Mega-Scandal: Was ‘Gunwalker’ a PR Op for Gun Control?
As there is a pattern of behavior to suggest that Gunwalker was not a botched law enforcement operation, but was instead an effort by U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder’s Justice Department to carry out a subversive anti-gun policy of the Obama administration, it is pertinent to examine Obama’s past associations with anti-gun groups.
From 1994-2002, Obama was a director of the Joyce Foundation. Joyce is a progressive organization dedicated to “social justice,” and one of their primary areas of advocacy has always been the funding of gun control organizations. Joyce has long attempted to erode Second Amendment rights, and during Obama’s tenure as a director went so far as to try to subvert Second Amendment scholarship. Joyce gave millions to effectively buy law reviews with grants, and then used those reviews to publish only papers that attacked the individual rights interpretation. The goal was to so pervert legal scholarship that the scholarship would affect Supreme Court decisions.
Joyce director Obama, and those surrounding him, internalized fellow Chicagoan Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals. While the Joyce plot narrowly failed, it affirmed Alinsky’s strategy of agitating, fanning hostility, and disorganizing the public in order to force radical change.
We know that Obama’s friends in Joyce Foundation-supported gun control groups suspiciously have not attacked the administration’s gun-running, but instead have attacked the Oversight Committee’s investigation.
We know that of the 7,900 weapons (just under 8 percent of the guns captured from cartels) that came from gun shops in the United States, about 2,000 of them were the result of Gunwalker.
We know that Gunwalker was never designed to interdict the weapons the ATF and DOJ pushed objecting gun sellers to provide. We know that management reacted to the spiraling violence that Gunwalker caused not with concern, but with enthusiasm.
The Department of Justice claims that their inspector general will investigate Gunwalker, but it appears obvious to the very agents that brought this scandal into the open that they have a clear conflict of interest. There are already calls for a special prosecutor to investigate Gunwalker.
Considering the arming of narco-terrorist gangs, the destabilizing geopolitical effect on Mexico, the foreign policy ramifications, and the possibility of extrajudicial and criminal activity at the highest levels of the executive branch, a special prosecutor should be just one avenue of investigation. This could possibly lead to prison for senior administration officials and an indictment against President Barack Obama himself.
ALSO READ: Obama Admin’s Comments on ‘Gunrunner’ Scandal Strain Credulity
“This could possibly lead to prison for senior administration officials and an indictment against President Barack Obama himself”
It couldn’t happen to a “nicer” bunch of guys.
Where have YOU been. Let’s see….DOJ – Holder – Obama flunkie, SOTUS – Two and counting – Obama flunkies. Clintion – Obama flunkie. Countless CZARS – Obama flunkies. You know the list goes on and on to the Thugery in Washington that make our Senators and Representatives COWTOW. Do you NOT see what the media in this country has changed to?? It burys deroggatory stories on this Administration quicker then my dog with a bone!! Even if we had enough evidence to bring ALL of this Administration to court, who stonewalls and smears its opposition, WHO is going to try the case?? Dream on!! Our best hope is getting someone with real _ALLS to put this country back on the right track!! Keep your eyes open and stand an support that candidate with all your best efforts!
Yes, I understand the criminals are running the show now, and are unlikely to cooperate, in helping to put themselves in jail. I don’t know how much power Issa has to force the revelation of information, it seems that Holder is more than happy to ignore a Congressional subpoena, and apparently, legally he can get away with that behavior. I wonder why a federal judge, cannot issue a subpoena, and order the US Marshals, who are officers of the court, to arrest anyone, at any level of the federal government, who ignores that court order. It seems that there are no legal controls on government, and that means we have a lawless government, much to the delight of the current thugs in power.
I would guess that only the appointment of a special prosecutor, would allow us to get to the bottom of this case, and allow for the punishment of all involved, no where they are in this administration. I hope that I am wrong, and that Issa will prevail, but I am not confident of the outcome at present.
Here, here!
Something to watch for are stories calling this mess “Project Gunrunner” which started in 2005 under Dubya and which actually appears to be well run and successful.
It must be remembered that this scandal only involves “Fast and Furious” — ostensibly part of “Project Gunrunner — and that Fast and Furious, which started in October 2009, is entirely Obama’s baby.
Why, of course, left/liberals in government have to prove why we need to ban guns for our own good… a border patrol agent’s life is small price to pay, utopia on Earth justifies the subversion of justice and rule of law.
During “Gunwalker”, the program was likely the single largest supplier of guns crossing the border.
The goal HAD to be to support the “90%” lie; there’s no other reason for that volume.
There is also the fact that the narcos could easily have procured equivalent weapons much more cheaply from non-USA sources. As others have said, the only rational explanation is that part of the funding for the weapons purchases also came from Eric Holder, Janet Napolitano, and Obama.
Is there anyone who believes a single thing, including the supposed “gun tracing”, put out by BATFE? These people are liars and must be treated as such.
