Ask Dr. Helen: How Do You Deal With a Palin Hater?
Instead, advice columnist Tennis makes excuses for “Hater,” fans the flames of her hate, and tries to psychoanalyze Palin when he is way out of his league:
I think what disturbs us about Sarah Palin is that she reminds us of the authoritarian personality. My guess is that she is also an ESFJ, or Extroverted Sensing Feeling Judging type, with a strong preference for sensing. Such a person prefers to acquire her knowledge from concrete objects and places instead of from abstract ideas. This would explain why she thinks being geographically close to Russia is a form of foreign policy expertise. As an authoritarian type, she strikes us as a person who prefers power to reason. The people running John McCain’s campaign seem to instinctively understand the uses to which such an impression can be put. Perhaps they know better than we do how deeply the American people long to be done with the problem of democracy, to yield to a powerful father-mother pair of authoritarians. The very thing that appalls us about Sarah Palin — her discomfort in the realm of reason — is her main selling point. This is so mind-boggling that you have to take a minute to let it in. Take a deep breath. Read that sentence again. Face it: Sarah Palin represents what many people want: a retreat from reason; a regression to childhood.
Say what? This advice columnist states that Palin is an authoritarian personality and his superior reasoning is that a Myers-Briggs (a test used by organizational and industrial psychologists) would say that Sarah Palin is an ESFJ — and then interprets the non-existent test results as meaning that she is an authoritarian personality?
And he thinks that Palin can’t reason? This is what is mind-boggling, if you ask me. Perhaps Tennis’ interpretation of an “authoritarian personality” is anyone who disagrees with a liberal.
In fact, Theodore Adorno, one of the researchers who developed the term “authoritarian personality,” has an anti-capitalist bent, so it is no wonder he and his work is held in such high esteem by those who fear the free market, private industry, and personal responsibility. These ideals are abstract, intellectual, and require reasoning.
Those are the ideas that Sarah Palin aspires to, but that Tennis has no clue in understanding. Perhaps Tennis would have given better advice if he had told “Hater” about the studies of University of Virginia psychologist Jonathan Haidt, who found that while conservatives could put themselves in the mindset of liberals, liberals did not return the favor. In other words, like Hater, some scream, rant, and rave when someone does not agree with them, with no understanding of why people are different. Perhaps a little empathy is in order here for Hater’s friends and family.
At the very least, Tennis could have told her to back off from friends and co-workers with her rants and angry tantrums. For her behavior is nothing but the regression to a two-year-old: throwing a tantrum because she has no idea that other people have different opinions than one’s own and that those opinions may be just as valid or more so. And yes, perhaps a self-help group would help Hater to reflect on her ugly behavior.
What do you think, is Hater’s behavior to friends and family justified?
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If you have a question you would like answered, please leave it below or email at askdrhelen@hotmail.com. Your questions may be edited for length and clarity. Please note that your first name only or no name at all will be used to identify your question – if you want me to use your name, tell me; otherwise you will be referred to by your first name or as “a reader,” etc.
I think a 12 step group would be very helpful to liberals in general.
On a more serious note, I do run into these people fairly frequently here in Seattle, aka Berkeley North. There is no point in engaging them in conversation on the subject, offering a differing viewpoint, or anything else. I drove a barber to near distraction last week by suggesting that Palin “wasn’t all that bad”. I resisted making a more extreme assertion for fear of being shaved bald.
I’m tempted to say we only have to endure this for another month or so, but I know better. If Obama loses, we will have four years of this to contend with.
Maybe I could use a support group too.
Dr. Helen, you ask, “…is Hater’s behavior to friends and family justified?”
If by “justified” you mean “the behavior has a healthy reason/explanation”, then I consider “Hater’s” behavior SICK SICK SICK.
OK, so she is NOT 100% “de-personalizing” Gov. Palin to isolate and deny her value as a human…yet I find “Hater’s” COMPREHENSIVE, VEHEMENT REJECTION of – what, “her hair, her personal style, her accent, her abilities as a mother, etc.”?!!? – virtually everything about Gov. Palin to be troubling.
Add to that “Hater’s” recognition of the impact on herself, “I’ve also begun to suffer personally and professionally. I bore my friends with my constant tirades against her, and am constantly distracted from my work by my need to continually update myself on the latest criticism, and indeed, ridicule, of her. In my hatred for her, I have begun to hate myself. … How do I stop?”
WHO WOULD SAY THIS IS “justified”?!
This letter seems to be an example of a fatal thinking fallacy in contemporary liberal/Leftist…err…”logic” [sic], in the sense that “identity politics” – as a part of the slow but steady takeover by the Far Left of the Democratic Party – suddenly has an existential crisis before itself with the candidacy of Gov. Palin.
Sorta like suddenly having the thought: “…bbbb buuuut but she can’t be a woman…she’s against abortion…she’s…she’s A REPUBLICAN!”
This woman is a commonly found type on the Left. I try to avoid them whenever possible because they get extremely upset and angry when I use facts to tear down their positions. They’re the ones who taught me to realize that “racist” in its modern context really means “person who is winning an argument with a liberal.”
I truly believe that being a Democrat Party member today is clear proof of serious moral and intellectual failings. One wonders how they can be so consistently wrong on so many issues without waking up to their own internal contradictions. I suspect if this woman ever read “Atlas Shrugged” her mind would snap.
Ok, mac, astound me with your facts on Palin and why she was the most qualified Republican to backstop McCain. Maverick? $20 million new debt for Wasilla, support of bridge to nowhere, abuse of powers, 5 colleges, Gibson, Couric, debate fiasco, George Will, Kathleen Parker, Peggy Noonan, Frum, etc. I could keep going. She’s an intellectual light-weight. I’m glad she wants to serve the country, but potential President? It’s an insult to all of us. Here’s a test for you. If she were a Democrat, after the past month of public appearances, would you be as accepting? Did the past 8 years indicate that competence matters, at all?
I read the column and several pages worth of readers’ responses with alternating horror and amusement. These people grew up and were educated in the Western tradition? Sheesh, they must have been absent the day we covered that in class.
If you are over 25 and you still hate Daddy and Mommy that much, for heaven’s sake see a psychiatrist. Ask your mental health care provider about “projection”.
In other words, Palin haters tend to be spoiled twits
Ah, yes. “Feel your hatred. Good. Good. I can feel your anger. It gives you focus.”
Where have I heard that line before?
C’mon, “sheep,” you can do better than THAT. You say, “She’s an intellectual light-weight.” Well, that is an understatement of Obama…the individual you promote as Presidential candidate.
Consider:
http://www.nydailynews.com/opinions/2008/10/05/2008-10-05_sarah_palin_is_taking_a_bigger_beating_b.html?print=1&page=all
EXCERPT:
“If she were a Democrat, her unusual life would be spun into a compelling narrative that would make her the darling of the coastal elite.
How she’s raising that lovely brood of kids, her care for that severely handicapped baby, her relationship with that rugged hubby who often cares for the kids and is part native, her unlikely rise through the political minefields, her tough knocks and gutsy performance on the national stage – all would be testament to a breakthrough of historic proportions we would be ordered to celebrate in the name of diversity and equality.
Yes, I know there are many legitimate reasons to vote against her and McCain. And I am not arguing for a second they should be supported, least of all because of her gender.
But couldn’t we all at least acknowledge Palin’s moment and what it means for America?
Apparently not. She must lose, the liberal narrative goes, because she is unqualified, case closed.
Some day, we will look back with disgust at the abuse Palin has taken and wonder how it could happen in this great nation, circa 2008.”
sheep, is it your opinion that Biden (Biden who?) is the “most qualified Democrat to backstop Obama”?
I had a similar disagreement with a friend over Dr. Rice’s ascendancy to SecState. He kept going on about “Is she the best person the Bush administration could have placed in this position?”; I had to counter with, “Was Albright? Because that’s the bar, isn’t it? The latest second-term SecState?”
In other words, Palin has certain qualities that help McCain. Not her entire story or persona helps him, but he and his team decided that she had the combination they wanted or needed the most. Presumably Obama performed the same calculus in choosing Biden over, say, Clinton. The “best” person in either party to “backstop” each party’s candidate is probably sitting on a front porch somewhere drinking coffee, forever unknown to both parties; what we get, virtually always, is the “most useful.” Sometimes we’re lucky and they turn out really really well; sometimes they’re a cipher (can we all say “Gore”?).
My take on it this is that Hater is disliking Palin, because she feels that the Republican party should not have a women in the VP slot at all. Just look at how she gets upset claiming that it is a hypocrisy of the Republican party and how Hater says they nitpick about her hair and so on. This sounds to me like someone who believes it was to be the year of Hillary, but can’t quite bring themselves to blame their own party or the other Democratic voters in the Democratic Primary. By Plain coming on the scene it created a perfect target for Hater’s rage. Hater could transpose this anger on Palin as Palin is not only a women still in the running while Hillary is not, but also a Republican (the most hated enemy of the left).
As for Tennis’ rant, it seems to me like typicla leftist dribble about not being loved enough as a child so you want to revert back to your childhood and have your Mommy take care of you.
If she were a Democrat, after the past month of public appearances, would you be as accepting?
By that, do you mean, if she were Barack Obama, would I be as accepting? $200,000 raise for his wife due to his clout, his opposition to the surge, abuse of powers, O’Reilly, debate fiascoes, PUMAS. Do you honestly believe that running for president serves as reasonable measure for experience?
A question: How old is “The Hater”? It might mean something. It’s not too much of a stretch to say that the post-menopausal face lift crowd (think Hilary, Boxer, Feinstein, Pelosi) are threatened by a young, sexually attractive woman. She gets all the attention, just by smiling and walking up to the microphone. Fury ensues. It is inconceivable (because it is so painful) that she is also smart, sensitive, competent, and of good will, just as they imagine themselves to have been when they were her age. Sarah’s still “in the game” they are not. Could it be partly late middle age “raging hormones”, or rather, late middle aged “lack of hormones” leading to rage?
A lot of supposedly political discussion is a thinly disguised vehicle for the expression of personal anger and hatred, displaced onto “the issues”. It’s sort of like road rage in a more social setting. There’s always a lot of free-floating personal anger and hatred floating around and political themes can focus and channel this.
Sheep, if you want to address mac’s comment, why don’t you address his comment rather than set up a straw man and attack something he did not say? By doing so, you actually reinforce the (earned) stereotype that liberals are unable to argue on the facts and fall back on talking points.
Ah, Sheep. What an apt name. Just follow along and see where they take you.
As an industrial organizational psychologist, I found Tennis’ psuedo analysis laughable. Here is a woman who admits she has a real problem. And Tennis’ solution is to spout a stream of poorly understood psycho-babble about the target of her hatred? What a moron.
Hater has my deepest admiration! She is the first Leftist (in Europe we have the type as well) in 8 years to vaguely understand that it is not healthy to deeply hate someone you do not even know personally. The Left’s projection of their own feelings of inadequacy onto Bus$Hitler, are presently transferred 1o1 on to Palin. The psychopathology of the thing stands to reason: the Left think of themselves as the height of Kantian ethics and being human, fail to live up to their own standards. Naturally they project all their own failings on their enemies (yes, enemies). At least Hater is aware there’s a serious problem. Even more amazing is her achievement – in a second act of projection – to have turned herself into a victim! Of course she’s not to blame for Hating Sarah Palin. That’s the GOP’s responsibility for having flung the woman into her face like they did! Mind-boggling indeed. Trust another victim like her to give her a likewise insane advice. I’m seriously looking forward to Dr Sanity’s expert analysis.
Sheep – Please re-reead the article and try to find the part where the author asserts that Palin the the most qualified VP candidate. The article was about idiot liberals who have no respect for other people’s veiws and react violently to disagreement.
I sent a link to the story about the President of the L.A. Chapter of NOW coming out to support Palin to my brother who also lives in LA and is a left-wing idealogue but insists that he understands feminists and gays.
Here is the link.
http://wizbangblog.com/content/2008/10/05/america-this-is-what-a-feminist-looks-like.php
That’s all I sent him. I didn’t have any commentary on it, other than the subject line which contained, “Wow”. I was quite surprised to hear that news myself.
Here was his response to me:
“Keep your horseshit emails to yourself. The great intelligent feminists of our time know she isn’t a feminist, but maybe You and Malkin and few idiots conservatives are on the edge of something really special. Bullshit.”
I know where he’s coming from. Being on the left is a religion to him and he is along the lines of “Hater” in the above mentioned article. Unable to contemplate opinions that differ from his. Any disagreement with the dogma of the left expressed by somebody must mean that they are facist, Bush-regime minions, right-wing extremists.
Jamie, I would say Biden is in the top tier. You saw his debate performance. His CFR experience, international experience, forthrightness and experience in the Senate for a considerable period of time makes for a good partner, in my opinion. I think Dobb, Richardson or Hagel would have been great as well. I would have been repulsed by Clinton. Furthering American monarchies is not my cup of tea. I do believe Biden is a top tier candidate.
I think it’s difficult to say that one person is the penultimate choice, but I think we can make distinctions about top 10%, top 20% or like Palin, bottom 20%.
Ed, I’m not certain I understood what you were trying to say. Obama is an intellectual lightweight? That’s a tough one to swallow. Listen, I’m not criticizing McCain’s intellect. I thought his first debate was pretty strong and I saw glimpses of the 2000 McCain that lots of people could get behind. It’s the Palin choice which is so distributing. It highlights two things: (1) that we settle for a wink and a whistle over substance and (2) that McCain is not in control of his own campaign. That his handlers chose her as a cynical ploy to motivate the base. That should be distributing to everyone. How will he staff his cabinet and advisors, through lobbyists and Republican operatives? In contrast, Obama has LED his campaign and remained calm and collected.
I’ve run into this same situation recently, often with people I otherwise find very appealing. What I’ve found helpful, if I wish to maintain an open dialog with them, is to ask them to go to http://www.politicalcompass.org and take the political opinion quiz. It doesn’t take much effort. At the end of the quiz the respondent is ranked and their cumulative relative response to the questions are graphed on a dual axis graph (conservative-liberal vs. authoritative-libertarian). Their results are then compared to historical and current political and popular celebrities. It often show a far greater degree of agreement than assumed difference.
This offers an opportunity to refocus the future discussions on similarities and puts many of the more heated, emotional issues of the day in better perspective.
I’ve used this approach many times and it can be very constructive and help some of these people see that they have much more in common with “fly over” America than they think.
sheep, If you ever read “Atlas Shrugged” and your mind didn’t snap, you’d learn that “emotions are not tools of cognition.” You don’t think Palin’s unqualified you feel she is. How do I know? Because if you really thought about it, you’d have to admit that, by your criteria, Obama is unqualified to be at the head of the Demo ticket.
And please don’t reply that Affirmative Action Obama is an intellectual heavyweight. Harvard Law Degree? I have two cousins who have them. Dumber than posts! Editor of the Law Review in which he never published himself? How come? Two books about himself? Wow! A sometime teacher of civil rights law? Yawn . . . What other intellectual credentials does he have? Faithful applier of the principles of Saul Alinsky? Granted.
I sometimes encountered this kind of hatred by Democrats while growing up in Alabama during the 1960s. Only then, the subject of their hatred were blacks. It’s the same irrational hatred, only the subject has changed. Once they become convinced they’re superior to someone else (e.g. “she’s an intellectual lightweight”), then they have no problem hating that person. Pretty pathetic, actually.
There are a lot of people like “Hater”. I thought long and hard about whether to put a McCain sticker on my car, partly because of my concerns about the candidate but mostly because I thought it likely that my car would be vandalized by rabid supporters of Democratic candidates. Every recent election has been marked by acts of vandalism by these people; it is rare for conservatives to act in a similar matter. Substantiated charges of election fraud happen at a much higher frequency on the left as well. It really is time for Democrats to step up and renounce these behaviors as intolerable rather than rationalizing them.
Sheep, My, you’re up early. Couldn’t get to sleep? Interesting eponymous nic for an evident Obama supporter. I voted for Hillary in the primary to share my bias.
I think Palin is the most appealing of the four running, As to your catalog of talking points:
Debt – my understanding is that the people of Wasilla approved the community center.
Bridge – initial support was later withdrawn.
Abuse of powers – tenuous charge at best. Sounds like she actually showed restraint in Troopergate.
