Time To Move On From the GOP?
In weaving their story that Obama alone is the catalyst of our crisis, the Republican establishment counts on the constitutional illiteracy of the electorate. The inescapable fact, however, is that all taxing and spending bills enacted by the federal government must originate in the House. The GOP’s all purpose abdication mantra, “We’re only one-half of one-third of the government,” would be laughable if our straits were not so dire. When was the last time you heard the left-leaning bloc of Supreme Court justices say, “We can’t impose our policy preferences on the country. After all, we’re only one-half of one-third of the government”? When was the last time President Obama restrained himself from issuing executive orders conferring, say, privileges on illegal aliens, by explaining that he is only is only one-third of the government (a third, mind you, with zero constitutional authority to confer anything).
In constitutional law, the pertinent issue is never what percentage of total power is allocated to a branch. The question is: Which branch is given supremacy over the relevant subject matter. On the subject matter of taxing and spending – including the task of setting the parameters of the government’s authority to borrow and spend – Congress is supreme and the House has pride of place. It is certainly true that congressional Republicans cannot force President Obama to sign bills and cannot, given the number of Democrats in both chambers, expect to override presidential vetoes. Nevertheless, spending requires legislative authority that originates in the House. It is not a matter of executive diktat. President Obama would not have a dime to spend unless the House and the Senate agreed to give it to him. The government could not borrow more money for President Obama to spend unless the House and the Senate both authorized the borrowing.
It is not that Republicans are powerless to tackle our debt crisis. It is that they lack the will. Just as they are stuck politically in 1964 – having forgotten the Reagan landslides, they’ve convinced themselves that embracing conservatism leads inevitably to Goldwater thumpings – Republicans are frozen in 1995 when it comes to spending. Even though the national debt is now well over three times (soon to be four times) what it was when Bill Clinton and the pre-Fox media successfully demagogued them for shutting down the government, the Republican establishment clearly believes it lacks the competence to make a convincing public case that there is no more money left.
On that, perhaps, we should agree – it is time to explore other options.
The spendaholic government that the Republican establishment has colluded with Democrats to give us has created a debacle in which mandatory spending (entitlements plus interest on the debt) now outstrips revenues by a quarter of a trillion dollars (and rising fast). That is, we are already in a perennial, structural $250 billion debt hole before the government proceeds to pile on its enormous discretionary spending – including $700 billion in military spending and added tens of billions in other national security spending that Republicans would increase if given their druthers, along with another $600 billion and change spread over an endless array of matters that Republicans, in apparent agreement with Democrats, have decided that the states and the people cannot handle without federal instruction.
The Middle East, meanwhile, is aflame. A heavy contributing factor is the American policy of embracing and empowering the Muslim Brotherhood and its Islamists allies, very much including al Qaeda. The Brotherhood is a committed enemy of the United States. In 2007-08, the Justice Department proved that it considers the destruction of Western civilization from within to be its principal mission in the United States.
I agree with the sentiment, but move on to what exactly?
My thoughts exactly. Where? Who else will Move forward Conservative values who can draw conservatives of all stripes?
How would this happen without becoming just another third party?
re: “but move on to what exactly?”
Simply remove your registration from the Republican Party. Recall all the attention showered upon the ‘independent’ or ‘undecided’ voter? The assumption was these voters leaned in one direction. The two party system relies on those registered party member numbers. Undermine that formula.
Rather than remaining a party member whose political ideals are ignored, it’s time to make the party heed these growing numbers of ‘undecided’ and ‘independent’ voters. You can still support a favored candidate financially & politically, just don’t let the party elites take advantage of your political leanings by assuming you’ll support anything they do simply because of your political affiliation. GoPe/RINO’s need to suffer a purge. We can each play a part, in a painless way of forcing this purge. Change your party affiliation to independent. Then send a copy of your confirmation-of-party-affiliation-change-letter to the politician(s) which disregarded your intended vote in this years Christmas/New Years/Chanukkah card – noting the absense of donation as well.
We need to return to the rule of law.
Open message for Rep. Darrell Issa, Re: John Chase of the Chicago Tribune
http://illinoispaytoplay.com/2012/11/13/open-message-for-rep-darrell-issa-re-john-chase-of-the-chicago-tribune/
It seems that the Repub leadership ARE the problem, particularly weepy, sissy pants (probably an alcoholic) Boehner! He is such an embarrassment to the party it is curious as to why he is in charge – of anything!
Obviously the young guard – with Ryan in the forefront – are the ones to keep America off the fiscal cliff. But it seems clear, the RINOS are no different than their leftist counterparts, they just hide it better. They are also more circumspect, but no less dangerous.
Leftist dogma is the same world over, whatever garb it wears -http://adinakutnicki.com/2012/07/01/leftist-dogma-the-same-world-over-freedom-loving-people-beware-commentary-by-adina-kutnicki-32-2/
but the question still remains:what’s to be done?
Did you and this author miss this election? How were the Republicans ever empowered to do something about out of control government spending? They took over the House in 2010, but they had no control over what the Senate, the Presidency, Supreme Court, or even the vast majority of the media. Just what did we expect from them, a miracle? How were they going to back Obama and his comrades into doing anything fiscally conservative? The reality of the situation bites, but Republicans did not create these messes and they don’t even have enough political clout to overcome the false narrative that they did. The majority of the people are now Collectivists. How do we teach them anything that goes against the brainwashing they received instead of an education. It is over for Conservatives and the idea of individual liberty. The reason Romney lost is that his Conservative rivals pounded him last year until he was forced to use their generally unpopular rhetoric to undercut them for the nomination. Obama then spent seven months painting him as a heartless, evil, rich white guy who only cares about himself and all the other heartless and evil white guys who are, by my count, a clear minority of the voters. It worked. Americans will buy that narrative because that is the only narrative they have ever heard. Now the aged among us, people who weren’t quite brainwashed by the education system, are a dwindling minority of the voters. The good news for us old geezers is that anyone with half a brain can see that all of this Collectivist claptrap will eventually become a bigger albatross for the Democrats than anything they manage to hang on their Individualist enemies. So, we are consigned to “I told you so” until the stupid people finally figure out who is really screwing them. I hope that happens in the near future, but I won’t hold my breath.
Ironically the Constitution gives the House Republicans all the power they need ‘All bills for raising revenue shall originate in the House of Representatives’ Right there the House simply says ‘No’. Not that they have the stones for it.
Speaking of which, it woudl be approriate to go after Obama care this way, as the bill did not originate in the House. – but rather was an amendment to a house bill that deleted the entire text except for the HR#
Sorry AC, the government is operating without a budget for 3 years. Just print money and have the Fed buy up the debt issues.
The House is powerless.
I suggest stocking up on precious metals. Brass and lead.
While continuing resolutions have kept the gov’t going, they DON’T have to be passed through the house. That was my point that the current House or perhaps house leasership doesn’t have the stones to say no to a CR. With out the authority to spend, it can’t be spent. There is no mechanism to spend it.
and no need to print it. However I exect there to be a CR because without one only SS, Medicare and debt interest will partly funded and nothing else will be. Yes, SS, Medicare and debt are all on ‘auto.’ Additionally current income is less than those 3 automatic items.
Here is why the Republicans are cowards and useless. Two weeks after Barack Hussein Obama flaunted his April 27th, 2011 computer generated birth certificate a forensic document expert,Doug Vogt, put together an incredible 28 page affidavit proving that the document was a flagrant forgery. He sent that sworn affidavit to the Director of the FBI, Robert Mueller,III and also to 60 Republican Congressional representatives. There was further evidence collected by Sheriff Joe Arpaio and his investigative law enforcement team for more than a year which backs up Vogt’s claims. Arpaio also has proof that Obama’s Selective Service registration was fraudulent. Susan Daniels, a private investigator, decided to look into Obama E-Verified flagged fraudulent SS#. She has more than enough evidence to prove it is fraudulent. Many Republicans have been hand delivered this information but they decided to remain silent.
Now I ask all who participate here at Pajamasmedia, do you think the left wing nut jobs in the media, Fox and Democrat Congressional Representatives would have ignored this fraudulent activity if it were associated with Mitt Romney? Please don’t give a stupid response, we know the truth.
Andrew McCarthy, there are cowards spread throughout this Congress. There are cowards at Fox and Enemies and there are cowards in the Conservative Radio Talk Shows and that is why Republicans cannot win anything. They do not know how to bring the fight to the Democrats, thus they are cowardly. They bring a butter knife to a gun fight.
No DonaldYoungsRevenge, this is not why the Republicans are cowards and useless. It is why you don’t understand a damned thing about how politics actually works in the cesspool we call the District of Columbia. The Republicans tried to stop Obama by balking at raising the cap on the national debt, and look what doing even that got them. They got the blame for the political impasse by the Collectivist President, Senate, and voting majority of this country. The result: “Republicans are racist white men who don’t care what happens to anyone else” was trotted out again and the stupid majority bought it again. Please tell us just what the Republicans could have done about runaway spending and actually survived to win their next elections. And don’t say they have to stand on their principles because that, unfortunately, is a losing card. The train has already left the station and it won’t be coming back for a long, long time. Try pointing the finger at the people who are actually taking away your economic freedom.
Hey Jim. How about nominating a real full bodied conservative for President who is not a big government health care climate changer Republican, who is unapologetic about conservatism, and will bring the fight on all issues?
Brooklyn, You make an argument based on what you think Romney might have done if he were elected instead of what you already knew the Communist was doing since his election. What did you actually know about what Romney would do as President besides what Comrade Obama told you he would do? Wake up soon, okay? You are losing your freedom.
I believe you are right about one of Boehner’s problems.Sad. and those near him must know this!
Something new: either start a new party or raise up the Constitutional Party as our standard bearer, and do to the Republicans as the Republicans did to the Whigs.
It took the communists 100 years to completely take over the democrat party. I believe I’ve heard that our communisty party of the US has actually dissolved itself because the democrat party now holds their entire party platform.
It has been my hope that the tea party conservatives take over the republican party. Small government, fiscal conservatives. Let the states deal with social issues. It needs to be taken seriously on a national level (all politics are local) if it is to work at all.
How is that possible? Do you imagine that it is any more possible for this nation to survive half pro-abortion and half pro-life any more than half-slave and half-free? “A house divided against itself cannot stand.”
Fine – then let it fall.
exactly. The leadership is the issue. Before we can make an effort for the nation, we have to prove we can win a party. Don’t move on, mow them over.
Republicans support “big government” as much as Democrats do. The only actual difference is in what either party wants “government” to do. Not in asking the question whether or not we want “government” to do what it does. Libertarians understand that “big government” is the “problem”, not the “solution” to our problems. We need to make government “smaller”, not “bigger”. There are far too many agencies and departments of the federal government that do things never allowed by the Constitution. Agencies and departments run by unelected civil service bureaucrats who can create their own laws and regulations and run roughshod over the American people. We need to seriously prune these agencies and departments that they run, and return the United States of America to the freedom loving country that it once was a long time ago!
Rush said that if the Moderate wing of the Repub. party blew it with another RINO nominee this time then it was over for the Repub. party. And Rush appears to be moderating. When that happens, you just know we’re screwed.
You don’t need a counterproductive third party. You need the Conservative Republicans to announce their independence from the party (change the “R” to an “I” after their names, it’s not that hard) and form an independent TEA Party caucus. Announce that they will caucus with the Republicans only when they make the conservative case for doing so and lobby them accordingly. Unless and until they do, just hand the gavel back to Nancy and shut the hell up. MAKE THEM BEG.
The smug and self righteous establishment would not even have the majority and Speakership without the conservatives that showed up in the 2010 elections, yet they spend all their time pretending they’re the problem and being embarrassed by them. If nothing changes, the Republican Party is a house divided against itself, and cannot stand. (from the Bible)
– become a rusty oil drum. Speaker is a weeper. Trouble is, the Dems have no balls — they keep restoring the aged billionaire crone from San Francisco.
It is past time to move on past the Republican party and begin serious discussion and planning for secession. Compare the electoral maps of 1860 and 2012. The country has split into regions with little in common and growing dislike of each other. Work out an amical split allowing people to move to the region that represents their politics then slam the doors shut. Failing this plan for forced secession.
