Obama Joins the Male-Bashing Brigade
Yes, the leftist male is not only a Democrat but a gynocrat as well. He (sic) reflexively defers to every manner of slovenly hack or fool as long as that individual possesses the proper genitalia.
Many foreigners, especially those outside of Europe, comprehend that American women need no protector as they are among the most privileged persons on this earth.
Yet pseudo-liberals know better and reject obvious indicators of female transcendence. They give a wink and a nod to the machinations of radical feminists who despise equality and for whom female supremacy is a constant goal.
Of course, sophistocates discount the impressions of plebes like me. To them women only appear to lead epicurean lives revolving around self-absorption, the pursuit of pleasure, and persistent entertainment.
Despite every experiential and statistical indicator, women remain oppressed. Should a given woman make less money than a man, it becomes de facto evidence of discrimination.
Conversely, if she makes more money she is also oppressed because she might enjoy working fewer hours or even prefer chucking away her “career” in the hopes of immersing herself in a hedonistic celebutard culture.
No matter what the complaint, there is only one thing for certain: the eternal male is to blame. His plausible crimes range from being too supportive or too unsupportive, and being too interested in sex or not interested enough — and that’s just the beginning! Never mind the why and wherefore, when a woman hurts, male guilt “has got to move.”
So it was from this societal netherworld that Barack Obama’s answer to a student in China arose. Oh, you don’t remember that mindless quip? He observed, “If you talk to women in America, they will tell you that there are still men who have a lot of old-fashioned ideas about the role of women in society.”
Which means what exactly? Obviously, as a devout conservative, I am one of those men under his ethereal indictment, but the particulars of the charge remain vague.
Admittedly, my views clash mightily with those held by radical feminists. I embrace equality and disdain the notion that one sex should reign supreme over the other. I seek to terminate affirmative action and ensure that no caste system exists in the U.S.
Moreover, one’s genitalia should never form the basis for societal privilege. While such a stance would unquestionably offend Obama and a plethora of the feministas who back him, there’s nothing retrograde about advancing equality.
As far as vocation is concerned, I believe that women should work if they want to and not work if they don’t. My “if it feels good, do it” approach to female choice isn’t exactly the stuff of the Taliban. Thus, Obama’s slant on this issue is worse than opaque.
As always with our post-modern president, one must read between the lines to ascertain meaning. His real lament seems to be that too few male submissives inhabit the America of 2009.
Apparently, my former senator wishes to douse in shame those XY types who continue to regard themselves as being the fully franchised counterpart to women. In his eyes, men must subvert their own desires and commit themselves to making members of the fair sex happy.
Our actions are not the problem though. It’s our thoughts, or as Barack put it, our “ideas,” that run afoul. Men must desist in defending their own interests and learn to regard women as lords in human garb. They are not to be ridiculed and they must not be held accountable for their behavior.
Educators in Australia have been quite audacious in their desire to meld young male minds. In Victoria, they have instituted compulsory feminist ed which “combat[s] common attitudes among boys such as young women are either ‘good girls or sluts.’”
The real purpose of such enlightenment is to ensure that no boy, upon becoming a man, objects to marrying a slut or is even capable of recognizing one should she drunkenly slither by on a Friday evening or stay over to press false charges of rape in the morning.
Cognitions are the problem. Men, historically speaking, have had a tendency to form them without consulting with women beforehand. This practice must end and our president is now providing us with proper notice of the fact.
Until we formally hold a Nuremberg (a Nuremberg of our own) to redress our sins and those of our fathers, femasupremacist agitation will continue at Barackian speed.
Eventually they hope to usher in a utopia wherein every man promptly adopts female habits, and the married ones hyphenate their last names while making sure to kiss their dominatrixes’ boot before settling into bed.
The key thing to remember about this manipulation is that just because leftist women complain about men, there is no reason why any of us should listen. Hell is where such harpies belong even though we do not have the right to place them there.
Moreover, Pajamas Media is the acknowledged home of unreconstructed males. Men such as we are not the kind found or welcomed by the Democratic Party.
Yet it is hoped that independent or waffling males will read this article, take notice of events, and realize that they have no more business in the pseudo-liberal ranks than a vegetarian does awaiting free food from Bob Evans.
All self-respecting men must abandon the Democratic Party. Sausage is on the menu at Bob Evans, but males are in Progressive Land. Fellows, ask not for whom the feminist scolds — it’s you.
Not ALL males are guilty the Black male is totally absolved of any wrongdoing at all. He can call women “Niger Beeeatches” and ‘Hos and have them perform barely disguised sadomasochistic sexual moves on countless moronic Rap video’s and STILL the feminists give them a free pass. Ah RACIST affirmative action don’t you just love it after all without it no Obambi.
I guess I can be classified an anti-feminist. I abhor those who seek preferential treatment just because….I detest those who pontificate about the ills of society, YET do nothing constructive to redress said or imagined ills. I disdain ALL those who profess to be holier than thou, YET commit all manner of sins in the name of said ills.
For the most part, I am an equal opportunity female, the mother of 2 wonderful sons, highly educated, VERY respectful of the female persuasion, YET decidedly repulsed by feminazis.In a word, self respecting males.By the way, their dad set their wonderful example, treating me like a princess, YET not behaving like a doormat.
Fellows-don’t ever apologize for being men, self respecting women would NEVER want you to!
Lots of good sarcasm here, until this clinker:
WRONG!
Me man. Me have poky-thingy. She not have. Me do the impregnating!
(Let’s see Congress try to repeal that societal privilege!)
You men STILL don’t get it! I worked for a Fortune 100 company. Altho we were all degreed, I was hired in as a saleperson at 1/3 of the men’s salaries. Our results were measurable (thankfully) and I consistently DOUBLED the production of the other 3 male salespersons(same job) COMBINED! True…I stayed every night until midnight doing paperwork so I could bring these outstanding results everyday! The men rose quickly…but were always later fired for lousy results. A woman in a different division sued for discrimination & won…that was the ONLY reason I was advanced. As a regional sales mgr, I was paid 1/3 (again) of what the 3 other male regional sales mgrs made. These 3 male regional sales mgrs had such unimpressive results that the company restructured, the regional positions were eliminated and I was “promoted” to National Sales Mgr…same low salary, of course. (The previous National sales mgr had been making 5 times my salary). I spent my life in airplanes & hotels. Brand new male entry-level salespeople across the country, right out of college, were making more than I. After 7 years, I eventually gave up and left the company. Yeah guys…THIS is why we whine!
Excellent! Easily proved. Remember the confirmation of Sotomayor and how the male Dems gushed, defended and approved of her comment despite being the target of said comment. They felt no embarrassment whatsoever at having been emasculated by her and voting for her.
votes, I believe it is about votes.
“oohhh they like us”…
MsMensa, why did you stick around for so long if you could do better? I was working at a female dominated workplace where, as a childless single male I worked most holidays and got called in to cover for married women whenever they had a sick child, even though their husbands should have taken off. Women would always complain about how hard they worked but it was, guess who, males who did the heavy lifting? When I saw a pattern of “women always tell the truth, men always lie”, I left for a better paying job in a more diverse workplace.
To Adina — Dorothy Parker once (wisely) wrote:
“The only thing worse than a man you can’t control is a man you can control.”
I tease my wife, half tongue in cheek… Modern women are looking for “WIVES” not husbands.
As for work… perhaps a women who perceives herself to make less than her male peers might look in the attitude and professional demeanor mirror… (News Flash… tough and good does not equal ruthless b!tch) I work in the high tech industry, have worked for/with female supervisors and bosses and co-workers. They were well compensated, and were very good at their jobs.
