In an England Suburb, Teaching the Kids Jihad and Jew Hatred
Recently I spoke at a British school conference on world terrorism in the suburb of Bushey. In the current climate of worldwide Israel-hatred and America-bashing, it registered as a rather frightening experience.
At the evening opening of the conference, I was in the audience. Outspoken Muslim activist Inayat Bunglawala, who once wrote to the Jewish Chronicle that the creation of Israel was one of the great mistakes of the past century, was one of the speakers. On this occasion he railed against the Jewish state and the U.S., as did pockets of audience members sitting near me. He made it appear that America had been attacking Muslim cities, hence the 9/11 al-Qaeda attack.
I was jumping out of my skin. He spoke a stream of inaccuracies in front of this large, mostly young audience; many of them were toddlers when 9/11 took place and have no historical perspective about the decades of radical Islamic terror that culminated in the attacks of September 11, 2001. I wagered that if I had said “Klinghoffer” to the crowd, they would have laughed.
There were several Israelis and Jewish students in the front row who got into a shouting match with the jihadists sitting near them, and the front rows engaged in a kind of verbal mini-pogrom. Every manner of invective was promulgated, including from one audience member the mantra that “a bunch of Ukrainian and Russian Jews converged on Palestine after the war who stole the land.” Two parents — with their progeny present — constantly chanted phrases about the “barbaric Israelis” and “American murderers.” I glared at them, but they just carried on.
At the end, three young Muslim men came over to me, one of whom I had challenged about a comment he had made from the floor about America and its “25% of oil consumption.” They shouted at me that Jews ran the U.S., were responsible for the lack of climate change legislation, manipulate the commodity market, and everything else.
The woman sitting next to me took me back to my hotel. She, a Hindu, and I agreed this was an eye-opener, as the 250 member audience — mostly children as young as 12 — was obviously filled with a near physical rage against Israel and the United States.
The next day, I gave my speech to a large audience of students from five local schools. From the platform I could see there were many youngsters wishing to express their identity with headscarves and keffiyeh-style neck scarves. I made the point that I was horrified that youngsters with sponge-like brains had been fed so many untruths the night before. As soon as the question-and-answer session got underway, a woman in a burka shouted at me from the back of the room: the world is in a perilous state because of the “stupidity, arrogance, and pigheadedness of the United States.”
The audience erupted. I thought they might storm the platform.
We in the occidental chrisian countries are facing continuous increase of confrontations with the growing flow of islamic jihadists that should be stopped and the only way is a radical total ban to immigration of islamic citizens arriving from islamic countries in general and specifically those applying the shari’a law.
The sad, simple fact – and I suppose it’s racist to point it out – is that Britain is lost unless it rids itself of something like 80-90% of its muslim population and returns to the sort of an historical education British youngsters received before the First World War.
No, not racist, but realistic. It is sad but the divisiveness of the UK benefits only one class: the politicians. They have allowed it to happen. They have encouraged it. Further, they abet it with smarmy words about multiculturalism, meaning that you aren’t nearly as good as someone else because you were brought up in Britain or, perish the thought, England.
It is sad, but the only people who benefit from the people being divided from each other are those who use that divisiveness to rule them as it is far easier to manipulate and control a large population when they are goaded into teh hate-based politics that are allowed, nay, encouraged by the UK’s political class – all parties.
By the way, it is the same in the US. Canada is on the fringes of going there, itself.
Carol,
thanks for the glimpse into the real world. These things are the signature of the coming generation in Europe and even here. If Israel feels at risk now, give it twenty years– if it even goes that far.
God help us all.
Ms Gould:
Once again your article is a series of observations and anecdotes which I am sure are true and of course disturbing. However as always you never seem to get to a point. Where does this hatred come from? Why do these young children believe these lies? What if anything can sane people do about it?
I for one believe that rampant immigration of muslims into any society sooner or later produces jihad! They pass the tipping point where their numbers overwhelm the schools and public services, populate the teachers unions, payoff the media, hire the lawyers, palm the right money to politicans etc. Then inside of one generation they produce a rabble of hate filled zomebies and drones who produce riots on demand.
The UK allowed this to happen and they must suffer the consequences including a lack of US tourists who won’t go to merry old England to be abused.
Why you persist in your travels through this dead end society is also a mystery. However perhaps you could also enlighten us as to a relavent POINT of your articles.
Tommy Gunn
How about simply to inform and educate people about what’s going on in the world? Does there need to be another point? I always thought that was an honorable thing to do, myself.
Of course, Its the muslim dictate to spread the faith at any cost. Remember these people feel that thoes who are not muslim deserve to die. They do a begrugingh tolerance but only until their numbers grow to a point where they can have some force. Until then to them other people are nothing. they can be treated any way the muslims want, cheated, lied to, harmed etc because they are not muslim. Its not only practice and encouraged, but a tennant of their faith. The muslim community has no honor. Only an ignorant blind faith based on a religion so weak and cowardly, that any form of contridiction or ridicule must be met with violent rage. Its time we start meeting violence with violence. We will NEVER EVER EVER convice them they are wrong or sate their rage. to waste time trying to negotiate with thoes who only want us dead is idiocy. you dont reason with a rabid dog… you shoot it
Every time I read another story like this about what is happening over in England I cringe.
Sadly, i am convinced that Great Britan will be swallowed whole by these radicals before my lifetime is over unless something is done.
Ms. Gould is indeed a brave soul to venture into the land of the brainwashed.
I’m certain that the children who are force-fed an irrational hatred for their fellow man will grow up to become useful members of society.
You have just described the future of Britain. The world as we know it is done.
I don’t know if “M” is a fatalist or not. But there is an air of defeatism in some of the comments. I once asked Francois Truffaut what he thought of Godard’s cultural politics: he answered that politics is housework, and Godard doesn’t like housework.
For another set of cultural influences that encourage passivity, see http://clarespark.com/2010/06/15/the-classics-as-antidote-to-science-education/. Upper-class Brits are famously proud of their classical inheritance. A gentleman was prepared in Latin and Greek from early childhood on; has this trickled down?
But is there something about the internet itself that is flawed? For instance, the illusion that we are doing something simply by schmoosing in an endless conversation? Housework, comrades, it is a gender issue.
