Felons Can’t Own Guns. So How Did This Guy Acquire Three … Gun Companies?
In August of 2009, Booth made his third and most alarming acquisition, bringing Bob Reynolds of Templar Consulting under the Victory brand.
Templar/Reynolds is licensed by the ATF to build weapons heavily regulated by the National Firearms Act of 1934 (NFA), including selective-fire weapons and machine guns. Booth allegedly ran Templar into the ground, as he did Pace Airlines, and Reynolds was forced to restructure Templar Consulting through a Chapter 11 bankruptcy. Victory Arms allegedly still possesses (or possessed) Templar property awarded to the company by the bankruptcy court, including: 3000 rounds of 5.56 ammunition, around 24 handguards, 148 bolts, cam pins, and 300 trigger control pins. Possessing these parts, in actuality or on paper, should presumably put Booth in prison for a very long time.
But authorities have allegedly turned a blind eye to Booth’s activities, time and again.
Investigations conducted by those interested have been far more competent.
An investigator has alleged that Lee Booth acquired a North Carolina concealed handgun permit within the past decade in Guilford County, apparently in direct violation of North Carolina state law. Booth allegedly surrendered the permit to the Guilford County Sheriff’s Department once it was revealed he had a criminal record, and the department allegedly let the investigation drop in order to avoid the embarrassment of explaining how they issued a permit to a felon in the first place. If true, this places the department and Booth in violation of numerous laws. The same investigator also alleges that the ATF’s Atlanta office knew he was a felon as a result of the Detonics USA acquisition in 2007, but no prosecution was pursued.
Likewise, Templar’s Chapter 11 court case and filings show that Booth’s company, Victory Arms, claimed ownership of gun parts and firearms belonging to Templar Consulting — including parts regulated by the National Firearms Act and Gun Control Act of 1968 — and had possession of these parts as well. This was evidence presented in a federal court that shaped the court’s ruling. ATF auditors were told on two occasions that Victory/Booth had controlled parts, and was reminded that Booth was a convicted felon. ATF again chose not to intervene.
After the Templar/Victory split, it is suspected that the FFL acquired by Victory was revoked, but no criminal charges have apparently been filed. We also know that the ATF was notified that Booth/Victory had illegally taken possession of AR-15 style rifles and parts from Reynolds, which was confirmed by the ATF’s own audit of Reynolds’ books (Reynolds did not know of Booth’s conviction until after their split, and maintains his FFL and rights to manufacturer custom firearms).
We have stumbled across one possible reason why the ATF may have refused to act.
According to an eyewitness, an IRS agent was frequently a guest of Booth’s at Victory Arms. It seems rather odd that a federal agent would frequent an establishment run by a convicted felon. As federal agencies in smaller localities such as Greensboro often share office space and close relationships with other agencies, it isn’t absurd to wonder if the agent’s alleged friendship with Booth and chummy relationship with other federal agencies became a factor in the local ATF’s refusal to act.
If all or even most of the allegations made by various sources are true, Lee Franklin Booth should be behind bars. If these allegations are accurate, Booth is guilty of possessing hundreds of firearms, operating three firearms companies that each had firearms inventory, and receiving a CCW permit.
A U.S. Department of Justice investigation should be launched to investigate the possibility that multiple law enforcement agencies allowed a felon to run free after attempting to build a gun manufacturing empire.
This couldn’t be the plot of a bad Hollywood movie. It simply isn’t believable theater. Unfortunately, it is real life, and those agencies responsible have a hell of a lot of accounting to do for their failures.
As The Professor would say, the country’s in the very best of hands.
Well there you go again, bursting everyone’s bubble that Obamacare will bend the cost curve down by managing the health care delivery system facing a looming doctor shortage, protecting the consumer from fraud, regional state medical market monopolies, and quacks impersonating physicians.
Clearly you have exposed an undercover/sting operation. Be prepared for a visit from the feds, who don’t take kindly to that sort of thing.
The innocent must be punished; the guilty must be set free. How else is the government going to convince us that maintaining their favor is more important than behaving legally?
Please submit your resume to whitehouse.gov.
Constitution @ work. Shall not be infringed upon
Not sure how to take this….
I do suggest you do some more research before demanding the ATF jump in and get this guy. You could be setting a dangerous precident because:
Owning a company (or several) that produce products you may not be entitled to PRIVATELY own yourself, is not a crime.
Would the president of GM be forced to resign if he gets a DUI conviction?
No? then how can he be “allowed” to be around cars if his license is suspended?
Would you advocate him being arrested by the FEDERALLIES for showing up at work at the car plant, or car show, since he’s not allowed to DRIVE?
Also, felons CAN have their rights restored. It is NOT impossible to legally “re-gain” your rights to own firearms, and get concealed carry permits issued….it happens more often than you think.
I wish you would have commented on whether that is indeed the case with him or not. Since you did not, I’m inclined to believe he IS within his reconstructed “legal rights” to be around/own/carry firearms, and for some reason that really REALLY annoys you.
I’ve never heard of this guy before. You paint a picture of him as a conniving slimeball, and perhaps he is….But lamenting the fact the Feds dont lock him away on (possibly trumped up) weapons charges in order to to “get even” with him for past business practices that seem to upset you so much, is very alarming to me.
Its the kind of thing Facists/Communists/Socialists/Progessives always dream of doing to their “enemies”, and quite frankly, I’m very dissapointed to find that sort of attitude expoused by a PJM contributor.
Please be careful what you wish for from the feds…you just might get it
I must emphatically agree with this comment. He owns gun companies, not necessarily guns.
And, please, please, don’t ever provide ammunition to F Troop.
Re-read the article. Booth took physical possession of more than 500 completed firearms from Detonics USA alone. Unlike toe poor example of a car company, firearms and certain parts are restricted items. The photo alone shows Booth undeniably holding two weapons, good for a 20 year stretch.
The BATF and other agencies involved need to be held accountable. Booth had to surrender his CCH because his rights have not been restored, and his criminal record–which I have seen–has not be expunged.
I did read the article…
you are now adding IMPORTANT FACTS that were NOT contained in the original article.
