High Drama Amid ObamaCare Threats
There’s a fallacy of rhetoric called the tu quoque — in other words, “you did it too.” The point isn’t to make this a tu quoque, but to point out that the threats we’re talking about, toward the congresspeople and others, are actually pretty mild.
The furor is not.
As is not uncommon, Victor David Hanson had something insightful to say:
So here we are with the age-old problem that once one destroys decorum for the sake of short-term expediency, it is very hard to restore it in any credible fashion on grounds of principle when the proverbial shoe is on the other foot. A modest suggestion: If the liberal community wishes to be more credible in its concern about contemporary extremist anti-administration rhetoric, then they might try the following: “Please, let us avoid extremism and do not fall into the same trap as Baker, Chait, Keillor, Gore, Moore, or Rangel when they either expressed open hatred toward their president, or speculated about the assassination of their president, or compared their president to a fascist. We must disown such extremism, past and present.”
Frankly, the fuss about “death threats” that Hoyer, and Stupak, and Talking Points Memo were all indulging isn’t real fear or real threats. It’s political theater, and poor theater at that.
But what follows today? We’re seeing more excitement. Rep Eric Cantor (R-VA) has a district office shot up; Rep Anthony Weiner (D-NY) got another famous package of white powder. (Speaking of theater, could we stop panicking over white powder? We haven’t seen weaponized anthrax in eight years, and we’re at the point when any idiot with a box of baking soda and a first-class stamp can make the national news and empty an office for the day.)
Well, here’s a thought. There are some nuts out there, we know that. Republicans were getting death threats last month, and there have been actual murder attempts as happened in Tampa last year.
Do you suppose using these calls, with all the political theater and the frankly manufactured outrage that somehow ignored Sean Penn and Courtland Milloy, but focuses on an anonymous voice wishing Bart Stupak ill, might be encouraging the nuts? Might just possibly be raising the excitement to a point where the nuts feel like the only way to protect their side of the fight is to act violently?
Real threats, of real violence, certainly can’t be tolerated. But calling national press conferences to take advantage of what were, after all, pretty normal nasty phone calls, for purposes of political theater, doesn’t improve the situation. Instead, it exaggerates, it exacerbates, and increase the risk to everyone.
“And naturally, no one likes to hear, as Rep. Stupak purportedly did:
Congressman Stupak, you baby-killing motherf—er. … I hope you bleed out your a–, got cancer and die, you motherf—er.”
Calling someone a “baby-killing motherf-er” is not a physical threat! The rhetoric is admittedly kind of rough—but Bart Stupak was not violently threatened.
Mr. Martin:
“But calling national press conferences to take advantage of what were, after all, pretty normal nasty phone calls, for purposes of political theater, doesn’t improve the situation. Instead, it exaggerates, it exacerbates, and increase the risk to everyone.”
Y’know, until someone is arrested, tried and convicted for these acts of political vandalism, no-one but the perpetrators know who really is guilty.
This sudden spate of petty property crimes seems to be orchestrated, but they certainly have arrived at a very politically convenient time…almost tailor-made in order to put the foes of phase One of Obama’s Socialist UtopiaCare on the defensive, does it not?
Until further evidence is unearthed that these acts indeed ARE the work of anti-HCR partisans, I reject any guilt that some may impute towards that movement.
And in fact, I will go so far as to speculate that it is not beyond the realm of possibility that these acts are the work of Obama and Pelosi’s allies in the unions or the now-defunct ACORN cadre.
Consider that these have been, for all the hype, the kinds of events that would otherwise not even merit back-page mention in your local newspaper outside of this political context.
We have seen the Left use these kinds of “faux-violent events” before…Clinton’s notorious “Black Church Burnings” across the South in the late 90′s comes to mind.
Frankly, if the radical Right wing in this country ever gets to the point that all these propagandists seem to think they are at now, a broken window or a nasty phone call will be so small a beer as to be laughable.
There will be Death Squads…that’s just the way the Right Wing has historically rolled, in this and in other countries.
Building a socialist state through tyrannical means is a VERY dangerous game to play against an armed and committed populace.
If this indeed IS a “maskirovka” by the Left, someone should start thinking long and hard about what can come from their play-acting.
Yeah, Weiner was so distraught, he was reduced to smiling and showing off his… er…
Democrats are wussy crybabies (and they try ride their upset into more support by attempting to get others to share their outrage).
guess we need some smelling salts for the dems side of the aisle – pretty sissy pants if you ask me.
They might be believable if they sent SEIU, Acorn and Bill Ayers packing – but then, who’d do the dirty work for them?
goy,
re: #3
I normally don’t think very highly of your comments but that last one was awsome. Seriously, keep churning those out.
Thanks
One reason the republicans are not in power is they are weak and easily manipulated by the mainstream media. There is both fear and political theater, but threats against republicans are ignored and threats against democrats are exaggerated. A single denunciation might be appropriate, but anything more than that is adopting the position of a guilty supplicant, which is exactly what the marxist media wants.
Conservatives need to move forward and not be cowed by media attacks on conservatives–apology is tantamount to confession.
We do know a republican office was shot at, which exceeds the violence that the democrats have been shrieking about. The media will duly ignore this and continue to agitate the sheeple with tales of tea party terrorism.
Somethign that came out a little too late for this article: The Organizing for America folks are now using this for fundraising.
Someone with a conspiratorial turn of mind might wonder what the downside of a little prevarication might be for the Democrats/
#7 Charlie Martin:
“Someone with a conspiratorial turn of mind might wonder what the downside of a little prevarication might be for the Democrats”
I think I already did that above.
This is likely all BS…I note that no-one has yet discovered the identity of Congresswoman Louise Slaughter’s “Wearing Her Dead Sister’s Dentures” Woman.
It’s a bumper-crop of political BS this season!
All this hoo-haa from the left is all made-up crap so they can be the victim instead of the bad guy. They know da– well that most Americans oppose what they did by taking over healthcare. Their ploy now is to try to regain ground with enough voters over the next seven months to get by with their power grab. They take us for fools. I, for one, will not be taken in by their cheap and repeated lies.
The left has no credibility. They have shown this time and time again. It’s time for we, the people, to put them in their place-the unemployment line. They need to be in the real world like we are and deal with the same problems we deal with. It’s time to take our country back, while there is still time.
Further evidence of foul play.
The bastids!
These miscreants should be treated as the domestic terrorists that they are. The People’s House has spoken. That’s the way Democracy works. Round them up and throw them all in the pen.
They’re scared sh*tless of the Tea Party movement! Can’t let up now. Remember last week when he was prolife, Stupak said his life was a “living hell” and he and his wife had to disconnect all the phones in his house. Do you think all the people calling were prolife or tea partiers? I think not.
Predicative Typical Democrat BS.
What did they expect for their unpopular vote?
This bag of dipsticks have a 12 percent approval rating,
even their own families hate them.
Tom Perriello’s cousin probably cut his brothers propane grill gas lines knowing that the congressman would be over there celebrating the health care vote with a beer and spa cook out.
#7 PT Bull:
“We do know a republican office was shot at, which exceeds the violence that the democrats have been shrieking about.”
In all fairness, no, we do not know that.
Have you ever BEEN to Richmond? It’s not as though random gunshots are unknown in that fair city at 1 am in the morning…
The wicked flee where none pursueth.
Considering what the Progressive Democrats have done,
and what they have made clear they plan to do, to the US,
it is no wonder that they are feeling anticipatory guilt
and fear; Totally unjustified, of course.
I have to laugh when Congress members, who hold the ultimate positions of wealth and power in this country, who daily make decisions to control all our lives, begin trying to claim victim status.
Put on your big boy pants, you bastards, and stop your crying. When you hold elected office, you will receive criticism, some of it quite nasty. It goes with the job. Our previous president endured some of the most hateful I have ever seen in my life. What you’re whining about is minor in comparison. But if you feel you really can’t take it, then perhaps you’d best resign.
To begin with, the Democrat Party is paranoid as hell. There is not a man among them. So, the slightest hint of a physical encounter, whether violence or not, will send all of them scampering to Mamma. At elite New England universities, I was known as violent because I played team sports.
But the real reason for this fear is good old Darwin-blessed GUILT. They are on a drunken binge of looting, rape, and murder that would give anyone nightmares. Their consciences cry out “Forgive us for we, in our drunken lust, have murdered our father.” They know that forgiveness will not be forthcoming.
I agree with those of you who feel this is all about propaganda for ‘sympathy’ because they know a LOT of Americans (not just tea party attendees) are majorly PEEZED!
Comment from a Boston Editor in 1775;
“A Torre is a person with his head in England, his Body in the Colonies and deserves to have his neck stretched.”
There is nothing new in what the Demonrats are hearing.
Calls for Civility are code speak for Shut Up and Take it.
jd
The Democrats passed Obamacare over the objections of the majority of the American people and probably over the overwhelming objection of those of us that will be footing the bill for this leap down the road to socialism so what did they expect? Surrender?
If they think We the People are angry now just wait until Obama and the radical leadership of the Social Democrat party try shoving amnesty and cap & trade down our throats. They may see real violence then.
Didn’t the National Socialists burn down the Reichstag and blame it on the Jews? I would expect to see a lot more violence and name calling blamed on patriots but actually carried out by SEIU thugs. This is a time-honored progressive tactic.
Some facts for the Social Democrats to consider:
1. According to a Gallup poll conducted last October (http://www.gallup.com/poll/123854/conservatives-maintain-edge-top-ideological-group.aspx) Conservatives outnumber Liberals 2:1
2. The majority of guns in this country are owned by conservatives.
3. The majority of the nation’s hunters are conservatives.
4. The majority of the nation’s veterans and active duty military are conservatives.
5. The majority of the nation’s law enforcement are conservatives.
6. Conservatives are actually willing to engage in order to protect our God given liberties.
7. Liberals are not willing to fight to impose socialism upon us. They will instead rely upon the courts and conservatives’ respect for the law and expect that we will willingly go into bondage.
Just some food for thought.
The media-fest of “threats” reads like a pretext for further regulating speech. Hey, we can become like Canada.
