Israel’s Phony Population Crisis
Many warn that Israel faces a demographic crisis. Their fear — that the growing Arab population between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River will endanger the Jewish and democratic state of Israel — is utter nonsense.
The truth has been distorted by manipulated information. Promoted by the dominant left-wing media, the faulty demographic argument was used to convince former Prime Minister Yitzhak Rabin to agree to the Oslo Accords. It continues to be advanced by Israeli ministers and politicians such as former Prime Ministers Ehud Barak and Ehud Olmert. Even Israel’s current prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, has accepted the argument.
The problem is, it’s a myth, part of a campaign to destroy the settlement movement. Though it has been thoroughly refuted (also here and here) we would do well to understand how it is that intelligent people keep being fooled. Here’s how the trick works.
Taking into account the entire population between the Mediterranean and the Jordan River, the situation looks grim: Jews and Arabs are almost equal. When seen as discrete areas, however, the perspective changes, and the alleged demographic threat evaporates.
Nearly all non-Israeli Palestinians living in Judea, Samaria, and Gaza live under the Palestinian Authority (PA), using PA and/or Jordanian passports. The Gaza Strip — under Hamas, a designated terrorist organization — is a separate entity with its own army and administration. It receives financial support from the PA, but opposes its controlling group, Fatah. “The occupation,” therefore, post-1967, refers to territory, not people.
According to the Oslo Accords, Judea and Samaria were divided into three regions: A, under total PA control; B, under PA civilian control; and C, under Israeli control. No Jews are permitted to reside in areas A and B (which comprise an estimated million-and-a-half residents). All Jewish communities and settlements (over 300,000 Jews) live in area C, along with a few tens of thousands of Arab Palestinians for which there are no accurate figures. In addition, over 200,000 Jews live in neighborhoods of Jerusalem established after 1967, and virtually annexed.
If the entire area of Judea and Samaria is considered as a single unit, the demographic argument looks overwhelming. But, when the areas are separated — viewing area C alone, as distinctly Jewish — the perspective is quite different: there is no demographic threat. In fact, the logic of the demographic argument suggests that Israel should annex Area C.
If ruling over Arabs is problematic, then large concentrations of Arab-Israeli citizens residing in pre-1967 Israel are of particular concern. Many consider themselves Palestinians and oppose Israel’s existence. Hundreds of thousands of Arabs, Africans, and other illegals, meanwhile, are flooding into Israel.
Using demographic arguments to promote the withdrawal of Jewish communities from Judea, Samaria, and eastern Jerusalem, and creating another Arab Palestinian state, may temporarily resolve the charge of “occupation,” but it will not alleviate Israel’s problems with its Arab communities. It will exacerbate social tensions in Israel. The likely result? Further violence and a deepening threat to Israel’s survival.
Were Israel to withdraw from Yehudah, Shomron and eastern Jerusalem tomorrow, it would not for one instant parry the accusation of “occupation” any more than Israel’s withdrawal from Gaza has. As far as the PA and the whole Islamic world is concerned the “occupation” began in 1948 and will not end until, God forbid, Israel ceases to exist. Witness the chant of Muslim demonstrators and their Western stooges “Palestine will be free from the river to the sea.”
Here is a suggestion for Israel its exactly what the vast majority of
American Jews, who are liberal, suggest for America. Ready?
1. Israel should be a MultiCultural society too, just like liberal
Jews in Hollywood, the mass media, and business want for America.
2. Israel should encourage mass immigration of anyone in the immediate
geographical area, the Southern Border of Egypt might be a start. If anything should go wrong Israel should learn to Celebrate Diversity
3. Along with mass immigration Jews should fast track Arabs to full
citizenship…invite Arabs into the Army, give them voters rights,
allow Arab groups waving Iranian and Egyptian flags to march by the
millions through Tel Aviv.
4. Jews should set up a Mass Media inside Israel just like they have
inside the USA and use that media to call anyone who doesnt like Israeli
MultiCulturalism a “racist” or a “bigot”.