So the solution is to isolation? This is quite frankly one of the stupidest ideas I have ever heard.
You do not help situations by splitting up everyone especially in a situation where you are dependant on others for resources.
Don’t throw stupid around unless you’re prepared to have it thrown right back at you. What part of your statement “dependant on others for resources” makes any sense whatsoever? No country is self-sufficient in every thing. And in this country right now there is nothing that an average red stater has in common with an average blue stater. We have a common language maybe but that is just about all. I certainly feel no allegiance to a country stupid enough to re-elect Barack Obama. By keeping the union together you might as well try a union of Sweden and Zambia.
Look at the old Soviet Union, it was too big, too diverse to survive, we are the same. Diversity kills, it always has and always will.
I agree. As the country sinks deeper & deeper into the case of utter balkanization, it’s becoming more & more difficult to govern efficiently. Don’t think I’d necessarily suggest splitting up the country along red & blue lines but geographically into four quadrants with a regional “federal” gov’t body overseeing the states within while preserving all the states’ rights according to the Constitution.
Yes! Another layer of government should do it! Be careful what you wish for because you just might get it.
Even the Scots are being given the option to vote on whether they stay in the United Kingdom, so why NOT Texas?
Why NOT the Confederate States?
Amicable secessions ARE possible…Norway from Sweden, Czechs from Slovaks, Russians from Ukrainians etc.
Seccession is the likely end game, come the fiscal collapse.
Until then White Europeans need to develop Identity Politics institutions to protect themselves from abuse in a balkanized Identity Politics zeitgeist.
EV…this should be self-evident, and the fact that the initiative is being received with such scorn by Democrats is proof that THEY can see the writing on the wall as well.
Separation is the only way to go. That is, if in your lifetime you want to see color-blind justice, a media with a semblance of credibility, and your children going to schools that don’t preach sexism, hatred of your own country and culture, and venom at those who built it.
We are way too far down the road to change anything now that could–even optimistically–mildly effect this country in any reasonable amount of time. If somebody can explain to me how we are not pretty much lock-step in line with the self-declared socialist European countries, I might think there could be a chance. But combining all taxes–federal, state, and local–puts our economy pretty much in line with our European counterparts for the percent of the economy controlled by the government.
Our candidates have to be perfect, every person who calls themselves conservative in America must be fully rational and never slip up, because when a single one does, the media uses that nut as emblematic of all conservatives. And when we do represent ourselves beyond reproach, the media creates something to lynch us by. They control the media. You cannot beat that.
There is no way out of this but following through with plans for a peaceful split-up. People always warn of “balkanization,” but the wars in the Balkans only ended with the break up of Yugoslavia. The problems come from trying to keep people together who do not share the same heritage, values and beliefs.
For the past couple years I’ve been talking about secession knowing that through the iron law of demographics and an inability to stem the propaganda, eventually our way of life will be gone forever. Well, I think America pretty much shoved it in our faces by reelecting Obama and clearly said that time has arrived. The United States was started by a group of brilliant minds, and it has ended now that too few of its citizens share in the philosophy that has guided this nation from the outset.
Western civilization with its objectivism, scientific methodology, dispassionate reasoning, and our shared experience in the Enlightenment–the very things villainized by those who from now on hold power, those who I suspect have no mental capacity to even understand it–will be gone forever. Maybe Europe lost it’s ability to maintain it’s civilization when so many of those who could understand and appreciate it left for America, driving the nails into what is itself such a delicate thing to maintain when so few can see past their own immediate needs and grasp such an evolved philosophy. Maybe it was universal suffrage. I can only guess.
At any rate, Europe is long past helping; the United States, irrevocably on its way. At least we still have the numbers to credibly assert our right to continue to live our lives the way we choose. By separating now the lessons of our heritage might just stand a chance of survival by further concentrating those who have the capacity to comprehend it in a new society. Lurch much further down the path and we will be helpless and Western civilization will have died.
I live in a blue state and I’ve lived and visited red states. The red states are far more self-sustaining then the blue states. If they secede and do it properly they have a far stronger currency backed by with real exchange value and no responsibility for US debt. That alone makes it practical.
The truth is businesses have been heading to Texas en masse and there are more corporate headquarters there than in New York. When then Senator Clinton complained about outsourcing it was found that the vast majority were not leaving overseas but relocating down south where it made sense not just from a corporate tax standpoint but from a cost of living and standard of living standpoint for their employees. Have the skills that are demands and make and keep more (the red state solution) or find yourself left behind and taxed more with less to look forward to (the blue state solution). It is real hard to see given those circumstances that a secession will fail. The first secession was the colonies from Great Britain. Independence was just another word for it. I think it worked.
Glad to hear that the red states are self-sustaining. That means you won’t need oil, natural gas, coal, and agricultural products from Colorado & New Mexico (self-sustaining blue states).
Last time I checked, Washington & Oregon; also blue states; were pretty good at self-sustainment.
Texas, (and the other Gulf states) Wyoming, Alaska etc have more than enough natural resources to let Colorado and New Mexico go. And Texas and Louisiana have enough refining capacity to keep us going and export to the blue states.
The fact of the matter is, it’s the Red states that have most of the exploitable natural resources. Well may California, but they refuse to exploit now, so not much change in the world supply there, right?
Yep, glad to hear about the self-sustaining blue states. I’m so very proud of them. Now lets be realistic with the force of history behind us: the blue-state model will be no different than the old Soviet model and no one has ever accused the Soviet Union of being resource poor. With your motivated, skilled workforce and your nomenklatura and takers you will starve and freeze among plenty. Good riddance too, the resources and land will be there for us to take after you die.
There you go again SteveB, talking about something you don’t know anything about. Want to clarify what you said?
I’m having fun with this. New York State, Massachusetts, maybe Illinois will be in big trouble after a secession. New York, does have some fracking capacity but it outlawed it and just try telling its masses that due to any kind of reason the entitlements will be lessened. They’ll just cry that their remaining leaders are in cahoots with the secessionists and there will be plenty to be had if they just take their fair share from those remaining. Your biggest loyalists become your own fifth column. Oh yeah, that’ll work. I doubt the blue states will have much success confiscating military bases and weaponry given that many of these states have been anti-military and have outsourced their defense to the red states themselves.
Face it. Energy producing ability, a retained manufacturing base (at least by current American standards) and the ability to maintain enough arms so that at least a stalemate is in play wins this game. Good luck gaming this in favor of the coasts. They’ll have a robo-call out in no time denouncing it and that might be their best effort.
Conservatives ought to trash the candy @ss no guts country club Republicans.
It took 60 years for the nihilists of the 60s to bring us to where we are.
It will take 60 or more years to undo it all, IF we had the people to do it.
Therefore: anyone over 21 yers old, if you want to have a life, go Galt now!
GTF out! Try Latin America.
Those States that are considering secession need only announce that they consider the edicts that are puked out by this White House to be unlawful or unconstitutional, and will not be followed.
Obama does it with regularity and impunity. What’s the problem? Make the FEDS force us to comply.
Hey, you’re fast approaching the time when armed insurrection is the only antidote to the fundamental transformation of this Country to Socialism. Make them insist on it. Let’s have a fight. Secession is running away. Stand and fight.
Why pay off the debt ? The debt exists because it is necessary. A modern economy cannot prosper without one. As the debt grows the economy will grow with it with little inflation just as has been happening for thirty years. It never has to be paid off and it cannot cause the country to go bankrupt. Balancing the budget ruins an economy by contracting the money supply and a national debt expands the economy by adding money to it.
We are not Greece. As part of the Eurozone, Greece does not have monetary sovereignty.
Why pay off the debt? First of all, we need to pay DOWN the debt, because the U.S. federal debt has surpassed the total production of the entire country (GDP).
The interest payments on that debt are only as low as they are, because the Federal Reserve is keeping them artificially low by printing devalued currency (quantitative easing). That cannot be sustained, before inflation begins to rear its ugly head (See the Weimar Republic). If the interest rates increase, so do our interest payments.The same thing will happen to this government, as it did to the sub-prime mortgage lenders. We won’t be able to cover the payments.
Wrong. Look at the bond markets. Right now, 30 year T-bills are being purchased at a loss (negative real interest). The bond markets are saying, “Please, please, spend some damn money.”
Massive amounts of debt are not the cause. They are the symptom. The cause is distribution: too few people can create too much, but the people who don’t contribute (because they aren’t needed) cannot show they earned their share, so they go without. The debt is a symptom: as more people join the “un-needed” group, they borrow while they still can….
Think of a world where 50% of the workforce can easily supply 100% of everyone’s wants and needs. So, do 1/2 the people work and 1/2 sit on their asses? Or does 1% make 50% of the people work their asses off, collect 1/2 the output, and use artificial shortages to control the rest?
You can’t austere your way out of our situation, that is nuts. Spending your way out forces a redistribution, so even if you don’t understand or can’t admit to the reality, in a way you are still addressing it.
Moronic. So why are we importing massive numbers of illegal aliens to work if there is no “work” to be done? A free market would create a natural balance between those creators with wealth and those who are willing to work for more stuff. Redistributing wealth so that folks can have free cell phones, plasma tv’s etc skews the economics adversely. In your delusional world there would be no need for aliens.
The actual result of a free market is more wealth for everyone and less backbreaking work. But handing out free stuff wrecks it all.
Yes, good old Keynesian static economic analysis. It’s worked so well for Europe, why not proscribe it for the US’s rapidly escalating economic ills?
The problem with your model is that we’ve reached a precipice. Can you identify a single country whose government survived the rate of spending AND borrowing currently employed by the US? The gummint can only spend so many trillions of dollars before the house of cards collapses. Furthermore, if the almost $1 trillion in stimulus spending over the last four years (financed by the Chinese, btw, what happens to your model when the Chinese decide they need are better return on debt and increase the interest rate to pay for domestic programs? oops! your model is getting more and more unstable) wasn’t enough, how many trillions are needed? (By now you should recognize how silly the model is.) In addition, austerity plans are not about growing economies, they are about SURVIVAL of an economic system. Economic growth isn’t expected short-term because the countries finances are so infected and sickly the only way to ensure continuity is to excise the metastasizing cancer (reckless government patronage aka “investment” and what ever euphamism the statists choose to lure the sheeple to economic slaughter) before the finances of the country implode under the weight of their own mismanagement. Economic growth occurs only after spending is reigned in, rational economics policies are implemented, and the country proves itself worthy once again of acceptance to the capital markets.
The hammer and sickle gang love to use the word “sustainable.” Why isn’t that word part of the conversation when discussing economics and irresponsible spending? If the Left had any principles, they would demand “sustainable” economic policies to go along with their environmental policies. But they don’t. Why? Because the end-game is a “fundamental transformation” of the US. That’s Barabonics for killing free enterprise.
Monetary sovereignty is not something to be treated wantonly, but rather a very serious responsibility. While it’s true that a monetarily sovereign country can never involuntarily default, it can and will experience hyperinflation if the population of the country and its trading partners are convinced that they are fundamentally unserious about EVER having anything even resembling a balanced budget. Furthermore, hyperinflation will cause the nation to forfeit monetary sovereignty as no one will accept any currency such a government prints with no backing beyond its word, because they have demonstrated their word to be worthless. That country will be forced to deal in either a foreign currency or a currency backed by precious metals or natural resources, thus imposing external limitations on its money supply because it lacked sufficient discipline to impose realistic internal limitations on its money supply.
Our status as a nation that is not only monetarily sovereign but also the issuer of the global reserve currency has brought us great prosperity, but that privilege does have a limit, and if pressed beyond the limit, causes that privilege to vanish entirely, forever. Do not allow your greed to cause you to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.
Correct – we’ve been down graded twice in 4 years – something that has never happened in our history. As a result our currency is being dropped by foreign countries because they no longer trust us. This is going to have consequences.
