Obama Is Wrong, Wrong, Wrong About Honduras
The Obama administration seems to have gotten just about everything wrong about the ouster of Honduran President Manuel Zelaya. Wrong on the law. Wrong on the politics. Wrong on the foreign policy.
On the law, Miguel Estrada, the brilliant attorney whose nomination to the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals was blocked by those who abhor a truly wise Latino conservative, actually has read the Honduran constitution. He finds that it specifies that it cannot be amended to change the limit on a single four-year term for the president. And it further provides that trying to amend the constitution “constitutes treason.” As Estrada reminds us, “The rules are so tight because these are terribly serious issues for Honduras, which lived under decades of military rule.”
But Zelaya, who fancies himself the next Hugo Chavez, ordered himself up a referendum earlier this year with the clear purpose to amend the constitution to do what is prohibited and indeed treasonous. After all, such a gambit is precisely the mechanism his role model Chavez used in order to extend his rule in Venezuela.
The Honduran Congress voted that Zelaya’s referendum was illegal. And what followed was a model of strict constitutional interpretation and fidelity to the rule of law:
The attorney general filed suit and secured a court order halting the referendum. Zelaya then announced that the voting would go forward just the same, but it would be called an “opinion survey.” The courts again ruled this illegal. Undeterred, Zelaya directed the head of the armed forces, Gen. Romeo Vasquez, to proceed with the “survey” — and “fired” him when he declined. The Supreme Court ruled the firing illegal and ordered Vasquez reinstated.
Zelaya had the ballots printed in Venezuela, but these were impounded by customs when they were brought back to Honduras. On June 25 — three days before he was ousted — Zelaya personally gathered a group of “supporters” and led it to seize the ballots, restating his intent to conduct the “survey” on June 28. That was the breaking point for the attorney general, who immediately sought a warrant from the Supreme Court for Zelaya’s arrest on charges of treason, abuse of authority and other crimes. In response, the court ordered Zelaya’s arrest by the country’s army, which under Article 272 must enforce compliance with the Constitution, particularly with respect to presidential succession. The military executed the court’s order on the morning of the proposed survey.
Estrada concludes that while Zelaya’s arrest was “legal, and rather well justified to boot,” his exile was not. (Solution: let him back in to the country and send him to jail.)
Then there is the politics within Honduras. It seems the Honduran people have figured out what Zelaya is up to and don’t like it one bit. The Wall Street Journal reports:
Honduran media published a CID-Gallup poll that showed 41% of Hondurans said the coup was justified, while 28% were opposed. The survey, conducted between June 30 and July 4, supported anecdotal evidence of anger at Mr. Zelaya. While thousands of Hondurans take to the streets almost daily to protest the ouster, larger crowds often demonstrate in favor of the coup.
Rodriguez said Zelaya’s bid for a nationwide referendum that could have extended presidential term limits violated an article in the Honduran constitution, which states that anyone who seeks to change a prohibition on presidential reelection immediately loses any office they hold. . . In an interview this week with CNN en Espanol, Rodriguez took the direct approach to addressing Chavez: “I want to take this opportunity to say that we totally reject the meddling of the Venezuelan president. We are a small country, but a sovereign one.”
So while Obama might find the ouster of Chavez’s “mini-me” to be “illegal” and “unacceptable,” the Honduran constitution and people don’t agree.
And then there is the foreign policy side of the equation. In yet another effort to apologize for past American sins, Obama was quick to weigh in against the “coup.” Now this was neither a coup (see Estrada) nor an American coup, but let’s not gets hung up on technicalities.
What Obama was clearly doing was trying to escape the image that he was merely one more American president in conflict with anti-American voices in the region. He wasn’t going to let a little bit of Chavez-emulation deter him. He is, we have come to see, in the business of being “Not George W. Bush.” And in this case that meant siding with the anti-American Zelaya and his patron Chavez.
That, of course, has put the Obama administration at odds with the Honduran people and the “rule of law” which Obama always invokes when he is not really following the applicable rule of law. So finding themselves in a bit of a bind, the Obama team punted to the former president of Costa Rica who proceeded to begin negotiations. He then penned an odd column in the Washington Post in which he explained that problems like this occur when “governments divert to their militaries resources that could be used to strengthen their democratic institutions.” (Actually in this case the military was defending democratic institutions, but let’s hope his mediation skills are up to the task of finding an acceptable solution.)