5. Jews should turn their education system over to Liberal Jews
who should rewrite Jewish history. just as thousands Liberal Academic Jews Sontag, Chomsky, Zinn etc have done to the USA….Chapter one of
the new Jewish History will be about King David as a xenophobic
bigot, a blood thirsty religious fanatic, a tribal demagogue and
a man with with a predeliction to loose women
6. In the new MultiCultural Israel, Jewish politicians should be elected
who advance MultiCulturalism..they will be deemed “broadminded”. The
Jewish Majority in Israel will be attacked as tyrannous and selfish, no matter how small they are in the bigger scheme of things..just as
Jewish Politicians do to white Europeans here in the USA, Feinstein, Bloomberg, Schumer, Axelrod, Rahm Emmanuel, do to white Europeans here in the USA. Whites are only 9% of the worlds population but always refer to them as The Majority.
7. To keep the above project going Israeli Jews should be encouraged
to spend all their earthly wealth and go as heavily in debt as possible.
Subversive Jews who tesist should be targetted for confiscatory taxation.
Debt repayment should extend out for several generations of Jews so that
any idea of resurrecting Jewish nationalism will be extinguished permanently.
How do you like my plan Moshe?
See #8 Benjamin – He did a good job putting it in perspective for you.
Also, you can come up with all the Jewish names you want, there are still more “Christian”, European Americans that are doing all that to the USA.
These far left loons have lost their religions a long time ago. They are not Jews or Christians but rather Marxists and Communist “do-gooders”.
I read the article and the responses and it is obvious that none of the writers have read the Bible. Israel belongs to the Jews. It is Covenant land given to them by God. He created it and He owns it. If he wanted the Arabs (Ishmeal’s generations) to have the land, He would have given it to them. Pulling our support from Israel and denegrating Jews will only bring more curses on the US. God said in Genesis 12:3; “I will bless those who bless thee and curse those who curse thee”……. He also said to Pray for the Peace of Jerusalem. Have you done that? I highly recommend that you do!
Judy, I completely agree with you. However, my fear is that because the world is mainly against Israel and the anti-Jewish occupants in the White House will force her to make concessions that may lead to her demise. I voted for Netanyahu twice, but I don’t think that he is the strong leader today that he once was. The rise of Islamic fascism and anti-Israel/Jewish fever that is spreading throughout the media and academic world should outrage most sane people, but we seem to be capitulating rather than fighing back. I truly believe that G-d is testing us right now. I just hope we pass it.
God isn’t real.
Ooooohhhh, Phranc, she’ll be pissed when she reads that.
All of this will be a moot point if Iran gets a nuclear weapon. The only question will be if Iran actually uses the weapon (either directly or indirectly by giving one to Hezbollah or Hamas), or if Iran will try to blackmail Israel with the threat of using one. Either way, Israel’s population isn’t going to matter much unless a nuclear confrontation is avoided between Iran and Israel. And, with Obama as president, I don’t see the United States doing anything to stop this from happening.
The fact that Israel moved 500K people into land that was not theirs…just because you can slice and dice Palestine and take all the parts you want and leave the people without their land does not make it right. In fact to suggest it makes me think that the Arabs are right. The israelis have no legitimacy if they arguing for blantently stealing (annexing) more land from the Arabs
Leon, the history tells us otherwise.
I think you should READ the history, rather then RE-WRITE it. If you still have a few brain cells left, use them. THINK!
If the Palestinians had accepted the UN mandate of 1948, they would have had their ‘homeland’ for some 62 years already. They could have shown the world how inventive and industrious they are like all the Islamic Paradises.
“The fact that Israel moved 500K people into land that was not theirs…”
You start with a pretty weak assumption – that Judea and Samaria and Gaza are not Jewish land. Would you care yo prove that?
I’ll take Arab claims more seriously when they quit the lands of others they are occupying. Ask the Kurds or Copts for starters.
War is the only way to solve this problem.
Actually there is solution to the problem. It is not military and avoids all violence and dislocation. The answer is as old as Judaism and has been staring the world in the face all along. The answer comes from The Torah.
Only Jews may be citizens of Israel. Others who wish to reside in the Jewish State as peaceful residents may do so. All personal, property and legal protections would apply to them. They may not vote nor are they eligible for social benefits. They will pay no taxes except on property they own in Israel or income they earn in Israel.
Moslems and Christians who wish to remain may do so as citizens of another country or holding another passport. Those moslems and christians who wish to live in moslem or christian societies can emigrate freely.
The pen is mightier than the the sword.
I’m an Israeli Jew and I’ll tell you one thing Menachem – your words put our religion to shame. There is nothing in Judaism that supports your vile ideas.
You put yourself at the same level as our enemies.