Carol, you write as though you are surprised by the reactions and hostility. These attitudes have been present for years and have been empowered by the West’s weaknesses. The alliance between the left and Islamofascists has been a long and colorful one and it has been growing with the increasing dominance of the lefty media, lefty universities, and lefty governments.
While your comments are appreciated you need to be broadcasting your experiences to the population at large.
This pattern will continue as long as it is aided and abetted by left in Europe and America, but I think we may be on the verge of a kind of collective awakening, beginning in November. My doubts are about the spinal fortitude of the republican party…would they rather be fashionable and wrong or unglamorous and right?
So far I only see guys like Christie and Ryan engaging the enemy head on in the public battle of ideas. Where is Boehner? Why has it fallen to the tea party movement to stand athwart Obama and say no?
My God, it’s like a nightmare.
I’ve actually heard that many British don’t even want Muslims in their country any more because of the problems that many of them cause.
You know, I’m the type of person who believes people should own up to their mistakes. Americans, Israel, and many others made mistakes or have done awful things.
However, this type of one sideness coming from many members of the Muslim community is down right scary and I think some children are too young to be going to these types of lectures.
Unless, of course, the lectures are created in such a way that both the pros and cons are presented fairly and equally without members of the audience shouting their biased. Maybe then these kids can see that despite religious background, people are the same and are capable of doing great good and great evil towards each other.
Thank you for the article.
If we do not expose these people, they will take over our country too.
You said the kids had on headscarves and keffiyeh-style neck scarves. So, wouldn’t the parents be aware of what is going on?..and apparently approve…
All of England needs to be made aware of these things. So many people turn a blind eye until it is too late.
England seems particularly vulnerable as they have let so many Muslims into the country. Plus the English “appear” to be lackadaisical in their towards them.
… AND English blood runs deep in the USA apparently. We had best be careful and start watching what is going on in our own country.
Muslims don’t need big bombs and machinery…
Islam/Muslims are like black mold …creeping, ever creeping with their lies. They have to be exposed to the light When children so young are exposed to these sort of lies and hatred it is difficult to reason with them i suppose.
Never forget that the Holocaust grew out of the class rooms all over Germany, where over hundreds of years children where taught that Jews killed the beloved Jesus.
Allah Akbar !!!!!! Infidels your days are numbered. Allah Akbar !!!!
All our days are numbered. Denying this is denying G-d. Thinking that you are numbering my days is delusional. Unless you are ready to take a bullet, I wouldn’t even contemplate thinking like that about other people. We won’t die like sheep. If our days are numbered, many of you will also go down with us. Free Palestine! Free the World! Get rid of the Arabs! Get rid of the Moslems!
It’s “Allahu Akbar,” Bill. “Alla-HU Akbar.” Come on. If you’re going to troll, do it correctly.
Of course, our days are numbered. It’s called a calendar and the Judaic/Christian West invented it.
I fear that all those men and women around the world who perished during the second world war fighting against fascism did not, through all their great sacrifice, prevent the coming dark age. They merely postponed the inevitable. The forces of tyranny and entropy that they died to destroy did not die in September of 1945. And now they have risen anew, a terrible beast with many heads, and it is opposed only with lesser sons of the great men who cast it down before…
“I fear that all those men and women around the world who perished during the second world war fighting against fascism did not, through all their great sacrifice, prevent the coming dark age. ”
You are correct. I have said many times at PJM that 250,000 Americans died in Europe in vain. They thought they were defeating Naziism. It’s obvious now that Europeans have been frothing, Jew-hating Nazis all along, and likely would have welcomed total Nazi control of the continent, if only to get rid of every last Jew. Now, they welcome the Islamonazis for the same reason.
Hitler lost the war on the battlefield but won the war of ideas… pretty much every country in europe is socialist. Many are borderline communist.
The fact that socialism(aka nazism, fascism, communism) are even taught in school as somehow being ok even in the US shows that hitler won and won big. WW3 will make WW2 look like a minor skirmish.
Hitler lost the war because he was a moron. If he could have brought himself to treat the Russians and various Slavic races better, he would have won. The Ukrainians thought they were being liberated until the SS and Gestapo showed up. The Italians, French, Finns and Norwegians were certainly happy enough to play along.
I don’t understand why England and even over here in the US, especially the Lame Stream Media are shielding Muslims, ie: honor killings, etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-3X5hIFXYU&feature=related
“Needless to say, Dr. Abdullah and the America-hating faculty member would not have been born, as people of color would have been next on Hitler’s annihilation list.”
OK article except for the above ridiculous sentence. Does the author think the Nazis would have tried to empty Africa of Africans, Arabia of Arabs, etc.?
Let me answer that, yes! They did that to the Slavs of Russia. Some 30 million dead. They regarded the blacks and Arabs even lower than the Slavs.
Do you think the nazi’s would have tried to empty all of europe of the jews?
#16 yes. There is no atrocity the nazis would have shrunk from had they won. They would have won if Hitler (“jewish physics!”) had not been so stupid as to deny Heisenberg and others the resources they needed to build a bomb. Terrifying.
If they had got the bomb first, do you think they would have tolerated the presence of dark or olive skins in the world, when there were plenty of white-skinned slavs to serve as serfs? If it was OK to wipe out european jewry, what’s not to like about wiping out the rest of the world’s untermenschen?
Carol: so what is your point here? that there are antisemite D….bags
out there… they been around since day one.. next time please write about
something more subsative
Yes carol, stop exposing the anti-semitism of miriams allies. They know that ignorance of them is their best weapon.
Yea, Jew-baiting is a real problem that seems to surface nearly every century, but how could one be expected to know that if they’ve never learned it?
“hate” is not in the DNA, it is a taught felling/thought, and obviously a way of life for some…a business etc.
one generation passes it on to the other like the family crystal.
frankly, I don’t care who killed Jesus. It was 2000+ years ago..get over it Jew haters.
someone killing someone that killed someone that might have killed someone in a time far far away is as stupid as it gets. Excusesexcusesexcuses…
Speaking of substantive(I gather that is what “subsative”(sic)is supposed to convey),the UK has allowed its legacy to be frittered away quite a while back.