Five colleges – sounds like a funds issue. Get those credits where you can. I identify.
Gibson, Couric – surely you are familiar with how the editing process an alter, elide, or truncate a person’s meaning and intent. These two are good examples.
Debate fiasco – ??? she did fine, much better than I expected based on the two hatchet jobs from Gibson and Couric.
String of conservative columnists – haven’t read them with the exception of Noonan who just seems miffed that she is no longer in the inner circle while still being in the Inner Party.
Palin seems smart enough and her debate against Biden showed an appealing Everywoman sort of quality. I’d rather listen to her for four more years than Biden blathering.
Incidentally, while your guy may win, I hope he draws mostly from Hillary’s bench. From what I know of Chicago, I don’t know that I want community organizers trying to run the country. That way lies madness.
I think it’s difficult to say that one person is the penultimate choice…
I don’t think that word means what you think it means.
Shouldn’t the advice columns response to Hater’s tirade have been something like this;
“Dear Hater,
Not to worry dearie, irrational hatred and bitterness is a natural female reaction to other women who are better looking, smarter and more successful in their private and professional life.”
Or alternatively might I suggest;
“Dear Hater,
Not to worry dearie, you’re just an A-hole”
With respect, Dr. Helen, have you read the essay by Haidt that you refer to? It’s titled “What makes people vote Republican?”. Here’s his short answer
“But now that we can map the brains, genes, and unconscious attitudes of conservatives, we have refined our diagnosis: conservatism is a partially heritable personality trait that predisposes some people to be cognitively inflexible, fond of hierarchy, and inordinately afraid of uncertainty, change, and death.”
Is this guy to be taken seriously? In mentioning that liberals are not able to empathize with conservatives, he’s doing it from the standpoint that conservatives are such alien creatures that intelligent liberals, indeed any intelligent human, cannot understand them. He’s basically excusing liberals from their intellectual laziness and giving the more vicious of them cover for their ignorance-born hatred. I don’t know that I would cite Haidt’s work as valuable to the liberal vs conservative debate. That he buys into the “us vs them” mentality should increase your skepticism of his work.
Personally, I think there’s a lot more to why someone votes Republican or Democrat at any one time then whether they are “cognitively inflexible, fond of hierarchy, and inordinately afraid of uncertainty, change, and death”.
Sheer jealousy. She settled for negative, hateful, misogynist Obama and “let go” of the Hillary fantasy when the Democratic convention ended. Then two days later comes Sarah Palin — someone more compelling than Hillary — even more compelling than Obama. Someone she would joyfully embrace as a candidate, except that in a cruel twist of the knife, She’s a Republican!
Now either she forces herself to hate Sarah, or faces the sickening realization that she has settled for Obama. She sees the pure joy of Republican women having a perfect candidate that she aches to support, but she is stuck with Obama. Either hate Palin or hate herself. She choses to hate Palin.
Jealousy.
“Perhaps they know better than we do how deeply the American people long to be done with the problem of democracy, to yield to a powerful father-mother pair of authoritarians.”
This statement is disturbing. I think among “Hater’s” various mistakes was asking Mr. Tennis anything at all. Where does Salon get people so limited in life experience that they can maintain such a distorted view of the people around them. My advice to both “Hater” and Mr Tennis is that they cultivate a little more diverse set of experiences and personal relationships.
I’m not sure the Obama haters around here can manage a cogent response.
http://www.davidbrin.com/addiction.html
The Most Common (but Unstudied) Form of Self-Addiction
So far, we are on ground that is supported by copious (if peripheral) research. If nothing else, at least there should be an effort to step back and notice the forest, for the trees, generalizing a view of this whole field as we’ve described so far. A general paradigm of self-reinforcement.
Only now, taking this into especially important new territory, please consider something more specific. A phenomenon that both illustrates the general point and demands attention on its own account.
I want to zoom down to a particular emotional and psychological pathology. The phenomenon known as self-righteous indignation.
We all know self-righteous people. (And, if we are honest, many of us will admit having wallowed in this state ourselves, either occasionally or in frequent rhythm.) It is a familiar and rather normal human condition, supported — even promulgated — by messages in mass media.
While there are many drawbacks, self-righteousness can also be heady, seductive, and even… well… addictive. Any truly honest person will admit that the state feels good. The pleasure of knowing, with subjective certainty, that you are right and your opponents are deeply, despicably wrong.
Sanctimony, or a sense of righteous outrage, can feel so intense and delicious that many people actively seek to return to it, again and again. Moreover, as Westin et.al. have found, this trait crosses all boundaries of ideology.
Wassamadda U, “Boris – Axelrod not paying yous guys enough to astroturf anymore?!
http://www.reason.com/blog/show/107064.html
Altemeyer, inventor of the [Right Wing Authoritarian] Scale, believes that there is no such thing as a Left Wing Authoritarian. “I do not think ‘an authoritarian impressively like the authoritarian on the right’ reposes on the left end of the RWA scale. Rather the contrary,” Altemeyer declared. In fact, Altemeyer finds that low RWAs are “fair-minded, even-handed, tolerant, nonaggressive persons…They score low on my prejudice scale. They are not self-righteous; they do not feel superior to persons with opposing opinions.”
Interesting. I personally gravitated toward Sarah just as viscerally – she seems to be very similar in personality to me – and I am an ENTJ – one of those that lots of people love to hate because we’re rational – thoughtful rather than “feeling” which is frankly, a more leftist trait, and intuitive rather than sensing.
I would ask one and all to stop using the word “liberal” (or “progressive”) when describing people who are, pure and simple, Left Wingers.
There is nothing liberal or progressive about them.
Jamie, I would say Biden is in the top tier.
That’s a joke, right? did you listen/watch the debate? I snorted out loud when he claimed that the US and France kicked Hezbollah out of Lebanon, then we let them back in, and that they’re now part of the government of Lebanon.
This is the best y’all could do for Veep? say it ain’t so, Joe!
I participate in a web site that helps reporters find contacts and stories. I think sometimes people just fabricate stories for the fun of it. For instance one reporter was looking for a psychologist who could comment on Sarah having Borderline Personality Disorder. What!!! In no way does she fit that criteria (I’m a therapist).
I have been at two functions in the last week which appealed to a broad audience: One was an author series that my library sponsored. There were 1000 people in attendance. The famous author chose this moment to bash anyone with a conservative mindset, even though she claimed to be a Christian. Then she had the gaul to say, “People are so mean these days, and she told a story about a comment a man made to her about her hair (which would certainly illicit comments since she’s in her 50′s and she wears dreadlocks). So she offended at least half her audience by her mean comments.
The other event I went to was a training for therapists. The lecturer chose this platform to make all sorts of snide comments about “that female VP who spoke in the debates last night but I won’t mention her name” and then he preceded to say she is ruled by fear. He made comments about her facial features.
I don’t get it….first of all what give these people the right to speak out from a non-political platform where people of all beliefs are paying to learn things about writing and counseling.
Second, they choose to ignore their own behavior as well as the behavior of the politicians they support. And they do it in such a mean, venomous way…the way bullies do. I could never treat people as angrily and cruelly as I have been treated by the liberal left lately. I choose instead to state my beliefs in a polite way. Their anger is very telling.
I was thrilled to see Sarah Palin come on the scene, for personal reasons. I grew up in Wasilla and was stunned that another self-made woman from Wasilla could achieve success despite the background.
I knew about her from before, as governor, and was pretty impressed with her ability to buck the republican inbred system in AK (you would NOT believe how entrenched my old state is-WAS!)
But immediately, the visceral response from her detractors took all my attention. What the heck were these people so mad about?
I am impressed that the woman wrote this letter asking for advice, recognizing the unhealthiness of her response. but the advice she got back was NOT healthy.
That many liberal-types are not able to recognize the real issue is a serious problem for their skills in political strategy.
what she hates, i like about her. what she’s done in Alaska seems ok to me. she made it work.
This is transference. Bush haters have been moving into depression, because they knew their focus for all their hatred is leaving office. He is going beyond their reach as a reason for everything that is wrong in their lives.
Now they have Sarah Palin, and the enormous hatred they feel towards President Bush can now have a new focus. They couldn’t hate McCain, because he’s not a conservative by any standard. But she is.
I have considered for a long time that Bush hatred is a form of worship. When you blame one being for bad weather, fires, floods, and your own personal problems, you are essentially worshipping a deity.
So now the new refrain is: All hail Goddess Sarah Palin!
(this may be a double post, if so I apologize…)
Ok Sheep, astound me with your facts on Obama/Biden and why they are the most qualified Jacka… er Donkey… Er democrat candidate. They organize our communities to suckle from the government teat (to suggest people not do that is racist, dontcha know.) Support for people to get houses that they can’t afford (to suggest people maybe shouldn’t be homeowners is racist, dontcha know.) They won’t vote for any cutting of the government trough (cutting the government trough is racist, dontcha know.)
As far as FIVE!!!! colleges… PALIN MUST BE AN IDIOT OR HIDING SOMETHING!!!!111!! Right? Hayzuse H on a pogo stick. I have gone to 6 colleges in my academic career. Let’s see a John A Logan (JUCO) while in high school; then SIU while in high school; then SEMO; then to Imperial College in London for a semester; then back to SEMO; then a semester back at SIU because I just wanted to take some classes there; then time to hit the real world for 5 years; then another semester at SEMO to finish degree #1; then real world for 2 years; then back to SIU for a second degree; then real world for 4 years; then UNLV as an undeclared grad student… Whew long winded there, but FIVE COLLEGES I must be hiding something!!!!1111!!!! right Sheep? Nope, I just have academic wanderlust and different needs at different times. Some times I was in MO and went to SEMO, sometimes I was back in Illinois and went to SIU.
I could go on and on with an indepth, point by point comments on how you are suffering from PDS. Every criticism you have of Palin is sexist dontcha know? You would never hold THE ONE and THE PROFIT of THE ONE to the same standard. Dear Leader is ok in your book and he should be in ours, correct? (IF we think otherwise then we are racist, right?) I imagine that you are very much like the woman who wrote to Salon.
Oh, but I would like to give you some props, well to you and those of your fellow travelers suffering from BDS. Over the past eight years you have shown me what the proper respect/support of a President consists of. I will put that to good use under a President BO administration. Just one question for you Sheep, will using the proper term of respect for the President be considered racist by the BO TRUTH SQUADS? After all, seeing your side call the current Resident Chimpy (did i get that right sheep?) can I call the President Barack Ochimpy (or some variation) come January 21, 2009?
Helen,
I have experienced this kind of tirade about Palin myself.
How does one respond?
I’ve found that telling the person that is going on and and on about this that you disagree with them only makes matters worse.
I wondered whether ” Look the Dow just went down 200 points. I would rather talk about that. “, might be an effective answer. Even that doesn’t seem to help.
How can I possibly avoid these tirades, other than hanging up on the person when they call or walking away from the dinner table and going for a long walk?
P.S. I live in Canada and I hear this stuff up here ,where nobody can even vote in your election. We’re having a federal election and a lot of people here are more concerned about Plain than about what is going on in their own backyard. Go figure.
And the reason why that is is that Gov. Palin, simply by being the VP nominee and by being who she is, is trashing “hater”‘s cartoon of sexist Republicans. When people operate off of a cartoonish model of reality rather than reality itself, they will defend the cartoon to the death.
What’s going on inside of “hater”‘s skull is called cognitive dissonence. Paranoid delusional personalities experience a lot of that, but the cartoon must win at all costs. The fact that reality is so threatening to the cartoon is what causes the anger.
What’s with this resentment about Republican “manipulation”? Aren’t these the same people who are passionate for Obama because he’s black? And what is Hillary’s main appeal? She’s female! Who’s the manipulating party here?
Yesterday I accompanied very left-leaning friend to an Obama rally, to watch Bruce Springsteen play a short acoustic set on the Oval of the Ohio State University. Politically, I trend middle-of-the-road. I’ve made my decision how I will cast my vote based upon issues that are important to me, but I respect others who reach a different conclusion by prioritizing issues differently. When she found out yestreday that I will not be voting for Obama she went ballastic. Even bystanders were visibly surprised/amused at her reaction.
She told me she didn’t she could be friends with someone who would vote for Republican candidate (“the party of racism and KKK”). She said she could help but feel digust when looking at me, knowing that I’m voting with the knowledge that McCain could die and Palin could become President, a SCOTUS justice could pass away, Palin could appoint a conservative justice, that justice could let personal ideology interfere with the adherence of constitutional law (my words, btw, her rant was nowhere near as coherent), Roe v. Wade could be brought to challenge, and it could be overturned. She asks: knowing that possible (though in my view, improbable) scenario, how *could* I vote for McCain and still sleep at night?
When I told her I felt McCain/Palin admistration wouldn’t be as “horrible” as she fears, Obama wouldn’t be as wonderful as his supporters “hope”, and that we have more meaningful opportunities to improve our own lives every single day, she became completely unglued. When I suggested that, if she could not accept or respect my decision, we could continue to be friends by simply ignoring our differening preferences in the politics, she shouted “how can we ignore politics?? Politics affect EVERY SECOND of our lives!” (ironically coming from someone who did not know the name “Nancy Pelosi” when I mentioned it 9 months ago)
I was patient until the end of the conversation, repeatedly and calmly encourage her to adopt a tolerance of diversity of thought, and a respect of other people’s opinions, prioritizations, and decisions. But when she respond that I would need to respect her decision not to be friends with someone who voting for the “the party of bigotry and ignorance,” I lost it. I told her I was disappointed by her intolerance and ignorance of those unlike herself, her discrimination against those who hold differing beliefs, and that she couldn’t understand my point of view was a shortcoming in need of improvement on her part, not mine. I told to have a nice day and walked away.
On my way back to my motorbike, one of the bystanders pulled me aside, saying he sees hostile people arguing bitterly like that “all the time” in the dorms… and by and far, they’re Obama supportors. I’m sure there are advocates Hillary and McCain who get just as ugly — and disappointing to think this sort of interaction and treatment of others has become socially acceptable.
It’s sad to think someone would toss away the benefits of a real-life friendship for an empty suit politician (/any/ politician) who makes a job out of telling people what they want to hear to get elected. I thought the acrimony of the 2000 and 2004 elections were unique many people didn’t personally like Bush, his decisions, or what they perceived him to stand for. I thought 2008 would be much more civil because, regardless of who is elected Bush is leaving office and the Bush haters be at peace with with their discontent. But I’m realizing it’s not the political positions of the candidates that causes such vitriol during the campaign season, but the personalities of people within the general population and lack of respect exhibited by many toward those unlike themselves.
Well, I guess I see where sheep got the name.
Dave,
I hear where you’re coming from regarding Haidt’s work. However, the point I was making was that his study showed that conservatives could understand the mindset of a liberal but liberals could not put themselves in the mindset of a conservative. It shows a lack of empathy on the part of liberals which is a flaw in my view and explains why “Hater” is not able to even begin to understand other points of view. I do not agree with Haidt’s work–I was using it to point out that what he found explained the lack of ability of Hater to understand anyone’s view but her own.
Palin’s qualifications do not really matter to the majority of the haters. If qualifications were that important no one on the left would have enthusiastically supported Obama when he started his run for the Presidency. If qualifications were that important Biden wouldn’t have ended his campaign due to garnering a measely 9000 votes in the Democratic primaries.
This level of all consuming hate is IMO nothing more than anger that the Republicans have nominated a woman, supposedly the purvue of the progressives, and a woman who is anti-abortion. She is NOT the right kind of woman because she is not a Democrat and she does not support the Holy Grail of abortion. How dare she run for office?
I agree with Cannon Asesrb. The Democrats have set the bar for how a President/VP should be treated. If indeed Obama is elected I can only hope that he will be accorded the same level of respect given to both the current office holders and the Republican candidates have gotten. I certainly don’t want to hear any drivel from the left about how “he is the President of everyone” and “the office deserves respect.” Personally I’m leaming toward Pres Obamahomma and VP Buffoon.
I am hoping Mr. Tennis made up “Hater” out of whole cloth. I hope for his sake he did anyway, and for hers too: if she exists, she was given no help by him. Hater shows at least some dim awareness of the unhealthy effects of her hatred on her life and others in it, but Tennis basically says “You go girl!”