I have also worked for women who felt that they were owed something extra special, they were nasty, had poor attitudes, were terrible leaders, and screwed over their employees at any opportunity to advance themselves… some even slept with the bosses to get their goodies…
Gee some folks, regardless of their sex (not gender…that is a linguistic term relating to whether a noun is masculine or feminine), are just plain awful workers who earn less because they fail.
The truth, as I have just read an article this morning on women having difficulties dealing with the return from combat operations, is that feminists are fundamentally hateful, and full of crapola.
This nation and culture has offered opportunities in abundance to women, that no other nation or culture would tolerate. What is even more telling is that this nation still offers women the socially accepted and supported CHOICE, of not working a W-2 job for a living. No man has that choice. We work.. or work… or die.
Sorry, no sale. Feminists’s chronic whining is going to fall on this “unreconstructed” male’s cold deaf ears. I have no interest in indulging the continued drubbing and will call a self-serving nasty attack what it is.
Life is tough. Nothing is equal. All things are difficult and require effort, compromise, and a certain amount of luck. Women who hate themselves, hate men, and hate life need to get over it. There’s too much work to be done and Western Society is crumbling in part because they want someone else do their jobs.
Tootles…
The Mighty Fahvaag
“Their self-flagellation has no correlation with increased personal responsibility. The feeling is nebulous and rarely applies to their own behavior, as the leftist lacks entirely the capacity for introspection. More than a little is wrong with them and, as they cannot fix their deficiencies via the normal means, their preferred form of therapy is immersion in politics. Progressive (read: regressive) crusades boost their self-esteem…That the left’s ideas invariably lead to ruin is of little consolation because by the time their follies are discovered they’ve already moved on to a new boondoggle.”
Methinks you’re on to something here.
…malignant personalities…they express love for humanity but disdain actual human beings.
You wouldn’t trust these yakkers to have your back.
“If you talk to women in America, they will tell you that there are still men who have a lot of old-fashioned ideas about the role of women in society.” (saith Obama)
Well, Michelle done whipped the old boy into shape, and he (a closet chauvinist who prefers the sports’ guys) has pontificated ad nauseam about a growing awareness that it was his job, too, when when their children got sick.
Moreover, one’s genitalia should never form the basis for societal privilege.
Especially if you’re dumb as a box of rocks, see Maxine Waters, Babsie Boxer, Nancy the Queen Bee and so many, many more.
…(Obama’s) real lament
I think his real lament in all his girl talk is to pretend to toss paeans their way. Any girl worth her salt hearing the President toss out his bones of pretend caring & concern will instantly recognize the scam.
Um, MsMensa, I call BS.
IF you did all that, that’s your own fault. Your story is too close to the party line to be true, especially today. Unless your story is over 40 years old, which makes you a dried up complainer still holding a grudge because nobody listens to you anymore.
Dadofhomeschoolers
Msmensa, While I am sure your anecdotal evidence is unbiased and representative of every company and corporation in America, I do have a few questions for you: why the heck did you work for someone who only paid you 1/3 of what you thought you were worth? Why did you stay with the company for 7 years? Did you think whining would make it better? Did you ever think of looking elsewhere?
Basically, you were in a bad situation and instead of taking any action you just whined. Yep, it’s all men’s fault.
Leftists hold some of the most outrageous and laughable beliefs I’ve ever heard of. From the notion that animals have souls (sorry, they don’t, regardless of what Miss Cleo tells you) to the belief that mankind has the ability to affect the weather on a world-wide scale, the best thing they’re good for is ridicule.
Confusion, self-loathing and, yes, guilt that you (not they) must atone for, that’s the short definition of today’s leftist.
4. Msmensa:
Lily Ledbetter Fair Pay Act . . . How may senators voted against it? 36. How many of those were Republicans? 36. How many Republicans voted for it? 4. How many of those were women? 4.
This ain’t rocket surgery, folks. Republicans don’t care. They got theirs, and if somebody else wants a fair share of the pie, that means less for them, so they’ll do whatever it takes to stop that from happening. If you’re a woman, or black, or brown, or gay, or young – they just. don’t. care.
If you’re a woman, or black, or brown, or gay, or young – they just. don’t. care.
Honey, real women don’t sit around waiting for people to “care”.
And they don’t rely on something like a Supreme Court ruling (cf roe v. wade, 1973) in order to assume “power” over their own bodies.
Capiche ? (no, I didn’t think so…)
“Conservatives try to solve problems that actually exist”
Yes, I just went through the last ten years and the cons certainly did that. We had a budget surplus, you gave us record taxes and spending. We had peace, you gave us a couple un-winnable wars. We had record employment, you gave us record unemployment. We had human rights…well we all know your answer to that…….
Thanks for the problem solving, next time (if/and when) the cons take over again please stop trying to solve things ok? Next time just stick with doing nothing about health care, at least you can solve that….. Dont you agree?
15. tanstaafl:
“Honey, real women don’t sit around waiting for people to “care”.”
It’s not about the women and whether they wait or don’t, it’s about the people who have the ability to influence legislation that affects their lives.
“And they don’t rely on something like a Supreme Court ruling (cf roe v. wade, 1973) in order to assume “power” over their own bodies.”
Good, I’m glad you agree that women have a right to choose.
11. dadofhomeschoolers:
” . . . makes you a dried up complainer still holding a grudge because nobody listens to you anymore.”
Home schooled, eh? Sounds like you were, too. Do us all a favor, stick with science and math. Don’t instill any of your cultural point of view in your kids. We want the future in the hands of reasoning individuals, not resentful, regretful dried up old bigots.
…legislation that affects their lives
If you’re depending on that collection of self-serving Congresscritters to pass legislation they often neither read nor understand to “affect” your life, you are, ipso facto something of a loser, male or female.
Good, I’m glad you agree that women have a right to choose.
Believing some federal court decision* relates in any way to your personal rights is, in fact, a dependent & weak posture.
(*Roe was not, in fact, an abortion decision (or a “right to choose” decision) but a judgment rendered on the basis of an implicit privacy clause in the Constitution)
I realize you will never get any of this, N&T, since you worship at the altar of the Leftoid Mindset the author outlines above.
For some insights (oops, you guys don’t do introspection)…
You can read about yourself in more detail here
We try to solve dilemmas that actually exist, a less sexy and glossy approach indeed.
Yes, among those problems, how do we stop our crack-head like need to throw our money into a black hole of government and contractor corruption in Iraq. Conservatives have been at that one for eight years–you’ve got to admire their determination. Even though Blackwater keeps reeming the Pentagon, and then tossing the evidence in the face of the American public, we still can’t stop giving them money to do what our military is perfectly capable of doing. But those brave conservatives won’t stop trying to solve that problem, will they?
Now and Then, you show up on a lot of posts around here. You seem to take a fairly negative attitude about most topics posted, looking to consistently put the blame on others. Yet I never really notice you suggesting any solutions; you typically come across regularly as a victim or you simply fire a flaming arrow and run.
Why is that? I can tell you that its really annoying to be around people who complain about all of life’s problems but never really seem to orient themselves to solutions.
Having an opposing view and being obstinate are not the same thing. I take great pains in my work to make sure that we have open debate about the issues and challenges that we face. If we don’t do that in our line of business, we soon won’t have a business. But we also take pains to not have serial complainers around who only gripe and moan but don’t find a way to create value. It may not be a fair representation, but you certainly come across in your posts as one of the latter.
Time for everyone to play the “my oppression is worse than your oppression” game.