I’ve noticed that people, in this case democrats, who snivel the most about other people’s conduct are usually guilty of it themselves. Or to borrow a prison platitude, what goes around comes around. Didn’t the democrats celebrate that British Bush snuff movie with gay aplomb? Gee, where were these democratic politicians during Bush derangement syndrome, General Betrayus, and the Truthers blaming Jews for being behind 9/11? Oh, yeah, and that Fort Hood shooting was just a Muslim going postal over having to violate the tenants of Islam, the religion of peace, because Christians were insensitive bigots and didn’t give him enough affirmative action special dispensations. But it is nice to know that with the passage of Obama care adults up to the age of 26 can stay on their parents health insurance plans. Gee, that means Johnny and Susie, the speed freaks, can mooch off mommy and daddy, smoke dope, snort coke, and get still get a state subsidized enema when they OD.
Or is this the beginning of the Obamunists self-coup? The reasons will be ratcheting up in tempo, me thinks.
Nicely said, Delia.
I’m curious to see how many Democrats come home for Easter. Cowards.
The concern that I have is that a people that disclaims violence in any and all circumstances will inevitably suffer a level of provocation that is complete and total……and just a hairsbreadth short of violence. If they know you will not shoot, then they’ll dispossess you, enslave you, maltreat your women and children, and turn you out into the wilderness — whereas if you shoot, they’ll say that you were the one that “broke the truce”, “disturbed the peace”, or “brought on violence.” We have about 6,000 years of recorded history that supports this pattern, and about two days of liberal whining that “this time is different.”
After the outrages of the Left during Republican administrations — not to mention more recent union thugs beating people at Tea Party meetings or biting off fingers — this latest Kabuki is very reminiscent of a little boy that slaps his brother and then runs around the corner to hang out with mom. As we all know, this game can be played over and over and over….and generally ends only when the brother catches him well away from mom and gives him a drubbing.
The doctrine of “we cannot hit” is a sweet tonic for a bully. It encourages them and brings out their worst. Accordingly, I believe that much of the current apologias and “deploring” and “can’t be tolerated” is counterproductive. Granted, violence is generally criminal and advocating the forceful overthrow of one’s government is a close relative of treason — accordingly, one shouldn’t issue a call to revolution whenever one gets a traffic ticket.
As another writer so eloquently put it: “Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”
Saying that revolution is unthinkable only encourages the outrages that bring it closer. Forswearing violence will lead to the loss of everything else…..and violence when naught is left. I would counsel, instead, that the better reply to such scandalous accusations would be, “the time may come for such things, but it is not yet — in the distribution of people offended by your actions, you are focusing on one tail of the curve….and there are always nuts on the fringes. Let us all pray, however, that we do not continue towards a tipping-point, where a majority of the people see ‘a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object’.”
As a final note, some have been saying, “we can’t have a Reichstag fire! We can’t have a Reichstag fire!” They fail to note, however, that (1) the Jews couldn’t have prevented non-Jews from burning the Reichstag themselves and blaming Jews for it, and (2) the Jews could hardly have been worse off if they DID burn down the Reichstag — and might have been wildly better off had they thus secured a reputation for being “difficult”. This is just the wrong example to use when trying to calm people.
Watch the videos of the Congressional Black Caucus strolling through the Tea Party Demonstration. Note their slow gate. Note how many are recording their stroll. Now, ask yourself, What was their motivation?
The U.S. current health care system is idiotic.
How do you expect a minium wage earner to pay for health insurance?
Should we just go back to slavery and not provide them health care
except to keep people alive during their crop picking years?
As is done successfully in Germany and Switzerland, we should have a
15% flat tax for health care (no limit on top bracket), make the
system be not-for-profit but care-for-people by well-paid flat
salaried doctors and nurses and give the job of designing it to some
people who know how to design complex systems (not bankers), also paid
with flat high salaries.
The people who invented the internet did so as a make-works government
program. Let’s put out bids to revamp the health care system to those
same qualified body of engineers and mathematicians (not bankers or
over-paid old-boy-and-girl school executives).
What cthulhu said.
All this aside, I’d be curious to know what everyone’s breaking point is. Specifically, at what point in this downward spiral would you consider violence? Never? On your way to the labor camp? And please don’t give me some drek about “when all other options have failed”. I’m genuinely curious to know what it would take for you to resort to violence.
It goes beyond the political theater you claim, Mr Martin. Stop and think how likely that a poll (full of leading questions and questionable methods designed to demonstrate bloodthirsty thoughts on the right) that is three weeks in the making happens to come out and coincide with
* random anonymous ominous acts (smashed windows, prayer vigil featuring coffin)
* black congresscritters losing their limo service and having to stroll through a demonstration aimed partly at them (staffers in tow, video cams aloft)
* a telephone campaign reporting threats, fears and threatening vibes
* congresscritters harumphing for the cameras
* instantly inflamed blogs, pundits and meat puppets, all with the same talking points
and all coinciding perfectly to lead a singly news cycle. Now stop and think how often we have seen this precise pattern before from the Dems. I swear they have an office of Potemkin Village Escapades somewhere. Why, in this case? Could it be so that when they go back to their districts for spring break, they can cancel or greatly restrict attendence at their townhalls so they don’t have to face the anger and don’t allow scenes of angry voters challenging them on the nightly news?
This is simply part of the campaign the Dems promised the members to mitigate the hit in November.
It goes beyond the political theater you claim, Mr Martin. Stop and think how likely that a poll (full of leading questions and questionable methods designed to demonstrate bloodthirsty thoughts on the right) that is three weeks in the making happens to come out and coincide with
* random anonymous ominous acts (smashed windows, prayer vigil featuring coffin)
* black congresscritters losing their limo service and having to stroll through a demonstration aimed partly at them (staffers in tow, video cams aloft)
* a telephone campaign reporting threats, fears and threatening vibes
* congresscritters harumphing for the cameras
* instantly inflamed blogs, pundits and meat puppets, all with the same talking points
and all coinciding perfectly to lead a singly news cycle. Now stop and think how often we have seen this precise pattern before from the Dems. I swear they have an office of Potemkin Village Escapades somewhere. Why, in this case? Could it be so that when they go back to their districts for spring break, they can cancel or greatly restrict attendence at their townhalls so they don’t have to face the anger and don’t allow scenes of angry voters challenging them on the nightly news?
This is simply part of the campaign the Dems promised the members to mitigate the hit in November.
All I have to say is what I posted on Politico in response to Hoyer’s disingenuous fake bloody shirt: if this descends into violence, it won’t be because of anything done by Tea Partiers. It will be a response to the arrogance and dismissive attitude exhibited by Democrats toward those who came out to speak to their elected leaders and got vilified and ignored in return.
I saw Neil Cavuto ask Michael Barone if he knew of any time in history where Congress and the President had ignored public opinion to this extent. Barone cited the furor after the Kansas-Nebraska Act of 1854, which resulted in the formation of the Republican Party and resulted in the Civil War. That should make us all uncomfortable. The way to resolve this split is political, not through violence, but when they mock protesters and accuse them falsely, they only give encouragement to those who think that nothing other than violence will work. I don’t want to happen, but if it does, I won’t consider it the fault of Republicans or the Tea Party movement.
Doesn’t anyone watch NCIS? Never ever say you’re sorry! Just roll your eyes, tell them to man up. It is all BS. When I worked for a Member of Congress, twice we had to evacuate our local office due to a bomb threat. During high profile issues, probably 1/4 of our mail was a hundred times worse than anything I’ve seen so far as to threats or inappropriate comments left on voice mail.
The Purple Shirts are probably behind all this. But, as I recall the far left whackos at the G8 conference were totally out of control and not a word of shock coming from dems or the media and does anyone remember any left side outrage at the movie about assassinating Bush? Like Charlie, I’m not going to play the “did it too” game, but if it came to that, I think it would be clear which side is prone to violence.
However, all that said, if one of those sleazebags calls me a “teab@gger” to my face or within my hearing, they will find out that this granny still has plenty of fight left in her. I just wish I had the money to file a defamation suit against Maxine Waters and McDermott for using the term on the floor of the House.
So lets get this in perspective BLACK congressmen who belong to an ethnic group that voted in a BLATANTLY RACIST way for Obambi are playing the RACE CARD and accusing everyone else of being RACISTS.
How absoluteley HILARIOUS
The Democrats remind me of 1944 SS camp guards accusing Jewish inmates of making death threats.
“Mami, they’re making fun of my jack boots. What should I do?” “Oh, kill about 6 million of them, and then you’ll feel better.”
Have the Germocrats totally gone off the deep end? Over the past 40 years they’ve taken violence to an art form. Burning down cities. Blowing up police buildings. Killing pig police officers. Beating up non believers from Reginald Denny to Kenneth Gladney without the least condemnation from a Democratic leader. Now, after murdering our healthcare system and gravely wounding our nation, when some patriots decide they’re rather fight than switch, the Democratic leadership lodges complaints to the water carrying Mainstream Media. It’s like the Nazis shooting up Malmedy, and then during the Nuremberg trials, preaching non violence.
But enough of that. Let’s talk about me.
Maybe it’s just been a bad span of weeks I’m going through. But I hate doing what I used to love. Most of all, Maybe most of all I hate blogging.
At the same time, I am so thankful that so many of you have stepped up so beautifully, and are writing such insightful, wonderful prose. Your blogging abilities put the dry, unimaginative Huffington bunch to shame. The Move-on, Daily Kos people are like tight angry fingers trying to play a riff on a guitar. It comes out sounding bush league, a mish mosh of sour hate notes. Atlas Shrugs is made up of writing neophytes compared to you. Love Pam, if only she could write as good as she looks. American Thinker needs to learn how to write.
I realize that everyone can’t be a cfbleachers or a Victor Hanson, but you girls and guys already are mighty close.