Good, get a library card.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ger_toshav
Do some homework.
Exodus 12:45, Lev. 25:6, Lev. 25:40, Lev. 25:47 and Lev. 25:55.
At least read 1 book.
You don’t know who I am or what I read but I do know from reading your comment that you are a fundamentalist, who is as bad in my eyes as any Muslim extremist.
With Jews like you there is no wander “gentiles” are unwilling to side with us. But of course you’ll be the first to blame them for not helping when time comes – and it is coming our way, very rapidly.
Being “Light to the nations” means that you need to be a good example to others and not a pompous supremacist.
Shall we check your references, Menachem?
“Exodus 12:45, Lev. 25:6, Lev. 25:40, Lev. 25:47 and Lev. 25:55.”
Let’s see:
Exodus 12:45: “A sojourner and a hired servant shall not eat thereof”
The context is who is allowed to join the passover meal. This is not relevant.
Lev. 25:6: “And the sabbath-produce of the land shall be for food for you: for thee, and for thy servant and for thy maid, and for thy hired servant and for the settler by thy side that sojourn with thee;”
The context is: Who gets to use the land in the seventh year, when Jews are commanded not to raise crops in it. Not relevant.
Lev 25:40: “As a hired servant, and as a settler, he shall be with thee; he shall serve with thee unto the year of jubilee.”
The context is: How to treat a Jew who has sold himself in slavery to another Jew. Not relevant.
Lev. 25:47-48: “And if a stranger who is a settler with thee be waxen rich, and thy brother be waxen poor beside him, and sell himself unto the stranger who is a settler with thee, or to the offshoot of a stranger’s family, after that he is sold he may be redeemed; one of his brethren may redeem him;”
Self-explanatory. Not relevant.
Lev. 25:55: “For unto Me the children of Israel are servants; they are My servants whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.”
Fairly straightforward. Also not relevant.
I noticed that your list of quotes did not include Numbers 15:16 or Exodus 12:49 – which is only 4 verses away from one you did quote (Exodus 12:45).
Numbers 15:16: “One law and one ordinance shall be both for you, and for the stranger that sojourneth with you”
The Hebrew: תּוֹרָה אַחַת וּמִשְׁפָּט אֶחָד, יִהְיֶה לָכֶם, וְלַגֵּר, הַגָּר אִתְּכֶם.
Exodus 12:49: “One law shall be to him that is homeborn, and unto the stranger that sojourneth among you.’”
The Hebrew: תּוֹרָה אַחַת, יִהְיֶה לָאֶזְרָח, וְלַגֵּר, הַגָּר בְּתוֹכְכֶם.
Mr. “Good” was right to rebuke you. You do put us to shame. In case you lost your library card, you can read the relevant verses online:
http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt0415.htm
http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt0212.htm
Good, you offer no cogent comments only epithets. Instead of dealing with issues you simply vilify the proponent. In my opinion you are neither Israeli or Jew. Just a pretender with nothing of substance to offer.
Thank you Jonathan for your support and for putting Menachem’s references into the right perspective.
Typo correction – wander should be wonder.
My pleasure, Good.
I am sure Menahem will soon address my cogent comments – I invite you to await his response with me.
Implement something like this and the epithet “apartheid state” really will be true.
KAHANE WAS RIGHT
all the JEWS were ethnic cleasned form ARAB LANDS after 48, all the JEWS from GAZA were forced to leave, Jordan explelled more Fakestinians than ISrael and all nations EXCEPT ISrael keep them stateless, jobless and in deplorable camps-
These areas are Israeli and every single MUSLIM should get out- take a brick from the abomination called AlAqsa with them…Jerusalem is NOT NEGOTIABLE, it is capital of ISRAEL
Jordan is OCCUPIED ISRAEL LAND, as is SINAI and all Muslims should also leave- Golan to Syria—> NO- and take back GAZA it belongs to ISRAEL andis now launch pad on Israeli children —>put them into the sea–do unto them before they do it unto you
Now I will be called a hater racist Zionist and Sadr and Abbass the murdering Nazi and gang will be called resistance fighters given MY tax money and arms by USA
While all that may be just fine, all of these comments thus far, I see as simple asides to the lively foundational issues which have to do with freedom of utterance. The Societal foundation itself, should be examined and assessed. And a good, and old Germanic word may be of assist, and in this placement: All this crap (pronounced: k-r-r-a-a-p) in a never-ending chorus advancing that, the Liberal view point—but principally, it’s proponents should be “given space”, “given consideration”, “given opportunity”, and “funded” to actually demonstrate the positive addition which they make to Society—whether, in the U.S., Israel or, wherever in the world beside—not only is it crap, it is already damned for falsehood, but yet, enjoying such favorable acceptation, all the while, in logic, so easily identifiable as bad; for, while, at any moment, the liar or Liberal may jump at the chance to falsify himself as though a Liberal repository of the same goodness and safety for children, as that inhering in Conservative values-hence, the popularity of the apparent RINO—Michael Steele on Tavis’s panel on platform: “Freedom of choice? Oh, sure!”.
