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	<title>Comments on: Debate Over Tea Party Protest Numbers Masks the Real History Made</title>
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		<title>By: Mary in LA</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-398576</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary in LA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 19:52:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-398576</guid>
		<description>Adina Kutnicki, Israel:

&lt;blockquote&gt;Since moving to Israel last year I have not been longing to go back to the US, particularly with Obama now in power.
However, when I heard about the Tea Party Express I had a real urge to return. For practical reasons this was impossible, but suffice it to say that if I was in the US wild horses could not have kept me from attending the DC event.
By the way, I have NEVER been to a mass protest before.
Kudos to all the organizers and the attendees. Special thanks to Glenn Beck for promoting it and waking up the masses. Watching his show every day at the YES satellite channel is invigorating.
Go Glenn!!&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Hello, Adina! There&#039;s already talk of another similar event next year (especially if the pols continue to be deaf to the meaning of this one).  So start saving your pennies and frequent flier miles for next summer.  It would be great to have you there!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adina Kutnicki, Israel:</p>
<blockquote><p>Since moving to Israel last year I have not been longing to go back to the US, particularly with Obama now in power.<br />
However, when I heard about the Tea Party Express I had a real urge to return. For practical reasons this was impossible, but suffice it to say that if I was in the US wild horses could not have kept me from attending the DC event.<br />
By the way, I have NEVER been to a mass protest before.<br />
Kudos to all the organizers and the attendees. Special thanks to Glenn Beck for promoting it and waking up the masses. Watching his show every day at the YES satellite channel is invigorating.<br />
Go Glenn!!</p></blockquote>
<p>Hello, Adina! There&#8217;s already talk of another similar event next year (especially if the pols continue to be deaf to the meaning of this one).  So start saving your pennies and frequent flier miles for next summer.  It would be great to have you there!</p>
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		<title>By: Gregory</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-398109</link>
		<dc:creator>Gregory</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 07:03:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-398109</guid>
		<description>Someone mentioned Japan. Hmm, let&#039;s see. Japan is an increasingly aging population headed for a population crash. Japan is an incredibly racist nation who like the Greeks refer to foreigners as barbarians. Japan&#039;s immigration policies are ridiculously tight, with very strict integration rules.

Japan also has a whole lot more people who eat fish and veggies. Plus a historical savings rate of ~20%, and a majority of people do not even own credit cards.

I&#039;m fairly sure if Americans adopted Japanese ways, then it might work out.

Let&#039;s not talk about France, where the radio stations must by law play &gt;60% French content, or Germany, where clashes between Germans and Turks are legendary.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone mentioned Japan. Hmm, let&#8217;s see. Japan is an increasingly aging population headed for a population crash. Japan is an incredibly racist nation who like the Greeks refer to foreigners as barbarians. Japan&#8217;s immigration policies are ridiculously tight, with very strict integration rules.</p>
<p>Japan also has a whole lot more people who eat fish and veggies. Plus a historical savings rate of ~20%, and a majority of people do not even own credit cards.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m fairly sure if Americans adopted Japanese ways, then it might work out.</p>
<p>Let&#8217;s not talk about France, where the radio stations must by law play &gt;60% French content, or Germany, where clashes between Germans and Turks are legendary.</p>
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		<title>By: vivo</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397984</link>
		<dc:creator>vivo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 02:34:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397984</guid>
		<description>174. paul_unalaska:

‘Independent since day one..’

&quot;Relying on Webster’s for your ‘party.’ Who are you fooling? Perhaps yourself.&quot;

You are soooo confused.  I said U r late to my party (celebration), not political entity.

The definition was for &#039;independent&#039; (free), not the political entity.

Sorry if u can&#039;t follow simple things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>174. paul_unalaska:</p>
<p>‘Independent since day one..’</p>
<p>&#8220;Relying on Webster’s for your ‘party.’ Who are you fooling? Perhaps yourself.&#8221;</p>
<p>You are soooo confused.  I said U r late to my party (celebration), not political entity.</p>
<p>The definition was for &#8216;independent&#8217; (free), not the political entity.</p>
<p>Sorry if u can&#8217;t follow simple things.</p>
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		<title>By: jharp</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397981</link>
		<dc:creator>jharp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 02:31:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397981</guid>
		<description>jharpisajoke:

If you think that those are “tax cuts” either in a national aggregate or for the individual, you had better get yourself a good accountant (and lawyer) real soon.