PC@16: How appropraite PC… Anyway your response is so off the charts in mendacity that it really does not deserve a response except to say that your response was so off the charts full of mendacity.
Now and then: In a free society, the government is not supposed to pass legislation that regulates people’s lives.
In fact, modern American women are about the most pampered and privileged group there is. This whole “diversity grievance” construct is just a hustle and a racket, and the results just shred the constitution.
The federal government has no authority at all to influence the work place, nor should it. No more than if all the men got together and had legislation demanding to eliminate women form the work place.
And Ms. Mensa, I do not buy it. Sound like some sort of rationalization to me. Sounds like BS. If there is some reality behind it, then welcome to the club because we men are quite used to lazy coworkers who are adroit politicians getting promoted while we do the real work. There is nothing new in this and it has little to do with gender. It is part of the workplace. Feminists have some rather juvenile supposition and expectations about the real world. It is a tough and unfair place. It will always be. You just have to put up with what men have had to put up with as a matter of course. In my experice, it si actually the women who get promoted becuase oif the usual OPC BS.
Then the competent men leave the firm and the higher management are either too stupid or too arrogant to adimt why they are having problems.
If anything, it is the white male that is getting screwed today.
Wait until we have had enough of it. Just see what kind of society you have then when we either opt out or play the grievance card.
The left despises the individual so it must always define people in groups so as to manipulate them,.
The left also despises traditional society. They wish to destroy it.
Feminism is just another one of these attacks. They could really care less.
After they destroy the American White Man they will turn around and destroy the American White Women.
It is about forming an Marxist-Leninist “industrial army”. Just imagine what the salaries would be like if the boomer wives had not gone out into the workplace but had stayed home. Think how prosperous the middle classes would have been then. A lot of feminists think that they have liberated themselves but all they have really done is enslave themselves.
I will tell you that my mother’s generation of woman who stay in the home and manged the home had more “power”than do the vast majority of “women” out there trying to get “equality in the workplace”.
As if we men in the workplace have any “power”.
Msmensa
Mensa? Damn. When I grew up working in the beanfields living in housing projects we thought you had to be a genius to go to college. If someone said they were mensa we would be to afraid to talk to them.
My son and daughter were put in the GATE program, Gifted and Talented but I can’t see that it helped much other than to make their problems more sophisticated. I asked my daughter what was better, smart or kind – and being smart she gave me the answer I wanted to hear. Today many of my friends have PhD’s, high IQ’a but most don’t seem to think they need to advertise it. Many people who are geniuses can’t dance, or play music, or create art, they can’t even dancer or be good lovers either. I am less sure as I get older that being smart is as good as I thought it might be when I was young. I have met people with modest IQ’s who seem wise compared to some of the smarter people who seem just as messed up as the rest of us. Go to an APA convention (American Psychiatric) Lot’s of smart and highl verbal people there stampeding to the chow line, out front smoking, hanging around strip joints, gambling. Being smart is just a thing. I would rather know your sources of information than how capable your processor is of crunching info that might not be correct to start with.
I was surprised to hear that the top 2% of the population could get into mensa. Hope not. I would think they would have standards as high as the NBA or Yale. Top two percent, such a difference from the bottom to the top of that small group. I would guess if you had to advertise it you were at the bottom and better at memorization than creativity. Sounds as if you memorized some pretty creative stuff from women’s studies.
Are you the kind of woman who sat around whining about how men wouldn’t let women run in marathons instead of just running 26 miles? Tell us the places you worked that paid women far less than men. I will call and see if they still do that and we can protest together. OR – did you just make it up? Usually when women tell me such things and I ask where it’s happening, they just refer me to MS magazine.
SD
Poor Citizen – certainly your grasp of facts is poor. “you gave us record taxes and spending” actually Republican CUT taxes, even so they didn’t come close to the true RECORD taxes under Dem administrations. “We had peace” really? do you have any knowledge of the Khobar Towers attacks, World trade Center I, USS Cole, et al. YOUR Dumb asses gave us a neutered Intel capacity and a CIA and FBI that had “walls” constructed between them so they could NOT share intel. “record employment”, that would have been under Bush, you have given us record UNemployment. Shall I go on?! You guys have a knack for twisting reality and facts to suit your vision.
“I will tell you that my mother’s generation of woman who stay in the home and manged the home had more “power”than do the vast majority of “women” out there trying to get “equality in the workplace”.
yeah they had the power to be trapped in marriage because they had no means to support themselves…god how i miss that power
#17 nope wasn’t, sorry to disappoint. I’s gots me one dem free public edumacations. Obviously you can’t read, because my title is DAD of homeschoolers. I stand by what I said, am I a bigot becuase I called bs on something anectdotal with no names or companies? or because I called the person on the fact that if she’s a “mensa” she’s supposed to be smart enough to determine long before seven years that she’s getting a raw deal at where she’s working and if she’s so smart why can’t she find someplace else to work.
Yes I am bigoted, against sorry old whiney feminists who are angry at the fact that they were born with the wrong parts.
True equality will only exist in a world where everyone pees sitting down!
President Obama the follower realized. Who wears the pants in the family? It’s not Obama. Doormat meet Obama. You’ll be the bestest friends….
20. steeple:
Completely unfair appraisal of my contributions, both in their own nature and in your lack of condemning those engaging in the relentless negativity of liberals and Obama and anything Democratic. You complain about me because I disagree with you. If i were relentless negative but just happened to agree with you, then you wouldn’t have a problem, as your post proves.
In other words, I find your situational principles of behavior wholly despicable.
23. Mongoose:
“Now and then: In a free society, the government is not supposed to pass legislation that regulates people’s lives.”
Is there another kind?
27. Dadofhomeschoolers:
“Obviously you can’t read, because my title is DAD of homeschoolers.”
Right, which I acknowledged when I wrote, “Home schooled, eh? Sounds like you were, too.” Obviously an acknowledgement that your kids are home schooled, and that you “sound” like you were, too. Yes, please, learn to read.
“Yes I am bigoted, against sorry old whiney feminists who are angry at the fact that they were born with the wrong parts.”
Yes, you are bigoted. And frankly, I always thought women were born with the right parts. At least the parts I’m interested in. You must be one of those home schoolers that teaches your kids that “Janey has Two Daddies”?
ha..4
girlie do the ” sorry, i have a headache thig”.. boy learn to use hands more wisely.. girlie go on to do bigger and better things…
Alice, nice rant. Two tiny little problems, though….
We haven’t been sinking money into Blackwater for the past eight years regarding Iraq. We’ve been in Iraq since 2003. It is now 2009. I trust you can do the math.
Also, Panetta just canceled a contract with Xe (formerly Blackwater) this morning. If you were paying attention to the news (no, Tiger Woods’ latest bimbo eruption doesn’t count as news), you’d know that.
I will bet my house that Msmensa fabricated or grossly misrepresented her story to make her sorry point. Even 30 years ago such unequal treatment would never have been tolerated – especially within Fortune 100 companies where it would be far more likely that she would be promoted and rewarded way beyond what her actual performance warranted.
I experienced a lot of this first hand but back then I bought into the notion of redressing prior era “inequalities” by allowing the pendulum to swing the other way. However, I noted over the years that an awful lot of people who benefited from affirmative action were not willing to put in the effort required to perform well. Rather they continued to escalate their feelings of grievance and entitlement. This appears to be a common theme among all of the beneficiaries of the left/liberal “progressive” programs.
Forget N&T. He is a paid instigator and vile person. He made comments about Glen Beck’s child that were off the charts in crudness.
