Helen Thomas’ Exquisite ‘Weimar Moment’ Reflects Progressive America
I have long been acquainted with the progressive “good people” who routinely go to those interfaith and church-sponsored lectures on the Middle East. They are compassionate in the extreme for Arabs who were displaced by the Arab-initiated war of 1948. They can wax eloquently on the history of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict with information taken right off the Saudi embassy’s web page. And they have become self-proclaimed experts on the differences between U.S. generated “grants” and “loans” to Israel.
I have never yet heard them show compassion for an Israeli child killed by a suicide bomber or concern for the people of Sderot living in a perpetual state of siege. Somehow they sing in a chorus where everything Israel does is wrong and everything the Arabs do can be rationalized or justified.
The “good people” don’t know that Palestinian nationalism arose as a reaction to Zionism and that Arabs calling themselves “Palestinians” only occurred in 1968 when Yassir Arafat replaced Ahmed Shukairy as head of the Palestine Liberation Organization, which previously had been a front for Egypt’s hegemonic adventurism. Shukairy himself said that everyone knows that Palestine is nothing but southern Syria. Ironically, Palestinian nationalism follows Zionism by nearly a century, but don’t mention that at the peace and justice sponsored pot luck. It doesn’t settle well with the notion of Palestine as occupied land.
Helen Thomas’ candor reminded me of Marge Schott, the often indiscreet late owner of the Cincinnati Reds, who was quoted as saying that Hitler “was good in the beginning, but went too far.” An interview with Schott could produce other quotes that generated national outrage, like her condescending and racist reference to her “million-dollar n*****s.” Yet in much of Cincinnati, where a long strain of racism persisted, people tacitly supported Schott because she said what they thought and felt but were afraid to voice. Similarly, I fear it is more than her long career that generated such active collegial support for Thomas.
We live in an age where the media seem to conveniently forget that the blockade of Hamasistan is legal and Hamas has declared a war of ultimate destruction against Israel. The media has declared the blockade an impediment to peace and lionized the club-swinging and knife-wielding terrorists aboard the Turkish-flagged Marmara as “peace activists.” Reuters has just been caught again falsifying photos, this time cropping a knife from the hand of a Palestinian terrorist standing over a bleeding Israeli commando, whose blood was also cropped. After all, knives, clubs, and blood don’t go with Reuters’ view of “peace activists.” And much of the media have conveniently forgotten the difference between propaganda and journalism.
So an independent Jewish state trying to adhere to the principles of liberal democracy amid a sea of kingdoms and despots bent on its destruction does not sit well with the UN, the peace and justice crowd, or the mainstream media. In Berkeley, the only city outside the Vatican with its own foreign policy, there is debate about whether to condemn Israel for its actions in stopping the Marmara. There will be no debate over the forty-seven South Korean sailors killed by North Korea, the 140 Muslims gunned down by Chinese riot police, or the everyday violations of human rights in the world of Sharia.
Helen Thomas spoke what a vast number of people think: the Jews should get the hell out of Palestine. After all, those “good people” at the progressive church potlucks believe Jews are going to hell anyway. What difference does it make if they get there a little sooner?
We are being lynched, the ”progressive” mob is no different than a lynch mob, that’s justice, progressive-style. This has nothing to do with facts, rational analysis, reasoned arguments. If you don’t like the analogy to a lynch mob, then think of it as a pogrom on an international scale. What we are really seeing is the setting of the stage for another genocide.
Yes, well, let it be known for the record that we are not all preparing for a pogrom. I am a Catholic, and irritated as I was by the author’s point about St. Mary’s, etc., I understand his broader argument and think he is right. Most Catholic churches aren’t like that – remember, we are frequently targetted for our refusal to play the progressivist game. We are instructed to pray for a “just and lasting peace in the Holy Land,” which certainly includes – whatever else – a safe homeland for the Jews in their ancestral country. I do not think many of us have any love for Hamas – at least not at my parish.
“Lynch mob, anti Semites, pogrom, Holocaust, self-hating Jews, terrorists, genocide etc, etc, etc……..” And he is talking about “facts, rational analysis, reasoned arguments”
Almost had me fooled Terry!
Not all church-goers believe this rhetoric. Christian Zionists have a totally different attitude toward Israel and the Jews.
Yes, and thanks for pointing that out. Most believing Christians are supporters of Israel because they accept the prophecies in both the Old and New Testaments that predicted the return of the Jews to the land of Israel.
It would be helpful to include a little more information about the comments that Marge Schott made in 1996: http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_hb5244/is_199605/ai_n20987543/
The Israeli government has a well funded and staffed agency for presenting Israel’s case abroad, it is called the Israeli Foreign Ministry and it has grossly failed in this mission for decades. Worse, some Israeli emissaries have even published bitter and unfounded criticism of their own government in the foreign media without so much as word of condemnation by their own minister.