Not even under Gunwalker were most guns used by the cartels coming from the U.S. They get their armament from international dealers in larger shipments. One such shipment would eclipse the number of arms sent to Mexico in Gunwalker.
There’s no doubt this was an effort to “prove” that the U.S. supplies arms so that Obama could scrap the 2nd Amendment.
Absolutely. Why would a multi-billion dollar operation that throws away cargo aircraft on one-way drug shipments purchase weapons from U.S. gun shops? They get them from the Russians.
See also Front Page Magazine’s Symposium: Sex, Drugs and Psychological Warfare
http://frontpagemag.com/2011/06/17/symposium-sex-drugs-and-psychological-warfare/
One of the reasons that the drug cartels are doing so well is that they’re supported by the Russian and Chinese governments in their operations against us.
There is no reason to sell AR-15′s and AK-47 varients to drug cartels.. They are semiauto. Most anti gunners don’t know the difference between a M-16 and a AR- 15. BTW those two guns are the most popular semi auto rifle to shoot in America. This is now walking and quacking like a duck.
Absolutely. A real deal AK-47 can be bought in a Third World arms market for less than $50. Why would an organized cartel with international connections need to bother with the hassle of onesy-twosey straw purchases in the USA for neutered semi auto versions of the real thing? At several times the price no less? This is clearly a political operation and its tentacles go deep, we’re talking to the highest levels of both the US and Mexican governments.
Are charges of treason against Obama out of the question?
Probably, but they shouldn’t be.
It’s not treason but it might be a war crime.
For a war crime to exist, there would have to be an open and declared state of war between the United States of America and the United States of Mexico. (Yes, that is the official name of the country, translated into English.) So, strictly speaking, no, it cannot be defined as a “war crime”.
However, arming insurgent groups which are attempting to overthrow the government of a theoretically friendly state (either neutral or allied) is defined as an Act Of War under the Hague Convention. This has been largely ignored in the last half-century due to the former Communist states’ predilection for arming “revolutionary liberation movements” here, there, and everywhere. (Attempts at UN Security Council sanctions were usually stopped by a Soviet veto, as with Cuba in Angola in 1975.)
But at least then, the offenders had the excuse that they disapproved of the government(s) of the nations in question. (I.e., they either were not Communist or were not Communist enough- cf. Angola again.)
In this case, there is no such excuse.
An act of war (or at least subversion) against an allied state was once considered par for the course; look up the Renaissance Italian city-states, the Hanseatic League, or the various “banana republic” governments in South America pre-World War Two, specifically the Gran Chaco War of 1932-29. (Those of a more political bent might want to study Cardinal Richelieu’, Cardinal Mazarin, and the German barons around the time of the Thirty Years’ War.) But in the modern era, it is not considered OK to stab your friends in the back, generally speaking, even if for the “highest moral principles”, at home or abroad.
Once more, it looks like Obama is reminding us who won the last election. In a particularly cynical way, even by his (Chicago-style) standards.
But don’t expect President Calderon’ to make an issue of it. He needs U.S. aid in large quantities to keep his nation’s collapsed economy- and his government- more-or-less afloat. Which means he will say whatever Obama tells him to, as we have already seen.
clear ether
eon
Treason is defined in the Constitution and this does not qualify. War crime would also be quite a stretch as there is no state of armed conflict between the US and Mexico and you cannot really say the narco gangs are after anything but money, they are not trying to conquer or overthrow the US.
Impeachment, on the other hand, would be eminently reasonable if Congress had the cojones.
That is right Marty. Impeachment is reasonable because this scandal is a “high misdeameanor”. The four grounds for impeachment are:
1) Treason
2) Bribery
3) High crimes
4) High misdeameanors
High means important, the opposite of trivial. Note that President W Clinton’s sexual misdeameanors were low, not high. Obama has done many things that could be called a high misdeameanor. Congress ignores them.
Even if the House Committee cannot find an email or phone call linking Obama to this there is still enough evidence of negligent oversight leading to a scandal. The buck stops with the POTUS. Negligence on this scale, allowing such a scandal, ought to be called a high misdeameanor. Death and corruption on this scale is not trivial. This is not a low misdeameanor.
If Obama is not impeached he gets away with killing people and arming criminals. The next President will also have a precedent.
Perjury is trivial? Boy, do I disagree with you!!
Does anyone think that the first president in history to start a war with a foreign country without even consulting Congress is going to worry about a little thing like smuggling a few thousand guns to narco-terrorists?
After all, if some country were smuggling guns into America to arm criminal gangs, what would that be to us… but an act of war?
Bambi, You are completely forgetting the fact that Congress has not declared War on ANY country since 1941. You are completely glossing over Korea, Viet Nam, and the other “Police Actions” we have been involved in (Tricky Dick never had “Congressional Approval” to bomb Cambodia and Loas).
It is extremely important for current congresscritters to make every possible preparation for federal prosecution of culpable officials and individuals, up to and including Holder, et al, if appropriate, post 2012 elections. If delays are needed before returning holdings and due bills, or whatever they be called, take the time to do it right. Examples must eventually be made. Progressives must learn that egregiously fouling the crucible of justice carries a personal cost. It ain’t political, it’s criminal.