Your emphasis in the original article concentrated mostly on this guys “douchbaggery-ness”, not on firearms law, and had the tone of a breathless hysterical liberal
“…cant own guns but has three gun COMPANIES”
The kind of headline a 2nd amendment supporter like me raises an eyebrow at first take
Yes, the part about him “taking the guns/parts” is illegal.
But the title of the post asks about how he acquired three gun companies.
The answer is, “because that’s not illegal”. Felons can own companies. They can even own companies that make things felons can’t possess, and as long as the felon owner doesn’t come in possession as part of his ownership, he’s free and clear of liability.
rmd: True except for the ammunition, which felons also can’t possess. (18 USC 922 (d))
Again, did Booth or his COMPANY take “posession” of over 500 firearms?
However “unfair loophole” it makes you feel, unless he, as a person, physically had them in his private posession, its not a crime to operate a gun business.
Even if it outrages you, if he had a “manager” or “supervisor” or “shop foreman” or “sales rep” officially handle the transactions on behalf of the company he OWNS, thats not a crime.
Believe it or not, sometimes the “gun police” are buddies with gunshops and gunshop owners. “Make sure I dont see you do X,Y or Z” are sometimes the way it is
My own personal experience with a State Police Firearms Investigation Unit officer (who checked all the nut-buster B.S. rules relating to retail gunshops) was very professional and friendly.
Small stuff that “could have” shut us down in the Peoples Republic of Jersey was honestly explained, and we made corrections. Things like a Smith and Wesson calander in the window violated the “no firearm, or facimile thereof, shall be visable from the street” rule, because of a picture. Also, personal firearms being cleaned or repaired should never be in the same “rack or display case” as the stores guns, because they can be construed as “un-papered” inventory.
He knew our intent was to run a straight up ethical gunsmithing business, so if something was a “technicality”, he TOLD US, he SHOWED US, and we THANKFULLY complied. He ENFORCED the law, he did not hunt for ways to trap us within it.
You seem to be itching to get this guy….stretching a rule to its maximum in order to get those you have an ax to grind with, is a dangerous power to encourage the State to use
According to the Templar Consulting bankruptcy filing Victory Arms, Inc. is a Nevada corporation. A quick search of the Nevada Secretary of State’s web site (http://nvsos.gov/) shows Victory Arms as a “Domestic Corporation” which would support your point that he did actually own the weapons in question the corporation owned them. Mr. Booth just owns stock in the corporation. Now if he acted as the agent for this transfer or if he signed for the receipt of the weapons in any way he could be in some legal trouble depending upon the laws of the states involved.
Point to note: Templar Consulting is listed a an LLC which I believe would not afford the same ownership protections as a “C” corporation.
Also, Mr. Owens point still stands regarding the photo, Mr. Booth is in a great deal of trouble just for handling a firearm as a convicted felon, and the concealed weapons permit violation is extremely serious.
No, Mr. Owens Booth, did not “take possession of 500 firearms.” You have bad and incorrect information. I have 100% irrevocable proof, records, witnesses. You are very wrong.
Certainly your new idiot friends didn’t inform you that in Fact the ATF did investigate this and many other false claims in great detail with numerous visits to me, or mention that these same claims have been before two State Court Judges and two Federal Judges.
I don’t know who you are or what your major malfunction seems to be and really don’t care but I promise you that you and I will know each other very well here soon as we go through a lengthy and expensive Court process, where I will produce the truth and facts and you will admit you are very wrong and possibly those that have tricked you into this dirty “gotcha game.”
You are a complete idiot but as I say Ignorance is a very expensive lesson.
I am calling you a Liar for the record and will see you in Court soon.
Be Advised.
I know the story here I loaded the firearms and drove them to NC. Booth NEVER had them in his possession. Owens is wrong, these are outright LIES. BATFE also was informed and gave permission for the transfer and movement. Owens is trying to screw another person over yet Again. He needs to be sued into poverty and knowing Booth, Owens will be in Court for a very long time…………..
> I must emphatically agree with this comment. He owns gun companies, not necessarily guns.
Felons are barred from both owning/running gun companies (licensees) and from possessing.
The prohibition on ownership was an issue for Winchester/Olin in the mid 60s because a principal had an income tax conviction. The current senator Dodd’s father pushed through a relief from disabilities program that allowed the Treasury secretary to decide whether Winchester/Olin could stay in biz.
See http://rkba.org/research/hardy/fopa_rev.txt .
And what ever happened to paying having “payed his debt to society”. I am in full agreement as well. You cannot be incensed on the one hand against big government and it’s fascist demogogery and then turn around and promote it, without people wondering who’s side your on anyway.
Even worse, now we have people who claim to be libertarians and advocates of individual rights and freedom trying to tell people what lines of business they’re allowed to practice.
And someone who’s been convicted for a crime going on 30 years ago (over half his lifetime looking at that photo…) shouldn’t be allowed to operate a business manufacturing or selling firearms?
Heck, the ban on owning and operating the products of that company shouldn’t extend that long, they should be lifted after he’s freed from prison.
If you don’t think someone’s safe around people while he may have a weapon because of something he did in the past, he should never have been released from prison.
Instead the restrictions on former felons mean that effectively ANY conviction for anything is a life sentence. When did that happen? Where in the law does it state that all crimes carry a mandatory life sentence?
Where does it state that the state can decide you’re unfit to own a company because of something you did 30 years ago?
And the Feds killed Randy Weaver’s wife and kid over a few inches sawed off of a shotgun barrel.
There is not better argument against the powers of the Federal Government than their own incompetence.
I dont think it was a even a few inches, I believe it was just ONE QUARTER INCH shorter (than the required 18″) that caused all that nonsense…
And it was the Gov’t informant that begged him to do it….offering a strangely large sum of money for a few minutes of simple work with a hacksaw, something that ANY able bodied person could have done themself….
…and actually handed him the hacksaw. The searce and arrest warrant, were issued after his court date was changed and no notification given of the change… and his susequent ‘failure to appear’ There are two types of possesion in case law pertaining to 922g. Active possesion and the catchall, constructive possesion… whereas another testifies that you instructed him or her to do something with a firearm, such as clean it, or put it in a gun safe for that matter.