So Obama on this one got the law, the politics, and the foreign policy wrong. And, perhaps realizing as much, he has had to reverse course (or force his secretary of state to do so) and get out of the limelight. That is the most positive development yet. Really, if you are going to “meddle” it is best to know something about the country in which you are meddling and the regional implications which will flow from it.






“What Obama was clearly doing was trying to escape the image that he was merely one more American president in conflict with anti-American voices in the region.”
No what obama was doing was reacting in fear and panic to a group that would dare hold something as “undemocratic”(ie anti-communist) as the evil hondarus constitution(you should hear what he says about our(US) constitution) above the will of “the people”(aka a “democratically” elected official, aka god, aka zelaya).
The simple fact is obama does not want anyone in the US to get any ideas that the constitution is the supreme law of the land…. only “the people” are the supreme law of the land and as the god selected by the ppl(aka a “democratically” elected official) that means that obama is GOD and supreme ruler. Obama said it himself “this is a very bad precedent”… because ppl revolting and forcing their leaders to obey the laws/constitution is a very very bad precedent for obama’s future plans and the fact that the military so easily removed a “democratically” elected official(aka god) causes him great distress… most of all because he knows the US military is very pro-constitution and is just looking for an excuse to come after him.
What he sees is his future self being arrested and its doubtfully he’ll be lucky enough to be sent into exile.
Obambi is running solidly to type. His sensibilities are pro-communist and he shows that domestically and internationally. Like Jimmy Carter, he will side with America’s enemies any chance he gets.
CONCACAF Gold Cup:
Honduras 4, Grenada 0
My My..a well written article on 7 rules for 2012, and another well written and thought out article on the situation in Honduras…Have trouble with extending that to why President Obama does something, but the centerpiece of this article is correct; the Constitution of Honduras does not support the President ( Ex? ) Zelaya’s actions.
Bravo.
Barack Obama minimally on a subconscious level envies Hugo Chavez. He was hoping he could do to the United States what his leftist counterpart is doing to Venezuela. Fortunately, Obama is increasingly becoming a marginalized figure. The main thing we may now have to be concerned about is whether he experiences a mental breakdown in office. Our elected representatives in Congress are realizing that it is politically safer to be on the opposite side of Obama on most issues. And I’m not limiting my remarks to Republicans. Purple and red state Democrats are now starting to run for their lives.
The assumption that Obama is wrong because he is unknowing, naive or stupid is itself naive and stupid.
Naive and stupid people don’t get to be POTUS.
Practically everything about Obama is upside down, but there are other explanations.
I must say it was an eye opener to watch the congressional hearing on CSPAN this past Friday.
Her is the C-span link if your are interested in it.
http://www.c-span.org/Watch/Media/2009/07/10/HP/A/20669/House+Subcmte+Hearing+On+Honduras.aspx
To a man (or woman) the left simply parroted the leftist talking points, couldn’t count the times they repeated the words “Military Coup” obviously following the old attack method of repeating a lie often enough hoping to make the public believe it. The left couldn’t have cared one bit for the facts of the matter, they just ignored those and pushed on with their talking points.
The Republican members of the hearing did a good job presenting the facts as did several members of the panel. Interestingly Lanny Davis , former Clinton Attorney was there representing several groups of Honduran citizens and presented his clients position very well and helped in getting the actual facts of the situation out into the public view.
Never in a million years did think I would ever be on the same side of an issue as Mr. Davis but it only goes to prove that right is right regardless of who the issues proponent may be.
I would encourage everyone who missed it to view the video from the link as it actually is quiet disturbing. It really brings home how far this administration and the leftist movement in our government is willing to go to push their obviously Socialistic agenda. It will leave you with no doubt as to how far left they really are.
When you know the truth, to sit there and watch these leftist politicians lie repeatedly, while ignoring the facts, for no other reason than to push a larger political agenda is chilling.
here is C-Span’s link to the Hearing from last Friday. It is worth your time.
http://www.c-span.org/Watch/Media/2009/07/10/HP/A/20669/House+Subcmte+Hearing+On+Honduras.aspx
What all else is Obama wrong about? Cap and trade, national health care, shredding bond holders contracts, having all these czars that answer to only Obama, placing caps on compensation of private executives, a stimulus package that does anything but stimulate the economy. Thinking that spreading the wealth of those that earn it to those that do not, and attempting to create a socialist economy in a capitalist one.
I knew it would be bad when he got elected but this is even worse than I had thought, those that did not vote in the last election must in 2010 and it is hoped that those that did vote for him are starting to see just what he is and vote out all liberals (mostly democrats) and put the brakes on the reckless spending and new taxes and possibly rescind what has already been done.