“Executive Order”? That seems an awful lot like rule by decree.
Disarming gun owners by decree sounds a whole hell of a lot like what the country was founded against.
Tyranny, anyone?
Have you heard of, “The divine right of KINGS?” This is the divine right of Progressives!
So what does it take for a federal agency to get the death penalty? We know that billions of dollars of damages to the American people didn’t do it for the Department of Agriculture.
We now know that violating the law, and “accessory before the fact” to murder of a federal law enforcement agent doesn’t do it.
How bad does an agency have to be before the entire agency is closed down with nothing to replace it? I mean if regulation leads to billions of dollars of damage to the American people and murder of law enforcement, perhaps we should try no regulations at all for a bit.
I agree. But have fun trying to sell that idea.
I agree. But have fun trying to sell that idea.
Have you any idea how many Bureaucrats would loose their jobs? Unemployment would go to 15%! Are you trying to ruin the economy?
These people are like a homicidal version of the Underpants Gnomes. This would be sad funny if people weren’t getting killed by it.
You cannot punish an agency with fines that we pay with our taxes. I think manslaughter charges would be appropriate for the Federal employees involved.
ATF should be disbanded and its responsibilities, but not its employees, disbursed amongf other agencies. People this immoral or stupid have proven they cannot handle authority.
yes …like obama said “under the radar” when he said he was dismantling the second amendment.
+1
This!
“I just want you to know that we are working on it,” Brady recalled the president telling them. “We have to go through a few processes, but under the radar.”
This would be just like this administration to manufacture a condition to help push their agenda. There is no conceivable law enforcement purpose to this operation but there is a clear and easily recognized political purpose … to push gun control.
Agreed. The sheer volume of guns involved is the most damning fact. If it were a small number you might actually ascribe the idea of seeding a few guns to trace distribution to sheer bureaucratic stupidity, and believe it. The scale of this really rules that out though.
The best response…go out and purchase some EBR’s (Evil Black Rifles). The more firearms in civilian hands, the harder it will be politically to confiscate or over-regulate them. Make gun control a practical impossibility.
Right you are!! A FISH STINKS FROM THE HEAD DOWN!
President Obama can try to get rid of the 2nd amendment in the Constitution by executive order; there will be Hell to pay. Obama is experiencing several backlashes already with ObamaCare, inflation, & high unemployment. The backlash to take away people’s guns will not go away. Gunrunner is another backlash backfiring on Obama as he tries to pretend he has nothing to with it. He really does think we Americans are stupid when he is the one with so much egg on his face he could be mistaken for a human omelet.
His administration is living proof that over half of Americans are dimwits! His argument has some basis in fact.
Marxists do not play politics, marxists wage wars.
This administration wanted to severely limit the Second Amendment rights, and it did engage in arming the narcotraficantes with legally sold American weapons to prove that the sale of weapons in America creates dangers.
That’s how marxist-leninists see the world: if the reality is against them, they create a new reality. Well, they try.
Every single victim of a crime in which a “Gunwalker” weapon has been involved should sue the current administration. Even the Mexican victims.
Well said.
Those who do not, or will not understand this, are “useful idiots”, guilty of aiding and abetting the enemy in time of war.
I don’t think this is so much about gun control in the US. Why send the guns to Mexico if its for that purpose? This is about the destabilization of Mexico – a re-creation of Colombia of the 1990′s. The Reds have been doing this kind of thing for a century. Now they are operating out of the White House.
Let me explain.
In the current political and legal environment (post Heller and post McDonald Supreme Court cases) more gun control laws are really impossible, unless they are extremely small in scope. The only way gun control can advance in a big way is to implement it via international treaty.
There is currently a small arms treaty in the UN. The US is not a party to it. But there is also a treaty being created by the Organization of American States that would restrict guns in a major way.
Both the US and Mexico are members of the OAS.
This evil policy is clearly designed to affect the passage of this treaty.
It’s also a public relations ploy. See how much publicity was generated about the guns going to Mexico, and against the evil gun dealers, even though BATFE ordered the dealers to go through with the sales?
To answer the headline question: Yes, obviously. And that is the ONLY reason for the entire operation. And it was directed by Holder on behalf of and with the knowledge of Obama.
As to what will happen? Holder MAY resign, though I very much doubt it. Absolutely nothing will happen to Obama. It has been decreed that he will not be held accountable for anything whatsoever. Well, until Nov 2012 anyway. When he gets thrown the hell out of the office that is so far beyond his abilities that it would be laughable if it weren’t so serious.
The phrase that comes to mind is ‘too clever by half.’
All those found to be complicit in the “Operation Fast and Furious” carried out by the ATF need to be prosecuted under the RICO laws and sent to jail if found guilty. The low level agents who were commanded to follow orders should be given leniency where possible. If it’s later found that Eric Holder and Obama were involved with this fiasco, they should be impeached and sentenced to jail also.