Remember… AFT agents are known to fabricate evidence, destroy inculplinary evidence and are trained to avoid perjury while lieing under oath.
…and actually handed him the hacksaw, and provided the truck tailgate for a workbench, on the side of the road. The search and arrest warrants, were issued after his court date was changed and no notification given of the change… and his susequent ‘failure to appear’ There are two types of possesion in case law pertaining to 922g. Active possesion and the catchall, constructive possesion… whereas another testifies that you instructed him or her to do something with a firearm, such as clean it, or put it in a gun safe for that matter.
Remember… AFT agents are known to fabricate evidence, destroy inculplinary evidence and are trained to avoid perjury while lieing under oath.
Left unmentioned are any campaign contributions he may have made along the way….
Of course the BATFE is the keystone cops organization in charge of things that are legal.
It is legal for the People to own guns.
It is legal to make and drink alcohol.
It is legal to grow and smoke or chew tobacco.
It is legal to possess, manufacture, and use explosives.
Laws which infringe on the right keep, bear, and own firearms are of no constitutional effect. Their licenses are not required. Their every act fraud. Their police power is assault under color of authority
But those all are great sources of revenue!!!!
In the end it is all about the Benjamins.
> Also, felons CAN have their rights restored. It is NOT impossible to legally “re-gain” your rights to own firearms, and get concealed carry permits issued….it happens more often than you think.
While felons can have their rights restored as far as state laws are concerned, that restoration is not binding on the feds or wrt federal gun law. Restoration for federal purposes is a federal process and the feds haven’t done any such restorations for decades. There’s even a law against spending any money on processing applications. (No, they can’t charge the applicant for expenses.)
Andy – The federal restoration process is for federal crimes only. States can and do restore 2A rights for state offenses. These restorations remove both the state and federal restrictions.
In fact the Feds strip you of your gun rights even if a only a state crime. Even though the state can restore your state rights, the feds don’t care. You can be sent to jail for ten years no matter how unrealted to violence/guns the state OR fed felony was. The wording is basically if the state takes away any of your rights for any period of time for the crime (they all do) you can get all of them back but your 2nd ammendment rights. Its an absurd policy and blantantly violates due process to have your petition for redress be ignored by the government. While I agree that violent criminals should not own guns while incarcerated, they should 100% get their rights back once they paid their debt. If they are so dangerous that allowing them a weapon put the public in danger, they should not be out of jail. You can easily kill someone with a knife, car, hammer, etc, etc. Maybe we should lock up all former prisoners in bubbles for life once they get out. Keep in mind if you go to jail for TAX EVASION you can never own a gun again. Or you accidentally kill an endangered animal? Felony with no jail time (there are nearly 40% of these for state convictions)? Sorry no gun for you ever again. Tell me that makes sense. It is simply a backdoor to strip away people’s 2nd ammendment rights. The federal legal code is so out of control that even the library of congress does not know the number of actual crimes on the books. Thousands of regulatory crimes exist that are felonies. I highly recommend you look at the book Three Felonies a Day. Here’s the author giving a talk. There are tens of thousands of felons who got ensnared by some law they were unaware of with no way to get back their 2nd ammendment rights, and some time ALL of their rights without a presidential pardon which end up going to the buddies of the elite politicians (i.e. Mark Rich). No federal expungement and state expungement does NOT remove you restriction to own a weapon by the feds. Estimates of people in the US with felony convictions is anywhere from 15%-25%. 5 million or more! Don’t think it can’t be you. Yet another reason the federal government needs to be reduced drastically.
You are incorrect. If a state removes a weapons disability for a state felony conviction, then the federal weapons disability disappears at the same time baring some other issue.
NOT SO! Its a completely different jurisdiction. Even if you have been found not guilty of ‘felon in posession’ in a state, and can document the restoration of rights… the feds can still prosecute under title 18, chapter 44, firearms statutes. Been there, and in the 6th circuit court of appeals… twice! ..and in both instances the court ruled that the states restoration of ‘rights’ does not bar federal prosecution.
You may very well be correct in the overall gist of the article and in other details, but this particular detail is simply false. There is no federal prohibition on possessing guns parts other than the serial numbered receiver.
Not true…
Mere posession of certain trigger group components of an M-16, (selector, hammer, trigger, auto sear) and NOTHING ELSE BUT A BOX OF EMPTY AIR, is considered an Un-Registered Full Auto by the ATF. No need to have a gun, just these bits will get you jail time.
At least, thats what went down in the 80′s…been a while since I tinkered with paperwork regarding full auto stuff
In response to the Root reply to comment #10:
This is untrue. Of all the components named, only the ownership of an unregistered sear would be unlawful. Possession of a Registered Drop In Auto-Sear (RDIAS) constitutes possession of a fully automatic weapon. Furthermore, it is the serial number of the RDIAS that the BATFE would record and authorize as a class III weapon; not the serial of the registered receiver. Additionally, ownership of an unregistered sear would NOT be illegal if the individual did not also possess a receiver.
This is untrue. Of all the components named, only the ownership of an unregistered sear would be unlawful. Possession of a Registered Drop In Auto-Sear (RDIAS) constitutes possession of a fully automatic weapon. Furthermore, it is the serial number of the RDIAS that the BATFE would record and authorize as a class III weapon; not the serial of the registered receiver. Additionally, ownership of an unregistered sear would NOT be illegal if the individual did not also possess a receiver.
Root… you are correct. For a violation of 922g it only requires the ‘possesion’ of ANY firearm part outside of the stock…barrel, breach, upper or lower receiver or any one of their components…sear, trigger, firing pin… even the firing pin spring….within the territorial jurisdiction of the US, in or effecting commerce.
Root… you are correct. For a violation of 922g it only requires the ‘possesion’ of ANY firearm part outside of the stock…barrel, breach, upper or lower receiver or any one of their components…sear, trigger, firing pin… even the firing pin spring….within the territorial jurisdiction of the US, in or effecting interstate commerce.