You might want to watch this video to educate yourself. The level of debt we carry is unprecedented and dangerous. What happens when we cannot pay and the countries holding our debt call for payment? Do you really think China and others will say don’t worry about it? Think again, there will be a great deal of pain for all of us. We have seen hyperinflation before in other countries, Germany as an example but never before have we all been so globally connected, is this all by design to manage the collapse, think George Soros.
http://www.americanthinker.com/video/2012/11/us_debt_crisis_perfectly_explained.html
If you belong to the school that thinks the only way to prosperity is by borrowing and printing money, please explain why that didn’t work for Zimbabwe. “Monetary Sovereignty” is just a dreamed up distinction. Here is the scoop, oh Master. Wealth is not money. Money can only be a placeholder for real wealth if and when it represents real wealth. When money is produced in order to create debt and inflation, prosperity is never produced. When money is produced to match the increase in actual productivity, wealth can still be held in the form of money and prosperity can continue. Every attempt to monetize government debt has resulted in inflation and the loss of the savings of the people. As such, increasing the debt is just another form of taxing the real wealth of the people. Your government is stealing from you and you don’t realize it because they don’t even have to admit they are collecting it. You savvy? Well, you will once you try to retire, M of D.
Ever hear of China? So according to you they should be over-spending to get themselves into debt? Ludicrous isn’t the word to describe your economic philosophy. Our interest payments alone support the Chinese military. That’s money that could be used to invest in economic growth – you know, like jobs, improve living standards, keep SS healthy, etc.
Why is anyone surprised by this? So we hear about reforming the tax code. How seriously should you take proposals to dramatically reform and simplify the tax code realizing that this would shatter the rice bowls for a good portion of the DC nomenklatura, not to mention an army of lobbyists? Après moi, le déluge.
It’s never been wise to put one’s trust in a political party. They who steer the Republican Party are animated by the desire that animates the kingmakers of any political party: the desire for power and prestige. They to whom these things are the Holy Grail of existence are the least scrupulous, least trustworthy men in the world. We should bend all our efforts to keeping them away from the levers of power…yet as Friedrich Hayek told us in The Road to Serfdom, they’re always the ones who manage to get there. (Read the chapter “Why The Worst Get On Top.”)
The Constitution of the United States was written with the power-tropism of the unscrupulous man in mind. There’s no point in mincing words about it: it has failed us…or we have failed it. In either case, if there’s a path forward, it does not lie in endless optimism about our ability to reform the GOP. It does not lie in the belief that we can take the nation back to its limited-government basis solely through political outreach and electoral action. It certainly does not lie in backing the pursuit of power by the most dangerous men in the nation.
We need a new direction? Of course, Mr. McCarthy. It’s inarguable. But that direction had better bend us away from politics. It had better tend toward improvements individuals and small groups can make without anyone else’s approval or any government’s blessing or support, or it will come to nothing.
One of the most cogent missives in the commentary Francis. Well said.
To your point, I would argue we’ve failed the system because too many of our fellow citizens granted power to the morally myopic whose interests were not of the advancement of society at large, but themselves. I believed the US was heading to a period of significant decline when Congress was unwilling to pass term limits legislation when it was debated in the early 1990′s as part of the Contract With America. The narcissism and corruption displayed at that time told me there was nothing our “entitled” political class would do to reign itself in. While there have been a few pols with the courage to self-limit, they are so rare as to be anachronisms.
I agree … the GOP is history. We are already moving towards Federal Libertarian
government … one that will have constitutional fidelity and one that will be much much smaller. Our house is being renovated and prepared for the future … and the foundation is being laid as we speak. First principles will be the order of the day … and our future is secure!! Third party? You betcha!!!
“I agree … the GOP is history. We are already moving towards Federal Libertarian
government … one that will have constitutional fidelity and one that will be much much smaller. Our house is being renovated and prepared for the future … and the foundation is being laid as we speak. First principles will be the order of the day … and our future is secure!! Third party? You betcha!!!”
This post here could be generously described as wishful thinking because it sure as spit ain’t true if current trends are anything to go by.
That poster is delusional.
“Under the leadership of progressive-lite House Speaker John Boehner and his fellow professional Washington moderates in the GOP Senate leadership, congressional Republicans agreed to budgeting that internalized into its baselines Obama’s exorbitant stimulus spending.”
This was:
a) the marxist’s plan from minute 1
b) the greatest fiscal crime in history
c) NEVER MENTIONNED during the 2012 campaign
The Republican party is dead, as it should be. Anybody who defends anything that the party does is a fool.
Unfortunately, the country as it existed for 230 some years is just as dead.
Boehner and everyone of his ilk are a complicit in the crime as the marxists are.
People, isn’t it brutally obvious that both parties are in it together? They both go for bigger government and more government control over our lives. The ONLY difference is that the GOP does it a little slower than the Dems.
If you need more proof than your eyes provide, read The Creature From Jekyll Island by G. Edward Griffin.
Both parties? I only see the Liberal Wing of the Democratic Party and the Moderate Wing of the Democratic Party arguing with themselves about how much of your money they deserve. And you really need to get a second and third job because you’re not paying your fair share.
The Repubs seem to be locked in the past, yes, but so is the writer of this piece. Specifically, locked in obsolete, cold war thinking.
Back then, we supported a lot of dictators and one-party states, because they were on our side rather than the Soviets. This was understandable, justifiable – we were locked in a game of speed chess with the USSR, and only one of us was going to be coming out intact. Survival, at any cost, was the only reasonable goal, and we crushed a lot of people under our treads in the process.
The problem was, and this wasn’t just ours, the Soviets had the same one, was that dictators are fundamentally illegitimate. They have no basis for their power save naked force, no true support beyond those military units that are bought and paid for. By and large, they build little, steal much, and leave their nation a poorer and weaker place when they are gone.
In the cold war, that mattered little. Today is a different day.
Muammar Gaddafi was not our friend. He was not helping Libya. He was only helping himself, and his cronies. And today, we have no good reason to help or support these worthless thugs.
The new Libyan government may be Islamist, but at least it’s populace chose it. It holds the legitimacy of popular support. And, unlike Gaddafi, who was not our friend, the new government is not our enemy. The difference is subtle, but meaningful.
Today, we can choose to be something more than a chessmaster. We can lead, by example, by choice, and show that we are friends to the friendly, enemies only to those who choose to be.
Shed no tears for the dictator Gaddafi. The Libyans don’t – and for the first time in decades, they can say so.
So the Islamists are big on democratic institutions are they Kevin? Sorry friend, projection on peoples with no history of self-governance and with a religious philosophy designed for totalitarianism is dangerously naive and part of the reason the middle east is in turmoil. In short, it the triumph of utopianism over rationalism.
You are living in Obama’s dream world. Too bad his dream world is a nightmare for the United States. What we have going on right now is the formation of a Middle Eastern Islamic caliphate and these people have no intention of allowing self governance by free people. The people of Libya didn’t choose this. It is being foisted upon them, just like Obama is attempting to foist world government on us. Look into your assumptions. What do you think happened in Libya in September of THIS year?
I don’t know, what did happen in September? People on this board sem to be round-robin blaming Obama, al Qaeda, the Muslim Brotherhood…though no one to my knowledge has blamed the Libyan government, either the interim or elected one.
Oh, wait, you must be trying to imply that Libyans actually had a hand in it. Which makes as much sense as blaming the US for 9/11. (Yes, I know some idiots actually do. Such is the reality of intense stupidity.)
However, in JULY the Libyan people id something that shows they have more idea what democracy is than you appear to, Poppakap. They voted. And they chose a new government, which will form a committee to propose a new constitution. No, the people of Libya don’t have a lot of experience with democracy, but neither did the US in 1776. You have to start somewhere. But if we had supported that maniac Gaddafi, democracy wouldn’t even have had a chance to begin. They may fail, but at least now they can say they tried it.
As to having this “foisted upon them”, well, I think the world could stand a little more democracy being foisted off on nations and peoples who want it but don’t have it. And regarding the, and I quote, “formation of a Middle Eastern Islamic caliphate”, well, I’ll worry about that when pigs fly.
I stand by my assertion that Libya has never been, and never will be a democracy. Besides, what is so good about democracy when it is used by the majority to steal from the minority, as it is being used here in the USA. Thinking that these Middle Eastern Islamic countries will ever be democratic is like saying that Iran is democratic. They have been having elections for a long time, all rigged to keep Islamic Sharia law as the fundamental law of the land. Our President thinks this is a good thing because it more closely aligns with his agenda, for the time being anyway. Communism and Islamic Fascism are an unholy alliance. Don’t start preaching about freedom to people who actually have a concept of what that is. You can call me delusional all you want, that is what Communists always do to the people who can recognize them for what they are. But in my view it was you who drank some Kool-Aid.
I think the main difference between us, Jim, is that I’m willing to let a bunch of people in another country try to find a better way, while you’re assuming they will fail and advocating a steady diet of more repression, force and tyranny.
And you’re calling ME a communist?
Kevin. I don’t see anywhere where I have advocated the repression and forced democratization of any Middle Eastern country. I have said that to think these people are having some kind of self determinative movement is to not see the Islamic caliphate they are actually producing. I have called you a Communist and, because you are supporting a Communist controlled political party, I will stand by my accusation. You are either a Communist or you are ignorant beyond belief.
Ah. This is shorthand, I see. “Communist” means “Anything to my left.”
Because it’s obvious you don’t actuallly know anything about Communism or real Communists. You’re just parrotting the words of others without any knowledge of their meaning.
Oh, and by the way, YES, you are promoting tyranny and dictatorship. Because that’s what denying people the simple freedom to choose their own way forward is: tyranny. I support Obama (and the US’ many European allies, who were also involved) in this because he was doing what Bush only lied about: spreading freedom. The freedom to make the most basic of choices, of who and what their government is to be composed of.
It may turn out that they will choose something we don’t necessarily like. But so what? The world doesn’t revolve around us, and they aren’t asking our permission. It’s their choice. And that IS freedom. Which, apparently, you don’t like.
A very communist position for you to take.
So find a comment I have ever made that says I favor denying any country the freedom to choose their own way forward. I claim you are either a Communist or an ignorant SOB, but I don’t make up stuff and claim you said it. Try your straw man arguments on someone else. I am tired of your drivel.
Which is shorthand for “I have no answer”.
Let’s take a look at your reasoning, shall we? The writer of the piece, Mr. McCarthy, is of the opinion that it was an error to assist the people of Libya in overthrowing Gaddaffi. I opined that this was obsolete thinking, that the people of Libya should be allowed to make their own decisions.
Here is where you come on to the scene, pooh-poohing the very idea of Libyans making their own choices. If you’re going to attack the idea that we should assist and encourage peoples, anywhere, to gain self-rule and democracy, then what else are you dong BUT supporting tyrants and dictators? So don’t get all up in the air when someone calls you out on it.
I wasn’t speaking any shorthand to you. Again, you make stuff up and accuse me of saying it. What have you argued with that you have interpreted as it was written, asshat?
I believe the only solution is to concentrate our efforts upon building stronger local economies, while seeking true Conservatives to run at the local and state level. Decenralization is the only solution to centralization. I am not talking about secession. That is merely a distraction from genuine efforts that might eventually pay off.
The solutions will not come from DC. Solutions will not be quick or easy. However, every one of us can begin by strengthening our local communities, by shopping and eating at locally owned businesses. We can network in our local communities to share resources and to seek out true Conservatives with the potential for leadership.
Theoretically, at least, it should be possible to create a silent revolution completely under the radar from those who would discourage and mock such efforts.
I like this idea. It is something I can do whether anyone else does or not and will give incremental positive results.
It may be possible, through the judicious use of this philosophy, to gradually change the structure of the nation into a loose confederation of city-states and mostly-autonomous regions. The trick will be carefully letting go of the Federal apron strings (shrinking its structure) without the nanny getting all spastic and bringing out the big paddle with holes in it.
To quote a certain young Dr. Frawnkenshtone, “It! Could! Work!”
That this idea seems novel to some shows just how badly we’ve allowed our political class to corrupt the model established by our founders. What you advocate is precisely the model laid out for our governance at the writing of our Constitution.
Sort of like going John Galt right in front of the Federal government’s watchful eyes. I wonder why Ayn Rand didn’t think of this in her novel. It would have been so much more uplifting. Our Federal government has become a malignant tumor which has already metastasized and is now consuming its host. Escape is the only hope, and it isn’t much of a hope.