He should be ignored.
I once worked with a woman who’s fiance told her he wanted her to quit work so she could greet him at the door every night in a negligee and martini in hand. I thought she was NUTS for marrying this guy. After 20 years of working full-time, what I wouldn’t give to meet a guy like that now…..
How much longer are we going to take this crap from those least able, least willing, and least likely to defend this country?
Now and Then, you’re right. Completely unfair. I suspect that you think most of life is unfair.
Say something substantive and then we will find out where we agree and disagree.
Despicably yours,
Steeple
Two legs good, three legs bad.
Must be nice to spew hate from your safe-haven in mom’s basement. I seriously doubt you have the manhood to back up your statements, or is that another bygone value you’re glad has passed?
Now and Then
Must be nice to spew hate from your safe-haven in mom’s basement. I seriously doubt you have the manhood to back up your statements, or is that another bygone value you’re glad has passed?
Msmensa here. Sorry guys…but my story is NOT BS, as some of you have suggested. Every word is true. Several of you have asked why I didn’t leave sooner. I had achieved FAR more advancement than any of the other women there. I was respected by all the district mgrs for my ability to get outstanding RESULTS. Requests for my (expensive) district visits overwhelmed the company’s travel gurus. I reached the position of National Sales Mgr…I just couldn’t make a “man’s salary”. I didn’t complain. I naively thought that my gender would soon be compensated as my male counterparts were compensated. I realized I was the first woman to attend their all-male board meetings but I knew I had bottom line value. I stayed because I was so damn good at my job and my psyche demands that I always be the best in any assignment. I figured that as top mgmt became accustomed to a women executive, my salary would fall in line. It never happened and I gave up and left. Yes, this was in ’83 but I find it amazing that you men won’t accept the fact that true discrimination exited!
So long as opposition politicians are afraid to speak up against the whines of the politically correct nothing will change. Here is Britain we are witnessing the rise of the British National Party, the not very pleasant face of right wing politics.
But while in the working class perceprtion nobody else speaks for them the BNP will do well.
It has not started in America yet but as soon as an extremist populist steps up people will be winnling to listen.
Does anyone watch How I Met your Mother? Barney, the womanizer played by Neil Patrick Harris, started off as a politically correct hippie who was nice to women. When he realized that he was basically just a loser and that the girls he liked would never date him, he “suited up”, made a ton of money, and sees a different girl every night. So I’m sure the current crop of male bashing will have some nice unintended consequences as todays 20-somethings get some harsh lessons about the world. (Not to say that Barney is a role model, just that he represents two extremes.)
It is likely that Liberals, generally, do not disdain humans, but that they disdain their position in the universe as powerless servants, as all humans are powerless servants. This position is commonly, though abstractly, referred to as rejecting authority – abstract since they actually do follow an authority – and, is based on the ironic juxtaposition of powerless servants able to comprehend the divine – the power of . This divide in human’s nature is their main objection (and unspoken), as what right did God have to make a frustrating existence for man (having boundaries) if we are gods? (The unspoken nature of this understanding has many implications, also.) So, it is rebellion on a principle that they blindly unite on, while it is the devil, yes Satan himself, that cares nothing for humanity, and who plays Iago to Liberals. Satan’s goal is to usurp God’s authority. To this end he plies man’s desire, while they are led to believe it is really their own that is being vied for.
Is it logical to think Liberals are simply illogical bozos as the article suggests, and as is common fodder in conservative ranting? Probably, in most cases, I hope, not.
But this also begs the question, Then is Satan an illogical bozo for thinking he can overthrow God? The answer is in the Power of the Word, which is known to all created things, it seems that it is what gives God His power, and whoever can take control of this can overthrow God. Satan is a being overtaken by lust for power. But in the end we shall all see that God gives the Word power.
As a woman, I’m completely disgusted by the libtard notion of fairness. I would love to be a stay at home mom and raise my children. I *LIKE* the idea of an aggressive, possessive man defending me and mine. It’s my job to back him up and that’s where I’m strongest.
Ohhhh…I have to jump in on this one! First of all, being a woman, I have no doubt that was MsMensa #4 says is correct. After 25 years of obtaining a well-earned degree from a well known university, I find it appalling how women are treated in the workforce. If the men aren’t successful trying every underhanded trick in the book to “trip you up” and bring you down, the undereducated women will.
How do you think women feel when they are paid 40-50% less than their male counterpart but are expected to perfom twice the work? If a woman demands and gets equal pay, the men absolutely hate her and make sure the woman’s life is miserable. I remember reading a news story about two men who worked for and sued Jenny Craig (a women’s company) saying they could not break through the glass-ceiling. I thought “welcome to the club butt-heads; now go find a job in a man’s company and stop trying to take away what few opportunities women have in the workforce”.
As for you John-TMF #9 and your “unreconstructed male’s cold deaf ears, when push came to shove, I would tell some men that I was not their Mother or wife or girlfriend; in other words they’d better listen up. You should have seen the looks on their faces, stunned with jaws dropped. I hope you don’t wake up one day “WIFELESS”.
As for Dave M #12 and Mongoose #23, MsMensa stuck in out and got an impressive resume, didn’t she? Mongoose, if there was not so much discrimination by the white male, there would be no need for any governmental intervention. Speaking of that, a young black professional was talking to me about feeling oppressed and discriminated against in the workforce and I told him I understood how he felt because I had been treated the same way. His response was “Well, that’s because you are a woman”. I have not been sympathetic to the black cause ever since.
I would like to clarify something in my previous statement. I obtained my degree 25 years ago not that it took 25 years to obtain.
Now and Then is just boring and predictable, uses ad hominem arguments, offers nothing in the way of discourse. This has been his way with any thread and any article.
Ha!!! knew that would catch some humorless angry individual…
I have had more close dear wonderful friendships, and very close and fruitful professional relationships with women than you will ever understand or care to know about. They are my equals and have been treated as such by me.
I have been married to the same woman for 22 years… and believe me she is not a nightie and martini type. She is a strong independent and wonderful partner who cares deeply about our relationship (as do I) and our family.
But you sure stepped in it. Tad bitter and angry eh? You should have quit and found a new job… seriously. If you were working for for dreck meisters, then you should have left. You are not a slave, no one owns you, and you are free to find new more rewarding work. It isn’t easy.. but it sure beats getting the short end of the stick.
That takes courage and self-critique, and honesty.
Almost everyone of either sex, including me, has worked a crap job where everyone else earned more, and we worked our cans off… its called paying dues. It stinks, it isn’t fair, it is often painful, and the lessons learned from the experience should lead to smarter choices, and better perspective.
I just never whined about it.. hung around to have it grind me up and spit me out… I just got up, quit, and found a better job.
Of course like I said no one owns me; and I don’t feel the burning desire to be a victim to suit my passive aggressive need to manipulate emotions. I sure don’t go crying to the government and the courts to fix every slight.
So… I am a happy man with a long career, comfortable in my own skin. I look for no one to validate my feelings, or tell me that I am special. I have God, my lovely and intelligent wife/best friend/life companion, and my marvelous children. I need little else.
Peace, Love, and Bobby Sherman
Sorry. This article really messes up big time. Given the Democratic misogyny directed towards Hillary Clinton and later Sarah Palin during last year’s election — do you honestly think Obama & co. revere women?
“Of course, sophistocates discount the impressions of plebes like me. To them women only appear to lead epicurean lives revolving around self-absorption, the pursuit of pleasure, and persistent entertainment.”
Aren’t you forgetting the child-rearing we have to do by ourselves, as I did? That’s while taking the role of breadwinning too.