The Israeli Hebrew radio, television, and print media are and have been for decades dominated by the Peace Now far Left minority of Israel and can easily be mistaken for spokesmen for the PLO, Hamas, and Hizballa. Their reporting about Israel in general makes Israel look like a racist, militaristic, and fascist society, but they are especially critical of any and all Israeli self defence actions against terrorists or Arab armies. Indeed, the Israeli Hebrew media is the darling of the enemies of Israel who liberally qoute them in their propaganda war against the Jewish People and Nation.
There is not much that can be done about the Left wing anti Israel bias of the media in Israel, but a thorough purge of the Foreign Ministry is certainly in order.
Ken Besig.
I totally agree with your comments rë: our lamentable Foreign Ministry. Their performance has been, to put it mildly, abysmal. But, in great measure this has been due to official gov’t. policy since Oslo. The very fact that successive Israeli gov’t.s
have embraced the two-state solution, land for peace, & other nonsensical ideas since Oslo, have all undermined any real defence of our position. The most serious problem is the idiot idea that to tell the truth about Abbas & his merry band of thieves, crooks, embezzlers, terrorists, & incomptetents in Fatah will undermine the ”moderates” – after all, how can the gov’t. justify peace talks with a group that is no different than Hamas? So, our spokesmen babble on about ”peace” blah, blah, blah. This also undercuts those in the American Jewish community who would want to defend us. Add this to the normal incompetence of our bureacracies, et voila, our hasbara is a total failure. Just as an aside, did you by chance see Ambassador Oren or Mr Shalom (Likud) on Fox News? What a joke. It was truely embarrassing.
I think you have to make a distinction between the far-left lunatics at Haaretz or in our universities who are really traitors & the wishy-washy politically correct liberal dummies as for example, at the JPost. While the looney-left is composed of a very small number of madmen, not even 1% of the population, sadly, there are far more liberal wishful thinkers.
What does it say about Israel when you hear about different parties and points of view being expressed and debated? You have a broad spectrum of political beliefs that support or criticize whatever party is in power at a given time in Israel, and who openly and loudly express their views. In the Jewish Homeland, you have Arabs as members of the Knesset (spelling?).
Now show anyplace else in the Middle East where anything remotely like this takes place. Show anyplace (with the possible exception of Iraq, for obvious reasons) where any view opposing the ruling government is tolerated. Show another place where relgious minorities aren’t oppressed and suppressed. Show another place where Jews are allowed to have positions of authority in a government.
Yet, it is Israel that is the only target of condemnation in the UN and by the dying Western democracies (dying because the West seems hell-bent on commiting societal suicide). Can anyone say “scapegoat”? And it is interesting to watch how, as the West grows more impotent and the enemies of civilization grow stronger and bolder, the only serious outrage is directed at the one country that is the primary target of those enemies and is the nation that has held those enemies at bay for decades. We are insanely weakening our real friend and empowering those who would not hesitate to kill or enslave us.
Ken, sounds like Israel’s media is like ours. . . not worth a crap. I can assure the author of this article he has been going to the wrong churches. . these same churches probably see nothing wrong with abortion, suicide bombings by the muslims, and full rights and benefits for illegal aliens. They ar of the Laodecian church ( see the Book of Revalation) which GOD says he will spew out of his mouth. Their just reward is coming. . . There are many Christians who support Israel, and are highly displeased with the “o” and his attitude toward that brave little country. Go IDF!!!
A laudable article, yet to me it appears that the phrase “Palestinian nationalism arose as a reaction to Zionism” falls short of the historical evidence available.
While it is of course possible to portray so-called “Palestinian” nationalism as a reaction to Zionism, such an argument could lend itself to belittleing the Arab nationalism that nowadays calls itself “Palestinian”.
Instead, it had better be understood which histrocial entities have lend a little more than just a helping hand in the formation of “Palestinian” nationalism.
The story according to historical evidence is that “Palestinian” nationalism dates back to the mid-1930s. In fact, it seems fair to assume that its formation took place in Egypt under the auspices of Nazi-Germany, its Foreign Office, the Nazi-Ambassy and the local chapter of the Nazi party in Alexandria, joined by Hassan al-Banna, the Muslim Brootherhood and el-Husseini, aka “The Grand-Mufti”.
Arguably, the historical ideological root of “Palestinian” nationalism is traditional Islamic anti-Semitism which has been given a nationalistic overhaul by the Nazis.
Nazi-Germany helped the Arabs under the rationale to go against the British when both parties indeed wanted to break the British lines in order to have another genocide in Palestine. El-Husseini and Nazi-Germany were two of a pair, united in Jew-hatred. (For reference: Matthias Küntzel, Jihad and Jew-Hatred).
Also, I find it noteworthy that the Rebbe who interviewed Mrs Thomas is now receiving death threats galore and apparently these come from the very mainstream of society (http://www.viciousbabushka.com/2010/06/rabbi-who-interviewed-helen-thomas-receives-death-threats.html) — quite telling for the current state of affairs, to say the least.