What you are describing is actually the objective of many Tea Party groups across the country. Start small, start locally, with the eye on the future.
After the election and Boner dropped to his knees to kiss Obama’s “feet,” I wrote my local Representative and told him that if that Quisling wasn’t removed from the Speaker’s chair to take me off his mailing list because the GOP will have proved itself part of the problem and they’d never get my vote again. Well, I got one more of his update/blog emails then nothing. Usually I’d get one every couple of days at least as well as personal responses from him if I left my opinion on something. I guess either he’s really busy or I know where he really stands: with Boner against Constitution and country.
The Republican elites are falling all over themselves to blame the tea party and conservatives for the fiasco. I think we should accommodate them. Accept the blame and resign in disgrace from the Republican Party. Leave it to our betters to do whatever they like with no pressure from us – which they will do anyway.
Time to look elsewhere for a party to support. We will NEVER be able to “take over” the Republican Party, as so many of us hoped. It’s time to go “into the wilderness” – perhaps for 40 years – and build something new.
Sigh….I hope you’re wrong, but I fear you also might be right. The Tea Party won a lot of seats, but the establishment republicans really throw a lot of money at their squish candidates.
I also know that I’m tired of the direction I see the country headed towards. That I don’t have anything culturally in common with at least half my “fellow citizens,” and that I’m ready to just start sitting it out.
*double sigh……..*
I agree with you in sentiment, but the problem is we have nothing like the decades it would take to go off “into the wilderness”. This is the end game. 40 years in the wilderness? The generations born over the next 40 years will have no connection whatsoever to the America we hope to restore. None. It will be as alien to them as Ancient Greece. No one will be carrying the banner of limited, constitutional government and the foundational principles of Natural Rights.
The statists have won for a single very important reason: they calculated that the average person is a moron who can be bought off with platitudes and trinkets. And they were right.
Third Party.
Straight up.
All in. Let’s roll. Todd Beamer is waiting for us.
For the first time ever, I support this idea.
We have lost everything we could lose and I doubt that the Republic will survive a second Obama term.
I would say that the GOP are like dogs who roll over on their backs when they are confronted, but that analogy is unfair to dogs. Dogs are loyal and brave when it comes to protecting their people. The GOP, not so much.
A party that will not define itself with clarity, or defend its positions with strength of conviction, and who cannot effectively defend themselves from negative attacks in the media, is neutering itself through its own weakness. After a decade of backing them, I really don’t know what the GOP stands for. I can see myself voting third party in the future.
A note on the Tea Party:
In retrospect, the Tea party made a mistake trying to reform the GOP, rather than starting as its own independent party. By not having leaders and a platform, in other words by not clearly defining themselves, they were effectively portrayed as radical extremists by a media who saw them as nothing more that an arm of the GOP they hate.
If they were going to try to reform a party, they should’ve picked the Dem party. They would have gotten a lot more support in the media and a culture that allows Dems an unfair advantage over the GOP . Democrats today, especially in blue states, can get away with almost anything and still beat a GOP opponent. I don’t approve , but it is a reality that must be dealt with.
In addition, the Tea party, like Romney and the GOP, are afraid to discuss the so called “social issues”. This election shows that is a losing strategy; those issues are too important to people to be ignored. There are moderate positions on issues like abortion and gay marriage that could appeal to a majority of people, if someone or some party had the nerve to take them. Romney could’ve been that man; the Tea Party could’ve been that party. It was not to be.
People who want constitutionally limited government and significantly reduced regulation and taxation (e.g., tea partiers and libertarians) would oppose the federal government funding abortion, directly or indirectly. These same folks would oppose you if your intent was to have the federal government mandate a prohibition on abortion. [Note the words 'federal'].
Marriage, gay, sad, or otherwise, should not be the subject to any federal regulations. It should not be the federal government’s business. If we abolish the income tax and a few other federal statutes, the federal government will be mostly extracted from the marriage business (gay, sad, or otherwise). Perhaps the Census Bureau would still care.
The enemy is the Communist Party which is now in complete control of the Democratic Party. Destroying that party is the only solution. Why hammer the Republicans for losing an election that we helped them to lose? Maybe we need to look at ourselves and realize that politics is not about showing up with the purest philosophy, it is about power. Obama will spend the next four years entrenching the Communists in power and whether we call ourselves the Tea Party, the Republicans, or Libertines, we will still lose if we don’t find a way to discredit the Communists, in the minds of the people, before then. That is, if we are ever given a chance to vote in a free election again.
Hey, a thought occurred to me that I am utterly astonished to realize I have heard not one, not ONE, mention of all week.
Namely, one of the GOP’s proudest achievements in 2010 was the flipping of about 790 state legislature seats nationwide. This was a fact that rightly would keep any Democrats who really knew the score up nights.
So where do we stand with that now? Anyone know? Did a bunch of those seats flip back? Are we pretty much on November 10th where we were on November 5th?
Does anyone have any info on that? IF we are still about where we were, then that 2010 victory still has much fruit to bear, AND the Dems remain with a pretty old bench selling a pretty old package of ideas. If the Dems had a night of glory on that score, well, I guess their triumph is all but total. But I have not heard such as a syllable on this question from either side.
Anyone?
The link: http://www.governing.com/gov-data/2012-state-legislature-elections-map.html shows a state by state map of 2012 State Legislative results.
The republican party no longer exist outside state politics.
The republican party is now the right wing of the democrat party.
The republican party will never hold any position in government that has actual power unless it’s for show by the democrats.
There will be no other party to take the conservative side of the political spectrum.
AMEN
Hey HEP-T, you can only hope you aren’t really talking about the Communist controlled Democrat Party. The Republicans didn’t lose this election. The American people did, and the sooner the Democrats understand that, the sooner we can purge their party of these cockroaches.
It’s one thing to be a conservative, another thing entirely to be a reactionary.
Conservatives didn’t used to wish that we could go back to the early 20th century or to the 19th century. Conservatives used to be for gradual and orderly social progress. In other words, like a brake pedal, not like a reverse gear.
Some things are not going to change. The fact that people with their own children no longer care for their parents under one roof as an extended family means that some kind of taxpayer-funded social safety net for the elderly is going to always exist. Permanently. It doesn’t have to be the mess that we currently have, there are lots of opportunities for reform and new ideas; but the idea that we can go back to the 19th century when the elderly had to either depend on care from their children or else end up in poverty is a non-starter.
A social safety net for those who are temporarily down on their luck will also exist. Unemployment insurance, for example.
And even Milton Friedman was a big fan of the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation, which prevented runs on the S&Ls in the 1980s when many of them folded. Needless to say, the Federal Reserve is permanent, the Federal income tax is permanent too. Get used to it.
IOW, conservatives need to distinguish themselves from Randian Objectivists once and for all. Laissez-faire economics is a fantasy and it’s never, never, ever going to happen.
It’s one thing to be a conservative, another thing entirely to be a reactionary. – sinz
Following Leftist “progress,” makes you a Leftist. Opposing it makes you according to them an reactionary.
You arent really a conservative but rather a moderate Leftist.
This is essentially defeat for Conservatives. This is what happened in Europe. The so called conservative parties have lost on all the big ideas and merely run as better managers of the Leftist Welfare State. In the US it would be termed Democrat Lite.
What you are advocating for is the embrace of Lefism as the solution for American Conservatism.
I do agree with you though, that Conservatism has lost and there is no way forward on that score without breaking up the nation, seccsion. White Europeans outside of Conservative institutions and the Republican party, however should move to implement Identity Politics, as a practical matter. They need to adjust to the current reality, banging your head and pining for the ideals of our Constitution and principles and values is a “lost cause.”
HeyEscapeVelocity. Is it possible that the left has spent the last 30 years trying to take us back to where they had us 80 years ago? Don’t give us this backward and forward claptrap without understanding that collectivism is the oldest form of government in the world and it has never worked on any level beyond the family clan or small tribes. Collectivist politics is REGRESSIVE. It is not PROGRESSIVE as its practitioners loudly proclaim. “Forward” to the cliff, “useful idiots”.
My bad. That response was intended for sinz54.
“Conservatives didn’t used to wish that we could go back to the early 20th century or to the 19th century. ”
Who, other than “liberals” is claiming that as a conservative goal?
Abortion is not progress, but regress to paganism. Just as slavery was a non-negotiable worth fighting a civil war over, abortion is worth paying any price and bearing any burden, up to and including succession, civil war and total economic collapse in order to abolish.
At least the author has faced the problem – or at least part- squarely and w/o caveat or excuse.
It’s a good place to start.
At least a part of the problem has been communicated in no uncertain terms.
Now, you can begin to reationally discuss options, plans, strategies and tactics about what to do about it
However, w/o a coherent political philosophy, or a simply worded ‘mission statement,’ your discussion will bear little, if any, fruit.
iow, there is , currently, no unified ‘vision’ for where Republicans or conservatives go from here.
w/o such a vision, you have no direction. Each of you wants what you want, when you want it, just the way that you want it…and to hell with the consequences. Until you change that, your aspirations to political power -to the extent that you claim to want it- are doomed.
That is because we aren’t unified. We just aren’t Communists.
Both parties follow the same Keynesian economic philosophy – continued inflation of the money supply financed by debt.
Nothing will change until we have stable money again.
Sounds like another reason for secession, to me.
#’s 11 and 13:
Yours are the best solutions presented and better yet is a combination of them both added in with a total boycott of the MSM, the Hollywood elites and those very blue states that have passed the point of no return. It is indeed time for a third party that stands for individual liberty, states rights and fiscal conservatism. Yes, we will be in the wilderness for a generation but in time, especially if the economy craters and we get true repressive government the voice of such a party will be listened to.
Third parties are just spoilers, doomed to fail. With that I submit that the GOP is effectively the new Third Party. They will be bumped out of the way by a new party that takes survival of the Republic seriously.
The GOP can take a page out of the 9/11 Report. The Democrats are at war with them but they are not at war with the Democrats. Quite the contrary.
Mark Levin is correct in stating that the answer is NOT coming out of Washington. The two parties are too corrupt. The Dems are taking us to communism and the Repbs. just want a chance to share the power/perks/prestige. No one is interested in adhering to the consitituion or the rule of law, either. If so, why in spite of stealing 1.5 billion dollars from investors is John Corzine not indited for stealing?
And John Boehner is an absolute joke. No guts, just the tanned, slobbering face drooling all over himself in front of Diane Sawyer and her ilk. Talk about displaying fear and subjucation.
Yes, Boehner, McConnell and co. are gutless, but they are gutless for a reason, they receive major funding from the forces that profit from our misery.
I am an electrical engineer, my last job before I started my electrical construction co., was commissioning automation systems in factories. To take an example; I went to a godawful industrial city in Central Mexico to restart automation equipment that, along with everything else, had been stripped out of a factory in Toledo. Just like that, close the place, put about 500 Toledans out of work and re-locate to this dump in Mexico, same owners, same product, same customers except that now the workforce is working a standard 12 hour day in inadequate lighting and ventilation (I had experience of working in Mexico, so knew to pack soap, toilet paper, PPE, etc. in my toolbox). My dust mask was black with grit and dust at the end of each day, the Mexicans were provided with nothing. Waste from the plant seemed to be dumped into a local creek, the town had a central open sewer the stench from which would dissolve a diamond.
But back to Toledo; the 500 laid off are not going to find industrial work as this is far from the only factory that has closed, so what do they do? Those that can, get social security or disability, all will get extended unemployment benefits, others will apply for food stamps and/or TANF etc., some will find other, most likely unskilled work, nobody can move because they can’t sell their houses. Literally Govt. handouts have replaced the wages that these people earned previously. But where have the wages gone? Into the pockets of a trans-national financial elite who don’t give a damn about anybody but themselves. They also own both the democratic and republican parties. Literally the debt that is being piled up by the Federal Govt. is going to support profits for a mighty few.
The answer to this is simple of course; impose import tariffs that counter balance the lower costs available in slave labor locations. We can start with a minimum of 20%, that will offset the VAT manipulation practiced by almost all of our competitors, and start at 500% for China and India. It will take some study to determine the correct rates, and hey, never mind your bleating, you want to avoid the tariff; manufacture in the US.