This operation is a stain on the reputation of the U.S. and those at fault not allowed to go free. Reps. Issa and Grassley should be commended for their actions in this unfortunate operation.
While Reps. Issa and Grassley should be commended lets not forget that this was uncovered by two gun bloggers – Mike Vanderbough and David Codrea. Without their efforts this might have suceeded.
This could possibly lead to prison for senior administration officials and an indictment against President Barack Obama himself.
From your mouth to God’s ear.
This is what I thought when I heard about Operation Fast and Furious. It was only a few months ago the media was working with the government to make legal gun dealers the bad guys. I think they realized things were falling apart because they don’t use the line of BS anymore. Not sure how much press this is getting in the MSM but I think half the population is so conditioned to think a certain way that if Jon Stewart tells them nothings wrong they’ll go back to sleep.
There is a scene in ’1984′ where the main character is on a bus and sees a groups of children reciting in unison propaganda. The rest of the adults are looking at them and realize the next generation will know nothing but lies and will accept them completely as it is the new reality. That’s how I feel most of the time, the ‘progressives’ have so taken over entertainment and education that everyone is taught the same lessons, which are lies.
The only thing that will really conflict this is that the Jihadists are teaching their children different lessons. As they grow in Europe and become bolder there and in North America, how long can people pretend the world is still a kindergarten class when they’re being attacked openly in the streets? It seems gays still embrace jihadists for some reason – perhaps they hope by showing they’re submissive they’ll be attacked less?
I don’t know. Fight the progressive power, but I think civilization is over a bubble. Learn to grow your own food and good luck, people, the future is going to be a little Mad Max for a while.
Article sub-head: The only conclusion? Law enforcement wasn’t the point, orchestrated violence was, and that’s a history-making scandal.
Great article Mr. Ownes. But if only the “history-making scandal” claim were to become true. Unfortunately, this story will die on the vine just like all the other real scandals and rule of law violations this administration has foisted upon our great nation. I offer the USDA’s Pigford fraud as another glaring example.
Sorry peeps, Barack Obama’s America is a literal banana republic – without the bananas – where laws are selectively enforced to further the Marxist agenda. But y’all already know that here.
Yes – the ATF and Dept of Justice ran an OPERATION against US – the law-abiding gun owners of America.
Bastards.
Time for a house cleaning in both departments….complete and sweeping.
Several observations: What do you expect from a president whose friends are Bill Ayres and Bernardine Dohrn, two know American terrorists, whose earlier employer was ACORN, and whose church had the “Reverend” Wright as pastor? The LSM buried this as it went whole hog in attempting to destroy Sarah Palin. Now, unfortunately unless the Republicans start very public impeachment procedures against Holder for DOJ’s role in this, or vote to defund ATF, the LSM will continue to bury this scandal.
Over 200 Mexican Police Officers have been murdered as well as thousands of Mexican Citizens, now its found that the 2nd Amendment hating Obama Regime has been complicit with this crime. Now he is threatening to do away with the 2nd Amendment by ‘executive’ decree like a King or Dictator, good luck with that. Mark well those that go along with this Marxist and illiberal action, they are the enemies of the Constitution itself and the remedies are in that honored document.
The gun shops which sold these guns protested all the while. They were forced to do it by the ATF. They did it while the ATF was watching. The ATF, therefore, are the ones which violated the law. THEY sold the guns. These guns led to the murder of many. This is gross criminal negligence, as the results were completely foreseeable. This is first-degree murder.
Begin Impeachment of Holder. It’ll all fall apart for them from there. Even the Dem Senate will have to convict, because the optics are just so bad.
I love the part where the Dem attack dog is forced to silence by the testimony. “Sometimes, there is no defending the indefensible.” – Daley
‘Gunwalker’ is indefensible. Violate the gun laws so you can claim that the gun laws are insufficient?!? How do you possibly defend THAT?
This whole administration is rapidly becoming indefensible, even by the most partisan Democrats. Even Debbie Downer is falling on her face trying to defend it.
Campaign slogan: “Obama – Indefensible!”
Contact your congress critters demanding a serious, relentless investigation. Contact them repeatedly, convince others to do the same. This malfeasance must be brought to light in such a matter that the MSM can not afford to ignore it. In addition to seeing his Occidental, Columbia, and Harvard transcripts posted on line; I want to know what did BHO know and when did he know it? Rot begins in the head of the fish.
Corruption is being rooted out…people like Rep.Issa are true patriots. I hope that more of our illustrious agents man-up and decide that the truth is more honorable than hiding behind their positions and claiming ignorance or that they were ‘just following orders’.
The Issa delegation meeting soon to take place with Mexican officials will hopefully restore some trust between us and Mexico; and also yield further evidence of the corruption of our ‘transparent’ administration.
Lying in order to deceive is an honor violation, and it seems that the Marxist-in-Chief partakes of the violation on a daily basis – imagine that.
Gee, I wonder why this isn’t being widely reported.