As usual, it’s the liberal who is the racist. It’s interesting how Biden, Jesse Jackson, Harry Reid and Obama can make insulting and insensitive statements, and the media and their followers easily give them a pass and look the other way. If George W. had said anything even remotely close to what these ignorants said, he would have been blasted in the press, on Huffington post and by Comedy Central.
Of course, GW has much more class and decency than these racist losers.
Let me see if I have this right.
Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East, has a thriving capitalist economy despite the daily dodging of incoming rockets from Gaza. They want to be left alone in peace.
Islam openly states its desire to conquer the world and claims that if we infidels do not convert, we will be killed.
World reaction to Islam = Meh.
World reaction to Israel protecting its borders from Islamic radicals = outrage.
There’s a word for that…
Yes, and that word is appeasement, just another form of cowardice. Robert Wistrich refers to it as “cringing anticipatory appeasement”. A neat turn of phrase, very apt!
I’m a Christian, and I do not believe that Jews are going to hell. The covenant God made with the nation of Israel is still in effect.
Devout American Christians are more loyal to Israel than are most American Jews. Far too many American Jews are engaged in their own form of appeasement, not to the Muslim world, but to the anti-semitic world of left-wing cultural sophistication (as they perceive it). They are deep in denial about who their allies really are. That denial grows less tenable every day.
Just a little angry are we, Abraham? Let me see, you skewered Catholics, Presbyterians, Lutherans, Neil Conan, the UN, CAIR, and Berkeley. Three out of seven ain’t bad.
Excellent article. The question for our progressives is, “Will that be truth or Pravda?”
The Russians had a joke about such propaganda, “There is no pravda in the News and no news in the Pravda.”
Stop saying only LIBERALS agree with Helen Thomas!
I am a card carrying Tea Party regular and I loath Israel, and hope the Palis send them packing as well.
You all forget that the Tea Party regulars are Ron Paul supporters [always condemned for his anti Israel rhetoric]
Tea Party regulars are from the Buchanan branch of the old Paleo GOP. [again, Pat is always condemned for his anti Israel rhetoric]
Tea Party regulars are also the remnants of the Perot movement – ALSO anti Israel.
Just because Sarah Palin is being pushed and groomed by Bill Kristol does NOT MEAN she is the future of the Tea Party. She is just one face – one useful GOY in the movement.
I love to watch the neocons and Bushbots try to claim the Tea Party… ain’t gonna happen.
It’s amazing how the anti-semites try so hard to convince themselves that there are people who actually agree with them.
Steady MarkTheGreat: I think G Marks is just a sandbagger trying to discredit the Tea Party Movement (of which I am not a part but I support many of their positions). I’ve never heard anyone in this movement condone any of the things he says here. And unfortunately there are many people who agree with Thomas’ views: and nearly all of them are liberal, nearly all of the rest of the “conservatives” are in fact libertarians.
Before you get to eager in bashing libertarians, remember, I am a libertarian before I’m a Republican. I have personally known hundreds of libertarians over the years, and not a single one of them was an anti-semite.
I think so, too, Logos.
Don’t be amazed- all bigots hate the Jews. Even Jewish bigots hate the Jews.
Yes, why is that do you think. Have you noticed that anti-semitism /anti-israelism is almost always explained and “rationalised” away as something else, whatever? But the explanation is even more irrational than the original anti-semitic bigotry and this often from our “intellectuals”? Boxes within boxes.
Hey G, where are these bigoted Tea Partiers. I would sure like to me one. For my part the most level headed people I’ve met have been Tea Partiers and I haven’t smelled a whiff of bigotry. Buchanan is an outcast and doesn’t speak for anyone except himself. Your whole statement smacks of blatant lies. Why not go even further? Tell us all that Hamas is a party of peace and the Jews blew up the World Trade Center.
I am also a member of a Tea Party chapter, and I haven’t encountered anything like what you have described, G. Marks. In fact, I very much doubt you’re part of the Tea Party movement at all. I suspect that you are, perhaps you too much credit, against the Tea Party movement and just doing your sleazy bit to discredit it with lies. It’s happened to us before, and no doubt will again, but we didn’t just fall off the turnip truck, you know.
In short, you’re a bigot, G. Marks, and there’s no room for the likes of you in the Tea Party.
Hi, my name is G Marks. You can tell it’s me because that’s what it says in bold above this paragraph. I’m a ringer working for SEIU. Have some sympathy. I’m working below minimum wage as a community organizer because ACORN isn’t paying as much as it used to for doctored voter registration cards.
Look, my job is to expose the racism and anti-semitism of you nutty teabaggers so that we can get card check passed. And by “expose”, I mean “make up”.
If we don’t win this election, we’ll stop getting federal funding and I’ll be stuck in this cube reading about free minds and free markets for the rest of my life. And nobody wants that. I want that cushy job as a union foreman with the fat, fully-funded pension we don’t let the union members have access to. So I need to keep plugging away, and you guys need to be intimidated by my name calling and go home so us Community Organizers can ram through our agenda.