This is not a democrat or a republican POV, it is just the way it is. So who is going to do something about it?
Oh, we can do something about it alright. Let’s start by making Ohio a right to work state so that workers can be more productive and less expensive, we can follow up by abolishing OSHA, the EPA and the IRS and all their regulations and taxes (and Ohio equivalents) which make it needlessly expensive to do business in Toledo as a factory. The progressives created all the problems that caused the factory to relocate to Mexico from Toledo. A VAT and tariffs are progressive solutions to progressive-created problems. This country needs to throw out the entirety of more than a century of devastation that progressivism has wrought upon this once great Republic.
Yes, let’s do it, throw out all the environmental laws, child employment laws, all the health and safety regulations, let’s all get down to the level of a Chinese peasant, we will all live in hovels and die young. great idea Mr “all things the same”.
The good news is that idiots like you will never win an election so the rest of us can rest easy that your nutcase ideas will never be implemented.
The nutcase socialist ideas you defend have already been implemented. That is why you have to implement even more socialism to ‘fix’ the predictable damage the previous stupid socialist ideas have caused. Of course, the prohibitive tariffs you propose will really make America’s citizens better off (Smoot-Hawley 2.0)!
Don’t see the likes of you in here that often. Can we put you on a ballot for mid-terms, or would you prefer to wait until 2016?
The problem is that there will be enough of them running on the backs of the GOP to keep the GOP screwed for sometime to come. Meanwhile, the democrats will continue to gain “progressive” seats in the House and the Senate just like this past election. 2014 and 2016 will be some interesting and telling times for those tea party folks but to late for a recovery by the GOP.
A great diatribe coming from the labor union lobby. Good job, boy. Comrade Obama can always use another “useful idiot” to support his agenda.
Jim Baker,
The problem with people like you is that you are incapable of understanding what is, you see all through your prism of what should, in your mind, be. You pine for the never was and dream of the never can be. But it doesn’t matter, the election proved beyond any doubt that the majority sees through your BS, your done, finished, fork in, over. And our society is the better off for it.
PS: You wouldn’t be a christian as well would you?
What did I say that was a wishful dream, Bozo? Another business, Hostess, went out of business because of wishful thinking and collectivist claptrap. Ask those 18,000 folks whether they are dreaming about how things ought to be. Where do you think your fascist government is leading you? Prosperity for all? Down for the struggle and all that, brother, eh?
cognitive dissonance strikes again
Is it really the 8 hour work day and workplace safety regulations that are driving manufacturing to other countries? Or is it unsustainable pension agreements and $50 an hour wages to low skill workers for turning the same wrench all day?
Sounds like you are trying to have gold-plated benefits riding the coattails of safety and environmental rules, because most people can recognize the usefulness of the latter but not so much the former.
The jobs lost in Toledo were mostly $18-$20 an hour with crummy benefits and no pensions, but that is still too much for the capitalist class to pay. Particularly if Goldman gets his way and we import millions more from India, there, if the workforce isn’t literally starving, the owners figure they are paying too much.
Your gold plated pay and benefits packages are all in the public sector and they are still here.
You people really need to open your eyes.
roger of Florida or whoever you are, my name isn’t “you people”. Is that some more derogatory focus group nonsense designed to help puff you up with a superiority complex? Go back to your precincts to jabber this crap. I hear there are 49 of those in Philadelphia.
It is probable that it has reached the tipping point, but be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.
Yes, the progressives, those nefarious bastards, who via the magic of time travel started the process of moving manufacturing overseas shortly after WWII. Or do you think the fate of companies making cheap transistor radios and other consumer electronics (but for one example) was somehow NOT an example of an historical ongoing multi-decade trend and mere anomaly? Do you require more examples? Maybe learning how to use google is a skill that would help you.
I’ll bet you’re highly regarded in the tea party. It figures.
Progressive would be a misnomer, Bozo. Read some actual history and philosophy, if you can, and try to comprehend the origins of your gang.
Yes, give me an example of how our businesses don’t pay the highest corporate tax rates in the world or how labor unions haven’t priced themselves out of the market. Why should I as a consumer be forced to subsidize higher product costs by paying for these high taxes and labor costs? It’s the free market that gave us cheap transistor radios, computers, cell phones, inexpensive cars, improvements in health care, etc., not governments and labor unions.
Jarmo,
You just don’t get it do you? Our whole society is being impoverished by the outsourcing of engineering and technology, you, or your children will be serfs to their CHINESE MASTERS if we don’t wake up and understand WHAT IS REALLY HAPPENING. Forget the BS that is being peddled by the likes of “Jim Baker”, (there’s a good name, a great sucker of Saudi appendage) or “Mr all things the same”. we absolutely need to maintain our ability to manufacture the products that we need if we are to have a high standard of living.
But perhaps that is unimportant to you, perhaps you are a christian and believe that we need to suffer, or perhaps you are a govt. employee who believes that the gravy train will go forever, either way, without a huge change in attitude we are done for.
roger in Florida, name calling again? Well, I can do that. You are a stupid Communist asshole. And I won’t try to support my accusation either. I will just repeat it a lot for you.
JARMO — It’s the free market that gave us cheap transistor radios, computers, cell phones, inexpensive cars, improvements in health care, etc., not governments and labor unions.
Actually it was government that kick started microelectronics in the cold war funding research for solid state miniaturised controls in ICBMs. The legacy of NASA (government) is something you’re proud of as well I take it, and it didn’t result in Tang.
The notion that to be a right winger you also have to be a laissez faire anti-gubmint moonbat is a modern (and incomprehensibly stupid) notion.
Don’t forget that the government has also given us the Post Office, FEMA, and Amtrak, all bastions of innovation.
“We’ve now seen enough to draw a conclusion: the Republican Party says what it believes must be said to entice conservative votes at election time, but it is not remotely serious about implementing limited government policies or dealing with the two central challenges of our age, existentially threatening deficit spending and Islamic supremacism.”
This strikes me as a bit disingenuous coming from a commentator as experienced as McCarthy. I’m sure he knows as well as anyone in DC does that in order to be effective, congressmen have to be re-elected. Turning the US from a socialist if not communist destiny is not a one term affair. It’s going to take a lot of time, primarily educating the voters, particularly the 47% who do not pay taxes and therefore care only about getting stuff from the government. What have the Republicans emphasized about the fiscal cliff? We can’t let it happen because it will raise your taxes. Do they make the moral argument, anywhere, anytime? No. It’s all about taxes. If you or anyone else thinks the American public is ready for a discussion that calls on them to sacrifice for the sake of the future, just look at last Tuesday’s results.
So the choice that McCarthy poses is a false choice in the sense that if standing on principles means you don’t re-elected, the Republicans will return to the status of Sunday Afternoon Debating Society, like they were 1936-1994.
First things first. Let the 85 freshmen get past their sophomore elections until they are secure in their seats, then tackle educating the public.
Nixon, 25 November, 1973: “What I have called Project Independence 1980 is a series of plans and goals set to insure that by the end of this decade, Americans will not have to rely on any source of energy beyond our own.”
Are you sure we only have to wait a few more years? I am tired of inevitable candidates who aren’t and long-term promises that don’t even nearly materialize. We need to stop the BS. It is time for the Republican Party to go into the ash heap of history.
You said: “So the choice that McCarthy poses is a false choice in the sense that if standing on principles means you don’t re-elected, the Republicans will return to the status of Sunday Afternoon Debating Society, like they were 1936-1994.”
Was Ronald Reagan President of the Sunday Afternoon Debating Society during 1981-1989?
No, what Ronald Reagan was, was the primary representative of the “deficits don’t matter” persona in US politics: A dumbo, an idiot, a cretin.
Deficits don’t matter. Debt matters. Even debt doesn’t matter until servicing it eats your entire budget and then some. When Reagan was president, neither posed the existential threat that they do now.
Thou shalt not blaspheme Ronaldus Magnus! He was merely trying to fix the mess left by Jimmah Cahtar
Posted by a (former) California registered democrat who voted for Ronaldus Magnus twice and had to listen to you cretins besmirch his magnificence!
When did Reagan chair the House Budget Committee? When was he Speaker of the House?
I am probably considerably younger than you, but still old enough to remember the 1980s. The annual game was announcing Reagan’s budget proposals would be Dead On Arrival before they had even been submitted to the Congress. And they were called DOA because they didn’t propose enough spending.
Reagan’s deficits occurred concomitantly with a massive expansion of the US economy. More than can be said for your current Blight in Shining Armor.
“Are you sure we only have to wait a few more years? I am tired of inevitable candidates who aren’t and long-term promises that don’t even nearly materialize. We need to stop the BS. It is time for the Republican Party to go into the ash heap of history.”
I thought Republicans were going to use their majorities in 1995 to start teaching the voters about the unsustainability of the welfare state. What did they do? They frittered away their time and our money on expansions of the welfare state trying to out-give and out-pander the Democrats with insanities like the prescription drug benefit while they picked dimwitted “leaders” like Bill Frist. Granted I’m disappointed in their failures. But more voters know more about the debt and deficit issue than did in 1996. Take heart in the knowledge that if something can’t go on forever, it won’t. [Ben Stein] Republicans need to used that installed base of knowledgeable people and expand it while keeping their seats in Congress. Otherwise, all the awareness in the world won’t help because the Dems will be solid majorities for the next 50 years.
“Was Ronald Reagan President of the Sunday Afternoon Debating Society during 1981-1989?”
Pretty much. Didn’t have Republican majorities in the House at all, and in the Senate only for one cycle I think, did he. Republicans were marginalized, playing Dem-lite,s as the Dems had trained them to do, picking up the occasional crumb the Dems would let them have. Reagan was very very lucky in that 1) he had an affable personality; 2) he knew how to let the other guy (Tip O’Neill) win some; and 3) he had built up so much rapport with the people by virute of his tours and his stints on tv that he knew he could go over Congress’ head when the issue was important enough and he didn’t abuse that. But movement conservatism was not a force in Reagan’s administration, certainly not like it is now.
My concern is that the Republican party is the only vessel Conservatism can sail on now. Not the Tea Parties (they’re not organized, not unified, not coherent, and have not mastered the art of finding, grooming, and running appealing candidates who can walk and chew gum at the same time). It’s not a happy state of affairs, but the Republican party is all we got and if we throw it out to try to create something more successful, we will watch Conservatism retreat into an ineffectual cluster of essayists limited to ranting in National Review, National Interest, Weekly Standard, and Commentary.
Start educating the public, hope your rep and senators are willing to hold townhalls and reach out to the commoners. I have found since the healtcare debates, both parties are spineless and don’t hold townhalls, they might hold a teleconference which is scripted and controlled. Nobody in my area has the guts to face the voter, only campaign donors…so they miss golden opportunities to educate the public.
“Nobody in my area has the guts to face the voter, only campaign donors…so they miss golden opportunities to educate the public.”
Not a very incouraging report. I wish the Republicans would start acting like they understand that Obama’s #1 priority and goal and obsession for the next two years is getting a Democratic House in 2014. Everything he says in the interim will begin or end with, “the worthless Republicans blocked me every step of the way.” Whatever the issue is, our job is to make the voters understand that what Obama wanted to do was unwise, costly, subversive, illegal, or whatever adjective fits the case, with explanation, keeping in mind the MSM will not report the two sides accurately or completely. They think they have us on the ropes. Let’s remember what happened after Goldwater lost abysmally. The Dems overreached and we came back. History doesn’t always repeat itself, but sometimes it comes damn close. [John Lewis Gaddis]. Let’s make this another such occasion.
I would like to support your point of view Corlyss, but I am afraid that you assume that American voters are not stupid. This last election was hard evidence that they are either stupid or completely brainwashed. And how do we realistically propose to fix either of these situations? I will continue to support the Republican Party because I agree with you that they provide our only chances. But I now think those chance have become only slim and none.
Lack of spine/political will are drivers of the out of control spending but the real issue is incentives. “Spendulus” is REWARDED and fiscal conservatism is punished in todays political environment.