If Hater is a real person, and Tennis is a real “counsellor”, this approaches malpractice in this layman’s eyes. Political positions aside, the advice he is giving to someone who realizes that she is exhibiting a form of aberrant behavior, and understands that it is unhealthy for her, is basically that her behavior is completely justified!
Tennis is either one sick puppy, or a fabricator, or both.
The best solution to any kind of hatred is to walk a mile in the person’s moccasins. I find that people who hate “country” things have never lived in the country, only in cities, and vice versa. It certainly wouldn’t hurt Hater or any other Palin-hater to go spend a year in what to them would be “the wilderness” and see for themselves what kinds of values it cultivates and why.
It’s interesting how much the Cult of the Man-Child resents authority. Should we be surprised of Obama’s natural affection for anarchists and other haters of authority?
Speaking of the ESFJ and Salon’s misinterpretation of the role of concrete vs. abstract in the personality temperament, Salon’s misreading is more an indication of their lack of capacity for abstract thought than anything. As one who manages risk for a global financial corporation, I work with numerous E**J’s which are mandatory personalities for success in the governance, risk and compliance (GRC) profession. You rely on E**Js every day to protect your credit card data, make sure your planes don’t drop out of the sky, etc. Many of us are regarded as utilitarians, meaning we care about outcome more than process. This is why we recognize Obama’s “Hope and Change” (process elements) as bogus goals. They are not milestones, but rather terribly vague descriptions of the method of moving forward. You can’t REACH hope or change as they are attributes of a transformative process. Of course I seriously doubt Obama grasps these nuances and his followers are too intellectually paralyzed to comprehend such concepts.
I’d have to concur that Palin is likely a E**J, though Salon is falling into a sexist trap by typing her as a ESFJ. There’s much more evidence of an E*TJ, especially looking at how ready Palin was to reject the need for belonging in the status quo when she became mayor, as well as her rejection and opposition to the Alaska Republican Party institution.
This all said, I’m sure it does stir up hatred by those narcissists who have stifled their emotional maturation and live as perpetual adolescents. While it’s nice that our nation can sustain such a large population of useless grasshoppers due to the productivity of our hard-working ants, they need to be mindful that if it wasn’t for utilitarian-minded hard working people making the hard decisions, their relatively easy lives wouldn’t be possible.
…so how should rational people talk with people like “Hater”? I’m surrounded by rabid Palin-Haters at work, and for sanity’s sake I leave my noise-canceling headphones on all day.
Socially, many of my few female friends are convinced that if she’s the VP all women of child-bearing age will be forced–by the government–to get pregnant and bear children. I’m astounded by the ignorance of the VP’s role, but I suspect there’s a little wishful thinking going on, as these women are childless, and either divorced or married to men who do not want to be fathers.
steve albert,
When people are this adamant about their views, it is hard, if not impossible to change their mind. I simply repeat a Ms. Manners line that I find it impolite to discuss politics and religion at the dinner table or with polite company. If you have to walk away, do so, I do all the time.
I’ve thought about disowning her, but she is worth more than I am.
And besides, I love her.
Hermit, usually that doesn’t work. All it does is give them just enough information to reinforce the cartoon. And they bristle at everything they come in contact with, and just get madder and madder.
Do you think that having a Nazi live in the Jewish ghetto would result in more empathy, or more hatred (sorry for invoking Godwin’s law)? People are not fundamentally empathetic creatures. And especially not liberals.
Ever hear of setting Limits and Boundaries?
When conversations or relationships with others become “NOT” healthy, like when they are USING you for their angry expression or negative behaviors, then you use the magic words, “NO”……i.e., I do not wish to continue this conversation. When you are dealing with close friends or family members, Make it a healthy resolution,i.e., WE will not continue discussions that are resultant in ……. whatever, is the issue that is causing discomfort or bad behavior toward either of you. Set limits of use of No name calling, set the tone for more validation required of the core issues in the conversations. Make the disagreement contextual and healthy instead of allowing abusive behavior! DO NOT get in their face! Besides, how do you expect others to “See the Light” if they cannot have their ideas challenged! Do you part, be intelligent, friendly, and pull out if you have to!
Hope this helps making debate more fun!
I recently ran into a “hater”. She approached me, out of the blue, and purposefully tried to make trouble by being insulting and generally rude. During the course of the conversation she complained multiple times about how conservatives were often rude to her… LOL Perhaps the fact that she actively seeks out conservatives with the intent of insulting them might have something to do with their reactions.
Dr. Helen, with all due respect, we should NEVER walk away from Demogenerates. We should confront them and use ANY MEANS NECESSARY, especially violence, to END them.
I’m sick of being called a chickenhawk after having SERVED IN THE MARINE CORPS. It is time to expunge these cowardly, privileged, sneering, perverted, subhuman parasites from
our nation. Sorry, I was shaking so hard I submitted that last post.
Sherlock said it, IMHO. Malpractice. If Hater is a real person, she got no help…instead the discussion turned to Palin’s political qualifications, personality, and significance. But Hater spelled out very clearly that she has become a victim of hate, that her feelings have overwhelmed her daily life, and that she recognizes she is becoming increasingly disabled.
That last point is significant. If Hater is not a fictional construct, she deserves sympathy and assistance. Sorry to say it, but most of the comments here, and the original post, seem to assume that Hater deserves to stew in her own juice. Include me out of that group. I feel sorry for her, and I don’t want to scold her, rub her nose in her mess, or change her political veiws. Hater is in deep, deep trouble.
IF she exists….
Maybe there is too much of a tendency to see normal political differences as defects, disorders, disease? I think so. It’s a way of stigmatizing one’s opponents. Today people are not evil, they are “sick.” People are not mistaken, they have psychological profiles that predispose them to error, and we should put these misguided souls into therapy. Or those who disagree with us are genetic weaklings who literally can’t think straight. It’s a new form of racism.
Hater’s problem is not politics, but excess: she has left ideology behind. She desperately needs a total change of environment, as well as gentle but firm externally imposed discipline.
For those who are not breaking down, adopting maladaptive tactics and losing their emotional balance, psychology is not a substitute for philosophy, any more than palm-reading is a substitute for erudition. Adorno was wrong: it’s ideas that matter, not syndromes…for individuals who can cope. Hater cannot cope.
I tend to think the “haters” wouldn’t worry about Sarah so much if they didn’t perceive her as a very real threat to their Utopian dream of an Obama presidency. They are simply lashing out, like small children do when they encounter a threat, real or perceived. They fear that they won’t get their way in November and they are frightened. I simply feed their fear when I encounter them. I agree that yes, the world will indeed end if Sarah becomes the VP so they better start preparing now by stockpiling food, building bomb shelters, buying defensive weapons, and learning how to defend themselves. I get blank stares by doing that, and they frequently turn pale because they think I’m being serious. When I tell them I’ve been pulling their legs, they “grimace-out”, or turn very red, and launch into their diatribes about how conservatives are evil and mean, and all the other usual talking points. I simply laugh at them and walk away, my last words being, “don’t be so gullible and you won’t be in this uncomfortable position”.
There’s no talking to these folks, so why not have a bit of fun with them?
I’ve run across people who had Clinton hatred similar to what this woman described. This isn’t exclusive to politicians; this kind of hate exists in all walks of life.
A few times in my life, I’ve found myself on a path that would lead to this emotional territory (though not to the extent that this woman described.) My solution is simply to disengage; to walk away. If it’s related to politics, I simply stop reading, watching and listening to the news for a while, especially the opinion pages (especially the ones you either totally agree with are totally oppose.)
Wow.
The paid Obama Push Trollers are here, too.
IMHO, we’re going to see much worse from the left if Obama is elected.
People with that level of hate are capable of ignoring the suffering of others.
Three things:
1) About the actual article, it’s an example of a leftist who is being an authoritarian personality, i.e. I will keep ranting and raving until everyone sees things MY way, projecting said behavior onto the object of her objections.
2) On Haidt, I find his work illuminating not just because he finds that leftists cannot empathize with non-leftists, but goes on to unwittingly demonstrate it. We in the real world could not come up with a better parody of the authoritarian left if we dared try.
3) On Obama’s intelligence, I’ll be the first to concede that Obama is probably quite an intellect, but intellect alone is not a qualification to be president. What matters is the ability to turn one’s intellect and other gifts into results for the people you work for. This is an ability that Barack Obama has completely failed to demonstrate.
Start with the Chicago Annenberg Challenge: $160 million spent on radical leftist educational ideas. Zero improvement in Chicago schools. Epic fail. Unless he worked for Bill Ayers and not the kids of Chicago, of course, then this would be a rousing success.
Then there’s his time in the Illinois legislature: Many present votes, many bills he “co-sponsored” at the last minute, no achievements of significance. It’s almost as if he were working for himself to propel himself to bigger and better things.
Finally, his time as a Senator: He’s opposed reform of Fannie and Freddie to protect his friends, and he’s run for POTUS. Considering the role Fannie and Freddie and his friends had in causing the credit crisis, this could be considered another epic fail. Unless he really only worked for himself and his friends, and this again could be considered a rousing success.
Barack Obama is unqualified because he uses his intellect in exactly the same way a con artist does when he convinces you to put down a $5 bill for a game of three card monty even though you know better. He’s directed his intellectual muscle entirely for the good of himself and his friends, and there’s no evidence that this will change if he gets in the oval office.
“We should confront them and use ANY MEANS NECESSARY, especially violence, to END them.”
Dr. Helen, what do you think of Ken’s homicidal rage?
I think this goes on in a different context all of the time, and yes, it’s malpractice when a women goes into a woman’s shelter, and spins a patently false story of abuse. The counselor, instead of trying to get a sense of the credibility of the story, immediately jumps on board the delusion, and fans the flames. This happens hundreds, if not thousands of times a day.
The counselor isn’t supposed to be a cheerleader for the grievance, but a dispassionate analyzer of the situation. But that actually happens in a small minority of cases.
I wonder if Ken and Boris have the same IP address?
The Democrats are going ape sh*t over Sarah Palin because they know she should have been a member of the Democratic Party. She would have been so, had the Party lived up to its own ideals.
**I have the answer for all you Palin haters!!
As a Palin-hater myself, I have found a way to not hate the way she speaks, forgets the facts, speaks in soundbites or chooses to not give her daughter birth control.
Watch SNL…you will laugh at this rifle weilding, annie oakley with glasses you betcha. You’ll love her quirks doggone it!…but like a heckuva lot of us..you will not vote for her!
She’s a gimmick…and a comedian…gosh darnit!
Yes, I’m pretty sure Ken is a moby. (Which is itself, as it were, QED.)
During the Republican convention, police blocked off the street in front of my office building. We heard that Sarah Palin’s car was arriving soon, so several of us stood in the front windows watching. As we stood there, a co-worker started a rant about how much she hates Palin. Palin makes her physically ill! Literally, she clenched her teeth and balled up her fists as she went on and on. This is an educated woman who is otherwise known for her ability to work well with others.
It’s really disturbing to me to watch things like this. I think politics has replaced everything for some people–religion, community activities, even entertainment. The political fanatics pour so much energy into their beliefs. It becomes a huge part of their identity. Their responses become emotional and irrational, and to justify the emotionalism, they blow everything out of proportion. Then mindlessly maintaining that disproportion becomes the most important task. Bush is Hitler. Republicans hate black people. Sarah Palin is a horrible woman. Dems are fighting the good fight, and if you disagree with them to any degree, you’re part of the dark forces that threaten humanity.
I don’t even bother trying to reason with people like this. They only turn on you. But I will say that this kind of irrational behavior has done me a great favor. Never before in my adult life have I considered it so important to vote.
Ken and steve albert,
Ken, I understand your rage, and have since re-thought my reply to steve. I was answering him on a personal level–that is, I was letting him know that letting it go might save him emotional energy that might be better off spent somewhere else. For example, I got into it with a man recently who told me that “Dick Cheney was the most dangerous man in America.” When I asked why, he went on about how we had Osama Bin Laden in sight and Cheney would not give orders to kill him. I simply looked puzzled and said, “Did you see ‘The Path to 9/11?’ Well, no you probably didn’t since the Clintons banned ABC from showing it, but it was Bill Clinton who refused to give the orders to kill Bin Laden.” The facts meant nothing to this guy, he launched into some other lefty lies while I just thought to myself, “I can spend my time getting mad or I can blog, podcast, and write columns that counteract these arguments and maybe someone with a more open mind will read them.”
But you do have a point. Physical violence is not called for but I do think a swift and strong verbal response can be a politically savvy way to confront someone who has no tolerance for any view but leftist propaganda. Getting in your aggressor’s face and yelling loudly that “Obama is an anti-American friend of terrorists who is working to destroy the American way of life and they are part of his minion and therefore why should you listen to a thing they say” is a legitimate response. Or telling them to save their views for Moveon and company might also work. One has to be prepared to lose a friendship, relationship etc. over this decision to verbally fight back but then, do you really want the kind of friend who wants you only to believe what they do?
I think this topic would make a good follow-up column to this one at some point.
Dr. Helen:
Thanks for answering me, and I’m sorry I got carried away.
Seriously, the Republicans really need to grow a pair when confronting the far left. I always see these “deer in the headlights” posts from GOPers saying something along the lines of, “How could they BE like that?” instead of “OK, they are like that, now let’s kick some ass.”
PLEASE, Republicans, try to avoid responses like “If this was a Republican the media would be condemning his actions.” When you say that you are ceding power to the media. If the media won’t act, then WE have to.
With respect to Ken, I don’t know if we are quite at the point of violence in this country yet between left and right. However, that said, at some point realities will need to be faced.
There were many who advocated restraint, dialoque, cooperation, negotiation, and yes, even appeasement before every conflict in human history. Even Hitler had his appeasers, if you recall, and that didn’t end very well, did it? We are in currently well along in the process of appeasing ourselves to death in regards to Islam, and Europe is half converted already.
I am grateful that Bush, for all his many disastrous policies and decisions, at least had a pair big enough to take it to them, yet we know by their own words that democrats will withdraw and appease. All this does is encourage them to be more aggressive. The same problem exists with the left itself – the more you give, the more they will want, until they have it all. They will NOT back down until then, either.
We also can see that the left in this country, strongly influenced by communist ideology (as Obama himself has been) has learned well the strong armed tactics that brought Hitler, Chavez and others to power through bloodless coups at the ballot box:
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/09/barack_obama_and_the_strategy.html
Intimidation, bribery, threats of physical violence, manipulation of a compliant media, vote fraud, constant use of the Big Lie and other smear techniques, were the preferred tools in gaining power for both Nazism and communism. Once people like this get in power, it is nearly impossible to dislodge them peacefully.
In addition to being able to squash dissent and have monopoly use of those shameful but effective tactics, they will also control all the military apparatus. How long do you think it would be before an Obama regime would pass the “Fairness Doctrine” and similar restrictions on the internet, the only means conservatives have to organize and communicate? (These have already been proposed by the current democrats in congress.) Or how long until the first national gun control legislation is passed, and from there to outright confiscation?
At some point those of us who value freedom, personal responsibility, and the rule of law under a reasonably restrictive Constitution, will have to face this very unpleasant scenario. If Obama gets in, that time will come much sooner rather than later. Even if he does not, the left will never give up until they gain control. There already have been threats of race riots if he loses.
Either way, this country is so screwed. The ideological gulf between left and right will be difficult to bridge peacefully.
It’s almost at the point where I think that maybe the red states and the blue states should go their separate ways and form their own unions. If that does not happen, we will all have to grow a very large pair or submit to the realization that “1984″ has finally arrived.
In my humble layman’s opinion, the core of so much of women’s crazed hatred of Sarah Palin comes down to abortion. Repressed guilt/regret often manifests in irrational rage doesn’t it? Even though I’ve never heard Palin out ranting on abortion, her lifestyle choices silently make a profound statement. I think most women who chose to abort their babies carry the guilt of “what if?” their whole lives. It hurts/angers them to be reminded of it so loudly by this admirable woman, who when also faced with hard choices in life took the high road and is SUCCESSFUL and HAPPY.
I have to wonder how many of these Palin Haters have gotten real good at it by hating Bush so fiercely for the last 4 to 6 years. BDS has transferred seamlessly from Bush (who is going away very soon) to Palin. I wonder why the left’s Haters haven’t focused on McCain, rather than Palin. But I’m convinced that the unhealthy emotionalism of the response has been learned from the viral hatred of feelings about “Bush Lied / People Died” with lots of exclamation points following.