There is no aggregate “cut”, or even an aggregate reduction in the growth of rates. They are in effect sort term tax credits, not cuts, there nancy boy. 

Ask “wifey”, she must do the taxes aournd tat pig pen of yours.
____________________________________________________________

Here you go.

http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=204447,00.html 

You got one point right. Good one. The tax credit is for 2009 only. Nevertheless it is a tax cut, in the form of credit, that lowers the amount of taxes paid in 2009, for 95% of Americans.

And even though I have an accounting degree from a Big Ten University, my wife does do the taxes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jharpisajoke:</p>
<p>If you think that those are “tax cuts” either in a national aggregate or for the individual, you had better get yourself a good accountant (and lawyer) real soon.</p>
<p>There is no aggregate “cut”, or even an aggregate reduction in the growth of rates. They are in effect sort term tax credits, not cuts, there nancy boy. </p>
<p>Ask “wifey”, she must do the taxes aournd tat pig pen of yours.<br />
____________________________________________________________</p>
<p>Here you go.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=204447,00.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.irs.gov/newsroom/article/0,,id=204447,00.html</a> </p>
<p>You got one point right. Good one. The tax credit is for 2009 only. Nevertheless it is a tax cut, in the form of credit, that lowers the amount of taxes paid in 2009, for 95% of Americans.</p>
<p>And even though I have an accounting degree from a Big Ten University, my wife does do the taxes.</p>
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		<title>By: jharpisajoke</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397948</link>
		<dc:creator>jharpisajoke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Sep 2009 01:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397948</guid>
		<description>Mr Harper. More evidence that you are  lying about that &quot;business career&quot; of yours.

If you think that those are &quot;tax cuts&quot; either in a national aggregate  or for the individual, you had better get yourself a good accountant (and lawyer) real soon.

There is no aggregate &quot;cut&quot;, or even an aggregate reduction in the growth of rates. It s pure Marxist hokum, amd smoke and mirrors. They are in effect sort term tax credits, not cuts, there &lt;i&gt;nancy boy&lt;/i&gt;. It is designed to have more people dependent on government than pay taxes. This is profoundly immoral and socially disruptive, and you would understand this if you possessed one shred of decency or concern for your nation (or even your &quot;family&quot;).

No wonder you have such crappy accomplishments to show as a &quot;business man&quot;, you cannot even figure out how the formal tax system works. Ask &quot;wifey&quot;, she must do the taxes aournd tat pig pen of yours. No dount wears te pants too.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mr Harper. More evidence that you are  lying about that &#8220;business career&#8221; of yours.</p>
<p>If you think that those are &#8220;tax cuts&#8221; either in a national aggregate  or for the individual, you had better get yourself a good accountant (and lawyer) real soon.</p>
<p>There is no aggregate &#8220;cut&#8221;, or even an aggregate reduction in the growth of rates. It s pure Marxist hokum, amd smoke and mirrors. They are in effect sort term tax credits, not cuts, there <i>nancy boy</i>. It is designed to have more people dependent on government than pay taxes. This is profoundly immoral and socially disruptive, and you would understand this if you possessed one shred of decency or concern for your nation (or even your &#8220;family&#8221;).</p>
<p>No wonder you have such crappy accomplishments to show as a &#8220;business man&#8221;, you cannot even figure out how the formal tax system works. Ask &#8220;wifey&#8221;, she must do the taxes aournd tat pig pen of yours. No dount wears te pants too.</p>
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		<title>By: jodetoad</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397672</link>
		<dc:creator>jodetoad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 19:42:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397672</guid>
		<description>The tea party committee I&#039;m part of refuses to allow Republicans to speak at our events.  I&#039;d guess many follow suit.

If the GOP has the brains God gave a goose, they will court the movement.  So far it is not happening.  