So please stop holding rallies and volunteering for campaigns. Whatever you do, don’t vote. You bunch of bigoted racists.
Yours truly,
A Parody of G Marks
(But probably not too far from the truth)
G Marks – you need to go call David Axelrod and tell him your feeble attempt to troll the comments of one of the most well-read conservative web sites was an abject failure.
But do come back. Your inane rantings are always good for a laugh.
A “card-carrying” tea party member, hey? Did you have it printed at Wal-Mart?
And one that you will never, ever see in a million years even after the devil begins serving sno-cones to his occupants:
“Yet in much of Cincinnati, where a long strain of racism persisted, people tacitly supported Schott because she said what they thought and felt but were afraid to voice.”
Wow.
Ignorant, much? More precisely — are you normally an ignorant bigot, or are you only an ignorant bigot in regards to Cincinnati?
The reality is that Schott was not SUPPORTED but rather was judged on more than just some quotes in a news story. People who actually dealt with her — including the baseball players — will tell you how nice she was, how kind, how giving. Was she, as she herself said, “an old broad”? Sure. She said stupid things, she said things we think are ugly. But she was never a cheerleader for Hamas or an advocate for genocide, like Thomas.
Re: racism Cincinnati
Is that supposed to be a slam at the Reform Judaism community?
In the Midwest, most of us believe that little old people in private life, or running private businesses however famous, are allowed to mouth off. If they embarrass themselves, it’s their families’ business to stop them. If their actions are kinder than their words, we believe their actions and ignore their hot air.
Little old ladies who earn their overpaid bread as reporters are different, of course.
“4. Ken Besig Israel ”
Your comment could as easily apply to the US State Department, especially recently.
“I have never yet heard them show compassion for an Israeli child killed by a suicide bomber or concern for the people of Sderot living in a perpetual state of siege”. Wrong, most people here in Germany feel very sorry for each child killed. Children should grow up protected, they should play and feel happy and their fate should not depend on the status, religion or nationality of their parents. The problems, many people in Israel refuse to see is our universal approach: All children.. that means children in Israel, in Gaza, China and everywhere. Yes, the people of Sderot live in a perpetual stage of siege. And the children in Gaza? Israel left Gaza. But the people of Gaza are locked into Gaza and even food is very limited (at least the variety). Apart from very few Israelis (whom I admire), the rest simply ignores the fate of their neighbours.
“Helen Thomas spoke what a vast number of people think: the Jews should get the hell out of Palestine. After all, those “good people” at the progressive church pot lucks believe Jews are going to hell anyway”. The vast majority of people in Europe believe if there is a God there is only one God for all people. The rest believes that there is no God. Personally I deeply dislike generalizations across whole people. They are very wrong.
Marianne, the reason Palestinian children are “locked” in Gaza, is because their parents refuse to stop trying to kill Jews at every opportunity. The only people to blame for the plight of Palestinian children, are their parents.
Marianne, the Israelis are not obligated to send humanitarian aid (which includes food) into Gaza, and yet they do, which pretty much proves they do care about the children of Gaza. You say that no one should make sweeping generalizations about a whole people, and yet you are doing that very thing. The Israelis are surrounded and besieged by enemies at every gate, and yet they haven’t degenerated into a society of violence like the thugocracies in Muslims countries who, by the way, turn on each other when they haven’t got any infidels to kill. You might want to listen less to European propaganda (i.e., media) and start digging out some facts on your own. What you find might surprise you mightily.
And the children in Gaza are taught, from kindergarten on, that Jew are monkeys and pigs, to be destroyed, and eventually all the other infidels as well, and that the US is the great Satan, and that it is good and sacred to blow yourself up, especially if you can take lots of Jewish kids with you, for which you will be rewarded by Allah himself with lots of sex with virgins.
If you are really concerned with all the children, you should be condemning this too.
As I said before I (and everybody I know) is concerned about the fate of all children. That includes Israeli children too. However, Israel is the stronger side. People in Israel can control their own lives while the people in Gaza and elsewhere must rely on the generosity of the Israeli government in terms of travelling, work? and shopping. I think that the concept “They hate us, therefore we have to hate them” is very wrong. Some months ago, the children`s channel(Kika) showed some Palestinian children how they approached the Israeli-Palestinian conflict in a play. The story ended with “we can be friends”(Israeli children and Palestinian ones). The boys acted with great empathy – something that is missing by adults on both sides. The most important question however is:Why people prefer death to life? Is life so horrible for them? Are some dozens of virgins so promising? The loss of a child is for all parents a very traumatic experience. Why do some Palestinian parents embrace the death of their own children? Perhaps the quality of teachers in Gaza and elsewhere should be supervised? Perhaps children should play together at least once a week? Behaviour is not fixed it can be altered.
That is a lie.
The people of Gaza do indeed control their own fate. All they have to do is give up on the idea of killing all the Jews, and the blockade will end. It’s their decision.