00Stephen, I love it when my liberal friends start talking about Republicans being the party of “racism and the KKK” because it gives me a chance to say “You do know that Jim Crow laws were created by Democrats and dismantled by Republicans via the Civil Rights Act, that KKK members were almost to a man Democrats, and that Republicans have been the party of civil rights going back to Abraham Lincoln, don’t you?” This always throws them for a loop.
More recently, I follow up with the fact that Republicans, specifically John McCain, tried to push for Congressional oversight of Fannie and Freddie and were therefore labelled as racist, and use that as an example of how Republicans have been unfairly and inaccurately labelled racist for years.
She is the biggest celebrity in the world, next to the likes of Paris Hilton and Nicole Richie. She promises the whole world but cannot go into even the slightest details of any of her promises. She uses the word “maverick” as if it was bestowed upon her from God. She was a literal unknown over 4 weeks ago but came into the center stage as quick as the biggest celebrities like Paris Hilton and Nicole Richie. What does America really know about our new biggest celebrity? Why do we love her with so much intensity? What has she done to deserve such recognition? Does she have a solid plan for our economy or our safety in this dangerous world of terrorism?
This new biggest celebrity in our lives is just a heartbeat away from the Presidency. Her Presidential nominee will be the oldest President in history, if elected. Can we feel confident that this new biggest celebrity name Sarah Palin can be the most qualified person to turn this country around from the worst economic crisis in over 70 years? Is she absolutely the most qualified, even with her high celebrity status, to lead the most powerful country in the world out of its biggest financial crisis?
One reason Democrats hate Republicans is that they have more TIME to hate us. Republicans spend all day working, while Democrats spend all day sipping latte and surfing porn sites. Republicans are our engineers, our construction workers, and our farmers. Democrats are hairstylists and philosophy professors, and are parasites.
Elimination of parasites makes a body healthier.
Can we believe that Obama is “absolutely the most qualified, even with HIS high celebrity status, to lead the most powerful country in the world out of its biggest financial crisis?”
The advice-seeker stumbled on her own diagnosis. She said she hates herself. Classic liberalism in a nutshell: self-loathing narcissism. Ego-driven vs. purpose-driven.
Couple things. 1) Bill Clinton’s opponents were angered by his Teflon qualities. I remember being somewhat surprised at how … almost obsessive some writers had become on the subject. The impeachment seemed to me to be grasping at straws and it occurred to me that there might be consequences for the next Republican in the Oval Office. Yet I have been horrified by the intensity of BDS. Perhaps every time this derangement syndrome passes to its next object it intensifies. Palin Derangement Syndrome looks at least as intense as BDS. I hope I’m wrong, but I wonder how long before someone winds up dead.
Along those lines, 2) It seems clear to me that a plurality of voters in this country have exchanged religious for political fervor, and not in a positive way. How many examples of religious-level fervor can you count up-thread? These people need not just a life but a positive faith, too.
Finally, the only difference between the PDS”Hater” and both of my professorial and very spoiled sisters is that “Hater” has at least a clue that the problem may be in her. That’s why I think she doesn’t exist and “Tennis” made her letter out of whole cloth so he could write the column he wanted to write.
Sorry, last paragraph should begin, “Finally, the only differences between the PDS exhibitors upstream, “Hater” and both of my….
I’m sick of hearing about the 5 colleges that Sarah attended as if that’s a weird thing. So she goes to Hawaii, goes back to Alaska, goes to Idaho, goes back to Alaska, goes back to Idaho to finish. Why would she do that? A lack of funds, yes, and, Hello? Does the name TODD ring a bell?? And it was 4 colleges not 5 – she returned to Univ of Idaho to finish.
My nephew actually went to 5 colleges in 8 years and managed to get a degree that he never used. Now he’s not the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree but he makes $220,000 a year and he’s his own boss. So Sarah Palin goes to 5 colleges and now she’s the sitting Governor of Alaska and the VP candidate and also makes a six-figure income. Crickey. Those achievements shame my traditional 4-year, one-college degree all to hell.
I’m lucky—I don’t have to put up with any Democrats within my immediate or even extended circle. I have two close relatives who are Democrats, but we don’t communicate during election years
I don’t hate Palin and I will vote for McCain in spite of her. But she is a bubble headed twit and all the faux populism small town Joe Six Pack spiel is just trash dished up for the saps here, she is a fool. If you are in a debate and you refuse to answer questions, it means you are hiding something like a stand that is unpopular or that you just don’t know what you are talking about.
“The advice-seeker stumbled on her own diagnosis. She said she hates herself. Classic liberalism in a nutshell: self-loathing narcissism. Ego-driven vs. purpose-driven.
”
Talk about psycho babble double talk! don’t respond to the point, just throw up some pop psycho generalizations.
Desmond Morris touched on all this in “The Naked Ape” and “The Human Zoo”
We think we’re smart, thoughtful and in charge of our own thought processes but in reality we are tribal and base political beings.
This woman is nothing more than a trooper for her cause. She identifies with the left to the point that it has enveloped her . . . for good or bad.
More freethinking middle-of-the-roaders please! It’s time to examine the tribes you belong to.
I’m beginning to think the Democratic Party has become a cult. The leaders have indoctrinated the members that something terrible would happen if their side doesn’t win. The fear and hate engendered has made them easy prey for a deliverer, in this case Obama, who was a community organizer, which people have said was just like Jesus. (Actually, I predicted Hillary would be presented as the Messiah. Obama just wasn’t on my radar at the time.)
Of course, in the end, this will justify almost any action. We’ve already seen some, including racist attacks at Condi Rice and sexist attacks of Hillary and Palin. Democrats won’t literally drink Kool-aid like at Jonestown. However, I’m afraid they’re capable of serious action, such as substantial and deliberate voter fraud.
A buddy of mine observed that women tend to view all other women as “cute” until the real thing shows up. Then they hate her.
My mother-in-law resides in Nutterville, as well. She believes herself to be a highly evolved, enlightened, and, of course, progressive woman; I know this because she told me so. She despises/loathes/hates Bush/McCain/Palin/Republicans all the while sporting a bumper sticker on her car that says “Idaho: Too Great for Hate. I have plainly stated in her presence that “I never send anyone unsolicited emails of a political nature as I think it is both bad form and bad manners.” Yet she persists in sending me her MoveOn updates.
BTW, I’m the only “person of color” (Hispanic) in my wife’s family. She likes to preen about that point with the other Nutterville residents. The other son-in-laws and grandsons have to endure the cracks about “evil white men.” She also aspires to be an “Elder” in the Native American culture. She believes her totem to be a white buffalo so I’ve taken to calling her “Dances with White Buffalos.” I shared that with my brothers and sister, they all think it is hilarious.
Sadly this comes from a person that is deeply involved in charity work and professes to have great caring for the poor and oppressed. I just avoid her as much as possible and shift the conversation to other topics whenever I’m trapped in her presence.
And kind of related is this quote from Orwell’s essay “Notes on Nationalism”:
“There is no limit to the follies that can be swallowed if one is under the influence of feelings of this kind… The point is that as soon as fear, hatred, jealousy and power worship are involved, the sense of reality becomes unhinged. And, as I have pointed out already, the sense of right and wrong becomes unhinged also.”
Read the whole thing–it can be found online. Seriously, it’s a must read. With very few changes it could’ve been written yesterday.
Oh,bother — are your spoiled sisters having any troubles at work? I have to think if people are starting to avoid the Haters in their personal lives, that might also flow over into their professional lives. Being that vile, out of control and emotional can NOT be a happy thing come review-time, which thereafter maybe reflects on one’s wage-scale.
Of course, in academia this is moot since the Haters are protected by tenure and mandated COLA increases, but in other professions (such as Journalism) being an overt Hater is very much affecting the industry’s bottom-line as well as individual job prospects for the foreseeable future.
I wonder if being a lawyer who’s also perceived as being a Hater by peers and clients has any effect on said lawyer’s wage scale.
Sheep: “Jamie, I would say Biden is in the top tier.”
Of what???? Gaffe emitters? Senate gasbags?
This is only the latest manifestation of a long American tradition. My father was a long-time operative of the California Democratic Party, and his biggest disappointment in life was that he didn’t make Richard Nixon’s Enemies List.
This was a problem because his best friend, banker Ray Lapin, was on Nixon’s Enemies List, and Ray never let Pop forget about it.
Ray got on it because, having been appointed as Chairman of Ginnie Mae (Governmental National Mortgage Association) by then-President Lyndon Johnson, he refused to resign early at the request of later-elected President Richard Nixon so Nixon could appoint some more deserving crony of his. And Nixon’s Attorney General, John Mitchell, even sent some FBI agents to Ray Lapin’s apartment in the Watergate Hotel to threaten Ray about it. Ray asked then if they were aware that his appointment expired in a few months, and they shame-facedly admitted they didn’t. It was pretty funny.
So Nixon got his (sort of) revenge by naming Ray Lapin as one of his most hated enemies. This did not merely make Ray’s day, but brighten his whole career, and he never tired of ribbing Pop about it.
Because Pop took such things seriously, too seriously in my opinion.
I personally find the victims of Palin Derangement Syndrome to be delightful specimens of people who have WAY too much time on their hands. As well as the adherents of a centuries-old American tradition.
I think the comment about the high of self-righteousness is very close to the mark. Palin is an existential threat to the foundations of the femininist platform. She’s bright, confident, successful, married to a man’s man, and HAPPY!
Hater’s whole foundation is crumbling around her. Palin’s mere existence is shattering the myth. They need to invalidate her to remove the threat. Hater sounds like a good person who is shedding her indoctrination. “Tennis” tried to reinforce the foundation that she herself believes in. Hater asked another Hater for help.
The treatment for someone like this is the back of one’s hand to the face. She is obviously hysterical. She’ll thank you for it. Pain focusses the mind, which is why we spank our children. She should ask a friend to slap her when she gets like this.
TO: Ken, et al.
RE: The Rage of It All
It indeed can be infuriating to deal with one of these sorts on line, let alone in the flesh. Their rank stupidity….yes, ‘stupidity’….is incomprehensible to rational beings.
I encounter people Dr. Helen described with here Cheney-is-the-most-dangerous-person person in the blogosphere all the time. Engaging a couple of them in different venues at this moment. However, I neither walk-away nor get shaking with rage. If I find myself getting to item number two, I just turn the anger over to Him. He can deal with it, and with them, better than I can. Sort of like my approach to abortionists. There’s not need to get overwrought, He’ll deal with them in His own way at His a time of His choosing.
But, I agree, just walking away from the ‘fight’ is to surrender the field. And, after 27 years in the infantry, that is not part of my nature. Besides, I enjoy a good ‘discussion’.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[A clash of doctrines is not a disaster....for ME.]
TO: Dr. Helen, et al.
RE: A Fascinating Read, That
Reading the Haidt, Gopnik and Harris thinkies….
Not through with it yet, but the tail end comment by Harris I thought was odd…
I’ve not seen many Democrats appeal to ‘reason’. And certainly not about Palin. If they are appealing to ‘reason’, it’s the reason of group insanity.
Over on another venue, I now see that they’re accusing Palin of practicing ‘witchcraft’. No supporting evidence, as yet. But there it is. And it IS ‘insane’. We’re talking signs of extreme desperation, there.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Those whom the gods would destroy, they first make 'mad'.]
FYI, Einstein, it’s “Theodor” Adorno, not “Theodore.” And he “had,” not “has” an anti-capitalist bent, as he died in, like, 1969.
But other than that you’re entirely correct. Okay, not really.
TO: Marc Malone
RE: TARGET!!!!
Cease fire.
The Palin SABOT round has scored a direct hit on post-modern feminism and their thick-skinned armor has not warded of the penetrator. The secondary detonations, like Hater’s, are spectacular and awe-inspiring. It’s called a catastrophic kill.
We can only hope she can arise from the ashes of that conflagration.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end. -- Texas A&M alumni]
My guess is for those of us who used to be on the left or spent the bulk of our adult lives there (I did), there is nothing surprising about these haters. In particular, when it comes to Democrat women who hate Palin, she has eviscerated their dogma about Republicans, conservatives, conservative women, feminism, and so many shibboleths of lefty dogma to the point where their heads literally are about to explode. The cognitive dissonance is not on our side, it is on theirs. She does not compute. The fact of her immense popularity — pure grassroots, utterly divorced from the MSM and conventional wisdom of the so-called elites — is probably worse for many of them than Bush ever was, as amazing as that may seem.
The true danger of Palin is her obvious potential to be the true face and future of the Republican party and this is why they are pulling out all the stops to destroy her. Just the thought that she could become the new conservative standard – and someone extremely appealing to many not “in the conservative fold” – is more threatening to lefties’ and lefty women’s safety than the next terrorist attacks. Believe it. It is a shame and yet a natural outcome of the current political climate that each side is to a certain degree looking forward to seeing the other side literally go insane.
I think if anyone ever developed a video game in which conservatives and liberals shoot and blow each other up and you choose your side, it would be an instant phenomenon. I’d buy it! It would be cathartic and release some of this pressure that’s building up.
This issue will be the subject of excellent books in the future. Unfortunately, if the Demagogues win as it seems they will, it is likely such examinations will be printed secretly in small batches, if at all, and passed furtively from one brave soul to another. I say that because for several years in our blueblue Oregon town my husband and I have learned to hide away our views as if we were protecting “Jews in the attic”. Our experiences have given me a whole new appreciation for how fragile and precious are the respectful, open-minded habits that make a healthy republic, how easily they can be eroded by the worst among us, and what bravery it takes to stand against such decay. I’ve even begun preparing myself that in the future I may have to give my life in order to stand for freedoms, not because I would be violent, but that in daring to take a alternative stand, jackboot enlightened ones like Hater would gather around to kick me to death without blinking an eye — and official publishers will look the other way.
So, doctor, what’s happening to me?
Chuck(le):
Try going into the really rabid dens of leftwing lunacy sometime – HuffPo, DU, Kos and see how long you get to enjoy a good “discussion”. I’ve been banned from all three for simply dissenting from the Kool Aid drinkers in a reasonably civil manner, especially in comparison to the drooling venom they spew when they come here, or any other conservative, independent or moderate blog. I believe they consider what I say some sort of alien, incomprehensible language.
To me that is an indication of how little they will respect the 1st amendment if Obama manages to obfuscate his way to the presidency.
palin fills the void…
this a community driven by hatred of bush, about to lose their demon.
are they happy? not until they find a new demon.
Palin’s main appeal to the base and most of the posters here is a shared common, ignorant, shallow anti-intellectual worldview. You feel safe with someone as ignorant as you. Most of you saps never heard of her or could tell me what the capital of Alaska was a month ago and now you act like she is Joan of Arc.
BTWL I wil vote for McCain in spite of her and that many would think I share a common bond with you!
As far as calling people haters go, I suggest that the people who are labeling others as haters have two things in common, they are full of hate themselves and have nothing intelligent to counter the otheres’ arguments. “You don’t like Palin, you’re a hater, you’re an elitist!?
TO: geokstr
RE: Been There….
….done that.
Got ‘killed’.
They’re turning themselves into echo chambers of angst, ennui and hate and any time the ‘light’ shines in on them, they stamp it out. It’s sad….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Whereas Good can tolerate the existence of Evil. Evil cannot tolerate the existence of Good, as Good will continually be pointing out Evil's problems. Therefore Evil must always try to destroy Good.]
TO: Mark I.
RE: Well….
….everybody needs to have a hobby.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Isn't sanity just a one trick pony anyway? I mean, all you get is one trick: rational thinking. But when you're good and crazy, the sky's the limit! -- The Tick]
TO: geokstr
RE: By the Way….
…it’s not just Kos and his ilk. I’ve found alleged ‘conservatives’ who will kill you in a heartbeat as well.
They tend to be atheists; Rachal Lucas, Andrea Harris, Amy Alkon, Charles Johnson.
So the problem is a tad more wide-spread than most people realize.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[No folly is more costly than the folly of intolerant idealism. -- Winston Churchill]
The only side that “hates” PALIN seems to be coming from the right.
The left just thinks she doesn’t have the chops to be (Second) Commander-in-Chief.