Then, to the obverse, because, for what they do, the essence of the left-winger is a thing in dishonor and is falseness—in observation of the most appropriate scourging in obloquy which, for his tattoos, Pat Boone got to himself—simply for the dishonor inherent to even a pretensive imitation of evil, not ever, would a Conservative wish to be identified as, party to or integral to the Liberal machination, nor even, simply imitative of that deadly mentality. And in this necessarily logical effect, then, to the Republican RINO, there is no Democrat corollary, simply because, there cannot be, such a thing is impossible of conception and realization, . . .
As can be seen in the history, for example, of ACORN, the cause and effect relationship inherent to left-wing propositions is that, the effect which the possessors of that mentality would see to be prevalent, is the very cause of the destruction of any enterprise which is so possessed.
As is with the deadly deed which several of our high Justices call infanticide, in the ostensible desired effect of freedom and prosperity and for which the left-winger would see the nation with him, conjure advancement, history shows as the cause for the destruction toward any Society of such embrace.
Then, also for economic theory, an essence of Keynesian is that, one memorize and internalize the paradigm or way of thinking in which, restatements of facts and conditions in ways which are oblique to wisdom and truth, or, diametrically opposed, becomes so facile as sipping one’s tea, . . .
And yet, however those things might be, the problem for maintenance of the larger Society is not that, there are so many bad people, rather is it that, there might be just not enough who, are themselves, so opened for goodness, and to such effect that, instead of driving the Liberals so far as any word may provide, instead, they’ve become confused—if they’re not rather spineless, in the very least, so many are weak-willed and without perfect effect, as in the nonsensical: “We’re all sinners, . . .”.
As I think, is spoken by Jeremiah, “The day is coming when the bad liar shall no more me called, ‘Liberal’.”—something like that—the Liberal element will advocate for things which can end only in destruction, and then, in death or shame, he, himself, quietly slip beneath the frothy swill.
Or, as appears, not ever, did Karl Marx read of Spartacus’ slave revolt, and of why—on account of things characteristic of any slave—all slave revolts are destined to fail, ab initio; or else knowing, Marx just went on, as did Keynes, but yet, still, so simplistic and mere a thing as Marxism is, otherwise learned Liberals—of this, of our time—and with a straight face—suppose to hold up for scholarly consideration, and with me sitting there, hanging on each word as droplets of gold!
And again, be the Great Dividion between that which is Occidental and that which is Oriental, the recognition and understanding that, the real G0D seeks us vis a vis, those mere ideas of one god or another, who in fulfillment of the definition of fabrication, as toward mankind, must forever remain rather unconcerned, that being so, why then, in that part of the world, in Israel, we have the only other nation, like-minded in correct consideration of understanding as of the very footings of civilization.
And the Israelis let their liberals continue to depreciate the nation and lie at every opportunity—audience or, no.
I’m not talking about the totality of foolishness inhering in every “fairness doctrine”, rather, that, the people themselves, do not so fully enough speak out or, shout out or, write as to have driven their own Liberals quite out of place and possibility, a long time ago.
And for the numbers of necessary layers of Societal strength arising from the foundation—such as valuable educational achievement and general ability in thought—there can be no experimentation on the matter; for, when the nation is destroyed, as the communists before and during the Nazi attempt, the Liberal element will not inherit the reins of power and production as though the foundations of Society were yet extant, and simply because, what they propose has nothing to do with building or maintaining a nation—but only destruction, . . .
“1. Israel should be a MultiCultural society too, just like liberal
Jews in Hollywood, the mass media, and business want for America.”
Israel is a multicultural society.