Ms Mensa – I am a serial entrepreneur who understands what it takes to succeed as you do. I would have you as a partner in a heart beat – it aint easy and you have paid your dues.
48. Kevin S:
if you were honest with yourself you’d admit that what you don’t lie is how good I am at pointing out the soft, runny inconsistencies that plague conservatives in general and the self-lauding Googlpediests here in particular. Now ain’t that right.
Surely you jest. If you are going to pretend you missed the misogynist slugfest directed at Hillary and then at Palin by the left, I can only assume you were stranded on a desert island without any ability to communicate.
In 2008, the left, led by Obama, showed the contempt they have for women. We are just a block to be used, threatened at voting time with the overturning of Roe v. Wade if we do not “fall in line.” And told to get out of the way of history. As if a woman being elected would not make just as much history.
If these boobs adored us so much why are we still earned 77 cents on the dollar to this day — they have had majorities in congress before and did not pass ERA. And no, the Lily Ledbetter Act is not the same thing nor does it have the same result.
#14 Now and Then
#14 Now and Then – The Lily Ledbetter Act was an attempt to pass an ex post facto law. Lily Ledbetter had already lost her court case, because she missed the statute of limitations deadline. Sucks to be her, but it’s her own damned fault. They then tried to hijack the system to accomodate her, which would have created all kinds of havoc in the courts.
Only those 36 Republican men seemed to give a damn about the Constitution. Everyone else seems to vote with their emotions instead of with reason. We’re governed by a bunch of teenagers.
Msmensa – If some of us have trouble believing your tale, it’s because to us Conservatives, such behavior is unfathomable. That they would treat you so, we cannot fathom. That you would put up with it for so long, we also cannot fathom.
For the record, perhaps you should not start your posts with, “You men just don’t get it!” ‘Tis a poor way of winning friends and influencing people. IOW, poor salesmanship. We men are not all the same.
FWIW, most men and women I’ve met in sales are not especially bright or capable. They are used to getting by on their looks and their affability/congeniality/collegiallity. Their work usually sets a very low bar. If someone comes along who had a solid work-ethic and real capability, he/she makes them look really bad, with predictable negative results. This doesn’t happen very often. The bosses can go through half a career until they meet one. Then, they are not sure what to make of such, or even what to do with the new reality.
This could explain much of your experience. Could also have simply been a bad company, top to bottom. Could have been bad luck of the draw for you. So, don’t blame all the men, nor think that it is like that everywhere.
I’m getting pretty suck of how males are protrayed as well. Whenever you watch a commercial, TV show or movie, take note of how many times a male is protrayed as intelligent, kind and hard working. Nowadays we’re always protrayed as lazy, stupid, abusive and generally as horny losers. Females are now demanding discriminatory work place and college acceptance quotas, preferential treatment in court rooms and unfair business standards that require employeers to pay them more than males per hour. Leftist feminist organizations also successfully lobbied the Democraps in Congress and the White House into giving female dominated work industries preferential treatment when it came to writing the “stimulus” bill – which was one of the main reasons why it was so incredibly unsuccessful at helping the economy. These anti-male feminist groups didn’t want all the money going to “while male construction workers” so they demanded that equal amounts of funding went to professions females dominate like teaching and nursing – which are virtually recession proof industries. That’s the reason why male unemployment is over twice as high as female unemployment right now and why so few jobs were created. Nearly half of the stimulus money went to covering local and state government budgets so they could keep their female employees hired. The modern feminist movement has ultimately become nothing more than a big leftist special interest group that is part of the problem in Washington D.C.. All the basic rights females needed have long been given. Campaigning for the equal funding of female highschool volley ball teams is pretty low on most females radars I’d imagine. Feminists trying to kick down doors that are already open just looks pathetic and annoying now.
Men made a huge mistake when they ALLOWED women to vote. NOW, NARAL and (Planned UnParents in the Hoods) is but one result. Basically, women have proven to be deceitful, unfeminine and the
enemy of men. They are a dishonest squeaky wheel that even our SCOTUS caved to; in the lie that was Roe v Wade. Title IX is yet
another destructive law; insisted upon by females, and catered to by an effeminate congress and educational system–where women
have infected fundamental education and destroyed the futures of
millions of male students; with their abuses. Radical feminist’s do not seek equality; they seek supremacy through the oppression of men they can NOT actually compete with. If males went on strike, from the REAL jobs that keeps our nation functional, the
USA would collapse; as women went on whining about their importance and lack of fair pay; another lie, perpetuated by feminist’s liars! Women think American citizens do not get their con; but we do. Education, dominated by women in the classrooms, is broken. The medical field, dominated by women, broken, bankrupt and infected by evil. I served many years in the USArmy–before it became coed by act of congress; women are destroying the U.S. military from within. DACOWITS, NOW, and NARAL conspire to deceive; a crime against America for the self centered female.
” God made the world and rested, made man and rested, made women and since then no one has rested.” DONG CHEE
#55 Marc, you have some good points. You’re right…my opening words were inflammatory and antagonistic. Seeing those words, you (of course) concluded that I’m an angry liberal feminist. You wouldn’t be more inaccurate. Raised by a US army general father who espoused integrity, discipline, & loyalty, I knew no other way than to give 100% to my company, NEVER complaining. NEVER rocking the boat. Republican traits!
And #56 Marsh, I’m certainly not calling for more gov’t interference in the private workplace. Actually I wanted only one result from my original post (#4): I wanted to see, “Yes, I’m a man who saw it…blatant discrimination towards SOME outstanding females who got the RESPONSIBILITY but never the corresponding salaries they deserved!”
That’s all I wanted…the male confessions.
#56. You are right. I am noticing a trend in the negative portrayal of WHITE males in the media, especially sitcoms and commercials. Criminals are now always white. (I refer to those awful home alarm commercials mainly)Now it’s the black males who are the bosses, talking down to their stupid white subordinates. Women are being shown as shrews, aggressive, whiny with a contemptuous attitude towards their husbands. Children are know-it-all 12 year-olds going on 30. It is a deliberate attempt to further screw up an already demoralized society.
55. Marc Malone:
“Only those 36 Republican men seemed to give a damn about the Constitution. Everyone else seems to vote with their emotions instead of with reason. We’re governed by a bunch of teenagers.”
Complete and utter nonsense, and I can prove it in one word . . . Schiaivo
Poor men. What a bunch of victims. D. Grant Chee, I bet you have a hard time dating, you sweet talker.
John-TMF #49:
You’re so full of it and you know it. I didn’t step in anything. All you did was to show the world you in fact have “male’s cold deaf ears”. You really didn’t listen(absorb)to what I was saying, instead your insecurities popped up, beating yourself on the chest saying how wonderful you are. You might want to check that “I’m wonderful, life is wonderful” radar of yours. It’s way out of whack.
And you speak of paying dues, please tell me what I can get with a business degree and 25 years of experience. Oh, I forgot I am a woman so that is discounted to an associate’s degree with 12 years of experience. I was actually told by one male interviewer I was qualified for the job but would not be considered because it wouldn’t be fitting for a woman to play golf with the guys. But of course, you won’t/couldn’t understand what the problem with that kind of blatant discrimination is all about, now would you?
25 years of angry and self-righteous is hard to get over.
It’s really interesting to be insecure and impressed with my “wonderfulness” at the same time. I must be more amazing than I ever thought…
Perhaps, just perhaps, you were looking in the wrong place. Or on another planet, because in no corporation that I have ever dealt with would that sort of job interview comment ever be tolerated. You’d have met your interviewer on the way out the door.