The Royals are a decadent,immoral,lot-although not that different than so many other leaders. The UK made itself weak and unwise in order to do penance I guess.The subjects followed.
There was a time when I felt warmly toward the “British Isles” but I have grown out of it.There was a time when I saw their contributions to law, freedom,literature,art,and innovation as a balance to any of the wrongs they had commited.Since then I have seen how they have lost appreciation for all that beauty /fineness and seek the darkness-sooner rather than later.Let them have what they so wish for, let them taste it for themselves. Unfortunately, some people have to learn the hard way if they ever learn at all.
Keep yourself safe, Carol.I wish that as well for all the good folks in the UK who still fight the good fight.
“Since then I have seen how they have lost appreciation for all that beauty /fineness and seek the darkness-sooner rather than later.”
Oh, and americans still have it?
No,unfortunately,we don’t have the appreciation either. Not to worry,lefroy, US is going to hell in a handbasket.
We aren’t discussing America; we are discussing what the UK was. The world hates the US’s guts and always will no matter what we do, so your point is wasted.
I certainly don’t hate the US’ guts . . I’m one of those people who thinks the US is still the last bastion against the dark ages; and incidentally, the place where muslims enjoy rights, security, opportunities and prosperity unequalled anywhere in the muslim world. But why am I wasting my breath?
So they’re fighting mad against Israel and the US, are they? Well, bring it on; let’s see the color of their blood.
What happened? I thought Obama’s “apology” tours were going to change all this…
…have things actually gotten WORSE since GW Bush???
You mean, there’s people who won’t like us no matter what we do?
I’m shocked, I tell you..simply shocked!!!
Is there anymore doubt what Islam means. How many example does one need?
Thank you CFR filled State Department for helping millions who follow Islam to come to America. We already see the same hate filled ideology here. But, that is what is desired.
Chaos brings change. Don’t forget to continue your efforts for a North American Union.
“Had the allies been annihilated by Germany and Japan in WWII, we would be living in the dark ages.” In a way we are now. Since Islam has shown its true colors for 14 centuries,only those who are total morons or whose intelligence is overwhelmed by blind devotion to political correctness cannot see that we are rushing headlong into another dark ages by allowing Islam to even exist. Islam has always shown itself to be nothing but unmitigated hate. We don’t need to know any more about Islam; we don’t need any more “understanding” of Islam; we don’t need any more “dialog”, we need the courage to act. The fact that we are discussing how to accommodate Islam rather than how to eradicate it indicates the cowardice of the civilized world. Islam is up front about its intentions: it wants to eliminate every other belief system in the world. If Islam continues to advance, and there is every indication that it will, there is no doubt that the world will descend into the darkness of hate and violence and destruction. I ask the apologists for Islam to answer this question: what other philosophy would be accepted if it called for murdering everyone who disagreed with it, rape of the women of other beliefs, honor killings, beheading of infidels,and virtually everything contrary to the accepted norms of Western Civilization? Why does Islam get a pass by calling itself a religion?
It is interesting to note that the numbers aren’t on our side in the long run regardless of what we do to change our immigration laws.
The long and short of it is our grand children and their children will inherit a very different world than we did – politically and economically. This is especially true in Europe where muslim immigration has been going on longer and in higher numbers than in the US and Canada.
Seems the only thing that will change the muslim’s takeover of Europe is to change their religion. Not likely to happen.
combine this with the current covering up the “terrorism” cameras in certain neighborhoods, and things should start to get interesting in jolly old england. intersting as in the old chinese curse of “may you live in interesting times”.
How appropriate a discussion of a new Dark Ages is on the 70th anniversary of Churchill’s “Finest Hour” speech on June 18, 1940 after the fall of France to the Natonal Socialists. We may, in coming years, need to emulate his courage in dark times…
“But if we fail, then the whole world, including the United States, including all that we have known and cared for, will sink into the abyss of a new Dark Age made more sinister, and perhaps more protracted, by the lights of perverted science. Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves that, if the British Empire and its Commonwealth last for a thousand years, men will still say, ‘This was their finest hour.’ “
Sir Winston must be rolling over in his grave.
Miss Gould, i knew you wouldn’t post my comment. why profess to be fair and balanced when you are not? comments that only agree with you are rather useless unless you seek only agreements and approvals and no other type of opinion. my comment was honest. i am a person of color i understand racism issues well. i don’t understand the aggressive reactive attitudes and fear that make jews sounds or seem like racists themselves. i see this happening, simply put, to deny it is futile.
Racism is over territory. One group not wanting to live with another. Blacks going back to Africa would satisfy the KKK. Anti-semitism is not over territory. The anti-semite denies Jews the right to draw breath.
I should like to add that my companion, a Watford local, told me on day two of the conference that she and her husband could not sleep a wink as they were so distressed watching the proceeedings on day one. In my article I mentioned that she is Hindu because she stressed to me in no uncertain terms the tensions between the communities in the locale.
27. unfair and biased:
This is not my website and I wish to make it absolutely clear I have no control over what goes on or off the comment board.
Carol Gould
Has the offense of ‘incitement to hatred’ been abolished as being anti free speech or something? Those that control public discourse as a classroom debate is should be held accountable for blantant incitement as this story suggests. It is no wonder that we have such intolerance growing in society simply because it is condoned. The Muslims are pretty sensitive on many matters why can’t we be also what ever background we come from?
With England’s history of anti-semitism, I don’t see what all the barking and woofing is about. Why not turn this all around and see your lovely muslim immigrants as your allies? You can drive all those awful Jews away; Britain can finally be Judenrein. Your dream come true.
Now, pour another cup of tea and have one of these lovely biscuits.
And how many of you posting here drive a Prius; and are actively engaged in replacing crude/gasoline as the fuel that funds the Islime war against us?
Obviously the resident oil rep, “…thefake” , does not.
Yes, just as “Environmentalists are invariably people that want others to use less energy!”; the people posting I suspect want someone else to do “something”, that “Prius does not pay…” I Like my Lexus
God who created the world knows everything and we the are suffering because (even if you this it is not true)we have gone away from Gods path and we are stiffnecked.if we the children of the loving,living God would only call out to him he will work wonders as of old the Bible is not a book of fabricated stories our GOD is a God who is ready to hel all those who call upon him. Be still and rest in him.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704289504575312142075243252.html
Carol: you and my uncle are exactly the same…whining all the time
I am from Iran and the hatred my uncle has of Britain because their actions
in Iran decades ago is legendry. both of you get over it….