“2. Israel should encourage mass immigration of anyone in the immediate
geographical area, the Southern Border of Egypt might be a start. If anything should go wrong Israel should learn to Celebrate Diversity”
Well that’s exactly what is happening right now with dozen of thousands of Sudanese and mostly Eritrean illegal workers entering Israel each year and anyone opposing it seen as a “racist” by the same left-wing people who would never accept to have one of them 100 meters near them.
“3. Along with mass immigration Jews should fast track Arabs to full
citizenship…invite Arabs into the Army, give them voters rights,
allow Arab groups waving Iranian and Egyptian flags to march by the
millions through Tel Aviv.”
Israeli Arabs have full citizenship, they are invited into the army but refuse to serve (unlike Druzes) even if a small and growing minority does.
“4. Jews should set up a Mass Media inside Israel just like they have
inside the USA and use that media to call anyone who doesnt like Israeli
MultiCulturalism a “racist” or a “bigot”.”
That’s already the case.
“5. Jews should turn their education system over to Liberal Jews
who should rewrite Jewish history. just as thousands Liberal Academic Jews Sontag, Chomsky, Zinn etc have done to the USA….Chapter one of
the new Jewish History will be about King David as a xenophobic
bigot, a blood thirsty religious fanatic, a tribal demagogue and
a man with with a predeliction to loose women”
Almost happened when Shulamit Aloni was Minister of Education in the 90s.
1. Have a solution.
2. Create or take advantage of a crisis.
3. Impose or get the government to vote for your solution.
Sound familiar?
Israel belongs to the jews a chosen people of the almighty God,and allwe out there just keep praying for the jews and jerusalem for it is our duty to do so.they have been targeted for so many years and god will not close his eyes to all this harm we do to them it just a matter of time.the so called peace talks is just nothing the whole arab nations are the real thugs who are destroying the peace of the whole world and coz of oil the other nations just hang on to them .
And this should be stressed: “The UN Population Division says that the drop in Muslim and Arab fertility rates is the highest in the world. Over 25 years, Iranians have gone from an average of 10 children per woman to 1.8. The number of children per woman in Egypt is 2.5 and is 3 in Jordan. In Israel the fertility rate is 2.8. The annual number of Jewish births in Israel has risen 40% since 1995 (112,455 in 2007 compared to 80,400 in 1995), while the number of Israeli Arab births has steadied at 39,000″.
Source: http://www.iris.org.il/blog/archives/2743-Steep-Drop-in-Muslim-Fertility-Rates.html
And it is now down to Israel: 2.72
Source: http://tinyurl.com/5t49962
Jonathan, Your quick google-ing is no substitute for study.
First you will notice there is a difference between ” stranger ” and citizen. The Torah is clear on this.
Second, if you spend the time you will find that ” the stranger ” refers to those who uphold the Noahide Laws and accept Jewish sovereignty over all of Ertetz Yisroel.
Since the muslim residents of Israel do neither they do not qualify.
We are not obligated, by either religion or common sense, to accept a hostile population amongst us that seeks our destruction.
Menachem Ben Yakov
Good, you offer no cogent comments only epithets. Instead of dealing with issues you simply vilify the proponent. In my opinion you are neither Israeli or Jew. Just a pretender with nothing of substance to offer.
January 12, 2011 – 8:01 am Link to this Comment
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I could have said the same about you. The fact that you are an extremist does not make you more Jewish or Israeli than me. I served my country, including one war and will do it again if needed, so my patriotism is out of question.
Also, the examples you picked up from the Torah do not relate to different rights of Jews and non Jews and the Torah doesn’t teach such nonsense anyhow. You may be affiliated with some fundamentalist Kahana-like movement which will interpret the Torah to suit their needs.
How can our Torah, the Torah of the people most persecuted, who lived in exile for thousands of years in other people’s countries teach us to treat our guests as second class citizens?
In your last comment to Jonathan you said: “We are not obligated, by either religion or common sense, to accept a hostile population amongst us that seeks our destruction”. This is a good point and there is a problem there but it’s not what you said @ #6. What you said is that Jews must have superior rights compared to any non-Jews, regardless of their loyalties and you tried to use the Torah to prove your point. Now you are trying to weasel out and use the Arabs as smoke screen.
We do have a problem within our borders, no question about it but we’ll have to solve it in a civilized way since that is who we are. We are not going to kill or expel all Arabs because some of them hate us.
You are neither a Jew or an Israeli. Just a troll pretending to be something. Go away.