I am in full agreement with MArk the Great on this Marianne, but would add this. When you state “…people in Gaza and elsewhere must rely on the generosity of the Israeli government …” this is ONLY because the massive aid that pours into Gaza goes for exclusively for three things: the purchase of weapons, the poisoning of children’s minds through rancid anti-Semitic broadcasts and “educational” programs, and the lining of the personal bank accounts of the top Palestinian leadership.
Israel’s fervent hope in pulling out of Gaza (and destroying the lives of thousands of innocent Jewish people in the process) was that the Palestinians would use this Jew-free land to FINALLY build a decent society for themselves. Under Fatah control, this was a longshot at best. Now that Hamas has taken over, all hope is gone.
Good fences make good neighbors. Too bad we have lousy neighbors and the world is doing everything it can to force us to tear our fences down.
Ad hominem comment: Isn’t she ugly!
Yes, she is, both inside and out
Sooner or later, the Israelis are going to conclude that they’re “damned if we do, and dead if we don’t,” and turn Teheran and Damascus into gently glowing, glass-lined craters. It’s only their self-restraint that prevents this from happening.
When the media doesn’t know the difference between journalism & propaganda, what they’re doing is Jerna-Lizzum.
Abe does it once again. As for the underlying antisemitism, there are indeed a vast number of people who more than just dislike Jews but won’t say it. The economy gets bad enough, they’ll say it and attempt to do something about it. In the first few days after the old biddy resigned, the interviewer at the White House country club who asked the questions to which she responded got over 25,000 hate mails, see his webite rabbilive.com; google “25000 hate mail” for more on the story.
Look, the reason there is a growing pro-Palestinian sentiment in Europe and North America is not because people feel that the Jews are “going to hell anyway” (article’s next-to-last sentence) but rather because people are afraid of Arab terrorism in their own backyard and fear loss of access to Middle Eastern oil. Helen Thomas’ parents came from Lebanon, so perhaps it’s just as well she was forced out before some of her Lebanese relatives persuaded her to blow up herself and the president in the White House press room. (Come to think of it, just how thoroughly are all those reporters searched before they’re allowed into presidential press conferences? Suppose they stuck some explosives in a body cavity — would it be detected?)
“Suppose they stuck some explosives in a body cavity — would it be detected?”
Considering that Helen Thomas’s body cavity is evidently commodious enough for her head to fit there nicely, that’s room for what — about 8 kg of C4?
That’d make for a pretty nasty boom.
In Thomas’s case, who would look?
There are some arguments that I have never heard made about the Israel-Palestine situation and the Palestinian refugees, that should be made often and loudly.
First some historical facts: the number of Arabs who left what is now Israel in 1948 was something like 500,000 to 600,000, the majority of whom left before Israel was founded. The Jews of Haifa and Jaffa begged their Arab neighbors to stay, largely in vain; those that fled did so in response to threats from the Arab armies that had invaded the country that they would be killed along with the Jews if they stayed.
Those that fled did not blame the Jews for their departure.
The number of Arabs who received refugee status in 1949 numbered approximately 1,250,000.
Where did the majority of these people who had never lived in what became Israel, come from?
Well, the deal offered the refugees was so attractive, that they came from all over the Arab world, to get the wondrous benefits offered the refugees. These were: free room and board, free education and medical care, in perpetuity for ever, all paid for by Western Nations!
In the same period more than half a million Jews were expelled or left Arab lands to come to Israel. Most of these lost their property without compensation in doing so.
So, who caused the Palestine refugee problem? The Arab States which invaded the country in 1948 to destroy the UN sponsored nation of Israel.
Who profited from Jews fleeing Arab lands? The Arab Nations from which they came.
These nations have never lifted even a finger to help the refugees.
The refugees for all these years have lived in the Socialist Eden of total dependence without responsibility. Well it turns out that they now hate that status and hate the world for trapping them in it.
The Palestinians have attacked almost all those who have given them shelter. They first attacked Jordan and were expelled in “Black September” Then they caused war and chaos in Lebanon, until the Israelis expelled them to Tunisia. They supported Saddam Hussein in his invasion of Kuwait and were expelled from Kuwait for their pains. Since then no Arab state has trusted them nor will allow them citizenship.
So who is responsible for the refugees? The Arab League. Who should take the lead in resettling them? the Arab League. Who has the money to do so? The Arab League.
Until the refugee problem is solved there is no prospect for Middle East Peace.
The United States should put pressure on the Arab States to solve this problem. Israel has nothing to do with it.
This old nag was a WH reporter? I thought she was the milkshake who yelled “Play Ball!” after saying grace in that “Christmas Vacation” movie…
There IS no connection between celibacy and pedophilia. I have been celibate for my 7 months here in Afghanistan without the slightest desire to sodomize boys, or men either for that matter. That says more about the author than anything else. Besides, if a priest has trouble kleeping his vows of celibacy, it’s far more acceptable to do a woman anyway. It’s not exactly unhead of.
Your anti-catholoic bigotry is showing. But don’t worry, it’s socially acceptable in America.