Kind of don’t know her well enough to hate her. Just fundamentally, viscerally, disagree with her world view.
The way the right perverts words, though, is amazing to me.
You say “patriotic”!
I say “Torture?!” “Civil liberties?!” “Constitution?!”
All is well in my world, though, as the McCain/Palin “stock” seems to be plunging.
A Dem friend of mine, twelve years, has made it clear she is never speaking to me again because I’m a Dem for McCain. When I said I thought Palin was a great Governor and a good VP pick, she almost hit me. The good news is, there are a lot more like me who aren’t haters, are feminists, and will vote for McCain. Compassionate conservatism is a good thing. Passionate liberalism is not.
TO: All
RE: As I….
….commented with a tagline (above)….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Insanity takes its toll. Please have exact change ready.]
P.S….
Thank you pe, for providing the supporting evidence.
TO: Dr. Helen
RE: A Prognosticative Question
What will these ‘haters’ become/do if McCain and Palin are elected to office? Some of them seem to be on the verge of going, quite literally, crazy and violently so.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Almost went crazy. It would have been a real short trip.]
Dr. Helen,
Could you do me a favor and post the IP numbers of proud elitist and Javelin? I’ll do the rest of the research.
I hope to God they turn violent. I can’t imagine anything I’d enjoy more than splattering them and laughing at them as the blood bubbles out of their mouths. THEY ARE NOT HUMAN.
TO: Ken
RE: Cuidado Compadre
You’ll just turn yourself into the ‘things’ you loath. And that’s self-defeating.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[We haz met the enemy and they iz us. -- Pogo]
the palin haters are no different than the hillary clinton haters. they wrote the same ugly, untrue, twisted, unstable diatribes in the nytimes comments, as they now write about palin. sarah palin is an outstanding example of an energy peculiar to america. she is unambiguous about her patriotism and her contempt for terrorist nations and their power mad leaders. we have been without this basic idealism for quite some time now. with no apologies, she makes direct contact with the people of this country. whereas only the pundits speak for us and the politicians, the governor, actually appears to be listening for our response. those who are threatened by her confidence that she can take on anything, should consider that she was relentless in winning from the oil moguls, the biggest tax revenues in history, and returning it to the people of alaska. clearly sarah palin can run with the big dogs. therefore it is not surprising that her detractors are so uniformly unhinged.
TO: Judy, NYC
RE: Really?
“the palin haters are no different than the hillary clinton haters. they wrote the same ugly, untrue, twisted, unstable diatribes in the nytimes comments….” — Judy, NYC
Please show me the one where they accuse Hillary of witchcraft. I do recall someone saying she practiced bitchcraft. And I doubt if you could find any rational person who wouldn’t agree with that. Nor have I ever seen anyone say she was a pig with lipstick. Or even allude to it. But I have heard people mention that she has fat calfs.
Then again, what are the ‘lies’ people are telling about Hillary? That Bill Clinton cheated on her? On the other hand, I recall hearing allegations of Todd cheating on Sa-RAH.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Useless Invention: Lie detectors for politicians.]
Chuck Pelto: this isn’t about me. It’s about the nation I love, and eliminating the disease of the Democrat Party from that beloved nation.
Ask yourself: just what is it that the Democrats contribute to this nation? Are we suffering from a shortage of welfare cheats, hair stylists, and philosophy professors? Would we, or would we not, have a better nation if the Democrats were removed from this great nation?
I live ‘behind enemy lines’ in a blue neighborhood in a deep blue state. I (used to) subscribe to a local blog that is run by and caters to women who sound a lot like “Hater” (i.e., professional, married with children, ‘mature’, financially secure). This blog can go for months with zero comments in any of its forums. After Sarah Palin’s coming out party in Ohio, the blog posted a thread on Sarah Palin…..which drew almost 50 comments immediately. Most of them could have been written by “Hater” herself, that my neighbors are so consumed by hatred of a person they don’t even know stunned me. Several of us joined the discussion to defend Sarah and politely, very politely! detail her positive life achievements. For daring to speak up I’ve been disinvited and the Sarah Palin thread has disappeared down the memory hole, like it never existed.
I think commentator Bill from above is on to something:
Bill: A question: How old is “The Hater”? It might mean something. It’s not too much of a stretch to say that the post-menopausal face lift crowd (think Hilary, Boxer, Feinstein, Pelosi) are threatened by a young, sexually attractive woman. She gets all the attention, just by smiling and walking up to the microphone. Fury ensues. It is inconceivable (because it is so painful) that she is also smart, sensitive, competent, and of good will, just as they imagine themselves to have been when they were her age. Sarah’s still “in the game” they are not. Could it be partly late middle age “raging hormones”, or rather, late middle aged “lack of hormones” leading to rage?
It’s not that complicated, really. “Hater” is a 300 pound butt ugly, self loathing libber, and the armpits of all her white blouses are stained federal safety yellow.
Tennis? His Myers-Riggs is BFAH.
TO: Ken
RE: Fair Warning
Going down that path will make it about you.
As I said, be careful, compadre.
Regards,
Chuck
I’m a liberal Dem (PUMA) who “gets” Palin after having lived in Alaska for a number of years.
Either “Hater” is uncomfortable with things out of her life experience, or she’s projecting like a M-F’er.
So sad when you want to attack what you don’t recognize in yourself.
Humor and mockery are the best way…
Just say with a straight face: “look at the bright side of a McCain win…all those Bush haters can now become Palin haters…we need to keep people employed in this economic crisis!”
My wife is an ESFJ. And loves Palin. I’m an INTP (complete opposite of my wife of 35 yrs). And I think Sarah is great, too.
Again — you mistake disgust at this woman being “qualified” to be VP (I won’t even tread into PotUS) with HATE. The left isn’t spewing hatred, but incredulity and snarkiness.
Look, she’s a politically savvy idiot. Just like G-Dub. And we all know how splendid those qualities fare for America.
Your presidential candidate has said he will hate go*ks for all time.
And your amnesia over the treatment over many, many years of Hillary (and Chelsea nastiness, to include McCain himself) bashing is quite remarkable.
No worries for me, though. Polls are leaning very positive towards Obama and sliding downhill for your Messiah and JohnnyPOWMac.
Of course, maybe you are all too d*mn prejudiced to vote for a black guy. I mean, I’m too age-ist to vote for the old maver-ICK (and I do mean “ick”) come November. Of course, so are my late-80′s grandparents, so maybe it’s just genetic.
To quote the McCain voting Javelin above:
–Palin’s main appeal to the base and most of the posters here is a shared common, ignorant, shallow anti-intellectual worldview. You feel safe with someone as ignorant as you. Most of you saps never heard of her or could tell me what the capital of Alaska was a month ago and now you act like she is Joan of Arc.
“how can we ignore politics?? Politics affect EVERY SECOND of our lives!” (ironically coming from someone who did not know the name “Nancy Pelosi” when I mentioned it 9 months ago)
This is typical of most of the ‘haters’ I know as well – both on the left and right. It always seems that ignorant people are the most confident in their opinions.
elitist – god, but you’re dumb.
Proud Elitist & Realitycheq
I’ve read several of your post over the last few weeks and I’ve come to the conclusion that you two are liberal Dupes. You are upside down versus the objective reality that exist for us all. There are only two categories of liberals: The Power Seekers and the Dupes. The Power Seekers understand perfectly well what they are doing, undermining and dividing America, and they do it for their narrow goal of short term gains of power. Almost all liberal leaders, whether elected officials, union leaders, civil rights gurus, professional feminist, some political columnist or a few college professors etc., are in this category. The Dupes are a little different. They are the true believers, who believe in the face of all evidence to the contrary, that liberalism improves peoples lives. You don’t strike me as power seekers. Regards
TO: Chuck(le)
RE: By the Way….
I’m an atheist. That does not mean that you cannot have honor, a sense of decency and integrity, the ability to use reason, and have respect for others’ belief systems (assuming they have those same underlying values).
All you trolls, if you don’t understand most of those words, either ask me go look them up yourself.
TO: geokster
RE: [OT] Atheists R Us
No problem for me. I know LOTS of them. Along with lots of pagans and wiccan, presbys, uniutils, bapts. Heck. My brother-in-law is an Iranian (expat).
Open minded and civil discourse is what made this country great. It’s a shame that too many of these people—mostly younger than I—have never grasped the sense of decency we support.
Keep up the good work….
….we’re all excited.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[The true test of civilization is not the census, nor the size of cities, nor the crops-no, but the kind of man the country turns out. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson]
I had a post that goes in a similar direction.I come out at a different end of the worm hole though. I came to the conclusion that the rage was all out of proportion for any of the sources deduced by what Rene Girard might call first appearances. It made me think that there was something much more fundamental at stake for the poor rage-filled Palin-o-cidal women and many of the most caustic and condescending Palinophobic men.
I made a long (and, I hope, interesting) discourse on it but what it boiled down to was that those folks are all people who have had to take on roles and put up facades to imitate an image of what (tempting the oxymoron now) an “intelligent” liberal “professional person” looks and acts like. They are women who are acting like men and men who are acting like women who are acting like men and they are (especially when they are at work) as stiff and unappealing as people can possibly be.
Now, here comes this woman who is attractive, natural, appealing and successful without swallowing all of the toxic liberal/progressive personality poison they have all dutifully swallowed. “Think of it,” they must be muttering to themselves, “she probably even has the gaul to laugh at a joke before she analyses it for racist, sexist or global warming content- The Bitch!” Wouldn’t you be pissed?
Here’s a link if you’re inclined: http://breathofthebeast.blogspot.com/2008/09/rage-sex-roles-elections-and-media.html
Proud Elitist –
Of course, maybe you are all too d*mn prejudiced to vote for a black guy.
There are plenty of minorities who I think would make wonderful presidents. Colin Powell, Thomas Sowell, Walter Williams, Michael Steele, Janice Rogers Brown, Bobby Jindal, several personal friends I won’t name here…
I do have a prejudice against self-serving politicians who come out of the most corrupt political machine in the first world. Barack Obama has been an abject failure as a public servant. (See my comment above for my quick analysis.) He has, however, been great at using his unquestionable intellect to advance his own interests and those of his friends.
If making an argument based on Obama’s actions makes me a racist, it makes me fear an Obama administration even more. The day dissent becomes taboo because people like you can’t stand legitimate criticisms of Obama is a dangerous one indeed.
People, people…
You’re making a huge fundamental mistake here. Those of us on the Left don’t hate Sarah Palin! We love Sarah Palin!
And it’s not just because she’s done a great job getting Obama’s numbers up in the polls. That’s just a side benefit, really.
No, no, we love Sarah Palin because she is comedy gold. She’s so instinctively funny that all we have to do is say things that she says to get laughs. No need to inject irony: it’s built right in!
It’s true we don’t want her on the world stage. But on small-scale campaign stages, she kills, people, she kills. Seriously. I wouldn’t want to follow her act, because the audience would be all laughed out. The lady’s got timing like a Rolex.
I gotta hand it to some of you, too, for your own comedy chops. To the person who claimed the nick SarahsBiggestFan? Mwah! Perfecto! Totally nailed it without even trying.
So, please. Diss us if you must, but diss us for the right reasons. (You know, because we love terrorists.)
It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring.
— Carl Sagan
As an aside, for all you Dupes on this thread. McCain is going to win this election, in a landslide. When that happens, I suggest you look in the mirror and ask why you were wrong, thinking Obama had a chance. It’s because you are Dupes. You need to grow as people, and get closer to the objective reality. Everybody that has ever lived, is living now, or will live in the future, was, is, and will be ignorant. There are no exceptions. Your job (and mine)is to try to get as close as possible to the objective reality that exist. Regards
Oh, yeah. I agree with Matt. To hate Sarah is too much for her. Inadequate. She is just funny and harmless to Obama’s camp. Had I got through Matt’s comment, I would not posted my one.
I wonder if disappointment-induced depression will be covered under either of their health insurance plans.
I hope not. It would only prolong the maturing process for those who deny any reality but their own.
My wife and I watched the VP debate at the house of a couple we know with a bunch of other friends. The views were split 50/50 between Republicans and Democrats but we managed to all stay friendly until one woman (she is a typical NYT reading Left-winger) launched a foul-mouthed tirade against Palin. We made the mistake of trying to engage in a reasonable discussion with her but every time we made a point she couldn’t seem to argue with she just said it was “Fox News B.S.” Out of nowhere she suddenly completely lost it and started sobbing hysterically whilst asking us, through her tears, how we could support “someone so evil”. She seemed to be having a nervous breakdown so we all changed the subject and tried to calm her down but she carried on sobbing and wailing about Palin for 20 minutes or so. Very disturbing.
Javelin – Please read the article. The woman identified herself as a Hater, not us. Furthermore, read our comments. Note the quality of the verbiage and depth of thought used by some posters. Do you really believe we’re shallow, ignorant, and anti-intellectual?
To whomever suggested that we’d be better off sans the Democrats, well, that’s just foolish. That way lies the very thing we hate: One-Party rule. We need the Dems to keep the far-right from going overboard and taking us with them.
Also, the Dems aren’t necessarily bad. Blue-Dog Dems are fiscally conservative, and often socially conservative. Most are decent folks who have a slightly different, and not unreasonable worldview. The problem is that their party has been hijacked by Socialists posing as Dems, because they know that, if they were to run as Socialists, they’d lose.
Interestingly, there is one U.S. Senator from the Socialist party… from NH I believe. He’s the SECOND-MOST-LIBERAL Senator, right after (or to the right of) Senator Obama.
We don’t think HATER’s position is justified. HATER should BACK OFF. Life’s too short, not to mention Richard Rubin. LOL. Roger’s short too but he has the guts to go toe to toe with the liberals. Sarah Palin? Let those who’ve dealt with more than Russian Trade Missions throw the first pirogi.
The Playdo Institute
Handel Glassberg, President
Somewhere further up on this thread, Jet City Queen wrote
“In my humble layman’s opinion, the core of so much of women’s crazed hatred of Sarah Palin comes down to abortion. Repressed guilt/regret often manifests in irrational rage doesn’t it? Even though I’ve never heard Palin out ranting on abortion, her lifestyle choices silently make a profound statement. I think most women who chose to abort their babies carry the guilt of “what if?” their whole lives. It hurts/angers them to be reminded of it so loudly by this admirable woman, who when also faced with hard choices in life took the high road and is SUCCESSFUL and HAPPY.”
JetCityQueen may be right that a huge reason for women’s hatred of Palin is her stance on abortion. But this whole notion that most women who chose to abort carry some huge guilt their whole lives is a complete fallacy. SOME women may regret it, but the huge, huge majority do not, and while a difficult and unpleasant decision, it’s not something that women wring their hands about for the rest of their lives. With Palin, we have a woman who is proud that her daughter “chose” to keep her child (her words), and that for her own part, she would “counsel a woman to choose life”. Well, there you go, and there is the whole argument of why many women can’t stomach the idea of Palin being in a position of power at the VP or Presidential level: choice. Oh yes, she is proud her daughter “chose” life, and proud that she herself “chose” to carry to term a Down Syndrome baby. That is fantastic for both of them. I mean that. It’s fantastic because they had a CHOICE but they want all other women to have none. This is why Sarah Palin, while she can be applauded for having a career and a large family, can also legitimately be reviled for her stance on abortion. She herself has said she would force her own daughter to carry a rapist’s child. Again, great for her (maybe not so much for her daughter), but this statement makes her anti-woman to many. This idea that a woman would want to force another woman to carry to term ANY child, under any circumstance, be a gang-raped or raped by your grandfather, etc. etc. So for women like us, the idea of Palin as VP or President is terrifying. She no more represents us than Dick Cheney does; gender does have something to do with it. We can dismiss a man feeling that way, because he is a man and will never, ever know what a situation like that would feel like. But Palin is a woman, and CAN imagine it. Or… she should. But that’s the thing too… I don’t think this woman has deep thoughts. I don’t think she thinks about the realities or consequences of what her stance would be like if made reality. God I hope she goes back to obscurity in Alaska really, really soon… like in November 2008.
“Democrats are hairstylists and philosophy professors and are parasites.”
Ken, how can you say something so nasty and unjustified regarding hairstylists. Most of us have hair and want it to look nice. Hairstylists, unlike, say, community organizers, provide a service. If you don’t cut hair the way people want, you’re out of business.
