&#8221;; now think &#8220;united states invades and annexes northern mexico/hawaii/alaska/cuba/philippines &#8221; (so many, many examples to choose from).</p>
<p>(c) of course i am talking about income redistribution &#8211; it&#8217;s at the heart of any humanistic approach to the threats against freedom and fairness inherent in unrestricted wealth accumulation.</p>
<p>the other questions &#8211; your answers to which all sound as if they were written off the top of your head without any recourse to, or background in, scholarly literature or political-historical analysis &#8211; have similarly complex dimensions to them that &#8220;talking points&#8221; style answers don&#8217;t even begin to address.</p>
<p>I would like to ask: are you more interested in understanding historical and social processes that involve the united states, or are you really just wanting to defend america blindly because you love it?</p>
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		<title>By: NS</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/out_of_iraq_why_are_the_democr/#comment-8369</link>
		<dc:creator>NS</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 May 2007 05:40:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://dev.pajamasmedia.com/blog/out-of-iraq-why-are-they-doing-this/#comment-8369</guid>
		<description>For all those Republican apologists out there, keep living in denial and blaming the democrats inspite of being in total control of all branches of Govt since 2006. What a bunch of shameless cowards !!

May be Bush should ask the House and Senate to make a constitutional amendment so that he can run for a 3rd term and a 4thterm and keep this war going.

May be that will give enough time for your fucked up Iraqi parliament to come back from recess. Obviously they have been working real hard to do absolutely nothing.

Iraqi&#039;s should fight for Iraq. Unfortunately there is no spirit in you people. The only people who have any fight in them are the terrorists and their Sunni supporters. And thats a shame. And the US should not be held responsible until all you morons fall in line.
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For all those Republican apologists out there, keep living in denial and blaming the democrats inspite of being in total control of all branches of Govt since 2006. What a bunch of shameless cowards !!</p>
<p>May be Bush should ask the House and Senate to make a constitutional amendment so that he can run for a 3rd term and a 4thterm and keep this war going.</p>
<p>May be that will give enough time for your fucked up Iraqi parliament to come back from recess. Obviously they have been working real hard to do absolutely nothing.</p>
<p>Iraqi&#8217;s should fight for Iraq. Unfortunately there is no spirit in you people. The only people who have any fight in them are the terrorists and their Sunni supporters. And thats a shame. And the US should not be held responsible until all you morons fall in line.</p>
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