They shouted at me that Jews ran the U.S., were responsible for the lack of climate change legislation, manipulate the commodity market, and everything else.
They’re morons, maybe got some wonderful instruction from the Deobandi crowd…
Grooming muftis and imams at the Muslim Eton
What’s important to this crowd is the “afterlife”. Apparently, this life, in real time, sucks.
One Deobandi school alumni, in typical moronic fashion, preaches…
“On Jews, he has said: ‘They’re all the same. They’ve monopolised everything: the Holocaust, God, money, interest, usury, the world economy, the media, political institutions . . . they monopolised tyranny and oppression as well. And injustice.’
No God, no Allah, would find anything salutary in such hate filled, moronic rants.
…a woman in a burka shouted at me from the back of the room: the world is in a perilous state because of the “stupidity, arrogance, and pigheadedness of the United States.”
This woman cops some cliché that has been pumped into her head by zealots ? She doesn’t have any grasp of the stupidity, arrogance and pigheadedness on ample display in Arab/Muslim countries ?
No understanding of the the Muslim on Muslim slaughter taking place with great regularity all over the world ? Peshawar ? Kandahar ? Just yesterday, 2 more lethal car bombings in Baghdad.
You should ask the woman wearing the walking prison, who and what is instigating the regular carnage around the world ? Largely directed against targets of convenience, Muslims themselves.
The evening was put on by the Institute of Ideas which runs a debating competition for sixth form students across the country.
http://www.debatingmatters.com/
A group of pupils from a Bushey school has won a regional debating competition.
http://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/news/6242773.Pupils_win_regional_debating_competition/
Some other views that are missed out,
Queens’ School, in Aldenham Road, opened its doors for the wider community to question an invited panel on subjects from terrorism laws to the British Airways strike.
About 300 people, of various ages and backgrounds, turned out for the widely publicised event and the debate became, at times, heated and aggressive.
Others views,
Headteacher Terence James said: “It has been a really good evening.
“It has to be good for education something like this. There was a good, well-informed audience and a lot of interesting discussion on serious subjects.
“Young people should be encouraged to discuss these issues.”
The topics included Islamaphobia, the panel’s opinions on torture laws, theories on climate change, the war on terrorism and restrictions of civil liberties.
The panel included BBC foreign correspondent Humphrey Hawksley, founder of Muslims4UK Inayat Bunglawala, Conservative candidate for Watford Richard Harrington and Kent Law Clinic professor John Fitzpatrick.
Mr Harrington said: “It was great I enjoyed it.
“Everyone put their views forward – this is what free speech is about.”
Sunday Times columnist Minette Marrin,(who has said we are to soft on muslim extremists) also on the panel, said: “It was fantastic. Even though it got aggressive at times there was a really good atmosphere.
“There was no separation between the generations here and there was a tremendous amount of energy.”
Tom Meehan, a Year 13 student at the school, said: “It’s been an exciting debate on interesting issues.
“It was great to see so many people here at our school for the event and for so many of them to share their views.”
“The brilliant thing is that it’s such a student-led thing.”
“It is all about student engagement. There was a lot of uncertainty about tonight but what it showed was there is an appetite for politics.”
Carol,
I genuinely hope you are in good health.
If it was so bad on day 1 why did you and your friend,who didn’t sleep a wink
in fear attend day 2?
Accusing us of anti-semitism and anti-Americanism whilst spewing deep anti-British hatred is beyond belief.
Also beyond belief is implying there are terrorist clothes-
keffiyeh style neck scarves?!
During this discussion,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y2ABBaMFkkA
Carol recognises that their is a rise of Islamaphobia.
One of the reason’s she gives is media whipping up hatred by the way incidents
are sensationalised against muslim’s which can incite hatred and violence.
Then she does exactly the same thing.
If nobody cannot be bothered watching it all,Carol comes in at 7:17.
Note that she recognises that action’s carried out by Israel effects how they are perceived in other countries.
That is not anti-semitism.
As with all racism,it’s hatred for people for who they are not for what they
do.
We supported the U.S following 9/11,we lost lives in Iraq,we have just lost two more soldiers in Afghanistan,considering America gave financial and political backing to the I.R.A ,you all don’t deserve our support.
The most asked question to Carol,
Why are you still here?
England has expanding madrassas, in Pakistan, the number of these schools has, reportedly, exploded, largely financed with Wahhabi oil money (ultimately, financed largely by we the-infidels-who-use-oil)
“When I first reported from Pakistan in the early Seventies the number of madrassas could be counted in the dozens. Today, there are about 20,000.”
“Wahhabis arose in Saudi Arabia in the 18th century and when the oil started flowing from beneath the Saudi deserts they became vastly rich. They have used billions of pounds of that wealth to fund madrassas around the world.”
“What makes their more extreme followers so frightening is that they believe God gives them the right to kill people they deem to be ‘infidels’…More than 5,000 Pakistanis have died over the past few years in bombings and shootings carried out by Islamic militants, most of whom either have direct links with the more extreme madrassas or are influenced by the ideology they peddle.”
Inside a Pakistani school where children are being brainwashed into terrorists
It would seems that attempts at civil discourse with this growing cadre of brainwashees and/or rational and logical arguments made to them, are a waste of time.
And which country is the greatest supporter of Saudi Arabia, home of Whabbism? Is it Russia? Is it France? Is itthe UK? No it is the USA! Ms Gould is the other side of the Whahabbi coin.
Michael;
The US doesn’t give a dime of foreign aid to Saudia Arabia. That oily government is entirely self supporting.
Try again …
Accusing us of anti-semitism and anti-Americanism whilst spewing deep anti-British hatred is beyond belief.
Here’s a charming recent Muslim display in east London.
A group of extremist Muslims prompted violent clashes at a homecoming parade for British troops today after they heckled soldiers and called them ‘murderers’.
Note that she recognises that action’s carried out by Israel effects (sic) how they are perceived in other countries.