I should tell you my mother’s theory about how the “dry look” Kennedy boys ruined our ozone with aerosol hairspray.
TO: Terry Johnson
RE: Heh
I’d have got out the camcorder and captured it.
Indeed. I think I’d have had a recorder going from before the first guest showed up. [Note: In the state here I live, it is not against the law to record conversations as long as ONE of the participants in said conversation is aware that a recording is occurring.]
It would be good evidence of just how ‘disturbed’ such people are.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
P.S. I do believe the woman you mention was ‘projecting’ about that ‘evil’ business.
If Obama comes into power, she’ll probably rat you out if you say anything untoward about the One in the Oval Office. Such activities have been pressed in Missouri. Indeed, I see that the nation of Kenya has arrested/detained the author of that anti-Obama book, Obama Nation.
TO: PosterGirl
RE: [OT] Okay….
Consider these items of research….
Study: Abortion raises risk of depression
Hiding abortions shadows
You may not care much for the source of the information, but the reports are based on research done by legit researchers and in the the Herald Sun newspaper of Melbourneand the American Journal of Orthopsychiatry, respectively.
Hope this helps….but….well….you know…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[You will know the Truth. And the Truth shall make you free. -- some Wag, around 2000 years ago]
TO: Marc Malone
RE: Javelin
He probably does. It’s part of that groups mantra.
RE: Ken
There are one of two possibilities regarding Ken; (1) he’s honestly in need of psychiatric help because he honestly believes what he’s posted here or (2) he’s an agent provocateur, trying to prove that we of the more conservative orientation are as rabid haters as the Kos Kids et al.
If the former, I’d like to know his specialty and what Marine units he served in.
If the latter, he’s probably going to be VERY upset that he’s not getting the sort of responses he was hoping to illicit here.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Some people wonder all their lives if they've made a difference. Marines don't have that problem. -- Ronald Reagan]
KEN–Maybe it’s time to look for a new hairdresser. Mine is talented, charming, accommodating, pleasant, and VERY right wing. Reasonable prices–volume, you know.
How do I deal with a Palin-hater?
Simple. Leave her or him alone. Never deal with her/him again. Let them stew in their hatred. If they call you, you don’t reply. If they come visit, don’t receive them, and be polite as to why.
Those like that woman who hate someone like Sarah so much they have begun to hate themselves surely have a little bit of a “Gollum” problem, IMHO. Leave them alone and let them be. They will be the poorer, mentally and spiritually, for it.
I don’t hate her–I just don’t think she makes a lot of sense. Like the best economic indicator being a soccer game. Or apparently not understanding what an “Achilles heel” is. It’s pretty obvious why they kept her cloistered for 3 weeks.
She is charming and engaging, but I don’t think that’s enough. She did win the talent competition though
Too many Democrats seem incapable of logical thinking. That’s what we get as a society by not making the study of logic a requirement in high school and in college.
Democrat ineptitude when it comes to debating ideas frustrates them and drives them from the argumentum ad hominem (attacking the person rather than the idea) to the argumentum ad baculum (threat of violence).
Democrats in general seem to badly need cognitive therapy so that they can more clearly see what’s upsetting them. They are faced with a successful and attractive candidate in Sarah Palin and they go ballistic. There’s a step missing. What do they tell themselves that drives them so nuts?
Is it guilt about abortion?
Is it that they fear that such an attractive candidate will take their presumed and assumed electoral victory from them.
Inquiring mind….. doesn’t really care much.
I’ll just try to avoid them till after the election. If they lose, they will all go into major depessions. More work for therapists.
To Reed Ehr and Sheep,Get back to MoveOn.org where you belong!!!
Osama…oops, I mean Obama is just another socialist and is not fit to polish McCain’s shoes. As a veteran of 2 wars myself, I can assure you that a “community organizer/law professor” who has never taken a real risk in his life be given the reigns of the most powerful military in the world would be a disaster. Stop drinking the Koolade!
Oh, the horrors of the last 8 years…no follow-up attack on U.S. shores, terrorists fleeing (or dead) in Iraq as your read this, a country that still offers the greatest opportunity from the perspective of liberty and economic freedom. It is obvious that both of you (like your boy, Obama)have never put anything on-the-line for your country other that your lips. GO McCAIN!!! GO PALIN!!! P.S. It is also notable that Iranian TV pundits have strongly supported Obama in programming recently…and don’t believe psycho-babble from the Myers-Briggs, it is slightly useful tool for assisting in “team-building” in corporate settings but has very little predictive validity related to behaviors. This is because it does not factor in life experience/intellect and/or transcendent belief schemas..(written like a psychologist eh? Well, because I am one!)
TO: rayy
RE: The Cloistering of Sarah Palin
Yeah….
….it’s called intensive training.
When I attended the 82d Airborne Division’s Jumpmaster course, all I did for two weeks was eat, sleep, drink and, on demand, regurgitate how to get 64 paratroopers safely out of the door of a C130 in flight. I did NOTHING ELSE. And when I DID do something else, involving my then spouse, that day I blew a key test. Fortunately I passed the re-test.
I think running for VP is on a par with that sort of objective; gaining a Jumpmaster rating. Therefore worthy of such an intensive training period.
Hope that helps….but…like with Postergirl (above)….well…..
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[You haven't lived until you've almost died. -- Truism of Airborne-Rangers]
Postergirl,
–You are mistaken in your amateur psychological appraisal of womens’ reactions to abortion. Increasingly, longitudinal studies refute your assertions. As a clinician with over 22 years of experience the regret/guilt related to abortion is manifest in over 80% of my patients and I am convinced that my sample is replicated all over the nation. Reactions to Palin and other Pro-Lifers fits elegantly into the most basic understanding of cognitive dissonance. The guilt ridden (often unconscious)must reconcile their past indulgences by defending those practices,defending them helps rationalize them. Try re-taking Psy 101.
I don’t know that I would assume that Palin hate is due strictly to a woman’s regret about actual abortions.
Is it more likely that the strident feminist movement has convinced many women that without unrestricted abortion they have no chance to suceed? Pregnancy and child-rearing has been a soft excuse for women not reaching the top – along with all those knuckle-dragging men who just want to keep us down.
So to see a woman who has achieved a great deal without buying the abortion agenda may pick at their belief that they might be responsible for their own success or failure.
TO: RealityChick
RE: [OT] Sooo….
….are you getting this? This business from Dr. Mark and the articles I cited?
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Selfish American women have killed more American men than all the wars the United States has ever been involved in, TOGETHER.]
Hate is drinking poison and waiting on someone else to die. Drink away lefties, we’ll wait with you, while enjoying a draft of Sarah Palin, a more satisfying, heady brew than that Kenyan bean, it being French-roasted and all.
Dr. Mark (and Chuck) – I don’t need to re-take Psych 101, I only need to be informed about it. The APA and its British counterpart have specifically said that there is no evidence of wider depression of women who have had abortions. And, they have picked apart the studies that do say they have greater depression, showing that the data AND analysis were flawed. I don’t say that women don’t get depressed after having an abortion; I’m sure many, many do. But they are no more depressed than those who don’t. The beef with anti-choice people is that they often are against contraception as well, and that it is FINE to not choose to have an abortion, but it is not fine to force other women to carry to term a baby that they do not want, cannot afford to raise, and ESPECIALLy for women who have been raped either by a stranger or a relative. The other beef I have is that no one has laid out a plan for what the punishment should be for a woman who does have an abortion, IF it were illegal. Anti-choice people call it murder, so one can only conclude that hard prison time or the death penalty would be the correct punishment for a woman who has an abortion if it were illegal. Does that sound doable and reasonable or humane?
If in your practice you have found that most women are depressed about it, it could accont for the fact that most practicing Christians, especially Fundamentalist Christians, or those surrounded by the rhetoric of the anti-choice foes, WOULD feel more guilty. Location, upbringing and political views certainly would affect feelins of guilt.
Here is another reason why the idea of Palin in the #2 or #1 position makes me nervous: her view on the age of the earth, which, from what I have read, is that it is 10,000 years old or less. No one has asked her about that specifically in this campaign yet, and I want to know what she really thinks and why. It would mean to me that she, being the daughter of a science teacher, has no respect for science, or that she has what has been called “intellectual inattention”.
Perhaps the word should be regret, not guilt or depression. Regret connotes something or someone in your life that is gone or damaged. All the pro-killing abortionist rhetoric and psychotropic drugs in the world can’t brainwash or drug away regrets. The road to regret ia a dreary and lonely way. There is nothing beyond regret, since one never gets past it.
I don’t actually believe that the people on this board would not vote for Obama because he is black. That comment is as ridiculous as Palin-haters, etc. Palin just doesn’t have it in her to be VP or President. She is welcome to return to Alaska with her high popularity ratings (although, plunging), her witch doctor, go answer a few questions into an ethics probe about her and let people who are actually qualified be on the ticket as the VP candidate.
—
If Karl Rove still has his IT Guru, Mike Connell, McCain might steal this election… If you are talking about an actual election, real people voting, nothing hinky going on — OBAMA.
At present, reading the polls on almost any site show a gaining Obama lead plus a strong electoral college lead.
—
All your man is doing is nasty, pathetic, transparent smears. The nation is in crisis, we are fighting two wars, state budgets are affected by this crisis, foreclosures are occurring, etc., and all your man wants to talk about is Ayers. Now. When that name, as you all here very well know and have tossed around for all time, has been around for a spell.
Reeks of desperation. Can’t wait to see his p*ssy temper on display tonight.
Quite simply, John McCain is a privileged, mediocre, entitled little SOB who has not treated people in his life with a lot of respect and has been craving this shot at PoTUS for twenty years — and he’s going to get his arse handed to him by a half-black guy who is so much better a man than McCain.
Here’s some entertaining reading for you: http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/23316912/makebelieve_maverick/print
TO: Postergirl
RE: Next Strawman, UP!
Please cite your reference to that statement. A URL to a reliable source of information would be your best bet. Preferably something other than what you may have picked-up from some Kos Kidz Komment.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[A lack of evidence is evidence of lying.]
TO: Postergirl
RE: Yeah….Right….
Informed? How VERY ‘odd’. As the two articles I cited provide the information.
Even more ‘odd’, as the article in item #2 I refer to, if you follow the links, takes you to an APA organization.
It’s pretty obvious that your mind is made up and no factual material will change it. Typical ‘progressive’ mentality.
Thanks for playing….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Liberals aren't. Progressives won't.]
TO: Postergirl
RE: Really?
Please cite the critical reviews. I’d like to see them for myself.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Figures don't lie, but liars figure.]
Don’t you just love a non-believer telling you what a believer believes? The age of the earth? True believers believe in Truth. The Creator has All Power, now and then. The observation of physical objects and natural processes “disprove God” only in ego-trapped minds. Having studied science my 60+ years, with a university degree or so in it, I’ve never observed anything in life or laboratory that did more than enlarge my wonder of The Creation and my certainty of my Creator. Bless your heart.
Postergirl, that was debunked, as bunk. It’s part of the stuff cited by Matt Damon (something about not believing in dinosaurs too, no?)– which, if I remember correctly, was taken from a satirical article or email circulated about Palin, which the perspicacious Damon (and others like him, all of intellect far superior to Palin’s, of course), took to be fact. Stuff then recycled by SNL (at least they’re in the business of making fun, not factual assertions), not to mention Palin-haters everywhere, ever since. If you think Palin is a caricature (from “what you read”), it might be worth looking into the possibility that what you take to be Palin is, in fact, a malicious caricature of her, promulgated as fact by those who hate her.
TO: twolaneflash
RE: Indeed
They do it ALL the time. And out of their ignorance, they just get more irritated when we point their ignorance out to them. Typical my-mind-is-made-up mentality.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Know your enemy and know yourself and you shall never be defeated. -- Sun Tzu, the Art of War]
P.S. These people know neither…..
Postergirl:
Once you lefties get hold of a smear, it never dies, does it?
The Palin “quotes” cited by millionaire nitwits like Damon and Dowd were part of an admitted HOAX. The author says so right on his own site that he made them up, and has been known since August 30th.
http://unbearablebobness.typepad.com/my_weblog/2008/08/governor-sarah-palin-quotes.html
She been quoted in interviews that her father was a science teacher, and she believes that evolution should be taught as scientific fact.
But these phony “quotes” will used against Palin for the rest of her life because of mean-spirited lefties who could care less for honesty. After all, that quality is a hindrance to true “community organizers”, isn’t it?
Oh, sorry, it’s that she believed dinosaurs existed 4000 years ago. Also promulgated, it so happens, by Maureen Dowd at the mighty NY Times. (I guess your 10,000 year-old earth thing is a variant.) Here’s more on that viral email, at Patterico:
Dowd & Damon both fall for viral email smear of Palin
Heh, geokster beat me to it.
TO: lael
RE: As….
….to be expected.
Benjamin Franklin warned US about this…
Typical ‘progressive’. Reality doesn’t matter.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[A faithful witness will not lie: but a false witness will utter lies. -- Proverbs]
All your man is doing is nasty, pathetic, transparent smears. The nation is in crisis, we are fighting two wars, state budgets are affected by this crisis, foreclosures are occurring, etc., and all your man wants to talk about is Ayers.
First, McCain isn’t my man. But neither is Obama. Second, if I were debating Obama, I wouldn’t give a whit about Ayers. I’d be on him to explain his stonewalling of the reform of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Why did he block reform when he was warned a crisis exactly like this one would happen? Where was his different kind of politics when he toed the left-wing party line and helped plunge this economy into the present crisis?
Of course, McCain will not do this because he doesn’t know why the economic crisis happened. He’s a self-proclaimed economic lightweight, and at a time when someone on Capitol Hill needs to pound home that this crisis is a clear cut failure of government, he’s off railing against anonymous “Wall Street greed” like a damn fool socialist. The greedist guys in the room were shoveling money into the Democrats’ feed trough hand over fist to avoid reform and it worked. They need to be called to account over that, as do their enablers.
We won’t fix this crisis without identifing how and why it happened, and without ridding ourselves of the people responsible. While McCain goes off and acts like a city councilman with a grudge, Obama goes unquestioned in enabling this crisis.
It should be clear to everyone that putting one of the people responsible for the economic crisis in the White House is a dangerous thing to do. And I fear we’re headed that way because people like proud elitist can’t step out of the “either-or” mindset to see the truth.
Hey, Chuckle, especially good work today.
Chuck, surely you know how to use Google? We can argue back and forth about whether abortion causes more depression in women or not, because I can find studies that say that it does NOT, and you can find studies that say it does. Every time I see the links for the APA or British study that say that abortion does not cause more depression, there is a ‘right-to-life’ website that says it doesn’t. And most of those seem to be organizations, not just news websites, so they would have a vested interest in negating anything that doesn’t suit their ideology about it.
.
You say “It’s pretty obvious that your mind is made up and no factual material will change it. Typical ‘progressive’ mentality.” You’re just being rude here… though, I don’t take offense to the “progressive mentality”… rather be progressive than regressive
I have no idea what Matt Damon said about Palin, just that he said something negative. My info about her age of the earth belief came from here http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-palinreligion28-2008sep28,0,3643718.story?track=rss
… and from the fact that she attended Wasilla Assembly of God, which appears to preach a young earth theory, like many other pentacostal churches. It is reasonable to ask her if she believes in a young earth or not. I have not seen this debunked anywhere. I know she said evolution should be taught in science class… I never said she didn’t. She also said that creationism should be taught alongside evolution. I want to know what her personal belief is, even if she says she won’t push schools to teach creationism. Just like I want to know whether or not someone believes personally in the dominion thing… and is all for whatever happens to speed up the end of the earth so that they can go to heaven. Personal beliefs CAN affect policy.
You keep accusing me of having my mind made up… are you saying you don’t? If anything, the rudeness of your posts and the fact you keep repeating yourself, says to me that you would not give in to facts… Most of us interpret facts to suit our beliefs. Most of us are also able to let go of what we -thought- were facts, if we are attentive to information and have an open mind. That is the difference, it appears, between you and me and many Christian Fundamentalists (not saying you are one, I have no idea). If there was ever a group that cannot be swayed by facts, it’s any type of Fundamentalist.
I await a rude, I’m-sure-gonna-show-her! answer Chuckle.