No, but a career choice that forbids one to enter into a conventional marriage is attractive to homosexual men growing up in a culture that sees this as immoral. For them it may seem the perfect answer – no need to explain why they don’t go out with girls and won’t get married, a gaurantee of daily contact with a lot of young men for life and near automatic admiration and respect from church members.
Not that these are the motivation for a majority of priesthood candidates – but it does skew the percentages – just as there is a higher percentage of men in police work with a tendency toward violence. The pedophilia part is probably because the younger males are more innocent and gullible and therefore more likely to fall for their predations.
Mr. Miller,
I enjoyed the article. This is one of those comments of a just in case you were not aware. At the danger of becoming repetitious, I feel led to continue providing this commentary.
Here in flyover country, we have our own breed of “interfaith” churches. After years of observation, I have decided my take on on these alliances is though their propaganda dangerous, they are relatively small in number but big in mouth. And the common theme of the alliances that I’ve followed has nothing to do with worship and everything to do with progressive politic – uber liberal politics under the guise of some sort of humanistic thought they label “religious.”
The “faith” portion of the interfaith alliance is lipstick on a pig. I suspect their creation and the appearance of rapid growth due to the fact that their membership figured out perhaps twenty years back, secular politic wasn’t selling well in much of America and they needed something to curb the growth of Conservative Evangelicals. Progressives new paradigm would simply operate under the same management but rebrand themselves with a more palatable flavor.
I do hope that the Jews of Israel who read this board understand that though Evangelical Christians don’t carry much stroke in the dinosaur media which makes up the vast majority of what you may read and hear, we are vast in number. Any Evangelical worth his or her salt sides with Israel and most understand all too well what is taking place. There is much discussion taking place in the pews of Evangelical churches concerning our support of Israel. You are in our prayers. We share a common misery with Israeli Jews of being perceived as some type of lunatic fringe that the world would be much better without. We discern what is happening to Israel and throughout much of the world and we understand the enemy like you.
I read recently that when polled, 63% of Americans take the pro Israeli position vis-a-vis Palestine. Don’t let the misperception of having our voices stifled by major news networks fool you into believing you are all alone in your battle. Obama and his minions may waver in support for Israel – but the heartland of America does not.
I find it interesting that people tend to forget folks like Mencham Begin and his idea of Eratz (sp?) Israel including a ton of territory that one would have to go back deep into history to try and define “Jewish Ownership” thereof. I am of the belief that only a two state solution with Jerusalem as either a divided Capital of both states or preferably as a “Universal City” owned by none. When you have the three major religions in the world sharing holy spaces within rock throwing distance of each other, it is hard for me to sign on to any group primarily comprised of one religious sect having a distinct claim on ownership. All that being said, until Hamas, Hezbollah and the rest get their collective heads out of their tails, I cannot fault Israel for having to do those things that provide it and it’s people security. At the same time, I find no shared beliefs with those who believe the solution to the problem is to dump the Palestinians on Jordan or any other existing State.
As an atheist I do not support Israel because the they are Jews returned as per some predictive ranting in a thoroughly discredited bad history and folk tales book.
I support Israel because I believe the West should have a ‘no more Czechoslovakias’ policy
They have rule of law… male that Law.
Some of the Ultra-Orthodox statements out of Israel creep me out but, in the end, she is still a democracy.
But I suppose the Liberal Intelligentsia has a predilection to ‘favours of the betters’ style of redress against government, especially since it is they who are all vast intellects. (Obama, Kerry, Gore – all geniuses!)
The Bible’s been discredited? Where? By whom?
I’m not saying that the Bible is 100% accurate as an historical document. (For example, archealogical evidence shows that it took around 400 years for the Jews to conquer Judea, not a single lifespan as recorded in the one part of the Bible. On the other hand, the Bible also details the Israeli’s having trouble with the Phillistines long after the time of Joshua.) It was never written as an historical document. The Bible has however been proven to be very accurate.
One of these days I will meet an atheist who has a clue regarding what the Bible says, and what Christians and Jews actually believe.
The Canaanite Wars continues throughout the time of the Judges, which spanned from the death of Joshua until the anointing of the prophet Samuel. There was a reason the Israelites believed their king should be a war hero and continue to lead from the front after being crowned.
If PBS is public, can I sell my share?
Defund the Left.
In Berkeley, the only city outside the Vatican with its own foreign policy…
Did Singapore disappear?
At the height of the second intifada in 2003/2004, I spent many months worrying about my son, a chayil boded-lone soldier-in the IDF, having volunteered after his graduation from Caltech.
In the midst of such parental anguish I decided to do something constructive, to guage the temperature of the conflict closer to home.To wit, I attended several SPME (Scholars for Peace in the Middle East) conferences, held at Columbia U in the heart of NYC.
To state that I was aghast at what I found is to put it mildly. Entering the lecture hall was like entering an armed camp, several layers of security deep.Who exactly were they protecting the attendees from, certainly not profs and their guests seeking to hear from the panelists.Again, who?