I came here today to say two other things about the politics of the day. One, about the death threats the Democrats are whining about and trying to blame on Republicans leaders. They’re doing exactly what I’d do in their onerous position. They’re like an abusing husband; a wife beater. When stopped by stronger powers, they’ll blame bad qualities in the wife for their behavior. Victimize the victim. The Democrats are taking this country to the brink of vaporization and what do they do? They blame Rush, Glenn Beck and people like you. Let me let you in on a secret. If you’re in the middle of a political campaign where you could take income away from the opposition, you’ll get death threats. It’s like playing poker and antying up. Death threats are a dime a dozen. Pay no attention to them. Granted, I got in the habit of packing, but, heck, I can’t karate them all to a pulp.
Second thing I wanted to say:
The black barnyard animals you saw yesterday on TV say they walked through a crowd full of hate speech.
I say, “black barn animals”, because not everybody as yet realizes that racist accusations thrown like mud against a wall no longer stick. Folks, there’s nothing to be afraid of. The end of the race card’s power can be traced to election day, 2009, when those bully boy black panther mothers dressed up for Halloween, tried to intimidate voters in Philadelphia. Somebody should have challenged them. I promise you they would have run like scared school girls. Then Eric and Zero let them walk when the feds had them dead to rights. That was when the day the racism play died like a stepped on cockroach. Cramer of Sienfeld could have ranted at those black political puke punk “they slurred me” boys two days ago and the polls would have reacted with a non-reaction. Oh, sure the mainstream media would have done the requisite Lewinsky suck up, but nobody’s swallowing the lies anymore.
Dems are singing the “oh, let’s be civil and not violent” song strictly to try to get the poll numbers back up.
It’s a ploy, nothing more, nothing less. Just point how hypocritical that is.
Remember when the labor union pukes beat up a black conservative guy handing out trinkets after a town hall meeting just before Obama got elected? No Democratic leader let out so much of a peep. When Bill Ayers bombed the pentagon and police stations, no Democratic leader let out a peep. When student terrorists occupied buildings in the 60’s, no Democratic leader let out with a peep. In fact, they encouraged it. And when they burned down cities in the sixties, no Democratic leader so much as criticized them. They encouraged them. So this sucking up to the non violent creed of Mr. King is a ruse, a fraud, a sham. When anybody talks the “don’t be violent” talk, point out the hypocrisy and walk them through a bunch of examples. Does the trucker, Reginald Denny strike a familiar chord? It should. Use it. Dems are unholy hypocrites.
But when Dems are on the giving end of the beatings, who’s complaining? The media and the Dem leaders are quiet as mice. They laugh when shoes are thrown at Bush. When pies are thrown at Coulter. They love it when conservatives have no freedom of speech.They’re neo-communists and they don’t even know it.
Neo Coms. New Communists. See you can use the word, and the sky’s not falling. I want this to be the day you all stop being afraid of the racist label. Nowadays the only real fear we should have is for our nation.
# 7 P T Bull
“We do know a republican office was shot at, which exceeds the violence that the democrats have been shrieking about.”
No, what we do know is that a random shot fired in the air came down in a window on the lower floor of a building where Cantor has an office when no-one was there. It came down with just enough force to break the window, but not to pass though the blinds. (From the police report.)
So for Cantor to say “Just recently I have been directly threatened. A bullet was shot through the window of my campaign office in Richmond this week.” is – there’s no other word for it – a lie. He was not in any way “directly threatened.”
Bush is Hitler, Kill Bush, Bush baby Killer, Bush took us to War on a Lie , hanging Bush in effigy, Bush Hitler T shirts and a completely hostile MSM and PROPAGANDIST Hollywood and now the disgusting left wing moonbats and RACIST Blacks have the utter cheek and HYPOCRISY to complain when they get just a VERY LITTLE BIT of what they gave back.
I for one am DISGUSTED with the left wing PC,MC, Islamophile moonbat HYPOCRITES.
JQ/39; the implied parallel between Cantor’s and the congressional strollers’ stories has a problem: it doesn’t exist. Why doesn’t it exist?
Okay, a bullet came thru the window and Cantor said he felt threatened. He may have been lying about his feelings but you can’t know that (and his reputation mitigates against it, too, but leave that aside).
There is actual evidence that he was not lying about a bullet coming thru a window and into his building.
So, when you say he’s lying, you mean to say you think he’s lying. Actually, the only lie is yours; it’s your claim of knowledge that he did not ‘really’ feel threatened.
The parallel between Cantor’s actual bullet, and the hearsay claims of epithets and spittles that somehow went unrecorded despite dozens of cameras actively seeking to record same, doesn’t exist. There’s no parallel.
===
I was watching tv that day, watching Greta Von Susterin interview Barney Frank. the interview was just inside the building, the crowd was audible just beyond the door to the outside. Greta asked Barney about the meaning of the crowd, and Barney answered that a crowd that size in a country of over three hundred million people more or less meant nothing, but that he, Barney, was very disappointed in the protesters, very disappointed that a slur had been hollered at him.
So, here’s why the Lord Protector of Fannie and Freddie somehow allowed them to make a few trillion dollars and the American economy and possibly the entire Western Enlightenment evaporate: he’s confused –he thinks that say three (generous to him, and easier arithmetic for me) slur hollerers in a crowd of 30,000 sullies and casts into disrepute that 30,000, but that 30,000 protesters from a crowd of 330,000,000 citizens is meaningless because the fraction is so small.
But it’s the same fraction, in both examples it’s one in ten thousand.
So Barney is of course, corrupt, naturally, we all know that, but did he just tell us also that numbers don’t meqn a thing to him?
I guess if so that would help explain his career performance, as well as continue to make him perfect to be setting democrat party policy for the people’s financial future.
“…numbers don’t mean a thing to him when ideological politics are concerned.”
JQ/39; PS, re your “No, what we do know is that a random shot fired in the air came down in a window….” –can you tell me how “we do know” that it was a ‘random’ shot?
The only way “we” could know that is if “we” fired it –so tell me, were we shocked to learn that our random shot happened to, in defiance of all odds, come down in the window of a politician hotly engaged in a political dispute that was elsewhere in the nation spawning violence?
Remember, if we aren’t shocked at the odds, then our random shot probability-wise most likely wasn’t really all that random, was it.
back on Blarney, if one wanted to squeeze the lemon for political advantage anywhere near as hard as his ilk do, one could do the arithmetic tight, and say that the one slur Barney says he heard was one in thirty thousand, out of a crowd of one in eleven thousand Americans –meaning that the Tea Partier is almost three times as civil and constructive as the average citizen.
And since the bearing of false witness against a neighbor is surely in proportion to the other virtues and vices, one could safely discount the Democrat claims at a rate of about three to every one of the tea party claims.
And this would be extremely generous to the democrats, granting them the same place on the scale as the ‘average’ citizen.
Since we all know that is n
Since we all know that is not likely to be the truth, that because that ‘average citizen’ has liberals on one side of him or her and conservatives on the other, it would be wrong in every way to ascribe to either side the same quantity and quality of virtue and vice as are the stuff of the basis of division in the first place, the democrats are ipso facto not as virtuous as the ‘average citizen’ –who is, as we’ve established, already only a third as virtuous as a tea partier.
So, we could not be far off the actual universal truth here, if we were to establish a mean within that liberal 50% on the liberal side of the liberal/Conservative average half, and arrive at a reliable enough general rule of thumb that on average democrats are SIX times as likely to lie as tea partiers.
Charlie Martin is a math wizard, i’ll bet he concurs with my conclusion, even though the only thing i know about numbers is that a constipated mathematician can always work it out with a pencil.
PS, one last observation: if a bullet comes into my space, whether i’m then currently occupying said space or not, and whether that bullet was random or not, i shall feel ‘directly’ threatened.
If it was a lightning bolt rather than a bullet, or a grenade, or a piano, that flew in through a window into a space occupied, some or all the time, by me or my assigns, i shall have been ‘directly’ threatened. Now, if the intruding object did not possess the power of injury or lethality, that would obviate the use of the word ‘directly’.
For example, no number of cigarets, tho lethal, coming thru the window singly or even in small groups would be a direct threat (tho they would imply that such was perhaps imminent, but that’s another story). However a cigaret delivery truck smashing anonymously thru the window would be a direct threat.
Point is, context is important –all the way from the nature of (and message contained by) the object’s lethality and rate of lethality, to the person whom it might have struck. I’m not at all worried about a white shark attack sitting here in my office, nor am i worried about a white shark attack that might be happening this minute to someone i don’t know someplace i’ll never hear of.
So, to sneer at Cantor’s statement is to not be Cantor. Just as not being a Cambodian schoolteacher in a Pol Pot execution ditch in 1975 makes that situation, no matter how utterly lethal to the doomed, entirely non-threatening as far as i’m concerned. That’s “context”.
Talk to your neighbors…post flyers in churches/grocery stores/bowling alleys, any place that has a bullentin board..Put Address and phone number where democrats can go of call to change to REPUBLICAN.. Its time to take our country back from the SOCIALIST who are out to destroy the United States of America..
Look, Democrats, you’ve just spit in the face of about, oh, 100 million or so Americans.
You’ve declared war on their freedom — and on their incomes.
You’ve made it clear that you are prepared to use whatever level of government force is required to impose your socialist/fascist dream of bleeding the productive to provide ever-more unearned benefits for the non-productive.
So what kind of reaction did you expect? You demand that we not only bleed, we remain silent, submissive and quiet while you drain away everything we’ve worked for? Not going to happen…..
But isn’t it all about the theater? Congress has been about the show of doing something to solve a problem rather than actually working to solve the problem for years. It has just gotten worse among the left since the Bush years.
Dennis:
Yeah, let’s do it like the Europeans so our cancer and heart attack survival rates can fall to European levels.