Let’s imagine a scandal where concealed carry is made to look good – police are told to stand by during armed robberies so that civilians save the day instead. Instant front page of NYT for weeks, dems everywhere going insane over the craziness of conservatives, etc. And no one even dies in that scenario…
Campaign slogan ?
“Now the Mexican drug cartels HOPE to receive better weapons, AND the mad mullahs can CHANGE, from IEDs to nuclear bombs”
Was the Gun Walker scandal a PR operation for gun control?
Well, knowing this administration as the liars and leftists that they are, what other credible explanation can there be?
Do we believe the Obama administration’s explanation? If we do, we are as dumb as a mud fence or rather we’re as dumb as Rep.Sheila Jackson-Lee Democrat from Texas.
People should disabuse themselves of the notion that Obama is a defender and upholder of the Constitution. He is not.
OBAMA IS AN ENEMY OF THE CONSTITUTION!!!!!
This reads like the UN Marxists agenda to disarm America.
Treason.
Well, the thing is, it would be imprudent to first set up a 200,000-strong presidential militia, and only then try and take away all the guns from American subjects, errrr, citizens to effect a globally beneficial, totalitarian takeover. That might result in skirmishes akin to a civil war, which is undesirable as long as it can be avoided. It is much more considerate to disarm the public first using any pretext available, and then arm the militia (in a historically recent, German analogy, they could be called the SA, although those classically educated would be inclined to think in terms of the Praetorian Guard).
Unfortunately, there seems to be a game changer now: It may well be necessary to organize the Red Guards, errrr, militia first, in order to remove the dangerous shooting toys from the public. Yes, it would palpably heighten the risk of some strictly limited, although kinetic bloodshed, but a real hustler has no problem with doubling down. Time is of the essence, however, as long as the hoi polloi are still allowed to approach the ballot box.
Perhaps the right to vote should go first, then sort out the rest… Any suggestions of how to go about it? – Write to me in confidence at the usual address (Whitey House, etc.).
This will be hard for many Americans to swallow. The thought of an American President aiding and abetting vicious criminals, in order to gin up a political case against lawful gun owners/dealers, will seem too far fetched for many. The question is: what would they have done differently if that were not the goal?
If Obama or Holder had any plausible explanation for F&F, I’m sure we would have heard it by now. Sometimes Occams razor ties everything up in a neat little bow.
This fits in perfectly with what Sotero does. He helps create the economic mess by having his followers go to the houses of bankers to force them into giving sub-prime mortgages, then demonizes Bush saying it was all his fault. Now his administration is doing the same thing to push their agenda, and this isn’t considered treason against the US because??
No one died at Watergate; Nixon would have been impeached, had he not resigned.
No one died during Iran-Contra; Reagan’s reputation took a big hit, though there was no impeachment.
No one died during the Lewinsky fiasco; Clinton made it through the impeachment.
Dozens, perhaps hundreds, of people have died (we will never know exactly how many) – and much of America yawns and reaches for the remote.
This whole story turns my stomach, and I am ashamed to be part of the same country as these evil b@$t@rd$ who cooked up this plan, and the lazy and stupid who want no part of current events or the Constitution.
This complete situation connected to the ATF Fast and Furious / Project Gunrunner needs to investigated and the truth needs to be known. The American people deserve an honest detailed and clear descriotion to what, why and how did this happen! There are two federal agents dead and Mexican citizens wounded and dead from this illegal program that comes out of the Obama Administration.
Everyone should see the C-Span recorded Congressional hearing that was held last wednesday. It was called gun smuggler and can be viewed on the C-Span website. After viewing this, please contact your two senators and congressman on your concern and that they need to get to the truth on this. Certain politicians are trying to bury this and turn this into a gun control hearing.
This is corruption and goes to the highest levels of the Obama Administration, reminds me of the Waco and Ruby Ridge disasters – another example of ATF’s work.
Arming narco terrorists so you can push an ideology of gun control is not just insane it is evil. It is incomprehensible to me that the left hates gun advocates so much they will see people die to get their way.
Why would this be incomprehensible to you scottlps? It’s the left for Pete’s sake! They are death-worshipers. A little innocent bloodshed can’t spoil furthering the agenda.
Just remember what good ol’ Joey Stalin said, “One death is a tragedy; a million is a statistic.”
You do realize that two of the basic principles of “revolutionary” dogma are;
1. Sacrifices must be made in the name of the Cause.
2. Dead people can be made into martyrs to the Cause.
Expecting any less from the intellectual heirs of Marx, Engels, Trotsky (especially), and Che’ Guevara is giving those heirs too much credit.
cheers
eon
the mere existence of the 2nd amendment is a hurdle that all previous totalitarian elements have never had to overcome
just the idea of an armed citizenry stymies the full throttled assault against liberty
there is a fundamental reason why the 2nd amendment is “second” and not 8 or 9 or 10– the right to bear arms is the statist repellant for the citizenry
It was Lenin, after all, who observed, “The worse, the better.” Intentionally making things worse, in order to destroy an existing order and replace it with a new, Vanguard Doctrine elite which will then impose a New Order, is an accepted part of the Marxist-Leninist canon. Witness that professor who, together with her now-deceased husband, in the 60s came up with the flood-the-social-welfare-state tactic (which has been quietly succeeding for several decades now) and who has in recent months been wistfully longing for Greek-style street violence here in the U.S: Her explicit aim has all these years been to destroy the foundations of America’s politico-economic order. And our president is, so far as anyone can tell, an acolyte.