What actions would those be ? Enforcing a mandate to search ships that may well be carrying weapons to Gaza terrorists ? A flotilla intended to challenge and incite Israel, whose organizers’ only interest in Palestinians is as a way to go against Israel ?
Israel defending itself against missile & rocket attacks from Gaza to the west, from assaults from Hezbollah to the north ?
What “actions” by Israel are you referring to ?
‘Here’s a charming recent Muslim display in east London.’
So they represent us all?
Does this charming display represent you?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-STpW7jarrs
‘What actions would those be ?’
It was Carol who said that,so you might be better off asking her.
Direct quote:
‘Things happening in Israel has caused anti-jewish feeling’
She claims right wing America feel their white race is being threatened and this has led to Islamaphobia.
Carol then supplies the crap to make you feel threatened,to hate muslims and the British people and you all just lap it up without question.
‘Enforcing a mandate to search ships ‘
The fortilla’s where in international waters. When weapons are smuggled into war zones,they don’t usually tell everyone they are coming and what time to expect them and have their own camera crew.
The protest was to show the lack of humanitarian aid getting into Gaza and what items were banned.
They got what they wanted.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1288232/Israel-agrees-let-military-items-Gaza-deadly-flotilla-raid-Turkish-aid-ship.html?ITO=1490
We don’t hate British people, ‘mags’, we feel for them, pity them, even.
Because they have let you run roughshod over them.
That charming display of Muslims vilifying returning vets does, most definately, represent all of you–because you do nothing to stop it.
When mad Christians commit crimes in the name of their twisted take on Christian ideology no one has to search for Christian leaders willing to denounce them.
When Jews actually overstep and move from legitimate defense into terrorism even the Israeli government leaps forward to denounce and do whatever it takes to bring them down.
But when Muslims kill innocents with acts of terrorism one must dig to find a Muslim who will denounce the act without equivocating–and when one is found, Muslim leaders routinely denounce them–sometimes even calling for their deaths.
We don’t hate the British, mags, we hate you.
I am not muslim,my religion is non of your business,but you hate who?
Just me for showing how much crap Carol writes to make you hate?
Just hate British Muslims? Carol should get a bonus from this site,job done.
Or hate all the British?
If you think that the British people stand by and smile at muslims disrespecting our soldiers then i pity your lack of knowledge and your fellow posters rapid response and un informed bile.
We have had enough of you though,our 300th soldier has just been killed in Afghanistan,no mention of that in Carol’s ‘article’.
She is making a fool out of you all,i pity you.
There is no special relationship,we have always known this.The funding of I.R.A terrorists who blew up women and children and weapons used came from our ‘closest allie’.
Many Americans have our blood dripping from their hands.
“We have had enough of you though,our 300th soldier has just been killed in Afghanistan”
Yeah?
350,000 Americans died fighting on your side against the Germans (and their pals) in two world wars.
Don’t throw your collective arms out of joint trying to even the balance there, Limeys.
Mags;
The funding of I.R.A terrorists who blew up women and children and weapons used came from our ‘closest allie’. Many Americans have our blood dripping from their hands.
If you’re not Muslim or from the middle-east, you could have fooled me. Your conspiracy mongering and US-to-blame-for-every-terrestrial-evil attitude is just as typical.
P.S: IRA weaponry was supplied by Libya and Russia.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/4284048.stm
I think some of you have many of you have missed a very important point. The hatred being spewed from the Muslim population in England is matched by the British people and government, and most of Europe. History shows the truth about England, going as far back to the 1920′s, and their hatred for the Jews. You only have to spend a short amount of time in England (and Europe) to see and experience this hatred. What happened during the Holocaust, happened with the European public’s full knowledge. Historians have and are lying when saying that “Europe didn’t know what was going on until the end of the war. Only the USA was in the dark.
In 1948, England aligned with the Arab countries with the hope and idea that the newly formed Israel would be wiped out, and this was fully backed by the British government. So don’t feel sorry for the Brits for their current situation, because they have fully embraced it many years ago, as the rest of Europe has done.
Looking at current events, the USA is in danger of falling to this propaganda.
Here in the United States, there’s still time to reverse the tide, but it will take a great deal more political courage and social resolve than we’ve demonstrated lately.
Islam’s best shield has been its representation of itself as a religion. It’s nothing of the sort. It’s a totalitarian vision with designs of world conquest, decorated with some pseudo-theological trappings. But to say so, even to a good friend, is likely to get you regarded as a kook — and a bloodthirsty kook, at that.
We have a hard road to travel. As for Britain and Europe…I’m afraid their time is past.
“It would seems that attempts at civil discourse with this growing cadre of brainwashees and/or rational and logical arguments made to them, are a waste of time.”
It would be wise for all of us, including Carol, to keep this in mind. While I appreciate her reportage of these sort of events( it keeps us informed), I believe any sort of rebuttle on her part should be saved for the later posting/submitted article on the event.
Even more so when it involves a venue such as the one noted here. Sorry, but it will be the day when I consider the ruminations of school children as pearls of wisdom-despite the fact that most parents believe their little darlings are an exception to the rule that life experience is a necessary element for forming such opinions.That applies to other venues where the audience makes statements that are allowed to go unchallenged and unsupported.No minor child should have been exposed to such blatant demagoguery and even the thought of older children being discerning enough can be called into question.
The inane idea that the term “Islamaphobia” makes sense to folks has to be one of the sillier concepts around today.
Unreasonable fear huh ? Get real.
The depressing array of state controlled consciousness displayed in these comments leaves me with little hope that the human will ever slip free of the mental bonds that have been imposed on it for these past few millenia. God, do ye not F%£KING get it yet?
Well, obviously not. Bah…
I suspect there will come a time when Islam will be categorized in the same manner as was Communism. I hope we may be able to neutralize this threat to the free world with more effect.
The first step is recognition.
#46 – What makes you think communism is dead? Have you looked at the Alinsky students in the White House lately?
Hitler t-shirts sell like hotcakes today in all the Islamic countries today. I was recently in Amman, Jordan and asked an attractive young woman why she was wearing hers and she said: “Because Hitler supported Arab independence and he was a grand anti-Zionist.”