“Naive and stupid people don’t get to be POTUS.”
Evidence please!
This is wishful thinking at best. A BIG LIE at worst.
Or perhaps those words Naive and stupid don’t mean what you think they do.
na⋅ive
/nɑˈiv/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [nah-eev] Show IPA
Use naive in a Sentence
–adjective
1. having or showing unaffected simplicity of nature or absence of artificiality; unsophisticated; ingenuous.
2. having or showing a lack of experience, judgment, or information; credulous: She’s so naive she believes everything she reads. He has a very naive attitude toward politics.
3. having or marked by a simple, unaffectedly direct style reflecting little or no formal training or technique: valuable naive 19th-century American portrait paintings.
4. not having previously been the subject of a scientific experiment, as an animal.
Also, na⋅ïve.
Whoops, my bad, I was unaware of #4. Although I could agrue that the Usurper fits #4 as well as he fits the first 3.
Jimmy “Peanuts” Carter fitthe first 3 as well as the Usurper does.
Then as further evidence I can present Wilson, FDR, both Bushs and especially Ford. I could even make and support the claim that most of America’s 20th century Presidents WERE naive to a certain extent. It’s almost impossible to win without it.
You see, the politics practiced internally, that any candidate for POTU has to master to win, have absolutely NOTHING to do with the politics practiced out in the real world.
The politics that get you elected Major of Podunk and Governor of Anystate will get your throat cut in Africa or Asia.
Should I do stupid too?
As a general rule ‘stupid is considered a lack of intelligence. Intelligence is the ability to learn. Wuold you not agree that someone who makes the same mistake over and over and over has demonstrated an inability to learn? Doesn’t that make them stupid?
Socialism has failed EVERY TIME it has been tried. EVER TIME. So wouldn’t that make proponents of Socialism stupid? Advocacy of a political system you know will fail is either stupid or evil. I’ll leave that choice to you.
As for the Usurper, he thinks religious fanatics killing people on gods orders are going to stop because he asks then to. If that isn’t naive, what is?
As far as stupid, the Usurpers plan to restore the economy has been tried many time in many nations. It has never worked. NEVER.
So is the Usurper stupid or Evil? Another choice. One you already made. I hope you get a make-over on that choice, although I doubt it.
The hondouras thing is part of the groundwork for Chavez and such people, including Obama. An outright attempt to take over of the US government will occur. Seriously, mark my word. It will be incedious,and it is happening now under our noses…Houdouras was a kick in the pants for Obama.
obama will be relected, come hell or high water..Soros and the powers that be will see to that. Come on folks, the press will have to turn on this man before he will be out of office. plus the republicans offer such poor condidates.
I did not like Obama, there was something swarmy about the guy. McCain was a weiner, he may have been a war hero, but he’s not presidential material, just as Obama isn’t. We have had poor choices. As americans we vote by…
“oh he’s so cute”, “he belongs to my party”, “who cares about his background, we need a change”..on and on…
We have worked for many years and seen our savings evaporate. We have a small business and under the current adm., we are struggling, making it day to day because others cannot pay their bills due to banks etc…When all this collapses Obama will step in with his people and save us from ourselves and there will be martial law…it’s coming..UNLESS, UNLESS we get people out to vote in 2010, and I’m not talking about the terminal welfare suckers voting in block. when the uninformed and uneducated vote, we get people like Obama, who is looking to be the next Chavez with backing of people like Soros and the Middle East.
He’s upset with Hondouras because it is a building block gone wrong.
The use the term “coup” which Rubin clearly stated was inaccurate should not then have been sidelined to the arena of technicalities. Buzz words and code words are key elements of Communist propaganda and their repeated use must be challenged frontally and repeatedly and not treated as an aside. This article provided a clear, detailed, accurate, articulate refutation of the President’s position on Honduras. Nevertheless the battle against buzz words belongs in the front line of the arsenal of verbal weaponry if opinion makers and voters are to be turned against this country’s feckless leadership moving us down the road to losing the battle for our strategic backyard and for genuine democracy in the lands of our neighbors.
Agent Zero simply does not want options available to the status quo. Thanks
to the damage already incurred via the stimulus package to relations between
the United States and countries that see US based companies play a role in their economy (and vice versa), we see blocs of the world being sealed off (so they hope) from trade.
After all, would Hugo Chavez want trade with anyone that he cannot dominate?