Reinforces my working hypothesis.
The 90% of weapons figure the Administration uses came from a selection of confiscated firearms which Mexico provided the SN to the U.S. for tracking.
That was 30,000 weapons, the Administration said 90% that selection was from the U.S. Fox look at the numbers and said 17%, FactCheck.org said 34%.
1) Was 30K the total number of weapons confiscated by Mexico? If it wasn’t why that 30K, what is the source of the rest.
2) What is the estimated total of Cartel weapons?
3) If you use Fox’s numbers half the U.S. weapons, HALF could be operation Fast and Furious firearms.
F&F obviously, with the agents testimony wasn’t about tracking weapons to the cartel, since they weren’t tracked.
Then what was the objective of F&F?
Gunwalker was not about tracing the guns to the cartels, and diminishing the violence. It was about creating a the impression lax gun laws in States like AZ and TX were contributing to the Drug Cartels firepower, and to be good neighbors to Mexico we would have to exercise Federal Authority and crackdown on the States with “lax” gun laws.
Nothing to do with assisting Mexico combat the Cartels, everything to do with restricting individuals access to firearms, and the Obama supported UN Firearms Treaty.
Correct, but will enough people hear about it to actually make a difference in the international “polls” to be able to clean out ALL progressive’s Democrat’s and Republican’s. They all must go!
This is treason. The administration creates the crisis it needs to ratify the UN Small arms treaty and broke the Brownsville treaty with Mexico. International border deaths…
The only way to subjugate this group of constitutionalists is to disarm them and tax them
Into understanding the need to redistribute income until they themselves need handouts
The UN Small ATMs treaty was designed to abrogate the US Constitution by design, and was awaiting a significant “crisis” along the border, defeating the second amendment, the Bill of Rights, the constitution (Law of the Land), States rights, and the peoples right of natural law
Treason alright
Drunk with power and control, the Obama government are guilty of innocent blood. In criminally supplying deadly weapons to the narco terrorists, the U.S. government became a part of the violent narco terrorists. If this is what they will do to our ally, Mexico and Mexican innocents, what dreadful plans do they have for America? This country is no longer recognizable as the great American nation it once was. Where America stood for justice, freedom and human rights. America is being transformed into something terrible.
If it was not for the fact that this horrible crime against innocents was perpetrated by the top leaders of our government, Mexico would be demanding the extradition of every guilty person to stand trial in Mexico.
Every American and every American ally should be extremely worried that the American government provided weapons to commit MURDER. This frightening crime should be the biggest story EVERY DAY in the media in America and around the world. Unless our elected representatives deal with this horrible crime against humanity, America faces a very dark and terrible future.
I see where Druge is carrying a report that Kenneth Melson (acting director of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives) is being thrown under the bus. While Melson is no doubt one of the culprits in this, the real ones (those above him) do not yet seem to be touched by the scandal.
And I expect that they wont be, unless this story is told far and wide. The truth will burn them to the ground but only if enough people know the truth.
So this was the method in the works for accomplishing gun control that Obama was hinting at earlier. Not only do these people not let a crisis go to waste, but they actually create the crisis in order to offer the solution, which in this case was more gun prohibitions. We know that the left will never rest until all firearms have been banned in this country, and we see now that they will resort to any trick they can think of to accomplish this end. Trouble is by pulling a stunt that borders on treason they have broken the law, and we cannot afford to be lenient on those responsible.
What else is new? Nuclear secrets and guidelines on how to build a functioning nuclear bomb ended up in Iran because of a similar scheme.
Anyone that thinks that this is just Holder that cooked this up is mistaken. Nothing this big would be done without obama knowing all about it. I do not know if people remember that Hilary also made remarks about all the (so called) weapons going from America to Mexico. It would not surprise me if her name did not come up in this.
This was all to appease the anti gun people and to get the second Amendment removed and then to start taking OUR weapons away from us. Not to worry though I am sure obozo would have allowed the criminals to continue to carry theirs. After all they are the minority and we do not distribute enough of OUR money to them.
Were the committee headed by Issa to level the charge that seems to have at this point acquired a consensus here, what would the committe hope to accomplish? Can the administration effectively stonewall with the public watching such a high visibility case? I think not. What happens if Obama offers a few heads to get the dogs off? That looks bad, too. I would back Obama into a corner so he throws anyone under the bus who even remotely looks like a bad guy. I tell you this. Chicago street thugs, like most others, don’t fight well alone. Obama can be isolated with this and part of his administration carved up for dog meat. This is the kind of political warfare the R’s have needed to be engaged in for a long time. The smell of blood is everywhere. Strike.