If I had been his boss I’d have fired him for it, on the spot.
As to the other stuff… such is the nature of negotiations. Maybe you should go work for the Feds… a GS14 makes a great salary with super bennies… and in the federal government everyone knows what everyone else makes. Since in every private corporation that I ever worked for that sort of information is confidential, and disclosing it is grounds for dismissal how you knew what others were making is beyond me.
As to the rest… Your vibe is negative and any good interviewer would pick up on it in a second. You have a chip the size of a redwood tree on your shoulder and that would put off any hiring manager of any sex. In short you probably look and sound like a law suit waiting to happen and not too many companies want that sort of heartburn.
As to the all male golf outing crowd? Who knows? I don’t play golf and don’t hang around the people who substitute it for business.
Wonderfully Yours [insert eye roll here]
The Mighty Fahvaag
1. Pragmatist: Black males get a free pass.
Only those in the UnderClass.
From the Morning News here in Dallas:
Female police officer, in uniform, gets
groped by UC Black male; He said he
felt like he had a right to. She said
he was under arrest.
2. Adina Kutnicki, Israel: Anti-Feminazi
That does follow.
Back when the US had a Frontier, the
pioneers who populated it had an outlook
like yours, for the same reasons;
The coming Hard Times in the US will see
a rebirth of that outlook, and the death
of the feminazi movement.
3. Francis W. Porretto:
Let’s see Congress try to repeal that societal privilege!
Can do easy, G.I.: The Loony Liberal Left/Feminazi Axis
proposes a Mental Health Adjustment bill, including a
provision for Castration Therapy for Macho Men with
terminal testosterone poisoning.
4. Msmensa: You men STILL don’t get it!
Mental Health break: “Oklahoma Crude” with
George C. Scott and Faye Dunaway; The message is that
Life is Unfair, to all of us, and that living well
is the best revenge.
9. John – TMF:
Gender; Linguistic term distinguishing M/F nouns
That turns out not to be the relevant useage here;
Gender refers to the masculine and feminine roles
in society, which are not 1:1 correlated with sex,
but show a complex multimode spectrum based on a
majority twin-peak distribution.
One wise woman’s opinion column put it this way:
“I am so glad that I am no longer inverted, that
I see myself as first a human being, next a woman,
and last a female.”
13. BackwardsBoy: Leftists hold that animals have souls.
Actually, Leftists hold that humans do _not_ have souls;
The Loony Liberal Left Wingnuts hold that animals are
sapients, humans with fur, and carry the concept to
its logical conclusion: Bestiality.
14. Now and Then: Fair pay for Msmensa
You never miss an opportunity to remind the victims of
discrimination that life is not fair to them, and that
they deserve their equal share of a zero-sum pie.
You thereby reinforce the psychopathology which keeps
them victims; Good for you, not so much for them, User.
28. Thomas_l……:
True equality will only exist in a world
where everyone pees sitting down!
As in Scandinavia, where, not satisfied with unisex
restrooms, the new demand is that the urinals be
removed, so that men can no longer commit the rude
and aggressive act of peeing standing up; No Joke.
30. Now and Then: 23. Mongoose:
M: legislation that regulates people’s lives
NAT: Is there any other kind ?
Yes: Congress shall pass no law…
36. Dan: Indefensible crap
Assuming you are one of those who has served;
Go ask the rest of your cohort about equal
rights for their wives and daughters.
45. Shimauna: Man-loving child raiser
I asked a couple of competent women about
the job-and-family dilemma; They said that
it is possible to do both, but impossible
to do both well.
46. angry american:
underhanded men and
undereducated women.
The opposites are even worse.
*********************************
My 2 cents:
Male Bashing, like all the other
vote-buying behavior used to win
the support of protected classes
of victims of discrimination is
about to come to an abrupt stop,
as the rules of life adjust to
Hard Times; When it is win or die,
nobody will have time for XX vs XY.
1. Pragmatist: Black males get a free pass.
Only those in the UnderClass.
From the Morning News here in Dallas:
Female police officer, in uniform, gets
groped by UC Black male; He said he
felt like he had a right to. She said
he was under arrest.
2. Adina Kutnicki, Israel: Anti-Feminazi
That does follow.
Back when the US had a Frontier, the
pioneers who populated it had an outlook
like yours, for the same reasons;
The coming Hard Times in the US will see
a rebirth of that outlook, and the death
of the feminazi movement.
3. Francis W. Porretto:
Let’s see Congress try to repeal that societal privilege!
Can do easy, G.I.: The Loony Liberal Left/Feminazi Axis
proposes a Mental Health Adjustment bill, including a
provision for Castration Therapy for Macho Men with
terminal testosterone poisoning.
4. Msmensa: You men STILL don’t get it!
Mental Health break: “Oklahoma Crude” with
George C. Scott and Faye Dunaway; The message is that
Life is Unfair, to all of us, and that living well
is the best revenge.
9. John – TMF:
Gender; Linguistic term distinguishing M/F nouns
That turns out not to be the relevant useage here;
Gender refers to the masculine and feminine roles
in society, which are not 1:1 correlated with sex,
but show a complex multimode spectrum based on a
majority twin-peak distribution.
One wise woman’s opinion column put it this way:
“I am so glad that I am no longer inverted, that
I see my self as first a human being, next a woman,
and last a female.”
13. BackwardsBoy: Leftists hold that animals have souls.
Actually, Leftists hold that humans do _not_ have souls;
The Loony Liberal Left Wingnuts hold that animals are
sapients, humans with fur, and carry the concept to
its logical conclusion: Bestiality.
14. Now and Then: Fair pay for Msmensa
You never miss an opportunity to remind the victims of
discrimination that life is not fair to them, and that
they deserve their equal share of a zero-sum pie.
You thereby reinforce the psychopathology which keeps
them victims; Good for you, not so much for them, User.
28. Thomas_l……:
True equality will only exist in a world
where everyone pees sitting down!
As in Scandinavia, where, not satisfied with unisex
restrooms, the new demand is that the urinals be
removed, so that men can no longer commit the rude
and aggressive act of peeing standing up; No Joke.
30. Now and Then: 23. Mongoose:
M: legislation that regulates people’s lives
NAT: Is there any other kind ?
Yes: Congress shall pass no law…
36. Dan: Indefensible crap
Assuming you are one of those who has served;
Go ask the rest of your cohort about equal
rights for their wives and daughters.
45. Shimauna: Man-loving child raiser
I asked a couple of competent women about
the job-and-family dilemma; They said that
it is possible to do both, but impossible
to do both well.
46. angry american:
underhanded men and
undereducated women.
The opposites are even worse.
*********************************
My 2 cents:
Male Bashing, like all the other
vote-buying behavior used to win
the support of protected classes
of victims of discrimination is
about to come to an abrupt stop,
as the rules of life adjust to
Hard Times; When it is win or die,
nobody will have time for XX vs XY.
John-TMF
You don’t know anything except I am glad I am not your wife or your kids. Poor things, may the angel of mercy bestow grace on them for having to live with the likes of you. The interviewer was the owner. I believe the owner sets the rules or do you want to fire him? By the way, what department handles/oversees the payroll department? Duuhhh, dope. Tried a little fishing trip there and came up with nothing. You are a 10-year old in a man’s body, so much lack of maturity.
Personally, “the little fahvaag” I really don’t care for another response from you because you are a troll.