Since both major parties have abandoned us, we are learning to look at voting records, to fact-check candidates, find a gazillion news sources to try to learn what the actual news is.  A 3rd party won&#039;t work, so we have to identify candidates that will represent us no matter their affiliation.  We have large enough numbers to make a difference.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The tea party committee I&#8217;m part of refuses to allow Republicans to speak at our events.  I&#8217;d guess many follow suit.</p>
<p>If the GOP has the brains God gave a goose, they will court the movement.  So far it is not happening.  </p>
<p>Since both major parties have abandoned us, we are learning to look at voting records, to fact-check candidates, find a gazillion news sources to try to learn what the actual news is.  A 3rd party won&#8217;t work, so we have to identify candidates that will represent us no matter their affiliation.  We have large enough numbers to make a difference.</p>
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		<title>By: Dale</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397641</link>
		<dc:creator>Dale</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 19:11:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397641</guid>
		<description>Step 1: Wall Street and a Republican administration (Two simultaneous wars, tax cuts for the wealthy, and trillions in wasteful no-bid contracts for Halliburton, KBR, Blackwater, Bechtel, etc.) fleece the American public and the Treasury, causing a massive depression.  

Step 2: Democrats are voted in overwhelmingly to curb the GOP&#039;s wasteful spending orgy, enforce current regulatory laws, and create new ones to reverse the &lt;i&gt;second&lt;/i&gt; Republican-caused depression in 100 years.

Step 3: The private industries that previously had their mouths on the government $$ hose, including the energy, finance, and health care industries, get very nervous that the incoming Democratic admin is serious about regulation. So they call their right-wing lobbyist friends and Dick Armey. 

&quot;We need to build public support against the president so that there will not be any new regulation. Regulation means we lose profits, and we simply can&#039;t have that. What do we do, Dick?&quot;

&quot;Relax,&quot; says Dick. &quot;I&#039;ve been doing this for years. All we need to do is link your cause to the cause of the common GOP voter, and bingo, you&#039;ve got an army of useful idiots to come out swinging and screaming for your cause.&quot;

Step 5: Private industries pay big $$ to groups like Dick Armey’s Freedomworks to get out the message out to right-wing politicians, writers, radio/tv hosts and clergy: “We must oppose the Democrats because they want to regulate Wall Street, Big Energy and the Health Care industry.  To counter this regulation, we’ll call the Democrats “Socialists” and “Marxists”, and hopefully that will be enough to rile up the GOP base.”

Step 6:  The angry, poorly informed, talk radio-fed southern GOP voter is looking for an outlet for their nameless rage – a rage that the south always seems to be on the bottom of the heap. Rage that they have lost to the Democrats. Rage that no matter who they vote for, conservative values never seem to be on the agenda. And yes, rage that the president is a black man.

Step 7: The corporate-sponsored Astroturf rallies/marches provide that outlet. Private industry is able to co-opt the right wing rage and exploit it to their advantage, bussing angry southerners to rallies to voice their anger on TV and Youtube. Fox News reports on the events, boosting the number of attendees, and offering much-needed legitimacy to the events. GOP lawmakers assist the fearmongering, sending poor and senior citizens into paroxysms of fear and anger over manufactured claims of rationing, government takeover, forced abortions and death panels.  

A triangulation of efforts ensues:
-	Freedomworks uses the corporate contributions from energy/finance/health care to sponsor right-wing protests and rallies to get the message out. 
-	Fox News helps Freedomworks not only by providing free advertising for Freedomworks-promoted events, but also lends legitimacy by having rodeo clowns Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity urge Fox viewers to attend the manufactured events.
-	GOP lawmakers, presiding over southern and midwestern welfare states, use the culture wars to convince their frustrated voter base to attend the rallies, once again hoodwinking the GOP voter to oppose their own interests by fearmongering that legalized abortion, teaching evolution in high school, and regulating Wall Street are far, far worse perils than having no job, having no health care, having no way to attain higher education, and having no way to save money for the future. 
-	Industry lobbyists interviewed on FOX News point to YouTube videos as evidence that the protests are grassroots and that they are representative of a majority of Americans. 