… but as we know, Holder’s Department of Justice refuses to cooperate
Perhaps, the next time Eric Holder comes to Capitol Hill the committee should have the Sargent-at-Arms take the AG into custody until he cooperates. If judges can do it, why not Congress ?
A fascinating case for sure, but I have difficulty accepting that this entire operation was a manufactured event just to create political cover for restricting gun ownership rights. It doesn’t make sense to me for two reasons:
1) People in government can’t keep a secret. An operation like this involves too many people who are not political appointees: precisely the kind that are unlikely to get bounced out of their job if they blow the whistle on something this stupid.
2) Never underestimate the government’s capacity for stupidity and gross malfeasance. C’mon, how many times have you folks read about astonishingly bone-headed policies and programs that have back-fired? The government has a very colorful and deep history of coming up with schemes that made no sense, wasted vast sums of money and actually injured parties it thought it was helping. Could this just be another one?
I prefer simpler explanations for situations like this: Incompetence is far more often the culprit than evil intent.
It’s both incompetence and evil planning.
The higher ups in the Obama administration who planned this fully intended for the guns to show up at crime scenes in Mexico. But I’d be willing to be that they didn’t intend for anyone to be hurt.
How can this be? They are the kind of people who can mentally disconnect the two concepts, so that they can both be true at the same time. The evil is not fully deliberate, but that does not make it not evil.
Build a narrative that tells a lie so as to gain more power. The liberal way.
This just came in. The head of the ATF is to resign because of GW. Obama has gotten his loyal dog to fall on his sword for him.
Pay close attention to where the sacraficial lamb ends up…. I envision a nice payout and a cushy job somewhere. If so, that will be VERY telling.
We are reaching the point where the Federal government is a domestic enemy of the constitution. I know what my oath said about domestic enemies…
This is what ‘Bama was talking about when he told Sarah Brady that his administration was working on gun control “Under the Radar”.
I find it odd that the Brady Campaign has been silent during all of this.
i believe that i have the answer to all this that everbody can understand:
holder (et al) just wanted to get defective guns into the hands of the cartel. its
just like a cowboy and indian show i saw once. they gave bad guns to the indians, and they all misfired during the fight and the good guys won. don’t laugh. the indians
were so surprised.
that story makes about as much sense as what we’re being spoon-fed.
Morons at all levels. This scheme is almost as brilliant as algore’s carbon tax fraud.
Could participants in the program be considered to be guilty of conspiracy to murder, since the apparent objective was for people to be murdered using these weapons? Is there sufficient evidence of this for cases to be brought to court? Nuremberg established that “I was only following orders”, is not a valid defence.
The obvious consequences of this program included the avoidable murders of innocent people, both in Mexico and the USA. These deaths are now actual and not merely hypothetical. These deaths seem to be intended by the instigators of the program and anticipated by all other participants. They, apparently, were in pursuit of public relations material, advertising, for a political campaign by those who advocate the abolition of people’s right to self-defence. Do the left now claim the right to commit murder in pursuit of their political agenda?
Similarly, for those who obstruct investigation, could they be charged with conspiracy to protect murderers? People may reconsider their cooperation with an investigation, if there are potentially severe consequences for protecting the guilty.
As I have previously stated, Project “Gunwalker” (Fast and Furious) will be the “Watergate” of the Obama Administration. Issa will appoint a special prosecutor and impeachable charges will follow. Liberals (yes, the same ones who vehemently despise those evil “assault weapons”) who are rushing to defend their leader and his inept administration, know the consequences of appointing a special prosecutor, will do everything within their power to stonewall the appointment; but, mark my words, the appointment (of a special prosecutor) will happen, and the result of the investigation will be the filing of criminal charges against Obama and Holder.,
Fast and Furious was nothing more than an attempt by Obama/Holder to flood weapons into Mexico, (which would eventually be used by drug cartels to eliminate their opposition) which would be traced back to U.S. gun dealers, and used as propaganda by Obama/Holder to ban these very weapons. THE ATTEMPT HAS BACKFIRED, and the administration will pay!
Our country owes a debt of gratitude to these brave agents who have come forward to expose this evil and corrupt policy of political cowardice which resulted in the death of one of their own agents and numerous Mexican officials and citizens. Every law-abiding gun owner in America should demand justice for the politically sanctioned murder of one of our own. Agent Terry is a hero in the fight against liberally biased, anti-gun propaganda.
“The Second Amendment is a doomsday provision, one designed for those exceptionally rare circumstances where all other rights have failed — where the government refuses to stand for re-election and silences those who protest; where courts have lost the courage to oppose, or can find no one to enforce their decrees. However improbable these contingencies seem today, facing them unprepared is a mistake a free people get to make only once.” – Judge ALEX KOZINSKI, 9th Circuit Court (Son of a Holocaust Survivor)
Guns are a state issue not the Federal Government! Abolish the BATFE and put that money to better use!