Is it ironic that his name contains both Lee and Booth? And that this story deals with firearms? Kind of a force multiplier for this-story-doesn’t-end-well.
“Jenkins”
“Jenkins” pleaded guilty to these charges on July 8, 2010. His sentence will be followed by a five year term of supervised release.
“Jenkins” and co-defendant Robin Brant robbed Bank Mutual, 5320 Monona Drive, Monona, Wisconsin, on April 24, 2010. Both Jenkins and Brant wore disguises during the robbery. “Jenkins”, a multi-convicted felon, brandished a loaded .38 caliber semi-automatic pistol during the bank robbery and jumped the teller counter. “Jenkins” directed one teller to open the vault. After she did so, “Jenkins” violently struck her on the back of the head with the pistol. He then restrained her hands. Brant brandished a facsimile firearm at two other tellers and restrained their hands.
After “Jenkins” and Brant left the bank, dye packs contained within the money immediately exploded in their car, which they had stolen earlier in the day. Brant was apprehended nearby and “Jenkins” was subsequently located in a tree in a Monona golf course. Both of them immediately confessed to traveling to Monona from Milwaukee for the purpose of committing the bank robbery.
Brant is scheduled for sentencing on September 3, 2010 at 2:00 p.m.
The charges against “Jenkins” were the result of an investigation conducted by the Monona Police Department, Federal Bureau of Investigation, and Madison Police Department. The prosecution of the case has been handled by Assistant U.S. Attorney Rita M. Rumbelow.
I’m interested in that kidnapping conviction. He was convicted of “KIDNAPPING 2ND DEGREE (PRINCIPAL)”. That looks like it might be a custodial dispute kind of situation. Not to say that he should be excused for violating the law, but it would be helpful in evaluating whether he is quite the scumbag the author makes him out to be.
4 years for kidnapping? Seems terribly short, doesn’t it? Guess it was technically kidnapping but in reality something else, like indeed not bringing his kid back in time to an estranged mother after a weekend of visiting rights.
And it’s of course almost 30 years ago… Had he been the scumbag he’s made out to be, where are all the other crimes he’s committed over the 25 years he’s been on the loose with the thousands if not millions of BAD GUNS he’s manufactured?
If there’s a better case for dropping the mandatory ban on former felons owning weapons than this one, I haven’t seen it.
And that should be the conclusion of the story, not a rallying cry for harsher gun control, especially coming from somene who claims to advocate 2nd ammendment rights.
I suggest that the federal law that prohibits ownership of firearms by felons is unconstitutional and ripe for review in light of District of Columbia v. Heller.
Agreed. If you’re in jail you lose your rights. When you’re out, you get them back. Self-defense is the first law of nature.
Seriously, isn’t there some sort of well-known legal disconnect between guns owned by a person and guns owned by a corporation? In the back of my memory, I seem to remember a case where for some reason a guy lost his vetting to own NFA weapons, but didn’t have to give back any of the NFA weapons in his possession because on the paperwork they were legally owned by a corporation he had created, and the corporation hadn’t lost its vetting.
IIRC, the law distinguishes between ownership and possession, defining the latter as physical. A felon would therefore be breaking the law by possessing a firearm, regardless of whether he owned, rented or borrowed it.
Ownership may also be forbidden, (IANAL), and so perhaps the sort of legal dodge you describe might make a charge under that section of the law moot, but the vast majority of charged and arrests under this law pertain to possession (e.g. Bob’s point about the photograph).
Comment 17, assuming it passes moderation, was intended to be a reply to this message but I clicked the wrong button.
Sigh. I’m a doofus. When I realized that I had posted a new comment (17) instead of a reply to my reply to comment, I tried to attach a redirect and put that on the wrong comment (14)! I’ll quit now.
People are completely ignorant of how Federal Firearm Licences are handed out. A corporation can apply for a FFL had have an employee or employeess listed on the FFL as the person or people conducting business. This is done every day with big sporting good stores, like Big 5. Big five applies for a FFL (for each store location) and lists the store manager as the person doing the day to day record keeping, business transactions etc. The CEO of Big 5 can be a convicted felon and this is still legal.
So in the case of Booth. He can legally own a gun company, so long as the FFL issued to the company doesn’t list him as the person responsible for the day to responsibilties reqyuired under the FFL.
Also, the only two gun parts the BATF cares about is Receivers and gun parts that allow a firearm to be select fire or full auto. All other gun parts are not (in general) regulated, can be purchased and sent through the mail etc.
Booth, may be a douche bag, but so long as he conducted all of his transactions under the cover of incorporation and his name was not listed on the FFL; he is in full compliance with the federal Firearms law.
Except his “possession” of those two handguns in the photograph, in his hands.
Hard to explain those away as being under the “control” of a corporation.
Are those real guns or models/props?
If real, do they contain the regulated parts?
Quite often companies will use props instead of the real thing in promo pictures and store displays. Think of the “demo versions” of electronic devices used in highstreet stores to limit damages by customers abusing them. Empty shells, more or less.
The photo doesn’t show.
Doesn’t in fact show if it’s really the guy or a standin (farfetched, of course, but for argument’s sake it could happen)
You know what Mr. Owens?
The more I think about it, I’d really RATHER see an article about someone convicted of SHOOTING PEOPLE, getting released, and caught SHOOTING PEOPLE AGAIN, and the Feds not going after HIM for “felon with a gun” rules.
That only happens, oh I dunno, 3-5 times a WEEK here in Philly….
Do us all a favor, pal….
Dont encourage the Feds to go after low hanging fruit like the photo you post (ten years for holding his company product?) while convicted, released, repeate murderers violate Federal Firearms Laws every single day, with absolute impunity.
Thats a more important, MUCH MORE RELAVENT story, that this
The more I think about it, I’d really RATHER see an article about someone convicted of SHOOTING PEOPLE, getting released, and caught SHOOTING PEOPLE AGAIN, and the Feds not going after HIM for “felon with a gun” rules.
Well said.
That only happens, oh I dunno, 3-5 times a WEEK here in Philly….
