Fiscal Cliff Wrangling Already Falls Short in the ‘Compromise’ Department
Before legislators left Washington for Thanksgiving, congressional leaders gathered ’round the table with President Obama as an opening gesture for fiscal cliff negotiations.
Today, the civility and understanding that leaders claimed to share after emerging from that sit-down vaporized as Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) declared on the floor of the upper chamber that there’s only one tax-cut extension that will make it past Obama’s desk: his.
Fiscal cliff negotiations — dealing not just with the expiring Bush-era tax cuts but the looming sequestration cuts — begin in earnest this week, and lawmakers stuffed on turkey appear ready and willing to play a game of chicken.
Ironically, Reid’s speech today began by waxing about the beauty of compromise.
“We could solve the greatest economic emergency facing the nation today — if only the House would consider the Senate-passed bill freezing tax rates for 98 percent of American families and 97 percent of small businesses,” Reid said. “As Thomas Jefferson said, we should not put off for tomorrow what we can do today.”
Republicans have rebuffed Obama’s pre-election pleas to pass the middle-class tax cut extensions now and come back to the upper-class cuts later — which, in congressional-speak, would mean indefinite shelving, especially in Reid’s chamber.
“Our legislation would give economic certainty to the middle class, protect important tax deductions for families and businesses and restore balance by asking the most fortunate among us to pay a little extra to reduce the deficit,” the majority leader continued. “It’s also the only bill with a chance of being signed into law by President Obama.”
“The Senate has spoken. …I only hope House Republicans have been listening.”
House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-Va.) said the lame-duck session needs to be about more than whose taxes get hiked. “We’re coming to the table having put very specific ideas into the debate about how you fix the spending problem. That we have to do. Because I don’t care if you raised taxes 100 percent on the wealthy, you’re not gonna fix the deficit problem,” he said on MSNBC today.
“We’ve got to have the president step up, and say, ‘Here’s my position on how to reform the entitlements and start managing down this debt and deficit.’”
Democrats are fixated on raising taxes on the upper-income brackets; others have expressed willingness to plunge off the fiscal cliff if the third rail of entitlements is touched. Republicans are averse to another can-kicking quick fix and are suggesting raising the marginal rate, cutting deductions, or closing loopholes as revenue-generating alternatives to raising anyone’s taxes.
And like it’s campaign season again, Dems are concurrently pushing the narrative that Republicans who want all tax hikes extended are against extending them for the middle class.
All told, expect the wrangling over the fiscal cliff to last at least as long as the Salvation Army bell-ringers.
Anyone in Washington for ObamaCare negotiations knows how the Senate vote in 2009 went to Christmas Eve, with a session beginning at 6 a.m. And that was for a pet project of the president’s, not for a deadline facing Congress that could plunge the country into another recession if not met.
House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) suggested a Christmas deadline for having an agreement on the early January cliff, which is in keeping with Congress’ tradition of arriving at 11th-hour patchy solutions.
The White House even tried using Cyber Monday as a hook for its new Council of Economic Advisers report about the middle-class tax cuts’ impact on consumer spending and retailers. It estimated growth of real consumer spending could be cut by 1.7 percentage points in 2013 if middle-class tax rates go up an average of $2,200 on a family of four, which would translate to consumers spending nearly $200 billion less than they otherwise would have.
Chairman Alan Krueger joined press secretary Jay Carney at the daily briefing to elaborate on the politi-report.
“I think evidence like this is one reason why retailers are so concerned that Congress has not yet extended the middle-class tax cuts,” Krueger said. “The Senate passed an extension of the tax cuts, and it seems to me the thing that we can all agree on, that middle-class families should see an extension of these tax cuts, and that would help the economy in the coming year.”
“I would say, also, that the president has made clear that he will not sign a bill that extends the Bush-era tax cuts for those making more than $250,000. He’s made that clear. I’ve made that clear. Others have made it clear, and that is a firm position,” Carney said. “…But the president has made clear, also, that he understands that compromise has to be part of this.”
Yet even prominent members of the president’s own party have encouraged some give-and-take on the issue.
Sen.-elect Tim Kaine (D-Va.), who won’t have to answer to Reid until the 113th Congress begins in January, is one of those saying the cutoff point for tax hikes should be $500,000, double the level sought by Obama.
“There isn’t anything sort of theological about the $500,000 number. It’s just a compromise,” Kaine said Friday on PBS. “The Democrats’ position has been tax cuts to expire over $250,000. The Republicans’ position has been make all the tax cuts permanent.”
“If that compromise were accepted, it would raise $500 billion in revenue over the next 10 years, which would take the potential trillion-dollar sequester and cut it in half,” he added.