66. M. Report:
“14. Now and Then: Fair pay for Msmensa . . . You never miss an opportunity to remind the victims of discrimination that life is not fair to them, and that they deserve their equal share of a zero-sum pie. You thereby reinforce the psychopathology which keeps them victims; Good for you, not so much for them, User.”
Stay with me. I didn’t remind her of anything. She told her story. I acknowledged her truth, which is more than you’re willing or able to do. Your transparent accusation is nothing more than a Turd Blossom Trick. Save it for people around here who don’t recognize you for what you are . . . blinded by entitlement.
You young trolls here have absolutely no idea how you are being used.
When you allow the state to have this kind of power, and when you destroy the Bill of Rights and the Constitution, there is nothing left but tyranny.
This whole diversity racket is just a bogus hustle to acquire power. You are not going to benefit from it at all. You have just been sold a bill of goods. You have been hustled. This White dominance thing is just a myth. You should try running a company and see how the hiring really works.
In fact, the government has no right to tell you who to hire, how to promote them, who you can sell your property to and what your opinion of some else is.
That you can not see this is a sign that your elders have let you down. If you thought like free men and women instead of slaves of the state you would see this.
If you stopped letting the left fill you with a diet of fear, misdirected anger and false and mafactored “Crises” and “wrongs” and “victims”, and tried to live your own lives, and live them without hiding behind the excuse that you are being “victimized” by some other group, you would see just who is trying to limit your lives, and believe me, it is not “white men” (as if most of the trolls here where not white males — I will not say men, for you are not men, not yet.) You are just being manipulated by your own fear an vanities, lead to the slaughter by you own weaknesses and ignorance.
If the Democrats go much father down the path that they are taking us on, we will all be slaves. Do you really think when the government controls entirely the work place that somehow all will be a meritocracy? No, it will be whoever the local commisar decides will “Advance” that will advance? It will be members of their family, people that pay them off one way or another, people that they can use politically. You will have to watch your every word and every action, but eventually it will not matter because they will eventually catch you. They will constantly change the rules on you. It has nothing to do with running a business, being productive or turning a profit. It is all about power. I know, I lived in the USSR.
The Democrats have artifically kept blacks on the “grievance plantation” for generations now. It looks that the women’s right crowd is about to be stuck on the same. The last thing they want is for any of their “victims” to be free.
The world has been own this road before, it has been a disaster. The Soviets had the same “diversity” garbage. Look where that lead.
All you have to do is look at incompetent imbeciles like Obama or Hillary Clinton to see how destructive Affirmative Action is.
Sooner or later, you are going to have to live in the real world. I suggest sooner.
You think that you are about “freedom” but you are about slavery. What will you do when you finally mature and discover not only that you are wrong, but that you share culpability for the destruction of your nation?
In your childishness you laugh at the prospect of this, but one day you will not be laughing.
yeah it sucks being discriminated against, been at the place were less talented fools got the promotions and the better pay. if women want to be equal then they have to bring their “A” game, same as the guys. get the rule book beforehand not after, so you can whine about what seems to be a party foul but is actually allowed by the rules. hate to tell you this but no matter how long you hang around, a woman will never be one of the “BRO’S. women do bring a definite skill set to the table, make sure its the right woman for the right job. hey just like for guys. i have also noted the presentation of the American male in movies and media.since i don’t like being discriminated against, i have to agree with my white brothers. America used to have veterans playing soldiers in the movies. now we have Sean Penn, as opposed to Jimmy Stewart.
My purpose for entering comments on this subject was to try to explain that discrimination against women really DID exist. After I gave up and left my Fortune 100 co, I entered a special program with Southland Corp (7-Eleven)…because I had a good resume. There at 7-Eleven, I encountered NO barriers…NO discrimination…zero…nada…none! There were the OCCASIONAL “That’s not fair!” outcries from EVERYONE…but certainly NOT the CONSTANT discrimination towards ONLY WOMEN at my former Fortune 100 company. At 7-Eleven we were judged on MERIT! Later I took the experience from both companies and started a business with my new husband. When I married him (a civil engineer with less than $200 dollars in his pocket), I had savings (like a good republican) & we started our own business. The 7 years of suffering discrimination TAUGHT me how to deal in a man’s world: sometimes I simply played the “supportive wife”…while I was really determining our business strategy. Today we’re happily retired with a multi-million dollar house and zero debt. Achievement IS the best revenge…but I STILL crave male acknowledgement that MANY women (outside of gov’t jobs) have been treated VERY unfairly!!!!
#38,
and a middle finger ?
The women enjoy many inequality > than those males. The British law thats being exercised all over the colonies of past has such laws. In adultery ” .. In this case the woman will not be punished as abettor”. ( See 497, 498 of Penal Code of Bangladesh, India and Pakistan).Also the case of “enticing” the woman will not be punished. How an adult woman be enticed away and if so why by his vote Govt., will decide. While voting, decision making she is adult/conscious but while so called enticing she’s immature all over the life. Women fighting and establishing many equal rights and we hope they will get success. But why they suppress these? They R protesting against attachment of surname of spouse but ironically true in many countries people (women) didn’t know it, they, to dignify their position attached so and increasing the population(Of users) and now protesting. In countries like oours its very few.
I observe many peculiar things. When we ask why separate footbal volleyball team etc., the answer is reasonable ” Yet to develop muscle-power like males”. Correct no doubt, but when we asks why a game like chess we got not reasonable logic to make separate competition, association ! Because chess isnt a muscle-power game. know via friends and media that The very word beauty, beauty compettition cosmmmetic photographs made me burst into laughter. My daughter will be Doctor or Artist and my son will be Engineer etc., the total phobia against Physical science and engineering .. ! Women criticizing males for using them as models but never criticize themselves for crowding flocking there.
I apologize, I might be treated as anti-feminist. I remember in India wives attacked their Husbands’ meeting and attacked and the welknown weekly of Kolkata responded to this happening as a sigh!
@Msmensa
A quick question. How did you know about the salary discrepancy to make the complaint or be aware of discrimination? Every company I’ve worked for it was company policy that compensation was not to be discussed between employees and that doing so could be grounds for dismissal.
In my book if you were out performing the men then the management was stupid to pass you over for promotion. However good performance can sometimes be its own curse as you may have made yourself indispensable in that position. Another thing I’ve seen in the corporate world, that I don’t agree with, is its not necessarily job performance but how well you play politics (or kiss ass) that leads to promotions. Is it possible that you were great at your job but didn’t play office politics well? Can you honestly say that there weren’t men who didn’t get promotions either due to lack of ability in the arena of office politics?
Also if you had a clear cut case of discrimination why didn’t you pursue legal action?
BTW as someone else mentioned, as a Conservative discrimination based upon sex, religion, or race are alien to me. Sexual preference is a gray area for me, it would really depend upon the individual and is less attached to what they do in the bedroom than how they behave on the job. The problem is that personality/behavior is somewhat inseparable from sexuality. If the person dressed and behaved within the accepted norms for business I could really care less about about their private life. Now if they won’t adhere to accepted norms that becomes an issue. Its really no different than me not hiring a heterosexual person who does not fit the image of my business I want to present to my customers. I wouldn’t hire a person with visible tattoos or piercings to interface with my clients, unless that was the norm with my clientele.
Back to the sexual discrimination discussion, if all things are equal (education, experience, duties) you should get equal pay for equal work. Thing is though many people think “I have the same title and job as that guy so I should make what he makes” when they don’t take into account “that guy” may have 5 more years of experience, maybe was a better negotiator when hired and at review time, or might have been with the company longer.