It’s like a mayor at a press conference regarding the murder of a policeman holding up a type of rifle that had never before been used in any of the other 4,000 or so murders that happened in the city in the last decade and demanding the end of the “right to carry” all the while leaving out the fact that the murderers were felons on parole .
If my memory is right that’s pretty much what Nutter did.
And, btw, murders are still less in the city than before Harrisburg made them adopt shall issue.
You may be correct with regard to possession of M16 fire control parts. My unresearched understanding was that possession of such parts and a semi-auto receiver would be construed as possession of a machine gun. I will concede to your knowledge on the subject. However, that is neither here nor there with respect to the quoted passage because no such parts are named.
Not fully related to the topic at hand, but related to gun rights and felons:
G. Gordon Liddy is known as one of those convicted in the Watergate scandal, and is a felon. I do not know of his current status, but years ago on his show, he commented upon his status as a felon and his enjoyment of firearms.
Basically, Mrs. Liddy owned a lot of firearms. She even keeps one under her husband’s pillow.
Let’s see, no picture on the linked site, so we may not have the same guy.
More importantly, the firearms restrictions are unconstitutional, something obvious to anyone who has bothered to simply read the Constitution. There are provisions for depriving someone of “life and liberty” through due process of law, no provision for depriving them of voting rights, religious freedom, speech, or arms rights. hmmm….
As an indictment of government incompetence, the article is worthy. Yet I wonder just how outraged over government’s incompetence in enforcing unconstitutional laws we should get.
What? We have a president of the United States with so little known about his background he can’t qualify for a security clearance; We have admitted felons in Congress and the Administration, and you are worried about this guy?
Give me an F’in break!!! At least THIS guy could help us in an attack on the homeland of America. And I’d be more inclined to share a fox hole with him than some ‘Americanized’ alien that carries a flag of his home country of Islamabad, and can’t understand english too well.
Let me ask you this;
WOULD YOU SHARE A FOX HOLE WITH BARRACK HUSSEIN OBAMA???????
Time to do away with the whole notion of FFLs. There was a time, and within living memory, when you walked in the door, paid your money and walked out with your gun. There is no moral or rational reason to involve the government in the sale of firearms. The whole business of filing out form 4473 assumes guilt – and our laws are based on the presumption of innocence. Get F Troop out of the gun business.
Sounds to me more like an argument to get rid of absurd restictions on people’s constitutional rights once they are no longer in prison, to me.
Uh, has anyone stopped to consider whether or not he may have had his right to own firearms restored?
This really, really seems like hysteria.
I’ve always wondered what happened to Hooters Air. Now I find out that the reason I didn’t get to fly with Hooters girls is because of this idiot?
Lock him up!
Yea! That’s an obvious violation of ‘Pursuit of Happiness”.
jvon
Hooters was closed 3 years before I became involved in Pace.
So how about Locking your mouth up or get the real facts.
Too bad ignorance isn’t a felony so you could get locked up.
Why would ANYONE be surprised to see that this is how “Law Enforcement” operates in the US? Be sure to thank them appropriately for the OUTSTANDING job they have done!
Who cares about felons, I want to make sure people on the terror watch list get guns. It’s the Tea Party way.
…considering Janet Napolitano’s statement that returning vets, people against illegal immigrants, abortion and ‘tea paty’ types are potential terrorists…I’d tend to agree.
She was quoting a study from the Bush Administration. But you don’t care about that part. Why not? Because you lack the information and the discernment to offer cogent commentary.
You seem to just spew crap out of the side of your neck, and expect (hope) people take your word as THE word. A couple things.. Your first blame it on Bush statement, is false on its face… “She was quoting a study from the Bush Administration” The DHS’s department, Office of Intelligence and Analysis (I&A) issued the nine-page document titled “Rightwing Extremism: Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in Radicalization and Recruitment.” On April 7, 09. Educate yourself further and you will find the classified DHS report is verbatim rendition of the leaked Missouri Information Analysis Center (MIAC)’s classified report which was leaked to Alex Jones and then published in March 09. See: http://www.infowars.com/secret-state-police-report-ron-paul-bob-barr-chuck-baldwin-libertarians-are-terrorists/ …and the whole reason Napolitano was even questioned on the (secret) report.
The MIAC report distributed to law enforcement is a more virulent version of a similar report compiled by the FBI in Phoenix, AZ during the Clinton administration (see page one and page two of the document). The Phoenix FBI document calls “defenders” of the Constitution “right-wing extremists.”
Secondly, You state that I “… lack the information and the discernment to offer cogent commentary.” When your statement is “Who cares about felons, I want to make sure people on the terror watch list get guns. It’s the Tea Party way.” WTF? How far gone are you? BTW, I can’t seem to find any where in our Constitution where it says the Second Amendment has been abridged or modified to exclude felons… excepting federal code, written by men to modify our inalienable. Please if you do reply, keep from personal attack, no keyboard warrior BS, just pretend we’re face to face.
I think this article only scratches the surface about Mr. Booth. He also claims to have been in the special forces with the Marines. Check that out, he was not. Saying that Mr. Booth is a con man, is putting it mildly, he is a huge crook that has stolen millions from innocent victims, and it looks like karma is catching up with him, and it’s about time.
Mr Henderson,
I don’t know who you are yet;however, you are a LIAR. There is no such thing as “Marine Special Forces” all Marines are considered a “special Force.” No Marine would ever say they were in Special Forces, is not the Army. You have also accused me of “stealing millions of dollars” again you are a liar and I hope you can produce evidence of this lie.
I understand all the other comments based on the Bob Owens Article and have turned that matter over to a very Competent Attorney due to it’s gross inaccuracies and untruths. I know the individuals who mislead Mr Owens and I know why they mislead him. Stay posted for that outcome.
Notice the “photo” funny shadow on the big pistol, what is the big white blotch on the left sleeve………fun never ends.
Your comments are in fact outright lies Mr Henderson, You are a Liar. You are either going to prove The “stolen Millions” or you are going to be making payments to an attorney in your defense just to start.
I am stating for the record what you have stated here is untrue and that you are a LIAR. Show me the millions.