If we are peaceful, we lose. If we ratchet it up a notch, we lose. The right will always lose because the left writes the rules and controls the public megaphones. Isn’t that the basic description of what is taking place? Where are the threats of “cities going to burn”? That’s just for starters. Where are the rioters and looters excused by the media? I heard that quote of the nameless woman telling StupidPak that “millions wished him ill”. Don’t they? How is that a DEATH THREAT? That is a statement of fact. By his actions he has consigned millions to the ghetto of enslavement and caused horror to rain on the unborn. He has accrued unto himself the collective disgust and revulsion of millions. He, in terms the left might understand, has brought himself some REALLY BAD KARMA. As for being a pile of human excrement? Well… just another’s opinion. This narrative was created by the left and we are complicit in its shelf life. There is nothing we can do because they create the narrative and the facts to fit. This has been going on for forty years but I think what might be scaring them just a little is that we on the right are starting to act….like they do?? Had we done this decades ago, instead of pretending that the left only wanted their victories here and there, instead of realizing they were going for total control over everything, it might not have grown to this epic proportion. It seems as if we are now fighting a rear guard action and this is but the last gasp of a free people. The sight of Pelosi and her henchmen strolling into the middle of a supposedly “hostile” crowd, head thrown back in a spasm of exultation, holding hands with race pimps in a perverted caricature of a civil rights stand, wielding a symbolic gavel (hammer) was the height of provocation and political theater. Such hostile and threatening crowds that she would risk her life for a cause!!! Can you stand the fraud? I only hope that with the internet and cable we can begin to undo the monstrous lies that have helped to construct the left wing (fascist) defense and playbook and finally shed a great deal of light and truth on how forty years of our lives have been shaped, twisted, and perverted to suit the marxist guerilla cultural wars which have brought us to the brink of oblivion. Yes Congressman Stupak, many of us do wish you ill. You reap what you sow. You cannot do what you have done and expect your victims to tug at their forelocks and go quietly into the night. That you would expect this to take place after the gang rape you were a part of is even more insulting that the actions you decided to take which precipitated these responses. The left has a favorite saying which they use to exonerate all their favorite groups: DON’T BLAME THE VICTIM. We are the victims. ObamaCare IS THE DEATH THREAT. That StupidPak thinks he can commit violence against the citizenry and our beloved constitution and country and still be entitled to gentleness, polite speech, deference, and his accustomed kid glove treatment defies credulity. Not only were we raped, but he wines and lies to hide his guilt. This is an attempt to demoralize, disunite, and discredit us. Calling us racists had a limited result so we are now potential killers? Stand firm and show them we are all acoloytes of Alinsky now. And we have their number now. You never know. Maybe that is the hidden meaning of what they call their death threat. Hey StupidPak, your capitulation on abortion was not only a threat, but the deaths will be real.
#32..I would have to suppose that the ‘breaking point’ would be different for any given individual. That said, sometimes war IS the answer. Armed resistence may become the awful reality in this country. I would hope not, but world history is littered with the fact that when any people are pushed to the limit by their GOVERNMENT, rebellion is a natural result. If the people have the means to resist, it will happen. I think personally, that day will come for me, when a government official comes to my property and demands the surrender of my guns. This administration is already shaping the battle space in preparation for their despotism. Many other events, now unforseen, may speed up this process. Freedom of assembly and speech will come under serious attack. Our liberties are quickly dissolving under this fascistic administration. I also think that any expressions about ‘violence is never the answer’, are quite wrong. The right of this people to overthrow the government for just cause, is also guaranteed. ” Give me liberty or give me death “, has not lost it’s force of meaning.
#52 Tim Smith:
” If the people have the means to resist, it will happen. I think personally, that day will come for me, when a government official comes to my property and demands the surrender of my guns.”
Excuse me, but do you not understand that it is your body, the only piece of property that you formerly owned, that has had a government lien placed against it?
You are no more than a unit of livestock now,(all that is needed is for the government health bureaucrats to staple a plastic tag through your earlobe for their own administrative convenience), with the Fed placing upon you the obligation to insure “your” body.
If you do not, they will punish you. And if you are insubordinate and do not accept their discipline, they will imprison “your” body.
I don’t know about you, but my body is more dear to me than my firearms.
The line has been crossed…and there’s really no other way to put it.
i wonder what percentage of the USA population has come, in the last year, to the beginnings of a true understanding of marxism.
“Real fear? Or political theater?”
I was stunned around Tea Party/Tax Day, last April, to hear David Axelrod on a Sunday morning show painting the tea partiers as fringey wackos.
Around the same time, Janet “Big Sis” Napolitano was doing the domestic terrorist shtick and Nancy P was bloviating about astroturfers and swastikas.
Apparently, such people (Axelrod et al) are frightened by the Truth of the tea party movement and have consciously decided on a concerted effort, a tactic, of using any means possible to discredit it.
In yet another contemptible and despicable move, they’ve graduated from the word war to painting this growing cadre of highly disgruntled Americans as violent, even, it seems, stooping to making up stories about them.
Attempting to present Napolitano’s domestic terrorist wet dream as true.
T/56; clearly they know they’re propagandizing. If they really believed Americans are racist, they’d NEVER have run an African-American for president –they’d have assumed he coul not be elected.
So, they’re lying, and they KNOW they’re lying, and they’re doing it in concert.
All those closed-door, Dem-only meetings? Why violate the C-Span transparency promise if only to discuss and devise open agenda policy-making?
No, the secrecy –and the criticism for the secrecy –are worth it only if the topic is how to keep secret (or deniable) a hidden agenda.
To rise in a hidden agenda front, talented lying –lack of visible shame while saying outrageous things –is paramount –right up there with the optics and the omerta. The two presidents the dems have had in this part of the great con –which probably launched the blow-off phase in 1997 when a guy named Chris Pettit was killed in a snowmobile ‘accident’ –have been above all else, as a senator once said of Bill Clinton, unusually good liars.
All this new leftwing narrative is setting something up –the tea party is marked and targeted for some ruse, you can bet the farm on it. In fact you’ve most likely already bet the farm on it and just don’t know it yet.
Remember, Tim McVeigh probably saved Clinton’s presidency –and the Dems know it. McVeigh may have been serendipity but since this admin seems to have zero qualms about anything and everything, we can expect that atmosphere to be replicated somehow at the right time.
If Obama’s seeming insouciance about reelction in 2012 is due to his already having a bad cop -good cop deal with the Clintonistas to break the country down in a one term rush and then let Hillary come in and let the Dems ‘fix’ it forever, we can look forward to Bill’s profit-motived protectors, the so called Dixie Mafia often blamed for the exceedingly bad luck of possible witnesses to Clinton wrongdoings, and possibly all without any orders or foreknowledge from or by the Clintons at all (just ridding the King of troublesome Thomas a Becketts), to be around still and planning something terrible.
Forewarned is forearmed. God, dear God almighty, will we never be rid of these people?
Charlie Martin,
Great article. I’d say it’s about 10% real threats and about 90% theater (on both sides but mostly DEMs).
On your article “Legacy Media Unimpressed”, you didn’t answer my first question; so I’ll assume that the answer is no (correct me if I’m wrong).
On my second question, your reference does not include latinos. As I stated earlier, Wolfram Alpha includes their portion of the population with whites. So the actual numbers should read ~65% white, ~15% latino, ~13% black, ~4% asian, etc.
And it does affect the question. If only 65% of population is white, why are 99% of the TPP white? Why is this movement so exclusionary? Additionally, why are 2/3 to 3/4 of the TPP male baby boomers/seniors?
Concerning your repeated question (that I’ve answered several times) on my view of an ethnically exclusionary political movement’s lack of credibility; my answer (again) is this: I don’t see how any political movement can claim any kind of credibility if it is ethnically exclusive. If an organization only allows whites, or latinos, or blacks, or asians among its ranks (deliberately or not) I don’t see how you can claim to be credible.
On your counter-question, yes I think that the credibility of organizations like the NAACP and NCLR are in question.
Finally, if you think I’m wrong on this point; can you name any movement in the U.S. that is as exclusionary as the TPP that you can state (with a straight face) is credible?
Charlie, meant to ask, you being a Jewish Cherokee Buddhist, how on earth are you going to pass the tea party phrenology test?
Forewarned is forearmed. God, dear God almighty, will we never be rid of these people?
I think not, they’ve multiplied like fruit flies over a very long time, infested the formerly someshat hallowed halls of the federal government like termites.
They seem to be proliferating, in a lot of sub-forms, a whole phalynx of stupid, I mean really stupid, congresscritters who occasionally make too candid gaffes like admitting healthcare as a move to control the folks (Dingell) or voting no twice when they really mean yes (Reid)
Always strategizing, Chuck Schumer. Always getting it wrong, when she’s not threatening to nationalize some business like “big oil”, Maxine Waters. Just plain dumb, Boxer, Pelosi, Sylvestre Reyes (the guy who didn’t know Sunni from Shi’ite). Lying, lying about Fannie & Freddie, Barney Frank, cheating, Christopher Dodd.
A dearth of statespeople, tho’ I do have heart that some of the relative newcomers to Congress might recognize their job as temporary service as opposed to lifelong entitlement, or some job raising funds for their next go round at election, King & Queenship, with massive taxpayer supplied perks.
Let’s see… 1/2 million to a million peaceful demonstrators at the 9/12 Tea Party in Washington… not a single incident of violence from the Tea Partiers (that I know of; anyone else?) and they picked up their trash as they left. Oh, yes, we are violent extremist right-wing-nuts, all right. But neat ones.
Mr Independent, you’re answering “yes I don’t think a political movement can claim credibility if it’s ‘exclusionary’”. Now, at least you go so far as to say you think the NAACP is covered by that definition too — but given that, I think you’re using a definition of “credible” with which I’m not familiar.
Youre assertion that the tea party movement is “exclusionary” would seem to be contradicted by this Quinnipiac poll, which has:
* 74 percent are Republicans or independent voters leaning Republican;
* 16 percent are Democrats or independent voters leaning Democratic;
* 5 percent are solidly independent;
* 45 percent are men;
* 55 percent are women;
* 88 percent are white;
* 77 percent voted for Sen. John McCain in 2008;
* 15 percent voted for President Barack Obama.
Now, 88 percent white of course means roughly 12 percent black, and considering the margins of error of the poll, that is exactly the makeup of the overall United States. Thus, it would appear that your whole thesis fails anyway.
Buddy, great to see you!
The answer to your question is that it gets even better. As you probably recall, I have both Choctaw and Cherokee ancestors; one of my distant cousins is doing the genealogy thing, and finds that some of the ancestors on my mother’s side of the family show up in the Dawes Rolls as, not Choctaw, but Choctaw Freemen. That is, freed slaves.