Kashe lecha lehitmoded im hametziut? = Is it hard for you to deal with reality?
Your last comment sounds just like the Fascist nut that you are. Thanks for helping me make my point.
Leon,
“The israelis have no legitimacy if they arguing for blantently stealing (annexing) more land from the Arabs”
The only way the Jews could be stealing from the Arabs is if they’d set up their state on the Arabian Peninsula. As it happens, it’s the Arabs who, anywhere outside the Arabian Peninsula, are living on stolen land.
And, there’s no way the Jews could be stealing land from anyone on Palestine. The Jews, as the indigenous Palestinian nation, have the right to inhabit Palestine everywhere they like just as surely as the Thais have for anywhere in Thailand.
GOOD,
“your words put our religion to shame.”
I say the same about left-leaning Jews and their words that make it out as if Judaism were all about witticisms and feel-good phrases. Leftist Jews put Judaism to shame.
“but I do know from reading your comment that you are a fundamentalist”
If “fundamentalist” means “takes his religion seriously,” then you’re right on target.
“With Jews like you there is no wander ‘gentiles’ are unwilling to side with us.”
Non-Jews will not side with us in our direst straits. Not because they’re untrustworthy, but because HaShem is moving history so that the glory will be given to Him. If people believe, as many today do, that Israel owes its continued existence and survival to America’s aid, then the glory is being given to American (human beings) instead of HaShem. That’s why I’m almost sure the relationship between America (the government, not the people) and Israel is headed to an end.
“Being ‘Light to the nations’ means that you need to be a good example to others and not a pompous supremacist.”
No, that’s not what the phrase ‘light unto the nations’ means. There are two sanctioned interpretations, neither of which agrees with you:
1) According to Rashi: the Jewish nation is the light unto the nations in that the nations, by looking at the events surrounding them throughout history, come to realize the God of Israel is true.
2) According to Radak: the prophet Isaiah is the light unto the nations because he brings the one and only true prospect for world peace, in the form of the future messiah (Mashiach Ben David).
Jonathan Levy,
This isn’t Christianity, you don’t interpret the Torah the way you feel like it. If you don’t bring the canonical interpretations (Chazal, Rashi, Maimonides etc.) then it’s not legit. Those interpretations, especially Maimonides in Hilkhot Melakhim (the Jurisprudence of Kings, where all the Jewish laws of statecraft are laid out), agree with Menachem Ben Yakov.
Thanks for your insight, Ziontruth.
- I agree with you that some left leaning Jews put Judaism to shame too. Hopefully you don’t think I’m a leftists and some of my previous posts can be a testament to that.
- Taking my religion seriously has many ways to it. Being a fundamentalist is only one way. You can be a good Jew without being a supremacist and that was my contention point with Menachem who used the Torah as a proof that Gentiles who are Israeli citizens should have lesser rights than Jews.
- Never said that we owe our existence to the US and of course there are people that will hate us no matter what we do but it doesn’t mean that we should push the issue and destroy good relationships. HaShem does let us make mistakes that sometimes have extreme negative influence on the future but we don’t have to make these mistakes.
- As for the interpretation of “Being light unto the nations”, let’s say that Rashi was correct, we can help others realize the God of Israel is true (as you said)by our own actions, therefore we can’t treat others as inferiors and honestly, I don’t see any signs of HaShem coming down here to do the job for us any time soon.
- Finally, I respectfully disagree with you that only so called “sanctioned interpretations” are legit. Those interpretations may carry a lot of weight of course since these great Rabbis spent their lives studying the Torah but they are humans and their interpretations were sanctioned by other humans.
GOOD,
I left you a reply that must have been too long for the forum software or moderator to accept, so here’s a condensed version.
Regarding “fundamentalism”: Judaism is diametrically opposed to the notion of Do-It-Yourself Religion. Just as, contrary to Korah’s idea, not everyone can be a priest and give offerings to HaShem directly, so too the sanctification of the Jew must be done HaShem’s way and not your own devised way. “Fundamentalism” is nothing but the acceptance of having to walk the one definite path that goes all the way back to Mount Sinai. Any other path is not the path HaShem has paved to His holiness.