Link to retraction:
http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/correction-and-clarification_regarding_lee_booth/
Skip the whole argument about corporations v. individuals. If you read the entire post, he had also obtained a CCW. You obtain a CCW as an “individual”, so the rest of the discussion is moot. Under the law, he belongs in jail.
Now, we can have a whole discussion on whether it is correct to deny someone their Rights after they’ve served their time. I may be in the minority, but I don’t think a felony should automatically cause a revocation of an individual’s rights. Rights are, by the Founder’s definition, God-given, NOT man-permitted. Once a person has paid his “debt” to society, he should be free to move on. The Jet Blue “flight attendant” who jumped down the emergency chute with a couple beers and then ran off for some rump-wrangling with his pole-pirate boyfriend accepted a plea bargain for a FELONY this week in order to avoid jail time. He might be a nut, but should his rights be terminated for life because he wigged out once? I don’t think it rises to that level. In fairness, his felony CAN be reduced to a misdemeanor after he completes his probationary period, but for now, he’s a felon. Felonies are thrown aroundlike candy and while I don’t really want killers running around with guns, we need to look at the big picture here. The bottom line is freedom, which in this America, is becoming as rare as a ten-pond diamond.
Your reference to the ATF made me think of a series of articles you wrote a few months ago regarding the ATF confiscating airsoft bb guns. Not sure if it was mentioned in your article or I read it somewhere else (I play airsoft. I was very interested), but the ATF agent that was responsible for the confiscation of the airsoft toys had been moved around the country quite a bit, allegedly due to screwing up wherever he went. It would be a very interesting coincidence if he worked at the Atlanta ATF office when this happened. You may want to look into that.
Has anyone paid attention to what this gentleman did to the three companies he was involved with? He didn’t seem to be in the business of providing good products or services for his customers. He seemed to be interested only in enriching himself at the detriment of others. For that Madof-like behavior, he should be under investigation. The gun ownership issue is secondary.
Good point. My earlier argument was along similar lines…the author seems to be most upset with this guys financial shenanagins, and is pissed of he (may have) found a loophole to get his gun rights back
So sicking the ATF on someone you have ill feelings for seems to be an acceptable “meant to an end” for the author….a very dangerous game to play with 2nd amendment rights
Prior to accusing someone of acting like Madoff, get your facts in order.
Please provide me with proof of “personal enrichment.”
Maybe it was me who started to get involved but found out about “criminal behavior” and got away from it. Ever consider that Bill?
If I am like Madoff, show me the money.
“Don’t worry, folks. We are from the government, and we’re here to help.”
Is Booth affiliated with The New Black Panther Party? If so he has automatic blanket immunity! Doesn’t he?
Black and white law and case law notwithstanding, some of us believe that the Second Amendment provides an absolute guarantee from Federal regulation of firearms.”Shall not be infringed” allows for zero exceptions. Certainly registration, sales records,etc., constitute infringement on the ownership and use of firearms. An FFl is such an infringement.
Good luck to the man. This article has a slant in it against matters which aren’t even clearly resolved. It reads like a man who got his act together after something which isn’t entirely clear but classed as a felon. For example did he ‘technically’ kidnap his daughter in a custody battle? What was it? Selectively left out in the article.
THe author of this article continues down this broken path. It is the reason why communism and socialism and broken economies is comming to a town near you. All because of negative distractions like this.
Um, yeah, he just ran three companies into the ground. That’s what you call “getting your act together?”
The problem is that, whether or not you approve of the law, under the law he is a felon. And, as a felon, he took physical possession of firearms, and was granted a permit. And -and this is the biggie- this was all done with the apparent knowledge of the AFT. MMMkay? Federal agents don’t get to pick & choose which laws they enforce.
“Um, yeah, he just ran three companies into the ground. That’s what you call “getting your act together?” You seem to be well informed… perhaps you could expound on the three companies he ran into the ground. … or are you just hoping for something to be the way you ‘think’ it is?
“-and this is the biggie- this was all done with the apparent knowledge of the AFT” Your statement is an answer in its self. If he passed the scrutiny of the lying ass and purjurous ATF…and being that he and the ATF know the details you do not… it stands to reason that he is ‘good to go’ lawfully. You can make a zillion accusations… but without fact, you are just manufacturing and spreading what is known as rumors or ‘gossup’.
BTW… I’m new here too. Does that mean my post carries less weight?
Duke-Jinx
I did not “run three companies into the ground.”
You are correct the BATFE did in fact come an investigate all the “claims” that were fed to Owens by others. They have used Owens and made him out a Fool.
They know who they are and so do I.
All this arcticle wants is to to slowly errode gun rights. One faceat of the American way of life at a time. Slowly adding clausing and so on, quietly, to every offence no matter how minor. In time that offence, especiallyby those unfamiliar to it in the first place, will be viewed as serious for nothing more than the quoted punishment. Shameful.
You’re new around here, aren’t you? Accusing Bob Owens of “errodeing” gun rights is, well, just darn funny. It’s kinda like calling Rush Limbaugh a Commie.
” Accusing Bob Owens of “errodeing” gun rights is, well, just darn funny”
Maybe, or maybe not. He clearly wants this guy’s rights eroded… So it seems Bob is just like so many others: I want things for myself but I don’t want others to be alowed to have those things.
Here we have a perfect case for showing how idiotic the laws are that impose a lifetime penalty and revocation of their constitutional rights on people for a single felony, yet Bob uses the case to rant about how someone found a loophole in that law and swam under the radar of gun confiscation groups and law enforcement for decades by running a legitimate business (is Bob anti-business as well, unless it’s his own business? Could be).
Isn’t this what everyone here wants? full deregulation. especially deregulation of guns. Please people like the government. Why all the hate? You probably know someone who works for them that tries hard and does a good job.