#47.lane: hitler’s t-shirts do not sell like hot cakes in Islamic countries.. christ. get real
I am from Iran and it is against the law to wear a t-shirt with Hitlers picture on it. you will get you ass kicked
let’s write about something more imporatanr
True — but the government of Iran openly calls for a second Holocaust, and works to bring it about. I suspect any dislike of Hitler by the government is professional jealousy.
Thank you for standing up and at least attempting to tell the truth. The only way to defeat the Muslim swine is to meet them head on with truth and evidence of their incorrect revisionist history. But sometimes there is more then that needed. I hope that you have a least a couple of body guards that go with you and I would seriously recommend that you consider a concealed weapon permit. The same sort of thing happens in American, especially at California universities when Israeli or pro Israel speaker attempt to speak. They are insulted, shouted down, threatened and harassed until they have to leave the stage. What the matter Muslims, does the truth hurt that much to listen to??
The problem is she isn’t telling the whole truth.
Carol attended a debating competition from The Institute of Ideas
Debating Matters.
The students were given a topic and then are GIVEN a side to argue.
The opinions must be backed up with research,and then have to forward it to a panel of expert judges.
This included opinions on torture,theories on climate change and civil liberties.
The debating team from Queens School Bushey are into the semi-final’s with topic’s including the expenses scandal.
To protray these pupils as violent jihadi’s is beyond contempt and Carol owes these hardworking kids an apology.
If she felt threatened there are laws in place to deal with this.
Don’t slander these people or a least say it to their face.
Mags,
Should Carol apologize to the young people who made this statement?
They shouted at me that Jews ran the U.S., were responsible for the lack of climate change legislation, manipulate the commodity market, and everything else.
And if so, what exactly should she say?
DAVID SURLS,
America did not ‘save’ us in ww2.You only joined the party after Pearl Habour.
The Battle of Britain had already happened by then.
We also had to pay you,we have only just finished paying off the war debt.We owe you nothing.
During the Troubles in Northern Ireland Americans financialy and politically supported I.R.A terrorist’s .
The bulk of the weaponary came from Lybia and the U.S. Escaped convicted terrorists were given political asylum in the U.S.
Even naming streets after them.
Your country gave visas to known terrorists to fund raise against our wishes resulting in the killing of women and children.
Oh and Dave it is 302 now,two more soldiers have been killed supporting an allie that has no interest in our losses or injuries
and does not deserve their sacrifice.
“You only joined the party after Pearl Habour.
Yeah? Well at least we showed up (even though you didn’t bother to invite us to your party when YOU declared war on Germany). Which is a hell of lot more than you did in Vietnam. The difference is is that you don’t hear Americans bitching and crying because the UK wouldn’t lift a finger to help us when we were fighting the commies.
“We owe you nothing.”
Your country couldn’t even BEGIN to pay the debt you owe the United States.
You could however honor the formal defensive alliance you have with the United States as a gesture.
“Oh and Dave it is 302″
Impressive.
“The Normandy American Cemetery and Memorial is a World War II cemetery and memorial in Colleville-sur-Mer, Normandy, France, that honors American soldiers who died in Europe during World War II…The cemetery is located on a bluff overlooking Omaha Beach (one of the landing beaches of the Normandy Invasion) and the English Channel. It covers 70 ha (172 acres), and contains the remains of 9,387 American military dead”–wiki
I’m sure the over 9,000 Americans resting in just that ONE graveyard in Normandy are impressed by the magnitude of your national sacrifice in Afghanistan.
Like I said…don’t throw your arm out of joint backing us up.
I bumped into Austin Williams, the chair of the Tuesday night debate, at the South Africa celebration at the 2010 London Book Fair and he was still stunned by the atmosphere that had unfolded at the schools event. So it wasn’t just me. Also, the first thing I asked the organisers when they invited me to take part was how good the security was. Read about the deputy Israeli Ambassador, Talia Lador-Frescher, who was almost killed at Manchester University on 28 April.
Middle-easterners are bitter, frustrated, and enraged. They perceive the backwardness in their part of the world and feel the need to blame someone – anyone but themselves. The conspiracy mongering and the scapegoating are symptoms of a socially and politically immature culture.
Nothing will change until they begin the long hard task of self-criticism and start owning their problems.
“They shouted at me that Jews ran the U.S.”
Yeah, that’s pretty much true. There’s two kinds of Jews: Christian Jews and Jewish Jews…and between them, they pretty much run America, which is why America is rich and free (although we do have a sub-cult called Democrats, who are constantly working to correct that…they’re kind of our versions of Muslims, won’t be satisfied until everyone is poor and enslaved).
Muslim countries on the other hand, are run by Muslims, which is why most of them (except the ones who happen to be sitting on top of vast seas of oil) are poverty stricken hellholes, where you can get your head chopped off if you don’t knuckle your forehead every time someone mentions the name of the child-molestor “prophet”.
Attempting to establish a civilized, logical dialogue with these rabid,bloodthirsty, anti-Semite mongrels is an act of futility.
I did not participate in a ‘debate.’ I was asked to be on a panel with three other speakers and deliver a speech, then Q&A from each other and from the audience.
In the morning I attended a lively debate amongst the youngsters. Ours was an adult event for a combined 5-schools audience.
Are you denying U.S involvement with the I.R.A? What exactlyis my muslim like behaviour? How bizarre.
I will just post a reply i have done before when this topic has come up.
For more than 30 years,the I.R.A was bankrolled by donations from the USA — and in those 30 years the U.S would not extradite wanted terrorists to face charges here, despite our repeated requests.
They where were political status so it took years to get them back to face justice.
The U.S gave visa’s to known I.R.A members to fund raise against our governments wishes.
Bars in Boston had drinks called ‘kill a brit’ and ‘carbomb’(The I.R.A invented the road side bomb that is killing our soldiers and yours)
Weapons sent included semtex and surface to air missiles,we didn’t intercept them all.
The IRA nearly killed Prime Minister Thatcher and her cabinet with a bomb in 1984, and it assassinated prominent British politicians and members of the royal family.
Rep. Peter King–for years, the congressman was alinged with “one of the most violent terrorist groups in recent European history”–the IRA
http://www.brownsvilleherald.com/news/member-87856-attention-politicians.html
The politician once called the IRA “the legitimate voice of occupied Ireland,” he was banned from the BBC by British censors for his pro-IRA views, and he refused to denounce the IRA when one of its mortar bombs killed nine Northern Irish police officers. But Mr. King is now one of America’s most outspoken foes of terrorism.