Most Democrats were eager to push the party line, though: Compromise, in fiscal-cliff-speak, means no agreement without tax hikes on incomes above $250,000.
Some just tried to push the hardline message in a nicer-sounding way.
“It’s important to understand that the president has proposed that everybody get continued tax relief, existing tax rates on the first $250,000 of family income,” Rep. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), ranking member on the House Budget Committee, said today on MSNBC. “So he says let’s extend that for everybody right now, but he believes we should ask higher income individuals to pay a little bit more.”
Even while pledging to put revenue on the table, though, Republicans weren’t buying the Dems’ version of compromise on the tax hikes.
“Remember two years ago, when the Democrats controlled all? What did the president say? President Obama, who had Nancy Pelosi as speaker then, and Reid, said don’t raise the rates in a down economy, it hurts it,” Minority Whip Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) said today on CNN, reminding viewers of the last extension of the Bush tax cuts.
“I think what we can do in three weeks is set up where we reform some of the government spending, we bring more revenue in. That’s what Republicans are putting on the table, because the president asked for it,” he said. “If the president would now say that he wanted, what, 2-1/2 cuts for every $1, show where those cuts are. And then set a framework so you have overall tax reform next year, where you — the committees can work on it.”
Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Ala.) questioned whether even giving in on additional revenue would make a difference in the country’s greater fiscal crisis — and insisted that any extra revenue negotiated be used to reduce the deficit.
“What I’m concerned about is where this money would be going. They say it’s for deficit reduction, but the president’s budget that he submitted to us in January would increase spending another $1.4 trillion, whereas he’s proposing now, I think, $1.6 trillion in new taxes,” Sessions said today on Fox.
“I have objected to this idea that we’re going to have some secret negotiations going on right now, which I, and 90-plus percent of our members of Congress are not a part of, and it’s going to be plopped down right before Christmas Day? And we’re going to be demanded to vote for it?”
Bridget, it is abundantly clear that You Don’t Know the Meaning of Compromise!
Compromise; n, v: [kom-pruh-mahyz]
Noun; To resolve a dispute by Complete and total Republican Capitulation to Democrat Demands.
Verb; To resolve News Media Generated Crisis by Compromise
jd, you left out, “at which time they roll over and expect to have their tummies scratched.”
And the only compromise the Dems will tolerate is a COMPLETE and TOTAL deconstruction/destruction of the economy.
This has been their plan all along, and the Repubs – who are not brain dead – know it too. The open question is – do they have the balls to stop it, instead of opining about the ‘fiscal cliff’, which will surely worsen with their capitulation? Then again, weepy, alcohol prone Boehner is at their helm. Oh,for heavens sake…
http://adinakutnicki.com/2012/08/07/barack-hussein-obamas-deconstruction-plans-green-wise-via-the-economy-disarming-the-citizens-via-gun-control-connecting-the-dots-addendum-to-the-second-term-plans-of-an-obama-presidency-c/
Things are not looking good…expecting Repubs to stick to conservative guns!!
I think a return to the Clinton Tax Rates is good. It ends once and for now “Bush Tax Cuts” which were for the wealthy -ie anyone making more that $20K. The public doesn’t know that because the media has told them it was all for the rich. At least we have decent law and regulation if they expire, vs some cobbled up bill with hundreds of pages nobody read.
Also, sequesteration was the great compromise in the last standoff, can the same players get a better deal now. I don’t think so. The stealth damage is the kick in of the Obamacare taxes, if the GOP compromises they will get branded with those also.
We had the election season to make our case, did we do it very well?
Obamacare was the really big issue and its stealing 700B from medicare, I don’t recall that even coming up after the convention.
Absolutely spot on!
The Republicans must be saying only three things: 1) It may be hard for America but the Democrats have won and we are returning to the Clinton Tax Rates. The Bush Tax Cuts have expired and everyone’s taxes now return to the Clinton levels. The Clinton Tax Rates are what is called ‘The Fiscal Cliff’.
2) The President and the Democratic Party have not made any kind of a budget so we must follow the sequestration plan set up two years ago. Of these small sequestration cuts, half will be from future military spending and half will come from the thousands of other federal programs, but not out of Social Security or Medicare. Congress can trim fat from government, doing its rightful job, and the impact of the non-Defense cuts will actually help the economy.
3) Republicans have nothing more to say or do toward ‘raising revenues’ until after the President and Democratic leaders present plans, proposals and budgets for all to consider. ‘Raising revenues’ is just code for ‘collecting more in taxes’ and the new taxes of Obamacare are heavy enough by themselves to cause a recession. Republicans believe government spending must be decreased from current levels. What do the Democrats propose? Let them show us their plans. Republicans want to continue the Bush Tax Cuts for all taxpayers.