#59 Msmensa – No, *I* did not think of you as an angry feminist. I did, however, have to work a bit to see past the bigoted brush, just as I had to work to see past this slur of me. Again, no way to win friends. I’m trying as hard as I can to be fair to you and listen to your complaints, but you are NOT making it easy.
In your post in #71, you related to us all your tremendous success. I applaud it. Good for you. However, you still demand acknowledgment of the unfairness you endured.
Please allow me to offer a bit of male wisdom. I ask that you consider this fully, because men DO have some things to offer.
Let it go.
In the end, all that matters is the face that looks back at you from the mirror in the morning. Self-respect is all. Men know this instinctively. They may seek adulation as juveniles, but in the end, once they grow up, they seek their own approval. Their measure is knowing they’ve made the grade. Money is only a small part of it. There are all sorts of societal measures as to what makes a proper man, and a man knows when he’s made the cut.
Women, too often seek the approval of others, as you are doing, seeking the acknowledgment of unfairness. Men have no time for such nonsense. We do not indulge whiny men. We have only contempt for those who seek the approval of others rather than themselves. Such behavior is a sign of weakness. such a man is a juvenile… or a pussy.
Women are physically weak and vulnerable. They therefore seek the group, and men, as protection. This is why they focus so much on “relationships”. Does he still love me? Have we changed overnight? Is she still on my side? Women don’t trust, because they feel vulnerable, so they are always gauging, gauging, gauging. They seek the approval of the group. Pussy men do, too.
YOU have achieved, Msmensa. You do not need our recognition of the unfairness you endured. You only need to recognize that you overcame it. The adversity was the key to your success, because it made you strong. It made you more determined. It eventually drove you to change; to leave the environment; and eventually, to start your own business with your husband, and succeed. If not for that, you would likely have become comfortable enough where you were, and not achieve the pre-eminence you have.
A man just shrugs his shoulders at unfairness. It is just an obstacle to overcome. We all have our challenges. We are not children on the schoolground, crying out, “It’s Not Fair!” We grow up. We become men. Adversity overcomes us, or we overcome it. You have overcome. Rejoice! Get down on your knees and thnk God for the adversity that made you strong. That adversity was the key to your success.
So, stop whining. It is unseemly in a man. I know you’re a woman, but you were competing in a man’s arena. Men compete. We strive for success. The business world is about ferocious competition; the Battle of the Balance Sheets. If women want to play with the big boys, then they need to learn to not snivel and whine. Be like men in this. You, Msmensa, have won, so quit whining about it, already.
Go look in the mirror. See the self-respect. Let go of the bitterness. Then, go enjoy your retirement, light of heart, knowing you’ve won.
77 Marc Malone:
“A man just shrugs his shoulders at unfairness . . . stop whining.”
I think that’s news to the whining men on this thread.
Then again, we expect conservatives to tell people how to act. It’s a control thing. If only they knew what’s right, it would so much less objectionable.
#77 Marc Malone…You’re right! I accept everything you wrote! I have to let it go. I have to think of those 7 years as the vehicle that changed me from the naive high school prom queen to the strong realistic businesswoman I became. Thanks Marc…you’ve nailed a major male/female difference and you’ve put me back on track!
As an aside, #77 Marc Malone, I just reread your first paragraph to me and nooooooooo…there was no sarcasm intended by me in my #59 comment to you. When I wrote, “Seeing those words, you (of course) concluded that I’m an angry liberal feminist”, I meant, “Of course you thought that, because my words DID sound inflammatory.” I DID NOT mean to convey sarcasm ..I’m sorry I wasn’t clear.
Real Deal. It is the left that discrimnates on Race etc., not conservatives.
That is just hg wash. The Democratic party was the party of slavery, the Confederacy, Jim Crow and the welfare plantation. Get your facts straight, You have just been brain washed.
These are just lies and propaganda Imagine going to China or Japan as a black female and run for public office.
What Conservatives object too is the victimology hustle, the bilking of the tapayer for it, the lowering of standards, the intrusions on liberty and the lack of personal responsibility all of this “diversity nonsense” cause. top misrepresenting what conservatives believe.
And, Real Deal, it is people like you that end up paying for all of this in the long run.
msmensa: “Strong realistic Business Woman” Too funny.
When I hear narcissistic garbage like that, I know that you are not even anywhere close to the truth about your role at that company or the “sexual discrimination.
You are just a kid. You are still wet behind the ears. You think you are headed for great things. You are not. You are a functionary and bureaucrat, and rely on politcal posturings, not performance. BEing and employee of antoher company does not make you a “business woman”. A Business woman would own her own business. Most people, of either sexes out there that call themselves “businessmen” or “business women” are noting of the sort, and take them out of their corporate heirarchies, and they would not know how to sell a beer in Ireland or noodles in China.
You need to have a look around and see how the real world works. Everyone is nailed to the deck. Get used to it.
I hope you remember 25 years from now that in your 20′s you were calling yourself a “Strong Business Women”.
This “Strong women” BS we hear out of females today–I will not say women, for they have not the slightest notion of what women are or what they do–is just vanity and nonsense, and the fact you are out here whining about “diversity” shows not that your are a “Strong Women”, or even a woman per se, but a weak, self indulgent little girl. You are not a “strong Woman”, you are a spoiled brat.
Strong people do not go crying to the government because reality does not affirm their narcissistic self-regard. Any group that has to constantly announce how strong they are cannot be anything but weak.
White men ought to run around for a while, puff up their chests and talk about what “strong businessmen” they are. This will point out the absurdity of all this “Strong Women” nonsenses. It is a vainglorious self promotion and in no way statement of fact.
Strength comes from overcoming one;s ego, not form indulging it.
Re hattip #82, I don’t mind your attacking me personally, but your conclusions are waaaay off:
1. You wrote, “You are just a kid”. Huh? I explained that the bad portion of my worklife ended in ’83.
2. You wrote, “A business woman would own her own business”. I wrote just that.
Marc Malone #77 wrote that I should recognize that my 7 yr experience of good promotions but lousy salaries made me fight harder (& smarter) and contributed to my later success. I had never thought of it that way and have concluded that Marc was RIGHT and I am working to let it go…and think of it as a positive.
3. You wrote, “You are out there whining about diversity”. Huh? I’m the daughter of an army general…”Personal Responsibility” has ALWAYS been my mantra.
4. You said, “Strong women do not go running to the govt.” Huh? I specifically wrote that I was NOT advocating govt interference.
I am a STRONG free market advocate!
Real Deal. It is the left that discrimnates on Race etc., not conservatives.
Have you been partaking of the medical marijuana Mongoose? I suggest that you re-read the first sentence of #76 several times.
I am fully aware of the political parties history, and probably know far more about the War of Succession (or War of Northern Aggression if you like) than you do. I prefer not to call it the Civil War as it is a misnomer, the Southern States legally seceded and the North then conquered and annexed the C.S.A.’s territory.
Ha! See the difference in responses to my remarks in post #77. #78 Now and Then ridiculed and sneered. #79 Msmensa saw it as good, life-changing advice. They can’t both be right. One is acting the fool. You decide which.
#82 hattip – You probably should have read through all the comments. See how well Msmensa took a solid, man-to-man talk. How admirable was that? Hope you apologize.
I’m a little late but that first comment was way off base. When you said black men get a free pass, you’re not paying attention. From back when black men would get lynched for even looking at a white woman to now when some woman can say a black man kidnapped her and her daughter and the entire Philadelphia Police Department believes her and stops every black man they can find, black men are always the scapegoat. There are over hundreds of subgenres of rap music. So when Don Imus calls black women nappy headed hoes, the media spins it on rap. You figure it out.