In other words it appears that at least one of my relatively close ancestors, a great great grandparent, or one generation further back, was a black.
My Georgia grandfather more or less went bat-you-know-what when he discovered that Mom was a ‘breed. What would he have made of this?
charlie you might would’ve had to explain the F-1 cross to him –then he’d've been proud, eventually, maybe, to have so much o’ that ‘hybrid vigor’ in the clan!
one of my North Louisiana peeps on momma’s side, Gills from Cornwall, married a Cherokee woman, leaving me a 32nd (and nixed out of the Oklahoma oil stipend dangit), so i guess if you ever gather up a hoss raid let me know, i orta go along & lend at least a fraction of a hand with them rascal Utes –
@6. Mr. Independent: – I normally don’t think very highly of your comments but that last one was awsome.
Frat house innuendo – no surprise you thought it was “awsome”. But I’m happy to return the sentiment and note that I’ve always thought you were part of the doucheoisie, actually. Still do. And #59 reaffirms that. Congratulations.
Your incessant, simpering Concern Troll B.S. about the “exclusionary” TEA Party is eclipsed only by the depth of your passive-aggressive ignorance regarding the root cause of skyrocketing health care costs. When we find out that you’re also one of the AGW faithful, that will be strike three.
Odd, it strikes me as odd that folks like mr. independent worry so over the possibility that there may be a new identity group around, what with the fact that we are a hundred years now into that deliberate policy (and determined execution) of splitting us into identity groups known as “Progressivism”.
Yes, more than a little ironic that the environment of race and class division into entitled special pleadings is suddenly become objectionable to the very people –the “progressives” –who have so bent nature into such artificial abstraction in the first place.
Perverse, that it is suddenly all so tsk tsk, the bluenoses having been so vigorously and assiduously at it ever since grand social engineer & wizardly population designer Woodrow Wilson by segregating the Army and by his fulsome praise launching the operatic paean to the KKK and cruel ridiculer of the black race, the perfectly progressively named “Birth of a Nation”, into the first national blockbuster film, which knit together the entire nation into the way of thinking about race therein acted out in what Wilson called “…an experience more real than real”.
John Q, it wasn’t a lie, it was a logical conclusion. If you had been receiving threats you would have thought the same thing. Any one would have.
A friend (just an aquaitance really) on fB illustrates liberal thinking well. She’s been daring ‘friends’ to delete her if they are racists or hateful, or this or that. She ends the post by saying that she means it, ‘this isnt a joke’. As if she’s gonna do something to them if they don’t confess to being racists by deleting her. Obviously she thinks some of her ‘friends’ are stupid enough to step into the trap. Not only is this propaganda theater, it’s a trap that gives the left ammunition to use against us. My ‘friend’ just wants to say ‘I told you so’ but the left in our government, as some have suggested, would like to use that ammo to do more than that. Right now, despite all of their exagerations, they don’t have anything to act on, but if we keep giving them enough rope then we just help them hang us.
Just as it is too early for the government to be calling out the national guard or declaring martial law, it’s a bit early to be dusting off ol’ Betsy. For now, I’ll put my faith in our constitution and those who are defending it in court.
Charlie Martin,
I still don’t understand what is so difficult to understand about my point. Webster’s dictionary defines the word credible as “offering reasonable grounds for being believed”. If you don’t (appear) to believe that latinos, or blacks, or asians, or anyone else who isn’t white, doesn’t belong in your movement, I don’t believe that you can be credible. You can disagree with that position but I don’t understand why that concept is so difficult for you to understand.
On your “counter evidence”, I should point out that the poll that you referred to in post #63, only includes 253 voters who say they are apart of the Tea Party Movement. Let’s forget for the moment that I’ve personally been to TP rallies that collectively have included hundreds of thousands of people (99% of whom were white). The poll you cited had a 6.2 margin of error. So potentially 94% of TPP are white. That supports my position that the TP (deliberately or not) is ethnically exclusionary. Only about 65% of this country is white
http://www.prb.org/Articles/2006/IntheNewsUSPopulationIsNowOneThirdMinority.aspx?p=1U.S.
http://www.census.gov/Press-Release/www/releases/archives/population/010048.html
and yet according to your selective poll 88% to 94% of TPP are white.
Additionally, the poll you cited did not specify that 12% of TPP are black; you appear to have concluded that all on your own. But just for laughs, if 88% of the country is white and 12% is black; what happened to the 15% of lations and the 4% asians who also make up the country? So your poll not only doesn’t contradict my thesis, it actually supports it.
Finally, I asked previously if you could name any group in the USA that is that is as ethnically exclusionary as the TP that you can state (with a straight face) is credible? Have you been able to think of any?
goy
re: #66,
I’d normally say thank you for your post but you probably wouldn’t believe me since this won’t be written on either your blog or the Wikipedia. BTW, I thought so-called libertarians don’t believe in class envy. Just for the record my parents were working-class people and I’ve become financially successful from hard work, while at the same time serving the citizens my country. That includes undeserving ones like you. Have you ever created jobs or served your country? I have my doubts but that’s neither here nor there.
It’s interesting that your “thoughts” on my comments are almost identical to Charlie Martins’. I see you’re still cutting and pasting someone else’s thoughts as your own. I also noticed that you (and others) have not provided as single shred of evidence to disprove my assertions. Charlie Martin has tried but in both instances his evidence has supported my position. Just out of curiosity have you ever attended a TP rally? Was it 99% white? More importantly, did you attend the so-called 9/12 project? I did and 99% of the TPP there were white. Additionally, my beliefs on the root cause of healthcare inflation are shared by advocacy groups, the government, and the industry itself. But of course you think you know better because you wrote so on your blog.
Mr Independent, you’re right in this: I should have said “non-white” rather than black. None the less, you’re point that the tea party movement is “exclusionary” still fails if for “non-white” rather than “black.” It fails independently because of the number of non-whites who were acclaimed speakers at this particular tea party movement event was significant.
Similarly, your notion of what is “credible” appears to include “has the approved specific ethnic mix,” but as you yourself noted, this leads inevitably to the conclusion that neither the National Council of La Raza, nor NAACP, is “credible”. You’re certainly entitled to think so, but I think this idiosyncratic notion of credibility is not widely shared.
Nor do I find the notion that credibility is established by racial characteristics a particularly appealing one.
@70. Mr. Independent: – I’d normally say thank you for your post but you probably wouldn’t believe me since this won’t be written on either your blog or the Wikipedia.
No, it’s much simpler actually. I discount what you post because, like a little kid, you just keep repeating the same baseless drivel over and over and over again, ad nauseam. You then engage in the most transparent of child-like projection by claiming that every response to that drivel amounts to “nuh-uh”.
You’ve been on this myopic and idiotic “exclusionary” kick since at least January. Give it up.
First, you’ve provided no evidence whatsoever in support of the one or two alleged experiences you claim to have had. No one cares what you think you saw at the events you claim you attended. Trust me on that. And more importantly, no one has any responsibility to “explain” or “excuse” what you imagine you saw there, much less address the implications you fantasize as a result.
Here’s the thing: if a policy position (or a movement based on that position) is credible, then it makes no difference what its racial component is… UNLESS – like you – one is trapped in a racist mindset (or pretending to be so trapped, as you clearly are, so that you can project your pretense of racism onto those you seek to discredit). Neither racial homogeneity NOR racial diversity is a prerequisite for credibility. That’s not going to change regardless how long you persist in trying to “guilt” others into responding to your lame, racist fallacy.
- BTW, I thought so-called libertarians don’t believe in class envy.
Maybe you should find some so-called libertarians and… hmmm… what’s the phrase… oh – ask them.
- Just for the record my parents were working-class people and I’ve become financially successful from hard work, while at the same time serving the citizens my country.
Right. Same with these guys. Or so they claim.
- That includes undeserving ones like you.
Ah, the transparently imperious leftist mindset: always determining FOR OTHERS who is “entitled” and who isn’t.
- Have you ever created jobs or served your country?
Both. The former, twice, both in times of economic downturn and the latter in a time of war. Why do you ask?
- I have my doubts but that’s neither here nor there.
Oh, so you really had no reason for asking – other than trying to project the notion that you’re morally superior based on delusions of your own self-importance and your own internally manufactured (i.e., fantasized) “doubts”. Got it.
- It’s interesting that your “thoughts” on my comments are almost identical to Charlie Martins’.
They say great minds think alike. In this case I’m inclined to agree.
– I see you’re still cutting and pasting someone else’s thoughts as your own.
That’s what you’re fantasizing, chum. What you actually see is more than one critical thinker who’s got your collectivist, racist number.
- I also noticed that you (and others) have not provided as single shred of evidence to disprove my assertions.
No one bears any responsibility for disproving YOUR assertions, sport. It’s up to you to actually demonstrate that your assertions are (a) valid and (b) have any significance whatsoever. As anyone can plainly see using a little simple logic, you have failed, consistently, on both counts.
- Additionally, my beliefs on the root cause of healthcare inflation are shared by advocacy groups, the government, and the industry itself.
So you claim. Absent evidence. And referencing various factions, ALL of whom have one thing in common: they couldn’t care less what the American Taxpayer or the health care consumer has to shell out for health care as long as their agenda is met. This is a perfect example of why both Appeal to the Majority and Appeal to Authority are considered fallacies.
- But of course you think you know better because you wrote so on your blog.
I took the time to examine the issue objectively, which is more than any of the above have ever honestly done. They have no motivation to do so and that’s reflected in their policy proposals – NONE of which will work to bring down the cost of health care for all using a restored free market. But the market – like life – will find a way. And until it’s completely crushed under the socially suicidal yoke of socialism, it always will.