The entire federal government operated under incentives to spend MORE not less.
After all, everyone loves “free stuff” and no-one likes having their rice bowl taken away. Hence Obama’s re-election.
The reality is the United States is already so insolvent it makes Greece look good. We have over $100 trillion in UNFUNDED liabilities and that which CANNOT be repaid won’t be. We have ALREADY gone over the cliff and are just waiting to slam into the ground below.
There will be NO slowdown in the spending (or the money printing that enables it) until the US dollar joins Zimbucks in the failed currency club.
That is the change we are all getting, regardless of who is in charge of the Federal government.
To be more accurate, the GOP has moved on from us…and from almost everything that it’s supposed to stand for, especially in the area of fiscal restraint/responsibility. Look for a long, slow process as the current GOP becomes a permanent minority party (because, basically, it chooses to do so, not because of some overarching demographic “doom”), and eventually, when things get much, much worse (especially with the nation’s finances), a new third party will coalesce around less “pure”(and more common sensical) libertarians and the Tea Party and assorted Tea Party types, that will eventually displace the Whigs/GOP as America’s other major political party. It will happen, I’m sure, but I’m also pretty sure it will be too late to save the nation intact in a form most of us would recognize.
Ahh, yes, the ‘tea party is the actual soul of the right wing’ business which is claimed by the tea party and believed solely by, astonishingly, the tea party.
Actually, randomengineer, if your reading comprehension was a bit better, you might have noticed that I’m say the tea party – the movement, not any organized group claiming to speak for it – is *not* the “soul” of the current GOP. Thank goodness for that.
Actually, randomengineer, if your reading comprehension was a bit better… [snip]
I can read fine, thanks. I struggled with “rightful heir to the right wing throne” and “living embodiment of right wing principles” and “we be the real right wing, bitches” and other phrasing suggesting that you guys think you’re the “actual,” rightful, and only right wing. These seemed awkward despite accurate.
Clearly you twits think of youselves as the heart of the right wing, sort of reminiscent of the wingnuts who think they’re one of the chosen in the rapture.
On the other hand I settled for the phrasing I used and reckoned the intent was clear for any adult readers.
Or not.
The Tea Party people are basically non-partisan, (read: representing people from ALL political parties) fiscally conservative, small government people.
Any other application is an invention of your own mind.
The Tea Party people are basically non-partisan, (read: representing people from ALL political parties) fiscally conservative, small government people.
Wishful thinking. In actual practice the tea party is almost exclusively composed of the far right types who consider the GOP “leftist” and imagine themselves latter day constitutionalists. It is also home to a great number of the religious right. Sen Jim DeMint pretty much claimed the tea party movement as a private club stating effectively that if you’re not a religious social conservative, you’re not a tea partier.
You can easily see this reflected in what the tea party supports. One example of this? School vouchers. On the surface vouchers are claimed to be concern of what children are taught. This of course would be interesting if the argument was centered in more physics classes and fewer sports activities, but when you drill down you find that this isn’t really the case. It’s never about the merits of teaching physics or orbital mechanics over other subjects and the type of emphasis discussion the concept suggests. Sadly there’s no high minded reality; the workaday (i.e actual) arguments re vouchers tend to be centered on far right christians bitching about the eeeevils of evolution being taught. Essentially the entire vouchers movement is by, for, and about the wingnut contingent, not serious constitutional scholars or educational experts, and is little more than a razor thin veneer over the same religious right claptrap nonsense that’s been the achilles heel of the GOP since before the Reagan era.
Essentially, the religious right effectively neuters any positives that the tea party could ever begin to offer, hence it’s a non-starter for the elctorate as an aggregate and attractive only to the same sub-segment of the population that is already identified as “far right.” It’s a minority position within the GOP, and a fraction of the electorate.
In sum, you’re simply wrong.
Typical left-wing brain. No matter what people claim, the moonbat self-confirms his own prejudices and paranoias with selected statements from people I’ve never heard of and lectures you on what you’re “really” thinking. A mentality not far removed from practitioners of voodoo by the disciples of Mother Gaia.
By the way Einstein, social conservatives are about 1/3 of the Republican Party. And even if I defended school vouchers as what I believe to be the one opportunity inner city kids have for a future, your brain is so stuck in mud you would claim my secret is to convert the world to Christianity.
I happen to be one of another 1/3 of the Republican Party, a libertarian. And from somebody whose primary political interest is freedom, my biggest fear isn’t some kid who knocks on my door and wants to talk about religion (happened twice in my life), its you control freaks who want to take half my income, use it for social engineering, race-baiting, sexism and the promotion of outright bigotry. That’s scary. And so are you, by the way.
By the way Einstein, social conservatives are about 1/3 of the Republican Party.
No, Keith, the number is well under 20%. And even if it were 1/3 that doesn’t automatically imply that the wingnuts are supposed to be driving. And why? Let’s assume your superior intellect can do arithmetic, and just for giggles I’ll even spot you your silly 1/3 number. What’s 1/2 of 1/3? About 1/6. Yeah, that’s the way to get the votes of > 3/6 voters by letting 1/6 of them call the shots. Try to grasp the notion that although *you* personally may not mind the 1/6 by and large there’s 5/6 of the electorate that does. Innumerate foolery such as yours is why you’re still saying “President Obama.” He thanks you.
Learn math.
I guess those are the quantum computations that really made you a name over at the HuffPo.
If you had any idea of how representative democracy works, you’d know why that small percent (1/6, huh? You’ll have to cite that one) is able to get (some) of the things it wants. But you’ll also have to remind me of what exactly they actually have gotten, other than platitudes from Republicans trying to hold together a coalition of sometimes directly conflicting agendas.
As for your claim (with righteous certainty) that 1/6 of the party is social conservative, would you include those that are Evangelical Christians? Protestant (also referred to as evangelical) Republicans, non-religiously motivative old line Republicans? Those who believe the left wing agenda has gone too far? Just what exactly encompasses the 1/6-as-absolute-fact that are social conservatives? I’ve always read 1/3, but since you’ve already dazzled us with your mathematical acumen, now show us how to source a claim.
As for your claim (with righteous certainty) that 1/6 of the party is social conservative [snip]
Reading comprehension much? 1/6 of the *electorate*, ace.
Well, since we’re getting persnickety, maybe your superior fractional intellect can explain how you came up with these:
“What’s 1/2 of 1/3? About 1/6.” Well, last time I checked it was exactly 1/6. Could have happened to anybody . . . uh, ace
Keith — touche. 8)
Yes, absolutely time to move on. We want a fundamental and radical transformation of America, an America which never existed, one of minimal government, pure laissez faire capitalism, survival of the fittest. Time to move to Somalia. God bless and good forward.
A strong conservative caucus in the House could function like third party in a parliament and force the majority party to the right on at least some issues.
This article is long in coming to anybody who has seriously followed the past four years–and prior to that with the disaster of Bush. What McCarthy suggests is the only possible road to survival. When the tea part was formed the agreement was to work within it and–if you will a hostile takeover. The campaign of Romney proved they were not serious and showed them to be spineless. We no longer have a choice we must leave and fight! To stay Republican means surrender. We now have a one party rule and this party isn’t fun!
It stands for nothing!
I truly believe Boehner is being blackmailed.How else do you explain his behavior?
May God send us inspired leaders who will fight for our beloved country!
After working so hard to send good people to DC in 2010 and the immediate cave in the last Lame Duck Session, I knew, the GOP would become the Whigs. The easiest way to win the debt ceiling debate was to strip out the stimulus spending that is now sealed in the baseline. The public would have backed them, in fact, they still will as part of the current “negotiations” the stimulus spending is still largely unpopular and most voters have no idea it is now embedded in the baseline, why wonk Paul Ryan never raised this issue is beyond me. Boehner is the weakest leader the GOP could have at a time when they need strength. The establishment GOP is a disgrace, they want the perks of working in DC but they have no desire to lead. Scott Walker gave them the playbook on how its done but they never opened the book. There bench strength is good but we need a leader now, Boehner went wobbly when he was handed the gavel.
Good piece over at rightscoop on why the players from the Bush era need to go, got that Rove!
http://www.therightscoop.com/gop-needs-to-leave-bush-era-behind-including-and-especially-karl-rove/
Rove and ilk should go but will double down on Jeb Bush next time most likely. And still propped up by phony boobs like Hannity and “O’Really”. Good link though. Thanks.
We warned them in 2010. They ignored us. We gave them one last chance this election cycle. They ignored us again with the weakest presidential candidate in memory at the most crucial moment in modern history. They’re done.
A new American Party should be formed from the tea party caucus in every state capital and Washington DC. While they remain a minority party, they can caucus with the Republicans. Eventually only the progressive-lite will remain republicans and that party will collapse of its own lack of will (or merge with the demonrats whom they so closely resemble).
Andy, your suggestion doesn’t even seem radical to me anymore. It makes perfect sense in the situation we face.
Bush family was handed every opportunity both times to define this country in conservative principles and showed themselves to be progressive scum, producing a couple of disastrous demoncrap presidencies following these 2 bozos. Stop honoring them, look at all the pictures of them glad handing, backslapping and having a good old laugh with Clinton and Obama. This followed by 2 weak candidates that kept saying what a great guy Obama is and glad handing, backslapping and having a good old laugh at our expense with Obumbler. Tea Party was used. When came time to shut down Gov’t like Reagan was willing to do, the newbies under crybabyboehner caved. You too Alan West – disgraceful move and predictable outcome. Sequestration – really? You thought that was a good idea?
Secession – now there is an idea.
Some of the commentary here is interesting to say the least. Three observations:
1. The same commentariat here who seems to think climate science is an exercise in confirmation bias seem incapable of detecting it closer to home. Echo chambers like this are not representative of anything outside the far right. The tea party is not supported by the electorate in general.
2. The tea party has also been usurped by the social conservatives. The 2010 republican “sweep” in congress and state houses nationwide resulted in no less than 944 bills designed to prevent, stigmatise, or otherwise outlaw abortion. Bait and switch. Even the tea partiers can’t keep their eyes on the fiscal ball; they’re easily distracted just like parrots and rings.
3. The fiscal message of the tea party? Absurdity on stilts. The supposed fiscal conservatism desired by the tea party has never been actually seen by any living person. For example the interstate system — a massive federal outlay — was during the presidency of Eisenhower.
Good luck with your fantasies. By all means go form a 3rd party of dead and dying “conservatives.” Maybe the GOP can then deal with the socialists. They/we sure as hell can’t get that accomplished with your “help.”
Tbe GOP can deal with the Socialists alright. As Lindsey Graham stated on his purpose as a Senator “to work with Democrats.
If by deal you mean effective counter, you cant effectively counter Socialists by adopting their policies. You’ve merely become a Socialist.
The faux Conservative parties in Europe are left to argue that they are better managers of the Socialist State. They have conceded the war of ideas in totality.
Well, we can see that no one is a good manager of the Socialist Welfare State, as Europe is about to collapse fiscally.
But alas, if you notice, you are an extremist.
PS – You can separate virtue and morality from governance, or the electorate and have a functional nation-state. No matter how many times you try. It will always end in failure.
Rather than the incoherent rambling on about your superior morals and misidentification of socialist tendency, how about addressing point #3. Extra credit will be awarded if it’s comprehensible.
You can keep on preaching hate and fearmongering. It is what haters like yourself do.
#3. “The fiscal message of the tea party? Absurdity on stilts. The supposed fiscal conservatism desired by the tea party has never been actually seen by any living person. For example the interstate system — a massive federal outlay — was during the presidency of Eisenhower.”
You know I’d really like to be able to answer your #3, but can’t quite figure out the point you’re trying to make. First you call Tea Party’s idea of fiscal sobriety “absurd.” Okay, now the reason why you would characterize it as absurd is because it has never been seen before. (A balanced budget, I assume?) Quite a bizarre statement, if that was your point.
Then you go on to claim that the interstates were first funded during Eisenhower’s administration. So I can only assume what you wanted to say was that conservatives sometimes fund large government projects. Okay. And that has to do with trying to stop our deficit from continuing its skyward projection? (A situation that is of no concern to you, since to worry about that would be “absurdity on stilts.” ) By the way, Eisenhower was able to do what apparently has never been done before by producing a budget surplus in ’56, ’57 and ’60.