Once inside, the real action commenced. Almost on cue, a few rabble rousers started screaming in the audience about the big, bad IDF.Well, THAT was enough to make my blood boil, but I sat still until the floor was opened up.
Par for the course, not only did I get verbally assaulted, for setting the record straight on the necessity of IDF operations, due to constant Arab terror, but a few of the Profs in the audience (Jews, one even with a kippah)tried to stop me from stating what they all knew to be factually correct. It was at that moment that I realized that facts aren’t worth a damn, even in a forum full of ‘scholars’ for peace in the Middle East. Apparently, whatever the lynch mob-intellectual or otherwise-thinks they can get away with is the ‘truth’ of the day.
Therefore, it falls upon ALL people of conscience to stand up, be counted, shout louder than Israel’s haters, NEVER letting the other side think they are winning. It will be the side with the most stamina which will carry the day-facts be damned.
By the way, I WON that round because I refused to stand down.
I was just looking at a side by side picture of Thomas and the basilisk from the 2nd H. Potter movie.
Seperated at birth?
I wish legacy media would stop using sympathetic euphemisms such as ‘suicide bomber’. The point of the action is murder, to kill some Jews or Americans even if it costs your own life. The media never focus on the malicious mullahs who recruit bigots and useful idiots to carry bombs into other peoples’ temples, planes or meeting places.
Christian Zionists are vital to Israel’s survival, and they are a blessing on the Jewish people. Secular types whether from the Jewish or the Christian community do not understand that you cannot fight the threat of radical Islam with nothing. It is why Europe, having lost its Christianity, is so vulnerable to Islam. Europe is asleep or worshiping multiculturalism while the Islamist threat grows more virulent. America itself is the unique outcome of a tolerant Christianity that enshrined religious pluralism and liberty. A resurgence of Christianity in America and in Europe is vital to stop the spread of Islamic intolerance. Thanks to our mindless media, most people don’t understand what Hannah Arendt so eloquently crafted in her post-1956 epilogue in the Origins of Totalitarianism: to stop something evil, you must believe in something good. You must stop those who embrace death by showing them and everyone else that religion is about embracing life.
Christian Zionists are vital to Israel’s survival, and they are a blessing on the Jewish people. Secular types, whether from the Jewish or the Christian community, do not understand that you cannot fight the threat of radical Islam with nothing. It is why Europe, having lost its Christianity, is so vulnerable to Islam. Europe is asleep or worshiping multiculturalism while the Islamist threat grows more virulent. America itself is the unique outcome of a tolerant Christianity that enshrined religious pluralism and liberty. A resurgence of Christianity in America and in Europe is vital to stop the spread of Islamic intolerance. Thanks to our mindless media, most people don’t understand what Hannah Arendt so eloquently crafted in her post-1956 epilogue in the Origins of Totalitarianism: to stop something evil, you must believe in something good. You must stop those who embrace death by showing them and everyone else that religion is about embracing life.
31. Adina Kutnicki, Israel
“…facts aren’t worth a damn…”
During the Nineteen-thirties, when the blackshirted Communists and the brownshirted Nazis were busting each other’s heads in roiling street battles in German cities, Hitler admonished the Brownshirts: ‘Break the Communists’ heads, but don’t kill them. When we win, they will be our first recruits.’
Hitler understood the rabid nature of the mob and how to rouse it to ravening bloodlust. He would have instantly recognized those that shouted you down for their true need which Hitler understood had nothing to do with facts or logic or ideas. Selective and partial facts, twisted logic, high-minded notions of a workers utopia or terrifying ideas of existential threat by a diabolical enemy–these are merely the emotional fuel that bloodshed-needy, fanatical personalities require.
The only rational response to such persons is avoidance and, that failing, a large caliber bullet to the head.
I can tell you from long experience: The Left does not accept or engage on the substance of rational argumentation that disputes their dogma. Instead, they will either try to redirect whatever issue is at hand, or they will simply go mute and wait for the smart conservative guy to leave the room.
Progressive? Why not the adjective of Gramsci? Whether it is Gramscian or Gramscite.
For, it serves the best interests of everyone to know who Antonio Gramsci was, and how his legacy of blight is with us today, including the demonizing of Israel or cultural conservatives.
Dr. Frank Lippenheimer
I can tell you from long experience: The Left does not accept or engage on the substance of rational argumentation that disputes their dogma. Instead, they will either try to redirect whatever issue is at hand, or they will simply go mute and wait for the smart conservative guy to leave the room.
I think this remark should be directed a G Marks and his kind!
It’s a shame that there’s no such thing as journalism subjectivity any more. So the only thing left to do is to find a reliable, balanced source.
I liked this guy’s commentary, funny as hell but also smart and witty:
http://www.entertainmedaily.com/2010/06/helen-thomas-deserves-a-punch-in-the-face-but-rabbi-david-nesenoff-should-be-kicked-in-the-balls/
What do you guys think?