We change the soul Biometric Gun Safe if you are involved then you can tour us at bulletproofshield.com
The marines does have a “special forces”. It’s called Marine Recon, walk into any marine recruiting office and look at the posters of the guys with suppressed weapons and sniper rifles freefalling and sneaking around in rubber zodiacs. These are recon marines, and the rest of the marine corps doesn’t get any of that gucci shit, and recruiters pimp them to lure unsuspecting high schoolers into a job pumping gas or shoveling food cause they thought they would be “hard” like the guys in cami paint in all the pictures. There, my two cents
Mr. Con Man Booth, you are a bully. Your threats and promises of legal counsel, is your ammo, you calling people names,shows your lack of character and integrity. You are a “GUILTY” man, that has finally gotten caught. You find companies that are in trouble, ie Pace Airlines, con them into thinking you are going to buy them, rape them of their assets, then run like a thief. Then, leave these companies, with “NOTHING”. If and when you are caught, you lie, declare bankruptcy, and start another company, How many companies have you started, 20, 30? How many bankruptcies, Mr. Con Man Booth?
You “DID’ take those 500 guns, and we have proof. Have a Merry Christmas, Con Man Booth, you will be spending the rest of your worthless life in jail.
“BJB”
Assets at Pace? the place was 25 million in debt. I did not get any assets at Pace. How can you leave a company with nothing to start with with nothing. You area Liar.
You have proof I took 500 guns. Show it, again YOU are a Liar.
I am not Guilty of anything nor have I been caught, so save your false accusations and drama for someone else.
20 or 30 Companies- prove it, more drama and more Lies from you.
Real big brave person hiding behind your computer-post your name or are you afraid your LIES will cost you in a proper Court of Law.
Put up Proof and your real name or shut your Lying Mouth.
You are an idiot and a Liar, a disgrace.
At Least Owens signed his name unlike you you Coward and Liar.
Another great “Bob Owens half baked story”, I did some checking, this fellow Booth for better or worse has in fact been given a Pardon by NC.
The Pardon is a Public Document and it does not say Booth can not own Guns on the Face of the Pardon and the “Warrant” that goes with the Pardon has “no restrictions.”
18USC clearly states that “unless the Pardon prohibits in English on the Face of the document firearms ownership” then the guy does get his 2nd amendment right back,it is a Constitutional issue and not one for “Judge and Jury Bob Owens.”
This story looks like a Character assassination via Bob Owens “Mighty keyboard.” Bully or not he should sue Bob Owens into poverty.
The guy did his crime, paid for it and was Pardoned. He did not get a Life Sentence, Bob.
What did he do shoot your dog or disagree with you on a matter?
This is flat out wrong and an “abuse of Media power.”
I wonder how much other stuff is “fluff” and incorrect here.
Yet another attempt by Bob Owens to try and “be something or someone famous” at some other persons expense.
We all need to start taking the time to check every single fact that Bob Owens spews out in his stories.
Thomas you sound like Booth’s gay lover and Booth sounds like a character out of South Park. Did you girls meet in prison?
George, Isn’t that the great thing about the internet, Cowards like you can make all sorts of untrue and funny little remarks from behind your keyboard and YOU THINK someone can’t find out who you really are in Life.
The only thing Gay about me is the Joy I will soon have watching your comment cost you.
How about coming to see me there Big shot?
George maybe they were doing your wife in her butt while you were licking your dogs penis. You think?
William, it is obvious you are Booth. Booth, is that what your girlfriend Thomas does? Is that how they talk in prison? You are a sorry excuse for a human.
George, looks to me and everyone else Booth signs his name when he posts.
I am not him and you are lucky, Mr Bobbie Neal Reynolds, that I am not him.
Borrow any more money and not pay it back lately??
You start posting nasty insults which have nothing to do with the story and when it happens to you you start losing your mind.
You started the crap shoot, not anyone else.
This is very amusing.
Thomas/William/LBooth are all rather obviously the same sockpuppet. He can use fake names all day long, but can’t avoid that fact that he can only write and think one way, with the same voice.
As for Booth’s pardon, he knows well it is only a Pardon of Forgiveness, which does not restore gun rights. He would have to have an Unconditional Pardon or Pardon of Innocence to restore his rights, which he well knows.
There is also the issue of whether or not he was dishonorably discharged, as he was booted out of the Marine Corps while in prison for his kidnapping charge. If he has the DD, that is a whole new round of federal charges, because a dishonorable discharge is a felony conviction that is not pardonable, if I understand the law correctly.
Perhaps I should check with NCIS for confirmation.
Hey Bob Owens it is my information that the shooter of the Arizona Congress woman read your article where you allegedly stated something about armed insurrection against the US Government and violence against elected Officials.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_congresswoman_shot
Another right wing wack job with a Military Fanatsy/James Bond/Savior of Democracy Complex.
The walls are closing in on you Bobby “Bull Sh**” Owens, bad ass wannabe…………..
Wonder what the ______ people think of your ramblings? You Know the Publicly Traded Company who’s tit you suck for your income.
Didn’t you write that a US Senator needed to be “Drawn and Quartered.”
People need to write to Law Enforcement about your alleged “threats of violence” against our Elected Officials so more shooting don’t occur.
Who says Bob Owens is a Joke and a Pussy, I do.
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Wash. Examiner’s Owens suggests right-wing violence will be necessary, hopes we “feel threatened”
August 03, 2010 2:27 pm ET by Ben Dimiero
Earlier today, I pointed out that conservative media figures have recently been ramping up discussion of possible civil war and armed revolt. Conservative blogger Bob “Confederate Yankee” Owens, who was recently hired by the Washington Examiner, stated that nations that have supposedly collapsed as far as ours have the need to either “reform or replace their governments,” and “reform increasingly seems to be a fleeting option.” Perhaps to prove my point, Owens now says Media Matters should “feel threatened” by him, and even suggests that violence will be necessary.
In a new post titled “Closer to Midnight”, Owens responds to my earlier post by writing: “They portray it as a threat when ‘Conservative media figures openly discuss armed revolution.’ I hope they do feel threatened.” He adds that our “feigned ignorance” and “mockery” in the face of “peaceable protests” means that “perhaps it will take a serious review of our capacity for violence to get them to realize we shall not surrender our individual liberties to their lust for power.”
We have moved “closer to midnight” not because of any singular act , but because of inertia of a political class that does not respect or enforce the laws, or this nation’s sovereignty. We have diametrically opposed views of how our nation can and should be run, and it appears that there is very little room left for negotiation.