I don’t think so. So, with Honduras in the pocket of Chavez (or so he hopes), he can deny entrance to outsiders.
But, there are people in Honduras, and outside, that will not let Obama and Chavez get away with it.
The truth is, that Obama has not been right about anything since he took office. His foreign policy is a disaster, his ecomonic policy is a disaster, his environmental policy is going to destroy the country and his health care policy is going to kill off the people that don’t die from all his other plans. This guy has got to go.
VIVO: who does Honduras play next? Is Brazil in the tournament?
Would you expect The O to do anything less than come to the aid of a fellow leftist gangster? In addition he had cover from the NY Times, still a beacon to the morally depraved and a paper that never saw an America hating murderer they didn’t like.
Going back to the campaign and up to today truly it may be said, by his company ye shall know the dirt bag.
TO THE OBAMA NAY-SAYERS: Stop talking about how Obama is “wrong on the issues.” Obama knows what’s right and what’s wrong. He absolutely knows that the Zelaya ouster was legal and justified. That is not the point. The point(s) are the IDEAS. Obama is a committed leftist who walks a tight line not to appear as such, lest he be ousted in 3.5 years. He sympathizes with Chavez and Zelaya because they too are socialists. He may not agree with their methods, but to Obama they are men of color who are trying to reverse years of exploitation and return wealth and power to the people. That’s Obama’s whole gig, from his days as a community organizer is the communist Saul Alinsky’s Chicago organization, to his opposition to ANY private ownership of firearms (lest an armed citizenry be able to resist the taking of their property), to the appointment of a racialist, Puerto Rican Nationlist to the highest court, to his support for a far left socialist who attempted to subvert the law and will of his people, because only he had the moral authority and ideas to transform society. Wake up people, smell the sickle and hammer, and get ready to vote in the mid-term elections.
Nobody else to throw under the bus on that one. The color of the chameleon finally shines through.
What I can’t understand is that Obama continually blames Bush for the mess that America is in, yet in the last two years of Bush’s term the Democrats controlled congress and the senate. Policy and initiatives were set by the Democrats yet I never hear Republicans respond to that fact.
@9 John Samford
You want proof that Obama isn’t stupid? The fact he was elected to the most powerful political position in the world despite a complete lack of qualifications required a level of intelligence which is much above average. He was smart enough to fool the majority, including the vast majority of the elite.
He was even smart enough to fool you into thinking he’s stupid.
He’s not ignorant about the facts in Honduras. He would have been fully briefed. He chose to support the would-be dictator rather than democracy. He knew what he was doing just as he knew what he was doing when he refered to the pro democracy protests in Iran as a robust debate, and just as he was practically vertical when he genuflected before the Saudi King (he didn’t suddenly lose his balance).
He’s upside down on most issues, but he’s not stupid.
And it’s naive to think he really thinks he’s going to talk the mullahs into anything. It’s just posturing (for the naive and stupid -media and otherwise.)
I notice you refer to him as the Usurper. Think of the implications of that.
Why dont we see numbnuts like Sheesh and Vivo defending the indefensible on threads like this
I live in beautiful Honduras, therefore i don’t read much from the obama bird cage liner papers, or the fish wrap unamerican NYT. Nor am i tortured by the leg tingling-obama worshipping tv air heads. I get the Honduras news from seeing what has, and is happening all around me, and of course, i read the conservative (truthful) blogs.
Why is the tin horn dictator Chavez so interested in who is president of Honduras? One reason is for the almost free flow of his illegal drugs through the country, with the help of Zelaya. The other is with his puppet dictator here, he can move his vast military to Honduras to challange the U. S. Last year Chavez, Ortega, and Zelaya made their move to take over the U.S. military base located at Palmerola, Honduras. President Bush said, “no we have a lease on that property, and we will not turn it over to anyone else.”
One of the main functions of the 600-800 U.S. troops there has been to work with the Honduran officals to stop the flow of drugs headed north from Venezuela to the U.S. One of the punishments from obama, and the State Dept., for upholding their constitution, was to stop that aid. In other words, Chavez does not have to worry-obama has given him the green light to procede without caution-bringing his drugs through Honduras. He punished Honduras by rewarding Chavez.
By his actions, obama showed that he wants to give the nation of Honduras and its military base to Chavez. Now only the conconstitution, president, National Congress, Supreme Court, police, military, and 90% of the people in Honduras stand in his way.