Of all of the commodity necessities of life, one is not like the others. All have experienced extensive federal regulation and explosive technological innovation. All commodities have remained relatively affordable over the last 60 years. All but one: health care. That is the one thing that is not like the others. It is different in two ways: (a) its cost has begun to exceed the ability of some to afford it without spreading the burden of that cost onto others; and (b) we consistently and pervasively abuse insurance – a tool intended solely to mitigate financial risk – to pay for it. As a result, health care costs have skyrocketed since the early ’70s despite the fact that the percentage of so-called “uninsured” has remained virtually constant throughout that entire time. That you can’t comprehend this glaringly simple notion is neither particularly surprising, nor especially significant.
buddy larsen
re: post #67,
You’re missing the point. The problem I’m discussing here, isn’t with ideology, identity, or the emergence of new groups. If you were to read the comments from the original article: http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/tens-of-thousands-protest-obamacare-in-d-c-legacy-media-unimpressed/
you would have noticed my comment about supporting a lot of the principals that the TPP claim to believe in. I don’t question the TPP’s views but their credibility.
I find it interesting that you (seem) to be comfortable with the emergence of new identity groups, yet you do not (seem) to have any problem with a movement that is 99% exclusive of all ethnic groups that are not white.
re: post #72
Well I see you’re still cutting and pasting my ‘nuh-uh’ comments about you.
Actually I haven’t been on an exclusionary kick since January; but the TP has been on one since its very beginning.
On your point that I have not provided any evidence proving my assertions about the ethnic exclusivity of the TP, that is true. But only because every time I’ve commented on this fact, other commenter’s have always agreed with my observations. Perhaps you should have read all of the comments made in the following article that you cited:
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-unbearable-elitism-of-david-brooks/
And if you or no one else cares about what actually happened at these rallies, why bother responding? As far a responsibility goes, I never stated that anyone here has any obligation to answer for the actions of the TP. I’m simply stating what happened.
http://michellemalkin.com/2010/03/20/day-of-defiance-nationwide-protests-as-slaughter-house-rushes-through-demcare/
http://blog.timesunion.com/capitol/archives/24164/q-poll-tea-party-movement-leans-waaay-republican/
I you disagree, the prove it.
On your next point, you don’t seem to understand the concept of my point. I support a lot of the issues that the TP claims to believe in. I’m questioning the TP’s credibility not their policies.
On your next point, actually I was passing judgment on you, not deciding what I think you’re entitled to. REB’s/Conservatives are always passing judgment on others, so you shouldn’t have a problem with it.
On your next point, you claim to have served my country in a time of war. Was it in the military and if so, what war and what unit?
On your next point, I stated I have my doubts because I find it hard to believe that you could be successful in business and not understand basic economic concepts. Additionally, your comments don’t sound like you could be someone interested in serving anything other than himself.
On your next comment, no I think you just cut and pasted his comments; like you’ve done with mine.
On your next comment, I see you’ve taken a page from Glen Beck. Someone points out some undisputable facts and your only response is you’re a racist. Pointing out that 99% of TPP are white is not racist. That coward’s game doesn’t bother me; it just reflects poorly on you.
On your next comment, I explained earlier why not and have corrected that problem. Additionally, Bill O’Reilly commented on this issued after the so-called 9/12 project. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHTEnAjWv70
Say what you will about Fox “News”, O’Reilly is a real journalist and he doesn’t use his own blog as evidence to support his reporting.
On your last comments, I’ve already explained in detail who and what supports my position on healthcare inflation. They include consumer advocacy groups, the government, and the industry itself. You can disagree with those groups all you want but without evidence, it’s just your opinion. And a link to your blog is not evidence.
Finally, as always your comments never cease to make me laugh. So please continue.
Charlie Martin
re: post #71,
Even based on the extremely small number of TPP that were sampled in the poll you cited in post #63, 88% – 94% of TPP are white. That poll reaffirms my position. Only 65% of Americans are white; not 88%, not 94%, and not 99%. On your secondary point, the “significant” number of speakers that were non-white does not disprove my point either. Michael Steale is the chairman of the RNC. Is he representative of the GOP? No. But to the GOP’s credit, 20% – 25% of the REB party is non-white. But not the TP.
On your third point, I do NOT think that a movement can only be credible when there is a specific ethnic mix. But I do think that a movement is not credible if it is ethnically exclusive. If the ethnic makeup of the TP resembled the REB party, we wouldn’t be having this discussion. But the fact remains, every single time I’ve attended a TP event, 99% of the TPP have been white. Bill O’Reilly commented on this issued after the so-called 9/12 project. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHTEnAjWv70
On your fourth point, I agree with you. The idea is not only unappealing, it’s absurd. But that’s not what I’m stating. Credibility is NOT established by racial quotas but (in my opinion) credibility in lost with ethnic exclusivity.
Finally, even though I completely disagree with your position on this matter I appreciate the way in which you’ve responded. Unlike some of the posters on this thread you didn’t engage in lying, stawmen, on childish attacks. Perhaps, things will change with the TP. As I stated in the original article, I agree with a lot of their financial concerns but until all of my countrymen are welcome in their movement, I can’t support them.
Mr Independent, you say:I find it interesting that you (seem) to be comfortable with the emergence of new identity groups, yet you do not (seem) to have any problem with a movement that is 99% exclusive of all ethnic groups that are not white.
The poll says 12 percent of the tea party movement is non-white.
You’re still arguing from a counter-factual. It is not the case that the tea party movement is 99% white, so any conclusion you draw from that as evidence is simply wrong.
Charlie Martin,
The poll said there was a margin of error of 6.2%. That means 88% – 94%. Never mind the fact that it was a very small poll. Additionally, I was actually at the rally and it was 99%. Furthermore, I was also at the so called 9/12 project and it was also 99% white.
I’m not arguing from a counter-factual. I’m arguing from personal observation. The poll you cited had only 253 TPP. The two rallies that I described had at least 100,000 TPP present. Look, you seem like an honest person but no matter how much you wish it wasn’t so (I certainly do) the TP rallies and I think the TP and a whole is 99% white. That’s not America and I won’t support it.
@74. Mr. Independent: – … you’re still cutting and pasting my ‘nuh-uh’ …
It’s called “mocking” you.
- … I haven’t been on an exclusionary kick since January; …
This post from January demonstrates that you are in fact a liar. As such, it’s clear you’re not posting here in order to have any sort of rational discussion. So we’ll treat the rest of your drivel accordingly…
- On your point that I have not provided any evidence proving my assertions about the ethnic exclusivity that is true.
Of course it’s true. No one needs you to tell them that. Feel free to bring the issue up again when you have some actual evidence.
- I support a lot of the issues that the TP claims to believe in. I’m questioning the TP’s credibility …
That they “claim” to believe in? LOL!!!! Congratulations. You just outed yourself. Again. This is the classic Concern Troll modus operandi. My guess: you’re either associated in some way with “Libertarian Activist” or you’re both sock puppets animated by the same troll.
- Pointing out that 99% of TPP are white is not racist.
And of course that’s not what I wrote. But then, you’ve already established yourself as a liar, it’s no surprise you’d lie about this too.
It’s simple. Pay attention. Your racism is inherent in your claim that the TEA Party lacks credibility solely due to its racial composition. That’s the very definition of racist, bub.
So you’ve established yourself as a liar AND a racist. Care to go for three?
goy,
Nice try with the quotes but like any typical liar you’re taking my comments out of context. The first one unedited is: “Actually I haven’t been on an exclusionary kick since January; but the TP has been on one since its very beginning.” I never wrote that I didn’t write that post. The second one is: “On your point that I have not provided any evidence proving my assertions about the ethnic exclusivity of the TP, that is true. But only because every time I’ve commented on this fact, other commenter’s have always agreed with my observations.” And in post #74 I provided photos, video, and a poll proving my claims. So the question is, why haven’t you provided any counter evidence? Could it be because you can’t? I think so.
Also, I didn’t state that you wrote “Pointing out that 99% of TPP are white is not racist.” Look at post #74; there are no quotation marks around the comment.
Additionally I’ve never once stated that the TP lacks credibility solely due to its racial composition. What I have stated is that is ethnic exclusivity undermines its credibility.
Furthermore, I noticed that you didn’t answer my question about your alleged “service” to my country. My questions were very simple: did you serve in the military, if so during what war, and in what unit. I suspect you didn’t answer because you lying, again. In fact I’d be willing to bet that you’ve read posts I’ve written exposing others clowns on this website that have claimed to be veterans and then couldn’t answer very simple questions about their service. Go ahead and try and make something up. I’ve been in the military for the past thirteen years; you won’t be able to lie to me.
Finally, all your ignorance about the TP aside, you really are pathetic. You’re not just a liar and a coward, you’re a fraud. But please keep the laughs rolling. How’s that for round three?
P.S. If you do decide to respond, be sure and include proof that that photos and video I provided above do NOT represent the TP.
I’m not arguing from a counter-factual. I’m arguing from personal observation.
Yup. Now, propose to me how you know that the people you saw near you were a representative sample either of the whole crowd, or of the tea party movement as a whole.
The poll you cited had only 253 TPP. The two rallies that I described had at least 100,000 TPP present.
And you saw every one of them?
That’s not America and I won’t support it.
Okay with me.
@79. Mr. Independent: – … like any typical liar …
LOL!!! This is the quasi-adult version of just mindlessly mimicking everything I write after I write it, right? What are you… nine? You really want your third claim to fame to be “child”? OK, no problem, it suits you: Liar, Racist, Child – all based on the content of your own Concern Troll posts. I’d say that pretty well sums up the left as a whole, actually. Good job, Concern Troll!
- The first one unedited is: “Actually I haven’t been on an exclusionary kick since January; but the TP has been on one since its very beginning.”
“Edited” or “unedited”, the meaning doesn’t change. You can include as much of the complete sentence as you like. As the linked post proves, you have been on this kick since January. To claim you “haven’t been” is, simply put, a lie. QED. In fact, it’s such a stupid, easily verified lie that one wonders why you would persist in repeating it, and confirming your deceit.
- “… other commenter’s have always agreed with my observations.”
Translation: Waaaaaaah!!!!!
I’m very sorry to burst the widdle bubble they helped you create, little child, but I’m not really interested in what other commenters have written. I’m sure that smarts, but you’re just going to have to learn to deal. Try gummy bears.
- What I have stated is that is ethnic exclusivity undermines its credibility.
Wow, another lie. I guess that’s par… for a child.