Add to what Neal Conan should have said,
Most of the Arab refugees of 1948 came to the area after the Jews ,because of the sudden prosperity in this deserted empty place that belonged to Syria. [ Mark Twain's testimony].
This is why the UN defines Palestinian refugees as those who were in this area between 1946 and 1948. Not by the place that they were born.
Why is the term “Weimar moment” used here? My understanding is that the Weimar Republic was brought down by runaway inflation and surging fascism – so why is Thomas having a “Weimar moment”?
Helen Thomas should have worn a burka.
That is all.
Mr. Miller says:
“I have long been acquainted with the progressive “good people” who routinely go to those interfaith and church-sponsored lectures on the Middle East. They are compassionate in the extreme for Arabs who were displaced by the Arab-initiated war of 1948. They can wax eloquently on the history of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict with information taken right off the Saudi embassy’s web page. And they have become self-proclaimed experts on the differences between U.S. generated “grants” and “loans” to Israel.
I have never yet heard them show compassion for an Israeli child killed by a suicide bomber or concern for the people of Sderot living in a perpetual state of siege. Somehow they sing in a chorus where everything Israel does is wrong and everything the Arabs do can be rationalized or justified.
Helen Thomas spoke what a vast number of people think: the Jews should get the hell out of Palestine. After all, those “good people” at the progressive church potlucks believe Jews are going to hell anyway. What difference does it make if they get there a little sooner?”
Mr. Miller, I don’t know what “good progressive people” you are talking about, but I seriously question your definition of “acquainted.” If you are truly acquainted with progressive church-goers who express concern about justice for Palestine, then you know (without a shadow of a doubt) that few if any think that Jews are going to hell, that many of them regularly express outrage concerning Israeli children (among others) who are killed by bombs, and that some have risked their lives in support of true peace. These are inflammatory and highly misleading statements. You are claiming knowledge of a group of people for whom you have little respect and even less information.
This is a disappointing introduction to this site.
You people are hilarious. I have no reason to lie about my political affiliation.
the Tea Party is an offshoot of the Perotistas and the Buchanan wing of the GOP… now long gone because the neocons infiltrated and then took over the party.
Many of my friends were solid Republicans back in the day… but Perot won them over, and the bond with Buchanan is ongoing.
the right has as many problems with the Jews of Israel as the left… but you people don’t want to listen.
the temporary alliance between Christian Zionists and Jews is just that… temporary. Witness the dust up between Ann Coulter and many Jews when she said they need to ‘be perfected’…. OMG – you’d think she asked they be herded into ovens.
Donny Deutsch went NUTS>… but she handled him and the lynching quite well.
AND she survived because she’s a Tea Party favorite… and she believes what we all believe… that Jews will return to Israel – and be converted to Christianity. Jews need to be saved. [from themselves AND Islam]
Well, ok, it’s aaabbbbout time! The funhouse mirror comes through. Skid Marks. Lame, lame….lame again.
Skid Marks, the latest model of The principal Liar sleazits Persons Galore. I see the Kick Me sign is in its proper place, nailed securely to your ass. I notice several posters kicked you at the flick of a flush. Bigot, sleaze, liar and more. It’s good to be noticed for your dominant attributes, is it not?
Hey Skid Marks, have you seen Van Jones lately? Boxers or briefs?
You actually have friends besides your cesspool soul mates? Hmmm… Republicans. The feeling of abandonment, being left behind. Then the rage. Maybe you can get a university professor to feel professionally sorry for you.
Well, another day, another lame attempt. Skid Marks, lame.
Did you win The Mr. President Flushes His Autographed Used Underwear contest? Are they oily, too? What does Rosie O’Donnell think? And Kyber?
You made your cesspool. Love it or leave it.
Whatever.
G Marks, are you working for SEIU, David Axelrod or Cass Sunstein? I’m only asking for information.
Ron Paul is constantly being called an Anti Semite.
Pat Buchanan is forever your favorite Jew hater.
Ross Perot was hammered daily as an unrepentant Jew hater because he didn’t want us helping Israel… he wanted us to cut it loose.
Now — all of the above are heroes and founders of what is today the Tea Party … and you still tell me I’m not a member .. and that the Tea Party loves Israel…
NO — the Tea party has lots of people trying to hijack it and send it to the neocon GOP…. Bill Kristol packaging Palin comes to mind.
But this Tea Party regular worked for the Perot people.. and thinks Pat Buchanan is one of America’s great heroes… he is also the hero of the Tea Party regulars… so is Paul…
yet you refuse to admit that Perot, Paul and Buchanan have followers in the Tea Party? — or that Libertarians like Badnarik… our last presidential nominee was also labeled an anti semite because he wanted us OUT of Middle Eastern Politics… I heard him say at the Convention in Atlanta…
LET ISRAEL drown in the blood of her crimes against her neighbors….
Hell, Badnarik was just the candidate 6 years ago!!
so do NOT tell me that the Tea Party loves Jews and Israel… because the founders clearly did NOT!