This was a custom created exploitable crisis in support of the anti RKBA agenda. Obama may prevent responsibilty and blame from reaching his level but there is no way all this occured without his knowledge and likely his approval.
If government officials were involved in the acquisition of firearms by criminals, and this acquisition of firearms resulted in the murder of an American citizen or citizens, then those officials would be guilty of being an accessory to the crime of murder. These officials, including all those at the highest levels who authorized this acquisition of firearms by criminals, should be tried in criminal court for thier actions.
Melson, who has been acting director since April 2009, is likely to resign within the next couple of days, says CNN.
Attorney General Eric Holder is to meet with Andrew Traver, head of the ATF field office in Chicago on Tuesday, about replacing Melson, the network says.
The Chicago way…..
Rush Limbaugh brought up this possibility yesterday on his radio show. I thought, “plausible but farfetched,” at the time. How could anyone be so heartlessly stupid to unleash such a devious and potentially dangerous strategy. But reading this article and considering the cast of characters in this administration among whom the end surely justifies the means, “heartlessly stupid” is not so far fetched.
When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns…
This discussion has reminded me that I need to get to the firing range today to practice AND buy some more ammo…
Does anyone ever consider what would happen if they were able to disarm law abiding citizens…..the mexican gangs and cartels then can all head north and take control….it’s been a known fact that Yammamoto said if the Japaneese attacked the US there would be a gun ‘behind every blade of grass’
Was ‘Gunwalker’ a PR Op for Gun Control? Yes, but it backfired.
If someone went to Spain,they could get an international warrant for Obama’s arrest.Remember Spain did that to Israel before. They will do it for anyone.
Not Obama. Remember, he’s already committed us to helping “bail out” Greece. Zapatero in Spain wants the same deal, but without the German/French demands for fiscal responsibility (i.e., raising the retirement age from 48 to a horrid, dehumanizing 55).
He’s counting on Obama to bankroll the Spanish phase of Saving The European Union From Itself by providing cash- borrowed from China. Think of it as “Stimulus- The Sequel To The Sequel”.
And of course, that way, it will be the American taxpayer, not Spain, that has to pay the Chinese back.
Zapatero & Co. aren’t about to do anything to piss off the goose that lays their golden egg. Or provides them with their golden parachute.
cheers
eon
If Obama, the head Czar of corruption and power abuse is found guilty of these charges, he will just pardon himself… I know Boehner will cry if he cannot lose at golf, again.
These are all good comments to an exceptionally good essay.
I was going to add my opinion about these acts of this administration and this President, except I realized I would violate the first two words of guideline number one. Fast and Furious is certainly not getting much airplay on Pravda and Isvestia (CNN, CBS, ABC, NBC, MSNBC), but we were once able to recognize the meretriciousnes of Isvestia and Pravda when they really had those names.
Your subject line alone is EXACTLY what has repeatedly crossed my Mind ever since this first became an MSM headliner.. The thought for me was triggered by the first cries for gun bans using the very violence you describe as part of their [mantra].. Became one of those “Well, isn’t THAT con-VEEN-ient” moments to these Fingertips.. Thank you for pulling so much of it together here..
When this first broke, my gut reaction to it was how Janet Napolitano was justifying her claim for gun control back a few months ago. She described in some detail how guns were being purchased in AZ and smuggled across the border to the Mexican drug gangs. I did’t hear her talking about how she aquired that information. Am assuming that she was well aware of the Gunslinger operation and using it to further her (Obamas) gun control agenda. I think it was about the time they were trying to paint the shooter in Tuscan as a “White Male Terrorist”
Very few people are putting this one together. Thank you for doing an outstanding job! I do doubt that this society will award any pulitzer prizes for this, but if it gets totally exposed and rises to the top echelons, it will be one for the history books!
Thank you again
Occasionally those who do not agree with our Founding Fathers slip and somehow the truth comes out. Here is a direct quote from Sarah Brady of Handgun Control:
“Our main agenda is to have ALL guns banned. We must use whatever means possible. It doesn’t matter if you have to distort facts or even lie. Our task of creating a socialist America can only succeed when those who would resist us have been totally disarmed.” to Senator Howard Metzenbaum – The National Educator, January, 1994, Page 3.
I do believe I read somewhere recently that the Bradys were told by Obummer that they needed to be patient because Obummer was working “under the radar” to implement stricter gun control measures. Could Gun Walker be that under the radar program? Is it the smoking gun? Pun intended.
The libs forced nixon to resign! So far just what we know from the testimony of the whistle blowing BATF agents; this scandal is so far over the top that Watergate looks like a kindergarten prank.
before the denials start see the following; http://www.justice.gov/ag-speechs/2009/ag/speech-090402.html thursday april 2, 2009. Holder knew all about project gunrunner. I will bet Obama knew about it too. Gun control means hitting the bullseye.
I just checked my previous post #69, and found the site has been taken down. This a .gov website, so this looks curiouser and curiouser. Yankee gun nuts website has the story at least for now ,it might also disappear.