He forged links with leaders of the IRA and Sinn Fein in Ireland, and in America he hooked up with Irish Northern Aid, known as Noraid, a New York based group that the American, British, and Irish governments often accused of funneling guns and money to the IRA.
He spoke regularly at Noraid protests and became close to the group’s publicity director, the Bronx lawyer Martin Galvin, a figure reviled by the British.
Much of the conventional weaponry and a great deal of the money necessary for IRA violence came from Irish-American sympathizers.
Mr. King’s advocacy of the IRA’s cause encouraged that flow and earned him the deep-seated hostility of the British and Irish governments
During his visits to Ireland, Mr. King would often stay with well-known leaders of the IRA, and he socialized in IRA drinking haunts.
At one of such clubs, the Felons, membership was limited to IRA veterans who had served time in jail.
Mr. King would almost certainly have been red-flagged by British intelligence as a result, but the experience gave him plenty of material for the three novels he subsequently wrote featuring the IRA.
No way this is some ‘blame America’ for everything thing.The truth must hurt.
The above was a reply to The Spaghetti Monster
55. Carol Gould
So are you now saying that the youngsters had a lively debate or were they jew hating jihadi’s as you claim in your article?
“Are you denying U.S involvement with the I.R.A?”
Nope.
Are you denying UK involvement with the IRA? Most of them were British subjects, weren’t they?
“Are you denying U.S involvement with the I.R.A?”
Are you denying UK involvement with Al Qaida?
“A number of British citizens and foreign citizens resident in the UK are known to have travelled to Afghanistan and Pakistan for terrorist training and/or dealings with Al Qaida figures. Some of the individuals convicted of terrorist plots in the UK since 2000 are known or believed to have had such training. They include Richard Reid, the “shoe bomber” who tried to blow up a transatlantic airliner; Dhiren Barot, who planned “dirty bomb” attacks in the US and UK; Omar Khyam, the “fertiliser bomber” who aimed to attack shopping centres and nightclubs; and Mohammed Siddique Khan, one of the London suicide bombers. Others who were trained in Al Qaida’s terrorist camps remain at large.”–MI5
Some of our citizens are/were IRA supporters and some of the UK’s subjects are Al Qaida TERRORISTS.
Welcome to real world, Simple Simon.
dave,
‘Are you denying UK involvement with the IRA? Most of them were British subjects, weren’t they?’
Any British citizen funding and supporting any terrorist group should be punished.We take it very seriously.We have introduced tougher anti-terror
laws.
Through intelligence led operation we have managed to prevent some plots that would of led to death and destruction for both our countries.
Following 9/11 people here qued for hours all around the country to sign a remebrance books ,some (including me)openly crying.
Immediately Tony Blair said ‘Shoulder to shoulder’. We went into Afghanistan
and we are still here.(it’s 306 now we have just lost four more lads who were from Liverpool where i am.
We invaded Iraq with you. We share intelligence as well.
Its different when it comes to the I.R.A. The U.S government gave them political support as well.
The U.S had a policy of not selling arms to Northern Ireland’s police force, the
Royal Ulster Constabulary (RUC).
The Real I.R.A was not put on your terrorist list until 2001,they done this is in 1998.
http://www.wesleyjohnston.com/users/ireland/past/omagh/main.html.
Visa’s were issued to known I.R.A members to fund raise againts our intelligence agencies and prime ministers wishes.
Refused to shut down NORAID when everyone knew it was funding the I.R.A.
They obviously denied that but explained that the money raised was for the wives and children of the dead comrades and to keep the graves nice and tidy-
sounds familiar?
The U.S wouldn’t extradite wanted terrorists,even escaped convicted murderers .
They were given political prisoner status,ignoring our justice system.
So were you with us or with the terrorist’s? Bush even said there no difference between the terrorist and the country that turns a blind eye .
We hav’nt invited Al-Qaeda to drink tea with the Queen.
The U.S gave the I.R.A it’s biggest platform-the Whitehouse.
‘Are you denying UK involvement with the IRA? Most of them were British subjects, weren’t they?’
Question not answered. Obvious answer…most IRA terrorists and supporters were British subjects (duh).
Point: The UK can’t stop it’s subjects from being terrorists and supporting terrorists, but somehow the United States is supposed to guarantee that every last one of our citizens will take the UK’s side in their dispute with the I.R.A.
Un-freaking-believable.
Once again…
“A number of British citizens and foreign citizens resident in the UK are known to have travelled to Afghanistan and Pakistan for terrorist training and/or dealings with Al Qaida figures. Some of the individuals convicted of terrorist plots in the UK since 2000 are known or believed to have had such training. They include Richard Reid, the “shoe bomber” who tried to blow up a transatlantic airliner; Dhiren Barot, who planned “dirty bomb” attacks in the US and UK; Omar Khyam, the “fertiliser bomber” who aimed to attack shopping centres and nightclubs; and Mohammed Siddique Khan, one of the London suicide bombers. Others who were trained in Al Qaida’s terrorist camps remain at large.”–MI5
Hey, pal your subjects aren’t just Al Qaida supporters, they’re Al Qaida TERRORISTS.
Now, are you with us or with the terrorists?
“The U.S wouldn’t extradite wanted terrorists,even escaped convicted murderers.”
Sometimes we deported IRA members, sometimes not. Joe Doherty rotted in prison in America for years, until we were finally able to deport him…and the rocket scientists in your country then released him as part of a deal. What’s the point of us holding the guy if you morons are just going to turn him loose?
“Refused to shut down NORAID when everyone knew it was funding the I.R.A.
They obviously denied that but explained that the money raised was for the wives and children of the dead comrades and to keep the graves nice and tidy-sounds familiar”
Sure does. Sounds just like George Galloway.
“Visa’s were issued to known I.R.A members to fund raise againts our intelligence agencies and prime ministers wishes.”
Yeah, and the UK released a convicted Libyan terrorist against our wishes.