Regarding “supremacism”: Like “racism,” this word has been distorted by the Left. Supremacism consists in believing yourself entitled to what belongs to others. Examples of this are Nazism in the past and Islam today. Supremacism does not consist in the good, common-sense idea that members of a nation should enjoy exclusive political rights in their own states. I believe the Jews should have exclusive political rights in their own state of Israel, just as I believe, for example, that the Thais are entitled to exclusive political rights in their own state of Thailand. The contrary view, of multiculturalism, which ends up robbing the indigenous of their sovereignty on their own land, is not only not a Jewish value, it’s a sneaky way for the Marxists to implement their doctrine that all national divisions within humanity must be dissolved. It leads to nothing but strife and bloodshed, as examples like Yugoslavia and Darfur show.
Ziontruth,
Again, I must respectfully disagree with you. I don’t know if it’s appropriate to describe Judaism as a “do it yourself” religion but most of the Torah is definitely written in a way that is open to interpretations. My opinion is that it was written that way for a reason.
Why wasn’t the Torah written in a way that everyone will understand it in one way if there is only one way to Mount Sinai as you said?
Some parts however are written in a way that no argument can exist, see the Ten Commandments – no ambiguity there. No one can interpret them in any other way than the way they are written – no ifs or buts. That tells me that the other parts of the Torah are expressly written in a way that will prompt us to think and explore as individuals and not just follow blindly this Rabbi or another. We are encouraged to take the path less traveled and maybe this is a contributing factor to our success as a people.
As for the second part of you post – Yes the Thais are entitled to exclusive rights in Thailand but there are Thais of different religions and I don’t see how is it that you want to exclude non Jews (Israeli citizens) from having the same exclusive rights as Jews. How would you feel if the US or UK will exclude Jews from having the same rights as their Christian citizens?
Menachem Ben Yakov,
Let me accept your points for the sake of argument.
Let us accept that there are differences between a ‘stranger’ and a ‘citizen’, despite the blanket statement of equality.
Let us accept that ‘The Stranger’ refers only to those who accept Noahide Laws and accept Jewish sovereignty. (Personally, I find this interpretation – and it is no more than an interpretation – unconvincing and anachronistic, but let us put that aside for the moment.)
Even accepting all this, your post still does not support your original point. There, you said that the solution is “Only Jews may be citizens of Israel”, adding that “The answer comes from the Torah”. When pressed, you referenced the laws of Ger/Toshav to support this claim.
Now, you are describing a way to GET AROUND the laws of Ger/Toshav, by claiming that they do not apply to Israeli Arabs for such and such reasons (because they do not keep the Noahide laws, or do not support Israeli sovereignty over the Land of Israel.)
Do you not see the contradiction?
Beforehand you said that your solution CAME FROM the laws of Ger and Toshav.
Now you say that your solution is legitimate becase the laws of Ger and Toshav DO NOT APPLY.
You’ve moved the goalposts.
GOOD
Hevenu lo ba-hafucha, ha?
Alav ye-amer, haposel bemumo posel.
14. ziontruth
I must also disagree. The ‘canonical’ interpretations are not above criticism. Neither is the Bible. Chazal & co. were human like the rest of us, and viewed the bible through the prism of the beliefs of their times and the limits of their knowledge. There is wisdom in their writings, but also ignorance, bigotry and prejudice.
“The ‘canonical’ interpretations are not above criticism.”
Without accepting those interpretations you could interpret the Torah to support any possible position. This is not the Jewish way. There is no private interpretation in Judaism; people who have lived a life holy beyond our imagining are to be trusted as the custodians of the true meaning of HaShem’s word.
“Neither is the Bible.”
So what’s left of the Jewish religion, then? Could people arrive at such a commandment as donning the tephillin by reason alone? Could all the Jews throughout the ages have endured what they endured had they believed it was merely human?
The Tanakh is entirely trustworthy. Of its three parts, the Ketubim are human words written under divine inspiration, the Neviim are HaShem’s message conveyed through the Prophets’ words, and the Torah is the verbally dictated word of HaShem unto Moses. Those are degrees, but all have the divine stamp on them. This a Jew must believe.
“There is wisdom in their writings, but also ignorance, bigotry and prejudice.”
You got it backwards. It is not you who determine if the Torah is moral, it is the Torah that determines if you are moral. If your morals are not now derived from the Torah, you must recalibrate them according to it.
Jonathan,
Echad efes lanu
Achen Ken, GOOD!
The sad thing is, the goyim have all gone home weeks ago, but the Jews are still arguing.
Sigh…