My God. You expect people to follow that kind of convoluted logic? Extra points for anybody who can explain why my professional analysis of this one falls under egomaniacal dementia.
And extra ponts for you if you can state the US deficit in real dollars as a percent of GNP under the profligate Ronald Reagan during the military build up that sank the Soviet Union but that also elicited endless doomsday scenarios (including the clock by that name) from you democrats and how it compares to today’s deficit under “Our Dear Leader.”
Why is the Tea Party a fantasy? They want lower taxes and a smaller government. We didn’t even have an income tax until 1913 when everybody worked. Why isn’t it an outdated concept now?
We should abolish the income tax and have a consumption tax.
Better yet, there was also a time that congress was made up from individuals who actually had JOBS back home. Now we have near 100% lawyers. Who thought THAT was a good idea. It should go back to the way it was – a part-time job that they actually left. They are supposed to represent US. How do a bunch of lawyers actually represent us?
System is broken.
LOLLY — Why is the Tea Party a fantasy? They want lower taxes and a smaller government. We didn’t even have an income tax until 1913 when everybody worked. Why isn’t it an outdated concept now?
It was 60 years from the first flight at kitty hawk to Neil Armstrong. Most of the kickstart of aircraft development and passenger travel came from investment by the bad old terrible gubmint; much of the early effort devoted to air mail is what started passenger travel.
When technology comes on line it is regulated for safety etc and this is what government does. Government grows as does technology, by definition. It won’t be that long before solar power is delivered from space. Perhaps in your lifetime. This too will require inevitable government growth.
There is nothing inherently wrong with government growth in and of itself. The problem with the tea party is that it rails against ALL government growth and not targeted excess (see Pournelle’s Iron Law of Bureaucracy.) Tackle the Iron Law and I’ll be a fan. Rail ineffectively and stupidly and I’ll continue to disregard it (along with most of electorate.)
You want to stop PBS funding? Me too. You don’t (can’t) do it by whinging about “big gubmint” but you _can_ target this as having lived beyond the original charter. Think of the airwave landscape etc when PBS was created. Is it still the same? (These are hints, try to think of the effective argument that would be used.)
Airmail was the primary accelerator aircraft technology? Uh, try the military and entrepreneurism. Granted, one of those is the government, but not any part of it that you would ever be a proponent of.
Government grows along with technology? (Here’s another gem.) And, get this, its BY DEFINITION. Of course, it does in your fantasy world.
And then you go on to throw us hillbillies a bone by saying PBS has outlived its charter. Good, I’ll bite. But then you claim that our government doesn’t so much need an overhaul as it does a little tweaking around the perimeter. That’s what you guys have been saying about our educational system for the past 40 years. In fact your ideology has so overwhelmed all other consideration in your mind that the fact that our kids are falling further and further behind is because it just needs a little fixing. Amazing how quick you are to toss our kids under the bus to perpetuate the abject failure that public schools in America have become because you’re not able to deal with reality. Same goes for the government in general. Check out how historically catastrophic our deficit has become and you say it just needs a little tweaking.
In fact your ideology has so overwhelmed all other consideration in your mind that the fact that our kids are falling further and further behind is because it just needs a little fixing.
My ideology? I’m a republican. Republicans invest public money into long term infrastructure that pays back many times. GPS — muiltibillion$ of US owned business — is a result of *republican* direction of funding into defense needs trickling into the public sphere. Democrats waste money on great societies. Downtown Detroit is the result of *democrat* direction of funding to social “needs.”
Your problem is that you are so wrapped up into your anti-gubmint “all spending is evil” nonsense ideoology that you can no longer rationally distinguish between the republican foresight that creates billions$ worth of business opportunity and democrat creation of Detroit slums merely because GOVERNMENT is the lever used by both.
Get a clue.
You have to be the most covert Republican in the history of the party. You’re also creating not just a little bit of a straw man argument. Everything the government spends is evil? Who said that? If what you’re saying is that you think the government can spend money wisely, just say it. Don’t spend your ink on slamming people for being extremists and justify it with a mundane statement.
Keith — You have to be the most covert Republican in the history of the party.
There are a lot of reasons one can vote republican that have dick to do with so-called “social conservatism” (statism) or the “small government” schtick of the execrable teabaggers.
In practice most of the tea party arguments for much of anything tend to be thinly disguised attempts by the religious right to get away with imposition of their agenda — e.g. vouchers, we covered this, just a new way to impose religious nonsense in schools… hey, Cletus, here’s an idea: let’s claim that abortion is a ‘states rights’ issue and we can continue our 40 year long idiotic tirade against Roe v Wade and look all scholarly and constitutional and such… and so on and so on and so on.
In short there’s a ridiculous amount of overlap of nouvelle “constitutional experts/scholars” and bible beaters. But hey, it’s only a coincidence.
Meanwhile the teabaggers who aren’t bible beaters seem to think that 225+ years of hard work and scholarship and hardship of dealing with wars and potential nuclear conflagration and disasters and societal upheavals and what we like to call real life by some of the best minds available were wrong. Every damn one of them. The very worst in armchair scholarship.
Do any of you wonder why the majority of historical and political and other scholars aren’t all lined up on your side? (Undoubtedly is the same vast left wing conspiracy that made the electorate vote Obama. That’s the wonderful thing about shadow conspriacies, eh?)
Does it sound like I’m making fun of you? Good. I am.
Dude. (We’re down to “dude” now.) So far your evidence for the Tea Party being hijacked by nefarious forces has come down to a whole lot of balderdash. (Getting your conspiracies from HuffPo, I see.) So we’re being guided down the right path to do the wrong thing? Or is it visa-versa? Who knows? Its a conspiratorial world and anything goes.
As for what I believe was your referencing US history as a world leader, yes, we can finally agree. I think we have done a pretty good job up until now, with caveats. What I can’t stand is spending all this effort, being hated and getting dissed by the world community (you know, the ones we’re trying to help), sticking our necks out so far we’re now the biggest nut-job target in the world, being accused of being warmongers directly from even those we bailed out militarily–and in the words of Collin Powell, asking nothing in return but the land to bury our dead–and all on our dime!
Seriously, you would have to be Mother freakin’ Teresa or one world-class patsy to call for business as usual for American exceptionalism in foreign intervention.
As for your last nugget, you’ll have to direct me to that study that showed constitutional scholars (and, once again, I’m assuming that’s what you meant by historic and political scholars) in agreement that our constitution can be interpreted to mean anything you want it to mean. Or just show me the consensus who say the Tea Party’s interpretation of the constitution (you know, the one that isn’t interpreted) is off track.
And as for which one of us is making fun of the other, I suggest you check out this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6y8Fr5XnPw
A hearty farewell and goodbye, best wishes, good luck & etc. to those finally leaving the Republican Party. We cannot say we will miss your constant griping, whining, sniping, and complaining, but we sincerely believe you will be much happier in the new party of Keepers of the True Beliefs you will create for yourselves.
As with any divorce, it is best the severance be made complete and permanent, so kindly don’t coming worming your way back into our primary processes in the 2015-16 cycle, mmmkay? We all know it wouldn’t end any better than most booty calls, don’t we? We’ll have all your stuff boxed up by Sunday, please pick it up promptly.
We will all look forward to you showing us how we should have been doing it all along! Oh – and don’t let the screen door hit ya where the Good Lord split ya on the way out the door!
No problem and no regrets – except in your party.
BTW – how’d you like that shellacin you just got? Get used to it. Because without us that’s your new normal.
People like Estrogen are content to be the minor vassals of the greater nobility. For decades the Republican Party was quite satisfied with being the party of virtually permanent minority status. The trappings of sinecure were still there, and they still got invites to the fancy dress parties in Georgetown. When they suddenly began having legislative majorities tossed in their laps in the 1990s and 2000s, they didn’t quite know what to do with them. When you cage an animal long enough, it will get to the point where you can leave its door open because it knows no other way.
This is, of course, exactly what the Whigs said to the Republicans in 1854.
As I see it we have two CLEAR choices, as members of the GOP Base: Either we bring *our* party to heel; or we create a new one of our own, much as the anti-slavery “Republicans” who took over from the Whigs in 1854.
It seems to me that the more practical choice would be to purge the GOP of its RINOs and proceed from there. But that may not be possible considering how *stupid*, *spineless*, and *intellectually-unmoored* our Republican leadership has become. We have the best of all possible rational agendas on our side, for God’s sake. In the current age, where truth (honesty), and reason, have no value in the media or in the popular culture, and given the dire situation (both domestically and abroad) that this nation has sunken to, it may well be that the only way to be heard and respected by the power boys is to pitch the GOP elite and start afresh. I hate that that might be our only option, but I REFUSE to continue to follow the Roves, and Bushes, and Grahamnesties, and McCains, and Boehners, and McConnells, and the whole effing lot of them, over the cliff of national socialism. I REFUSE! It is time to fully consider our options. We have counties and states across America petitioning for secession from the Union. It is 1860 all over again. Except that this time around, the secessionists have valid moral grounds for wanting to cut ties with the federal government. This time around, it isn’t about preserving slavery, it is about PREVENTING slavery. Slavery to Washington (how ironic is that?), and to the elites in Academia, the public education unions, Hollywood, and DIANE F***ING SAWYER, ET AL. Enough!
We will be finding out well before Obama’s second inaugural what course our party leaders intend to put us on. Pay close attention, and be prepared to react accordingly. This one-sided game where the Democrats and their Pup Cult apologists are allowed to say and do ANYTHING, while our side forever seeks the High Road of appeasement (Neville Chamberlain was a British conservative, you know), has brought us to the precipice, and we need to end it NOW.
Why do we need to wait for America’s utter economic collapse? Why must we wait for nuclear terrorist to wake us up? Why can’t we stand up and act before it’s too late?
Dude, the Confederate seccession was about preventing slavery to the Federal Government.
The tension on this Centralization of Power at the Federal Level and State Sovereignty is still with us.
Lincoln enslaved the Nation to Washington, by destroying the US Constitution and instituting a Military Despotism….forever changing the balance of power to the Federal Government.
Youre mind is still shackled, it would seem. Wake up. They are gonna demonize you if you lose this go round, too. And then some fool in the future is going to say….”This time around the seccessionists have valid moral grounds, not like those racist xenophobic haters back in the early 21rst Century.” Condemning you, because history was written by the winners.
You need a good slap in the face. Snap out of it.
We continue the same battle that the noble Sons of the Confederacy bled fighting.
Maybe you could peruse this site for some de-indoctrination.
Apologia for Civil War Views
http://www.etymonline.com/cw/apologia.htm
excerpt…
The CSA was a bid to form an independent nation out of a region that had a common enemy and some collective regional identity. But the CSA comprised many sub-cultures (a few of them didn’t want to be there), and it had a leadership that sometimes confused self-interest with public policy. It had its fair share of charlatans and profiteers and criminal opportunists. It had some brilliant generals and a great many men in uniform who would be the pride of any army in human history. It was committed to 18th century republican values that were incompatible with fighting a modern war, and it had internal social conflicts that the war aggravated.
In nearly all of this it was entirely like the American Revolutionaries. The colonists in 1776: one-third for independence, one-third against, one-third uncommitted. That must be the standard for legitimacy, or else our United States lacks it. The CSA fought a much larger enemy than George III, mostly on its own soil, without a Dutch loan or a French fleet to aid it, and the majority, in spite of internal divisions, put up a herculean effort, won spectacular victories, made shift with what little it had, and held out till the place was literally gutted and blood-drained by its foe.
End Quote
Check out the articles on the Left Side of the page.
“Dude, the Confederate seccession was about preventing slavery to the Federal Government.”
Oh Lord, a devoted Neo-Confederate has entered the fray. And a huge Ron Paul fan to boot, no doubt.
In reply: 1) the basis of your argument, stated above, from which the rest of your words spool out, makes no sense; and 2) none of your remarks address my point re the establishment of a new party based on freedom.
So you should have just started a different thread.
Ron Paul is a nutter, his son Rand seems to be a bit less wacky. Even less wacky than Gary Johnson. Im a big fan of Bob Barr though.