She did *not* say, has never said, creationism should be taught alongside evolution. She once remarked that free discussion of the question, e.g. if raised in class by a student, should not be *outlawed*– her position is libertarian, if anything. So that too has been debunked. (I don’t have time to find a source right now, but if no one else has it by tonight, I’ll try to dig it up.) She is in no way a fundamentalist.
And I have to say, the sourcing in that article– relying solely on the word of just one single guy, a music teacher who runs a “liberal political blog” called “Progressive Alaska” (which “regularly criticized Palin in recent years”), who claims that, running into her after a commencement speech, he asks her about her religious beliefs, and (deigning to confide in him, and him alone– since these beliefs of hers have been corroborated by no one else), she tells him that “dinosaurs and humans walked the earth at the same time”… please. I doubt even a Christian who was a creationist would answer in that way a question about his religious beliefs (when dinosaurs walked the earth is kind of ancillary to, I don’t know, how you feel about Jesus Christ). Again, people who hate her will lap up whatever they want to believe (or want others to believe) about her. NY Times columnist, LA Times columnist, just as willing I’m sure to spread lies (or the most flimsily sourced malicious gossip) about Palin.
TO: Postergirl
RE: You Wish…
….shall be granted….
….tomorrow morning.
Sleep tight….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[...rough men are prepared to do violence so that you can.]
How I wound up on this site is a mystery. But for people who psycho analyze crap like this it’s really pathetic. Liberalism is really taking this country backwards, and I mean back into a toilet spin. Obama/Biden haven’t so much as run a hotdog stand and are bent on pushing a bunch of liberal B.S. down the American throats. Obama and his wife are transparently ANTI-AMERICAN and seek to destroy it like a python would its prey — patiently. When McCain & Palin win this election, I hope all of you Democrats and Liberals just start falling out of high-rises. Pretend you’re one of the several unfortunate souls who perished that way on 9/11. The only difference is, they did it with courage, you would only do it out of cowardliness. Death to Liberals!!!
Yes, we get it mobys, touché, conservatives– or “conservatives”– are filled with rage too. (I’ve always wondered about the psychological compulsion certain liberals have to impersonate “conservatives.” It’s always more revealing of the person mobying, as it were, than the mobied. In this election, mobyism seems to have become a campaign tactic… I personally find it repellent.)
I think the Palin hater is suffering from something much more simple than anything on the Myers-Briggs.
She is suffering from having someone whose views aren’t hers (ex., Palin’s) take center stage and receive positive attention for those views.
Her views have been rendered unimportant. She has been invalidated.
Andrea – Yes. Glad you agree with me. Palin is an existential threat to radical feminism just by existing and being popular.
It seems to me that the Palin hater must be ugly!
I’m writing a second time to apologize. I wrote earlier that I didn’t have to listen to the Palin haters. Wrong. During a phone call with a friend this afternoon, I casually mentioned that I would probably watch the debates, and she launched into an amazing anti-Palin rant—accusing McCain of pandering to stupid women who would vote for a vagina. It went downhill from there.
lael: She did indeed say that creationism should be taught alongside evolution: From the Anchorage Daily News: “The volatile issue of teaching creation science in public schools popped up in the Alaska governor’s race this week when Republican Sarah Palin said she thinks creationism should be taught alongside evolution in the state’s public classrooms.
Palin was answering a question from the moderator near the conclusion of Wednesday night’s televised debate on KAKM Channel 7 when she said, “Teach both. You know, don’t be afraid of information. Healthy debate is so important, and it’s so valuable in our schools. I am a proponent of teaching both.” Then later (probably when she realized it might not be in her best interest to admit that she’d like to have creationism taught in the classroom, she said about the above debate: “In an interview Thursday, Palin said she meant only to say that discussion of alternative views should be allowed to arise in Alaska classrooms:
“I don’t think there should be a prohibition against debate if it comes up in class. It doesn’t have to be part of the curriculum.”
The reason extremely religious people like her say things like that, is that they know full well that there is no way they can survive politically if they say what they think, which is that “intelligent design/creationism” should be taught in science class.
The point is, that even though she agrees evolution should be taught as accepted principle, she is not against creationism alongside it, in schools. Creationism is a religious opinion, not scientific fact. It could be taught in some kind of philosophy class, but never, ever in science class.
I have realized something in my short time on this forum, which is that I would rather debate and discuss with real people and not on the internet, and since I do have a few (only a few) Republican friends and acquaintances, that I’ve already spoken to, that is what I will do instead of posting on close-minded forums that pretend to be about ‘discussing’ anything. So I am leaving this forum. There are too many loonies like John Sharkey above, who have no clue how to discuss and are incapable of deductive reasoning or simply putting forth opinions in any elegant way (….who does that remind me of… oh yeah, Palin!), but just spew hatred, like his last line “Death to Liberals!!!”. Nor would anyone here even consider the ‘other side’… there IS no debate here, no discussion. It’s a 100% Republican forum, where the word ‘liberal’ is supposed to be a put-down. I’m proud to be liberal because liberal means caring for your fellow man, caring for people beyond the fetus stage, open-mindedness, curiosity about the world around us. Liberals favor individual liberty, don’t want government in our personal lives (conservatives on the other hand, want to peek in our bedroom windows and decide what we do with our bodies). Liberals are: Broadminded, Moderate, Freethinking, Tolerant, Generous. There is a time and a place to be conservative… um like fiscally. The Republicans of the last 8 years have been the complete opposite of conservative… and in some cases, fascists. True Liberals, in the classical sense want democratic institutions, economic freedom, social freedom, and government limited to enforcing the rule of law. We have HUGE HUGE government now, thanks to “conservatives”! This you cannot deny. Ok, you can deny outloud, but you know 100% in your heart that what I say is true.
So goodbye all you Conservatives (Old-fashioned, Traditional, Old School, Conventional, Conformist, Unadventurous). Oh, and selfish. I leave you with this to think about: the most affluent, most financially successful (both personal and business) most educated areas of the U.S. are BLUE, liberal states. The poorest, most uneducated, most run-down areas with THE HIGHEST TEEN PREGNANCY RATES, AND THE HIGHEST ABORTION RATES, are RED, conservative states. Does that make you go ‘hmmmmmm’? Probably not. Self-reflection is another trait that most conservatives don’t have either.
Farewell and here’s to hoping to a true Democracy in the U.S. (Democrat… Democracy…hmmmmmmm!!!)
Postergirl
postergirl wrote:
“Farewell and here’s to hoping to a true Democracy in the U.S.”
So much for that musty old Constitution, I guess.
Are you certain you’re actually debating people here, or do you have little action figures that you move around, much like Dark Helmet in Spaceballs?
(Though, I do find it amusing. I think evolution is a pretty good theory and have no problems with creationism being brought up in class. Why? Because in most debates I’ve read, it becomes obvious that proponents of creationism have no idea what proponents of evolution really believe or think. Hmm… reminds me of postergirl w/regard to those oh so awful icky “conservatives” who disagree with her.)
Another observation to “postergirl’s” post:
Of note that there was no date referenced to the Alaska article, as what she ostensibly quoted is the opposite of what Palin has been saying out there on the stump. Open debate? Yes. Forced to teach it? No.
Disinformation…sigh.
TO: All
RE: Another Monty Python Moment
It was to be expected. Most of the time, these types don’t have the gonads to stick around in a stand-up
fight</strike….errrrr….discussion.However I’ll post my response to her anyway. Not just because I KNOW she’ll be back to look at them, like it is written in Proverbs….
…but for the consideration of others in manifesting how her ilk refuse to REALLY discuss things. Instead, they like to ‘argue’. And without supporting evidence.
More to follow….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Run awaaaaayyyyyyy! --
Monty Python...err...PosterChild]P.S. I think PosterChild could be RealityChiq’s twin sister…..
Dang!
Why doesn’t this outfit have a PREVIEW function?
TO: Postergirl
RE: As Promised (Part 1 of 7)
Careful. You’re beginning to come across like some sort of feminist version of a masochist.
Yes. I’m rude, crude, and socially unattractive; certainly amongst so-called ‘Progressives’. They tend to avoid me because they don’t care to have their erroneous spiels corrected. More on that later.
And I’m proud of it. After all, the Truth does matter.
RE: The Replies
This message in reply to your lengthy item of late yesterday is in several parts. This is part 1 of 7 such parts. Other parts will follow at various and irregular times, depending on time availability.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Are you still here? The message is over. Shoo! Go away!]
P.S. I guess she did…..already…..
TO: Postergirl
RE: [OT] Using Google (Part 2 of 7)
Sure. I can use web-search engines. However, in any situation where someone wants to prove a point, be it on a blog like this or in a court of law or even in the scientific community, if you’ve got a point to make the onus is on YOU to provide the supporting evidence.
I’ve never seen any lawyer, real or theatrical, win a case by telling the judge and/or jury to go out and find the supporting evidence for themselves.
And if some debate team I judged were to say that, they’d be laughed away from the podium. Not to mention losing that round.
RE: Discussions
Are we arguing? I’m ‘discussing’ this matter with you. And as part of discussion, I offer you evidence supporting what I and Dr. Mark understand to be facts.
You rejected it. You claimed that you’d seen reports saying the data and findings were flawed. However, you fail to provide any evidence supporting your claim. That’s a failing proposition in ANY debate. You resemble nothing more, that a child in a school yard shouting, “Tis NOT!” And you’re just about as effectual.
Bring forth your linkerages that support your claim that abortion does not cause depression. I eagerly await seeing them.
If you do not, then there must not be any such supporting evidence. That would make you look to be……what-do-you-think….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Contents of this message may have settled during shipment.]
TO: All
RE: Postergirl and ‘True’ Democracy
Obviously a relatively recent graduate of high school. Why do I say this? Because she obviously has no knowledge of what happens to a ‘true democracy’. History has shown that they tend to commit collective suicide on the advice of some demagogue.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Democracy... while it lasts is more bloody than either aristocracy or monarchy. Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There is never a democracy that did not commit suicide. -- John Adams]
TO: Postergirl
RE: Sources of Information (Part 3 of 7)
Yes. Lots of people have their agendas. And do a good job of hiding them from everyone else. On the other hand, at least you can trust the Christians to be putting their agenda before you. Why should they lie about it? It would only (1) make them look bad to others and (2) offend God. Whereas being honest is what God requires of them.
Whether you like it or not is between you and God.
On the other hand, organizations like the APA tend to hide their agenda. I’ll address that a little later in this series. I found something rather ‘interesting’ while doing the additional research.
Meanwhile, you’re welcome to follow the links I provided….and follow the links they offered, on occasion.
However, here is the direct link to the article published by the APA. You’re welcome to buy a copy for just under $12, if you wish. But judging by the abstract, you can get the primary information for free from my earlier link.
Then again, I found ANOTHER item, this one based on a database of Finnish women who had abortions and later died. Something about with abortion, six time as likely to be dead now than without struck me as interesting.
You must have missed that tagline about Liberals aren’t. Progressives won’t.
I know a number of ‘progressives’. I’ve attended a number of their seminars and a few of their workshops. On local issues, I can even work with them. That is IF they’ll stop slobbering spittle and focus on the task at hand, if something on the state or national level comes up.
The one’s I’ve encountered tend to be the most rabid and lying group I’ve ever personally encountered. One professor at a local university goes literally ballistic at the mention of Christians or Republicans. Calling down curses from a God she doesn’t believe in on both groups heads, in a VERY loud and—due to her Cajun background—recognizable voice.
Her display was akin to what Terry Johnson reported about the Palin-Biden debate scene. She shocked most of the group standing around her at that time. I just smiled and looked around her side, straightened up and asked, “Where’s the volume control?”
That calmed her down. I guess she noticed a LOT of other heads in the largish room swiveling in her direction. Target acquisition and recognition can do that. Especially if you realize that YOU’RE the ‘target’.
In the meantime, I’m the one here providing factual information and URLs for you to verify my reports. And YOU still just say, “Tis NOT!”
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[For more information please read this message again.]
TO: Postergirl
RE: The Aging of Earth (Part 4 of 7)
Oh. Great. A second hand report from a source (Munger) whose reliability and accuracy have not been determined. Interesting, but it won’t hold up very well in any debate.
And as for the report being in a newspaper….well….I recall how the Boston Globe, just last week, restated the already debunked report about Palin on Rape Kits, as if it were true.
As Ben Franklin’s comment goes, “One person tells a lie and a thousand others repeat it as the truth.” If it’s a newspaper, it must be a million or two do so.
RE: The Pentecostal Churches
Not being a Pentecostal, I can’t speak to their doctrine. And their welcome to their opinion. But if I encounter someone who claims it is a ‘young Earth’, I’ll ask them the same thing I keep asking YOU, “Prove it.”
However, if he or she breaks out a Bible and starts explaining it from there, at least they’ll have a better understanding of Christianity than YOU seem to have. From there, I can explain a LOT to them. And I’ll probably get further in teaching them something than I will with YOU.
Well…maybe if we knew whether or not Munger voted for or against her, we MIGHT get a clue. Or maybe there’s some other hidden item about his opinion of her.
I don’t recall indicating either way.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Thoughts in this message are weirder than they appear!]
TO: Postergirl
RE: The Teaching of Young Minds (Part 5 of 7)
What’s wrong with teaching young minds how to compare and contrast and apply logic and reason to decide which of two matters bears the most credibility?
As far as I’ve seen in my years of judging high school debate, the vaunted American public education system seems to have stopped that form of education. We have YOU here today, as evidence of that.
I think we all would like to know that of EVERY politician who puts themselves forward to be elected to public office.
OOOooooo…… A new strawman has been stood up.
Bring forth your proofs. Or I’ll bring forth my box of matches.
Indeed they can. That’s why I’m so ‘impressed’ with Obama’s personal belief, for 20 years, in anti-American black racism.
Indeed. I don’t believe I am nearly as mentally blocked as you appear to be. After all. I offer evidence. Therefore, evidence can likely sway my understanding. But you, for some strange reason, don’t offer much in these discussions. All you do is yell from the playground.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Taglines can be more interesting than messages]
TO: Postergirl
RE: Rudeness (Part 6 of 7)
On the one hand, they stopped commissioning officers in the United States Army as ‘gentlemen’ the year before I got my commission.
On the other hand, you are not allowed to hide behind your gender if you step into the arena. I hold no prejudices that will favor it. You are just the same to me as nick or Javelin, woman.
On the third hand, if you can’t stand the heat, you shouldn’t step into the firestorm.
Stop projecting.
I’ve offered you evidence. Facts. You don’t seem to be living up to your aspirations, here.
Oh. Believe me. I am VERY MUCH a Christian of ‘fundamental’ understanding. But I caveat that with the statement that that Old Book is full of literal as well as metaphorical and allegorical comments. The biggest problem is trying to wrap, or maybe warp, you mind around them in order to gain understanding. It’s a LOT like trying to appreciate The Matrix. It’s hard to grasp that there is more to this world than meets the eye.
As Morpheus says to Neo, “It is the world that has been pulled over your eyes to blind you from the truth. ”
However, I have found something of a ‘key’, or rather a Rosetta Stone. And, once you grasp it, it IS a big help. Many things, including the Creation, make so much more sense now. And, of all things, they parallel our scientific understanding of the creation of the Universe and the development of life on Earth.
Try not to stereotype. It makes you look SOOOOOO ‘prejudicial’. You remind me of kids I went to school with in the mid-to-late 60s in Louisiana. People who hated other people for the most prejudicial of reasons. I, having been raised in the Air Force, didn’t see people as black or white or whatever. And therefore, because I wasn’t like my classmates, I was stereotyped….just like you’re doing to me now.
Don’t worry. You aren’t hurting MY feelings at all. I’ve been abused by the BEST!
But back on your comment about Fundies could never be convinced of anything, I do believe you’re projecting…again….
For instance, I keep offering you evidence that would change any reasonably prudent individual’s mind. Or at least cause a rational skeptic to do a bit more thinking on a subject and, if available, offer counter-args.
YOU, on the other hand expect to change my mind/opinion on a topic just on your say-so. Or with the flimsiest of information, e.g., Munger. Heck. I don’t know Munger from Adam. How do I know how reliable and accurate he is. And I’ve been WELL TRAINED in analyzing information. It seems better than YOU have. Comes when you make field-grade officer and get to go through something called the Command and General Staff Course (CSGC).