“The Terrorist who killed 270 (most of whom were American) in the 1988 Pan Am Flight over Lockerbie Scottland was returned to Libya today, after only serving 8 years of a life sentence…”
190 Americans killed, and the only guy ever convicted gets eight years, and a ticket home to a hero’s welcome in Libya courtesy of the UK. That’s the way it goes sometimes.
“So were you with us…”
No, I’m not with YOU. You’re just looking for any excuse to take the coward’s way out and avoid honoring the formal defensive alliance you have with the United States. Tony Blair I’m with…You? No way.
“We have had enough of you though…”
Good riddance. Any Brit that wants to stay true to our alliance and help us fight Al Qaida (with the United States doing most of the fighting and taking most of the casualties…without bitching and moaning about it…as usual) is welcome to. Brits like you (or Inayat Bunglawala, who is a flat out cheerleader for Osama Bin Laden) can sod off.
End of discussion.
‘Question not answered. Obvious answer…most IRA terrorists and supporters were British subjects (duh)’
I don’t think you understand the conflict.
The I.R.A and it’s supporters in Northern Ireland are British. That is what the conflict is all about!
You have just insulted them, they believe they are Irish and want to get rid of Brtish sovereignty .
Their M.P’S when elected don’t take their seats in parliment because they won’t take the oath and doesn’t recognise the state.
It’s not that we in the U.K don’t want an United Ireland,it’s the method used.
Through political means and the principle of consent.
Not through terrorism.
Any supporters of terrorism should be punished whatever their background.
‘Sometimes we deported IRA members, sometimes not. ‘
Why? Explain.
The I.R.A nearly kiled Thatcher and the tory party during their convention in Brighton.
They have killed other M.P’S and members of the royal family. They hit Downing street with mortars.Blew up a church service on remembrance sunday,killing old soldiers with shiney medals.Harrods on christmas eve.
I could go on and on.You are justifying atrocieties.
‘Joe Doherty rotted in prison in America for years, until we were finally able to deport him…’
But not until a street corner in New York was named after him. He was an escaped convicted murderer.Why on earth would it take so long to extradite him that he had time to rot. If a terorist group managed to nearly wipe out the republican party our response would be different. Why do you think thats ok?
Following the Good Friday agreement ,prison release had conditions.We had been trying to extradite him for the eight years prior to the agreement.
The U.S didn’t recognise our judiciary, our democracy,treating it like some third world country.
‘George Galloway.’
?
‘Point: The UK can’t stop it’s subjects from being terrorists and supporting terrorists, but somehow the United States is supposed to guarantee that every last one of our citizens will take the UK’s side in their dispute with the I.R.A.’
We are a least we are having a go. We have strengthened our anti-terrorism laws, and called them terrorists.Your leaders said the I.R.A where freedom fighters.
You have just reeled off successful operations against muslim extremists ,and they are only ones we know about.
The operations are based on intelligence ,like infiltrating mosques.
We also share that same intelligence with your good selves.
Of course you can’t stop every citizen helping the I.R.A. These same Americans used to have drinks called’car bomb’ and ‘Kill a Brit’.
You gave political support,we have frozen extremists assets here, the U.S allowed fund raising for a terrorist group organised by your politicians.Rudy Giullani gave Gerry Adams an award!
http://www.nytimes.com/1994/09/29/nyregion/at-city-hall-an-ira-leader-gets-a-warm-reception.html
You made them legitimate by inviting Sinn Fein to the Whitehouse with no real
conditions.
It’s the same as asking Hamas’ political wing to meet the President.
John Major was absolutley furious about this,apprantley he slammed the phone down on Bill Clinton.Then this happened,
http://reason.com/archives/1996/08/01/bill-teds-irish-misadventure/print
‘Yeah, and the UK released a convicted Libyan terrorist against our wishes.’
I am not condoning that.The U.S reponse. Boycott Scotland especially the small businesses that make tartan.
http://www.boycottscotland.com/
The Scottish people didn’t agree with this ,i assume you agree with all Obamas policies?
‘No, I’m not with YOU. You’re just looking for any excuse to take the coward’s way out and avoid honoring the formal defensive alliance you have with the United States. Tony Blair I’m with…You? No way.’
Dave mate,you will struggle to find a different view then mine.
You want us to be eternally greatful for an alliance over 60 yrs ago,but ignore the last few decades.
Is there a statute of limitations on ww2.How many more soldiers/people have to die to repay that debt.
We invaded Afghanistan and Iraq with you.We are still losing soldiers lives and limbs but you refuse to acknowledge our support.
without bitching and moaning about it…as usual)
All you do is bitch and moan about it!
‘Freedom fries’-hilarious.The word french comes the word frenched-a way to cut a potato.It has nothing to do with France.It is like me saying thay i don’t agree with the country Turkey so i am not going to eat turkey.
It made as much sense as that.
Dave,
The truth hurts whether you like or not.
You have had the chance to recognise our soldiers deaths in Afghanistan,
while standing ‘shoulder to shoulder’ with your troops .
I think us arguing doesn’t help,but i would really appreciate answers to my questions.
Also your opinion on this.
http://www.nytimes.com/1994/09/29/nyregion/at-city-hall-an-ira-leader-gets-a-warm-reception.html
England had brushed aside Indias objections in all 70s 80s that the Islamic militancy gaining groundswell in UK is not just targetted against India or other nation but instead the cancer is going to engulf their own nation. Ilived in UK inthe first half of 1990s. The shortsighted, loudmouthed megalomanics didnt realize whats going to hurt them, its kind of too late now. Hindus to this day have assimilated in any and every nation they settled down, contrarily their muslim counterparts became the greatest threat to all nations. Europe and later US and Australia, cnada will see the same trends wherein Islam posing very serious problems there….no solution in sight…
So – I read that the UN is passing out pamplets to the Arab children teaching them to fight for their rights to a land that is supposed to belong to them? Why then cannot the American Indian, Australian natives and African people use that same pamplet (changing the people group named as the ORIGINAL OWNER of the land)to assume their rights to their own land from their forefathers? Everyone in America without the Indian’s government registration number should have to leave America for the sake of peace efforts outlined by this world government institute. You cannot make one country responsive to a declaration of a unified world effort without including the rest of the world. That’s just how it is.
Why don’t you go back to America? Serious question.