Some wonderful events have occured in Honduras. For the first time in history, the Roman Catholic Church, the evangelical churches, and the Jewish community have united in prayer to uphold the constitution and the new legal government of this country, and for peace. Large prayer meetings are taking place all over Honduras. They will prevail-God is on the side of truth.
God bless America!!
God bless Honduras!!
Bobby Gibson
bobbyhonduras@yahoo.com
Obama was raised by Marxists in a Muslim household. What else can we expect but for him to favor Marxist dictators over democrats?
A key question is: when will those many Democrats who are not Marxists wake up and put a stop to this madness?
#19 Terry Gain: I don’t think winning the election and fooling 51% of the population is proof that he’s “smart.” It only proves that he’s conniving and that he’s a skilled con-man.
If he were a smart man, he’d recognise the folly of communism and stop mangling the Constitution. A smart man, in his position, might start worrying about receiving the same treatment as Zelaya. A smart man might even lay low for awhile and cool it on the vapid rhetoric that his slobbering fans are becoming immune to – he would pay close attention to the approval rating that keeps dropping further in the minus-sphere.
A truly smart man wouldn’t even think of a second stimulous, nevermind actually voice that thought aloud.
No, Obama is not smart. Neither is he naive. He’s just a smarmy street punk who cleans up well.
I want Honduras free.
Reminds me of the dems after the wall fell down and Russia was struggling for a few years. Democrat quote: “I guess freedom isn’t for everybody.”
No wonder the “north” in the civil was was Republican Abraham Lincoln led.
“The president is wrong on the law, wrong on the politics, and wrong on the foreign policy.”
Absolutely inarguable statement.
And making the point plainly this way concerns who? Certainly not the left. Certainly not Col. obama’s minions.
Apparently not our Secretary of State (who comes and goes like the Cheshire Cat).
Not only is he wrong. He doesn’t care who knows it.
Why? Because nobody’s stopping him.
He does what he wants. And nobody is stopping him.
Many are talking about it. But nobody is stopping him.
When.will.someone.stop.Soetero?
Obama knows exactly what he is doing….. but why is the question. years of central and south america neglect by the previous administration have brought us to this. obama will finish the job, and the whole area will soon be taken over by those that hate us.
honduras can not stand alone, with enimies to the south, north and throughout the region. it will simply fall without our help.
one thing did occur to me though. maybe obama is playing chavez. maybe obama is sick of chavez and behind the scenes is sticking it in his eye this time. really, a plan so overt, so childish could only have been dreamed up by chavez. lets see. i will get my ballots printed in venexuela, then have a sample vote even though the law forbids it.
we need to get off this oil kick as soon as possible. energy near independence is a basic requirement for the future if we want a chance.
Meryl he will be stopped in 2011 when the current congress is booted out, hopefully all democrats and RINOs. The tea parties were the beginning and not the end and with that said it is hoped that more will not only vote but also run for office in local state and national levels to offer a positive and realistic change to the political landscape for years to come.
Before he was President, Obama was a long-time friend to terrorists. See: Against All Enemies (foreign & domestic) http://emmeffemm.com/id136.html .
No surprise, then, that upon assuming the presidency he has heartily embraced tyrants.
1: Robotech M. Yes this is his (O’s)plan for US, how can he argue against it?
21 Bobby I hope you do prevail
tommyd thanks for the link.
Obama is an African snake oil salesman…the quicker this is made obvious (to the fawning masses) the better…it doesn’t help when CNN etc basically downplay the seriousness of the ouster, and support the White House language on the situation…it’s sad that our media dropped to Pravda status…which in actuality may now be more credible then the US press–at least for perspective.
boobama speaks in favor of Zelaya because he too does not want to be held to the laws of our constitution.
boobama did not speak out against the violence against the protesters in iran because he knows the people will be protesting against him when he violates the laws of our constitution. I wonder if he plans violence against them too ?
14. James:
“who does Honduras play next? Is Brazil in the tournament?”
Honduras plays Canada in the quarterfinals 7/18.
CONCACAF (the Confederation of North, Central American and Caribbean Association Football), so Brazil is not playing.
http://www.goldcup.org/page/GoldCup/Home/0,,12802,00.html
20. Realist:
“Why dont we see numbnuts like Sheesh and Vivo defending the indefensible on threads like this”
Because things are taking care by themselves, just like it’s supposed to be. And watching the games takes time . . .
21. bobby:
“I live in beautiful Honduras, … and of course, i read the conservative (truthful) blogs.”
