Many people tilt at windmills.

Jack

Why is/are the father(s) out of the picture?

Many people hate God (or Primary Cause) for making
half of the human species female and the other half
male.

If someone is unwilling to budge, we’ll just do it without them, plain and simple. You talk about things being the way they have been for hundreds of years as if that (even if true) were a sufficient reason for not making changes. Slavery, womens rights, equal pay, etc etc. should have arguably been fixed long before they were, but too many people resisted change because of their parochial views that were out of date.

We in this country have a history of freedom and equality, but sadly only after struggles that lasted too long. My feeling is that those who are resisting gay rights will find themselves looked on as the intolerant and discriminatory ‘bad guys’. History is full of these parallels. I just ask that those who resist are critical of their views (as I should be of mine, of course) and try to get and understanding of what their core concerns are. If it ISN’T, for example, the ability to make sure that gay couples can adequately protect their children the same as straight couples, then don’t throw the baby out with the bath water out of dislike of gays or specifically, gay “marriage”.

And I think RightWingHippyChick #132 makes a great point…why is the right fighting against loving couples protecting themselves and their families when they want to embrace the very unity the right claims to hold so dear(between them)?

I’ll leave you with this. I work with a lesbian who has been with her partner for around 10 years. They have two beautiful twin girls who are just over 2 years old. However, because our state won’t allow the partner to adopt the children, if my friend dies then the state gives no protection that they’ll stay with their other parent (anyone in either family can challenge for custody with a fair chance of success). They are considering having to uproot the entire family and move to another state just to make sure the kids are cared for emotionally as well as financially (because that state provides for 2nd parent adoption although not gay marriage). Does it seem like we are doing the right thing for that family? It certainly doesn’t to me.

Knowing this couple for the past 5 years and having helped put swingsets together for the kids and going their birthday parties and holiday events has made it abundantly clear to me I’m on the right side of this. Letting something foul befall this family unit simply because some people don’t like that it is what it is and so they are not afforded the same benefits as the rest of us is, in my mind, evil at worst, callous and selfish at best. I’m not trying to throw stones at you personally, but I really think you need to see the issue from their perspective a little.

Jack

Really? Whose definition is that? Yours? And who are you to decide? Marriage used to be defined as a man and a woman of the same race. But that changed. Why? Because it was bigoted and discriminatory. How typically conservative it is to forbid other people from doing things for no other reason than you find it to be icky. Well, I find it icky for priests to molest young boys, so I think we should forbid the Catholic church in this country. Let’s make a deal – we’ll forbid gay marriage and kick out the Catholic church. Don’t like that deal? Wanna keep the church? Then mind your own business.

Even the argument that marriage has changed or doesn’t mean as much to some, or the vows are taken lightly, still does not negate the fact that the word marriage has a meaning, and a definition, and including other groups into it’s meaning or definition, changes it.

Well, it could be the whole argument is out of our hands now, as it seems to be going faster than our ability to discuss it or think about it. If one day, one side or the other prevails, I will remember our conversation and will wonder what you all are thinking.