“Why can’t we stand up and act before it’s too late?”
The pre-Thanksgiving sales are on at the mall! Priorities, man!
Meh. I left the Repubs when GHW Bush raised taxes. After this election, I am done.
Everyone has missed the most basic fact.
“This government was designed for a moral and religious people. It is wholly unsuited to any other kind.” – John Adams
We are no longer that people, so the nation, as represented by the Constitution, is dead. We are ungovernable, now. Too many people are too fundamentally corrupt, and too illiterate, to allow for self-governance, so tyranny is the only answer.
We are at the tale end of the Tytler cycle. We are heading into bondage. The only question is, what kind of bondage? Who shall be our Caesar? Obama will be recorded as our first Caesar. Congress has been reduced to a mere advisory body. The SC merely rubber-stamped OCare. It’s over.
You can talk about a 3rd-Party, a New Party, but it is meaningless. You can talk about secession, but tyrants do not allow power to be drained away, thusly. The only answer is a shooting war.
The government after, assuming success, will have to strip certain people of their rights. One must cut off the head of the snake.
The problem is, it is social taboo to contemplate what must be done (a civil war), the disenfranchisement of people (say, no longer allowing blacks to vote, because all they see is skin color; or no longer allowing single women or those under 30, to vote, or something belike), and the draconian ending of social welfare (Darwinism will take place). The more we embrace the necessary draconian steps, the weaker will be such a revolution, and thus, more likely to fail.
“When the ballot box fails, all that is left is the ammo box.” There was massive vote fraud. It is time to fight. I just do not think we have the will to do what is necessary, so we will keep having Obama and his ilk. They will keep the forms of the government, but it will all be a fiction.
The American Republic is dead. There shall be a Caesar. The only question is, will he be from the Right or the Left? The Left will have power via the broken ballot box, and the Right will have the power from the ammo box. It’s up to us to choose. “As for me, give me liberty, or give me death.” – Patrick Henry
Good for you Malone. Now you are a loser like all of those inferior Republicans you like to hammer every chance you get. Get some new material. I told you so didn’t make your life any better either, did it?
If you don’t like the racial socialism of the Nazi/Democrat parties, then join together in a universalist religion.
I think Malcolm X put it best: “I have never before seen sincere and true brotherhood practiced by all colors together, irrespecitve of their color.” We should accept Islam, then transform it from the inside on our own Gramscian march.
At a news conference in Las Vegas, Romney wouldn’t weigh in on…an effort spearheaded by Michele Bachmann calling for an investigation into….alleged Muslim Brotherhood infiltration of the federal government.
“Those are not things that are part of my campaign,” Romney said. (Politico)
“agreed to budgeting that internalized into its baselines Obama’s exorbitant stimulus spending”
this is the crime that really sticks in my craw. For the life of me I cannot understand why this wasn’t a huge scandal. Republicans enabled it and the media ignored it. The stimulus was a total sham, a giant stimulus for government. and now that is the baseline to base cuts off of? forget about any new taxes, government needs to be weaned of the fraudulent stimulus.
Washington is run like a crime family.
Quit your own whining about only owning part of Congress; you are also part of the problem. It is called LEADERSHIP…..and it starts with the guts to call out the media during those gotcha moments…be it a Sunday talk show or the View…call them out on their own hypocrisy. They will NEVER accept nor like Conservatives so quit trying and show some spine. Slowly the tide of the population will wake up to truth when the GOP’ers show some resolve and not Progressive lite. But one point missed by most all is the Hegelian Dialect and the divide and conquer and presently we are losing. The Tea Party is co-opted by RINOS like SP and her ilk. If you cannot get past that then like the liberals there is no hope for explaining it to you all….
Gop’er allow the media to control the narrative. No push back on the Democrats to COMPROMISE with the GOP only one way for the GOP to do all the compromising. So GOP talking points about forcing the issues on spending cuts and all the welfare, SS money going to illegal’s. So until the GOP get some spine (and they won’t) we will continue to get squeezed out socially and economically until we implode. We fail to learn from History and fail to demand leadership from the elected and most of all YOU all keep voting for the same ones. I have been done for some time due to lack of conservative running except here in Texas and trhen only vote for one or two….. the rest really do stink on ice….
The Tea Party is co-opted by RINOS like SP and her ilk.
SP? Sarah Palin? I thought she was goddess of wingnuts; now she’s the enemy?
I really need a scorecard.
No. You just need to go back to your Collectivist blogs to find your comfort zone.
Yes, Jim, you’re correct — nobody who isn’t in love with Palin or social conservative wingnuts and teabaggers must by definition be a collectivist. Heavens, they could never be a republican moderate. (Where’s the “you’re so effing stupid you can’t possibly breathe without assistance” rolling eyeballs icon for this site?)
Pull your head out. You’re in the minority of the GOP.
I bet you are a liberal and that you were never even an engineer, much less a random one. What are these imbecilic derogatory references to “teabaggers” about? Get some new material. Sheesh.
Vote for one party, you get big government and a growing police state. Vote for the other party and you get big government and a growing police state.
Vote for one party, you get out of control spending and a growing deficit. Vote for the other party and you get out of control spending and a growing police state.
Vote for one party and you get government interference in your private lives. Vote for the other party, you get government interference in your private lives.
Vote for one party, you get undeclared wars and military interventionism. Vote for the other party and you get undeclared wars and military interventionism.
Vote for one party, someone’s freedoms and liberties disappear. Vote for the other party and someone else’s freedoms and liberties go away…until we have few freedoms or liberties remaining to any of us.
Vote for one party, they use government to impose their morality and culture upon the rest of us. Voter for the other party and they use government to impose their morality and culture upon the rest of us.
Vote for one party, and they’ll convince you that their motives are pure and that their opponents are satan, incarnate. Vote for the other party and they’ll convince you that their oipponents are satan, incarnate.
Vote for one party and they’ll tell you that only they support freedom and liberty. Vote for the other and they’ll convince you that only their motives are pure.
Both claim to be on the side of the angels, while whle the actions of both are anything but angelic.
Apparently the supporters and the base for both parties love to have it all turn out this way…with America becoming an absolutist, statist tyranny, in all but name.
The only subtantive difference between the two parties is which one blames the other for all of our problems.
That’s the real world ‘deadlock’ which confronts America and her people.
The battle cry of both parties seems to be ‘Better destruction than Freedom!’
You know what they said when they cut the tail off of the monkey. They said, ‘Well, it won’t be long now.” You spelled out your conundrum, not mine. At least one party is not controlled by the Communist Party of America. This is my conundrum: How do we get rid of them at this point?
You can’t get rid of them, they have got rid of you, you and your ilk are done, finished, over. But please stick around and keep posting, the rest of us find your rants quite amusing, the bubble of insanity you live in constantly reminds us of what we don’t want.
Who is we, Tonto?
The 99.99% of the population who realize that you are a raving headcase.
You speak for over 300,000,000 people? You don’t even speak for yourself very well. And even if you actually think you could speak for more than 300,000,000 other people, how would that make your argument unassailable? And it sure doesn’t support your idea that I am a “raving headcase”, even though I just might be a “raving headcase” regardless of how badly you have argued for that.
Baker,
See, the thing is that you are an idiot, you don’t realize that you are an idiot but that is typical of fanatics. The facts are that you are a complete non entity, you don’t have any support other than a few similarly delusional deadbeats. We will have single payer health care, we will have nationalization of energy companies, Obama is going to put you and your cohorts over the barrel and shove it right up. How does it feel loser? You know why Obama won? Because whites feared black reaction to an Obama loss, you are chicken shit, you are cowards, you are the crap of history, you are garbage and done for.
You have a nice day, and come back, ya hear?
It was too easy to reduce another liberal to this kind of trash talking nonsense. This one was nowhere to be found around here until after the election. Now, these bozos are everywhere acting like a President who got re-elected with 6,000,000 fewer votes, a smaller percentage of the vote, and fewer electoral college votes than he won his initial election with, and a nice boost from many the purist conservatives who refused like fools to vote against him, has some kind of mandate to continue on his current path. I say that if it looks like a duck, waddles like a duck, swims like a duck, flies like a duck with all the other ducks, and quacks like a duck, there is pretty good reason to believe it is a duck. I stand by everything I have said about you and your opinions, roger dodger.
You wouldn’t know the definition of insanity if it bit you in your eye.
Still hurting Baker?
Well you can rest assured, for you and your type it will get much worse and will never get better, and the good part is, you know it.
You have a nice day now, Ya hear?
You know absolutely nothing about my type, fool.
It’s amusing to read the comments by people who were forcefully saying before the pretend “election” that it was over if the marxist won. Now they are pretending that it isn’t over.
Well it is over.
The marxists have even begun the inevitable purge of useful idiots (Petraeus, dear thing, who probably actually believes in honor and the founding principles, and didn’t think, usefully idiotically, that doing what powerful men have done for the last 100,000 years would actually be used against him.). What was it worth having him as a CIA director? A million “votes” from people who didn’t know they were “voting” their country away, I would guess.
Don’t kid yourself. Humiliating him two days after the election is the equivalent of Joseph Stalin sweetly emphasizing loyalty, and then disappearing a couple of henchmen. Bet your last dollar that every top military man in the country who is attached to his pension and children has started clapping in praise of our own little Stalin, and they won’t stop clapping ever.
I am not one of them, proreason. I am just pissed off that many people, who couldn’t make the distinction between a good man and a Marxist, unwittingly helped Obama get re-elected. Staying home was worse than showing up and voting for Gary Johnson. Now Obama even thinks he has a mandate. As to your comments on Petraeus, my opinion is that you have nailed it where he is concerned.
It seems to me that what with the split in the Senate that three or four Libertarians in that body could control the flow of legislation and very possibly give the conservatives in the House a rallying point.
This potential will have to be realized by conservatives, not Republicans. It’ll be messy to implement but one there are that three or four in theere the other two parties will be constrained to pay heed to their demands to get a majority in the senate.
I’d pick small states to try this plan. The Dakotas, Montana, Idaho, Alaska, Vermont, New Hampshire, maybe Tennessee. Others?
It can’t be a scattergun attempt. Pick the states and concentrate. Its a perfect Tea Party party.
I thought the loss in ’08 would have schooled the Rs and ’10 seemed to show that it had. But as the primary was spent five months as “anybody but Romney” by 2/3 of the primary voters and we got Romney, it is time to call school off and take a trip to the woodshed.
Heading off an expected objection to Libertarian, they’re best positioned right now to win a few and make a difference.
Dude, it needs to be tried in the NorthEast and West Coast, not Republican strongholds. If you are trying to expand over and above Republican seats.
Andrew McCarthy for President.
Well, I know they’ve lost me, forever.
The vaunted Ryan budget plan [...] claims what Republicans always claim: they’re going to get serious … tomorrow … or maybe the next day – or the next decade.
That’s a fair point well made, and it will be news to many in the Stupid Party — but one hopes, at least in Ryan’s case, that the sting is removed by your next point. Ryan certainly knows that no congressional action today can bind the congress of tomorrow. Unless you believe he’s either dense or rotten — good luck there — he’s likely concerned about a package palatable enough to be acceptable today. No news to say politics is the art of the possible. And a journey of a thousand miles….
Ryan has the mental heft to handle complexity; he is surely a vital part of any solution. IMO, to rise and thrive, he belongs far from the ship of fools that comprises GOP ‘leadership’, like anyone with talent who is serious about our future.
Yes, of course we need a new party. The idea really falls into the category of universally known and indisputable propositions, right next to ‘the earth is not flat’. The other choices are secession or lock, load and head for the hills, i.e., we’ll do it the hard way. It really isn’t complex.
Andrew, I’d like to consider repudiation of illegitimate debt as an alternative to secession and boondock survivalism. Murray Rothbard has written on this, but I disagree with self-indulgent repudiation of valid debt. http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard190.html Search Facebook for the Center for Principled Repudiation page, whose “manifesto” is at once an argument for ethically defensible repudiation of illegitimate debt, and fair warning to future lenders and investors that they should not rely on us to repay corrupt debt.