You know blogs can be written by ANYONE without verification of truth. For example, pajamasmedia.
Obama’s a constitutional scholar. If he says it’s a coodeta, it’s a coodeta. Who are you to question an expert from Harvard, you bunch of inbread white trailer-trash hix from flyover, anyway?
You Republicans is so stoopud!
Republicans seldom talk back….that is one of our main problems.
talk with your vote.
that the press even let him go on about honduras, without calling him on the facts that have been presented in numerous places, is a sign of how bad the press has become.
this isn’t exactly inconsistent with previous epsiodes:
when russia invaded georgia, the press all but made it into a moment of liberation for the oppressed russian minority lving in georgia.
Stimulus is failing; cap and trade/carbon tax will fail, Healthcare will fail.
Why Obama is disturbing to me with his handling of the Honduran oust and this link showing how there is a move to repeal the 22nd Amendment.
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas
I submit he holds the view of Ayers and Wright. He is radical. His recent statement that the U.S. did not win the Cold War is insane.
Honestly, he truly doesn’t care how the economy is doing. Proposing one massive spending proposal after another – talks of a second stimulus as he’s backended the first stimulus for 2011 – 2012. The media adulation is not fading fast enough as he might give up our defensive missle system in Europe. Scary stuff.
first off nearly everyone that writes on here has the intellectual capability of a five year old but the only problem in this assessment is that a five year old has more common sense. I’m sorry people but you got to wake the hell up and get your mind out of your socially primitive thinking. I know you hate liberals but hey maybe you guys should look at trying to improve yourself instead of focusing on hatred. Grow up and stop making childish rants. It makes you guys look stupid which is why no one will take you serriously anymore.
Honestly you guys are a joke.
The above link may not work. If so, try http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c109:H.J.RES.24.IH:
Again, try the link from this site http://www.gamehourz.com/22nd-ftopict25716.html
Sorry for the multiple posts.
yes man Honestly, he truly doesn’t care how the economy is doing.
Hmmmm……You fault Obama for being pro democracy and anti-coup….reminds me of the 80′s and I’m not that old…..Let people vote. If they make a bad choice, they will be the first ones to feel the consequences. If you want to foment “revolution” in any country, the first step is to tell them that their vote/democracy doesn’t live up to Western standards…That is all he is doing. Respecting the peoples vote. If Zelaya isn’t the peoples choice, they will vote him out of office. Obama isn’t defending Zelaya, just Democracy. Enough with the conspiracy theories people. If your emotional state is anything like your posts, then I feel bad for you. Education, Education, Education…. I’m not being condescending, but the more you know, the less hateful you become
#42 bham
nice try but sorry you obviously do not agree with the Honduran Constitution or the purpose of the rule of law..
You say let people vote, wonderful. what if people vote to put to death all people with blue eyes.? Does that make it right simply because the majority votes for it?
A constitution is there to provide protection for everyone including the weakest members of a society. It establishes a rule of law not a rule of man. A constitution can be changed but there are strict rules on how to change it.
The Honduran constitution is very clear concerning term limits of the President. The President is limited to one(1) four year term.
As a matter of fact the Term of the President, referred to below as the “Presidential Period”, cannot under any circumstances be altered.
ARTICLE 374.- It is not possible to reform, in any case, the preceeding article, the present article, the constitutional articles referring to the form of government, to the national territory, to the presidential period, the prohibition to serve again as President of the Republic, the citizen who has performed under any title in consequence of which she/he cannot be President of the Republic in the subsequent period.
Why is that the Hondurans had the foresight to include such a provision in the constitution? To prevent from happening exactly what Zelaya was attempting and what Chavez has accomplished in Venezuela.
The constitution also states that
Anyone who violates this provision or the proposed reform, and support those who directly or indirectly, immediately cease the discharge of their duties, and shall be disqualified for ten years to exercise any public function.
Article 272:
The Armed Forces of Honduras are … established to defend the territorial integrity and sovereignty of the Republic, keep the peace, public order and the rule of the Constitution, the principles of free suffrage and alternation in the presidency of the Republic.
Constitutionally, it is the military that is charged, in concert with civilian organs of government, to ensure that the one-term limit of the presidency is enforced. It is the military that is constitutionally charged with ensuring the integrity of national elections.
The only coup was the one prevented by the Honduran Supreme Court & Legislative branch by removing a Chavez wanna be from office.
Government by mob rule has never and will never produce a free society.