Here’s a direct quote from up above (and eliding the preface doesn’t change its meaning): “…I think the TP and a whole is 99% white. That’s not America and I won’t support it.” Sorry sonny, but saying you don’t support a group solely because of its racial composition – as you have right here – is Straight Up Racism. Read what you wrote carefully: YOU THINK the TEA Party is 99% white. And what YOU THINK is making YOU THINK they’re “exclusionary” (the code word for racist). And so YOU THINK you don’t want to support them.
Of course that’s only the specious, convoluted idiocy you’re using to try to paint supporters of the TEA Party as racists. Tell us all again what they “claim” to believe…
The inescapable conclusion: Concern Troll. QED.
- … I noticed that you didn’t answer my question about your alleged “service” to my country.
This is going to come as a really serious shock, I’m sure, and I’m sorry to have to put you through the emotional anguish, but I have a news flash for you. So steel yourself.
…
Ready?
…
— I’m actually not obligated to answer your questions. —
You can “suspect” (read: fantasize) all you like (just as you would, of course, if I answered), but just like your inability to understand the simple, obvious economics behind skyrocketing health care costs when there’s nothing substantive acting to keep them under control, your fantasies really aren’t all that significant.
It’s tough to take, I’m guessing, but better I should tell you than you hear it from someone you care about (or, worse, someone YOU THINK cares about you). Children can be traumatized for life by such things.
Charlie Martin
In every instance that I’ve attended a TP rally, I’ve always stayed for at least four hours. In the case of the two DC protests I attended, I stayed all day. Not in one place but constantly walking among the protestors. These were not small town hall meetings. In the case of the so called 9/12 project, there were tens of thousands of TPP; probably 100,000 or more. Are you honestly trying to tell me that in a city where over half of the population is black, it’s normal for me not to see anyone black joining with the TPP? The poll that you referenced earlier indicated (with the margin of error) that potentially 94% of TPP are white. The photos and video that I linked above are from Michelle Malkin’s and Bill O’Reilly’s outlets. You have attempted to dispute my observations but the evidence you’ve provided to back your claims has ended up supporting mine. This may be a very uncomfortable fact to accept but the TP is made up almost entirely of white people. That’s exclusionary. Instead of trying to deny that fact, perhaps instead you should be trying to change it.
@82. Mr. Independent: – In every instance that I’ve attended a TP rally, I’ve always stayed for at least four hours.
You just make this B.S. up as you go. Amazing.
- … the TP is made up almost entirely of white people.
That’s your claim. And it’s irrelevant.
- That’s exclusionary.
That’s your opinion. Also irrelevant.
- … you should be trying to change it.
Perhaps you should abandon this fantasy you have the moral authority to tell others what they should and should not be trying to do.
goy
On your first point, I never stated that I didn’t write the post you quoted in post #72. In fact I cited that very article in post #74 to demonstrate your ignorance and dishonesty. Not once in any of my posts have I ever stated that I didn’t write that post in January. Your comment specifically stating so is an indisputable lie. I’ve being writing about the ethnic exclusivity of the TP since the so called 9/12 project. What is made very clear in post #79 is that I haven’t been writing about the TP’s ethnic exclusivity just since January and the TP appears to have been ethnically exclusive since its very beginning. Obviously you’re not just a liar and ignorant but apparently you’re also illiterate.
On your next point, the fact still remains that virtually all TPP are white. Should I have included photos and video to prove my observations? Yes. I’ve since corrected that error. And Charlie Martin was even kind enough to provide a poll that indicates (with the margin of error) that potentially 94% of TPP are white.
On your next point, my comment “What I have stated is that is ethnic exclusivity undermines its credibility” is most certainly not a lie. I’ve stated a version of that comment several times.
On your next point, as I’ve stated earlier I’ve never stated that you are obligated to answer any of my questions. However, you have stated on this and other articles that you cannot prove a point by simply stating ‘prove me wrong’, you must provide evidence. In fact, in post #78 you stated “Feel free to bring the issue up again when you have some actual evidence”. I did that in post #74. Courtesy of Malkin and O’Reilly. So where is your evidence disproving mine?
Additionally, you stated in post #72 “Both. The former, twice, both in times of economic downturn and the latter in a time of war. Why do you ask?”. I’ve asked you several times since to specify when and with what unit did you serve. You made the comment. If you really were a veteran you shouldn’t have a problem answering that question. But I suspect that you’re not a veteran. I think you just made that up. How pathetic. It’s bad enough that you were too cowardly to serve your country; it’s even worse that you’re now trying to lie about doing so.
On your next point, it’s not racist to point out that I will not support a movement that is exclusionary. Nor is it racist to point out that a particular movement is ethnically exclusionary. I know I don’t want to support them because they are exclusionary. Every TP rally I’ve been has been 99% white. Charlie Martin provided a poll that indicates (with the margin of error) that 94% of TPP are white. The TP movement is ethnically exclusionary. I’ve proved evidence to back up my observations. If you have proof to the contrary, show us. Otherwise, you’re just another Glen Beck crying racist anytime someone points out an uncomfortable fact to you.
Finally, as I’ve stated earlier you’re always good for a round of laughter. Please keep the laughs rolling. Remember, I’ve provided evidence to support my claims; so don’t forget to provide you “counter-evidence”. And your blog does not qualify.
@84. Mr. Independent: – … I never stated that I didn’t write … In fact I cited … Not once in any of my posts have I ever stated … Your comment specifically stating … I’ve being writing … I haven’t been writing …
I’ll bet you actually think all that glurge qualifies as “argument”, don’t you. Heh. You lied. Learn to live with it.
-… the fact still remains that virtually all TPP are white.
And only a racist would care.
… as I’ve stated earlier I’ve never stated … you have stated … you stated … Additionally, you stated … I’ve asked you … I suspect … I think you just made that up. …
*yawn* Your silly, childish fantasies ⊄ my concern.
- … it’s not racist to point out that I will not support a movement that is exclusionary.
It’s racist when your only criterion is racial composition.
- Nor is it racist to point out that a particular movement is ethnically exclusionary.
You haven’t pointed out anything of the sort. All you’ve done is project your own racism onto the TEA Party and, in the process, exposed your own delusional assumptions. Those assumptions are based 100% on the racial composition of the group, nothing more.
YOU ASSUME that racial composition demonstrates an exclusionary attitude. But that’s just your own assumption, which is not based on any stated policy or any survey of the group on their attitudes toward race as a facet of membership in the group. So what you claim is “exclusionary” is in fact all in your head, and is nothing more than your delusional assumption based on what you claim to see. Since – by your very own admission – racial composition is the ONLY criterion you’re using to form your assumptions, you are in fact a racist. QED.
What’s more, you don’t (or you claim, as any Concern Troll would claim, not to) see that your assumptions are based 100% on racial composition. That makes you not only a racist, but an obtuse, arrogant, annoying racist. And a liar (see above). And a child (ditto).
- I know I don’t want to support them because they are exclusionary.
Then don’t. It’s that simple. Was someone holding a gun to your head, telling you that you had to support them? Somehow I doubt it. Since your personal assumptions about what you claim is an “exclusionary” nature are based 100% on racial composition – which makes you a racist – I’m sure they aren’t interested in your support anyway. Problem solved.
85. Now that that’s settled, the rest of us would like to hear about your service, goy. Accusing someone of feigning veteran status is a very serious charge, so you ought to answer it to put to rest whether you are guilty of it, or rather if Mr. Independent is a false accuser. Leave dodging the questions to Obama, because it only makes you look guilty when you refuse to answer a simple question.
22. Actually they blamed it on the Communists. Kristalnacht was unrelated to the Reischtag fire. Then again, it makes little difference on whom they blamed it. What matters is that there’s plenty of reason to believe the National Socialist Democrats of America Party would pull a similar stunt.
@86. myth buster: – the rest of us would like to hear about your service … so you ought to answer it to put to rest whether you are guilty of it, or rather if Mr. Independent is a false accuser.
The “rest of us”… meaning… you? Heh… and give Mr. Underpandent an excuse for another endless pissing contest, as s/he proceeds to make follow-up accusations, demands evidence and “proof”… as if that were possible in this forum?
Thanks, I’ll pass.
Anyone who needs to know my backstory can just go read it on my site.
32 Fen: When there is some reasonable chance of winning. There are a great many who now feel this way. People blurt it out all the time now. How do you expect people to feel when they don’t consent to the form of government to which they are subjected? Would we secure our freedom by force if we could? Who wouldn’t? But that is a big hypothetical unfortunately. Maybe someone has a shorter trigger and will go rebel before there is an apparent chance of winning (and while we still have some viable peaceful options). We may regard them as imprudent but how could we find fault with them morally any more than we could with Locke, Jefferson or Washington?
goy,
First of all where is your evidence disproving the photos and video I provided earlier?
On your first point, once again you’re cutting and pasting my comments out of context. Try as hard as you want, you won’t be able to change the fact that I’ve shown you to be a liar.
On your next point, I’m not stating a racial criterion for anything. I’ve written so many times. What I have stated is that the TP rallies have been ethnically exclusive.
On your next point, actually I have demonstrated the above as being true. Once again, I suggest you look at the photos and video above.
On your next point, it’s your assumption that a movement that is 99% exclusionary of all non-white ethnic groups is not in fact exclusionary. I stated several times that the TPP’s ethnic exclusivity may not be deliberate but the movement is still ethnically exclusive. I would once again suggest you actually read my comments. I have never once made any comments on the TP’s attitude. I’ve only commented on their publicly stated policies and their ethnic exclusivity.
Furthermore, advocating for ethnic inclusivity is completely incompatible with racism. Your assertions otherwise are not only absurd but defy simple logic. Advocating for ethnic exclusivity is racism. Ask yourself, between the two of us; who has been the only one advocating against exclusivity? It wasn’t you. Does that make you a racist?
Additionally, you should probably ask someone who understands Latin to explain to you the meaning of “quod erat demonstrandum”. You don’t seem to understand the concept.
Finally, you’ve made it perfectly clear that you are not just a liar, a coward, and a fraud; but you’re also not interested in actual discussion. I’ve asked you several times the provide evidence to disprove mine and you have refused. More importantly, you have claimed (I think falsely) to be a veteran, and have refused to state when you served and with what unit. Unless you can answer those questions about you’re so called “service” to my country; do not bother responding to any of my comments. If you do, you’ll just be ignored.