So. Please. Pretty please. Support your arguments. Show me your evidence from more credible sources.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Today's subliminal message is....]
TO: Postergirl
RE: Discoveries of the APA (Part 7 of 7)
While tracking down the link to the APA’s article on how women who have abortions are more likely to seek out/receive psychological help afterwards, I did notice something I thought indicative of a relationship between abortion and depression.
It seems that the APA web-site as SCADS of articles that come up when you search on those two words; ‘abortion’ and ‘depression’. I mean….I could NOT find the end. And the APA was not willing to divulge how many articles there were. I can only ‘guess’ why. But it would be an educated guess.
I wonder how many other word combinations have that many articles.
The point I’m making here is that there seems to be a very high correlation between ‘abortion’ and ‘depression’; there being so many articles on the combination of words. That would imply that this combination is a ‘hot item’ in the APA.
In the military we refer to that much ‘activity’ as being something of an ‘indicator’.
Where there is smoke….
Some parts of the training one receives during the Intelligence Preparation of the Battlefield (IPB) phase of CGSC can be applied to everyday life. Especially where people aren’t telling you everything they’re up to.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[I cannot be responsible for future messages as apparently my cat has learned to type.]
Why “hater” hates Palin?
It seems pretty simple. “Hater” considers herself a successful woman with a career and family. She has worked hard to get where she is. Her opinions fit neatly into her social strata. She has never really been challenged by other opinions or ideas. All those who she associates with she believes sees her as such: successful, intelligent, loving mother, etc
Another woman, whom she knows little about except in caricature, who obviously holds differing opinions politically and socially, is successful in her own right without having restricted herself to the expected and respected dogma as this woman “Hater” has, comes out of no where, and is over night catapulted into the limelight. She is pulled out of the audience, so to speak, and given a position of power.
It is the fantasy of many women who have been clawing their way up the ladder of success. Mainly, that one day all of their hard work and adherence will net them that recognition and sort of “stardom”.
“Hater” simply cannot reconcile that this other woman did not follow the expected path and did achieve exactly what this woman sought for herself. She simply cannot handle the cosmic dissonance.
It is a classic case of narcissism. Really, what this woman hates is that she has done all of the “right” things and it was not she who was selected.
kat-missouri – interesting thought, but I doubt professional jealousy rates that kind of visceral response. I can see it if they were co-workers, rivals, ans she lost. No, a woman who achieves that kind of success on her own would see Palin’s “elevation” as a motivator. Gotta have your stuff together to get that far.
To the dumb guys out there who accuse Hater of being a fat loser, take a chill pill. This is a decent woman who is acting irrationally abd recognizes her irrationality, and seeks some help. Don’t kick her when she’s down. It’s ungentlemanly.
Turns out my 78-yr-old mother has the same hate for Palin, but she knows why. She hates her anti-abortion stance. Which is weird, because my mother had 11 kids!
She did have an abortion at 46 or so, because of health issues.
Her reasoning is that she knew many girls when she was young who had to get backroom, dangerous abortions, so she is opposed to anti-abortionists, and she sees Palin as too big a danger to this cherished “right”.
It still is odd to hear your own mother be supportive of abortion. That gives one the feeling of stepping over one’s own grave. Think about that one, then ask your own Mother if she ever considered aborting you. That right there will alter your perception of abortion.
Just imagine, “Yeah, we were gonna abort you, but the car broke down on the way, and after paying for the repairs, we couldn’t afford to pay for the abortion. By the time we could, I was too far along.” That’d rock your world, huh?
TO: RealityChiq
RE: [OT] Nobel Efforts
Keep up the good work. And it is an interesting article.
On the other hand, instead of trying to ‘manage’ cancer, I prefer killing it.
Mom’s squamous carcinoma is still there, but she IS improving. The swellings come and go but her neck and chin are (1) not as livid in their discoloration and (2) her skin is returning to a normal texture.
It’s probably going to require several more months of drinking this tea, but I think, God willing, that we’ve found the cure for cancer. And that’s ALL KINDS OF CANCER.
Paul Newman died of lung cancer that was apparently detected last January. That’s nine months. Mom’s squamous is far more aggressive, according to the oncologist, and she seems to be recovering from it after eight months.
If you REALLY want to cure cancer. I recommend you look seriously at this graviola stuff. Of course, you’ll be branded as a heretic. But what would you rather do? I guess it all depends on the basis of your moral code.
RE: [OT] Overpopulation
Overpopulation will take care of itself, one horrible way or another.
And, if you think that overpopulation is our biggest worry, I’m not surprised that you are not actually pursuing a CURE for cancer. Managing cancer is so much more profitable to the medical industry. It’s a lot like psychiatry. If you cure the patient, they never come back. But if you don’t cure them, they keep coming back and you keep your cash-flow.
RE: [OT] Republicans & Sex Education
Try not to be too obtuse.
Most sex education that is taught is all ‘how to’. There is no moral basis in it whatsoever. No instruction that it is morally wrong. Why? Because that would be introducing {HORROR!} ‘religious’ thought into the public schools. [Note: Nice dodge, that.]
And when children get instructions from adults on ‘how to’ do something, they perceive it as approval to do it, with guidance on how to do it.
So we show the children a ‘gun’ and how to load and use it. But we don’t tell them that it’s morally wrong to use it except in certain circumstances. Then we leave them alone with their guns and the ammunition. Heck. In some instances, we pass them the ammo.
They’ve seen these ‘guns’ used on television. Every day and, based on what I’ve seen of late, every night. [Note: I'm only catching television because Mom is staying with us for the time being. And what I'm seeing on it shows me that the children are being shown all KINDS of 'guns' and their uses on prime time.]
And you don’t think any of them are going to use these ‘guns’? After all the ‘education’ and the ‘exposure’?
You’re more naive than I originally thought. That or worse.
RE: [OT] Time On-Hand
I take breaks between bouts of writing code to clear my mind before diving into a difficult segment again. Your ‘sister’ wanted a response to a lengthy post. I gave it thought and responded.
Should I have just blown her off as a waste of effort? As if she were worthless? Should I do that with you? Are YOU ‘worthless’? Personally. I don’t think so.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Hatred is not the opposite of love. Indifference is.]
P.S. [OT] The more I think about the guns v. sex and the public education system, the more it works.
Consider this….
If we teach children about sex in school. Why don’t we teach them about guns?
“How Do You Deal With a Palin Hater?”
I just say “You think Sarah Palin is bad? If it was up to me women who got abortions would be punished by death.”
Then I step back and watch the Palin-hater’s head explode.
Dave Surls – Funny! Can’t stop chuckling.
realitycheq – INteresting that you believe life begins at conception, but you’re pro-abortion.
I get the argument about the cost-benefit analysis. Of course it does leave out the moral discussion, does it not? Why stop there? Let’s off the non-productive people, and also sterilize ones with gross genetic flaws.
Your argument makes sense, though. 52% of abortions in this country are by black women, so this is a fine way to keep their population in check. Um, you’re a Dem, right?
You are right, though. Overpopulation is much of the cause of the problems. The prosperous countries have the low birth-rates. You can afford more stuff, and have more money to invest if you don’t have so many mouths to feed. Poverty is a curse.
TO: All
RE: The Sister Act
Just like her sister, RealityChiq doesn’t have what it takes to stay in a ‘stand-up’ engagement.
More on her latest tomorrow….
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[Integrity without knowledge is weak and useless, and knowledge without integrity is dangerous and dreadful. -- Samuel Johnson]
realitycheq – I usually vote Pub, but I’m not beyond casting a protest vote in favor of a 3rd party candidate. Occasionally, I vote for a Blue-Dog Dem if I find one.
Libertarians have some policies to recommend them, but tend to be too extreme. More like anarchists.
I’m a fiscal conservative, social moderate, and believe strongly in the Constitution over everything else, but only for our own citizens.
TO: All
RE: RealityChiq on Sex v. Gun Education
How interesting….that you should deliberately misconscrew the inference. But not unexpected.
Birth Control is may be like ‘keeping the safety on’ the gun. But isn’t it better to educate on a higher level? That guns aren’t safe in the first place?
Keeping the safety ‘on’ on a ‘gun’ is admitting that someone has the gun in their hands and they are ready to use it. Whereas not picking up the gun in the first place because you know that if you’re handling it something bad might happen. The ‘gun’ might go ‘off’ on you and someone ‘might’ get ‘shot’. And in a manner that is ‘fatal’ to their intended Life.
You see. This analogy works VERY WELL vis-a-vis sex education. And I can make it come out as a ‘bad’ thing that (1) hurts people and (2) correlates well with the vaunted American public education systems unwillingness to teach gun safety along with sex safety.
For those who do not quite ‘grasp’ the significance, let me put it plainly before you….
Guns and sex are things that are VERY dangerous if not properly understood and used with great control.
Proper understanding requires a moral background as to when and where they, i.e., guns or sex, SHOULD be used, under certain circumstances. This is as opposed to when they CAN be used, i.e., ANYTIME someone feels like using them.
The vaunted American public education system is willing to teach a LOT about sex education. The VAST MAJORITY of it in the form of ‘how to’. And VERY LITTLE of it as with WHEN and/or WHERE.
As a result of it, we have a—statistically speaking—dramatic increase in unwed, teenage pregnancies since I was in high school; late 1960s. And these so-called ‘liberals’ appear to be totally-clueless as to the why. Are they merely ‘ignorant’? Or are they REALLY ‘stupid’? [Note: My working definition of ‘stupid’ is ‘ignorant and proud of it’.]
Two daughters; 32 and 22.
They’ve survived, but not without mistakes. None of which involved killing a their own children….my grandchild….to the best of my knowledge….thank God…..
What’s your point?
RE: Cancer
Bullshit. [Note: Please pardon my ‘french’.]
Money is ALL that the medical industry, practiced today, is about. Heck. The CEO of the ‘non-profit’ hospital across the street from me is reputed to have said his raison d’etre was to improve the ‘bottom line’ of his CORPORATION. Now THERE’S a ‘killer’ indicator for you.
And if you don’t have the ‘money’….they’ll take everything you DO have. The medical industry has turned from serving the community to serving themselves.
Or maybe YOU can explain how a liter of physiological saline costs over $250.
I remember in the 1980s when people complained about how the US Air Force was charged $600 for a hammer. Well….at least they got to use the hammer more than ONCE!
Everyone likes to whine about the insurance and drug companies, vis-a-vis medical costs. But NO ONE points the finger at the other abusers of the ‘system’; the doctors, the hospitals, the government bureaucrats, the AMA, research ‘institutes’ and the likes of YOU.
What’s YOUR annual income, babe?
You’re stuck in the same group-think of the medical industry.
You’re stuck in the same group-think of the medical industry.
You’re stuck in the same group-think of the medical industry.
Most ‘conventional therapies’ aren’t for squadoo. That speaking from what I’ve witnessed to date…on a personal note.
The only reason anyone would take them is strictly as a matter of ‘faith’, if they have (1) no knowledge of what else is available, i.e., someone is suppressing the information about graviola, or (2) they’re so bound up in ‘The Matrix’ of conventional therapies and trusting the priesthood of modern medicine, they can’t appreciate anything ‘better’.
And the AMA does a rather thorough job of keeping them ‘ignorant’ of what else is (1) available and (2) seems—to date—to work.
[Note: Mom has developed a secondary infection. Some virus I picked up at a meeting and brought back home to be distributed to everyone in the household. It involves nausea, vomiting, fever and chills. The guy who gave it to me admitted that he was sick when he came into the room. I should have fled at once. But he was not overtly sick. He didn’t cough. Nor did he sneeze. And yet. I came down with something withing 48 hours of that meeting. Nor did I attend any other activity outside the house between then and when I noticed the symptoms coming on.
God help US if bird flu comes to pass..... Stupid idiots will go into work and distribute the virus so that all can ‘benefit’.....]
S—! If the cancer ‘stem cells’ are positively charged, then the graviola will KILL THEM AS WELL.
It’s up to people like YOU, to determine whether or not graviola is effective against the source as well as it seems to be effective against the result.
What the flock are YOU doing about THAT?
Well. As I understand this, the cancer cells have an electrical charge that healthy cells do not.
Is this true or not?
I seem to recall asking you about this before. But you never answered me.
Are you still interested in winning a Nobel Prize for Medicine? Or what?
I tell you the truth. If YOU are not interested in this. Someone else who is REALLY interesting in (1) helping humanity cure this dread disease and/or (2) truly desires to be remembered throughout history as the person who cured cancer will pick up on it. All they need do is stumble upon these missives and begin their own research into the matter….that is provided their supervisors don’t ‘object’ for some monetary reason. [Note: I doubt if the people working for the pharm company that has been trying to come up with a synthetic facsimile of what God has provided us naturally will have the opportunity to advance this research. Who knows. You might be in that particular category, for all I know.]
I leave the field on this to you. I’ve got other matters to deal with.
Interesting. As, based on what I’ve studied to date on graviola, it would seem that God has figured that out.
Why is it you won’t pay attention to Him?
Well….
….as the saying goes, “So far….So good.”
I explained her circumstances in the previous verbiage. And I’m thinking that if there are no opportunistic attacks that could bring her down, she’ll fully recover from this very aggressive cancer.
Who cares? Especially if we can CURE cancer in people? Let the research mechanics follow the reality in order to understand how it works. Don’t put the cart before the horse.
You’re getting too much into the details when the simple answer could well be presented to you before your face.
Regards,
Chuck(le)
[To God be the glory....]
P.S. Did I forget to advise you that God will judge you upon how you decide to deal with this information?
Your the so-called ‘professional’ in this venue…..
…and He judges such based on their deeds.
I love it. The liberal left democrats are frothing at the mouth like rabid dogs. Sitting here reading your blogs I laugh myself silly. The stupidity that comes out of your mouths is hilarious. You know what’s even mor funny? Hearing Joe “Diarrhea of the Mouth” Biden at the debate. The man who says that FDR was president during the 1929 stock market crash and went on TV to talk about it. Classic comedy. A true “smart” liberal left democrat for you. You all should be so proud. Keeping on frothing.
There seems to be an element of social bonding there as well, something you can see when you find newsgroup threads that are celebrating a Palin hatefest.
Another thing that makes me think is the schoolyard bully routine that this inspires too, this Palin obsession is sort of like a test if you are in ‘our gang’.
It would be interesting how much mutual hate pep talk was practiced by those people in their social groups before they decided that liking Sarah Palin is akin to something terrible, like (say) cannibalism ie something that justifies (and demands!) a strong social exclusion reaction like the ones displayed and a high aggression situation is voluntarily entered without there being an emergency situation. This kind of hysterical reaction is culturally quite alien to many western people.
As for how to deal with a Palin hater?
Remove them from your environment at the earliest opportunity — compliment the out of the door, walk away, sack them if they work for you, split up if they are your partner… anyone who obsesses to this degree is like an unexploded bomb — you don’t know what their unbridled aggression will put them up to in the future, but what you found out is that they are capable of going mad in an ungood way. Whoever it is, they are not a good person to know, the fundamentals of their personality are not sound.
How to deal: Therapy, and lots of good drugs… on them or you. Take your pick.
hate? how can one hate someone so pathetic
who lies,
who is corrupt – twice or three times,
who wanted to ban books (two),
who wants creationism taught in schools.
who is a hypocrite – dont have sex
Chuck[116] wrote: “We haz met the enemy and they iz us. — Pogo”
Actually, this line was first delivered not in Pogo’s voice, but in that of Walt Kelly himself, who created the delightful Possum. Kelly’s actual words were, “. . . Resolve then, that on this very ground, with small flags waving and tinny blasts on tiny trumpets, we shall meet the enemy, and not only may he be ours, he may be us.”
This was in his Foreword to “Positively Pogo”
[Simon and Schuster, New York; ca. 1955], a collection of the strips themselves. And I’ve always liked the mock-heroic tone and his use of the subjunctive voice “may be.” Pogo himself may have spoken with an Okefenokee twang, but Kelly’s words still compel and delight us.
Marxists. They’ll always find a way to turn anything into a victim situation, and then, somehow, because they think so highly of themselves (NOT, apparently), will become that victim.
All I can say is wow when I come here. I love your blog!