And please , save your obamaisms for your fellow believers. Did you mean to say ReEducation, ReEducation, ReEducation…
further insightful reading:
http://zerosheep.com/2009/07/01/no-coup-in-honduras
http://senseofevents.blogspot.com/2009/07/honduras-constitution-and-its-army.html
Bham:
“Hmmmm……You fault Obama for being pro democracy and anti-coup”
How’s your reading comprehension?
Ogabe is taking the anti-democracy, pro-coup side. Zelaya tried to negate the laws and constitution, and was lawfully and constitutionally impeached for it.
“Respecting the peoples vote”
Apparently you are conflating ‘democracy;’ with mob rule. Sorry, but a functioning democratic republic must be a nation of laws. Zelaya violated them.
Would you argue your position if, say, Obama conducted a national ‘plebiscite’ in order to get around the 22nd Amendment?
It’s also worth observing that the ‘will of the people,’ in Honduras, is about 70% anti-Zelaya. But of course the results of his cooked referendum wouldn’t have reflected that, any more than in Iran, Venezuela or Chicago.
#43 Tommyd:
Nicely said. Obama doesn’t seem to realize that other countries also have constitutions. Ultimately, Obama’s reaction shows that he never really gave the issue any serious thought. If you take only a superficial glance at the issue, it is easy to see this as one more military coup or an internal power struggle where one side is no better than the other. On the other hand, if someone takes 10 minutes to familiarize himself with the relevent portions of the Honduran constitution, it is clear that the anti-Zelaya forces are merely upholding their own constitution.
Re; Bham #42
Needless to say and inevitably, good old Bham had to get the hate thing in, as in “hateful”. Not that he is condescending you understand. It’s just that in today’s culture, and usually from the left, if someone disagrees with you hate must be the reason.
And of course, it follows, he shows he doesn’t know what he is talking about. That makes seeing hate a lot easier.
Bham, stop reading those NY Times editorials.
It’s always a amusing — though a little scary — to see the inevitable mouth-breather commenting “let the people vote!”
One of President Reagon’s greatest unsung accomplishments was to keep Central and South America from going Communist. Chavez,Castro,Obama and the other Marxists would like to correct that,and Obama wants to be the Chavez-Mao-Stalin of the United States.
38: Jeff
Wow. That was stunning. I defer to your omniscience. However, I rarely hear hate rants unless on a liberal site. I have no axe to grind, but if you post on this site you should make a claim of fact and back it up.
Vivo
When you die, i fear that about half of the knowledge of the human race will be gone forever. You are absolutely correct. Anyone can write a blog without, “verification of truth”.
Perhaps by chance, you did not read the El Heraldo p. 16 this morning, if you had, you would know that Krupskaia Alis Rumazo, who is a correspondent for CNN, in Spanish, also works for Daniel Ortega, who with Chavez and Obama support Zelaya. That means that much of the news in the NYT, CNN, and from the TV air heads in the U. S. has been, verified by Ortega and Chavez to be sure it is “truth”.
On the same page your could have read about how Castro and Chavez are determined to rid Hondurs of the U. S. military air base at Sato Cano in Palmerola, Honduras. Will Obama give it to them?
If you had read pp. 58 & 59, you would know that, in the past six months 14 airplanes from Venezuela loaded with 4,000 kilos of cocaine have either crashed or have been captured in Honduras. Even Zelaya could not protect all of them.
I really believe that you lberals need to be more concerned about this-did Obama, the State Dept., DEA, or anyone in his administration know that Zelaya was involved in the illegal drug smuggling racket?
Please allow the sovereign nation of Honduras the freedom to enforce their constitution and the rule of law. But always remember, i stand in need of your brilliant mind to help me be wise like you.
Honduras will prevail, because God is on the side of truth. Little David will slay big Goliath every time, when he goes in the name of the Lord.
God bless America even vivo!!
God bless Honduras!!
Bobby Gibson
bobbyhonduras@yahoo.com
It’s open season on Democracy. Just make sure the law abiding citizens don’t have any guns.
50. bobby:
“That means that much of the news in the NYT, CNN, and from the TV air heads in the U. S. has been, verified by Ortega and Chavez to be sure it is “truth”.”
I only read a local non-liberal newspaper. The news is accurate. I also wait for Newsweek to cover the news. They rarely fail to tell the truth.
And your ‘god’ will not help you: it doesn’t exist.
I don’t blame you for hating Chavez, Ortega , Obama et al. They are your enemies. But don’t tell me who’s telling the truth. Time tells the truth. I’m patient.