@90. Mr. Independent: – …where is your evidence disproving the photos and video I provided earlier?
I never claimed to need any. Everything required to demonstrate that you’re a racist has been cheerfully provided BY YOU, right in your own incessant, redundant, convoluted posts. Your photos and video are irrelevant, because the TEA Party could be comprised 100% of any race or ethnicity and your ASSUMPTIONS – based as they are, solely on racial composition – would still make YOU a racist. It’s an inescapable, undeniable FACT that is beautiful in its simplicity, really.
You claim the TEA Party is “exclusionary”. But have you seen TEA Party members actually “exclude” anyone? No. Instead, you look at the ONLY thing you want to know about them – their racial composition – and you ASSUME they’ve excluded “certain” people, and that they’re therefore “exclusionary”. That makes you a racist. It’s painful to hear, I’m sure. That’s why I keep repeating it.
- … it’s your assumption that a movement that is 99% exclusionary of all non-white ethnic groups is not in fact exclusionary.
As usual, you have this backward. You’re making a claim that the TEA Party is “exclusionary”. You’re making that claim based solely on the racial composition of the people YOU claim to have personally seen at TEA Party events. Now you’re telling me to disprove that claim? Sorry, spud, but it doesn’t work that way. YOU are the one who’s making ASSUMPTIONS. YOU need to back them up with something OTHER THAN your perception of the TEA Party’s racial composition.
Meanwhile, I have not made ANY assumption at all. I have no reason to. I could care less what the racial composition of the TEA Party is. They could be 100% Hmong for all I care. That’s why I AM NOT THE ONE posting Concern Troll B.S. in an attempt to discredit TEA Party supporters, YOU are.
Pay attention: YOU are ASSUMING an exclusionary character based solely on the racial composition of the group. YOU are ASSUMING they’re exclusionary because YOU THINK their racial composition MAKES them exclusionary. That’s not only circular reasoning, it’s racist circular reasoning.
Other than racial composition, you have NO other evidence on which to base YOUR idiotic claim. No manifesto. No mission statement. No survey data. No web site. No application form for TEA Party membership that includes a check box for “race”. No tawdry reports of someone being asked to leave a TEA Party event because they’re the “wrong color”. Nothing. Not even an MP3 with a collection of anecdotal discussions involving actual members indicating in the slightest way that they are “exclusionary”.
The ONLY thing you’re basing YOUR ASSUMPTION on is YOUR perception of the TEA Party’s racial composition. That makes you a racist.
Now, you’re apparently expecting me to disprove YOUR ASSUMPTION. That makes you a racist, and an idiot.
- Furthermore, advocating for ethnic inclusivity is completely incompatible with racism.
You have NO EVIDENCE of the TEA Party members actually “advocating for ethnic exclusivity”. You also have NO EVIDENCE that I have advocated for it either. I have NO OPINION on the TEA Party’s racial composition. All you have are YOUR ASSUMPTIONS, which are based SOLELY on racial composition. That makes you a racist. Now you’re trying to project your ASSUMPTIONS onto ME. That makes you a racist, and mentally disturbed.
…do not bother responding to any of my comments.
Here – try this: take a break for ten minutes and do not bother breathing.
- … you’ll just be ignored.
Right. I smell another lie.
91 I too would like to you the answers the questions about your military service. 86 has it right. If you continue to dodge the questions, you only look guilty.
@92. The Last Don:- I too would like to you the answers the questions about your military service.
Was that supposed to be a sentence?
- 86 has it right. If you continue to dodge the questions, you only look guilty.
Guilty of what? Laughing at a Concern Troll who thinks he can demand personal information in an open forum on the internet?
Look, d!psh!t, if you’ll try pretending for a moment that you’re not a seven-year-old and that you’re capable of thinking this through, I’ll try to pretend that you’re not a sock puppet, and explain things to you. Okay?
Ready?
First, Mr. Underpantent doesn’t have any authority whatsoever to “demand” personal information.
Second, there is NO answer that can possibly satisfy this question – at least not for anyone with half a brain or more…
I could post an extensive history of my enlistment, MOS, training, weapons qualifications, medals, awards, rank, duty stations, years of service and discharge. What would that prove? Nothing. Because I could ALSO post a completely fictional history based on others’ service. Anyone WHO HAS EVER ACTUALLY SERVED in the armed forces would KNOW this.
So how, exactly, are you going to verify which is which?
Do you honestly think I’m just going to hand out my name or my SS# or something so you can verify it all? Does Mr. Underpantent?
And if you can’t verify ANY of it – which of course you can’t – then of what possible value is that information to you? Absolutely none. See how manifestly stupid? Don’t make me giggle with your “you only look guilty” B.S.
You are… I mean… Mr. Underpantent is only interested in drawing attention away from his own blatant racism, so he’s trying to change the subject. Epic fail.
93 The name calling is not necessary. All I and others have asked for is to for answer the questions about your military service.
myth buster / The Last don,
First of all, thank you for your posts. I think it is incredibly disrespectful to all of our country’s service members and veterans when someone like ‘goy’ lies about being a veteran. Now everyone on this website will no that he really is a fraud.
To begin with, it’s important to point out it was ‘goy’ who insisted that he/she had served in the military (post #72). On several occasions ‘goy’ has demanded prove for positions I have stated. On every occasion I have provided such information. When ‘goy’ then stated that he is a veteran, I asked him two very simple questions: when and with what unit did he/she serve? ‘goy’ has refused and still refuses to answer those questions.
The reason I asked those questions was to catch him in a lie and he has done so even though he/she probably doesn’t know it yet. In post #93, ‘goy’ wrote “I could post an extensive history of my enlistment, MOS, training, weapons qualifications, medals, awards, rank, duty stations, years of service and discharge.” And “Do you honestly think I’m just going to hand out my name or my SS# or something so you can verify it all?”
On his second comment, I should like to point out that a service member does not normally use his/her social security number in the course of their duties. For at least the past 60 years uniformed service members have had what’s known as a service registration number. That unique number stays with the service member for their entire career. The new term that is used today is called an EMPLID; which stands for employee identification. Any real veteran would know this. But since ‘goy’ doesn’t use any sources of information other than his blog or the Wikipedia, he/she does know that.
On his first comment, there are several mistakes he made that would only be made by someone pretending to be a veteran. Stating that he/she could post a history of his MOS and training, doesn’t make sense. MOS stands for Military Occupational Specialty. That’s what someone in the Army is trained to do. Why state so twice? ‘goy’ did so because he’s lying about being a veteran. Stating that he/she could post a history of their medals and awards also does make sense. In the military, awards are referred to as decorations and commendations, not awards. The reason being, that when a service member is recognized for their service, that decoration or commendation is earned, not awarded. Also, the majority of decorations are ribbons; the rest are badges. Medals are worn on formal dress uniforms in lieu of ribbons. A real veteran would know this.
I’ve caught other clowns pretending to be veterans before. Their behavior is almost always predictable. First they claim that some absurd position is valid and when asked for proof they respond with something like “I know because I’m a veteran”. When asked very simple questions about their service they refuse to answer and then get angry. Does any of this sound familiar? You see ‘goy’ is not just a clown, coward, fraud, and a liar. He/she is also what is known in the Army as a PX Solider. That’s someone who just buys decorations that he/she hasn’t earned and wears them.
@Mr. Independent – First of all, thank you for your posts.
Thanking “The Last Don” is a bit of a stretch… rather recursive. You do realize that sock puppets are kind of old news, yes?
- I think it is incredibly disrespectful to all of our country’s service members and veterans when someone like ‘goy’ lies …
Clearly, you don’t understand this, but you have no evidence of a lie, Concern Troll. YOU made an ASSUMPTION with nothing but your own self-delusions to back it up.
Once again we see that you’ve posted a laundry list of claims without a single shred of evidence to back ANY of it up. So, let’s see how well you did…
OOPS! All we need to do is check this:
- … I should like to point out that a service member does not normally use his/her social security number in the course of their duties. For at least the past 60 years uniformed service members have had what’s known as a service registration number.
Really? SRSLY!??! Heh. Heheheh. HAHAHAHAHA…
PAY ATTENTION MR. UNDERPANTENT: here’s where everyone learns how COMPLETELY FULL OF SH!T YOU ARE…
All we have to do is check with the National Personnel Records Center in St. Louis regarding your “revelation”. We’ll see how you wasted the last few days “researching” this topic in a lame and desperate attempt to come off sounding (in your head, at least) like a vet. According to them…
“The military services discontinued using the service number as an identifier and began using the social security number on the following dates:
Branch of Service / Date of Changeover
Army and Air Force / July 1, 1969
Navy and Marine Corps / January 1, 1972
Coast Guard / October 1, 1974″
ANYONE who’s actually served in the U.S. Armed Forces in the last 40 years would know this. Which, of course, is why I referred to it earlier, correctly, and you completely screwed the pooch, stupidly.
Any vet would also know that in the Army, your MOS is your job. You have to get training for that job. Duh.
And yes, the Army does refer to them as AWARDS, d!psh!t. You’d know that if you’d bothered to actually look it up instead of just making sh!t up.
Oh, and since you keep bringing up WikiPedia for some reason, I decided to check there too just for laughs. Even that steaming pile of crap gets this one right, where you don’t have a clue:
“The U.S. Armed Forces has used the Social Security number as an identification number for the Army and Air Force since July 1, 1969, the Navy and Marine Corps since January 1, 1972, and the Coast Guard since October 1, 1974. Previously, the United States military used a much more complicated system of service numbers.”
Now, I’m sure after all this we’ll find out that when you were writing “my country”, you weren’t referring to the USA. Sorry, that one’s not gonna fly.
You know, I’ve seen some flaming @$$h0le slimeballs in my day, but you may very well have just created a whole new category of slimeball.
Now go give Daddy back his laptop. Tell him you’ve been using it to p!ss off the adults, and need a good spanking.
Run along, troll, you’re outed.
Again.