Step 8:  Private industry’s funding of the right-wing movement backfires.  As the healthcare/finance/energy industries misjudge motives and overestimate the intelligence of the right wing voter, it becomes evident that while the Tea Parties have failed to bring about the resurgence of a legitimate, focused Republican party as planned, they have had the unexpected result of mainstreaming the kind of violent, racist, ignorant, hateful theocratic ideology that has lain dormant in the south for the last 50 years since civil rights legislation.  As the movement is hijacked by the same breed of militant brownshirts that propelled the Nazis to power, the energy/finance/ad health care industries are forced by a looming PR nightmare to divest themselves of funding the rallies/protests, FOX News pretends they never had anything to do with them in the first place, the GOP is &lt;i&gt;still&lt;/i&gt; leaderless, and, as always, the average GOP voter is left on the side of the road wondering how he got hoodwinked &lt;i&gt;again&lt;/i&gt;. 

Step 9: Decades of Democrat congressional majorities follow, during which American prosperity rises. Nobody notices, but even the south prospers. 

Step 10: A generation of Americans is born into prosperity that knows little about the GOP, and has no first-hand knowledge of how terribly they govern.  Because they have been born into an era of prosperity, they have a bit of money to spend and save. The GOP is able to convince this history-challenged voter that tax cuts and limits to the capital gains tax will only create more prosperity, and this message sounds great to a growing middle class that suddenly has some money to save, and has little conception that the GOP’s strategy is prescription for another depression. 

Step 11: America, with its stunning inability to learn from history, votes GOP.  

Step 12: Repeat step 1.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Step 1: Wall Street and a Republican administration (Two simultaneous wars, tax cuts for the wealthy, and trillions in wasteful no-bid contracts for Halliburton, KBR, Blackwater, Bechtel, etc.) fleece the American public and the Treasury, causing a massive depression.  </p>
<p>Step 2: Democrats are voted in overwhelmingly to curb the GOP&#8217;s wasteful spending orgy, enforce current regulatory laws, and create new ones to reverse the <i>second</i> Republican-caused depression in 100 years.</p>
<p>Step 3: The private industries that previously had their mouths on the government $$ hose, including the energy, finance, and health care industries, get very nervous that the incoming Democratic admin is serious about regulation. So they call their right-wing lobbyist friends and Dick Armey. </p>
<p>&#8220;We need to build public support against the president so that there will not be any new regulation. Regulation means we lose profits, and we simply can&#8217;t have that. What do we do, Dick?&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;Relax,&#8221; says Dick. &#8220;I&#8217;ve been doing this for years. All we need to do is link your cause to the cause of the common GOP voter, and bingo, you&#8217;ve got an army of useful idiots to come out swinging and screaming for your cause.&#8221;</p>
<p>Step 5: Private industries pay big $$ to groups like Dick Armey’s Freedomworks to get out the message out to right-wing politicians, writers, radio/tv hosts and clergy: “We must oppose the Democrats because they want to regulate Wall Street, Big Energy and the Health Care industry.  To counter this regulation, we’ll call the Democrats “Socialists” and “Marxists”, and hopefully that will be enough to rile up the GOP base.”</p>
<p>Step 6:  The angry, poorly informed, talk radio-fed southern GOP voter is looking for an outlet for their nameless rage – a rage that the south always seems to be on the bottom of the heap. Rage that they have lost to the Democrats. Rage that no matter who they vote for, conservative values never seem to be on the agenda. And yes, rage that the president is a black man.</p>
<p>Step 7: The corporate-sponsored Astroturf rallies/marches provide that outlet. Private industry is able to co-opt the right wing rage and exploit it to their advantage, bussing angry southerners to rallies to voice their anger on TV and Youtube. Fox News reports on the events, boosting the number of attendees, and offering much-needed legitimacy to the events. GOP lawmakers assist the fearmongering, sending poor and senior citizens into paroxysms of fear and anger over manufactured claims of rationing, government takeover, forced abortions and death panels.  </p>
<p>A triangulation of efforts ensues:<br />
-	Freedomworks uses the corporate contributions from energy/finance/health care to sponsor right-wing protests and rallies to get the message out.<br />
-	Fox News helps Freedomworks not only by providing free advertising for Freedomworks-promoted events, but also lends legitimacy by having rodeo clowns Glenn Beck and Sean Hannity urge Fox viewers to attend the manufactured events.<br />
-	GOP lawmakers, presiding over southern and midwestern welfare states, use the culture wars to convince their frustrated voter base to attend the rallies, once again hoodwinking the GOP voter to oppose their own interests by fearmongering that legalized abortion, teaching evolution in high school, and regulating Wall Street are far, far worse perils than having no job, having no health care, having no way to attain higher education, and having no way to save money for the future.<br />
-	Industry lobbyists interviewed on FOX News point to YouTube videos as evidence that the protests are grassroots and that they are representative of a majority of Americans. </p>
<p>Step 8:  Private industry’s funding of the right-wing movement backfires.  As the healthcare/finance/energy industries misjudge motives and overestimate the intelligence of the right wing voter, it becomes evident that while the Tea Parties have failed to bring about the resurgence of a legitimate, focused Republican party as planned, they have had the unexpected result of mainstreaming the kind of violent, racist, ignorant, hateful theocratic ideology that has lain dormant in the south for the last 50 years since civil rights legislation.  As the movement is hijacked by the same breed of militant brownshirts that propelled the Nazis to power, the energy/finance/ad health care industries are forced by a looming PR nightmare to divest themselves of funding the rallies/protests, FOX News pretends they never had anything to do with them in the first place, the GOP is <i>still</i> leaderless, and, as always, the average GOP voter is left on the side of the road wondering how he got hoodwinked <i>again</i>. </p>
<p>Step 9: Decades of Democrat congressional majorities follow, during which American prosperity rises. Nobody notices, but even the south prospers. </p>
<p>Step 10: A generation of Americans is born into prosperity that knows little about the GOP, and has no first-hand knowledge of how terribly they govern.  Because they have been born into an era of prosperity, they have a bit of money to spend and save. The GOP is able to convince this history-challenged voter that tax cuts and limits to the capital gains tax will only create more prosperity, and this message sounds great to a growing middle class that suddenly has some money to save, and has little conception that the GOP’s strategy is prescription for another depression. </p>
<p>Step 11: America, with its stunning inability to learn from history, votes GOP.  </p>
<p>Step 12: Repeat step 1.</p>
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		<title>By: shoey</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397462</link>
		<dc:creator>shoey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 16:17:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397462</guid>
		<description>this movement will not be co-opted, it will do the co-opting</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>this movement will not be co-opted, it will do the co-opting</p>
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		<title>By: paul_unalaska</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397461</link>
		<dc:creator>paul_unalaska</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 16:17:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397461</guid>
		<description>&#039;Independent since day one..&#039;