Gee, if it was me doing the negotiating, I’d be on TV every day pointing out to the American public that spending was increasd in Feb 2009 by 890 billion as a temporary “stimulus” measure, but somehow has reoccured every year since, and apparently that’s what the criminals intend to do permanently. There is no conceivable tax on any number of “rich” people that can pay for fluhing that much money down the toilet every year.
Maybe eliminating that spending should be something to consider, since every dime of it comes out of the taxapayers’ pockets, who have already seen their lifestyles decrease by about 10% on average, and sinking.
But then again, I’m not a Republican, I have a brain, and I’m not a slimeball politician who cares only about myself.
I for one am getting tired of losing Presidential elections because Republicans are seen by so many otherwise potential Republican voters as “The party of the Rich”.
The democrats are expert in gigolo-economics (gigoloconomics). Spend EVERY penny she’s got and then *boom* you’re on your way. The “fiscal cliff” really means “the point when I have to shut up and pay the bill”. There’s no cliff, just a bunch of democrats who have to pony up. Democrats are evil and republicans are stupid. Sadly, I think that evil will win another round when “negotiations” (ie. the agreed upon democrat outcome) begin in earnest.
The democrats know damn well that the extra money collected from the wealthy, by taking away their tax cuts, will not be much more than a few spits and pees in the ocean compared to all the government spending on various forms of welfare and boondoggles, but that’s not the point and it never has been. The point is to paint Republicans as being overly concerned with the wealthy and at that the democrats are a big success and because of it gain probably a 5% advantage in every election now. So Republicans, if you want to keep losing elections and freedoms then just keep making this a hill to die on.
And your solution for the Republicans, and the country, is then …
Being an investor, I am moving all assets to cash or metal prior to witching day. It should be a fun 3 weeks. There is no way these people will have a deal prior to Dec 30, not a chance.
the cliff will arrive and the lemmings will jump off. the middle class, who the democrats have so steadfastly told everyone who would listen they are defending will have to pony up. the democrats will steadfastly blame the republicans, they in turn will have no words to explain. crash crash crash.
If you want to screw billionaire Democrat hypocrites, limit income tax deductions for foundations, estates, trusts, and endowments to say, $250,000. Better yet, eliminate the income tax entirely. This would screw the Ford Foundation, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the Harvard Endowment Fund, and countless other progressive tax shelters. The whole Democrat discussion about tax rates completely ignores the pittances their crony capitalist billionaire a$$holes actually pay. Remember, they think you are stupid. Are you?
What the hell – if the Democrats are so hell-bent-for-leather to run this country off the cliff we might as well do it now in grand fashion and be done with it. Give em what they want Boehner – you will anyway – why all this pre-negotiation lip service?
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Harry Reid: “The Senate has spoken. …I only hope House Republicans have been listening.”
Little Lord Fauntleroy of the Senate has spoken! Whatta ya gonna do if they don’t obey Harry? Go over there and kick Boehner’s ass?
That’s why I’m kind of OK on having the cutoff at $250K — because it will mostly hit blue-state voters. They voted for tax increases, so let’s give it to them! The problem is that it also hits the types of small businesses that run on lots of gross revenue but slim profit margins. Maybe if someone in Congress is sufficiently clever in accounting, they could fix this with some kind of sneaky accounting rules change.
We are spending $3.5 trillion annually and taking in say $2 trillion in revenue. The full tax increase if Obama gets his way is about $80 billion. Wow! That really does help the problem. I say screw the democrats and shut up. Tell these jerks we want to see their plan NOW for cutting entitlement spending. NOW NOW NOW! Don’t quote the bible, don’t try to explain why you favor no abortions for rape victims, don’t talk about amnesty. Just shut up and say you will NOT say another word until this jerk puts his big ass plan on the table. I am tired of these bozos playing rope a dope with us because we have so many dopes that fall for these tricks. Let the Libs Lead for once in their pathetic miscreant lives. Screw them and the horse they road in on.
Party like it’s 1937, y’all.
Three tax increase measures that the voters mandated:
- The “Hollywood Tax Cuts” Hollywood went big for Obama in 2008 and 2012, they yammer about “the rich not paying their fair share” and bemoan “special interests”. Eliminate their special consideration in the tax code just as they’ve demanded.
- confiscation of all individual assets over $50 million. The “rich” voted big for Obama in 2008 and 2012. The poster child for the rich, tax cheat Warren Buffet, admits that he has too much money. And I say that after $50 million you’ve got too much money. The voters spoke, give them the “wealth tax” they’ve demanded.