Propagandists for the elitists at Media Matters seem troubled by A Nation on the Edge of Revolt. They portray it as a threat when “Conservative media figures openly discuss armed revolution.”
I hope they do feel threatened. Attempts at peaceable protests have been met at turns by feigned ignorance, then mockery, then attacks on the character and motives of those would not sit quietly by. Perhaps it will take a serious review of our capacity for violence to get them to realize we shall not surrender our individual liberties to their lust for power.
I have not yet been swayed to the point of view that an armed conflict is inevitable, TN_NamVolunteer. But we are close enough that one would be wise to prepare for a possible conflict, just as one would prepare for any coming storm.
I wonder what the Washington Examiner’s policy is for employees who openly speculate on the need for politically motivated violence.
I feel the same way. The second amendment is a “right” that you can’t take away. Look at the Martha Stewart case. You people mean to tell me that she shouldn’t have firearms, but the person who neglects or abuses their pet dog is the great gun owner? What about misdemeanor embezzlement or shoplifting? They can own firearms, but the felon embezzler or shoplifter is banned for life? So if someone shoplifts or embezzles $999 dollars worth of money or merchandise they can be the model gun owner, but the person who does the same with $1000 should lose that right for life? Also in many states possession of a Schedule I or Schedule II drug is a felony. Why should someone who got caught with a little coke or heroin years ago be lumped in with violent offenders? In Arizona mere possession of marijuana is a felony, so someone who gets caught with a single joint here should lose the right to own guns for life, but the person who is caught in Virginia or California can be the model armed citizen? I blame our politicians, the laws, and the other idiots who support these laws. Too many victimless actions are crimes and too many of them are felonies. In some gun control states like New Jersey, merely possessing a semi automatic AK-47 is a felony charge but one can possess the same item in Virginia or Texas and be the model gun owner?? It is straight up b.s. This is why I feel that banning so called “felons” from owning firearms is counter productive. They need to defend themselves just as much as anyone else. Also it’s not just felons, it can be people convicted of misdemeanors in some states that allow prison terms for misdemeanors. In Pennsylvania for example brandishing a firearm is a first degree misdemeanor that carries a penalty of up to 5 years in prison. Perjury and second degree assault in Maryland are both misdemeanors punishable by up to 10 years in prison.
You can certainly see your expertise in the paintings you write. The world hopes for more passionate writers such as you who aren’t afraid to say how they believe. Always follow your heart.
Mr. Owens the only thing amusing is your reliance on false information provided to you by Bruce Siddle, Jerry Ahern and Bobbie Reynolds.
You are so over eager to be famous that you jumped on half truths and old well known information and made a complete fool of yourself. You could have at least gotten the “public information part correct” but you did not in fact.
Perhaps Ahern didn’t tell you of his admitted straw purchases to BATFE or Siddle having brought “all of this exact same information in writing before a Federal Judge in Tenn, or Reynolds complete entire string of Lies concerning Victory Arms and his pitiful situation he calls his life.
The Federal authorities, including the BATFE were well aware of everything you had written, at least the small truthful parts of the “sensational news breaking” story you feel you have written. Oh, did I mention the Court filings containing the exact information before the Federal Judge?
Your accusation that they did not investigate was also very incorrect.
Since you operate your life from your “bully pulpit,” hiding behind your keyboard, you somehow feel some sort of immunity from the incorrect and horrible things you write from time to time. Wait until we have your story told………….
I understand you are an over educated failure in life and you think you have found a way to gain fame and attention. In my mind your a Clown at best a real “billy Bad ass.”
No matter what happened to me in the Marines, good or bad, “At least I went in and served.” You on the other hand “hurt your knee.” Your entire life is a fantasy in your mind with one excuse after the other. You are an idiot and a joke.
Why do you bring up the Pardon now? It certainly wasn’t mentioned in your article. For your information the Pardon does not contain any restrictions In order for a Pardon to have restrictions it must state any restriction “on the document face or on the attached warrant.” Mine does not contain any such restrictions. But you “know the law so well” who am I to dare say anything to you.
Why did you crop the photo and take Mr Ahern out of it?
I really got a kick out of your forensic idiot. Was he there, Did he examine the “Guns in the picture,” did he fire them, are they movie guns, and your credible witnesses the Aherns are well known liars to say the very least.
Hey wait Randy Travers the singer, a convicted Felon in NC Pardoned with a Pardon of Forgiveness was in a movie called True Grit, with guns, quick get Mr Forensic and start an email writing campaign to the authorities, like you have done to me !!! Come on Bob Owens, why you are the voice of all reason and Democracy. Everyone looks up to you for your truthfulness, common sense and unbiased journalism!!!!!!!!
I was not “Dishonorably Discharged” so sorry to disappoint you. By the way tell me about your Military Service Mr Owens? Oh I forgot you “hurt your knee.” Bull- SH** !!!!
You accuse me of numerous untruths in your lame story.
Now you accuse me of “fake posting”, I post under your my name. I am certainly not afraid of you, you coward. I am slightly amused would be the best description.
I have never met you and I have never done anything wrong to you or anyone in your family but you are attempting to have my freedom taken and to lie about me. Unacceptable, old boy, unacceptable.
People who know me know I am not a bully or con man. They also know I don’t sit well with Liars and incompetent individuals. Maybe that is why your new “Friends” put you up to your story.
You have your fun, you failure and loser and just remember as we go forward that “Free Speech” is much different than what you have done in your writing.
I promise you this Mr “UFC” Bob Owens, we are certainly going to get to the truth of every single word you write or have written.
Like I say enjoy your playtime, Mr Bad Ass Republican Know it all Gun Guy. You have allot of enemies and I have allot of new friends.
I really tried to just ignore you but thanks for making me pay attention and now all the “rats are in the same basket.” Thank You, sincerely.
Hey Maybe your new buddy can PPCT me, wait, he doesn’t own that anymore……………
You said “Lee Booth Knows,” but you don’t know what I know or what the outcome will be for you and your family.
Standby, going to be quite a story, “Mr Truth and Justice Bob Owens.”