Relying on Webster&#039;s for your &#039;party.&#039; Who are you fooling?  Perhaps yourself.

&#039;A liberal man is to broadminded to take his own side in a quarrel&#039;

-Robert Frost

When you do give your take, it&#039;s expected fawning over Obama.

An Independent for Big&#039;GER&#039; Government, One Party control and a myopic, partisan Government health care bill... hahaha!

A large number of people at Saturday&#039;s event were Independents.  You&#039;re attempt at polluting, lying, etc., standing with the Independent Party -you&#039;re a joke.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;Independent since day one..&#8217;</p>
<p>Relying on Webster&#8217;s for your &#8216;party.&#8217; Who are you fooling?  Perhaps yourself.</p>
<p>&#8216;A liberal man is to broadminded to take his own side in a quarrel&#8217;</p>
<p>-Robert Frost</p>
<p>When you do give your take, it&#8217;s expected fawning over Obama.</p>
<p>An Independent for Big&#8217;GER&#8217; Government, One Party control and a myopic, partisan Government health care bill&#8230; hahaha!</p>
<p>A large number of people at Saturday&#8217;s event were Independents.  You&#8217;re attempt at polluting, lying, etc., standing with the Independent Party -you&#8217;re a joke.</p>
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		<title>By: Adnerb</title>
		<link>http://pjmedia.com/blog/debate-over-tea-party-protest-numbers-masks-the-real-history-made/#comment-397441</link>
		<dc:creator>Adnerb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Sep 2009 16:00:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pajamasmedia.com/?p=66715#comment-397441</guid>
		<description>82. Moho: I protested the war in Iraq three times before it started.  I e-mailed my senators and the White House to not invade Iraq.  I was also at the 912 event in Washington on Saturday.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>82. Moho: I protested the war in Iraq three times before it started.  I e-mailed my senators and the White House to not invade Iraq.  I was also at the 912 event in Washington on Saturday.</p>
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