- confiscation of all “non-profit” assets. Any business that’s engaging in “not for profit” activities is engaging in wealth destruction. Wealth destruction is the providence of government and those “non-profits” have no business usurping governmental authority. The economy cannot recover with willy-nilly wealth destruction, it must be left to the professionals. Confiscate their assets and close them down.
It’s well past time that the GOP shut down the taxpayer funded axillary wings of the Democratic Party and their money laundering schemes.
DISAGREEING WITH OBAMA CAN RUIN CHRISTMAS, SAYS WHITE HOUSE REPORT. Any Republican refusal to accept President Barack Obama’s fiscal plan may ruin Christmas for the nation’s retailers, the White House claimed in a report released Monday morning.“The National Retail Federation is forecasting that holiday sales will grow 4.1 percent this year … [but] if … READ MORE: http://bwcentral.org/2012/11/disagreeing-with-obama-can-ruin-christmas-says-white-house-report/
I’d just let the Bush era tax cuts expire, and run ads on national TV telling the country that Reid refused to negotiate, Obama refused to negotiate, so there was no deal and Obama won. Now that we have Clinton era tax rates, let the Democrats explain why we can’t have Clinton era spending.
Give the Dems what they want. Get rid of the Bush era tax “cuts.” And in exchange, freeze government spending at, say, 2004 levels. If you don’t want to touch social security or medicare then change the law so that the revenues earmarked for these programs CANNOT ever be used (raided) for anything else (Al Gore’s “lock box”). Cut the remaining expenditures across the board (yes defense as well) to fit into the budget. This will erase “baseline budgeting” where the government is guaranteed an automatic growth rate of around 8% without doing anything.
“…But the president has made clear, also, that he understands that compromise has to be part of this.”
Reminds me of the “Rules of Engagement” episode where one guy (Jeff I think, played by Patrick Wharburton) said something like “Audrey wanted to get a cat, I didn’t want a cat, so we compromised and got a cat.” The friend says, “well I’m allergic to cats”, response “so am I”.
Let’s compromise and do what I want and your feelings have nothing to do with it.
Since we’re spreading the misery around, how about a congressional/presidential pay cut?
As others have stated: compromise in DC means Republican capitulation to Democrat demands. This was terrible under Bush where promising programs and laws were totally wrecked by compromise with Democrats, particularly Ted Kennedy whom Republicans ALWAYS fought each for prime groveling position at his feet. Then they acted surprised when he kicked them in the face, so they just grovelled harder the next time and got a harder booting. It was really disgusting, particularly how they slobbered all over him when he finally died.
But then most Republicans want the same thing as Democrats: bigger government. They lie when they say they want “cuts.” What they mean is “Reductions in the Rate of Growth” which is not the same thing as cutting the absolute size of government. No, they’re all for bigger government. They only fight over how big and how fast. The Democrats want total control NOW by revolution. Republicans will ooze on up to that. Obama is the perfect hybrid in that he does a lot in secret and has been taking his time but will very soon spring the trap when things will happen very fast.
Sorry, but Obama’s STILL campaigning after 4 years; he’s got no time for trivia like “fiscal ciffs” and such.
“Harry Reid (D-Nev.) declared on the floor of the upper chamber that there’s only one tax-cut extension that will make it past Obama’s desk: his”
I think he meant “The Leftist Senate is broken… I only hope House Republicans have been paying attention.”
So, dump Boehner and put someone in as Speaker who will stop Reid’s insane bills… and a few of the insane bills in the House while he’s at it.
Someone with a spine for a change.
Someone who will come back with a balanced budget that cuts federal spending by the required $1.3T or whatever it is.
There’s plenty of room to compromise over whether the federal debt should be paid off in 40 years or 5 years or something in between, whether congressional (and judicial and presidential) pay should be cut by 2% or 20%, whether to freeze federal government spending at 1980 or 1990 levels.
If need be, shut down the blasted feral federal government for a week or 10 weeks; I’m in no hurry for their depredations to continue (as the woman in the storage pods commercial says).
If raising taxes on wealthy raises so little money, why is it so damn important to prevent doing it by any means necessary? Most of the rich don’t care very much if you tax them at the Clinton rates. Lets get this damn issue off the table.
Let the Bush era tax cuts expire. I’d rather see it “rain” on everyone’s parade. I am sick and tired of the liberal sponsored class warfare. This crap about don’t touch my taxes but raise his because he makes more than me is disingenuous to the max. Everyone needs to feel the pinch of higher taxes. BTW, I HATE paying income taxes but I am all for EVERYONE sharing the burden.