Time tells the truth. I’m patient.
So is my dad. He was a 22-year-old flight engineer during the Berlin Airlift, and now he has a framed piece of the Berlin Wall as a souvenir.
Newsweek…They rarely fail to tell the truth.
Now I know you’re full of, how do you say, mierda?
Vivo
I must disagree with you about the existance of God-i just talked with Him. He provides all my needs plus the needs of 44 beautiful orphans in Honduras.
You must think that you are able to see inside my heart to discover that i hate “Chavez, Ortega, Obama et al”. You are wrong again. I do not hate these misguided men-i do “hate” the Devil. He is my enemy, and what i believe he is trying to do through these and others. But thanks for reminding me-i do need to pray more for them and you. That you and they will understand that there is a loving God who sent His Son Jesus to die on a Roman cross so He can forgive our sins, and give us a new life, with a purpose to help others.
Bobby Gibson
bobbyhonduras@yahoo.com
God bless the United States and vivo!!
Viva Honduras!!
Vivo: Please name that “local non-liberal newspaper”. It wouldn’t be the New York Times would it? How do you judge a non-liberal paper anyway? Please explain. I’m curious as to how you make these judgements. I am not being critical of you, I just think it will be helpful to all of us to understand the process.
#43 – Well said! What if Civil Rights had been put to a plebiscite in the 1960s?
Hmm, suddenly the Left is all about “let the people vote.” Yet when the people voted in favor of Proposition 8 banning Gay Marriage in California, the Left went to war in the courts to try to reverse the “people’s vote.”
The Left loves to protest against right-wing leaders who govern above the law, like Pinochet, yet can hardly find words against law-flaunting left-wing leaders, like Castro, Chavez, or Zelaya.
The Left loves to question authority, unless they’re the authority being questioned.
54. bobby:
“But thanks for reminding me-i do need to pray more for them and you.”
Go ahead, do your thing.
55. Tri Geek:
“How do you judge a non-liberal paper anyway? Please explain. ”
It’s relatively simple, some news have a heavily conservative slant, but the paper tries to cover all kinds of news in a fairly neutral way. Some letters to the editor come from rabid extremists, but are published anyway. Consistency in the news is the basis, as time goes by, different reporters will eventually paint the true picture, you can’t distort things forever if you’re trying to your keep readership, whom are intelligent people and can detect trends, truths and fallacies.
Vivo, thanks and God bless. You are precious in His sight. I think that we are getting off the topic of the Coupe that Chavez and his puppet Zelaya tried to stage in Honduras.
I am going to be very busy, during the next few days, building a home for our older orphan boys. I may not be able to spend much time online. In the future, please email me at bobbyhonduras@yahoo,com. Please look at our web address hhmmission.org. Also, i invite you to visit us in Talanga, Honduras.
Please forgive me, for coming across as, being rude to you. That is not who i am. I am truly sorry.
God bless you and your family!!
God bless America!!
Viva Honduras!!
58. bobby:
I never thought you were a bad person or rude. Now I understand that you are doing something very worthwhile. We may have different political opinions, but, to tell the truth, this Honduran situation can be very confusing because the news NEVER explain everything right. I just hope that everything resolves in the name of Justice and Truth. My regards.
http://csis.org/publication/military-coup-honduras-under-what-circumstances-did-president-manuel-zelaya-leave-hondur
Q2: What international legal norms have been breached by this military coup?
A2: The coup is in violation of the Inter-American Democratic Charter, which was signed in Lima, Peru, in 2001. This charter, affirming defense of democracy in the hemisphere, has been ratified by all member states of the Organization of American States (OAS). Article 9 of the charter specifically addresses coups and the actions to be taken—including suspension from OAS membership—as a result of an illegal takeover of government. Not one government in the Americas has recognized the newly installed government, all citing it as an illegal entity in violation of international law.
A coup is a coup, no matter how a pretentious american calls it. On what grounds you tell me, a hondurian citizen, what government is best for me? What harm can a leftist hondurian government can make you?… I mean besides that pathetic headache you may feel when some far away nation in the world is not being ruled as your personnal ffelings wolud like.
El Negro said:
‘A coup is a coup, no matter how a pretentious american calls it.’
Pretension is as pretention does.
D Prager said it very well:
“When did a military coup ever take place that was ordered by that country’s supreme court, that was supported by the political party of the president who was overthrown, in which not one person was injured, let alone killed, and which replaced the ousted the president with the president of the country’s congress, a member of the same party as the ousted president?”